[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner

[kaoriharang]

8 minutes ago, MezzJowdie said:

Still praying for episode 16 to air despite the baseball game... I wanna see the lYOn (yo) king spiral into madness... Talk about karma. 

The paranoia that Mu once had, he get his own fair share as well. A traitor will always be a traitor.. Im so excited to see how JH will portray this... 

 

 

 

 

isnt there always this understanding that once you gain power and have it, it become hard to let it go. so hence that paranoia begins. Especially when i guess for Yo he attained the throne through underhand ways. 

[riuenu]

27 minutes ago, wordsmyth0253 said:

 

WE, with great difficulty, takes on the attacking palace guards with SD. WE entreats JJ (WY) to let them live but JJ (WY) aims an arrow at WE. Meanwhile, WS is (emotionally) wounded by HS, who hid the fact that WE was hiding in Damiwon [from him]...

 

우리 말랑 카우 어떻게~ ㅠㅠ #상처받았소 

Thanks for the translation … So is emotionally wound, maybe that explain why he is drifting from Soo at first, and why Soo asking So, he hasn't forget her yet right, our OTP … *sigh* and today baseball … *double sigh*

[kaoriharang]

5 minutes ago, sunshinefate said:

So, they will clear the misunderstanding between them with kiss, won't they? As seen in the picture if the show is cancelled tonight, will they give us 2 episodes back to back tomorrow?

 

 

from what i understand if ep 16 gets cancelled today, SBS will only air one ep on tuesday not two. 

[riuenu]

Fan comic for Sohae, tot I dunno what they talking about 

Credit ryepe instagram 

 

[UnniSarah]

1 hour ago, soorani said:

My friend just sent me a really great analysis she found on this Tumblr and I absolutely loved it so here you go: 

It seems like she analyzed every episode till now.. well I found something to do while waiting for tomorrow's episode 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Scarlet Heart: Ryeo Episodes 14-15

It took me a while to get this one up, and it’s not even as long or complicated as my usual reviews, I just had a hard time sitting down and doing it. For the first time since this show began to air at the end of August, I found myself kind of relieved that the episodes were over and I got a bit of a reprieve. Not because I thought this week was bad, by no means. But I’ve felt so emotionally strung out with this story for the last two weeks, it was nice to have a few days to regroup.

I feel us hurtling headlong toward the end of the show—only 5 episodes left—and I’m not prepared. I’m just stalking up on lotion fortified tissues and bracing myself.

Scanning through other commentary and my askbox, disappointment seems to be the word of the week. Disappointment with Jung and his attitude toward So. Disappointment with Soo especially, for all kind of things. Because she didn’t trust So and tell him where Eun and Soon Deol were hiding. Because she didn’t detect and stop Moo’s poisoning. Because of her lack of history knowledge. Because she hasn’t done more to try to change the future. And even because she waited two years to accept So’s feelings. She just couldn’t do anything right.

A lot of people on my dash already jettisoned the SoSoo loveline long ago. They were primed early on by 4th prince’s death threats and physical intimidation, and the forced kiss at the end of 9 cinched it. Into the garbage with the whole ship. Which is totally fine, ship and let ship. I was down for this kind of unhealthy, high-risk, high-intensity relationship from page one, so it was going to take a lot to scare me off. But though I have been at various times called “So apologist” I don’t feel a particular devotion to one character or another, not so far as to sacrifice the narrative as a whole. For me characterization trumps a swoony romance every day of the week. As long as all the characters are consistent I’m happy.

Let me not be accused of being more empathetic toward my male characters than I am toward my female characters. Let it not be said I’m less cognizant of the consistency in Soo’s character development than I am of So’s.

I didn’t see the fandom at large close ranks and defend Hae Soo this week, and it would have been nice to see at least as much passion about the legitimacy of her feelings as there was for So after the forced kiss. I’m not sure why it always seems to work that way. Is it because of the way people feel about IU? Just the tendency of Kdrama fandom at large to be harder on the female characters than it is on male characters? Or maybe it’s in some part people comparing Soo unfavorably to Rouxi from the original Cdrama. Is it just that she’s the main female character, she’s front and center all the time, and so we have the tendency to over analyze and criticize everything she does?

