[Drama 2021] Vincenzo, 빈센조

[Le_Amarant]

Guys, I'm really struggling with the final episodes now that there's been some time between immediate viewing.

 

Honestly, I am a bit stunned at how dark the final episode was and how the story ended. I know Vincenzo is supposed to be dark comedy, but it's always straddled the line between darkness and comedy, usually favoring the latter. We know Vincenzo is a mafia, but it's kinda been a joke and treated lightly up until episode 16. The sheer ruthlessness that Vincenzo displayed in 20 took me aback.

 

I don't get why he needs to escape Korea. This is a big plot hole. He has the Guillotine file, he has the Intelligence agencies on his side, he has Miri who is a hacker, he has all the leverage and resources to stay.

 

I really thought Vincenzo was going to leave his mafia roots and adopt his original Korean identity. It's shown through the series that he has trauma from his mafia life, and I think it's super depressing that he's just burdened with living in darkness forever. This is the ending note that I find most heartbreaking.

 

I'm having trouble even re-watching Vincenzo because all the episodes until 16 were just really comedic, and then it went full dark mode after. Episode 20 was brutal.

[itsmeash]

  

16 hours ago, sal2 said:

I was thinking about the fact that he can not visit Korea when he want because he is on the police wanting list so he can not meet up with the family. Of course they could go visit him again, but that maybe put him in danger. So like the start of the drama when he left Italy because he was on the wanting list he now again on another wanting list. So my point is that because of him killing people he never gonna be in peace with his life.

I mean he could... this seems like writer error because Vin does know some people who could easily help him bypass all that... Idk why it wasn't mentioned in the finale.

From a moral stand point, yeah, I doubt he'll ever find peace. But from a morally gray area, I feel he's self accepted who he is and therefore he will and does have peace, inner peace at the least.

8 hours ago, realistic2280a said:

And yes, he confirmed that it wasnt a happy ending between V and CY... sigh...... nvm, i will just think that CY actually took V's offer and visit him there soon ...

He didn't confirm anything. It's just his personal take. The whole point of the ending being left just open enough by the writer is that it is fully open to everyone's own interpretation. That being said, I do think the writer gave more hints of them making it work than not, which is why I definitely view this as a bittersweet ending leaning more towards happy.

 

**** 

To those who say Vincenzo and Cha Young aren’t going to make it/last and/or that now V will leave CY for good.. here are a list of reasons why they literally will make it, and V will never leave CY for good and vice versa.

1. V literally says he has a room in Italy for her.

2. He bought a deserted island and told only her about it. He clearly wants them to have said island to just themselves.

3. If he was just gonna leave, he’d never send those post cards.

4. Why would he come back to confess and kiss her or come back at all if he was gonna leave??

5. They’ve gone through so much crap together, a LDR is nothing on all they’ve been through before.

6. CY says she can’t wait to be able to go visit him.

7. THOSE KISSES!! AND THE CONFESSIONS!! AND STILL MISSING EACH OTHER AFTER A YEAR APART!!

And the biggest of all…

8. V LITERALLY CAME BACK AND WAS THE INITIATOR IN THE KISS AND CONFESSION!!

9. Vincenzo finally excepts that he is deserving of love.

10. Cha Young excepts every part of him, the dark and the light.

 

They are one soul in two bodies!! They are built to last forever and always!!

 

So all in all, considering the type of show this was, we got a darn good ending and a strong AF OTP!!

[Le_Amarant]

SJK needs to shut it and just let us fans have some peace of mind. Jeez louise.

[sarahsarahh]

33 minutes ago, Le_Amarant said:

 

I don't get why he needs to escape Korea. This is a big plot hole. He has the Guillotine file, he has the Intelligence agencies on his side, he has Miri who is a hacker, he has all the leverage and resources to stay.

 

I really thought Vincenzo was going to leave his mafia roots and adopt his original Korean identity. It's shown through the series that he has trauma from his mafia life, and I think it's super depressing that he's just burdened with living in darkness forever. This is the ending note that I find most heartbreaking.

 

I'm having trouble even re-watching Vincenzo because all the episodes until 16 were just really comedic, and then it went full dark mode after. Episode 20 was brutal.

