[Drama 2018] Mr. Sunshine, 미스터 션샤인 - Winner of Critics’ Choice Award for Drama category

[tzupi]

38 minutes ago, charray said:

I did not quite understand what Lord Go mean when he said that he is the black bird over Eugene. Is he implying that Eugene has to accept his decision since he is the elder here being Ae Shin’s grandpa, in a way acknowledging Ae Shin’s relationship with Eugene? 

Yes, something along these lines.

First, by using the black bird comparison, Lord Go acknowledges that he remembers Eugene. And also that he was impressed with Eugene's wisdom.

Second, I think Lord Go tries to force Eugene to make a decision about his nationality.

Eugene was always a character that hid behind his American nationality. He uses it as a cover, but also as an excuse. We saw him coming a long way from the first episodes where he did not want to have anything to do with Joseon, but he is still clinging to his American nationality. He helps Joseon people, not the country. (he accepted his instructor job for protecting AS and the potter).

 

So I think Lord Go tries to push him even more out of his comfort zone and make him be clearer on what side he is fighting.

EC is in the safest position now, for him there is always a possibility of leaving and we saw AS's scenes in America were very dreamy, it is like a paradise. It is in a way like the blue sky.

By requesting to kill Mori, lord Go made it difficult for Eugene to have the safe alternative (I also think this safe alternative is more wishful thinking, for America was never so nice for Eugene as AS was dreaming).

If Eugene kills Mori, I do not know if he can return to being an American soldier. So killing Mori, it is, in my opinion, giving up on being an American soldier.

 

This is my interpretation, kind of very convoluted. Of course, there is also the easy interpretation: Lord Go is the black bird because he does not want to see Eugene with AS.

 

 

 

[mistymorning]

29 minutes ago, tzupi said:

Of course, there is also the easy interpretation: Lord Go is the black bird because he does not want to see Eugene with AS.

 

 

 

This+a. Lord Go is basically saying he knows he is ruining Eugene. Exactly like little Eugene said, a black bird can ruin the whole sky. 

 

The task Lord Go gave Eugene, killing the head of Japanese military as an American means there is really small wriggle room Eugene can have. Higher chance of serious consequence if Eugene is found out as a killer. So no happy ever after with Aeshin, and looks like Lord Go doesn't mind that either. 

[andy78]

27 minutes ago, tzupi said:

If Eugene kills Mori, I do not know if he can return to being an American soldier. So killing Mori, it is, in my opinion, giving up on being an American soldier

i agree....the old man was very cruel to both men...

[Guest]

 

A country can invade and take over another country, it can bring on destruction & death.  Evil, greed and small minded men like Mori will believe that they will forever have the upper hand.  That power, cruelty, and the control of preying on the weak and defenseless.  Will destroy the spirit of the Joseon people and the love that lies rooted within their hearts for their country.

Not So...

 

That hanging a woman for all to see to bring fear or trying to stop them from showing respect or honor to those traditions and values and people that they hold so dear. 

One can do all of that and yet the one thing that no man can touch or take from another not even in their last breath.  Is their true sense of self who and what they are and that which lies within them that cannot be seen, taken or destroyed. 

unless given... Freely ...

 

[ces8]

I cant help but to join the thread ...been a silent lurker for a while...my heart is in explosion right now...

Lee Wan Ik is such a brilliant and effective actor...he made me hate the character so much...the scenes from the last episode made me remember the plight of my ancestors when the Japanese invaded our country...Im excited when I saw Ae Sin at the rooftop it was a beacon of hope in a moment of bleak situation and future.

I am so proud of Hui Song. (don't know the spelling) He wasn't that worthless un-employed playboy afterall. I hope that nothing had happened to the lady servant and confidante of Ae Sin but death is inevitable. I am thrilled and been holding my seat for the next episode... 

 

 

 

[tzupi]

2 hours ago, mistymorning said:

This+a. Lord Go is basically saying he knows he is ruining Eugene. Exactly like little Eugene said, a black bird can ruin the whole sky. 

 

The task Lord Go gave Eugene, killing the head of Japanese military as an American means there is really small wriggle room Eugene can have. Higher chance of serious consequence if Eugene is found out as a killer. So no happy ever after with Aeshin, and looks like Lord Go doesn't mind that either. 

Yes, but Lord Go does not seem to be a cruel person. This is why I do not think he did it with the intention of ruining Eugene. And it is not clear to me that he necessarily wanted to keep Eugene and AS apart. But one thing that probably he does not want is for AS to leave the country.

What he requested from Eugene was to sacrifice something for the country (not only for some Joseon people and something important).

But I do not necessarily see this as a bad thing, for if Eugene really kills Mori, there would be no turning back for Eugene, he would become a Joseon person. If that happens, he would have bigger chances to end with AS. Because I do not see her going with him to the States.

