[Drama 2020] The King: Eternal Monarch, 더 킹: 영원의 군주

[Elnin Joery]

14 minutes ago, Heretorant said:

Sounds possible. 
 

The LG who traveled back and restored balance, will he be able to cross to the new timeline? In the new timeline, is there an LG who is different from the one who restored balance? Or are the people in the new timeline the same people we have been watching and LG just needs to return back to the future? Lol, sorry I’m asking as though you are writer Kim. Lol. 
 

What’s hardest for me to accept is if the LG we have been watching does not end with his JTE. I need these two to end up. I don’t care about LG and JTE 2.0. 
 

Omg, I forgot to watch Back to the Future  Maybe I could have answered my own questions if I watched it lol. Tonight, tonight... after I finish marathoning TKEM lol. 

 

The LG in the 3 different timelines is the same LG not a different one and the same goes to JTE. 

 

It just means that time was reset hence it's the same person just a different timeline where events and segments take place different. 

 

-Example lets say you married X in this timeline and married to X for 20 odd years but you regret that and want to change it so you go back to the time you meet him and simply reject him. Which means you craved out for youself a new timeline here. Your past's decision will take hold and become your new future. It's still you but you are now married to Y not X. You forget all the events that took place between you and X for that odd 20yrs and they are replaced by new memories with Y naturally

 

[1ouise]

12 minutes ago, Elnin Joery said:

If he changes the past tho the future will also change meaning his memories will get wiped out naturally. His 1994 version won't have the badge unless he leaves it again for him and that was the only thing that made him remember her in the first place but if he wipes things out without that he won't remember anything on her to remember by which I believe will be the case. 

 

LG is very smart he figured out that there was link with this ID badge he had but without he won't be able to calculate anything or assume her magically which means he will be without memory

 

He is the time traveler and his memories won't get wiped out (according to Back to the Future style time travel).  He will travel back more than once until he accomplishes what he needs to.

 

 

[vangsweetie637]

2 minutes ago, mrsj3n said:

 

 

I'm on episode 4 and oh my god.

Why did I just realise PM koo is such an annoying and arrogant richard simmons?

 

 

Off with her head!!!!

 

 

 

 

LOL!! You just realized? I knew it from the beginning when she kept trying to take pictures with LG. I was like::

 

 

[mrsj3n]

@vangsweetie637 

 

 

 

 

[Elnin Joery]

2 minutes ago, 1ouise said:

 

He is the time traveler and his memories won't get wiped out (according to Back to the Future style time travel.)  He will travel back more than once until he accomplishes what he needs to.

 

 

 

I concur if they are going by this. Yes he can attain his memories and still alter the timeline but I am thinking if he didn't leave junior LG the badge he wouldn't have remembered anything or have any hints or leads which somehow pulls him down this rabbit hole that his memories could disappear or he leaves the badge again giving Junior LG something to figure out. Your theory is absolutely possible tho that he attains his memory

[Heretorant]

20 minutes ago, 1ouise said:

 

People have different ways of describing things.  There is only one timeline.  The one we are watching will be replaced with a different one.  The people are the same, but their history will change.  Yes, LG just returns to present.  They are the same people, but they will have had different experiences.  Other people might describe it differently.  If you have seen Back to the Future it is easier to understand.

 

 

 

Yayyy!! I love it! YOU SHOULD BE WRITER KIM!! 
 

I had the same theory after episode 10’s ending. My understanding is future LG is actually living in the present and we are watching his past. They are the same person just like how us 10 years ago is still us. It’s always so hard to explain in words! Imagine trying to execute this flawlessly! That’s why TKEM struggled with execution lol. 
 

I’m getting on to that Back to the Future homework lol. 

[x2020]

13 hours ago, bebebisous33 said:

 

Spoiler

 

Finally, I was able to finish this analysis. As you can see, it is quite long. So be prepared!  @Guyangi_Dalpeongi @vangsweetie637 @ms_inquiry @imels @ktcjdrama @mrsj3n @YongZura⁷ @Jafstar@Edgar Pordwed @syntyche @mychoiyoung @Dramafreak @2handsintertwined @madmad min 

The Earth is flat: Jeong Tae Eul's relationship to sciences and faith

 

Since the beginning, Jeong Tae Eul is associated to the following expression: the Earth is flat. This expression is quite important as it reveals Jeong Tae Eul’s personality and the way she perceives the world.

