[Drama 2018] Mr. Sunshine, 미스터 션샤인 - Winner of Critics’ Choice Award for Drama category

[rubie]

On 8/28/2018 at 7:36 PM, Seoulmemories said:

Sorry to add a bad news, lee Byung hun together with yoo yeo suk will not attending the celebratory dinner. Oh so sad. Aeshin fan club will not have a get together....

 

Hope they could re-schedule.. or something.. for everyone to attend but it won't be easy. 

 

August 28, 2018

 

MR.SUNSHINE September 2 Ending Party, Lee Byung Hun unable to attend

 

Source: YTN (Google-translate)

 

 

On August 28, an official of tvN's hit drama MR.SUNSHINE stated to YTN Star, "After the last scene shot, there will a special dinner to commemorate the last day of filming".

 

MR.SUNSHINE which had been broadcast up to 16 episodes since July, will end with episode 24 on the 23rd of September. As there will be remaining one month until the last airing, a special dinner is being prepared to appreciate the hardworking efforts of all the drama crew and cast.

 

However, due to their pre-scheduled activities, actors Lee Byung Hun and Yoo Yeon Seok are unable to attend the dinner. Co-stars Kim Tae Ri, Kim Min Jung and Byun Yo Han are coordinating their schedule. Kim Tae Ri's additional scenes will be finalized this week as the filming ends.

 

The actors and crew have committed almost a year to the production of MR.SUNSHINE since September 2017 hence it's difficult to gather everyone once the filming ended.

[mistymorning]

@KDramaLogic, Welcome to Soompi! 

 

I don't really like pulling another board story here - that wasn't something allowed when I was in different board - I stopped going DB after episode 14, so I cannot comment on recent comments.

 

For your points, I just want to list out some of my thoughts here.

 

1. If this story goes after 1910, Aeshin needs to go out of the country. Almost all RA in Joseon will be killed by Japan around that time. I don't think this drama will go after that, but there's no other way if it goes further. If not, that will be alternative history from then on.

But so far i don't think AS will go, her fantasy sequence with EC is just that.. fantasy of peaceful time, where they can live happily without shame or obstacles like class difference. But we'll see what KES will do.

 

2. HS, DM and EC are all affected by AS in their decisions to stay and fight for Joseon. Honestly speaking, I don't think any of the EC/DM/HS are really thinking about Joseon people or doing this for the great cause of Joseon, they are helping Joseon because of AS. Esp. DM. And that's not a bad thing, isn't it?

 

For AS, she is changing after the EC's talk on the frozen river and after the command to kill EC. She had opened her eyes thru EC's viewpoint. she started questioning her orders and made decision by herself.  Remember they said she always said Yes to any command? To me, AS's change is not just understanding low class hardships , but also personalizing/recognizing what it means to fight for her country and its people for real. and what exactly she's fighting for, which is very relevant question considering current head of RA.

 

Currently RA is just limb of king, extended thru LJM. And LJM is someone who views at things by the King ( and country, for him ). And for LJM and previously Eunsan, there's greater cause(survival of king and country, which are all the same to him) and all can be sacrificed for that. I think we'll see this clash (between greater cause and individual sacrifice) under more heightened threats from Japan in next set of episodes. I was really happy to see inkling of changes in Eunsan in last episode.

 

 

 

 

[mistergenie]

@KDramaLogic

Let me ask you - why is Hwang Eun San fighting as the leader of the Righteous Army? What Joseon is he fighting for? I don't see anyone asking him that. Even after being the leader of the RA , he bows and acquiesces to the commands of a nobleman, Lee Jeong Mun. What is Gunner Jang fighting for?  - in his own words, he wants there to be a King in Joseon (and the accompanying social structure) so that one day he might rebel against him - no mention by Gunner Jang of disabling the rigid class system of Joseon - he is only opposed to foreign forces because he deems their interference as a threat to the King. Why is no one holding Gunner Jang to account?

 

Hui Seong has done nothing till now. Nothing for Joseon. He has tentatively started a newspaper to tell stories of people who have been wronged. Will his newspaper eventually end up helping Joseon people? That is for the future to tell.

 

Kudo Hina only helps herself, only protects herself. She is legally Japanese, she is almost untouchable. The only reason she helps out LJM is that he dangles her mother's whereabouts before her as bait. She is already preparing for a helpless Joseon to be taken over - have you forgotten how she is buying properties? The woman is only looking out for herself. And I don't blame her.