The thing that really makes me itch is the idea that Soo is being held to this impossible standard that no human person would be able to maintain. A higher standard, indeed, than the other characters in the show, male and female. She is really in an impossible position and considering what she’s been through, I think any other choice she could have made would have been out of character.

Soo has so many people giving her advice it’s crazy. She has Ji Mong in one ear, telling her that she can’t do anything but watch things unfold. Under no condition should she attempt to meddle with history. She has the late King in the other ear telling her that she shouldn’t be so wrapped up in what is going to happen in the future that she loses what she currently has. Rattling around in her head are also the words of her late mentor: don’t trust anyone, especially not the words of princes, the palace changes people. She has her recent painful experience with Wook corroborating that. She has a lover ready to abnegate his principles and personal well being in exchange for her safety, and to top it all off she has disturbing premonitions she can’t tell anybody about showing that same lover is going to murder Eun and Soon Deok, Soo’s dear friends.

In that situation, what would you do? There are bigger things at play here than whether Soo trusts So deep down. But sure, at the risk of your friends lives and your own lifelong happiness, trust your boyfriend. What could possibly go wrong?

But framing this conversation in terms of trust is probably the wrong way to think about it. Because Ido think that Soo trusts So, that has been demonstrated over and over again. 

But there’s a difference between trusting someone, and expecting them to behave outside of their established pattern and personal interests. Soo has already seen So bow and swear allegiance to a brother he hates over the murdered body of a brother he dearly loved in order to save her. She knows what value he places on her life, she knows what he would be willing to do to keep her safe. And that’s a double-edged sword. On one hand it can give her a sense of absolute security as he stands by her side, on the other hand it gives her ever reason to fear what he could do if the situation arises where her values and her personal safety are placed at odds.

Would he do something Soo found morally abhorrent if it was the only way to save her life? The answer is yes. Absolutely yes.

The incident where Soo hides Jung in her room is kind of a dry run for what happens with Eun and Soon Deok. Soo and So clearly demonstrate their priorities, and establish the parameters for honesty and trust in their relationship in episode 14.

At the top of Soo’s list is the lives and happiness of all the brothers, above any of her romantic relationships. That has always been the case. She loves So, certainly, but she would not sacrifice a single one of her princes in order to be with him. 

She still refuses to choose sides, even though Jung calls her naive for trying to play referee in an untenable situation. She’ll still put herself bodily between her friends and So, if that’s what it takes, and threaten her own life to keep everyone safe and alive.

At the top of So’s priority list is Soo’s life and safety. But Soo’s life doesn’t necessarily equate to her desires or approval. He has demonstrated that he will make decisions which put her happiness at risk, but not her life. He tries to protect her happiness because he loves her, but if it comes down to not getting married because she won’t like it and sending a small child to suffer as a hostage in Khitan, his choice is clear. He’ll try to avoid to killing his brothers because he knows it will scar her, but there might be instances where he can’t avoid it. And he acknowledges that. He said so when she asked him to spare Wook. It was demonstrated when he fought Yo on the cliffs. And it is the subtext of the situation with Eun. He’ll do everything he can to save Eun’s life, but there’s no way he can guarantee it.

She never directly lies to So about Eun, she only withholds information, which in her mind is consistent with the established ground rules of their relationship.

Soo doesn’t want to be the reason So does something to his brothers. Whether because he loves her or because he is trying to protect her, she doesn’t want to put him in the position to make that choice.

It might not meet your romantic ideal, but I think her decision is respectable. The SoSoo relationship is still wildly imperfect, but I think that’s part of what makes it fascinating. Certainly there is this idea that love cannot exist where there isn’t trust. Or that loving someone and fearing them are mutually exclusive concepts. But I don’t think that’s the case for SoSoo. I think Soo has decided to love So in the moment and not hold his future actions against him, even though she has knowledge of them—or at least believes she has knowledge of them. She believes in her heart that he is eventually going to scar her, but she has decided to be with him anyway.

Loving someone with the expectation that they will eventually break your trust and break your heart is definitely not a healthy way to approach a new relationship, but Soo has been hurt too many times by the men she loved to believe in their promises. What’s more, she has her own recollection of history and her frightening visions assuring her that So is going to turn into a monster before her eyes, but she’s chosen him anyway. She’s offered up her heart, fully believing that there’s just another dagger waiting for it. To my mind, that makes her incredibly courageous.

