[Drama 2020] The King: Eternal Monarch, 더 킹: 영원의 군주

[mychoiyoung]

14 hours ago, CallieP said:

On 6/6/2020 at 12:23 PM, mouse007 said:

This part I am also curious to find out. Since I understand that Lee Rim is already dead in 2020. Basically 2020 Lee Rim died because 1994 Lee Rim killed him. So does this mean then that LR does not exist past April 13, 2020 when he travelled to 1994? If so I wonder what happens to the flute. I wonder if the little kid is actually the spirit of the flute (he says something like “I want to be whole again”). The way I understand it is that the King is the rightful owner of the manpasijeok and that is likely what the little kid is alluding to when he says that LG’s Destiny. I wonder if by knowing the power of the  flute, and respecting it, will he truly be the owner and therefore be magically restored. Almost like he has to prove himself so to speak. 

I say this because it looks like past kings have used it but have always understood the boundaries. Only this time, LR got involved and took what wasn’t meant to be his and abused it. Therefore, the king LG needs to put things back into place so to speak. 

 

I have the same question, LR was killed by his younger self so logically, the younger self would live until the day he killed himself then he should vanish so how did he survive past that?  I don't think it was explained well just that he survived his beheading! Huh!

 

LR will remember that he killed 2020 LR who came to him one hour of the nIght of Treason.  So LR  that we are seeing now will not go back to 1994 version of himself. The idiot sort of wisened up through time.

[MairaA]

WOW WOW WOW, I WATCHED EPISODE 15 A COUPLE HOURS AGO AND NOW IVE FINISHED BACKTRACKING! WHAT AN EPISODE!! I STILL HAVE NO CLUE HOW THIS IS GONNA END!!! UGH!!! 

 

I didnt see anyone else mention this but we still haven't seen the sword being used to kill someone or do something  (except on the eventful night where LR uses it to kill LGs dad and baby LG uses it hurt LR) but LG does go to the past with it (as seen at the end of this episode). So the scene where LR tries to shoot at LG while time is frozen, no objects work. What if the sword is the exception? What if that's the only thing that will work? If LG can somehow make a plan to once again freeze time at the right spot (whatever he believes the right spot in time that is), and use the sword to kill LR, I think that'll be the winning scenario. IDK LIKE CMON SWORD DO SOMETHING!!

 

Once again though this episode had me CRYING, especially when LG requested JTE to let him go. That was heartbreaking. Like I couldn't even see the screen cause I was crying so much  I think all of our sentiments are the same as JTE's, our couple didn't do anything bad and yet they are being punished the most, their love is being put to the test every time. 

 

I'm gonna put my interpretation of episode 15 below. Sorry this will be LONG.. But it will be worth it to read!!! I will be reviewing major scenes. 

Spoiler

Episode 15

1) The way I get the whole timeline thing is that when the past changes the future versions of them change as well, like in terms of their memories, the memories get added but it doesn't seem like the old memories get deleted. They just have two memories of the same things happening, memory 1 (first time they met everything happened at a very slow pace) and memory 2 (because JTE embraced her fate much earlier second time around, things happened more quickly between them but generally their fate stayed the same which leads them to where they are now). This means that in both those memories, our characters ended up in the same spot in April. So in order to change that, something needs to happen on the eventful night WHILE still allowing the original timeline to flow - that is if LR is killed, baby LG will have the whole flute growing up, meaning he can go to JTE faster BUT that's only if someone leaves JTE's ID card there. The original timeline will still flow this way because baby LG will wonder who helped him and wonder who's the ID girl which will lead him to finding the portal but this time he will have the orange/red portal (because the flute will be together in one spot) not the green portals we see when the flute pieces are divided in half and used in separate spaces. It seems like though that this is going to be very hard to achieve. There are high chances of failure because JTE has brought herself into the picture. According to the preview, LG and JY are shooting up the place meaning JTE may not have been successful in getting LR killed, what if they both end up surviving and we now have 2 LRs? JTE is heading to a VERY unknown territory because she only knows about the night but doesn't know about every detail like KSJ. LR1 could be taking JTE hostage and LR2 could be killing baby LG as planned. They may manage to kill LR2 but miss out on LR1. I dont know why but I feel like they have to go to the past one more time because everything and everyone being so involved in one night is only increasing the chances of failure because lack of communication and lack of information. But lets see what happens! 

 

2) KSJ was abandoned by his mom and chose to become LR's helper to give SJ a better life. 

 

3)KSJ given order by new and more evil LR (will call him LR-EVIL from now on) to get LGs whip and kill him otherwise he will hurt both his moms - KSJ mentions he isn't that good of a son. 

 

4)Nari mentions to LR-EVIL that his fate was extended when he got hurt by baby LG, meaning as long as he has that scar, he will continue to be beheaded and commit treason - I think this will apply no matter what. WE thought LR-EVIL will never go to the past again because he will meet LR-EVIL2 again and repeat the same richard simmons, but LOOK AT US, they're taking him back to do JUST THAT, follow fate, follow the timeline, etc. Same stuff is happening but in a way that suits the current thinking of the characters. 

 

5) Luna didn't hurt JTE as much because he felt bad for her father and she doesn't want JTE's organs. Although that'd be nice, Luna at this point already accepted she will die soon enough. This whole conversation was interesting because we didn't get to SEE ALL OF IT. I think JTE realized Luna either mirrors her really well or Luna is her from a timeline failure. Which is what leads onto the next scene. (REFER TO POINT #17 FOR CONTINUATION)

 

6) LG is ABLE to come out of the portals right in time to where he left (almost). So it's good enough. It works out. 

