[Mainland Chinese Drama 2018] The Story of Ming Lan 庶女明兰传 / 知否？知否？应是绿肥红瘦

[Lunkera]

@linhlinh111 Someones reputation isn't so easily restored even today. In ancient china aswell as other ancient kingdoms restoring your reputation was no easy thing. Grandma still wouldn't choose him.

[Lunkera]

I did watch episode 39 of the uncut version. Waiting for the TV version. I think madam liang looked sad she didn't get ML as a daughter in law. Molan looked jealous and took a grip on something just to calm herself  . I don't know what it was, looked like some round type candy. Sorry i can't find the right word for it. 

 

preview scenes : 

Spoiler

 

 

[nichiwoohee]

52 minutes ago, hello210 said:

I’ve commented before that I think GTY may feel insecure based on what him and ML said to each other in the love triangle trailer. It’s not about ML not being her true self since they changed that in the drama, but they also gave us more feelings between QH and ML than in the novel. I think they will have everything but the words I Love You. They have admiration, respect for each other, and happiness. And since GTY knew about the romantic feelings between QH and ML, after seeing their little meeting, there’s probably some insecurities there that he’s not in ML’s heart. Imagine what it would feel like to be in love with the person you’re married to but that person may still be in love with someone else. He’s very much in love with ML and may want the security of knowing she feels the same way. Based on ML’s remark to GTY in the trailer, GTY hasn’t mentioned love either and maybe that will also make him realize that he himself wasn’t completely honest with his feelings even though he tells her he admired her, I don’t think he’s mentioned love yet. No matter how great some actions are, sometimes people just need the security of those three little words or that they have a place in each other’s heart. 

 

That’s just my take on what their little personal crisis point could be about based on the little bit I saw in that love triangle trailer. We’ll see how they actually play it out when that part comes since these trailers can be misleading. 

 

Thank you for giving your insight, I was really confused with the insecure part. I tend to analyze all the trailers, I cant help it 

from the viewers pov we can see the changes between them when they are around each other, but yes the right way is waiting on after their marriage, maybe something will happen that makes ML clammed up again (the Gu family meddling perhaps)

 

https://youtu.be/JnyM_AgrMqg

 

oh my!!!!! That first seconds of gty and ml *fans herself furiously*

[Suzzy San]

Values or not, they will still have to scheme to marry Ming lan, because even if ML vouch for his character, grandma would have gotten angry that she doesn't tell her anything and that would have further not allow them to marry. It's like embarking on QH 2.0 proposal. If it wasn't what happened for this wedding, danniang wouldn't have adopted ML and ML would still have been a di daughter. If he had proposed outrightly, Rulan would still be the first to be considered as she is shu daughter and GTY is now an official,and she is also the eldest.. He could have told ML his plan but like what ML said when he eventually told her the plan that wasn't he worried about rulan's reputations at all. So ML wouldn't have supported that plan and she wouldn't want to hold onto any stupid promise that might not work. So working alone to make the mission accomplished is the best choice ever. At least, no one was under the burden of waiting and he wasn't under the pressure 9f disappointing someone. He did it silently and quietly as possible. ML has a great value now than ever, because she married grandly and as a shu daughter, if it was a direct wedding, the wedding might be grand but there will be a lot of rumors as to her reputations again that she is just trying to get everyone in high positions.. But now they all think Rulan was the stupid one and ML is pitiful to have been a replacement. So they are all happy for her that she got to be a madam after all her predicaments... This is a well thought out plan by GTY to not only marry ML but to also raise her reputations in the society. 

[minglan1]

14 minutes ago, Lunkera said:

I did watch episode 39 of the uncut version. Waiting for the TV version. I think madam liang looked sad she didn't get ML as a daughter in law. Molan looked jealous and took a grip on something just to calm herself  . I don't know what it was, looked like some round type candy. Sorry i can't find the right word for it. 

 

preview scenes : 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

We are on a romance overdrive.Not that I mind.

