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[Current Mainland Chinese Drama 2018] The Story of Ming Lan 庶女明兰传 / 知否?知否?应是绿肥红瘦

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17 minutes ago, cherubstomato said:

Yes I know QH is being silly and petty. I SYMPATHIZE with him because I see his regret and pain but I am not DEFENDING his current actions. There are things in life that are beyond our capabilities and for QH, being with ML was one of them. I sympathize with him because no matter if he tried the universe went against him, that’s just life and they weren’t destined to be together. 

 

I dont care if GTY had offered QH help before. GTY was a man who had nothing to lose, he can bet his life on anything. But QH is not the same. He is not someone who can risk and bet on chances.... Therefore I understood why he turned GTY down when he offered to help. QH and Dr. He can’t do what GTY did, schemed his way to get ML.

 

Take away is the wrong word, I’m not blaming GTY for marrying ML. I’m speaking from QH POV the last person he’d want to see ML be with is someone who is related/close to him. Because the regret he has is amplified by it. More so feeling betrayed. Yes, I understand him feeling betrayed. You’d be lying to yourself if you were in QH situation you wouldn’t feel a bit of resentment towards a friend whom you confided in about the person you love and than the next thing you know, they are together...

 

Sure, they all should’ve moved on but if I were GTY I wouldn’t touched ML even if I had feelings for her. That’s why I understood QH when he brought up the past of them together, as if GTY didn’t value their relationship since he went behind his back to marry ML.... Granted ML is no one’s property, but going behind his back I mean that he didn’t come to QH like a man to let him know what’s up. Maybe there would’ve been a fair match between them but GTY can’t take that risk because I know that GTY must have ML, that’s why he only confronted QH after all was said and done.. GTY acted ignorant in front of QH like he didn’t know he hadn’t moved on but he knew that next person he going to have to face is QH. Really now? 

Maybe that is just me and my views in life and how I value the bonds of the small relationships I have. It’s fine for me if GTY and QH can’t go back to the way they used to be. I’m not going to condemn neither of them for it. In fact I don’t expect them to. 

 

I agree that it is unfair to QH current wife. Because he thought he could force himself to heal, force himself to accept that life should go on. Therefore he got married, and focused himself on his career, yet he is still hasn’t fully moved on. 

 

 

 

LOL, I don't get why GTY should value and consider QH's emotion over his own? If QH was a close friend to GTY like CB (who still care for him when he was kicked out of the house, when his life was ruined) or all those people from Yuzhou (who been through life and death battles with him), then I agree that he should have talked to QH first. But they're not THAT close? They were like casual friends. Remember what QH was doing when GTY was kicked out? He was happily preparing the dumb birthday plan for his mom :)) Why should GTY sacrifice the love of his life for such casual friendship?? (I'm not saying that QH has to care for GTY when he was at his lowest, but the fact that he didn't implies that their friendship has never been that deep, hence GTY has never owned him anything, let alone sacrificing his love for QH)

 

As far as he knows, QH had already married someone else and moved on from his relationship with ML. It's been several years since their relationship ended, he had married, she had moved on to talk about marriage with someone else. I don't get why GTY had to care about the feelings of some ex lover of her from years ago? QH didn't own ML, even after his wife died he didn't tell anyone about his intention to get back to ML, how should anyone knew if he still had feelings for ML or not? Why should GTY consider his feelings when QH himself obviously does not care about anyone else's feelings other than his own? He doesn't even care about ML's feelings! 

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2 hours ago, gleek49 said:

 

GTY didn't take her from anyone. QH and her had no longer had any relation whatsoever after he married, I don't care if he had reasons or not, their relationship was over, period. In modern term, they had broken up and she's single, that's it, anyone could try to court her and QH had no say in it.

 

Dr. He hadn't even officially proposed to ML yet, so he also had no claim on her. In modern term, they hadn't become an official couple yet, so again, she's still single, any could try to court her and sent proposal gifts to her house and Dr. He couldn't say anything.

 

After his wife died, QH only INTENDED to go ask for her hand, but he didn't actually do it, he didn't even tell anyone of his intention, how could anyone suppose to know what he wanted? He couldn't just expect her to stand in one place waiting for him? Hadn't it occur to him that there can be other guys who like her too? He could at least ask around to see if there's anyone else, if he did, he would have known about Dr. He and he might had the chance to act faster. But he didn't do it. If GTY wasn't there, he would have still lost to Dr. He with his way of handling things. His tantrum right now towards GTY is just him unable to cope with his own incompetency, him looking for someone to blame on for his misery. The mature thing to do is to face your mistake, move on and let your wound to be healed. Both ML and GTY had met with as much pain and struggles as him, if not more; but they didn't sulk in a corner being bitter and blaming the world, they moved on, that's why they are able to be happy with each other now. QH not only refuses to let go, but he tries to drag others down with him just because he's unhappy is nothing less of an angry child and a sore loser. Until he's willing to admit that this is his own damn faults, he has no right to blame it on anyone.