 

7)LG and JTE discuss their NEW memories while retaining their old memories. I'm still unsure if the memories update to the new version or they retain both memories but regardless, whatever it is, their love stays the same and they end up in the same spot.

 

8)Seems like LG's conversation with his ROK mom was much more deeper than I thought, seems like when LG said she can't come back, it could mean she has to kill herself or LR will kill her, which I doubt it would be LR, cause he planned to show her off as proof that there is another world and cause havoc in ROC. Now their conversation is so interesting cause it could be interpreted in so many ways. When LG says he'll help her,  I'm thinking it means help her come back to ROK but then she says will you come and save me? Come two days before the anniversary. I know the date too and thats when LG decides how he will ambush LR. To her being saved means to die. To be saved from the pain of this world and the guilt she holds for her own sins. Also, I think they're in ROK since they were all seen in ROC in the previous scene and would have to cross the portal to make time stop and the two doppelgangers from ROC who are working as businessmen in ROK can be seen. 

 

9)PM Koo seems to have always been that bit*h, looks like LRs job to her was to get LG or the Kingdom since she didn't get either and he even didnt get to attend the mass, he makes her regret it as seems to have replaced her mom.

 

10) LG exiles PBs son for helping LR on the eventful night and KSJ abandons his REAL mom. Although, literally, emotionally he seems to still be very connected to her. That's the vibes I got.

 

11) LG and KSJ go over the eventful night. LG says maybe baby LG will die since next time he plans to go back he will focus on killing LR as he tries to kill baby LG. Things to note here are that KSJ now knows everything, in detail that happened that night and JTE has an idea overall but no details and she still does not know about this plan yet.

 

12)LGs doppelganger mom in ROK poisons herself and LR gets poisoned as well although slightly, I think once he touched the flute, it may have stopped the effects of the poison. Cause otherwise, shouldn't he be DEAD? He then proceeds to look for LG as he expects him to show up somewhere near him. They meet, LR gets mad, LG says he's delayed his natural death too long (by 25 years since he should be 70) and that too many people are working towards his downfall. LR gets further upset and tries to shoot.Moving objects we learn now don't move, and he's left there even more angry. LG says time will be stopped for awhile now and the way LR interprets his "time" seems to be in steps as according to Netflix translation he says time first only stopped for 22 steps and now LG has made his time stop even longer and he can't have or do anything, ugh he sounds like a bratty kid LOL. 

 

13) LR gets shot in left leg by JY. KSJ, LG, and JY abduct LR to his gate and try to open it. We learn now that only LR can open his gate because his blood got infused with his piece. Blood creates association with the flute. But then we see, regardless of that, once the flute is together, LGs grandfather King Haejong's gate is opened AND LR knows about it meaning he's heard about it from someone, either his own father or his mother. LR also mentions that LG now has eternity and infinity in his hands. But LG says the Flute isn't crying thus he can't go to the night of the treason. LR says bro you're dumb, but fine go ahead and do it but now someone's gotta assist me to my gate and my fate, meaning someone may die in the process, who will you give a potential death sentence too? JY and KSJ then try to decide who will sacrifice themselves. Seems like KSJ gets chosen here. 

 

14) LG seems to go into the orange/red portal, the one his grandfather used, since the appearance is very different inside, looks very peaceful and bright - also it seems to be a beachy area (remember we saw a spoiler of LG and JTE at the beach but who knows if it'll be related to this) 

 

15) LR is sent to ROK and LG decides in ROC that he will have Se-jin be next in line to the throne. JTE misses LG and the flowers he gave her in episode 10 begin to disappear. Girl, isn't this a positive thing? Idk. 

 

16)JTE runs to question LR about more details, asking about the Flute, where it is and who has it. LR understands with her questions she is ready to die. Now, she also wants to be the sacrifice (potentially). LR still doesn't understand why everyone is going to such great lengths to prevent everything, etc and be the sacrifice or whatever but that's the result of not knowing what love is and not knowing when you've crossed too many lines. BUT what he says is very interesting, she should be very scared because regardless of where he is, he has a plan in motion. He still brings hell upon LG and the PM. He kills off Se-jin using pregnant lady and replaces PMs mom (mom doesn't say she had mackerel for dinner, that was their code) and it's the first time I've seen the PM scared of someone. If someone as evil as her is now scared, and now has potentially lost her mom forever, I think LR may still have stuff up his sleeves which is why JTE going with him to 1994 in ROC is very dangerous, but maybe that's the change that needs to happen?

 

17) Back to JTE and Luna. JTE uncuffs Luna, says she's leaving for awhile so she has to stay with her father and live for a long time so he doesn't get upset and to steal something for her (@SweetButters mentioned it may be the ID, and I agree but where is the ID?). JTE (seemingly) and KSJ have a talk about LR and the Flute. She seems to have caught up to the plan. JTE and KSJ have a heart to heart, he confesses, she confesses she loves LG and that she needs to do this for love, sanity and the world. KSJ holds JTE's hand and seems to give in. 

