[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner

[larinalove]

Gals, I know, believe me I understand why you feel saddened and frustrated and gloomy but please try to cheer up and be positive, yes there is a very big possibility that the ending will be sad but as long as it is well executed and explained I think we will accept it as part of the deal, we all knew what we were getting into while watching this.

 While I enjoy reading your ending predictions that will probably take place in these last 2 episode I will also kindly suggest to all of you to not delve and focus too much on it or at least not solely on it, let's try to enjoy this last week together also remembering the good times, let's stay positive and maybe there is a chance that the show will surprise us, who knows? Hope dies last as the saying goes.

Okay, let's pinky promise each other from now on to be more positive shall we?

[Sharine Phinisia]

It's Thursday. still cannot move on besides crying buckets over the instrumental osts and browsing for any reason why they should be together and end up with all kinds of separation in the ending. Do I want Monday to come faster? um... 

[Adnana]

20 hours ago, briseis said:

[...]

“I will not give up on you over that scar. No one can force me to. I won’t give up either.” 

Some people say that they want back the wild WS who didn’t care about rules defied everyone and who would do anything for HS, BUT HE IS STILL THAT WS, HE HASN’T CHANGED AT ALL. He is ready to FIGHT THE WHOLE WORLD FOR HER (just like he did many times before) - HE’S READY TO WEATHER THE STORM, PREPARED TO ABOLISH A CENTURIES-OLD STUPID RULE ABOUT SCARS, FIGHT THE CLANS AND ALL FOR HER, SO HE COULD MAKE HER HIS QUEEN! And you know that in the end, he would have won because he’s smart and ruthless, he would go over dead bodies to achieve it, but all Goryeo kings went over dead bodies. It’s HER WHO IS GIVING UP, who is afraid to fight for them - it’s because she wants to stop bloodshed and to protect him, but the truth it’s noble idiocy in it’s purest form. In the end, HS hasn’t changed either.

[...]

@briseis I disagree. If E18 did one thing right, is build up to the inevitability of Wang So having to give in to the clans' pressure in order to protect his as-yet very tenuous hold on the throne. Hae Soo's decision to reject his marriage proposal in the established context wasn't noble idiocy but necessary sacrifice.

There was NO noble idiocy in E18. At least, not in the first half.

Let's review the facts.

Wang So is a newly crowned king, who hasn't had enough time (and resources) yet to build a strong foundation for his throne. Moreover, there are still ugly rumors swirling in the background, questioning the very legitimacy of his ascension. No small thing, that. All of which means, So's position as King is very shaky. Not enough, maybe, that a strong, concentrated gust (of opposition) could blow him off the throne... but not far off it either.

Goryeo itself is still a young, vulnerable nation, made up of many rival clans with conflicting interests, tenuously held together. How easily So's own maternal clan, led by Jung, comes before King Gwangjong in E17, questioning his right to rule and threatening secession. The many powerful clans of the land, with their significant share of economic power, their sizeable private armies and their complicated agendas, hold all the real power and Goryeo's king at that point in history has a very limited scope of what he can actually do. If he doesn't juggle the complex game of politics well, he might even get to see the whole fragile nation disbanding before his eyes. Queen Hwangbo is right when she matter-of-factly warns So of the risk that one misstep might shatter his father, King Taejo's, great legacy.

"Are you going to let Goryeo fall apart during your reign, Your Majesty?"

So's position as a young, untested King--in just a few short years he's the 3rd in a line of princes that have so far failed to prove themselves worthy successors of Taejo--is particularly untenable in the drama. Whereas historical Wang So had the support of three powerful clans (maternal, adopted, wife's), drama Wang So stands alone. He's been cut off by his maternal clan (the Chungju Yoos are even actively working against him), his adopted Shinju Kang clan seems to have vanished in the woodwork (bad writing, there), and there's no wife. The General who made So's rebellion succeed is gone, too. In a land where power is derived from the clans, So has no clans supporting his rule. When they boycott him, there's nothing he can do, no alliance of stronger clans he can call upon to keep the others in check.

With the General gone, there's no military might he can call upon either--not that it would have been a solution anyway. Now that his rebellion has succeeded, the fight has moved from the military to the political arena, and that's where So has to play now, and win. I mean, it's not like he can kill everyone, right? Then there'd be no ministers, no court left to rule over--and everyone else left from all the clans would be baying for the king's blood. In truth, it's still much too early for it to be viable (or even possible) to implement the bloody purges that Gwangjong comes to be known for much later, when his reign is secure. 

In any case, did you catch how King Gwangjong showed up for Court but there was neither hide nor hair of his ministers or any court officials to be seen? He had to wait impotently, sitting on his throne in an empty room (talk about heavy-handed symbolism!) until Wook showed up with his demands. Outrageous demands, that the King relinquish all his financial and military authority--but demands that Wook felt safe to make because he had the backing of the clans, whereas the King had no backing, and so the King was weak, and so all the power that the King was being asked to hand over was actually his in name only and not available in fact for him to wield. Not without the support of the clans.