While our protagonist Lee Gon is introduced as a mathematician and scientist, hence he tries to understand the world through numbers and physical laws, our heroine appears to be the opposite, she is a liberal arts person. That’s the reason why Jo Young initially rejects Jeong Tae Eul as he says that JTE is not the science type hence she is not Lee Gon’s type. The fact that she is a liberal arts person is pointed out on many occasions. First, she reveals her lack of knowledge in math, when she tries to reject Lee Gon’s proposal.

 

She doesn’t realize her mistake, until Lee Gon points out the issue with the 360 degrees. Sure, she corrects herself, yet this incident underlines her disinterest for math and sciences in general. Another example for her lack of interest in these topics is when she doesn’t even try to understand Lee Gon’s explanation about the existence of a parallel world. She doesn’t really pay attention to his explanation about the Quantum mechanic theory, for her it sounds so complex to grasp that she even gives up before really listening. At some point, she gets upset as Lee Gon keeps trying to explain to her about the parallel world that she yells back that for her, the Earth is still flat.

Why does she mean with this? She knows that the Earth is round as it is a planet. In reality, she wants to say that she needs to experience that the earth is round in order to accept this knowledge. She can not understand things through numbers or theories, she needs to live it with all her senses. She is so different from Lee Gon who uses his brain in order to grasp the world, she uses her other senses in order to gain knowledge: the eyes, the hands, the heart… As conclusion, she belongs to the type of people who prefer learning through experience. learning through experience (if you want to read more about this)

This explains the choice of her career. She could have become a senior inspector much earlier, if she hadn’t opted to work as a detective. She chose to work on the field rather than behind a desk. This also explicates why Jeong Tae Eul is a Taekwondo fighter. This sport worships the following virtues: courtesy, integrity, perseverance, self-control and indomitable spirit. Through her body, our heroine learns these virtues hence she was there to help Kang Sin Jae, when the latter was bullied. First, out of courtesy, she asked the students to stop the bullying. She didn’t give up, when she got threatened (perseverance). Our female lead was able to control the students and showed no fear, when she started fighting against 5 students (self-control and indomitable spirit). That’s the reason why JTE embodies those qualities as well.

But since she met Lee Gon, she was confronted by a dilemma. On the one side, she wanted to believe in Lee Gon’s good nature, on the other side she didn’t believe in his words. Therefore, she remained by his side and even helped him to sell the diamonds or invited him to eat something. But at the same time, she wanted to reveal his lies. Strangely, she needed to use sciences for that. She asked for a fingerprint test, for a DNA test and finally for the help from the Korea Racing Authority because of the horse. Striking is that the sciences she neglected or rejected before proved that Lee Gon was not lying. With her own eyes and ears, she discovers that everything Lee Gon said is correct. While she didn’t believe in his words in the beginning, the sciences are the cause for her change of heart. Little by little, her resolve to see him as a weird or crazy person diminishes. She is more and more doubtful. She is not entirely convinced hence she wants to see Lee Gon’s world in order to believe him entirely. Once there, she wants to discover Monarchy of Corea hence she makes a trip to Seoul. Through her travel, she witnesses all the differences between her world and this world which leads her to admit the truth: the existence of a parallel world.

Just like Lee Gon who had stopped believing in gods, Jeong Tae Eul didn’t believe in the existence of the parallel world but at some point, she realized her mistake. Later, she even conceded to her colleague Kang Sin Jae that she believed Lee Gon and everything from him. She has become a true believer as she experienced the new world on her own.

Since she is a person who acquires knowledge through experience, she is really adamant to know if Lee Gon has been dating before meeting her. That’s why she focused on “first” things: first dating and first girlfriend, first snow, first cooking etc. That’s why Lee Gon asks her on the other hand if her earth has become rounder. She has gained experience and knowledge through what she has lived.

 

episode 6: Jeong Tae Eul says here “I was just waiting on Earth, which has become slightly rounder”. With these words, our detective confesses that her affection for Lee Gon has grown.