 

18)LG figures out the scar on his neck is related to his destiny, he will have to change that destiny, even if it means he dies. He also reveals he knew Lady Noh was from ROK but never brought it up because he was afraid she would want to go back. He also asks her permission to let him go.Lady Noh's cries calling out to Pyeha were so heartbreaking... ugh what a scene 

 

19)JTE wears THE NECKLACE. LG is WEARING THE SUIT. LG has the sword, probably has the Flute too (his original half) and JY joins him to go to the past. 

 

 

Hopefully all that made sense. Let me know your thoughts. I will also be doing my interpretation of episode 16 preview later today as well. Goodnight 

[mychoiyoung]

14 hours ago, AgentQuake said:

When LL is caught, and the danger is over, 1994 smol JY no longer needs to be the Unbreakable Sword, ready to fall on it any moment for the King.  He can grow up to live his own path, without the plan his future had set for himself

 

But JY will still have to be LG's Unbreakable Sword cos he belongs to the family which has a long line of tradition protecting the King. That's why he was in the coronation of the King with his Dad. However, this time around he may have more freedom & be livelier cos the spectre of doom that is LR, will no longer be there.

[deabakdrama]

9 hours ago, ktcjdrama said:

What a superb acting by KGE when JTE saw LG approaching her outside the hospital!! I teared up so much with their hug and have to just pause and come here to comment on that scene first. 

I know why they want to cast KGE for the role(s) in TKEM because really, only she can make it work. 

@ktcjdrama Yeap, that simple and short scene caused me  so much. KGE is really a good actress. 

Love this scene..........

 

Both of them looks so natural. I think LMH felt comfortable acting with KGE and she gives him inspiration too.....What do you guys think? I never watch his drama after Boys Flower and i don't know exactly his personality?  

 

 

[mychoiyoung]

14 hours ago, Heretorant said:

14 hours ago, wenchanteur said:

The first one: The retro-version of Lee Gon's memories in a double time loop.

 

At the end, Lee Gon and Jo-Yeong go into the portal to go back in time. All right, that was the duet I had in mind from the start.
But in the meantime, I also thought of Tae Eul, my current VOTE.
Except: they can't go back in time if Tae Eul isn't there at the other portal too, with the other piece of flute that we assume she got from that loser Shin-Jay.
Or maybe there's something I missed, and Lee Gon never gave the flute piece to Shin-Jay? (we don't see him doing that, so it's a grey area). Just another confusing undisclosed thing that's getting us into trouble. Maybe Lee Gon still has both pieces of the flute, or even gave a piece to Jo Yeong. I ask myself too if Tae Eul could use that flute piece because any potential "blood on the flute" problem. But if it's her period week, she should be able to fix it.

 

 

Ma friend, I’m trying to understand where your confusion is but I’m not entirely sure what you mean. 
 

1) care to elaborate more?

 

2) I thought it was understood that LG gave one half flute to SJ and they planned to travel back on a certain date and time? It wasn’t specifically shown but it was implied. SJ will bring LR, who will be able to access the portal with the flute in his hands. If SJ ends up giving the flute to JTE, she will not go alone, she will take LR with her. At the end of episode 15, JTE already took LR. I assume she asked Luna to help her steal LR. 

 

That is my understanding too from that exchange between TE & SJ when the latter questioned TE why she let go of Luna.

 

Additionally, I am guessing we will see SJ eventually accompanying TE to KOC. How could he let her go alone, after confessing his love? That completes the scooby gang in KOC!

 

[gwin]

OK, I finally finished backreading from page 757.  You guys are nuts.  I can't do live watching, but the backreading after is so difficult!

 

I understood most of what happened, though I already said I find myself disappointed with some developments.  Here are my thoughts for now:

 

1.    The postponement of Episode 14 last week really screwed up the impact of the scene in Episode 14 where LR kills his future self.   I felt that the "shock" of that revelation in Episode 14 lost its impact when we see immediately in the next episode that LR is still alive.  If Episode 14 had been our cliffhanger as originally intended, that scene would have more of an impact.  As it is right now, after we watched Episode 15 and immediately saw in the first 5 minutes that LR was still alive, LR killing himself became just a footnote.  And to be honest, completely unnecessary.  What a pity.

 

2.   Speaking of unnecessary, I do not get why KES decided to go with the "new memories" route.   As of now, I still don't see the purpose.  Wouldn't it be better if LG retained just his old memories , while JTE has the new memories only?  Especially after JTE said that the events played out almost exactly the same, only faster. 

The problem is, it's absolutely impossible to explain how LG knows that JTE hugged him in Gwanghwamun square, because that LG we saw in the hospital bed with JTE never got to experience that (that LG was stuck in the in-between, trying to get to 2020 again).  So how does he know?

 

Why, oh why, did you decide to go with this route, KES?  It's confusing and unnecessary.  PLEASE SOMEONE GIVE ME A CLEAR EXPLANATION WHY THIS IS NECESSARY.

 

3.    I think the main issue that KES has and the reason why these time travel principles that she's applying are all jumbled, is because there are too many restrictions to the time traveller in TKEM.    The most glaring restriction is the fact that time traveller LG could not go back to his present after the 1994 coup.   

 

I'll use Back to the Future again as an example.  In BTTF, after Marty alters the events of 1955, he doesn't hang around in 1955.  He goes back to his present (1985) right away.  When he goes back, his present world is already much different (his parents and siblings are more successful, his parents like his girlfriend etc, they have a nicer house etc.).   But he never got to experience the altered timeline from the time he was born until when he returned in 1985 because he was never there (he time travelled)!  As far as Marty was concerned, the memories that he had from childhood until 1985 were still the memories from the original, unaltered timeline.   Everyone else whom he returned to in 1985 (his parents, his girlfriend, his siblings), however, no longer had memories of the old timeline.