Jealous Molan I love it.

[Lunkera]

@nichiwoohee clip is restricted by country

[gleek49]

10 minutes ago, linhlinh111 said:

Yeah but that was his past life. Wouldn't asking for ML, a shu daughter, prove that his view on status has changed? Instead of asking for the di daughter and get the shu daughter as a replacement? Maybe ML and Grandma now knows that he really wanted ML but others don't, so wouldn't that kinda cheapen ML's value?

 

If he ask for her directly, (1) grandma who has a very low opinion of him would not agree. (2) I wouldn't bet on Minglan's feeling for him, he has mentioned marriage a few times but she's never caught on, which means that she's never genuinely considered him as a possible match. Yes, she has respect for him, but there's no guarantee that she'll choose him, who has a complicated background that she's very much aware of, over Dr. He who is much more simple. (3) Big Madam would be very angry that he chooses ML over Rulan, this is not good for Minglan; so with the scheme, he manages to make Big Madam gladly hand Minglan over to him, without any jealousy or anger, she even went around proudly advertises ML as a "di" daughter of her. (4) WIth everyone believe that Minglan ending up with him is only "accidental", no one will consider her a target of jealousy or some sort of weakness that can be used against him.

 

In the end, everyone in Sheng house is satisfy and happy; Minglan''s never be targeted by anyone and her status and value is higher than ever.

[nichiwoohee]

1 minute ago, Lunkera said:

@nichiwoohee clip is restricted by country

 

Sorry guys! Actually all the youtube spoilers everyone posted also restricted by country for mez So it means the one I can see, others cant see  what an odd channel

 

Spoiler

You may already seen it, the first seconds are gty kissing ml’s ears and neck on the next morning after the wedding night

 

I just realize maybe all the spoilers I see are just being uploaded late 

 

 

[UnniSarah]

1 hour ago, hello210 said:

In my opinion, possibly with the exception of Doc He, CB and wife (that we can see so far), everyone is a schemer in this drama, whether it’s for survival, revenge, or to get something they want. The difference is that each one schemes within their abilities and character. QH pulled little innocent schemes that in his mind is not harmful whereas GTY and ML pulled some whopping ones but they all did it within their characters and perceptions.  Same for the others, SH, CL, Molan, Madame Liang, etc. They all have their flaws and their good points.  And both QH and GTY have the right to feel the way they do because each has their own perspectives of what’s going on. For me, the fact that these characters have been able to generate this much discussion is a testament to the writers and actors for the great job they did. I also enjoy reading everyone’s varied opinions. 

 

Well said @hello210.  I think because of the era they are in scheming seems to  be the way of life. 

[Lunkera]

@nichiwoohee Ah, i just posted that clip. probably the urltext that's the problem

[fra8]

I loved the clip with granny ML and GTY. They were all so happy, the way granny looked at her and them.

[nichiwoohee]

4 minutes ago, Lunkera said:

@nichiwoohee Ah, i just posted that clip.

 

I’m late then

[linhlinh111]

I have to say again that I agree with most of GTY's plan, including the Dr. He's cousin, cuz he was just saving ML from having to deal with her after marriage, but I disagree with him on 2 things:

 

1. He asked for Rulan instead of ML. Rulan was already in love with someone. If he was afraid that Daniang would not be happy with him bypassing her daughter, he could have just exposed Rulan's scandal first then ask for ML after Rulan was already betrothed. If ML didn't want to marry him then he was forcing her against her will. If ML actually liked him then she would be very sad. Although he explained later that sad period could not be undone.

 

2. He waited until everything was done to tell ML. I understand he wanted to ensure the result but sometimes a man's gotta do the right thing even if it would bring him more difficulties. He could just scheme and calculate everyone cuz they don't matter, but that doesn't include ML. You don't do such things to the one you want to marry. Imagine one day you fiance telling you: "Hey I lied to you and tricked you on this and that but it was for your own good and now I tell you the truth so don't hold a grudge?". Moreover, ML is a smart, strong independent woman, so GTY was actually risking the trust between them. If I was in ML's shoes, then yes I would be happy there's a great guy going through such length to get me. But there will always be that uneasy feeling of being manipulated and lied to.