I won't even get into all the reasons why the clans and the entire Court would have been outraged had King Gwangjong chosen Hae Soo as his Queen. Frankly, her scar--though the taboo against a scarred woman belonging to the King is real and deeply-ingrained enough to not be easily challenged in Goryeo society--is a minor issue compared to:

1) her status as a mere court lady who's served many kings over many years

2) her belonging to a minor clan only (if she wasn't disinherited by them completely, that is, which is actually very likely after that debacle when she almost married the late King Taejo)

3) her suspect behavior at Damiwon, which includes her unusual knowledge of various aspects, her alien writing etc.--all of which made Soo personally very suspicious and particularly questionable as the King's potential partner.

"She has no background. Yet, she has many weaknesses."

And for the King to reject all available princesses, all the noble daughters from the powerful clans, and instead marry a suspect little nobody like Soo? Moreover, a scarred nobody?! Not only would the nobles have been personally offended, but they might have also--rightfully--questioned the King's sanity. Or at least his capacity to act as a real ruler should.

In the Court's eyes, not only was Soo too severely lacking in all aspects (background, position, behavior; and yes, the scar) to ever be considered worthy to marry the King, but she was even liable to fall in personal danger because of the existing suspicions about her. Like, her alien writing--might it mean that she was a foreign spy? Let's not even talk about Soo being accepted as the King's bride; if some powerful accusers had stepped forward, and with some extra fabricated evidence, she might have seen her very life endangered. And maybe not even the King--as weak as he is now--could have protected her. You do remember King Taejo (comparatively more secure in his reign, and considerably more powerful at the time) and how he still had to sacrifice Lady Oh, right?

 

Once again, I've written too much, but the short and main of it is, there was no way in hell that So could marry Soo and keep his throne at this point in time. He could NOT go against all the clans for Soo because he was at the start of his reign, and much too weak. He would NOT have won, could not have won such a fight--but his rash actions had he tried that route would have likely precipitated the very worst-case-scenario, namely the dissolution of Goryeo itself. So knew all that, but he was too stubborn and proud and determined not to break another promise to Soo, so he proposed to her anyway. Soo knew it too, so she refused his proposal. And So was absolutely not in a position to argue against Soo's selfless decision. No noble idiocy involved on either side, just clear-headed acceptance of the unavoidable facts.

So literally had no choice but to let Soo refuse him and pick a powerful wife instead, like he should have done in the first place. He did NOT marry Yeonhwa because Soo told him to; he married her because it had to be done, only he refused to do it until Soo allowed him to. He needed Yeonhwa's clan's support to finally get the other clans to acknowledge him and allow him to act as King (i.e. by actually showing up for Court).

One last thing. As I see it, faced with the untenable (give up making Soo his Queen or lose the throne), So gritted his teeth, strangled his soul-deep outrage and unwillingness and compromised. He married Yeonhwa for the chance to at last become King in fact as well as name--that is, for the chance to grow the power he needed not to be forced to EVER compromise again. He couldn't marry Soo now, and that's why he's so angry and why he's turned so much darker and sinister after his wedding to Yeonhwa and why he's hardcore giving in to his ruthless side & going for vengeance now that he finally can--but I'm positive that his ultimate goal is to bide his time and arrive at a place of unshakable strength from where he really CAN fight the clans, and the whole world if need be, and win. A position from where he can finally safely reach for Hae Soo and hold her to him without endangering her, or his throne. Little does he know that by the time he rises to that position, it will be too late. Soo will have already left him--not by simply stepping outside the Palace (where So could, and would, have brought her back eventually)--but in a far more permanent and soul-crushing way.

[shairli]

2 hours ago, zi4r said:

My posts fluctuate between trying to maintain some Zen & positivity, and wallowing in grief & negativity. Not sure which side is winning. 

I feel your pain. Hubby has made me promise no more K-Drama for the rest of the year after this. Well, he tried "no more LJG", but no amount of mind-whammying and negotiation on his part can make me stay away from LJG... so he's given up. As for my job, my team has gotten quite used to seeing the zombie version of me on Mondays and Tuesdays. And thank god, the 2 clients I'm attending to right now are also crazy in love with MLSHR. 

 

As far as I know, there are 3 versions of the drama:

• SBS logo is local/Korean version
• OneHD and DF are same international version, I think. (Cuz I don't watch OneHD)
• Then, there's Youku version... which is said to be slightly different from international version in some episodes

I have stopped trying to keep track of the plot differences. I just watch as many versions as I can fit into my schedule. Because for me, even if the plot stays the same, the tone, the music and the coloring are still so different!

Thanks for the infos @zi4r.. I'm downloading all versions available online (yes.. the madness I'm in right now).  Hopefully the ending is at least acceptable (to my heart)   Its a comfort to know that there are so many like us and hubs like ours... Lucky you to have ppl who share the same interest (MLSHR) in office! Started to like LJG in Arang & The Magistrate.  Going to start on other series of his soon.

#Eat*Sleep*Play*Work*Think MLSHR-WS

[q4q4]

6 hours ago, Akiddo said:

Ep 19 - 20: Farewell to my eternal love

Ep 17-18 sped up the sequence of events in the original novel and C-BBJX. We have 2 more episodes to bring this epic love story to a close.