 

Now why couldn't KES have given us that logic instead?  It boggles the mind.

 

MORE THOUGHTS LATER....

 

 

[Yippeun_eonnie]

 

Please tell me we'll have a royal wedding. It KOC flag and the seating looks like a very important event most likely like a wedding 

 

2 hours ago, mrsj3n said:

But why would the throne go to LR?

He's supposed to be "dead" in KOC.

I thought he would bring back evil nasty cousin to be the puppet King since he is the so called "last" royal.

 

I guess after the new year face off scandal with LG at public festival,  everyone in KOC mostly know that LR is alive and never aged at all. That's why I assume why he killed Se Jin, because no one in the line of throne other than him with Se Jin death. 

 

2 hours ago, rambutan said:

My guess is PM killed doppelganger so that the latter can't take her place in KoC.

 

She did killed Koo Euna, that's why the scar appear because she ruin the balance by killing her doppelganger at the other world. 

 

2 hours ago, mrsj3n said:

No! I refused to accept such ending.

Someone need to give KES more books on happy ending for her research purposes.

 

I'm with you. I won't accept that kind of ending too. Although for me sometimes KES gives "too plain" ending for a great whole story plot before it. But it was still acceptable thou its not giving the "WOW" feeling on watching the ending. But that kind of ending I won't think I'll survive for days after watching it. 

Edited June 7, 2020 by Jillia
Please do not post consecutively, edit you previous post instead. Thanks!

[Phoenix Klaw]

34 minutes ago, Heilo said:

 

He wants to first get eternal life and he can get it with the whole flute without being in the between. I guess after eternal life he would seek power and he seems to be patient and not in hurry with gaining throne immediately first thing is first for him which is eternity. His ambition is pretty simple laid out and if you watch the show you will understand it immediately. He used 25 years swapping people in order to gain power in both worlds replacing powerful ppl with their peasants counterparts in order to have powerful elite people in high places. 

 

How do you think they managed to kill that woman in Jail and the camera's went off just like that he has alot of power both in ROK and KOC thru swapping people. 

 

Example that pregnant woman she was influential and powerful figure in KOC so he replaced her with her peasant counterpart in order to gain a high positive in the KOC government

 

We didn't meet many powerful people who had been replaced by a peasant counterpart. The only senior person he threatened to do that with was KSR, but that was in order to get her to do what he wanted. She was not replaced. Most of the people he placed or attempted to place in KOC were low level folks, eg, tea lady to the king, security guard,  fish monger, stable hand, shipyard workers, and many of his minions. The sister in law to KSR was threatened with a sad life in ROK was brought back in order for her to go to LA to kill Se-jin, the heir to the throne. She seemed like a socialite with no real job in the chaebol. The only influential people that comes to mind were the chaebol father and heir in ROK. If he wanted to replace powerful people in order to stage a coup, it should be ministers and generals, but we have not been shown any of them.

 

If seizing the eternal life flute was a means to get the monarchy, exactly HOW would eternal life give him the kingdom? Its not like people recognize the flute as a symbol of kingship and anyone who owns the flute rules the kingdom. That is a trope used in some other books and dramas. Eg, there is a popular Chinese martial arts novel called "Heavenly Sword and Dragon Sabre" where everyone was fighting for the Dragon Sabre, because the legend is that whoever has the Dragon Sword commands the world. But that does not seem to be the case here. 

 

And this picture of wonderful eternity and infinity hasn't fleshed out for us either, except as that place with no air and no wind. Not exactly a place you want to spend the rest of your life.

 

When LR said he was going to appear at the Memorial Service and introduce the Queen and reveal a parallel universe, I was waiting for the big nefarious plot to be revealed. But then LJH's mother committed suicide and LR was captured before that.

 

So maybe there is still a LR plan and goal to be revealed, so I am waiting.

[annchong]

I AM REPEATING - KES, IF YOU GIVE ME A MOON LOVER -LIKE ENDING, I WILL HUNT YOU DOWN!

[Wanderer062287]

AHHHH FINALLY FINISHED BACKREADING

 

Below are some of my thoughts while I was catching up to the present lol. WARNING: Extra long post ahead

 

19 hours ago, nikir said:

So if Lee Rim's death in 1994 by his past self does not affect his future self.. then even if JY dies in past.. his future shouldn't be affected right RIGHT ??

 

I think so, as long as 1994 JY kid would not be killed in any way.

 

19 hours ago, nikir said:

And JTE has now two memories of falling in love with LG?? The original timeline n the new timeline which started after she hugged LG.. how can JTE remember both? It should be 2 different timelines ..ergo 2 different JTE..not the same JTE with both memories!

 

I think we're working with only one dynamic timeline here. The events are not producing alternate timelines, rather they're altering the one timeline we're working with.

 

Here is @1ouise's explanation. Really helped for me  

 

 

19 hours ago, nikir said:

I still didn't get how LR is alive... wil wait fr the subs to check out that scene!!

 

15 hours ago, MJM said:

By the way, how come Lee Lim came back when he was killed by the young Lee Lim?