In addition to her conduct toward So, the other big gripe I’ve seen about Soo—not just this week but pretty solidly since the rain ritual—is that she isn’t doing enough to try to change the future, or that she isn’t going about it the right way. But this week we got confirmation of something that I’ve long doubted was even possible: history is changing and Soo is the reason why.

Not only have we gotten confirmation of changing timelines, but some actual insight into how. From what and into what. Ji Mong’s words to So seem to confirm something I’ve long speculated about, but have had no way to test or confirm. We appear to be moving from an alternate time line to a true time line. Soo’s future and history knowledge is actually the alternate history, and we are moving closer to the version of events recorded in the true history of the period. In the alternate time line So is a murderous psychopath who kills his entire family and his long term subjects without remorse. Yo is a traitor, but never takes the throne.

It seems that the details of the visions themselves are not changing, but perhaps some of the circumstances are changing. And the affect around them.

I think it comes down to her giving So reason not to want to kill his brothers, motivation to be good, not to kill without reason. The old “Wolf Dog” So would probably not have held back when he was fighting Yo. The old So would not have hesitated to run him through. But the So who believes there is a real possibility he will lose Soo forever if he kills one of his brothers, held back. I think if we can pinpoint it anywhere, that is the moment where the details of history began to change. I think Yo was supposed to die there in the original timeline, and because he didn’t he ended up on the throne.

If we think about the reasons why Soo is here and the effect that she’s having, we have to think back to her last conversation with Taejo, when he told her that the reason she was there in the past was to assist Crown Prince Moo in rising to the throne. She did exactly what she was supposed to do in that instance. She withheld information from Wook, who was fomenting rebellion, she gave the information to So who was loyal to the Crown Prince.

The things that she was not meant to do was warn Wook about So, which has had a large influence on Wook’s trajectory after his fall, as well as his suspicion and animosity toward his 4th brother. What she wasn’t supposed to do was warn So off his predestined path. To warn him to be cautious, not to kill anyone, not to hurt his brothers, not to draw his sword without good reason. I would argue that her “lectures” which he is always dismissing, but seems to have taken deeply to heart in some ways, combined with his ever-deepening lover for her had a direct impact in allowing Yo to survive and changing the timeline.

If So had never met Soo, if he had never fallen in love with her, if she hadn’t made her fear of his violent ways so incredibly clear and given him a reason to keep his brothers a live (i.e. not to scar her) then I think he would have killed Yo right then and there and history would have played out the way that Ji Mong was expecting.

Since the question is one of determinism vs. the ability to change the future, it’s hard to say if the situation with Eun will be changed in the same way. Afterall, Soo’s visions still predict Eun’s death. And it’s not clear if her interference and attempts to get Eun and Soon Deok out of the palace without So’s help, will directly result in the fall out that she was trying to avoid (the self-fulfilling prophecy) or if she has managed to sway things in any way by her interference.

It’s hard to say if she’s changing the course of history or this was always the way things were meant to play out, and she’s in the past to guarantee that the course of things gets corrected. What is clear is that she has had an effect on So’s personality. He is not the kind of person who would murder a brother in cold blood and laugh about it. He is the kind of person who would deeply regret and weep over the death of a brother, even an evil brother. And I believe in some part, Soo is the reason for that.

 

Jona

http://overthinkingkdrama.tumblr.com/post/151898395592/scarlet-heart-ryeo-episodes-14-15

 

 

 

 

Chingu @soorani ... Thanks for sharing that great analysis from your friend. The writer was on point and she is right these episode is draining me emotionally too. I won't wactch or I will watch it and even after that emotional roller coaster ride I am still can't wait for the next episode. 