After parting from Lee Gon in the episode 6, she misses him more and more. Her longing lets her realize what Lee Gon means to her. At the end, she has no problem to show her affections to him therefore she hugs him. Step by step, she learns what love is. In another scene, the king complains that her Earth is still flat, which she admits (“It’s as flat as a thin pancake”). In that scene, she didn’t know how to console Lee Gon as she had never done it before. Since Lee Gon is her first love, she lacks experience but due to her love for him, she has changed. She is learning how to love and show love to someone.

While watching JTE all along, I couldn’t help myself thinking about the apostle John who is often called the doubter or sceptic. He refused to believe in the resurrection of Jesus Christ until he saw Christ’s wounds. The reason why I associated JTE with John is because of the painting of Caravaggio

 

Pay attention to John’s behavior. He is actually touching the wound and not really looking at it. Because of this experience, he believed even more in the resurrection of Jesus Christ.

Actually, the other apostles had also a hard time to believe in this miracle, yet only John is considered a sceptic. In reality, John is a stronger believer as he is willing to die for Jesus Christ, he is also a team player (John 20,25; John 14,5), just like our heroine. The latter says that Lee Gon can rely on 5 people next to her. She is willing to do anything for him, she trusts him so much that she doesn’t even doubt that he won’t be able to rescue her. Unlike Lee Gon who rejected faith after that fateful night (coup d’etat of his uncle Lee Rim), JTE has always felt some affinity with the supernatural. She mentions the story about the moon rabbit which our king rejects by saying that the moon is covered with regolits. Then when she is in the passage between the two worlds, she wonders if there is magic there. Magic is a symbol for supernatural.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

In this scene she sows seeds

Lee Gon answers her that space can not be explained scientifically as there is no wind, no air and no time, yet his explications don’t stop her to sow some seeds. She hopes that a plant could grow. Hope has a strong connection to faith. She is different as she feels that this passage shows wonders. Her closeness to legends and myths makes it easier for her to believe in magic. Her hopeful attitude contrasts much more to Lee Gon’s behavior. She starts believing much earlier than him… only in the episode 12, he wants to pray to god with JTE. We see JTE’s praying much earlier, when she talks to the plants.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

episode 6: “I know you’re from a different world, but you should sprout. Your friends are in a much harsher place now”.

 

 

Notice that Lee Gon also starts talking to the plant after his return. Nonetheless, his talking to the plant doesn’t resemble a prayer as it is an order. He orders the plant to sprout in this world. However, both protagonists have to make the same leap of faith. For JTE, her love confession should be perceived as a leap of faith. She calls it fate.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

episode 7

She believes in fate hence she says:

It took me a long time to realize this. When it’s fate, there is no coincidence. The fate is determined by the choices you made but there are times, when your fate chooses you. Things that are bound to happen are taking place even at this moment. I was struck with a sad premonition that this will be short-lived but I decided to love my fate that chose me.

Since she is a learner through experiences, she needs much more time to understand the world and her own feelings. This explains why Lee Gon wants to marry her as soon as possible and it took her much longer to realize her love for him.

The more she interacts with our hero, the more she is influenced by him. She has already accepted that she is his number 0. In the episode 6, she admits that there was no way she could know what was happening in his world. Because he was a person who was beyond one and zero. With these words, she unveils her longing. She feels the huge distance between herself and Lee Gon. She is no longer rejecting numbers and science at all. Furthermore she keeps asking Lee Gon to appear within 10 minutes.

Notice that she calls the existence of the parallel world “science fiction”. One could claim that she is avoiding the topic “existence of the parallel world” as she feels that KSJ will never come to believe it too. However, I feel that her choice of words reflects her own mentality. Since JTE listens to Lee Gon’s scientific explanations (the time difference e. g.) unlike in the beginning, she has somehow combined the two worlds (science and belief/faith) in one expression. Belief was not really rejected by her, it was just that she somehow neglected it, just like she neglected sciences. With Lee Gon by her side, she has now turned into someone who believes in “sciences” and in fate (faith) as well since she has experienced it.

Lee Gon was able to change her attitude towards math and science because he used many metaphors with mathematical expressions “Root” “0” and “1” so that JTE could visualize and feel it. “I guess, you know now what root you are standing in front of. It’s my hell and my history”.