5 hours ago, Thong Thin said:

same here...confused till dont know which is left or right . Brain

 

6 hours ago, lilmisslisa said:

I am still very confused how the 2020 version of LR is still alive when he went back in time to 1994 and got himself killed by the 1994 LR. How is it that he's still alive in 2020 when LG caught back up to the time when they both left? If LR remembered the 1994 even and chose to not go back because he knew he'd get killed and stayed in the new timeline, then doesn't that mean that LG wouldn't have been able to go back also which would then mean Prince B's son wouldn't have gotten shot in the leg and limping in 2020....my brain hurts.. wish this was better explained.. :-/

 

Even if 2020 LL was killed, 1994 LL was still alive, hence he would still 'grow old', make it to 2020, which is now the episode 15 LL. When LG caught back up to the present, he essentially became the 1994 LG he saved, only now with 2 sets of memories - one from his lived experiences in his original timeline, and another one from the lived experiences of the 1994 LG he saved, which, at the moment he went back to the present, became him.

 

19 hours ago, Joanna Alfson said:

Don't remind me about that. same here 

 

Don't remind me about this either.. I went with LG and SJ. Amazing me

 

18 hours ago, CallieP said:

It has just been a few days. But it seemed to me like she was waiting a long time too for him.

 

Maybe because she knows that he is not just traveling between worlds; he is literally in another time, and there is a chance that he might not make it. That's why the longing here was stronger.

 

15 hours ago, CallieP said:

I have the same question, LR was killed by his younger self so logically, the younger self would live until the day he killed himself then he should vanish so how did he survive past that?  I don't think it was explained well just that he survived his beheading! Huh!

 

The LR we're seeing now is the 1994 LR who beheaded his 2020 self. He would not 'live until the day he killed himself' because he knows that if he goes back to talk to his 1994 self, he would get killed, so this time our LR 2.0 took a different course of action (but still ended up losing anyway lol)

 

15 hours ago, MJM said:

Also, shouldn’t there be two Lee Gons?

 

When he went back to the present, he is already the LG 2.0 who is returning into a world that is lived out by the BB LG he saved when he went back. He is one and the same person, but with a new set of memories because of the alterations he did while going back to the present. 

 

1 hour ago, wenchanteur said:

- Then how does LG2 go back in time?

 

In reference to my thoughts above, I think when LG1 went back to the present (the one we got at the start of episode 15), he has essentially merged to become one and the same person with the BB LG he saved (I think LG2 in your definition). LG2's time travel arc became one and the same with LG1. As you said, LG2 would not be able to travel back without LL2 traveling back too (which we're assuming he won't do anymore because of what happened in the past), so he never really left. BUT when LG1 has finally caught up to the present, he became an LG that both time-traveled and did not time-travel. Essentially, he ceased to be LG1, and became LG 2.0 with two sets of memories from then on. 

 

42 minutes ago, gwin said:

The problem is, it's absolutely impossible to explain how LG knows that JTE hugged him in Gwanghwamun square, because that LG we saw in the hospital bed with JTE never got to experience that (that LG was stuck in the in-between, trying to get to 2020 again).  So how does he know?

 

I guess my thoughts above can apply to this too. He has memories from his original timeline, but once he returned and become the very same BB LG he saved when he went back to the past, he acquired a new set of memories - the ones that BB LG lived.

 

12 hours ago, koreaboooo said:

Honestly they can just skip having a second female lead. LG is too into JTE to even turn heads for a need for second female lead. PM is there for eye candy.

 

I think the character of PM is not meant to be a 2nd love interest for LG - that was never going to happen. Instead, the threat from her is her greed. She can either do something politically to undermine LG, or, as we saw, she can side with the traitors. Her character is not really for a love triangle; she is a threat to the King.

 

12 hours ago, jerboa83 said:

3) Lee Gon and Lee Rim's final confrontation seemed quite anticlimactic to me... I was like "Well, that's it? They shoot him in the leg and capture him just like that?"

 

Same thoughts. But I guess its redeeming factor for me was that he was with JY and SJ, implying that though he had so much time and so many chances to capture LL, he couldn't have done it without these two.

 

EDIT: I change my mind. I think the ultimate confrontation is still about to happen in episode 16, when LG and JY go back to the past to kill LL once and for all.

 

12 hours ago, jerboa83 said:

4) Hadn't Lee Rim eaten poisoned food? He even spat some blood... Time had stopped, so the antidote was useless: how was he walking around like that, fine and dandy?

 

I think maybe he didn't get to ingest too much of the poison, since he only took one bite and then spat out the food.

 

12 hours ago, Heretorant said:

7) They catch LR. Don’t ask me how SJ made it that far. Wasn’t he supposed to have been frozen? Lol. But it is what it is. 

 

I've always been confused by this. So let's say LL is traveling with his minions. When they pop out to the other world and time is still frozen, do the minions freeze too? Or are they moving normally with LL?

 

11 hours ago, AgentQuake said:

It's funny - PM and SJ both came from poor, destitute families.  SJ had the terrible parent, PM had a great parent.  Both worked themselves to become civil servants to help the public.  One became a pillar of good, the other a pillar of evil.

 

Sorry to cut this one short but oh my god this whole post. I totally agree with you. SJ is such an underrated character. No, we even got to the point where he hated him because he seemed to be useless. But wow what a character we have here. I said I would stop crying this morning, but reading this turns me back into a wreck again 

 

8 hours ago, Orientalfan said:

Greed has been a main reason why leaders met their downfall. 

 

This couldn't be more relevant, especially with our political climate nowadays. The only difference is, unfortunately greed is not leading them to their downfall; instead, it's making them gain more power. How ironic.