[arsdf]

OK let's pray people... wish today there's raining so hard till midnight in SK hheehhee 

[luci13]

Hahahaha @wordsmyth0253 since the first time I heard that name, I've been expecting lots of puns and Korean fans are way creative with that Me too I like that SBS video about So's charms with all the hashtags! Aaawww I like that one pun too!  월요일 기다:려 !  That Ryeo part! XD 

 

[sooji28]

9 hours ago, ruizaio said:

 

Because traditional, conservative families (especially from privileged classes like royalty) keep meticulous family trees. While there are many Lees, Kims, and Parks in Korea, they are not all the same. There are different clans. LJG is from the Jeonju Lee clan, Prince Yangnyeong's branch. Also, each generation has a character that all members of that generation uses in their name. The character for the 19th generation after Prince Yangnyeong is 基, and there happen to be several Korean celebrities from this generation.

This doesn't mean all Koreans whose names are Lee **** Gi/Ki are from this generation, but there have been press reports that have specifically identified LJG or some other Korean celebrities as being from this generation. Important members of this clan do keep the records somewhere (and I've even found a website for them, but you had to be a member to access it).

Oh wow, things you learn at this forum. Thanks @ruizaio for your history explanation. It is really interesting.

No wonder LJG is so immersed with Wang So's role. Turns out, he is a REAL royal descendant.

[junejungki]

15 hours ago, wordsmyth0253 said:

 

WE, with great difficulty, takes on the attacking palace guards with SD. WE entreats JJ (WY) to let them live but JJ (WY) aims an arrow at WE. Meanwhile, WS is (emotionally) wounded by HS, who hid the fact that WE was hiding in Damiwon [from him]...

 

우리 말랑 카우 어떻게~ ㅠㅠ #상처받았소 

Emotionally wounded?? Uh oh!! doesnt sound good to me 

[chi13lou]

speculations galore!

@arsdf But @ruizaio mentioned that if the game is cancelled today, it will be postponed to tomorrow. So there has to be rain until tonight and starting around 5pm KST on Tuesday.LOL

[SizzlerZ]

39 minutes ago, pass3rby said:

 

How could they give us spoiler still when Ep 16 might not be aired? I am rolling into a ball and weep. It's so bad for my emotional health. I need CPR.

 

 

That's exactly what I'm thinking! At first I thought SBS was just trying to kill me with those spoiler pics but now with a possibility of a delay I'm sure it's torture then death.

Edited October 17, 2016 by LyraYoo
please do not quote images

[kingpin]

 

c as tagged

 

[dustdevil]

The 24 hours before the episode airs is always my favorite time on this thread: preview stills, videos of preview stills, gifs, actual teaser previews, cast instagrams, and theories, theories, theories. I love reading all of the historical background and character analyses! 

So in that spirit, here’s the thoughts that have been kicking around in my head for the last few weeks. Almost all sagueks weave together two threads: the actual history and the conventions of TV saguek genre. MLSHR is adding in a third thread, the Chinese source drama (and novel.) Looking at how the writers have done this (well, and poorly) it’s fun to predict how the threads will weave together in the remaining 5 episodes.

Thread 1: BBXJ- I’ve watched the first 17 episodes and heard lots of discussion here.

What have they kept from BBXJ? 1) the time-traveling heroine. 2) the brothers vying for the throne. 3) A lot of key scenes and lines of dialogue.

Whats different? 1) Lots of folks have compared MLSHR to Game of Thrones, and if I were going to compare BBXJ to a recent English-language show, it would be Downtown Abbey. It's based on the relationships, conveyed through lots of dialogue, and it’s all about restraint and manners. The Korean version is taking that structure but amplifying the drama, the stakes, and the action. 2) the characters in the Korean version are presented as younger, less mature, and more impetuous, which increases the intensity of the drama.

Thread 2: The conventions of Korean saguek dramas.

Which conventions is it keeping? 1) Almost all Korean sagueks have a strong nationalistic theme, even with a romance or a tragedy, the true “end game” is some historic moment or choice or action that saves and preserves the nation. Obviously it’s there in the traditional 50+ episode dramas, but it’s also there in more recent “fusion” shows like Faith and Moonlight Drawn By Clouds, where a major plot arc is the King learning to lead the nation. Both of LJK’s recent shows, Joseon Gunman and Scholar Who Walks the Night, had him saving the nation from external threats (foreign imperialism or sexy vampires.) And it’s definitely a major theme in MLSHR, where Taejo and JiMong are deeply worried about the tenuous future of Goryeo, and the big midpoint dramatic scene was So taking his place in the rain ritual to save the nation from drought. 2) The beautiful, but ultimately doomed romance is another key theme of saguek, There’s a long list of historic dramas where the lovers end up dead or separated, a much shorter list where they only have a happy ending in alternate future or afterlife (Shine or Go Crazy, Arang, Gu Family Book, Faith), and very, very short list where there’s a true happy ending for the romantic leads.