 

 

[mistergenie]

2 hours ago, mistymorning said:

This+a. Lord Go is basically saying he knows he is ruining Eugene. Exactly like little Eugene said, a black bird can ruin the whole sky. 

 

The task Lord Go gave Eugene, killing the head of Japanese military as an American means there is really small wriggle room Eugene can have. Higher chance of serious consequence if Eugene is found out as a killer. So no happy ever after with Aeshin, and looks like Lord Go doesn't mind that either. 

 

YEP. THIS^^

 

Dong Mae put it succinctly well to Eugene - the old man ensured that both of us could not get close to his granddaughter - by giving Eugene a high stakes, possibly perilous mission to kill Mori, a mission that would require his undivided attention plus put his life at risk and OTOH, paying money to DM to act as Ae Shin's bodyguard thereby ensuring DM maintaining a healthy, professional distance from Ae Shin.  

 

2 hours ago, andy78 said:

i agree....the old man was very cruel to both men...

I can understand him being cruel to Dong Mae but to twist the knife into Eugene was a low blow by Grandpa Go because he already knew that Ae Shin's heart belonged to Eugene yet he still went ahead and tried to make sure that Eugene would stay away from her due to his mission.

[mistymorning]

2 hours ago, tzupi said:

Yes, but Lord Go does not seem to be a cruel person. This is why I do not think he did it with the intention of ruining Eugene. And it is not clear to me that he necessarily wanted to keep Eugene and AS apart. But one thing that probably he does not want is for AS to leave the country.

What he requested from Eugene was to sacrifice something for the country (not only for some Joseon people and something important).

But I do not necessarily see this as a bad thing, for if Eugene really kills Mori, there would be no turning back for Eugene, he would become a Joseon person. If that happens, he would have bigger chances to end with AS. Because I do not see her going with him to the States.

 

 

Well, if you remember, this is the scene.(subtitle from Netflix, well mostly)

 

Lord Go:(to DM) I heard you will do anything for a price. (giving DM money) That is all I can give you. Please Protect Aeshin.

Lord Go:(to EC) You said you don't want Joseon to fall. I feel the same. I beg of you. Please kill the Japanese colonel.

DM: Why am I the protector and he is the killer.

Lord Go: A man who will provide protection by any means necessary and a man who will not allow any mistake along the way. It's the difference between a man who scales the wall and a man who will enter through the door.

EC: Why it's not LWI but that Japanese soldier?

Lord Go: Lee Wanik can be killed by the hands of Joseon man. However, if a Joseon man kills that Japanese soldier, it will give Japan a reason to attack Joseon. That's why I'm leaving it to you, an American soldier.

EC:(losing light in his eyes, and with a shaken voice) You're... so very cruel to me.

Lord Go: You can blame me all you want. I intend to become the black bird to your sky.

EC(looking down).

 

(scene change) Outside beside the fallen wall.

DM: In the end, he got both of us well away from Lady Aeshin. He made me protect her, and you a killer. Cruel old man.

EC(monologue): It doesn't matter who is the saddest. We walk on our own paths, but will reach the same place in the end. I love you. (showing Aeshin in the shed) So my dear, please stay alive. Eventually, no one's ending will be a happy one.

 

From this exchange, I think it's official to say Lord Go's request to Eugene is a cruel one. I think, basically Lord Go and Aeshin come from the same mould. They share the code what to do with a great cause, and while Aeshin loves Eugene so will not put him in danger unnecessarily, Lord Go doesn't and comparing to the great cause of Joseon, Eugene is an acceptable sacrifice. Lord Go also applied same priciples to himself and only exception is Aeshin.

 

For killing Takashi, because US and Japan were allies then, if Eugene were to be found as a killer he could be prosecuted as a murderer in the military court. Considering the position Mori has, I don't expect a good result from it. So.. what Lord Go is asking Eugene is a grave sacrifice, which could mean his life.

 

 

 

[aurelionsol]

Eugene probably kill Takashi Mori in duel (Jemulpo Temple)

(the duel of officers is frequent in these times in many countries, they were often fought when they were offended or some honorable case)

 

Mori probably will want see result his actions and Eugene go with Kyle/american soldiers

 

Mori: "You have been making a stand where you shouldn't be"

Eugene: "Because I'm going to kill you"

preview after ep 18, both of them has not spoken these sentence yet

 

[rubie]

What a twist.. Such a cruel but necessary action by Lord Go, he's not going to make things easy for anyone after he's gone.. he wants to ensure the best 'legacy' for his granddaughter. He may not be around anymore.. but he has the life insurance and a revenge plan all set up for Ae Shin.

 

Big thanks to everyone for the enlightenment (great discussion as always).. although it's really the hardest part of the drama to learn and take in right now. 