He was not only trapped by his feelings for her (see his love confession) but also by his own situation as a king (his past and his family). He can not escape from his destiny, he is a king and as such he has his duties which he can not deny. Besides, he needs to catch his uncle too. Lee Gon understood very early how JTE thinks hence he changed his words towards her. Unlike our heroine, Lee Gon claims that he is a quick learner, while she needs experiences to acquire knowledge.

But the results are the same: both protagonists have changed and become both true believers. They no longer rejects science or faith. They have accepted that both can complement each other, just like Blaise Pascal wanted.

 

Let me know what you think. Feel free to comment.

 

 

 

     Daebak!!!! I have tears in my eyes reading your writing. Hugsssss !!

 

I love when people watch this kind of drama with every bits of their senses and soul. You not watch drama just to watch the love scenes or the visual of casts but go deep down to the all aspects : content, the meaning for every shot, every word of the script, expression and all. 

 

@bebebisous33 if you ever have a dream to be a writer, I support you... 

Edited May 29, 2020 by Jillia
Quote too long

[gwin]

34 minutes ago, 1ouise said:

 

The timeline is classic Back to the Future.  The only chance to repair the present is in the past--at the point where LR crossed over and started murdering and swapping. That is the reason for LG to wipe out the timeline we are now watching by traveling back and preventing LR's actions.  LG won't forget anything, and everyone else will go on in the new timeline (including some people who will never have died) without knowing there ever was anything different.  The portal is closed.  LG hasn't met TE.  But he remembers her and he knows how to use the portal.  The rest is destiny.

 

 

I am always triggered whenever Back to the Future is mentioned, because that is one of my favorite films of all time.   But I disagree that the timeline is classic Back to the Future.  I had already summarized this in a previous long post here, but for the benefit of everyone who hasn't seen the film, I'll summarize here again.   See if there is anything that can apply to TKEM's timeline:

 

1.    In BTTF, the lead character is actually repairing the past in order to ensure that he will exist in the future.  The reason why he had to repair the past is because he himself altered an event in the past (unintentionally), so he had to undo what he altered.

 

The difference in TKEM is that the lead character here has to go back to the past initially in order to save himself from getting killed.  Lee Gon (assuming he's the savior) time travelled to a point in time where he already existed (1994, 8 years old).

 

In BTTF, the lead character didn't go back in the past intentionally.  It was only when he went back to the past when he triggered the events that would alter his future.  He went back to a point in time where he wasn't born yet.

 

2.   In BTTF, if the lead character doesn't "repair the past", he never gets born into existence, therefore he will not exist in in the future.

 

3.   There's a side plot in BTTF where the lead character witnesses the death of a close friend (the guy who invented the time machine) in the present time, who got assassinated by terrorists.  In order to save his friend from death, the lead character warns his friend in the past of the exact date and time and manner of death in the future.   Thus, when the lead character returns to the future (present time), his friend is sufficiently warned and is already wearing a bulletproof vest (LOL, another TKEM reference?).

 

Let me know what you guys think.  I've been trying to make a connection between BTTF and TKEM for a while now, but I can't make a connection.

 

 

Omg, I forgot to watch Back to the Future  Maybe I could have answered my own questions if I watched it lol. Tonight, tonight... after I finish marathoning TKEM lol. 

 

Watch it!   It's the BEST.  MOVIE.  EVER.

 

[Chellsee]

How we felt waking up expecting a new episode and hearing it got postponed.

Why oh why SBS! 

 

 

[Elnin Joery]

9 minutes ago, Heretorant said:

 

Yayyy!! I love it! YOU SHOULD BE WRITER KIM!! 
 

I had the same theory after episode 10’s ending. My understanding is future LG is actually living in the present and we are watching his past. They are the same person just like how us 10 years ago is still us. It’s always so hard to explain words! Imagine trying to execute this flawlessly! That’s why TKEM struggled with execution lol. 
 

I’m getting on to that Back to the Future homework lol. 