 

I see a lot of people trying to defend him, giving him lots of excuses, but his method, albeit effective, was wrong and although it succeeded, it set a few unpleasant stones in their marriage. He could have succeeded doing it the straight way, but he chose not to. Actually this was a major part of the story when they try to resolve this issue. He never realized his fault and blaming ML until ML has to clarify it for him.

[darkphoenix123]

Hualan looks so happy when Minglan & GTY walked out onto the field laughing

[darkphoenix123]

17 minutes ago, linhlinh111 said:

I have to say again that I agree with most of GTY's plan, including the Dr. He's cousin, cuz he was just saving ML from having to deal with her after marriage, but I disagree with him on 2 things:

 

1. He asked for Rulan instead of ML. Rulan was already in love with someone. If he was afraid that Daniang would not be happy with him bypassing her daughter, he could have just exposed Rulan's scandal first then ask for ML after Rulan was already betrothed. If ML didn't want to marry him then he was forcing her against her will. If ML actually liked her then she would be very sad. Although he explained later that sad period could not be undone.

 

2. He waited until everything was done to tell ML. I understand he wanted to ensure the result but sometimes a man's gotta do the right thing even if it would bring him more difficulties. He could just scheme and calculate everyone cuz they don't matter, but that doesn't include ML. You don't do such things to the one you want to marry. Imagine one day you fiance telling you: "Hey I lied to you and tricked you on this and that but it was for your own good and now I tell you the truth so don't hold a grudge?". Moreover, ML is a smart, strong independent woman, so GTY was actually risking the trust between them. If I was in ML's shoes, then yes I would be happy there's a great guy going through such length to get me. But there will always be that uneasy feeling of being manipulated and lied to.

Grandma & Minglan talk about the second point. Minglan was a little hesitant because of that. What if in the future he schemes against me? That’s why she was avoiding him until his confession during the polo match. It’s only when he properly proposed that she accepted 

[Lunkera]

tv version 41 out

Spoiler

 

 

[ForgottenSoulx]

27 minutes ago, linhlinh111 said:

 

 

Its like you people are not getting the era this show is set in , if he asked for RL he would simply be denied by the grandma. He did expose RL's scandal hense was able to marry ML? Im confused. If ML and Grandma respected what GTY did in the scheming i dont see why you even have issues with it. This is the damn era of manipulation if you dont do that then enjoy a sad life. 

 

12 hours ago, Golden Flower said:

 

 

 

He liked her since the river bandits but im not sure if he planned to marry her since then. That kidnapping was a scenario to see if QH would really go to the end of the world for ML and as proved he would not.  Since when are friends honest and tell each other everything, GTY has no reason to tell QH anything they were never that close. 

 

11 hours ago, Golden Flower said:

 

 

I think he was 100% Sincere if QH asked for help then winning ML over i think GTY would have helped, if anyone really thought that princess thing was serious then yikes. I do think he knew about the second assassin but it was not planned by GTY.

 

 

10 hours ago, tomo74 said:

I think I should moved on from discussing QH, it's very clear that people taking side, it sounds to me, when GTY acting cunning and manipulative to ML, people always find an excuse, but keep saying QH is bad, trashing ML reputation, like he do it in purpose, please look at the whole story and characters, I'm happy that some people already try to understand QH's character without squeeze him to death, once again, I'm not pro QH.

 

No offence but you have taken aside as well you are clearly on QH's side so you are pro QH maybe you just do not see it.

 

If QH was doing what GTY was doing i would like him alot more then GTY but hes not.

