[Drama 2021] Vincenzo, 빈센조

[raziela]

2 hours ago, bee_wannabe said:

 

@raziela i'm glad that you mention that conversation between VC and Hong Shik. I love that conversation. Although part of me still feel conflicted about it since it means that each of us just need to do well in what we do and not to meddle with others and this world's affair. I need to go back to that scene to digest it. 

I rewatched that scene again and transcribed the subtitles.

"Leaving the past behind and becoming a new person.  Forget all that.  Do what you do best.  That's what you can do to help the wold"

I actually understood the conversation differently.  I thought what Hong Sik was saying was more like: Vincenzio shouldn't try to be something he isn't. He can't erase the past so he should use the skills and abilities he has to help others. 

 

I could be misinterpreting.  It's hard for a non-speaker like me because Netflix subtitles leave out a lot of depth and nuance.

 

Anyhow, I loved that little conversation and insight into Hong-Shik's past.  The actor, Choi Deok Moon, just seems so cool.  I'm glad we finally got a bit of follow-up on his amazing scissr skills. I really would have liked to seen more him in the drama.  I just don't know what the writer was thinking giving the residents so much screen time to just be shallow gag characters for nearly two-thirds of the drama and only starting to develop them from episode 14 out of a 20 episode drama. 

 

The Lee couple are another example.  We only learn in episode 15 that for some reason Mr Lee didn't want to have kids but they have suddenly decided to try for a baby and episode 16 she is pregnant! Huh? Why not mention this childfree issue before?  See them discuss or argue about it? See Yeon-jin chat to Hee Soo or Miri about it?  Literally, these kind of scenes would have taken a couple of minutes and developed and humanised them more than shouting, scheming, pretending to be zombies twice and hunting for gold. 

 

2 hours ago, bee_wannabe said:

JW is pure psychopath. It's unbelievable how he can act so empathetic to OKJ. He casually mention how he's envious to VC because his father never loves him the way OKJ loves VC. If we see this scene before the reveal that he's babo people can easily take his side. But then several minutes after he looks so happy and orders MH to execute the plan well. He even DANCE  enjoying their success in killing OKJ. 

I think that's one of his biggest assets.  He looks like such a handsome, well-mannered good boy.  Nobody would think badly of him. The dancing was vile.  i can't believe they are so proud of themselves for killing a defenceless elderly, terminally ill woman.  To call them trash would be an insult to trash

 

2 hours ago, suzy0604 said:

Now that you mentioned it, yes it was pretty unusual for him, if he doesnt want CY to see the dead bodies he could just tell her. Perhaps, he doesnt want her involve in his italian mafia problem?

Yes, but just telling her wouldn't involve her. Not like she is going to go and call Paolo to curse him out or something

 

1 hour ago, shinystar1985 said:

Looks like a perfect location for a kiss scene.  It was here Vincenzo told Cha Young he prefers a love with no reason. Can this come full circle with a confession and kiss?

 

Could it be that Cha Young is still in the dark about his killings? I mean she knows but he has never confirmed it with his own mouth. Again I still think the conversation need to be had. 

Ooooh yes!  That would be a nice way to make it go full circle...but I want their next kiss to be private 

 

Conversations definitely need to be had. I just hope the drama gives VC/HCY time to have them.

 

[bee_wannabe]

@Le_Amarant i guess so. Which means that we'll get the continuation of the romance at the very end? Just like what @shinystar1985 said, it may be in parallel to their previous scene there. Something like CY asking him why he chooses to stay even when babel has been defeated then he will just answer : For no reason but proceed to kiss her. Please dont mind me. I'm just being delusional here

 

I think CY is well aware of what VC did in the past and what he's capable of doing i.e. killing. We've seen her (very briefly) being disturbed by the pic of VC's violence in the past. The thing with CY is she's open minded. SJK mentioned it in the tvn interview when he was asked about CY.

 

CY experiences it firsthand how infuriating it can be witnessing the unjust herself, and lives are at stake here not mere pennies. She doesn't hesitate paying the killers back with violence (the torturing scene inside the car). So in my opinion, it is not addressed in the drama because that's the direction the writer wants to go to, that CY can be open minded with VC's way of life/principle and accept it as it is. In fact, just as she said, she has the talent in her, because she enjoys doing the sweet revenge in the mafia way. 

 

I might contradict myself here but still CY is a girl and by far all these sweet revenge that she does is still mild. No actual over the top violence that leads to death. Hence VC still protects her from seeing him doing the killing act or even see the trace of it, because he knows it will still bother her.