 

And GTY didn't rub salt in his wound, agitating QH do no one no good, why would he do such stupid things? He was just trying to tell QH what he did wrong, trying to get him to face his mistakes, not blaming on others; he told him point blank because he cared about QH and he wanted him to move on.

So much this. Well said. I couldn’t believe when this guy actually brought up NM’s accusations against GTY in the court without knowing anything. It came across as self serving and presumptuous to me that I just had to laugh. Fortunately because of everything GTY has been through whether through true or false accusations, he has thick skin. He knows how to weather the storm. However, him going to that guy’s manor to offer him the olive branch that was firmly repudiated clearly showed me just how petty that QH’s actions were. He needs to grow up and move on and should start by taking responsibility for his actions. How dare he entertain marriage prospects with ML anyway after unintendedly sullying her reputation and exposing her and her family to public derision.

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@gleek49 GTY and QH were equally selfish in their own ways... GTY has no right to lecture QH just as QH has no right to hold grudges on GTY.

 

I didn’t think their relationship was casual. Lol They grew up together as well. If it were casual QH wouldn’t be so affected the way he is towards GTY... If it were casual GTY wouldn’t try to help him with a very dangerous plan that could cause his life or his loved ones... I truly believed QH genuinely wished well for ML just as GTY wished well for QH and ML. QH never showed resentment towards Dr He (I’m sure he knows about it as news travel fast) nor did he try to break their engagement off like GTY... He just didn’t imagine it would be his uncle whom he looked up to, confided in, whom had seen the heart break he and ML went through to be that man for ML... It’s not about valuing someone’s emotions over others... It’s about valuing relationship from brother to brother.

 

Why should QH bring up marriage with ML right away? It wasn’t the right time, the emperor died, his first wife was killed, his mother was in total shock, he needed to get his family and life back together before he can present himself to ML. 

 

GTY is the same, he took a chance and succeeded in causing a disruption with Dr. He engagement. He also waited until he was successful to get ML... So why didn’t he proposed to her right then and there when he realized he wanted to marry her when ML showed he cared for his daughter? He basically just had the better timing and schemed for it. Where as QH and Dr He could only do it the way it’s naturally done. At least QH and DR He was upfront with their proposal for ML while GTY had to hide behind in disguise of marrying a di daughter which he had everyone to believe it was Rulan. And I also see GTY pov why he had to disguised it. 

 

I dont get why you think QH only cared about his feelings? Did he not apologize to ML when his mother made a declaration in sheng household that they are sisters. Did he not send the doll to ML to let her know that he is sorry that he couldn’t keep his promise? If you were in his position what were you supposed to do when your father was kidnapped and threatened for his life if he doesn’t marry? I don’t trust GTY plan either in kidnapping the princess as well either. And it would be much more selfish of QH if he brought GTY into his troubles. There’s always someone who has to sacrifice. We can’t have everything we want. I’m sure QH knows it but he can’t help to feel the way his feeling because his situation was also unfair. 

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Apart from GTY x ML, I actually really want to see what happen to Molan at the Liang household. I thought her mother in law doesn't like her, but she is actually quite smart to gain the favour of her husband (her husband seems to dote on her a lot). 

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One thing I like about GTY is that he doesn’t pretend to be anything other than himself. I wasn’t pleased with the way he lived his life previously but he is trying to live a “better” life. He knows his faults and admit to them. QH, however, comes off as pious to me yet how could he not see nor understand how his actions publicly hurt ML? Furthermore, ML is now a married woman. If he’s so pious and righteous, why not pay attention to his home and do his duty to his wife and stop pining after someone else’s wife? He can carry a torch all he wants for ML but isn’t it dishonorable to make it obvious and public for others to bandy about as gossip? A more honorable man would see the folly of his careless actions. 

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57 minutes ago, cherubstomato said:

@gleek49 GTY and QH were equally selfish in their own ways... GTY has no right to lecture QH just as QH has no right to hold grudges on GTY.