 

Dong Mae - He too has done jacks*it for Joseon. He stayed in Joseon to help? No, he came back as a mercenary for hire and revels in the power that position affords him. He doesn't care two hoots about Joseon. If the King's bank certificate had fallen into his hands, he would have given it to Minister Hayashi and collected his reward. Do you remember Lee Wan Ik talking about the bank certificate with Dong Mae? If Dong Mae was truly looking out for Joseon, he would have walked away immediately but he only ever got angry because Lee Wan Ik insulted is butcher status. What else ha Dong Mae done for Joseon? Given candy to a poor boy? The only reason he went to Go Sa Hong is that he is Ae Shin's grandfather - so his motives and moves are purely selfish and not done for the sake of Joseon.

 

Let's talk about Eugene. In his own words: "I don't care about Joseon. I don't care about who rules over Joseon."' His only worry is that the people he cares about live long - The Potter and Go Ae Shin - nothing else. He returned the bank certificate in such a way that his revenge could be accomplished and he later tells Ae Shin that he did it for her.

 

Finally we come to Ae Shin - Yes, she had a very romanticized idea about the fight she has been fighting but her delusion has been broken by Eugene. In the grand scheme of things, Ae Shin's role in the fight of Joseon is like that  of a mouse. She scurries and attacks and scurries back to her cover. Gunner Jang only ever uses her as a weapon to wield - he feeds her information on a need to know basis. He even asks her not to ask too many questions. Ae Shin is as flawed as the next human being - the little she does for the RA, she considers it to be a big contribution -she takes pride in her work (nothing wrong about it)and thinks of herself as a flame (a bit naive) . But i think she has now realized that she is no Joan of the Arc. She wants both things in her life  - fight for Joseon, fight for her love and the freedom to live life on her terms - there is no shame in going away from Joseon so that she could build a life with Eugene and try to carry on the fight from outside.

 

 

[Seoulmemories]

@KDramaLogic I like what you wrote mostly but I think I don't blame AS for not seeing the plight of the lower class.

 

As a noblelady, although she goes for physical training, she must have led a very sheltered life. Since I assume in her household, her slaves must have been kindly and fairly treated, she probably thought everyone does the same thing with their slaves. She probably grew up with a tunnel vision of slaves Are slaves and that's the way society is structured, so she couldn't accept at first that EC was actually a slave by background.

 

Her world is fairly black n white, that's why like what you said she can't see DM beyond his facade. 

 

But I don't blame her, a person is a product of their upbringing, hopefully now that she is older and going out more, she grows to see other perspectives in life.

 

......

 

 

 

[miracle23]

@kansas424 I think I remember seeing a similar claim about DB being a cancerous site at the comment section. Honestly, if I were to be such commenter, I would claim similarly with Soompi as I have seen and read quite a number of fanatic postings and bashings but thanks and kudos to the mods controlling them before things get really out of hand. Having said that, I am not going to put myself on the same pedestal by making such claim. I refuse to judge people and their preferences. I would rather having the space to discuss why a certain character is flawed in my opinion and why others are more compelling instead of simply accusing the commenters for having views that are evidently in contrast than mine. It is their rights to feel what they feel for any characters or plots. We really should not go to that route. Such attack itself is worst than being cancerous. It just shows how ones can't accept differences in preferences/opinions.  Not everyone can relate with what AS is as of 16 ep than what AS was in the beginning. Many of the commenters are actually rooting for AS as a character from the beginning but until recent eps, some has indicated their frustrations from their observations. And I am among them. And I am also one that root for the supporting roles, DM included. Hence, I will not be backed down by comments like fangirls or cancerous s***. Please have some respect when writing here. I believe all of us here are grown ups. Soompi is not that much different in purpose than DB since it provides space for kdrama fans to mingle and enjoy sharing their likes and dislikes of kdrama. Let's keep it peaceful in both places. I personally find beanies are a funny bunch where I envy, in a positive way, their articulate and creative minds. It makes reading their comments so enjoyable despite we are not sharing views on some points.

 

 @KDramaLogic welcome my dear and thank you for such a good written constructive discussion. You have explained really well on behalf of the majority of beanies frequenting Mr. Sunshine recap section. We discuss thoughts and not who likes what. I hope people understand this. Keep on writing, I look forward to read your views.

 

@rubie please don't be influenced by anything to not post link for the recap of DB here. I usually read your highlights first before going to DB which means Soompi is where I park my car. Those who do not want to go there is really up to them but I really appreciate your effort putting up alert for us. So, please keep it up. 