THIS. im also wondering why he didnt end it all with the guillotine file.

is it because he has to kill them instead of making them go to jail (since hanseok is probably gonna find his way out anyway)? and thus needs to be punished if he stays in korea??

 

also yes im confused about the bye bye balloon ticket too. i legit thought its gonna be used....................

 

 

[lexicon]

Regarding VC and Cha Young, as I had mentioned earlier I liked their relationship and the way it was built up. 

 

I am not very clued up on international law or the laws of SK. Surely VC will always be a criminal and wanted man in SK. As much as I agree he could have used another identity or even his birth name, and has the connections to do so - he would pretty much be living a lie.

 

He absolutely will always be Vincenzo and is a member of the mafia. That is how VC identifies himself. 

 

Cha Young can always move to be with him or in the interim "visit" him. However, as with VC, she was someone before meeting him. On top of that she is a lawyer in SK. As much as we know that VC took care of the villains, Cha Young can't just turn a blind eye everytime he kills someone. 

 

If Cha Young ever joins VC she would have to basically be aligned to the mafia way if life - I do not think that she is ready to that - at least not currently.

 

Yes they both love each other, and that confession by VC was maybe just short of a marriage wow. They are both meant for each other and love each other and respect each other. However they both know that they can't live in a conventional relationship basically because of their life principals. 

 

The ending is bitter sweet, but I still think it is a good ending and from my point of view a fairly realistic one given the circumstances.

[Dddddddnnnnnnrrrrrrrr]

44 minutes ago, Le_Amarant said:

SJK needs to shut it and just let us fans have some peace of mind. Jeez louise.

Tell me about it. 
I love you SJK but please do not further destroy my already broken heart by saying it’s not a happy ending. Vincenzo is only wanted in SK, they both can meet anywhere else in the world and on his island. Also Chayoung even need not involve herself in his mafia business anymore should she visit him on the island. 
 

The ending was perfect for both of them and I don’t care what SJK says no matter how much I adore him. 
 

*Goes back to listening to Vincenzo OST to reminisce and cry some more*

[meix2]

Here's my 2 cents after 24 hours of thinking over the ending...

Honestly, I now think that the ending was very fitting. I could have easily done without the death of hanseo  or the brutal death methods but understands that thematically it makes perfect sense, although emotionally, it was heartbreaking and hard to watch!

 

I was shipping for Vin and CY to be together in the end, but Ep. 20 did make me change my mind completely! We were consistently told how brutal Vincenzo can be- this was revealed to Han seok and Han seo (who went practically went pale at the photos!)- but we were never really shown it. Torturing and executing his mother's killer was one thing but to come up and plan/ organise the torture deaths was on another level altogether. Perhaps, as mafia, he needed to instill fear in his other enemies when/ if words get around but there was literally no one there to witness it. If it was just revenge, it was truly vicious whereas a bullet in the head would have been efficient and eliminated the problem (although definitely less satisfying).

 

I think it was a good move to finish the series by showing the audience what Vinchenzo is actually capable of, to dispel any notions of a happy ever after. CY has been shielded from most of the killings and although when she says 'make him/ them pay'- does she actually know what that entails? Gassing some killers in a car to make them talk was totally tame- I don't even think she realised that V killed them after that (i.e. V being 'merciful'). She was visibly shocked when V blew up the guy who was involved in her fathers death. I really do not think she would fully embrace this mafia side of him.

 

Plus, although V might have been at odds with Paolo and how he ran the Cassanos, he was obviously still loyal and attached to his mafia family, so to ask him to give up everything and move to Korea is difficult. He is literally torn between his Italian and Korean family, so I think the together but separate ending is a satisfactory one. I'm going to interpret it as they will continue to live their own lives but regularly meet up and also share a life. That's what I'm going with and that's that *puts fingers in ears* !

 

Edited May 3, 2021 by meix2

[peachfuzz]

1 hour ago, Le_Amarant said:

Honestly, I am a bit stunned at how dark the final episode was and how the story ended. I know Vincenzo is supposed to be dark comedy, but it's always straddled the line between darkness and comedy, usually favoring the latter. We know Vincenzo is a mafia, but it's kinda been a joke and treated lightly up until episode 16. The sheer ruthlessness that Vincenzo displayed in 20 took me aback.