 

10 hours ago, kboramint said:

This feels like a cop out. 

 

We are going to get an ending where LG and JY goes back to save  young LG but also kills LL which saves LG's doppleganger from dying as a child, and he grows up to be an adult. Young LG grows up not knowing who JTE is because he never grabbed the nametag, and therefore never went to ROK to meet JTE in Episode 1.

 

Time jump to  2022, JTE has no memory of LG but suddenly meets LG's doppleganger and feels some kind of connection. 

 

In the spoiler we saw, she broke down after seeing LJH, so I don't think at that point she only felt a 'connection' - she knew the guy, only it isn't the guy she knows. I think somehow JTE retained her memories after the butterfly effect. I'm not sure how this would work, but I guess we'll see next week.

 

9 hours ago, Alice Wonderland said:

I wish Luna can get a donor and live a new life. She met LJH and live replacing JTE in ROK. JTE choose to live in KOC with her king husband, LG. JY marries MSA. JTE deliver the firstborn crown prince. Once in a while, like they're having a vacation overseas. They all go for short holiday to ROK visit ES and NR there. They held a housewarming party and Luna will come with dad, making real TE a bit emotional but managed to handle her feelings for the sake of everyone. The crown prince got a new friends and they're playing around while the parents are having some small talks. Ahhhh.... it's an ending I want. This way it compensates all the tears and worries we have for months. They deserve happy ending. It's like a saying I keep hearing in dramas "you're granted with a blessed and prosperity life after you save a country in the previous life" it's what LG did. He sacrifices his own happiness for saving the world. 

 

All the baddies got beheaded or prisoned for life. That's all I want! Is it too much??

 

Omooooo I totally love this but as for Luna, I hope she and SJ will end up together. 

 

7 hours ago, lindas55 said:

The old prince told him what would happen if he followed his fate. The King has accepted that “the footsteps “he” takes by risking “his” life is what is his fate.” To follow his destiny there is no other choice because there is “a place he needs to reach even at the risk of his life”.

 

Can y'all stop making me cry already

 

6 hours ago, Elnin Joery said:

I don't think it's officially out his enlisting date he can prolong it a year or 2 imo 

 

I hope he does prolong it so we can still potentially get season 2 yayy wishful thinking

 

5 hours ago, 122am said:

16 eps is just too short for this type of epic plotline. It's too rushed. There isn't a breather in between the scenes. For example, in Goblin, the actors had time to argue and cook, or go out and take a walk. In Mr Sunshine, there are wide-angle shots of beautiful scenery and landscapes. The premise is good and I can see a lot of research went on to establish the timing and the mathematics.

 

I couldn't agree with you more. Why do they have to compress this epic story in 16 episodes huhu. A season 2, if against all odds it happens, can continue the story and the world-building, but it's still not gonna be able to flesh out the story that we have now. It's gonna be a different story with a different plot. So yes I wish it were longer, but I also appreciate the fact that we had to understand many aspects of the drama on our own because it allowed us to invest and connect deeper with it, something that I probably would not have felt if I was just watching it casually with everything being fed to me. Though I must admit, it might have been the other way around for a lot of people, considering that many dropped the drama because of its confusing storyline.

 

I'm definitely on camp season 2. The worlds and the premise are just to big to be left just like that.

 

3 hours ago, realistic2280a said:

Hmm... cam someone tell me HOW Lee Gon can choose the timeline he wants to go bk to?

 

I don't think he can choose. He is only taken back by the manpasikjeok to the night of the treason. Maybe when the manpa- is whole again, he can (hence the 50s looking blast from the past spoilers we got).

 

 

[Rosemary83]

33 minutes ago, gwin said:

Speaking of unnecessary, I do not get why KES decided to go with the "new memories" route.   As of now, I still don't see the purpose.  Wouldn't it be better if LG retained just his old memories , while JTE has the new memories only?  Especially after JTE said that the events played out almost exactly the same, only faster. 

The problem is, it's absolutely impossible to explain how LG knows that JTE hugged him in Gwanghwamun square, because that LG we saw in the hospital bed with JTE never got to experience that (that LG was stuck in the in-between, trying to get to 2020 again).  So how does he know?

 

It is absolutely essential. Because that's the only way to demonstrate to us that we have exactly the same girl . Who went through everything, like LG. And their story is still real.  Otherwise, it would have ruined all their story we had been watching during 13 episodes.  Her new experience, although similar to the previous one, is different and it's fundamental  to perceive their couple as always and what they went through.

 

And LG remembers a new meeting in the square, because as her memories changed, so did his. Another thing is that we were not shown how our LG and LG from the new time loop synchronized. Where was the new LG at at the beginning of the ep??? He couldn't return to the past because the new LR didn't. 

[ck1Oz]

I still haven't watched episode 13- 15 and don't intend to till episode 16 airs.

 

In the midst of all the speculations does the meaning or name " omnipotent " get mentioned. That's the meaning in Korean. Since I didn't know what the Korean fans are speculating.

[gwin]

21 minutes ago, Rosemary83 said:

 

It is absolutely essential. Because that's the only way to demonstrate to us that we have exactly the same girl . Who went through everything, like LG. And their story is still real.  Otherwise, it would have ruined all their story we had been watching during 13 episodes.  Her new experience, although similar to the previous one, is different and it's fundamental  to perceive their couple as always and what they went through.