What’s different? The speed at which the plot is moving. I was re-watching Faith, and was reminded of the many, many episodes where the heroine was poisoned, was looking for an antidote, then was poisoned a second time. MLSHR is churning through storylines and jumping ahead years.

Theme 3: The recorded history of Gwangjong.

What’s been the same so far? They’ve kept to the actual rulers,the years of the reigns, and in general the family lineages and alliances. Some of the intra-family tension from history remains (the importance of the clans, Yo revolting against Mu.)

What they’ve changed: The tension between So and Yo, Wook, and the Queen. So’s facial scars and time-traveling cosmetic artists.

 

Thinking through these threads and how they’ve woven together in the first 15 episodes, I think you can make some general predictions for the remaining five episodes:

1. They will use key scenes and plot points from the later episodes of BBXJ, but the stakes and emotional impact will be higher. If they use the miscarriage storyline or some reveal of the Wook-Soo relationship (see below for rant), it will be more life-and-death and fast moving than in BBXJ. (For example, in BBXJ, Ruoxi was kneeling in the rain to protest an imprisonment, in MLSHR, Soo is protesting an execution.)

2. The historic characters are going to make sacrifices and decisions for the good of Goryeo, and will step up to support Gwangjong. So is going to have to realize that he needs to be King for the good of the people, not just as a way to marry Soo. Since they are sticking to history, and we know Wook and YeonHwa supported Gwangjong, I think there’s going to be some sort of  semi-redemption for those two, where they become loyal to So.

3. There is not going to be a happy ending in Goryeo times for So and Soo. No surprise there, but based on the precedent of BBJX drama version and all of the fusion sagueks, I think a present-day or afterlife reunion is pretty likely.

* Rant about So "finding out" about Soo and Wook below:

Spoiler

 

The only thing that could truly ruin this show for me is if they make it a key plot point that So did not know that Soo liked Wook. There is NO WAY he doesn’t know! So absolutely knows that Wook had romantic feelings for Soo, based on every single one of their possessive standoffs over her:

-when Wook kills the assassin in the woods

-when Wook tells So to stop interrogating Soo about the assassins in the woods

-when Wook tells So that Soo (and YW) are Wook’s people, not So’s people

-when Wook organizes Soo’s escape attempt from marriage

-when they both go to beg the King to end the marriage

-when So asks Wook to find evidence to free Soo after the poisoning attempt

-when they argue and grab each other before the party where Taejo collapses

-when they swordfight in the courtyard

-all of the other times that they stare each other down

So also knows that Soo was sending flirty emoji responses to Wook’s poetry, and he’s never pressed her to answer who the person was that she said she liked, only to confirm that it’s not the people he doesn’t want to fight, Baek Ah and Jung. So would have to be an idiot not to know, so if they make him that clueless, I will be very, very, very annoyed with the drama gods.

 

[Gabi Bros]

21 minutes ago, riuenu said:

Fan comic for Sohae, tot I dunno what they talking about 

Credit ryepe instagram 

This is so cute!!! 

[rei_smasher11]

2 hours ago, soorani said:

My friend just sent me a really great analysis she found on this Tumblr and I absolutely loved it so here you go: 

It seems like she analyzed every episode till now.. well I found something to do while waiting for tomorrow's episode 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Scarlet Heart: Ryeo Episodes 14-15

It took me a while to get this one up, and it’s not even as long or complicated as my usual reviews, I just had a hard time sitting down and doing it. For the first time since this show began to air at the end of August, I found myself kind of relieved that the episodes were over and I got a bit of a reprieve. Not because I thought this week was bad, by no means. But I’ve felt so emotionally strung out with this story for the last two weeks, it was nice to have a few days to regroup.

I feel us hurtling headlong toward the end of the show—only 5 episodes left—and I’m not prepared. I’m just stalking up on lotion fortified tissues and bracing myself.