 

Last but not least, I have said it before and I will say it again, do not point fingers to the fans, DMNation, HSNation, ASnation, HNNation or ECNation notwithstanding. Agree to disagree. Respect.

 

Cheers!

[rubie]

Ok.. time to cool down .. but everyone's thoughts are really good to read.. H is for Hug..

 

Now for something we all love to hate.. or hate to love.. the PPLs.. they've been pretty quiet lately. Are we in  a 'no PPL zone'.. like, finally?  Nope nope nope.. not even a dream sequence can keep them away. 

 

Source: Nara Home Deco

 

 

Also.. isn't that Subway PPL in the picnic basket? 

 

[mistergenie]

One thing I find really funny and makes me scoff is that people are blaming Ae Shin for not doing anything mission related in recent episodes - hello people with short term memory loss! She stole from Wan Ik's house the reports that interpreters have been sending him - the very reports that Lee Jeong Mun is currently studying in detail to weed out the Wan Ik loyalists and traitors in the King's court. You want to see her hop and jump rooftops in every episode? Shoot her gun every alternate episode?  That is just wishful thinking on the part of the fans. Why would you belittle her achievement by ignoring nay even trivializing her action of  getting the reports? What more are you expecting from her? It's not like she is in any position to plan solo ops - all she does is follow orders like a faithful soldier - her missions are few and far because Gunner Jang is mostly about protecting her than putting her in more danger.

 

Sneak into a house, steal reports and end up helping weed out traitors - how's that for helping Joseon, huh? A million times better than all the supposedly altruistic male leads that are fighting in their own ways(whatever that may mean) to help Joseon.

 

So quick to pass judgment on Ae Shin but all the leeway for the male leads? Going so far as to attribute motivations/altruistic reasons for the actions of the male leads when the canon is showing that all of them have been thoroughly selfish - and I am not passing judgement on the male characters - I get that they too are flawed people doing what little in their capacity to help individuals they care about.

 

@rubie My mind didn't go to subway - I was only thinking of two things - was that a hamburger bun in the picnic basket - the one that Eugene was  telling Ae Shin about during their beach date; the second thing which captured my full attention was Ae Shin's laughter - she looked so beautiful in that moment that it was breathtaking.

[rubie]

22 minutes ago, mistergenie said:

 

@rubie My mind didn't go to subway - I was only thinking of two things - was that a hamburger bun in the picnic basket - the one that Eugene was  telling Ae Shin about during their beach date; the second thing which captured my full attention was Ae Shin's laughter - she looked so beautiful in that moment that it was breathtaking.

 

To be honest, I'm not sure.. it could be because so far, they've been meticulous to include as much details as possible (from what's been mentioned in earlier episodes).. even stuff we thought would be forgotten.. like the baby blanket, the tragic ornament, hair pin etc.

 

Ae Shin's laughter on the boat while they were fishing was just heartwarming to see. She was even blushing there and then when Eugene teased her.

 

I always feel she's a bit 'tomboyish' in Joseon (obviously to pass as a male), but even when wearing hanboks. However, in the imagination (western) scenes, she's behaving more like a lady.

[charray]

 

Some fave scenes in episode 15 and 16:

 

1) The confrontation between potter Eun San and Eugene which led Eun Dan to reassess his position and not to just take order from LJM.

 

2) The hug scene between Eugene and Ae Shin where he said that he does not belong anywhere and she replied that he is with her. And how he hesitated before taking her hand and pulling her into a tight embrace.

 

3) The funeral scene where Eugene bid farewell to Joseph. LBH acting is on point here.

 

4) The scene where Ae Shin asked the temple medium to light a candle for Joseph who would be buried that day. Ae Shin is hesitant as the person believed in God. The reply from the medium “The dieties must know each other very well. I am sure Buddha will show him the way to God”. These lines particularly touched me. I guess many of us must have wondered how do we pray for someone of a different religion or belief from ourselves.

 

4) The scene where Dong Mae and Hina silently acknowledged and reassured each other from afar without a word  being spoken, all the while he was hugged by Hotaru. I feel that Dong Mae and Hina had a great understanding of each other like soulmates. Hope they can find their way to each other and not waste their time to keep pinning for the wrong persons who did not as much glance at them.

 

5) The goodbye scene of Ae Shin and Eugene where he held her foot to put on her shoe for her. (I personally feel that this is an intimate gesture akin to a kiss. Not sure about Joseon but in olden days in China, a woman’s feet should be seen only by her husband so touching a woman’s foot is kinda of an act of intimacy.)