  Reveal hidden contents

In BBJX, the eagle incident happened during Kangxi's reign. That incident ended 8th Prince's lifelong struggle to be the crown prince/emperor. The attention shifted to 14th prince to take over the throne as he became powerful as a grand general and was the favoured sonwith strong family backing from his maternal side. When 4th prince took over the throne by force - the 8th prince gang was up in arms to fight but were helpless against a very prepared 4th Prince who had Longkodo and Nian Gengyao. 14th prince was faraway from the palace in a battle. Ruoxi was also the first to kneel and greet 4th prince as emperor at the death bed of Kangxi. RX's guilt was extremely deep rooted as Kangxi was a father like figure to her and she knew 4th Prince didn't get the throne through an honourable way. But she knew history was at stake and went along with it. 

Hence the 8th Prince punishment to kneel in front of a temple over some incident. Ruoxi prayed on her kneels, followed by standing for the whole night in her room to protest against the punishment. He was eventually released from his punishment but this was the beginning of the rift between 4th Prince and Ruoxi, 13th prince warned Ruoxi to let go of all matters related to 8th Prince to keep him safe but she couldn't due to her compassion to all the princes, not just because of her past relationship with 8th. Things just spiralled downwards from there. 8th Prince's story arch was really sad and I for one felt that 4th prince went overboard by getting him to divorce his wife - causing her to commit suicide. The misunderstanding between RX and 4th prince went deeper and deeper to the point where they had to part. 

 

In the ep 19 preview, the sequence of events is jumbled in my opinion. My version for Ep 19-20 is as follows. Parts of Baek Ah and Woo Hee are not included as my concern is only So-Soo. Points 11-25 could be vastly different from the drama. I just need to get these thoughts out of my system. 

1. GJ plots to get rid of Wook - with the help of YH and Won. 

2. Wook is condemned to death for attempted treason. 

3. Soo steps in to beg for Wook's life - possible that Wook's mother asked her for help and tells her the sequence of Wook's progression into the dark side. Given her personality, she risks her life to help Wook one last time - out of guilt, out of her loyalty to her late cousin, out of whatever residual feeling she has left for 8th. She succeeds in getting his life saved but causes a permanent rift in her relationship with So. 

4. Wook reflects on the sequence of events and figures out that his sister has betrayed him for GJ. By then, Jung will have gotten wind of Soo's decision to leave with him. 

5. So gets the late King's edict to betroth Soo to Jung. He refuses to acknowledge the edict. Jung shows the hairpin as proof of Soo's decision. The sight of his token of love to Soo hurts GJ deeply. Baek Ah realises the significance of Soo's request and is devastated. 

6. Wook loses all hope in his life and family. He confronts GJ for a final show down - tells him the truth about the poisoning incident, YH's involvement and why he couldn't save Soo. He pulls everyone into the blackhole with him - if he has to suffer, GJ and YH will have to suffer along. Soo becomes the collateral damage in this confrontation.

7. GJ is devastated by Wook's confession and links her determination to save Wook as a sign of her love for Wook. He confronts Soo and she admits to her past relationship with Wook. GJ tells her that he doesn't want to see her anymore and she has the permission to leave the palace. 

8. Soo leaves the palace and Songgak for good. Before she steps out of the gilded cage, she looks back with tears in her eyes and memories of the past flashing before her. Soo knows she will never see the palace again. 

9. GJ looks from afar with tears streaming down his face. Memories of happier times flashing before him. WS is inconsolable but GJ soldiers on. He fulfils his promise to YH to give her an heir. 

10. Time skip. Soo starts life anew with Jung in exile. A celebration of marriage is prohibited between them but Jung is happy to have Soo by his side and tries his best to make her happy. Soo misses So deeply and continues her writing every day. 

11. GJ continues to consolidate his empire. He has spies in Jung's household. Jung is aware of it. GJ gets reports on Soo and Jung regularly. 

12. Jung creates an illusion of intimacy between him and Soo for the spies to report back to GJ, mainly to rile GJ. GJ is devastated that Soo has finally moved on from him and orders that reports on Jung's household must not be presented to him from here on. 

13. In the mean time, Soo's health continues to deteriorate. She knows her end is near. Asks Jung to help her to deliver a letter to GJ. She hopes to see him one last time. 

14. Jung accedes her request. Notices her handwriting is too similar to GJ's. He puts her letter in another envelope with his handwriting on the envelope. 

15. Letter reaches GJ. GJ doesn't read it. 

16. Soo dolls herself up the best that she can. Deteriorates rapidly.

17. GJ dreams of Soo. His right arm where he was once wounded aches terribly. 

18. Soo gives up hope that So will come to her. She asks Jung to cremate her right away after she dies and throw her ashes into the ocean/lake on a windy day. She wants to forget all of them. She asks him to let go of the past and live on fruitfully. Soo doesn't leave any last words for her beloved. She dies in Jung's arms. Soo finally leaves Goryeo behind. We see a solar eclipse transporting Soo back to modern time the moment she passes on. 

19. Jimong sees the solar eclipse and sighs for the loss of his kindred spirit Soo. He knows she is gone. 

20. Words finally reach GJ and Baek Ah that Soo has passed away. He is shocked beyond words. He scrambles for the unread letter. He finds it and opens it with trembling hands. He sees Soo's handwriting for the first time. Reads the letter while the audience weeps with him. All inconsolable. Ambulance and medics should be on standby at LJG's fan meeting. 