[ryanallright]

Kind of off topic, when VC shot the guy, shouldn't the bullet penetrated him and hit MH who is standing directly in front of the guy as well?

 

At such range, it should penetrated and hit her 

 

 

[suzy0604]

About the romance, at this point I think we all know how important CY to VC, and VC to her, and that they love each other, he literally would do anything for her. but the real question is will they act on it?

 

For VC, that guy is like a solid rock, even for the love he feel for his own mother he needs a lot of encouraging from CY to show affection and embrace his longing for her. Maybe because he was trained not to show feelings because its like showing weakness.

 

For CY, I feel like he is reading VC, she wants to act upon her feelings and have the conversation, but the timing is not right, and she doesnt want him to feel uncomfortable if she put their feelings out in the open. Because I dont think CY is the type that will hold back when it comes to love.

 

I'm not nervous about the ending, but I am about the loveline, there's a chance the writer will keep them platonic like Mulder and Schully, but my personal wish is for both of them together as lover, partner and best friend, so they will have someone to call family.

 

P.s

I just love how Byebye Ballon CEO call VC, Binbin... soo cutee...

 

[raziela]

Two nominations for Vincenzo! Director Kim Hee Won is also nominated for Best Director at the Baeksang Awards

Pretty awesome seeing two women nominated for best director (the PD for Beyond Evil is also a woman)

 

  

2 minutes ago, suzy0604 said:

P.s

I just love how Byebye Ballon CEO call VC, Binbin... soo cutee...

LMAO!  I have said it before but the Bye Bye Balloon team are so funny to me especially CEO Park Seok Do.  I always enjoy Seok Do and his sidekick's antics and their scenes are just the right length.  He was even pretty cool this epsidoe.  I love how he and Vincenzo have gone from enemies to having a working relationship and are even on first name terms now

[suzy0604]

31 minutes ago, ryanallright said:

Kind of off topic, when VC shot the guy, shouldn't the bullet penetrated him and hit MH who is standing directly in front of the guy as well?

 

At such range, it should penetrated and hit her 

 

 

Yup... it could have, or perhaps she was still in a safe distance? but, I dont think he will kill them in the next episode. We still have 4 more episodes to go..

[Slyfindor]

Judging from the latest BTS picture of Chayenzo the theory of small acknowledgement of their feelings at the very end seems to be most likely to be true!! (Judging from the atmosphere and the location where they are filming). I think we might just get very micro crumbs of this couple until then! (Ngl even though there isn't much scope for romance in this drama it still makes me sad)

 

Also there's another picture of the entire Geumga Gang with VinCha whole suited up floating around on twitter / insta - can't help but think it's from one of their final scenes and may be we are going for a Fiery Priest kind of ending(?)

 

I think Vincenzo not telling her about the killings is to show how he may still be unwilling to reveal THAT side of his to CY yet. I mean it seems like CY knows what he has done and what he is capable of doing but never once has it been explicitly acknowledged in the show. He has covered up telling her about the killings twice now (after killing the assailants and after killing Italian henchmen) which makes me think what will he do this time around? Or will it be even addressed by the makers or be swept under the rug as usual. But i do think it's a conversation that needs to happen if they are to get together.

[Le_Amarant]

I don't want microcrumbs! I want the romance storyline properly addressed! The show synopsis promised a romance storyline! And the chemistry between SJK and JYB is off-the-charts sizzling - SO USE IT.

 

I'm going to throw hands with the writer if he gives us some open-ending or platonic ending or sad ending.

 

Maybe we need to start campaigning on Twitter again or doing those manifestation circles or whatever you call them.

 

Good grief.

[ryanallright]

47 minutes ago, suzy0604 said:

 

Yup... it could have, or perhaps she was still in a safe distance? but, I dont think he will kill them in the next episode. We still have 4 more episodes to go..

 

Well, I am seeing thing from the perspective of science. Since I had handled firearm before, in reality the bullet would penetrated and hit her as well at that range. Furthermore, it is two shots, one in the abdomen and one in the head.

 

I forgotten that this is a drama, so she wouldn't be hit by it. She will only get a shock from the blood 

 

[Slyfindor]

37 minutes ago, Le_Amarant said:

I don't want microcrumbs! I want the romance storyline properly addressed! The show synopsis promised a romance storyline! And the chemistry between SJK and JYB is off-the-charts sizzling - SO USE IT.

 

I'm going to throw hands with the writer if he gives us some open-ending or platonic ending or sad ending.