 

I didn’t think their relationship was casual. Lol They grew up together as well. If it were casual QH wouldn’t be so affected the way he is towards GTY... If it were casual GTY wouldn’t try to help him with a very dangerous plan that could cause his life or his loved ones... I truly believed QH genuinely wished well for ML just as GTY wished well for QH and ML. QH never showed resentment towards Dr He (I’m sure he knows about it as news travel fast) nor did he try to break their engagement off like GTY... He just didn’t imagine it would be his uncle whom he looked up to, confided in, whom had seen the heart break he and ML went through to be that man for ML... It’s not about valuing someone’s emotions over others... It’s about valuing relationship from brother to brother.

 

Why should QH bring up marriage with ML right away? It wasn’t the right time, the emperor died, his first wife was killed, his mother was in total shock, he needed to get his family and life back together before he can present himself to ML. 

 

GTY is the same, he took a chance and succeeded in causing a disruption with Dr. He engagement. He also waited until he was successful to get ML... So why didn’t he proposed to her right then and there when he realized he wanted to marry her when ML showed he cared for his daughter? He basically just had the better timing and schemed for it. Where as QH and Dr He could only do it the way it’s naturally done. At least QH and DR He was upfront with their proposal for ML while GTY had to hide behind in disguise of marrying a di daughter which he had everyone to believe it was Rulan. And I also see GTY pov why he had to disguised it. 

 

I dont get why you think QH only cared about his feelings? Did he not apologize to ML when his mother made a declaration in sheng household that they are sisters. Did he not send the doll to ML to let her know that he is sorry that he couldn’t keep his promise? If you were in his position what were you supposed to do when your father was kidnapped and threatened for his life if he doesn’t marry? I don’t trust GTY plan either in kidnapping the princess as well either. And it would be much more selfish of QH if he brought GTY into his troubles. There’s always someone who has to sacrifice. We can’t have everything we want. I’m sure QH knows it but he can’t help to feel the way his feeling because his situation was also unfair. 

 

As I was saying, QH was affected because he himself is hurt, he's looking for someone to bear the blame for his misery. He can't be angry at the stranger like Dr.He, of course it's easier to blame someone he knows. They didn't grow up together, they know each other growing up, there's a difference. GTY was going to risk himself for ML's future happiness too, not just for QH. If it wasn't for ML, I doubt he would go to talk to QH the minute he heard about his engagement. 

 

QH doesn't have to ask for her hand right away, but he could at least let his intention known. No one was obligated to go and ask for his permission to propose to his ex girlfriend, years after he'd already married someone else. 

 

Yes QH doesn't care about anyone's feelings other than himself. He didn't care about ML's feelings when he ignore all of her warnings and rejections. He didn't care about her feelings when he decided ALL ON HIS OWN that he should marry her after his wife died. He didn't care about his parents' feelings when he pull the birthday stunt on his mother or starve himself. Did you see how he was treating his 2nd wife? He obviously didn't care about her feelings either. I would say that he didn't care for GTY's feelings, but you would just say that GTY doesn't deserve it, so don't bother. I mean honestly, have you seen him talking about anything other than his own feelings, his own issues?

 

And please don't say that QH had it "unfair", everyone in the world has some sort of hardship. QH was born rich, handsome and talented, with parents completely devoted to him. Right now his career is going along greatly, he can have a nice marriage too if he's willing to work on it. Life is not unfair to him, he's bleeping blessed. He's the only one doesn't appreciate it. I'm honestly so done with his whiny, entitled richard simmons throwing tantrums and blaming others when things doesn't get his way. So what if GTY wanted to put his own need first? He doesn't own QH anything, he has already tried to help QH the best way he knows how, he doesn't have to curate his life to please some random guy who's only his friend when he need him and nowhere to be seen when his life is hard. That's how I see it, GTY did nothing wrong to QH and QH needs to stop acting like a spoiled child.

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I see a few people sympathizes with QH there is nothing wrong with that but I find his opinion of being betrayed by GTY pathetic. I feel that if he truly understood or know GTY, know matter how mad he is . He would never believe the ranting of MN or rumors that are going around the town about him. QH has lead such a sheltered life that he could never smell conspiracy brewing in his own life/court. He is such a follower, he can never be a leader because he doesn’t know how to think outside the box.  TBH GTY was never really close to QH .  If he was close to him like Changbai is he would of have asked him what is going on instead of trying to ruin him without physical proof. We all watched the Prince tell the Emperor that once The Scholars saw the stab wound , they stop trying to bully GTY. QH  and his parents easily believe in rumors and are very bad at judging peole. They believe/trust people who are on high position. With the exception of QH, his parents do look down on people of the lower cast instead of judging someone on their character because of how they grew up. Like @gleek49 QH has never been there for him or seen his struggle and pain since they were young. CB is like a brother to him and respected  GTY . 