 

6) How Ae Shin stood firm with her Grandfather on annuling her engagement. But when her Grandfather found out that the man that she loved is Eugene, she gave in and agreed to his condition to remain single all her life and not see Eugene again to protect Eugene from being hurt. 

 

7) The scene where Eugene met Ae Shin and the palace maids in the palace grounds and Eugene’s monologue which appeared to be directed at the palace maid but meant for Ae Shin. 

 

I recalled that Kim Tae Ri had mentioned in her character introduction interview that it is a story of personal growth for her character. I agree with the views expressed in earlier posts above that there had been change and growth for her character but perhaps these are not as dramatic or fast or as great a leap as some viewers would have preferred like how it had been for the male characters like Eugene, Dong Mae and Hui Seong. For me, I am happy to take on this long and slow journey of change and growth with her.

[KDramaLogic]

3 hours ago, rubie said:

 

@KDramaLogic welcome to the drama thread.. you brought a thought-provoking gift. Fans of MR.SUNSHINE really shining bright!

 

Sorry to cut your post in two and not necessarily in order!  Thank you for welcoming me, and, yes, fans of Mr. Sunshine keep on shining!!!! 

 

 

3 hours ago, rubie said:

Regarding DB, I was contemplating whether to continue highlighting the recaps here. But I'm hoping to be as open as possible and remembering that it used to be a great blog from a long time ago. It may not be the same impartial site but a recap by DB is quite a privilege of sorts for MR.SUNSHINE. Imaginable it's quite the task to recap an entire episode twice a week and another task to read through the replies but there are still good positive comments to read. Having been through SLS before, I understand the feeling watching a drama not to our preferences and the frustration of not enjoying it fully as we tend to see what we want to see. It's either we swallow or spit out the bitter aftertaste. It sucks having such a drama within a drama.. maybe that was what the writer intended all along. Strong reaction means it's shaping to be a drama well-written.. hopefully.

 

Perhaps, there's no need to highlight the DB recap here anymore. I think we all know it'll be posted soon after the weekend airing of the episodes. With just 8 more episodes to go.. like the kicka$$ ladies of Joseon and the 3 fanboys, along with the ever-growing RA community ready to defend the nation, let's do the same. 

 

Regarding the elusive "K".. the famously-overlooked alphabet throughout Ae Shin's lessons. Both LBH and KTR are movie actors, who definitely are as professional as can be in their daring roles.. but MR.SUNSHINE is set in a period modest setting.. some 100+ years ago. Maybe a peck of a kiss is all that we'll get but who knows what KES is thinking in EuShin's minds. I thought the longing, gazing and embrace have been well acted out by the star-crossed lovers. But we wouldn't complain if the letter K comes along.. eventually.

 

I hope no one will be too upset.. except to the misleading previews. Please consider this as ramblings of an old school fan-girl. 

 

 

For this drama, Dramabeans usually posts recaps for odd-number episodes on Mondays, and even-number episodes on Tuesdays.  So, perhaps the DB recap may not need to be highlighted here anymore.  It's just that there may be some Soompiers who may appreciate getting redirected from this thread to the Dramabeans episode recap.  Personally, I could just directly go to Dramabeans (and Soompi) rather than rely on redirected links.  But, I cannot speak for others.  So, again, I enjoy reading your posts and appreciate your efforts in highlighting the Dramabeans recaps 

 

Admittedly, ever since Dramabeans changed its website format sometime this year, the recaps, posts, etc. have become less impartial on certain Tv dramas, movies, etc. that they choose.  Noticeably, the main Dramabeans creators including javabeans have more-or-less ceased in recapping dramas, as well as posting News Bites and other features.  If anyone wanted to check on Dramabeans any dramas or news that are not officially posted by Dramabeans users, then they'd have to check the Fan Post page, which, while somewhat informational, is rather disorganized and, of course, less impartial.

 

As for the SLS and "drama within a drama within a drama...", I'd say that phenomenon is not limited to KES dramas or any other Korean dramas/movies only; it's found anywhere in any country (i.e., Gossip Girl- the whole Blair/Chuck vs. Blair/Dan debacle was pretty rabid during the later seasons on the official CW threads/blogs, YouTube, and other (fan)sites ).  So, yes, this could take away some (but hopefully not all) the fun of watching the drama/movie/etc., especially if you are looking for neutral recaps, feedback and/or comments on the said work that would either align, differ, or even challenge your earlier thoughts.