 

Source: TV Daily

 

[bedifferent]

AGB Nielsen Ratings:

 

Episode 1   7/7/18       8.852%

Episode 2   7/8/18       9.691%

Episode 3   7/14/18    10.082%

Episode 4   7/15/18    10.567%

Episode 5   7/21/18    10.835%

Episode 6   7/22/18     11.713%

Episode 7  7/28/18      11.114%

Episode 8  7/29/18      12.330%

Episode 9  8/3/18        11.695%

Episode 10  8/4/18      13.534%

Episode 11  8/11/18    12.792%

Episode 12  8/12/18    13.399%

Episode 13  8/18/18    13.327%

Episode 14  8/19/18    15.626%

Episode 15  8/25/18     12.893%

Episode 16  8/26/18   15.023%

Episode 17  9/1/18        7.694%

Episode 18  9/2/18     14.722%

Episode 19  9/8/18      14.114%

 

Source

[rubie]

A tribute.. for a great companion.. 

 

Source: Will Entertainment via YTN

 

[aurelionsol]

I think Mrs Haman still alive - she lost consciousness (stone? the camera was strangely directed)

[elfvanvan]

My poor poor heart.. 

I think i will watch it after all episode is done..cause i dont think i can take anymore heartache

So its really a guns, glory and sad ending.. 

[rubie]

39 minutes ago, aurelionsol said:

I think Mrs Haman still alive - she probably fell and lost consciousness (stone? the camera was strangely directed)

 

Hopefully... I hope she's ok but have to prepare for the worst. 

 

It looks like she got shot (accidentally) by the bullet from the Japanese soldier that Lady Cho hit with her arrow. Everything so chaotic and happening so fast. But.. who knows.. your thoughts might be right. They didn't show her face after she fell.

[charray]

How did Lord Go die? He just died in his sleep? Is it heart attack ? Or he had committed suicide? Did they mention anything or I had missed it?

[aurelionsol]

27 minutes ago, rubie said:

 

Hopefully... I hope she's ok but have to prepare for the worst. 

 

But I think she got shot (accidentally) by the bullet from the Japanese soldier that Lady Cho hit with her arrow. Everything so chaotic and happening so fast. But.. who knows.. your thoughts might be right. They didn't show her face after she fell.

 

Maybe barque - I really think shot was not deadly and japanese soldier missed essential parts of the body

 

The problem is that sometimes you see blood and sometimes there is no blood effect (japanese soldiers)

so that's just my guess

[mistergenie]

18 minutes ago, charray said:

How did Lord Go die? He just died in his sleep? Is it heart attack ? Or he had committed suicide? Did they mention anything or I had missed it?

 

Unclear but the way he prepared everything, from his will to setting his affairs in order, made me think it was suicide.

[KDramaLogic]

 

Hi Soompiers.  Now that I've had time to process all these harrowing events in today's episode, I'll give my 2 cents on all this.

 

Standard disclaimer:

1. Apologies in advance for the long post AND multiple quotes. 

2. Please let me know if I've missed any significant plot point and/or characterization.

 

On 9/3/2018 at 8:26 AM, andy78 said:

 

this is a fact!!!we know otp won't be able to stop that....is just the begining of a long war and will not have a happy end ...we know what happened  don't we?

 

Hi @andy78. Sorry to cut your post short.  Oh, and off topic, crossing my fingers for the long-overdue JonXArya reunion (and the epic finale of GoT in 2019)!

 

Given what's happened up until today and the real-life tragic outcome of the Japanese colonization of Korea, I'm very curious- more like anxious- about how what kind of fates KES will lay out for our beloved characters, especially AS and EC.

 

First, I want to give AS a huge shout-out and kudos for:

1. Not backing down due to DM's unwarranted cutting of her hair and actually telling him off (while holding the sword to his neck...), and

2. Not letting DM's unwarranted action, her grief for her grandfather's death, or WI's orders of shooting down the funeral profession deter her from picking up her rifle (and her uniform) and joining the (RA?) shooters in fighting the Japanese soliders and protecting our ever-meaningful-but-defenseless HS (though I hope Haman survives!)

 

That being said (and I apologize for repeating this mantra), I do hope that KES shows scenes of AS contemplating her future and safety (and that of EC and her other loved ones),  as well as the actions (or lack thereof) of the RA, the Joseon king (Gojong or Sunyong? I'm losing track), and the supposed allies including the U.S. that will eventually leave Joseon Korea in the midst of the inevitable Japanese conquer of Joseon Korea.  Don't get me wrong; AS has shown that she's capable of defending herself (and her love/relationship with EC) no matter what, as well as continuing her fight for Joseon independence in or outside Korea.  But now that AS' grandfather aka Lord Go died AND WI had the audacity to besiege the Go household before and during the funeral procession, whatever security (and lifestyle) AS had as a Joseon noblewoman is basically over.  Not to mention that, as you said in the quoted post above, neither the OTP nor the RA will succeed in preventing the 30 years (or more) of oppression and atrocities by the Japanese (including the Comfort Women that the Japanese government, to this day, continues to dismiss) that the Joseon people of all social classes (and everyone else who were under the Japanese colonization during the 1900-1945 timeline) who were stuck in Korea will suffer.  So, AS (and EC and other characters) will need to reconsider whether or not it's worth risking her life (and her relationship with EC, if he survives) for a virtually losing battle/war that, as we've learned from history and/or Wikpedia, neither the Joseon government (namely, King/Emperor Gojong and Sunyong) nor the supposed allies (i.e., U.S.) bothered defending all the way.