Scanning through other commentary and my askbox, disappointment seems to be the word of the week. Disappointment with Jung and his attitude toward So. Disappointment with Soo especially, for all kind of things. Because she didn’t trust So and tell him where Eun and Soon Deol were hiding. Because she didn’t detect and stop Moo’s poisoning. Because of her lack of history knowledge. Because she hasn’t done more to try to change the future. And even because she waited two years to accept So’s feelings. She just couldn’t do anything right.

A lot of people on my dash already jettisoned the SoSoo loveline long ago. They were primed early on by 4th prince’s death threats and physical intimidation, and the forced kiss at the end of 9 cinched it. Into the garbage with the whole ship. Which is totally fine, ship and let ship. I was down for this kind of unhealthy, high-risk, high-intensity relationship from page one, so it was going to take a lot to scare me off. But though I have been at various times called “So apologist” I don’t feel a particular devotion to one character or another, not so far as to sacrifice the narrative as a whole. For me characterization trumps a swoony romance every day of the week. As long as all the characters are consistent I’m happy.

Let me not be accused of being more empathetic toward my male characters than I am toward my female characters. Let it not be said I’m less cognizant of the consistency in Soo’s character development than I am of So’s.

I didn’t see the fandom at large close ranks and defend Hae Soo this week, and it would have been nice to see at least as much passion about the legitimacy of her feelings as there was for So after the forced kiss. I’m not sure why it always seems to work that way. Is it because of the way people feel about IU? Just the tendency of Kdrama fandom at large to be harder on the female characters than it is on male characters? Or maybe it’s in some part people comparing Soo unfavorably to Rouxi from the original Cdrama. Is it just that she’s the main female character, she’s front and center all the time, and so we have the tendency to over analyze and criticize everything she does?

The thing that really makes me itch is the idea that Soo is being held to this impossible standard that no human person would be able to maintain. A higher standard, indeed, than the other characters in the show, male and female. She is really in an impossible position and considering what she’s been through, I think any other choice she could have made would have been out of character.

Soo has so many people giving her advice it’s crazy. She has Ji Mong in one ear, telling her that she can’t do anything but watch things unfold. Under no condition should she attempt to meddle with history. She has the late King in the other ear telling her that she shouldn’t be so wrapped up in what is going to happen in the future that she loses what she currently has. Rattling around in her head are also the words of her late mentor: don’t trust anyone, especially not the words of princes, the palace changes people. She has her recent painful experience with Wook corroborating that. She has a lover ready to abnegate his principles and personal well being in exchange for her safety, and to top it all off she has disturbing premonitions she can’t tell anybody about showing that same lover is going to murder Eun and Soon Deok, Soo’s dear friends.

In that situation, what would you do? There are bigger things at play here than whether Soo trusts So deep down. But sure, at the risk of your friends lives and your own lifelong happiness, trust your boyfriend. What could possibly go wrong?

But framing this conversation in terms of trust is probably the wrong way to think about it. Because Ido think that Soo trusts So, that has been demonstrated over and over again. 

But there’s a difference between trusting someone, and expecting them to behave outside of their established pattern and personal interests. Soo has already seen So bow and swear allegiance to a brother he hates over the murdered body of a brother he dearly loved in order to save her. She knows what value he places on her life, she knows what he would be willing to do to keep her safe. And that’s a double-edged sword. On one hand it can give her a sense of absolute security as he stands by her side, on the other hand it gives her ever reason to fear what he could do if the situation arises where her values and her personal safety are placed at odds.

Would he do something Soo found morally abhorrent if it was the only way to save her life? The answer is yes. Absolutely yes.

The incident where Soo hides Jung in her room is kind of a dry run for what happens with Eun and Soon Deok. Soo and So clearly demonstrate their priorities, and establish the parameters for honesty and trust in their relationship in episode 14.

At the top of Soo’s list is the lives and happiness of all the brothers, above any of her romantic relationships. That has always been the case. She loves So, certainly, but she would not sacrifice a single one of her princes in order to be with him. 

She still refuses to choose sides, even though Jung calls her naive for trying to play referee in an untenable situation. She’ll still put herself bodily between her friends and So, if that’s what it takes, and threaten her own life to keep everyone safe and alive.