21. GJ and Baek Ah arrive at Jung's residence. Fight ensues. Baek Ah stops them, asks them to let Soo leave in peace after being sandwiched between all the brothers for the past 10 years. 

22. So enters Soo's room to find her belongings - the hairpin, the arrow, stacks of her writing...So breaks down once again. He knows she left with him etched in her heart. There was no room for anyone else. He was her eternal love, just like she is to him. She is completely his person, always and forever. Need more back up on ambulance and medics - many are suffering from excessive sobbing and heart aches.  

23. So takes her ashes back to Songgak. Jimong tries to explain to GJ about Soo/Ha Jin - offends GJ and is banished. So and Baek Ah throws her ashes into the ocean or Dongji lake as per her wishes. GJ mulls on Soo's odd ways and concludes that he will find her one way or the other. 

24. GJ lives for another 20+ years, misses Soo everyday. GJ tries to leave clues for the future Soo/Ha Jin. Dies on a solar eclipse in 975. 

25. Time skip 1000 years to modern day Seoul. Your guess is as good as mine. Let's hope for a good ending with all the loose ends tied up nicely. 

Will we all be alright on Tuesday night? I am going to ask my hubby and kids to stay out of my way from 9pm. 

This is tragic but so beautifully written. Thank you 

[Akiddo]

57 minutes ago, sooji28 said:

 

Just reading your thoughts and theories, makes my heart beat sooo fast and aching.

Isn't it the saddest epic love story ever???!!!

Gosh, i need a therapy after MLSHR is finished.

Epic in a soul twisting sort of way. Didn't help that LJG did such a great job portraying Wang So. OTP's chemistry is very palpable - especially in ep 18 during their date. The smiles on their faces. Aigooo....

[parkr1n]

10 hours ago, owlcat said:

 Hi can you tell me which interview he stated they were running out of time in please? I would love to watch or read the interview. Thanks  

https://www.facebook.com/notes/jgfamily/the-star-august-2016-part-1/1340932262601808

https://www.facebook.com/notes/jgfamily/the-star-august-2016-part-2end/1340941829267518

[stevii]

4 hours ago, violet90 said:

you know what make me want to cry later on when Su die???? 

she did said to Jung that she want to travel go to the dessert and ocean.. that's why she did't want to be buried cause once again even after death she still tied to one place.. when she alive the palace make her suffer and she being caged the whole time so when she die she want to be free like a bird... and she will ask Jung to cremated and scatter her ash.. i don't know but it will break my heart seeing Jung will explain to So what Su truly wanted cause all this time he did't know Su have that ambition... 

there is so many thing that So did't know actually.. yes he been in love with her so many years but now that she loves him everything that she wanted she burried deep down in order to stay with him.. i think it will destroy So knowing all this...

but he did know tho? remember when he brought her out of the palace on horse back? after their first kiss together, he wanted to bring HS out of the palace right that instance, and again when he proposed to her. It's so sad that HS didn't even think of being trapped in the palace (aka being queen) because she wanted to be with So as his guidance to be a good king. she just realized that shes gonna be trapped just after Jung reminded her when she was praying (episode 17) 

4 hours ago, violet90 said:

you know what make me want to cry later on when Su die???? 

she did said to Jung that she want to travel go to the dessert and ocean.. that's why she did't want to be buried cause once again even after death she still tied to one place.. when she alive the palace make her suffer and she being caged the whole time so when she die she want to be free like a bird... and she will ask Jung to cremated and scatter her ash.. i don't know but it will break my heart seeing Jung will explain to So what Su truly wanted cause all this time he did't know Su have that ambition... 

there is so many thing that So did't know actually.. yes he been in love with her so many years but now that she loves him everything that she wanted she burried deep down in order to stay with him.. i think it will destroy So knowing all this...

but he did know tho? remember when he brought her out of the palace on horse back? after their first kiss together, he wanted to bring HS out of the palace right that instance, and again when he proposed to her. It's so sad that HS didn't even think of being trapped in the palace (aka being queen) because she wanted to be with So as his guidance to be a good king. she just realized that shes gonna be trapped just after Jung reminded her when she was praying (episode 17) 

4 hours ago, violet90 said:

you know what make me want to cry later on when Su die???? 

she did said to Jung that she want to travel go to the dessert and ocean.. that's why she did't want to be buried cause once again even after death she still tied to one place.. when she alive the palace make her suffer and she being caged the whole time so when she die she want to be free like a bird... and she will ask Jung to cremated and scatter her ash.. i don't know but it will break my heart seeing Jung will explain to So what Su truly wanted cause all this time he did't know Su have that ambition... 

there is so many thing that So did't know actually.. yes he been in love with her so many years but now that she loves him everything that she wanted she burried deep down in order to stay with him.. i think it will destroy So knowing all this...

but he did know tho? remember when he brought her out of the palace on horse back? after their first kiss together, he wanted to bring HS out of the palace right that instance, and again when he proposed to her. It's so sad that HS didn't even think of being trapped in the palace (aka being queen) because she wanted to be with So as his guidance to be a good king. she just realized that shes gonna be trapped just after Jung reminded her when she was praying (episode 17) 