 

9 hours ago, tomo74 said:

Now, talk about GTY, people say his best friend is CB, my question, why GTY have to mislead his bestie about marrying his sister, he can honestly say, "hey bro, I like your 6th sister and I plan to marry her, give me your blessing please", instead he just say (I don't know what his exact word, since I'm not up to that episode) I want to marry your sis (even though what he wants is ML), he should knows that his words will mislead CB and the whole Sheng family, lucky enough that RL doesn't like him, can you imagine what happen if RL likes him too, and they agree to let GTY marry RL, and then GTY will tell them, "um... actually I dont want RL, I want ML", if he is a gentlemen with good moral, he won't do that, how RL can live her life after that rejection, isn't he trashing RL reputation (purposely).

 

So would you rather GTY tell CB and then maybe CB decides to lie to his parents is that the better option. I think its better to keep your friend in the dark then make them betray their belief's. Also if he asked that way grandma would deny the marriage,

 

GTY would not have even thought about doing this scheme if he thought RL would be interested.

 

8 hours ago, Golden Flower said:

 

 

As i said above the plan was to test what QH would be willing to do i dont think it was serious at all and maybe QH has not directly said GTY was not suitable for ML but he 100% implied it with his actions.

 

 

8 hours ago, historicalfictionftw said:

I finally made an account! I stumbled upon this forum on pg 80 when I couldn't stand the suspense of waiting to know what is going on, especially after the boat raid episode. I'm passed the QY understanding point and moved on to the curious about GTY and if he's a good fit for ML. Both him and ML are very strategic and I'm so excited about seeing them work together. I think it would be cute to see them playing Go together as well. I'm currently in my second semester of Chinese and I realized that the language used in this drama is far more advanced than what I'm learning... nevertheless, I make sure that when I watch the raws that I cast to my TV and try to pay attention to the characters. What are the chances my character knowledge increases by the end of this show? I'm also open to recommendations of other Chinese dramas. Admittedly, I used to be k drama all the way till I decided to take Chinese...so I'm behind the curve. I look forward to stalking this forum and any spoilers/sneak peaks/raws that are shared. This has quickly become a passion of mine that I'm worried how I'll take it when the show is over. But for now, I'll live for the upcoming wedding and moments where ML shows how mighty she really is.

Side note: GTY seems very haughty in his laughing at most situations... I wonder if it's a defense mechanism.

 

Nirvana in fire 1/2 , Empresses in the palace, yanxi in the palace, 10 miles of peach blossoms are must watch Chinese drama;s.

 

8 hours ago, tomo74 said:

So, it's ok for GTY to mislead his best friend?, it's ok to scheme the family?.

About GTY knowing RL has bf it doesn't mean she can not change her mind, he is not GOD who can read people's mind.

If this thing done by QH, I dont know what people going to say.

This is why I said, some people just biased, for certain character it's ok for doing bad thing and have an excuses.

I'm not against GTY, I just want people judge each character fairly.

 

 

Who has said its ok for GTY so mislead his best friend.. just that its the better option then telling CB and maybe CB messes up the plan or would lie to his parents. 

 

If it was done by QH i would give him a round of applause for finally growing some ball's. 

 

Its really annoying me people saying they want people to be unbiased/judge people fairy when they are firmly against GTY or on QH's side in like every post..

 

1 hour ago, linhlinh111 said:

One thing I'm wondering is Why GTY had to scheme to get ML in the drama? He had to do it in the book cuz no one was on his side and ML barely knew him, but in the drama, he and ML had many interactions with each other. He was in a position where Sheng family would be happy marrying ML off to him. The only obstacle may be Grandma but if ML told her how he had helped her several time she would have accepted him. Besides, ML actually was fond of him this time. Why couldn't he just ask for ML's hand directly so that she could be proud and high. Instead everybody is thinking ML was just a replacement for Rulan. Why didn't he think that honesty and sincerity would work? He was in a very advantageous position yet he still had to use such underhanded method? And he wasn't being honest with ML either. He only told her when everything was already done. What? He didn't think that ML would accept him? It never crossed his mind that maybe it was against her will? At least he could have hinted to her what he was gonna do beforehand.