 

Having said that, I think KES envisioned a very poignant, beautiful, and immersive storyline that highlights both the historical context of Joseon in the face of the (unfortunately inevitable) Japanese annexation and the plight of the people/characters whose loyalty (or lack thereof) to their mother country is tested in different ways during that period.  So, for me, the whole AS/EC vs. AS/DM vs. AS/HS vs. EC/DM/HS dynamics is somewhat secondary- but, to some extent, still essential- to the overall big picture of how and why these characters will work together towards fighting for Joseon and their people before (and hopefully during and after) the Japanese colonization rule.  If anything, these encounters/dynamics have compelled these four characters (and HN and other characters) to reassess their own and each other's personal backgrounds, losses, and stance for the future of Joseon- something I hope that KES focuses more on toward the later episodes rather than the whole "Will ___ end up with ____?" trope.

 

Somewhere down the road, K will arrive- and not that "kiss-on-the-cheek", which, in AS' (and KES') defense, occurred only in her imagination.  There is that saying: sometimes, the real thing is better than what you imagine. 

 

2 hours ago, aurelionsol said:

@KDramaLogic peacful opinion

 

Aeshin grow up (she change very much from 1st episode, especially recently in connection with RA and her relationship with EC). 

She will not change her rebellious character and certain habits so quickly and she needs more time. She already noticed that Eugene's decisions are thoughtful and calm and many other things but she fight for her man right now. Even DM works for her and I think Lord Go will discover and understand that she protects the family more than he does. Maybe even give her leadership because he getting old and not keeping up with the changes. Eugene become new leader RA when potter resign (many mistakes even though I like him in general). It is time for young people to defend their homeland and people they love.

 

First of all, thanks!  I also appreciate peaceful and relatively objective opinions (for we are humans with embedded bias even though we like to tell ourselves otherwise...).

 

I apologize if I sounded rather harsh and judgmental on AS' recent actions and thought-process in the more recent episodes.  It is true that AS is growing up and reevaluating her position both as a Joseon noblewoman and a (potentially more prominent) independence fighter alongside the RA, thanks to her encounters with EC, DM, HS, HN, Seung-gu, her grandfather and others.  I also hope that others, particularly her grandfather, will acknowledge AS's cause for protecting Joseon from Japan as means of protecting those whom she love, and that they would help her evolve and share a similar cause in fighting for Joseon.  Last but not least, I don't want AS to give up her rebellious streak; after all, that's what EC, DM, HS, and we the audience love about her! 

 

Till then, I hope that AS's thoughts focus somewhat less (for the sake of the plot and historical context of the drama) on protecting her love for EC (we know that, given AS' passionate, rebellious nature, she will let nothing stand in the way of her love for EC ) and more on understanding the current plight of the Joseon people of all backgrounds so that she could work with others not only to fight off the Japanese rule (which, unfortunately, will prevail in the next 30-40 years) but also establish a more egalitarian Joseon that champions the rights of all its citizens regardless of their social status.

 

2 hours ago, kansas424 said:

Appreciate the effort, but you should really take a look at the comment section to really understand why they hate on AeShin. 

I disagree about the lack of character evolution of AS that you were talking about. Regarding her RA involvement, you only need to watch EP 15 to observe her growth. The conversation between AS and Eun San, whereby she claimed she knew EC would never harm the RA and especially the potter. And even giving up the chance to take revenge on the man responsible for the death of her parent, to resolve the whole RA vs EC and Joseph's death saga. 

Watch the whole conversation between AS and her grandpa. How she refused to safeguard her own future by getting married. And when grandpa ask for Eugene, she stopped him from doing so knowing EC will get hurt by his grandpa with regard to his slave origin. Wow, a female character taking initiative to protect her love one? This is unlike any past korean drama, whereby woman has always been portrayed as weak and requires protection from their man.

She's readied to live her life alone than betraying her love for EC. 

Lots of review on AeShin has been written in weibo and heaped with praises. Which is why it shocked the hell out of me when AeShin was hated, like literally the only place you can find such comment, which happens to be the hideout of Dong Mae nation aka Dramabean. 

 

First, I appreciate your honest assessment on both my post and the Dramabeans recaps/comments.  Also, thanks for pointing out that one scene where AS decides to give up her quest of seeking revenge on the person who murdered her parents (Wan Ik, obviously); I did not catch that right away upon recalling. 