4 hours ago, violet90 said:

you know what make me want to cry later on when Su die???? 

she did said to Jung that she want to travel go to the dessert and ocean.. that's why she did't want to be buried cause once again even after death she still tied to one place.. when she alive the palace make her suffer and she being caged the whole time so when she die she want to be free like a bird... and she will ask Jung to cremated and scatter her ash.. i don't know but it will break my heart seeing Jung will explain to So what Su truly wanted cause all this time he did't know Su have that ambition... 

there is so many thing that So did't know actually.. yes he been in love with her so many years but now that she loves him everything that she wanted she burried deep down in order to stay with him.. i think it will destroy So knowing all this...

but he did know tho? remember when he brought her out of the palace on horse back? after their first kiss together, he wanted to bring HS out of the palace right that instance, and again when he proposed to her. It's so sad that HS didn't even think of being trapped in the palace (aka being queen) because she wanted to be with So as his guidance to be a good king. she just realized that shes gonna be trapped just after Jung reminded her when she was praying (episode 17) 

4 hours ago, violet90 said:

you know what make me want to cry later on when Su die???? 

she did said to Jung that she want to travel go to the dessert and ocean.. that's why she did't want to be buried cause once again even after death she still tied to one place.. when she alive the palace make her suffer and she being caged the whole time so when she die she want to be free like a bird... and she will ask Jung to cremated and scatter her ash.. i don't know but it will break my heart seeing Jung will explain to So what Su truly wanted cause all this time he did't know Su have that ambition... 

there is so many thing that So did't know actually.. yes he been in love with her so many years but now that she loves him everything that she wanted she burried deep down in order to stay with him.. i think it will destroy So knowing all this...

but he did know tho? remember when he brought her out of the palace on horse back? after their first kiss together, he wanted to bring HS out of the palace right that instance, and again when he proposed to her. It's so sad that HS didn't even think of being trapped in the palace (aka being queen) because she wanted to be with So as his guidance to be a good king. she just realized that shes gonna be trapped just after Jung reminded her when she was praying (episode 17) 

4 hours ago, violet90 said:

you know what make me want to cry later on when Su die???? 

she did said to Jung that she want to travel go to the dessert and ocean.. that's why she did't want to be buried cause once again even after death she still tied to one place.. when she alive the palace make her suffer and she being caged the whole time so when she die she want to be free like a bird... and she will ask Jung to cremated and scatter her ash.. i don't know but it will break my heart seeing Jung will explain to So what Su truly wanted cause all this time he did't know Su have that ambition... 

there is so many thing that So did't know actually.. yes he been in love with her so many years but now that she loves him everything that she wanted she burried deep down in order to stay with him.. i think it will destroy So knowing all this...

but he did know tho? remember when he brought her out of the palace on horse back? after their first kiss together, he wanted to bring HS out of the palace right that instance, and again when he proposed to her. It's so sad that HS didn't even think of being trapped in the palace (aka being queen) because she wanted to be with So as his guidance to be a good king. she just realized that shes gonna be trapped just after Jung reminded her when she was praying (episode 17) 

[hiluna]

On 10/26/2016 at 1:20 AM, Loua said:

I suspected this was coming.  I subconsciously didn't invest in HS and WS's love scenes too much because I had this awful suspicion that they would just end up being bittersweet memories in what would end in a tragic separation.  For the reasons stated at the beginning of my post, I am finding myself disliking Wang So.  Compared to the Wang So that risked his life to save Eun from being executed, Gwangjong's arbitrary and unjust treatment of Jung speaks badly of the king he has become.  Whether it is faulty writing or just my own high expectations for Wang So's behavior, I feel that his character has taken a dark turn that cannot be undone.  Judging by the preview, it looks like it will only get worse in the next episode.  

Two major things stuck out to me as I reflected on episode 18:
1) Forbidding Jung from visiting with his mother on her deathbed was really cruel on Wang So's part.  On one hand, I understand the latter's desire to have his mother's affirmation at least once before her death.  However, using his kingly power to coerce this type of affection and rob Jung of saying goodbye is remarkably selfish. 

[As a side note, I would like to see Hae Soo happy with Jung for at least one episodes.  Given her devotion to Wang So, I would find anything other than a platonic love to be unrealistic.  But even if their love is not a passionate one, it is clear from that one scene in episode 18 that they are quite capable of making each other happy.  The similarities they share (someone mentioned in an earlier post how they both desire to be free from the palace and live unencumbered, which is a very good point) make them a solid team.  And I absolutely do not blame Hae Soo for finally wanting to leave that ill-fated, depressing palace.]

2) Holding Hae Soo's relationship with Wook over her head just seems so random. Didn't Wang So say that he didn't care??  What has happened to cause such a drastic change in his character?  Does power truly corrupt so completely?  I was hoping that Wang So would be able to hold onto his better self since Hae Soo was on his side, but it seems that her companionship, love, and loyalty was not enough.  I don't see a way back from this unfortunate twist in the story.