 

Maybe we need to start campaigning on Twitter again or doing those manifestation circles or whatever you call them.

 

Good grief.

I hate the thought of getting just micro crumbs too (hopefully we get that atleast) but currently there doesn't seems much scope or luxury of fully fleshing out their romance given the all plot points we have to cover.

And this seems especially cruel given how much they've teased us the last episodes and how much development we are given in regards to their cruel relationship.

 

My delusional self is lowkey hoping that the break they took was so that they could add a few more Chayenzo scenes given the popularity the couple has amassed.

 

 

As for the end - they deserve flying off somewhere on the hot air balloon after all that they've been through!!

[hankukin]

Yesterday, I said I was going to be fine with the two-week break. Well, I lied.

 

 

i want to have my fill of Vincenzo but I don’t think I’m ready to commit to rewatching the emotional roller coaster that is episode 16. Agreed with everyone about SJK’s acting- I was impressed by his portrayal of the character up till now, but yesterday I was blown away, then actually became petrified as the rage in his eyes became more and more untempered, disengaged, and unhinged. Not to mention the scene with his mother, which left me in a puddle of tears. In that brief moment, he wasn’t the suave, cool, terrifying consigliere everyone fears, but Juhyeong, the kid who was waiting, and is still waiting, for his mom to come pick him up because she made him a promise.

Edited April 12, 2021 by hankukin

[Le_Amarant]

@hankukin I was physically recoiling at SJK's lighter x fingers scene. The last 20 minutes of ep 16 was an incandescent display of acting.

 

BRAVO! Tosses popcorn.

 

12 minutes ago, Slyfindor said:

I hate the thought of getting just micro crumbs too (hopefully we get that atleast) but currently there doesn't seems much scope or luxury of fully fleshing out their romance given the all plot points we have to cover.

And this seems especially cruel given how much they've teased us the last episodes and how much development we are given in regards to their cruel relationship.

 

We could've had a full romance storyline if the writer had removed all the filler content from the episodes. There was ALOT of filler content.

[bee_wannabe]

1 hour ago, raziela said:

I rewatched that scene again and transcribed the subtitles.

"Leaving the past behind and becoming a new person.  Forget all that.  Do what you do best.  That's what you can do to help the wold"

I actually understood the conversation differently.  I thought what Hong Sik was saying was more like: Vincenzio shouldn't try to be something he isn't. He can't erase the past so he should use the skills and abilities he has to help others. 

 

After going back to that scene i got what Mr.Tak is saying. To add to what you said, he also said that things are becoming complicated because VC keeps meddling with others' affair and he notes that VC is indeed korean after all. I really like this saying. Another subtle mesage from the writer. Despite being raised in Europe VC has the overly caring attitude of Korean. It's a virtue in most asian countries (actually it depends on the individual but still in some countries this virtue is stronger). Although it can be annoying at times this attitude is actually a good virtue and much needed to bring equality in society.

 

1 hour ago, raziela said:

The Lee couple are another example.  We only learn in episode 15 that for some reason Mr Lee didn't want to have kids but they have suddenly decided to try for a baby and episode 16 she is pregnant! Huh? Why not mention this childfree issue before?  See them discuss or argue about it? See Yeon-jin chat to Hee Soo or Miri about it?  Literally, these kind of scenes would have taken a couple of minutes and developed and humanised them more than shouting, scheming, pretending to be zombies twice and hunting for gold. 

 

Speaking of Mr. and Mrs. Lee, i think it is hinted that they used to have a kid (episode 11 as reference) because Mr. Lee said he just wants to make Dal Rae proud of his dad. This kid might have died to whatever reason it is and make them stop the thug life, hide their talent and maybe stop the thought of having babies again. I conclude this because Mrs. Teokbokki asked him if he changes his mind after hearing the pregnancy plan. I think most of these geumga tenants yearn for a meaningful life/job but they lack the tools to do so. Once this charismatic mafia who has the power, brain, and money come to back them up, they gain their courage to contribute more in bringing down the bad people. This also encourages Lee couple to accept their past and move on with their life hence they are open to having baby again.

 

Strangely enough i'm not worried at all about the ending be it the overall ending or the ending for CY-VC couple. Is it because i trust the writer too much? I somehow believe that he can wrap it well despite maybe some loose ends. For example VC's nightmare, will the child that witness him appear and play a big role in the future? Or is that nightmare's sole purpose is to show VC's never ending regret of his past? What about CY-VC past encounter? I don't quite like this trope in kdrama of -it's fate because we've met before-. But then why bother giving special BGM and scene where VC seems to recognize the old CY. Time will tell. For now i can only force myself to patiently wait.