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39 minutes ago, shihuangdi said:

Apart from GTY x ML, I actually really want to see what happen to Molan at the Liang household. I thought her mother in law doesn't like her, but she is actually quite smart to gain the favour of her husband (her husband seems to dote on her a lot). 

Same, but it is already all bad. Since her trusted maid might become sixth Liang new concubine and he is onto Molans act. I just hope to see that she pays for the caused of the other concubine miscarriage.

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@UnniSarah Yes, I agree. He shouldn’t bring his personal grudge with him to work. He is holding a grudge far too long and it’s getting the best of him.

ZYL was such a good actor, that scene of him and FSF confrontation. When he broked down in tears and let it out, as he have been putting on a facade of an emotionless soul, ugh I couldn’t help but also in tears. I don’t know why his expression just show a whole lot. And in that moment was when I sympathize with QH. Resentment, regret, shame all sharp blades slicing through his heart. All the words that GTY said to him went for the kill, straight in the heart because he knows himself that it’s true. 

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1 minute ago, cherubstomato said:

@UnniSarah Yes, I agree. He shouldn’t bring his personal grudge with him to work. He is holding a grudge far too long and it’s getting the best of him.

ZYL was such a good actor, that scene of him and FSF confrontation. And he was all tears, ugh I couldn’t help but also in tears. I don’t know why his expression just show a whole lot. And in that moment was when I sympathize with QH. Resentment, regret, shame all sharp blades slicing through his heart. All the words that GTY said to him went for the kill, straight in the heart because he knows himself that it’s true. 

@cherubstomato...ZYL’s performance was very good. I think once I saw that performance, I felt he realized that he was targeting GTY for personal reasons. When he started tearing up he kept repeating that he was just doing his job. Now we have to wait to see will he stop or contact down the path of revenge.  What do you think??

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1 minute ago, UnniSarah said:

@cherubstomato...ZYL’s performance was very good. I think once I saw that performance, I felt he realized that he was targeting GTY for personal reasons. When he started tearing up he kept repeating that he was just doing his job. Now we have to wait to see will he stop or contact down the path of revenge.  What do you think??

Yes, I feel as if he was trying to reassure his heart that he is over ML. He was trying his best but it was more like pretending to move on... He is in denial. The way to let go/move on, one must first learn to accept. He still hasn’t accepted the fact ML is GTY now. This I feel is hindering him from moving on, as well as him holding onto grudge... The confrontation with GTY may have opened QH to realize that he still loves ML. We’ll see how it plays out. It’s hard to make a judgement based on previews. 

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8 hours ago, shem1 said:

 

They must like her a lot.  She has 3 wax at Tussaud now right?  Wow!  Bravo.  I hope they made them nice.

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I hope QH isn't involved because it would taint his feelings for ML. But I am not sure since I doubt his role is over after the confrontation with ML.  Next episodes are really packed and we have tons of vilains, I'd be fine without QH playing that role too.

However they stresses their antagonism in court, they even looked at each other in one of the clip, QH is on ED side and if he is there for ML during the fire, while GTY isn't, he could convince himself GTY doesnt deserve her and he has to act to protect her.

 

 

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6 hours ago, hello210 said:

That smug look on her face showed that she was probably expecting a position but we saw that GTY wasn’t really going to sleep with her.  I think she stirs up trouble if that’s her that was trying to take a blade to the throat in front of ML in one of the previews? Probably because she has not been made an official concubine and GTY basically didn’t want her or touch her. 

                Also so on another note, in one of the previews we can see that 3rd Gu bro, GTW, may be aligning himself with ED like in the novel so we may see that twist in his character since he can’t get away from Stepmom’s influence completely. 

I know right?  LOL.  Served her right.  She was looking a tad smug when Aunt Gu told ML that she is giving a concubine to GTY since ML is still not pregnant despite being married for almost a year :triumph:.  She looked uncomfortable around GTY and he just went off to sleep with his beloved wifey.....I was like "awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww, so sweet":heart:

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1 hour ago, cherubstomato said:

Same, but it is already all bad. Since her trusted maid might become sixth Liang new concubine and he is onto Molans act. I just hope to see that she pays for the caused of the other concubine miscarriage.

I'm loving the fact that Sixth Liang is taking Molan's maid as his concubine. This should drive Molan crazy. I hope the maid is also cunning and can handle Molan. Also the maid was supposed to get married but not released by Molan. So I think the maid should hold some grudge towards her. 

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11 hours ago, leeza77 said:

Lol.. Ml is a foodie. How can he compete with food??? :joy:

She is always eating and it is obvious she shares food with her maids LOL

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