 

I don't think TKEM struggled with any execution. The material is just vast but it was not the execution cause I think the hints in the show is put out great so people can theorize and think. There is no obligation on the production team to rush segments or events. They also wanted to give things little by little instead of revealing everything at one go. There is no such thing as the perfect series but it was certainly not execution they had issues with. They had issues with impatient viewers who seek everything to be thrown at them from the get go. It took it's time patiently to build up and thats why we are enjoying it so much now because the characters and arc has been build up patiently

[1ouise]

1 hour ago, gwin said:

I am always triggered whenever Back to the Future is mentioned, because that is one of my favorite films of all time.   But I disagree that the timeline is classic Back to the Future.

 

The plot of Back to the Future 2--where Marty goes back to the past to repair the present--more closely resembles TKEM.  And since it appears they travel further back into the past, that would resemble Back to the Future 3.

 

There are so many similarities in BTTF2, right down to the PPL.  

 

 

[Heretorant]

4 minutes ago, Elnin Joery said:

 

I don't think TKEM struggled with any execution. The material is just vast but it was not the execution cause I think the hints in the show is put out great so people can theorize and think. There is no obligation on the production team to rush segments or events. They also wanted to give things little by little instead of revealing everything at one go. There is no such thing as the perfect series but it was certainly not execution they had issues with. They had issues with impatient viewers who seek everything to be thrown at them from the get go. It took it's time patiently to build up and thats why we are enjoying it so much now because the characters and arc has been build up patiently

Agree. Agree! 
 

Maybe I should have said where I found the drama was lacking is the uneven distribution of screen time per subplots. I still think too much time was designated to the police station in certain episodes lol.

 

But, imo, this drama is near perfect . Am I so biased because I love it too much? It’s even better the second time marathoning. I have such a soft spot for LG that I get emotional when JTE treats him harshly lol. 

 

I’m dramatic lol. 

[gabylee]

Hello again!! 

 

It is difficult to catch up among all your theories but really, really helps me to wait for more episodes of The King!! Actually, I don't know what I am going to do with my life when this is over... my last obsession was Faith, so it's been 8 years... lol... 

 

Anyway, I decided that I have plenty of time and decided to read from the beginning this thread... and I found this:

 

Spoiler

 

So... this is an outfit for a queen right? I mean, it has some embroidery similar to the jacket of doom, only in silver color..

 

If we don't see this in the drama, maybe there was a change on the writing... 

 

Still, there is still hope for a queen!

 

Saludos desde México!!

 

[gwin]

9 minutes ago, Elnin Joery said:

 

I don't think TKEM struggled with any execution. The material is just vast but it was not the execution cause I think the hints in the show is put out great so people can theorize and think. There is no obligation on the production team to rush segments or events. They also wanted to give things little by little instead of revealing everything at one go. There is no such thing as the perfect series but it was certainly not execution they had issues with. They had issues with impatient viewers who seek everything to be thrown at them from the get go. It took it's time patiently to build up and thats why we are enjoying it so much now because the characters and arc has been build up patiently

 

I will reserve judgment until the end of the series, but there are a few issues in execution in my view.  The more I think about it, the more I feel bummed because these issues could've saved the series from the early criticism!  I think I already mentioned these earlier, but here are my pet peeves so far:

 

1.  Product placement from Episode 3-8:   Simply too much.  I do not mind PPLs if they're not in-your-face.   The worst for me was the coffee LG was drinking in his hotel room (absolute cringe), followed by that scene of JTE and Jangmi in the car where they promoted both the cheek tint and kimchi.   When characters actually talk about a product and not just use or show them, it takes me out of the viewing experience.   

 

2.  Too much focus on the detective team in Korea:  Unless the chief detective gets a bigger role in subsequent episodes (I doubt), I really do not understand why we had to devote precious time to him and his wife.  We got a scene of them in the grocery (to this day I don't know what was that about!), we got conversations about what he's doing in his spare time etc. etc.   And I know some people like him, but Jangmi is really just there for PPLs.

 

3.   Too much focus on Shin Jae's backstory:  Don't get me wrong, I like this character.  I like the actor.  But just look at how much focus was given to him in the earlier episodes:

-That whole sequence of him with the gambling boss, his mother and the raid at that gambling den (he meets the gambling boss I think 3 times?)

-The background story of how he and JTE met

-JTE rescuing him from bullies

-Scene between him and Jangmi (?!?!?)