At the top of So’s priority list is Soo’s life and safety. But Soo’s life doesn’t necessarily equate to her desires or approval. He has demonstrated that he will make decisions which put her happiness at risk, but not her life. He tries to protect her happiness because he loves her, but if it comes down to not getting married because she won’t like it and sending a small child to suffer as a hostage in Khitan, his choice is clear. He’ll try to avoid to killing his brothers because he knows it will scar her, but there might be instances where he can’t avoid it. And he acknowledges that. He said so when she asked him to spare Wook. It was demonstrated when he fought Yo on the cliffs. And it is the subtext of the situation with Eun. He’ll do everything he can to save Eun’s life, but there’s no way he can guarantee it.

She never directly lies to So about Eun, she only withholds information, which in her mind is consistent with the established ground rules of their relationship.

Soo doesn’t want to be the reason So does something to his brothers. Whether because he loves her or because he is trying to protect her, she doesn’t want to put him in the position to make that choice.

It might not meet your romantic ideal, but I think her decision is respectable. The SoSoo relationship is still wildly imperfect, but I think that’s part of what makes it fascinating. Certainly there is this idea that love cannot exist where there isn’t trust. Or that loving someone and fearing them are mutually exclusive concepts. But I don’t think that’s the case for SoSoo. I think Soo has decided to love So in the moment and not hold his future actions against him, even though she has knowledge of them—or at least believes she has knowledge of them. She believes in her heart that he is eventually going to scar her, but she has decided to be with him anyway.

Loving someone with the expectation that they will eventually break your trust and break your heart is definitely not a healthy way to approach a new relationship, but Soo has been hurt too many times by the men she loved to believe in their promises. What’s more, she has her own recollection of history and her frightening visions assuring her that So is going to turn into a monster before her eyes, but she’s chosen him anyway. She’s offered up her heart, fully believing that there’s just another dagger waiting for it. To my mind, that makes her incredibly courageous.

In addition to her conduct toward So, the other big gripe I’ve seen about Soo—not just this week but pretty solidly since the rain ritual—is that she isn’t doing enough to try to change the future, or that she isn’t going about it the right way. But this week we got confirmation of something that I’ve long doubted was even possible: history is changing and Soo is the reason why.

Not only have we gotten confirmation of changing timelines, but some actual insight into how. From what and into what. Ji Mong’s words to So seem to confirm something I’ve long speculated about, but have had no way to test or confirm. We appear to be moving from an alternate time line to a true time line. Soo’s future and history knowledge is actually the alternate history, and we are moving closer to the version of events recorded in the true history of the period. In the alternate time line So is a murderous psychopath who kills his entire family and his long term subjects without remorse. Yo is a traitor, but never takes the throne.

It seems that the details of the visions themselves are not changing, but perhaps some of the circumstances are changing. And the affect around them.

I think it comes down to her giving So reason not to want to kill his brothers, motivation to be good, not to kill without reason. The old “Wolf Dog” So would probably not have held back when he was fighting Yo. The old So would not have hesitated to run him through. But the So who believes there is a real possibility he will lose Soo forever if he kills one of his brothers, held back. I think if we can pinpoint it anywhere, that is the moment where the details of history began to change. I think Yo was supposed to die there in the original timeline, and because he didn’t he ended up on the throne.

If we think about the reasons why Soo is here and the effect that she’s having, we have to think back to her last conversation with Taejo, when he told her that the reason she was there in the past was to assist Crown Prince Moo in rising to the throne. She did exactly what she was supposed to do in that instance. She withheld information from Wook, who was fomenting rebellion, she gave the information to So who was loyal to the Crown Prince.

The things that she was not meant to do was warn Wook about So, which has had a large influence on Wook’s trajectory after his fall, as well as his suspicion and animosity toward his 4th brother. What she wasn’t supposed to do was warn So off his predestined path. To warn him to be cautious, not to kill anyone, not to hurt his brothers, not to draw his sword without good reason. I would argue that her “lectures” which he is always dismissing, but seems to have taken deeply to heart in some ways, combined with his ever-deepening lover for her had a direct impact in allowing Yo to survive and changing the timeline.