 

 

I have a similar problem with the final episode as well! I’m not so bothered by how ruthless and brutal it was as much as I am bothered that we never really got our comedy fix like we used to in previous episodes. Since Vincenzo so seamlessly weaved darkness and comedy together for like, 80-90% of the show, I kept waiting for my comedy fix and it never quite happened. I also realize that Vincenzo is a mafia drama and that it also started off with bloody scenes, so I hesitate to criticize the last couple of episodes, but like you said, the drama had a good deal of humor for 16 episodes. I don’t think it’s entirely unreasonable to have anticipated a better ratio of darkness and comedy for the last 4, especially final 2, episodes.

 

I honestly think the frequent and consistent tone shifts in the first 2/3rds of the show that once served as one of the drama’s strengths became its weakness and directly caused the ending to feel somewhat out of place/dissatisfactory for some because they established a familiar pattern which was done away with in the last few episodes. Granted, Vincenzo’s mom and Han Seo were killed and all, but..

 

After rewatching the last episode, I’ve mostly come at peace with it. I definitely don’t think it was bad at all! I think it made for a mostly fitting conclusion, but I think it could have been even better. I’m heartbroken that Han Seo died, and like others, I do think the scene of Han Seo’s death was written/executed a little poorly, but I overall don’t have a strong grievance about Han Seo’s death, maybe because I was “ready” for it? Han Seo had death flags written all over him for so long. It doesn’t make his death any less tragic or heartbreaking, and of course I wish he could have lived! But I also don’t really mind that he died? His death was honorable and he was able to prove his worth, really to his own self, and he did something incredibly smart, brave, and noble in helping Vincenzo bring down Han Seok and in protecting his Cha Young and his true brother Vincenzo. 

 

What bothers me the most is how little of the Geumga Plaza tenants we saw in Ep 20. I know I know, the drama is titled Vincenzo and Vincenzo is the main-main character, but I was hoping for a way more flamboyant and elaborate takedown of the bad guys involving the tenants. The tenants became increasingly involved in fighting the bad guys in later episodes, so it was, imo, regrettable to see them sidelined. I guess only Vincenzo was capable of killing Choi Myung Hee and Jang Han Seok (the whole evil defeating evil thing), but it was a pity to me how they faded into the background after we learned about their secret talents/identities and grew attached to them. They were a family.. until they were not? I felt like I was given a dose of melodrama and I never realized I signed up for it, probably because the drama was so wild, energetic, and humorous at times.
 

I think I would have enjoyed the finale more if the drama hadn’t been so addictively energetic and comedic in earlier episodes. It’s really not the intensity of the darkness and violence that get me the most—it’s just not what I was expecting/hoping for. The last few episodes felt more characteristic of an OCN show. 

 

As for the loveline, I’m not going to pay attention to Song Joong Ki’s comment/interpretation  As the older monk said, they’re all bound by fate/pretty much destined to meet again. And look at @itsmeash’s list! I think the writers left more hints of hope for their relationship than hints of doom. I don’t know why people think sencha ended up just like CLOY’s leading couple; similar, yes, the same, no? Vincenzo and Cha Young can way more easily settle down together one day. 

[itsmeash]

1 hour ago, Le_Amarant said:

SJK needs to shut it and just let us fans have some peace of mind. Jeez louise.

I love him, but yes. Just let us have this, dude. lol.

  

56 minutes ago, lexicon said:

Regarding VC and Cha Young, as I had mentioned earlier I liked their relationship and the way it was built up. 

 

I am not very clued up on international law or the laws of SK. Surely VC will always be a criminal and wanted man in SK. As much as I agree he could have used another identity or even his birth name, and has the connections to do so - he would pretty much be living a lie.

 

He absolutely will always be Vincenzo and is a member of the mafia. That is how VC identifies himself. 