Then again, maybe Gwangjong will mellow out after a period of time and focus on helping the country rather than using his power to satisfy his personal desires.  Unfortunately Hae Soo will probably be dead by then and the way Wang So married YH, executed CR, banished Jung, and now blames HS for daring to be in a relationship with Wook [that ended a long time ago] really irks me.  Was this side of him there all along?  I'm reminded of the scene in the first episode where he slaughters his horse simply to make a point.  It really did not sit well with me at the time because I find it disgusting when people needlessly harm innocent animals, but I was willing to chalk it up to dramatic emphasis and move on.  Now the more I think about it, the more I realize that Wang So is and has always been capable of great ruthlessness.  Hae Soo's redemptive affection for him caused us to see Wang So in a different light, which was quite exciting at the time.  It also affirmed that people can change, even those who seem the most hopeless.  But now it seems that he is reverting to his old self, blinded by jealousy and a desire for power.    

I hope my sentiments are not too pessimistic and I'm sorry for writing such a negative post on Wang So.  It is too bad that things are playing out this way.  I also have to say that I first started having strong misgivings when Wang So lied in order to gain the throne.  Consequently, it is simply not fair to punish Jung for questioning Wang So's legitimacy.  Truth has a way of revealing itself and Wang So put himself on the losing side by establishing his royal authority through deception.  Jung was probably only guilty of saying what everyone else was thinking.  To add insult to injury by refusing to let Jung visit his dying mother - that is terribly heartless indeed.

I totally disagree with you.

I don't want to see her happy with Jung because in leaving with him she would have twisted the knife in So's heart. How can she do that to the man she loves knowing how jealous he was of Jung that he wouldn't even let him near his dying mother.  

As for holding Wook's relationship over her, we don't know yet from the preview what is exactly going on, it could be all out of context, and I am not sure about the loyalty factor with HS, she seems to be more loyal to everyone else rather than to him.

He never wanted the throne for his personal desires. He even said to Queen Hwangbo "what is so good about this seat", at that moment he wanted HS more than the throne. He told HS he wanted the throne to make a better world for the common people, and to do that he will have to use his power to get rid of all those who plotted against his dead brothers, HS and himself. 

Duh! that was the whole point of killing the horse at the beginning, to establish his ruthlessness and the symbolism of how bad his life was with the Kangs that he never wants to go back there, also a message to the Kangs. You haven't seen beneath the surface of the action.

Wang So didn't really lie, he went along with HS when she bowed to him as the new king, and she in turn was given the choice by Yo, so the fact that the decree had no name on the next king meant that Yo expected her to choose and she did to stop any bloodshed. Besides he already won the throne by force as he said to HS, so having a decree with no named heir would only have caused him to kill his kin which was quite common in a change of reign by military power. Bottom line, there was no deception but if you have to bring it up then the ones who deceived were Yo and Wook who stole the throne from So after killing their brother Mu because Mu was going to abdicate to So.

I am sorry that you don't see the great character that is Wang So, but it can be blamed on the editing and short time frame of only 20 episodes to really do justice to the character.  They wasted a lot of episodes on the Wook-So romance which everyone knew was going to be a dead end.

[ktcjdrama]

47 minutes ago, Adnana said:

No noble idiocy in E18. At least, not in the first half.

@briseis I disagree. If E18 did one thing right, is build up to the inevitability of Wang So having to give in to the clans' pressure in order to protect his as-yet very tenuous hold on the throne. Hae Soo's decision to reject his marriage proposal in the established context wasn't noble idiocy but necessary sacrifice.
Let's review the facts.

Spoiler

Wang So is a newly crowned king, who hasn't had enough time (and resources) yet to build a strong foundation for his throne. Moreover, there are still ugly rumors swirling in the background, questioning the very legitimacy of his ascension. No small thing, that. All of which means, So's position as King is very shaky. Not enough, maybe, that a strong, concentrated gust (of opposition) could blow him off the throne... but not far off it either.

Goryeo itself is still a young, vulnerable nation, made up of many rival clans with conflicting interests, tenuously held together. How easily So's own maternal clan, led by Jung, comes before King Gwangjong in E17, questioning his right to rule and threatening secession. The many powerful clans of the land, with their significant share of economic power, their sizeable private armies and their complex agendas, hold all the real power and Goryeo's king at that point in history has a very limited scope of what he can actually do. If he doesn't juggle the complex game of politics well, he might even get to see the whole fragile nation disbanding before his eyes. Queen Hwangbo is right when she matter-of-factly warns So of the risk that one misstep might shatter his father, King Taejo's, great legacy.

"Are you going to let Goryeo fall apart during your reign, Your Majesty?"

So's position as a young, untested King--in just a few short years he's the 3rd in a line of princes that have so far failed to prove themselves worthy successors of Taejo--is particularly untenable in the drama. Whereas historical Wang So had the support of three powerful clans (maternal, adopted, wife's), drama Wang So stands alone. He's been cut off by his maternal clan (the Chungju Yoos are even actively working against him), his adopted Shinju Kang clan seems to have vanished in the woodwork (bad writing, there), and there's no wife. The General who made So's rebellion succeed is gone, too. In a land where power is derived from the clans, So has no clans supporting his rule. When they boycott him, there's nothing he can do, no alliance of stronger clans he can call upon to keep the others in check.