[Le_Amarant]

7 minutes ago, bee_wannabe said:

Strangely enough i'm not worried at all about the ending be it the overall ending or the ending for CY-VC couple. Is it because i trust the writer too much? I somehow believe that he can wrap it well despite maybe some loose ends. For example VC's nightmare, will the child that witness him appear and play a big role in the future? Or is that nightmare's sole purpose is to show VC's never ending regret of his past? What about CY-VC past encounter? I don't quite like this trope in kdrama of -it's fate because we've met before-. But then why bother giving special BGM and scene where VC seems to recognize the old CY. Time will tell. For now i can only force myself to patiently wait.

 

There was no past encounter. I keep seeing people misconstrue this scene. VC did a double-take because CY looked so dorky in those photos - which is why he asked the dad if CY had a sister. And then when CY came into the house, she ripped the photos off the wall because she was embarrassed of them.

[holyfea]

1 hour ago, Le_Amarant said:

 I was physically recoiling at SJK's lighter x fingers scene. The last 20 minutes of ep 16 was an incandescent display of acting.

 

Damn scary! His silent rage, his wrath, his agony! OMG.. he didn't even open his mouth and make it even more dreadful!

Spoiler

 

It's a crime to kill people. But she is demon! I believe she's the one responsible in making JW's psychopathic state even worse. She's demon mastermind!

Spoiler

 

Edited April 12, 2021 by holyfea

[backstreetboysfan]

4 hours ago, bee_wannabe said:

 

 

Here's new pic from the filming site

  Hide contents

 

 

 

OMG is that VC and CY, maybe a good ending??.

[hankukin]

1 hour ago, bee_wannabe said:

 

After going back to that scene i got what Mr.Tak is saying. To add to what you said, he also said that things are becoming complicated because VC keeps meddling with others' affair and he notes that VC is indeed korean after all. I really like this saying. Another subtle mesage from the writer. Despite being raised in Europe VC has the overly caring attitude of Korean. It's a virtue in most asian countries (actually it depends on the individual but still in some countries this virtue is stronger). Although it can be annoying at times this attitude is actually a good virtue and much needed to bring equality in society.

I definitely also took note of and appreciated Mr. Tak’s passing remark. It marks another instance where VC is accepted and embraced by the motley Geumga crew as both family and a fellow countryman, almost like a rite of passage. In the earlier episodes, VC was viewed as an untrustworthy, foreign interloper whose sole purpose was to take away the place the Geumga Plaza residents call home. Hong Yoo-chan even berates VC for stirring trouble and gruffly tells him to « go back home » to Italy, not knowing that VC was flying back to Korea upon being rejected by his Mafia family, and by extension the very country he’s come to regard as home.

 

that isn’t to say that coming back to Korea is like a tearful homecoming. In fact, quite the opposite. After being abandoned by his mother and sent abroad, he no longer has any real ties to his birth country, and only views his stay in Korea as a necessary layover to collect his stash of gold. When he visits his mother in prison, he states that he won’t be here for long because « this isn’t his country. » However, while he attempts to adopt a matter of fact attitude about it, it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to know just how deeply scarring it is for him to not have a sense of belonging anywhere. His words carry a lot of venom meant to hurt his mother, but also profound resignation because he’s always been an outsider.

 

Fast forward to yesterday’s episode, VC’s moment on the rooftop with Mr. Tak is like a verbal acknowledgment of him no longer being an outsider. In his time with the Geumga residents, he has very much found a family that cares about him and accepts him for who he is.

Edited April 12, 2021 by hankukin

[shinystar1985]

@hankukin I love your post so much! Eloquently conveyed. 
 

Regarding the special episode, will it be released on Netflix as well?

 

D-12

 

Don’t mind me as I start the countdown to Vincenzo Day...

[Butterfly_hugs]

Yesss!!! on SJK's best actor nomination. Elated for him! This is an overdue consolation of not getting his fair due in arthdal chronicles. 

[hankukin]

1 hour ago, shinystar1985 said:

@hankukin I love your post so much! Eloquently conveyed. 
 

Regarding the special episode, will it be released on Netflix as well?

 

D-12

 

Don’t mind me as I start the countdown to Vincenzo Day...

Not sure. Netflix adjusted the release dates of episodes 17 and 18, but there doesn’t appear to be a new slot for the special episode. No doubt it’ll be up and subbed on YouTube though!