 

Cha Young can always move to be with him or in the interim "visit" him. However, as with VC, she was someone before meeting him. On top of that she is a lawyer in SK. As much as we know that VC took care of the villains, Cha Young can't just turn a blind eye everytime he kills someone. 

 

If Cha Young ever joins VC she would have to basically be aligned to the mafia way if life - I do not think that she is ready to that - at least not currently.

 

Yes they both love each other, and that confession by VC was maybe just short of a marriage wow. They are both meant for each other and love each other and respect each other. However they both know that they can't live in a conventional relationship basically because of their life principals. 

 

The ending is bitter sweet, but I still think it is a good ending and from my point of view a fairly realistic one given the circumstances.

Honestly, nothing about them is conventional, so I like  this kind of ending for  them. They are in love, in a LDR, can be together whenever and also have their own lives still. It's so perfect and fitting for them both. 

[Le_Amarant]

Holy moly. Has anyone seen this Youtube edit?

 

 

[sal2]

1 hour ago, itsmeash said:

I mean he could... this seems like writer error because Vin does know some people who could easily help him bypass all that... Idk why it wasn't mentioned in the finale.

He manage to sneak in the country true the Italian delegate for the South Korea - Italy anniversary party. So it is not gonna be easy for him to do enter again Korea. 

[Le_Amarant]

I don't get why it's hard for him to enter Korea. He's literally friends with the head of the Intelligence agency, and An and Mr. Cho are looking for him too. Miri is also a top notch hacker.

 

If all else fails, he is a billionaire and can buy himself multiple fake passports.

 

WUT?!

[agenth]

2 minutes ago, Le_Amarant said:

I don't get why it's hard for him to enter Korea. He's literally friends with the head of the Intelligence agency, and An and Mr. Cho are looking for him too. Miri is also a top notch hacker.

 

If all else fails, he is a billionaire and can buy himself multiple fake passports.

 

Dafuq?!

 

I think Vincenzo suffered in the last two episodes. This is one of the things that makes no sense. Besides, South Korea has an extradition treaty with Italy (through European Convention on Extradition). And yes, Malta is part of it, too. 

 

So it's not like he'd be safer in Italy or Malta, by that logic. 

[shinystar1985]

 

Just wanted to share this cute edit in memory of our most powerful married couple. The withdrawal is no joke. 

[meix2]

4 hours ago, Le_Amarant said:

Holy moly. Has anyone seen this Youtube edit?

 

If this was a trailer, I'm so going to see that movie! Some wicked skills with editing.

Edited May 3, 2021 by ferily
Please don't quote videos. Thanks!

[TheaN]

2 hours ago, lexicon said:

I am not very clued up on international law or the laws of SK. Surely VC will always be a criminal and wanted man in SK. As much as I agree he could have used another identity or even his birth name, and has the connections to do so - he would pretty much be living a lie.

 

He absolutely will always be Vincenzo and is a member of the mafia. That is how VC identifies himself. 

...

 

The ending is bitter sweet, but I still think it is a good ending and from my point of view a fairly realistic one given the circumstances.

 

I agree with you .  It isn't that Vincenzo could not stay.  He CHOSE to go because of who he was, who he is and the life he plans to lead.  There is a change in that he envisions life as a "good" mafia, if that is possible.  He remains true to himself and leaves a door for Chayoung to join him when she can.

 

Edit: I believe that during the break, the death scenes for our villians were among the ones that were rewritten.  They were intentionally made more brutal so that viewers could better accept that Vincenzo was also evil and would make the decision to leave Korea.  I read somewhere that the "Spear of Atonement" was a prop that was made quickly near the end.

[bee_wannabe]

I may sound like a broken record here, but again this is PJB's ambitious writing. This drama is manifestation of PJB's anger towards the corrupt system. Law can not touch them so there needs to be an existence who can punish those behind the corrupt system hence he creates V. He creates Vaisravana for this fictional world of his.

 

V is an evil who punishes other evils. He can not leave that part out of him, the part that feels enormous anger whenever human stoop way too low or hurt others close to him, the part that feels the need to channel that anger towards the perpetrator. And this aligns to PJB's first intention, the existence of Vaisravana. If V settles down and leaves his mafia side, the Vaisravana disappears, the purpose of this drama disappears.