 

And LG remembers a new meeting in the square, because as her memories changed, so did his. Another thing is that we were not shown how our LG and LG from the new time loop synchronized. Where was the new LG at at the beginning of the ep??? He couldn't return to the past because the new LR didn't. 

 

But how did LG remember what happened in the alternate timeline?  How?  During that time (from 1994-2020) he was stuck trying to get back to her.  

 

LG has always been in the in-between place from 1994-2020, and occasionally going out to meet JTE at certain points in time.  That much is clear to us, because he didn't age and he didn't change appearance (or clothing).  He said himself that he couldn't keep on visiting her at various points in time because the flute was slowly disintegrating.

 

And take note, their memories did not change.  Based on the dialogue (unless the subtitles are wrong again), it seems that they remember both the initial timeline and the new timeline.    The old events did not change.

I'm not being sarcastic, but from a storytelling perspective, the could not have gained those memories.

 

And I'm not even talking about the other people around them... so now what... they have also two memories?

 

 

I enjoy this show, I really do, but this is one storytelling booboo they didn't have to make, really.

[wenchanteur]

54 minutes ago, mychoiyoung said:

 

That is my understanding too from that exchange between TE & SJ when the latter questioned TE why she let go of Luna.

 

Additionally, I am guessing we will see SJ eventually accompanying TE to KOC. How could he let her go alone, after confessing his love? That completes the scooby gang in KOC!

 

 

Ah ah, I just come from BOD blog, and writed that too.

[mrsj3n]

Hi everyone..  

It's me again.

 

Let me share some optimism.

Don't click if you don't want to be spoiled:

Spoiler

I'm not kidding.

I'm really trying to be optimistic here.

 

Click if you confirm you want it!

Spoiler

LAST CHANCE!!!

 

Spoiler

HERE IT IS:

 

 

 

 

 

 

[blobbityblobbityblob]

I keep rewatching the episode and does anyone share the same thoughts as I do? I really like the scene where JTE is pleading for KSJ to give her the flute piece and to let her go and KSJ trying to make her stay so she won't die... I think that might be my favourite scene in the episode, followed closely by the scene where LG says goodbye to JTE (goshdarnit they really had to cram so many heartbreaking scenes in one episode)

The music was so on point, and the acting too...

I never really got super invested in KSJ's story but to me that point somehow broke me real hard when KSJ confessed (and as others have said earlier it isn't because he wants her to love him back but it's a desperation to cling on to something real in his life and keeping her alive since his life has basically been nightmares... and she's basically the closest thing that is real to him)

And also how JTE took things into her own hands and basically couldn't bear to wait anymore for LG and instead commit to following her destiny no matter where it took her (to death or to LG or to wherever). Oof... And I think the translation on Netflix is a bit off I'm pretty sure she didn't say "Please help me" she said "Please save me" followed by how she thinks she would die if she doesn't leave... That really hit me hard ;-; 

That scene was legendary to me. Am I the exception in thinking of it so highly? I keep watching it and I keep crying arghhh

Ah yes, I'm still a loser (LIGHTING OF THE SHOES WHYYY)

[Wanderer062287]

17 minutes ago, gwin said:

 

But how did LG remember what happened in the alternate timeline?  How?  During that time (from 1994-2020) he was stuck trying to get back to her.  

 

LG has always been in the in-between place from 1994-2020, and occasionally going out to meet JTE at certain points in time.  That much is clear to us, because he didn't age and he didn't change appearance (or clothing).  He said himself that he couldn't keep on visiting her at various points in time because the flute was slowly disintegrating.

 

And take note, their memories did not change.  Based on the dialogue (unless the subtitles are wrong again), it seems that they remember both the initial timeline and the new timeline.    The old events did not change.

I'm not being sarcastic, but from a storytelling perspective, the could not have gained those memories.

 

And I'm not even talking about the other people around them... so now what... they have also two memories?

 

 

I enjoy this show, I really do, but this is one storytelling booboo they didn't have to make, really.

 

Idk but I don't really see it as a mistake or sumth. It's just a very different approach to time travel. They're not creating new timelines; they are altering a single timeline. May I quote some of my previous thoughts?

 

40 minutes ago, Wanderer062287 said:

When he went back to the present, he is already the LG 2.0 who is returning into a world that is lived out by the BB LG he saved when he went back. He is one and the same person, but with a new set of memories because of the alterations he did while going back to the present. 

 

40 minutes ago, Wanderer062287 said:

In reference to my thoughts above, I think when LG1 went back to the present (the one we got at the start of episode 15), he has essentially merged to become one and the same person with the BB LG he saved (I think LG2 in your definition). LG2's time travel arc became one and the same with LG1. As you said, LG2 would not be able to travel back without LL2 traveling back too (which we're assuming he won't do anymore because of what happened in the past), so he never really left. BUT when LG1 has finally caught up to the present, he became an LG that both time-traveled and did not time-travel. Essentially, he ceased to be LG1, and became LG 2.0 with two sets of memories from then on. 

 

40 minutes ago, Wanderer062287 said:

I guess my thoughts above can apply to this too. He has memories from his original timeline, but once he returned and become the very same BB LG he saved when he went back to the past, he acquired a new set of memories - the ones that BB LG lived.

 

Although I must say you raised a very good point regarding the rest of the world having different sets of memories now (those who would have had been affected by any of the effects of LG's actions). Maybe in our terms it's what we can refer to as a deja vu of some sort. Im just not sure if that's a good enough explanation.