 

If they had given some of the screentime for him to Jo Yeong (who is severely lacking in character depth to this time), I think it would have served the show better.  It's just so odd to me that JY is so loyal to LG, I would have appreciated something, anything which would justify why he's fiercely loyal to LG.

 

That's just my top three.  It's sad because the premiere episode of this series was soooo good and showed so much potential. 

[SweetButters]

Made a nice little doc to maybe explain space time in TKEM lol. If there's anyone who has better knowledge/understanding of quantum mechanics or physics and see that I've made a mistake in the explanation, please let me know so I can fix it! Quantum mechanics was just as confusing for me today as it was years ago when I studied it so I'm sure there is probably flaws somewhere in my explanation of it lol.

 

[mrsj3n]

So.. random thought.

 

What happened to the female guard in KOC?

Her doppelganger had murdered her room mate and died.

So she disappeared too?

[gwin]

11 minutes ago, SweetButters said:

Made a nice little doc to maybe explain space time in TKEM lol. If there's anyone who has better knowledge/understanding of quantum mechanics or physics and see that I've made a mistake in the explanation, please let me know so I can fix it! Quantum mechanics was just as confusing for me today as it was years ago when I studied it so I'm sure there is probably flaws somewhere in my explanation of it lol.

 

 

Great explanation, but I'm not sure I completely agree.  I think the LG we are seeing now is someone who has not yet spent considerable amount of time in that in between place.  He can't, because he has to go back to being a King.

 

I honestly don't think any time manipulation (or non-linear time sequence) has been shown on this show so far, except in the following scenes:

 

1.    The first scene of Episode 1 up until that point where LG is facing the gate

2.    The last scene of Episode 10

 

Everything else to me follows a normal timeline, except of course for the occasional time stops.   I realize that my opinion is the minority view though.

[mrsj3n]

Deleted. Not sure why there's duplicate post.

Got a bad gateway earlier. Sorry!

[Emmy Nur'aenny]

6 hours ago, mychoiyoung said:

Guys, has anyone noticed that there has been a change in the translation over Netflix?

 

1. Change in translation Epi 12

I must confess it took me a while to re-watch epi 12 cos am being sentimental (go figure!). I noticed that the translation of an important story element in the bedroom scene has been changed --

 

ORIGINALLY:

LG: “I think it’s a side effect of crossing the road of thunder and lightning. What about you? Aren’t you hurting?”

TE: “No, I feel fine.”

(At her request, he only glances at her shoulder briefly and says she has no scar.)

TE: “Is it random?”

LG: “It’s strange. This means the rule of traveling between worlds has been broken.”

 

NOW 
LG: “It’s strange. This means it’s not connected to crossing the two worlds.”

 

I checked the SBS version and it is the same as the original translation in Netflix.

 

What do you make of that? Which is the correct version based on what was actually uttered by LG?

 

I think this is the correct one

 

TE: “Is it random?”

LG: “It’s strange. This means the rule of traveling between worlds has been broken.”

I can speak Korean a little bit and I listen to what LG said carefully and I think that is the correct one, 

 

Edited May 29, 2020 by Jillia
Please do not quote pics! Thanks!

[Alice Wonderland]

3 hours ago, syntyche said:

The 13th episode of SBS's "The King," which was scheduled to air on the 29th, will air on the 30th with the movie "Contagion" being aired as a special program for Covid-19. Afterwards, the 14th episode airs on June 5, the 15th episode on June 6, and the final episode, 16th episode, on June 12.

I know to gather more awareness of covid 19 is important, but I'm still pissed-off why should sbs air it on friday. We have mon tue thurs and sun.... why would sacrifice our friday???? Why??? I really can't understand this. 

 1 week for waiting ep 14-15 and another 1 week to ep 16,  I thought should I watch it all after ep 16 ends. 

 

Talking about covid 19, how is your life buddy? Are you still in lockdown? Yesterday I heard on news that our government has planned a new scenario toward new normal life. I see they posted lots of instructions and protocols until the vaccine is done. I thought how could this be a normal life. Well, it's something we have to deal with. I hope everyone stay healthy and safe! 

 

One more day to Saturday. The wrap up party, won't they have it?