If So had never met Soo, if he had never fallen in love with her, if she hadn’t made her fear of his violent ways so incredibly clear and given him a reason to keep his brothers a live (i.e. not to scar her) then I think he would have killed Yo right then and there and history would have played out the way that Ji Mong was expecting.

Since the question is one of determinism vs. the ability to change the future, it’s hard to say if the situation with Eun will be changed in the same way. Afterall, Soo’s visions still predict Eun’s death. And it’s not clear if her interference and attempts to get Eun and Soon Deok out of the palace without So’s help, will directly result in the fall out that she was trying to avoid (the self-fulfilling prophecy) or if she has managed to sway things in any way by her interference.

It’s hard to say if she’s changing the course of history or this was always the way things were meant to play out, and she’s in the past to guarantee that the course of things gets corrected. What is clear is that she has had an effect on So’s personality. He is not the kind of person who would murder a brother in cold blood and laugh about it. He is the kind of person who would deeply regret and weep over the death of a brother, even an evil brother. And I believe in some part, Soo is the reason for that.

 

Jona

http://overthinkingkdrama.tumblr.com/post/151898395592/scarlet-heart-ryeo-episodes-14-15

 

 

 

 

 

The writer was on point! Can't wait for later's episode. I think the OTP moments will be on Ep 17 not on 16. Hopefully I'm wrong 

[kingpin]

[Yippeun_eonnie]

24 minutes ago, arsdf said:

OK let's pray people... wish today there's raining so hard till midnight in SK hheehhee 

Now I understand why some people wish for the storm too....

because...

 

[violet90]

So will feel hurt that Soo hide the fact that Eun hiding in Damiwon and maybe distance himself but he will never truly abandon her in any way.. So know that beside him and BA Soo have nobody in palace and that's why no matter how hurt he is abandon Soo is something he will never do...

in preview So will look at Soo with so much regret and hurt after he killed Eun... but So will even take arrow for her that's something that will never changed.. he willing to die for her and maybe that's where they clear the misunderstanding...

Soo will likely tell So that she never want him to choose between her and his brother and the only way is not to let him know where Eun is.. she trying to protect everyone but in the end hurting everyone... that's why we going to get that passionate kiss with Soo crying because both of them been holding their feeling maybe for a while after Eun death.. 

 

[Umi_ni_Sora]

Ehhh...from the synopsis, maybe Soo will finally realize now that she needs to trust So with every fiber of her being. It's has been a work in progress up to this point.

We don't know whether Eun would have been saved or not regardless of whether Soo told So, but regardless So will be heartbroken because Soo did not tell him/trust him. That is what he will believe. This is a wake up call for Soo. Maybe then it will prompt her to tell So about all that she knows or even maybe the fact that she is from the future, once they're alone together (in the stills). They need to somehow reconcile this before going further in their relationship. I too would also be emotionally wounded if the person I love hid things from me, and this prevented me from doing all I could to save my family.

I think if anything, their relationship will strengthen even more afterwards so long as Soo tells him the truth and why she did not trust him. They said they'd be honest with each other from here on out. This is Soo's chance if she ever wants to have a future with So. It is just a shame that Eun and SD had to die in order for them to get to this point. 

[cojulie]

1 hour ago, wordsmyth0253 said:

 

Heh, sadly, I can't take credit for that ^ ^. Because So's name is also a verb ending commonly heard in Sageuk, there are all sorts of plays on his name floating around the Korean forums. Some of my personal favorite punny So hashtags include #말랑 카우 #수바라기 #하찮소 and #소든어택 XD A lot of them appear in that video SBS posted not long ago with all the hashtags about So's various 'charms' - it's clear whoever is in charge of making the videos is very in touch with what's trending in the fandom (vampire So, the rain ceremony parody, etc.) . I enjoy them X)

There's also, 월요일 기다:려  

 

That is such an appropriate line though cause I'm always waiting for Monday!

42 minutes ago, MAROSA_JIN said:

 

 

Aw WM!!

Last film gathering
HS who works hard even in the rain
WS who protects her
WW who looks from afar
BA and Jung who gets down on knees
Won who ran away with the umbrella
WM who's sadly watching them from afar

I LOL'd at Won's.  (correct me if I'm wrong, Korean is not my native tongue but my in-laws)