 

From PJB previous work we know that he's still someone who values religion and God. This prevents him from giving justification to the killing spree V's done. Getting rid of evils doesn't justify that what he does is right. There's price V needs to pay for choosing that life. That's why the option of living in Korea or any kind of happy ending for him is not possible.

 

What makes it hard to accept as viewer is that we've been fed too much comedy to realize that there's noir in this drama. We get to believe this drama is about redemption because of the growing connection between him and others around him. The connection serves a purpose eventually because V inspires others to be strong and fight fervently when others try to take their rights and V finds his new purpose of cleaning up the scumbags instead of just getting involved in the mafia business.

 

However spending 16 episodes building that connection then turning it back to the starting point just doesn't feel right. It's inevitable if some viewers feel cheated. Not to mention 4 episodes to bring it back to noir is way too short thus the loopholes is inevitable.

 

Regarding VCY, as a shipper, i choose to be delusional and stand to what @hankukin and others have said. Both can actually get best of two worlds and they have the financial support to visit each other frequently. Happy ending for VCY. No one can say otherwise, not even SJK.

[Le_Amarant]

@bee_wannabe The thing is, as I watched the drama progress, I was under the impression that VC wanted to leave the mafia world behind and he was haunted by his mafia experiences. It felt like he was forced unwillingly into that world initially - because his mother "abandoned" him and his foster parents then got cruelly killed - so he fell into the mafia world bc of the cruelty of life rather than consciously choosing to be in it.

 

I never got the sense that he particularly embraced the mafia side of him. It was almost a necessity that he learned for survival. Korea was his one chance to break out of it. For him to be stuck in that darkness is tragic.

 

I am in love with this drama and it definitely tops my list of kdramas, but I agree that the writing and pacing could be alot more cohesive. It kind of fell off the track after 14, and 19 and 20 were super haphazard in terms of the tone shift. It was not necessary for Han-seo to die.

[itsmeash]

2 hours ago, Le_Amarant said:

I don't get why it's hard for him to enter Korea. He's literally friends with the head of the Intelligence agency, and An and Mr. Cho are looking for him too. Miri is also a top notch hacker.

 

If all else fails, he is a billionaire and can buy himself multiple fake passports.

 

WUT?!

Exactly why I say this is clearly writer error because all the ways V can bypass everything are right there.

 

****

 

Honestly, though, a straight up happy ending now that I think of it would have felt wrong. This ending works perfectly. Both V and CY stay themselves, but still love and can be with each other whenever they want without either having to give up who they are separately. It's the best ending that is not a typical happy ending.

[peachfuzz]

I 

52 minutes ago, bee_wannabe said:

V is an evil who punishes other evils. He can not leave that part out of him, the part that feels enormous anger whenever human stoop way too low or hurt others close to him, the part that feels the need to channel that anger towards the perpetrator. And this aligns to PJB's first intention, the existence of Vaisravana. If V settles down and leaves his mafia side, the Vaisravana disappears, the purpose of this drama disappears.

 

I agree! The real tragedy is that we need someone like Vincenzo in the first place to deal with evil. 

 

I also agree with your statement on how it’s not possible for Vincenzo to be given a perfectly happy, guiltless ending given the writer’s values, and I don’t think Vincenzo himself believes he deserves a guilt-free happy ending either. We all love Vincenzo and know he’s not the evil that Han Seok and Myung Hee are—of course we want the best for him! We’ve seen how much he cares for others! But the blood’s been spilt, and there’s no undoing the evil Vincenzo committed. There was tragedy to Vincenzo/ character from the very beginning. 
 

I don’t really feel like he was forced into cruelty. Unlike Han Seok and Myung Hee, Vincenzo has a sense of morality, so I think it’s only natural that he’s haunted by the evil he’s committed, and I think there is a part of him that does wish to be cleansed of his sin, but from what he told the monk, it’s also evident that he doesn’t want to let go of his mafia life, either. I feel like he’s torn about the whole thing because he has that sense of morality but unwilling to let go because he can’t bear to see people more evil than he is.