With the General gone, there's no military might he can call upon either--not that it would have been a solution anyway. Now that his rebellion has succeeded, the fight has moved from the military to the political arena, and that's where So has to play now, and win. I mean, it's not like he can kill everyone, right? Then there'd be no ministers, no court left to rule over--and everyone else left from all the clans would be baying for the king's blood. In truth, it's still much too early for it to be viable (or even possible) to implement the bloody purges that Gwangjong comes to be known for much later, when his reign is secure. 

In any case, did you catch how King Gwangjong showed up for Court but there was neither hide nor hair of his ministers or any court officials to be seen? He had to wait impotently, sitting on his throne in an empty room (talk about heavy-handed symbolism!) until Wook showed up with his demands. Outrageous demands, that the King relinquish all his financial and military power--but demands that Wook felt safe to make because he had the backing of the clans, whereas the King had no backing, and so the King was weak, and so all the power that the King was being asked to hand over was actually his in name only and not available in fact for him to wield. Not without the support of the clans.

I won't even get into all the reasons why the clans and the entire Court would have been outraged had King Gwangjong chosen Hae Soo as his Queen. Frankly, her scar--though the taboo against a scarred woman belonging to the King is real and deeply-ingrained enough to not be easily challenged in Goryeo society--is a minor issue compared to:

1) her status as a mere court lady who's served many kings for many years

2) her belonging to a minor clan only (if she wasn't disinherited by them completely, that is, which is actually very likely after that debacle when she almost married the King Taejo)

3) her suspect behavior at Damiwon, which includes her unusual knowledge of various aspects, her alien writing etc.--all of which made Soo personally very suspicious and particularly questionable as the King's potential partner.

"She has no background. Yet, she has many weaknesses."

And for the King to reject all available princesses, all the noble daughters from the powerful clans, and instead marry a suspect little nobody like Soo? Moreover, a scarred nobody?! Not only would the nobles have been personally offended, but they might have also--rightfully--questioned the King's sanity. Or at least his capacity to act as a real ruler should.

In the Court's eyes, not only was Soo too severely lacking in all aspects (background, position, behavior; and yes, the scar) to ever be considered worthy to marry the King, but she was even liable to fall in personal danger because of the existing suspicions about her. Like, her alien writing--might it mean that she was a foreign spy? Let's not even talk about Soo being accepted as the King's bride; if some powerful accusers had stepped forward, and with some extra fabricated evidence, she might have seen her very life endangered. And maybe not even the King--as weak as he is now--could have protected her. You do remember King Taejo (comparatively more secure in his reign, and considerably more powerful at the time) and how he still had to sacrifice Lady Oh, right?

 

Once again, I've written too much, but the short and main of it is, there was no way in hell that So could marry Soo and keep his throne at this point in time. He could NOT fight all the clans for her because he was at the start of his reign, and too weak. He would NOT have won, could not have won--but his rash actions had he tried that route would have likely precipitated the very worst-case-scenario, namely the dissolution of Goryeo itself. So knew all that, but he was too stubborn and proud and determined not to break another promise to Soo, so he proposed to her anyway. Soo knew it too, so she refused his proposal.  And So had no leg to argue against Soo's selfless decision. No noble idiocy involved on either side, just clear-headed acceptance.

So literally had no choice but to let Soo refuse him and pick a powerful wife instead, like he should have done in the first place. He did NOT marry Yeonhwa because Soo told him to; he married her because it had to be done, only he refused to do it until Soo allowed him to. He needed Yeonhwa's clan's support to finally get the other clans to acknowledge him and allow him to act as King (i.e. by actually showing up for Court).

One last thing. As I see it, faced with the untenable (give up making Soo his Queen or lose the throne), So gritted his teeth, strangled his soul-deep outrage and unwillingness and compromised. He married Yeonhwa for the chance to at last become King in fact as well as name--that is, for the chance to grow the power he needed not to be forced to EVER compromise again. He couldn't marry Soo now, and that's why he's so angry and why he's turned so much darker and sinister after his wedding to Yeonhwa and why he's hardcore going for vengeance now that he finally can--but I'm positive that his ultimate goal is to bide his time and arrive at a place of unshakable strength from where he really CAN fight the clans, and the whole world if need be, and win. A position from where he can finally safely reach for Hae Soo and hold her to him without endangering her, or his throne. Little does he know that by the time he rises to that position, it will be too late. Soo will have already left him--not by simply stepping outside the Palace (where So could, and would, have brought her back eventually)--but in a far more permanent and soul-crushing way.

 

 

Love what you have written. Thank you for giving us this perspective of the political game WS has (possibly regretfully) signed up for.

[andy78]

1 hour ago, Adnana said:

No noble idiocy in E18. At least, not in the first half.

i agree with you!Who wears the crown bears the crown ....

[Akiddo]

1 hour ago, q4q4 said:

This is tragic but so beautifully written. Thank you 

Thank you. Thank you. A lot of it was inspired by the c version and novel. But somehow...it is more tragic in the k version. Waeeeeeee......

Thanks all for indulging me and my long post. This is like therapy without the shrink. More like alcohol anonymous. I will miss you all very much when this is over. 