 

If he didnt scheme he could not have married ML , if he nothing then she marry's the doctor and he loses her forever . I still think Grandma deny's the marriage no matter what ML's say's. Honesty and Sincerity in Ancient China how did that work for QH? 

12 minutes ago, darkphoenix123 said:

Hualan looks so happy when Minglan & GTY walked out onto the field laughing

 

Shes the sister i like the best but we saw the least. 

[ForgottenSoulx]

32 minutes ago, linhlinh111 said:

 

I see a lot of people trying to defend him, giving him lots of excuses, but his method, albeit effective, was wrong and although it succeeded, it set a few unpleasant stones in their marriage. He could have succeeded doing it the straight way, but he chose not to. Actually this was a major part of the story when they try to resolve this issue. He never realized his fault and blaming ML until ML has to clarify it for him.

 

No he couldn't have succeeded doing it the right way no chance in hell if he thought he could then he would have done it that way , i think hes smart enough to think through all the options and this was really the only way to get her. 

 

His scheming is wrong but this is how China was back then literally everyone we seen so far nearly scheme's the people who dont scheme get walked over. 

 

Also Grandma and ML actually both sort of respected what he did because he was fighting for her.

 

 

[gleek49]

16 minutes ago, linhlinh111 said:

I have to say again that I agree with most of GTY's plan, including the Dr. He's cousin, cuz he was just saving ML from having to deal with her after marriage, but I disagree with him on 2 things:

 

1. He asked for Rulan instead of ML. Rulan was already in love with someone. If he was afraid that Daniang would not be happy with him bypassing her daughter, he could have just exposed Rulan's scandal first then ask for ML after Rulan was already betrothed. If ML didn't want to marry him then he was forcing her against her will. If ML actually liked her then she would be very sad. Although he explained later that sad period could not be undone.

 

2. He waited until everything was done to tell ML. I understand he wanted to ensure the result but sometimes a man's gotta do the right thing even if it would bring him more difficulties. He could just scheme and calculate everyone cuz they don't matter, but that doesn't include ML. You don't do such things to the one you want to marry. Imagine one day you fiance telling you: "Hey I lied to you and tricked you on this and that but it was for your own good and now I tell you the truth so don't hold a grudge?". Moreover, ML is a smart, strong independent woman, so GTY was actually risking the trust between them. If I was in ML's shoes, then yes I would be happy there's a great guy going through such length to get me. But there will always be that uneasy feeling of being manipulated and lied to.

 

1. If he expose Rulan's scandal first, and then ask for a daughter, then there's no guarantee the family will accept his proposal at all. Cause if he knows about RL before proposing, people would be very confused as to why he insisting on marry a Sheng girl, even after knowing they only have a lowly shu one left. It just makes him look suspicious. He has to push them into the situation where there's no coming back. He has to make them agree to his proposal first, make it known to the whole city that the emperor approves of their match. By pushing them into the corner, even grandma is unable to think of any way out. Sheng family literaly has no other way than to marry Rulan to the scholar and Minglan to him. He has to make it look like both him and the Shengs are on a sinking ship together, that both sides have to compromise; not him holding their neck with the Rulan's affair. Ruthless, I know, but higher chance of success.

 

2. As I said before, there's no guarantee that Minglan herself would choose him over the obvious easier choice that is Dr. He. What if she still doesn't want to marry him after he confesses to her? As you said, she's very smart, if she knows his intention, she'll be very careful not to be trap by him, she'll even counterattack his plan. Isn't that just shooting himself in the foot?

[ForgottenSoulx]

13 minutes ago, darkphoenix123 said:

Grandma & Minglan talk about the second point. Minglan was a little hesitant because of that. What if in the future he schemes against me? That’s why she was avoiding him until his confession during the polo match. It’s only when he properly proposed that she accepted 

 

I dont think she ever really thought what if he scheme's against me she knows him better then that.