 

By the way, in another post you mentioned today, I concur that AS' grandfather's expectations for EC (and, to a lesser extent, DM) are cruel, which, according to Netflix subtitles, AS' grandfather himself admitted.  I'd add that AS' grandfather's reasoning behind said expectations, like DM's reasoning for cutting off AS' hair, will have little or no effect on ensuring AS' protection in the midst of the Japanese annexation of Joseon Korea, especially while WI- and Takeshi Mori- is still around.

1. Again, WI already tried uprooting (and killing) the Go household while AS' grandfather was still alive.  Obviously, WI could care less about AS' (or her family's) noble class status.  Heck, WI could care more-or-less about whatever the Joseon king/emperor thinks or does to him, as long as WI doesn't die and/or lose his power...

2, As for EC, well, @mistergenie, @mistymorning, @anipanch, and@rubie (and other Soompiers I may have forgotten to mention) already highlighted the dire consequences that EC would face if he, as a U.S. soldier rather than a Joseon person, were to do AS' grandfather's bidding and kill off the Japanese soldier Mori.  I'd also add that, considering (unless I've been misinformed or KES pulls another creative liberties with the Joseon era at this point of the drama) that the U.S. will eventually pull out of Joseon Korea, EC's overall position and actions will be compromised, whether he chooses to leave with the U.S. army at the expense of AS' (and the Joseon people's) livelihood/future or stay with AS in Joseon at the expense of his immunity as a (highly-ranked?) U.S. soldier.

 

I get that AS' grandfather wants to protect AS, and that he doesn't trust EC's alliance with the U.S. (although I'm nonplussed over AS' grandfather's entrusting of DM to protect AS when he barely knew DM as much as he knew EC).  Nevertheless, WI, Mori, and other Japanese (and their supporters) no longer regard the Joseon noble status and instead will persecute (and execute) anyone of any social status who declares opposition to the Japanese rule.

 

 

 

9 hours ago, rubie said:

Gunner Jang finally got his moment of revenge on LWI. But feel so bad & sad for him about HongPa .. they never showed her meeting him again after he got promoted as the Palace Security Chief, did they? He must get a chance to whip that Mori really really good. Perhaps, it's Eugene and SG who kidnapped Takashi Mori. I'm pretty much guessing now.. tonight's episode is just too much..

 

@KDramaLogic I believe only Eugene knew about LWI directly killing Ae Shin's parents but he hasn't told her about it.

 

A one-shot kill for LWI is too easy for a traitor and villain and enemy of the country... make that 5x. 

 

Hi @rubie!  As always, I appreciate your feedback and updates on the ongoing stress-inducing progression of Mr. Sunshine.  I know the cast and crew earned their well-deserved after-party; now, I can only hope we'll make it to the end relatively unscathed, which, unfortunately, I cannot say the same for our beloved characters yet...

 

Thanks for the clarification regarding who knows about WI's involvement in AS' parents' death.  Now, what I'm uncertain of (and hoping that it isn't so) is whether or not WI knows about AS' relations to her parents yet.  If not, then, as much as I understand EC's reasons for not disclosing this matter to AS, AS should know about this before WI makes that connection (along with AS' involvement in the RA/ fight for Joseon independence) and threatens the livelihoods of AS, EC, and everyone else in Joseon.  If anything, AS will have more cause to avenge her parents and her grandfather (and any other member of the Go household who have not undermined AS) and finish off WI once and for all!

 

Speaking of which, I also share your sentiments regarding WI's needing more than one shot as a villain and traitor to Joseon (and his family including HN).  But I don't want WI to survive any longer than needed before more damage is done in both the drama and Joseon, even though I'd normally prefer that WI's death be drawn out.  Perhaps Gunner Jang Seung-gu (as sworn in both Ep. 1 and Ep. 19), HN (I know she's WI's daughter, but WI did sell her off in a forsaken marriage and future that she most certainly didn't agree to at the beginning), and others directly impacted by WI's vile actions can join in right after AS shoots first.  Think of it as a long-overdue poetic justice....

[lilyphenix]

Why does this TV show make me cry so much?