Honestly, I really wanted to dislike MLSHR in the beginning. How could they remake the c version classic? How is that possible with all the funny costumes and idol actors? Criticise it to bits. Tear it apart. I was all ready like a tiger looking at its prey. But in the end, I became the prey to this painful but highly addictive romance. 

[ShaiKeun]

Sobbing hard just looking at this picture.  Thanks goodness, i can't understand a thing. 

http://m.viva100.com/view.php?key=20161027001103198

[kingpin]

 

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[ShaiKeun]

Yes! They're leading. I voted maybe more than a hundred times now. Does my vote stil counted?

http://www.hallyuvote.com/face-off-battle.html

[whyo]

3 hours ago, minhyuklikeyeah said:

 

omg i love how your dad watches scarlet heart. I don't know anyone's dad that watches korean dramas. What are his thoughts and who's his favorite character?

He loves it. He like to mention what episode will air each time we watch lol. 

Spoiler

My dad only have interest on historical drama. We (me+dad+mom) marathon DongYi till the end of episode.

They watch SHR because I claim I will posses TV at mon-tue when SHR air. So both of them try to watch what I want to watch (because they can't watch another broadcast). And they fall in love with SHR  They mesmerized by the cinematography and like the cuteness of first episode (especially EunxSoo fighting scene). Sometimes my mom try to storytelling about the episode while they are watching SHR re-run. But actually my dad already know the story, because he watched it too!  

My dad not too attached (sometimes he goes here and there, especially at lovey-dovey moment hahaha). He is not the type to discuss if I'm not the one who start the discussion, unfortunately I'm busy discussing with mom, haha. One time he can't accept the plot when Yo running away and So 'kill' him. He said "why he didn't let the royal guards chase Yo". I think he upset because it become So the one who kill Yo. He like WangSo and I'm sure he is rooting for him 

*sorry for my english haha

 

[hiluna]

On 10/26/2016 at 1:26 AM, dears said:

I am

as shocked as Ji Mong,

as heartbroken as Hae Soo,

as scared as Baek Ah,

to see the sudden change of Wang So since episode 17.

What's with killing all the people who accuse of him stealing the throne,

Why would he cared so much about people talking about the letter Yo wrote.

Because as he said before, after all he earned the throne by a revolt anyway.

And How about his intention to take the throne to stop this brother killing brother,

Now he wants to get back on his words and goes on killing spree.

Wang So is out of character.

And I blame the writer trying to compress this rich stories into 20 episodes.

It's not working.

I didn't regret any scenes from episode 1-16, the lighthearted story, I didn't feel it was too long, I like it.

But as much as I dislike this gruesome conflict to get longer, I want to see it's proper phase of how Wang So slowly turns that way.

If spirit exist, I would believe that Wang So is possessed by the spirit right now.

Bong Pal and Hyun Ji need to fight that spirit and take him away from Wang So.

I know he's not always that way. Sometimes he's just like himself.

So is the spirit attached to the palace or the throne? That's why he always had the sudden change in the king's throne room.

Huff, how am I suppose to take all this?

I am not shocked but revel in his role as the avenging angel, no love-sick king for me. Yo was right that HS is his weakness and everyone who wants power will use her against him. Even YH mentioned using her until So cut her off and saying that she was out of line, that scared her quiet.  I think in his heart he knew that it was only a matter of time before Soo would have to leave him if they were to survive.  He knows Soo will not be content to sit pretty and live for him alone. She will always end up getting into trouble and one day it may be impossible to get her out of it even if he was the king.  I would like to think that the next episode, he actually uses her past relationship with Wook as an excuse to push her away, it won't be the first time that he has used this method (after Eun died). As for killing his brothers after taking the throne, he had no idea it was Won and Wook who plotted against the throne so you can't hold that against him. It is certainly very lonely at the top. I felt so sad for him when he sat all alone at the throne just before Soo came in to talk him into the masked outing. LJG posture was so good in portraying that heavy burdened king with the sadness in his heart, it really set up the bittersweet date, a final farewell to better times. The whole scene from him sitting alone at the throne to the tears that ran down his face when he hugged HS after his last and final proposal was what touched my heart and made me cry, for this moment was the true ending of our SoSoo couple in Goryeo.

[junejungki]

6 minutes ago, ShaiKeun said:

Yes! They're leading. I voted maybe more than a hundred times now. Does my vote stil counter? 

http://www.hallyuvote.com/face-off-battle.html

If u have to vote every 5 minutes to avoid your IP address being ban.

[dhia205]

 

 

[Killa92]

2 hours ago, minhyuklikeyeah said:

 

omg i love how your dad watches scarlet heart. I don't know anyone's dad that watches korean dramas. What are his thoughts and who's his favorite character?

Well actually my mom & dad in 50's also watch this drama. I remember they also watch Descendant Of The Sun with me & my sister but they didn't really like pay attention watching it or sometime doing other things when the drama air. But with Scarlet Heart they pay full attention watching. They even ask sometimes on Wednesday or Thursday where is that Queen drama? They didn't  knew Scarlet Heart title they just pronounce it the Queen Drama. So I answered oh... That drama only air on Monday & Tuesday. When Lady Oh died on ep 11 my mom was crying. I was like omg... Because that is the first time my mom ever crying watching K drama because they didn't really interested in K drama.