[madmad min]

18 minutes ago, gwin said:

But how did LG remember what happened in the alternate timeline?  How?  During that time (from 1994-2020) he was stuck trying to get back to her. 

 

Its the Same way How did JY/SJ/JTE remember what Their PAST versions did. 

 

In terms of IT, OS version is same a patch is applied which leads an OS with better Functionality lol.

 

Lets just say OUR LG and OUR JTE got seperated, OUR LG placed memories onto PAST JTE and hence JTE became upgraded patched with New memories.

 

Essentially the same thing happened with LG.

 

Upgraded LG had new memories patched onto by PAST JTE who then already had OUR LG's memory of him.visiting her in 2016 and 94, PAST JTE became more responsive had earlier and sweeter actions.

 

Now both OUR LG and OUR JTE even if they are in the OWN TIMELINE have upgraded memories because one and the other patched/instilled those actions differently what now is their past.

 

Essentially there are still 1 flute half of each with other, 1 LG; 1 JTE.BOTG JTE/LG merged somehow with their own self.

 

LG1/LG2=LGUpgraded.

Lg was not reinstalled he was just Upgraded.

 

This is Single timeline Altercation like someone said above.

 

[Rosemary83]

Just now, gwin said:

 

But how did LG remember what happened in the alternate timeline?  How?  During that time (from 1994-2020) he was stuck trying to get back to her. 

 

And take note, their memories did not change.  Based on the dialogue (unless the subtitles are wrong again), it seems that they remember both the initial timeline and the new timeline.    The old events did not change.

 

And I'm not even talking about the other people around them... so now what... they have also two memories?

 Because He has to be synchronized with new LG. Or you think the last one just disappeared?) 

 This is what I called a change of memories - when new ones from a new time loop are added to their old ones. Yes, the old ones didn't change.  Everyone involved remembers (JY. SJ.TE.) - what we were shown. Others - I guess, the same. The girl investigator  remembered that there was no recording of a telephone conversation before) But the main characters know what all the changes and new memories are connected with, for others this may seem like a mystery. The question is how significant they are for the rest)

[karamelswirl]

18 hours ago, AgentQuake said:

Spoiler

Hmmm...if Yeong dies while going back in time, then technically there still IS a Yeong in 2020, it just isn't the one that we've been seeing all along.  Because if they succeed, once 4 year old Yeong grows up and hits that day in 2020, he would have no need to go back in time and will continue living out his life. 

 

So here's what we still have to see in 16, based on promos and spoilers.

  Reveal hidden contents

• Re-do of gun battle
• JY getting hurt or dying
• Lee Ji Hun back to life, JTE passing him in the streets and crying
• A scene that was shot with Nari/Sin Jae/JTE at The Alley, one of the 3 final scenes shot.  WDH is also there with ES and JY styling.
• 1939 scene with JTE/LG
• Scene on the beach with LG in his trench coat from their Instagrams
• POSSIBLE jacket of doom redo?  Will explain below.
• 1 of 3 final scenes shot in LG's bedroom/chambers with Lady Noh, JTE, LG
• May 27, 2022 scene in front of the bookstore with yo yo kid
• Ugly wedding chairs scene

 

Here are my two prevalent theories right now -

 

Jacket of Doom - I think the flowers tell it all.  The future changed.  Until the moment the flowers vanished, at some point in the future, LG was going to put on the jacket of doom, come to TE, and lay out all his regrets and say goodbye to her one last time.  The flowers were proof that it happened.  If LG in the future never comes to her, she may still have the memory, but the physical proof if it didn't happen.  I think that's what got JTE off her richard simmons so fast - she probably realized that if he sacrifices himself right now, there's no LG to come back in time to her. 

 

Granted, the flowers disappearing could also indicate a HAPPY ending.  LG never regrets not telling her he loves her, or that he hasn't given her flowers, because they're living happily after ever and he tells her he loves her and gives her flowers every day.  But at this point for them, that sort of optimism isn't there and nobody can see it.  So she's chasing her own optimism and going to help him.  Or get stuck with him.  The scene where she swaps herself with Luna pretty much proves that she's saying yes to his proposal.  Even if it's a proposal to die together instead of marriage. Just like LG tried to plan for his successor, she planned for hers.

 

Luna - that brings me to my second theory.  I think they're going to Parent Trap the next part of their lives.  She's trusting Luna enough to 1. go fetch LL without betraying them, and 2. telling her to protect her dad and her friends.  JTE is a bigger person than I am, I would've stabbed Luna in the throat.  But despite all that happens, JTE is offering her a happy ending, and she is actually genuine.  JTE's offer is essentially the same as LL's offer.  Steal the enemy, get a loving life.  But JTE is genuine, and I think that means a lot to Luna.

 

So JTE goes to KOC and becomes Queen, Luna lives as JTE and gets to live a loving life.  Maybe they swap back and forth.  They could be the balance that the Yo Yo kid is talking about.  That's why he's helped them both and why JTE is casually walking back and forth on her birthday in 2022.  It's possible that JTE and Luna switched briefly so she can celebrate her birthday with her dad.

 

Am now picturing Luna locked up in the study while LG and JY glare daggers at her while waiting for the Queen to come back.  Queen comes back in a fireman's carry by Jangmi 2.0 because she's slow AF.

 

I have just registered on this website to say that I love this theory and I hope the happy ending comes true.

Edited June 7, 2020 by Jillia
Quote too long