 

Since I cannot read in Korean or Chinese, I wouldn't trust the (relatively inaccurate) Google Translate in translating whatever Naver (Korean), Weibo (Chinese), and other non-English website posts related to Mr. Sunshine.  Dramabeans (and Soompi) are the closest English websites on Korean dramas/movies/etc. that I could rely on for updated information, recaps, and/or comments.  As I mentioned to rubie (again, I'm new to posting Soompi comments, so I'm not sure how to link Soompi users in reply posts other than quoting/cutting their posts), I concur the new Dramabeans recaps, comments, and fan posts have become increasingly more opinionated to the point that not a lot of the shows I watch are being recapped (due to Dramabeans users' personal schedule, interests in the drama, etc.).  Still, Dramabeans is one of the few English websites I know that is recapping this drama.  If there are any other English websites that offer K-drama/movie/etc. recaps, including Mr. Sunshine, please let me know.  I'd appreciate it!

 

In addition, as mentioned in my earlier post, I already concurred that the Dramabeans recaps of earlier episodes contained substantial number of comments incessantly "hating" on AS for snubbing the "more attractive, age-appropriate, brooding" DM.  And, btw, I will not speak on behalf of those commenting with that sort of mentality; for I also posted that AS and DM, so far, have not established any substantial understanding of each other that's worth shipping; if anything, even AS and HS have a better understanding of each other's predicament (and that's not saying much).  But, as far as I could see in at least the Ep 15 recap/comment section, I've seen mostly posts that, if directed negatively towards AS, are calling out AS' clinging to the romantic notion of fighting for Joseon, lack of further insight on the everyday plight of Joseon people from non-noble classes, and relatively lack of participation in RA movements compared to EC, HS, and even DM.  Then again, I just read the recap earlier this morning (which had only 25-30 comments), so maybe more of those "DM fanfirls hate AS just because she snubs DM" comments will show up later today. 

 

Again, as I mentioned to aurelionsol (again, don't know how to link the profile here), I apologize if I came off rather critical of AS's actions in the recent episodes, particularly in regards to her stance on Joseon independence. I am glad that AS called out Eun San's BS in foolishly labeling EC as a traitor to the RA (seriously, Eun San, you of all people!?) and fought for her love for EC despite her grandfather's rejection due to EC's prior slave background and occupation as an American soldier.  Still, most of AS' scenes since EC's postulating of "Will your Joseon include butchers, slaves, etc.?" have focused more on her exploring and defending her relationship with EC (which I commend KES for developing in a plausible manner amidst the historical period) yet less on her contemplating the prospects of the RA and Joseon people amidst the impending Japanese colonization of Joseon Korea.  It's almost as though AS views Joseon as some afterthought or ideology rather than a nation with people of all backgrounds whose lives are at stakes and whose voices need to be heard.  It's even more apparent when EC, while contemplating his love for AS and trying to make peace with his futile revenge(?) against HS' family for his parents' death, is shown taking more proactive steps toward defending Joseon (i.e., assuming the position as Joseon Royal Guard) even though he, as an American soldier and former Joseon slave, can walk away from Joseon any time.

 

Then again, there are 8 episodes remaining (assuming that KES sticks with the 24-episode format); so hopefully AS will have more scenes of evolving in her stance and proactively fighting alongside EC, the RA, and others for Joseon independence.  We all know that AS' rebellious streak will forbid anyone from undermining her relationship with EC; now she should channel that rebellion into reaffirming her fight for the Joseon nation and its people.

 

As always, if I missed any characterization or plot point, please let me know!  Whew, long post again...sorry! 

Edited August 28, 2018 by KDramaLogic

[kansas424]

45 minutes ago, miracle23 said:

@kansas424 I think I remember seeing a similar claim about DB being a cancerous site at the comment section. Honestly, if I were to be such commenter, I would claim similarly with Soompi as I have seen and read quite a number of fanatic postings and bashings but thanks and kudos to the mods controlling them before things get really out of hand. Having said that, I am not going to put myself on the same pedestal by making such claim. I refuse to judge people and their preferences. I would rather having the space to discuss why a certain character is flawed in my opinion and why others are more compelling instead of simply accusing the commenters for having views that are evidently in contrast than mine. It is their rights to feel what they feel for any characters or plots. We really should not go to that route. Such attack itself is worst than being cancerous. It just shows how ones can't accept differences in preferences/opinions.  Not everyone can relate with what AS is as of 16 ep than what AS was in the beginning. Many of the commenters are actually rooting for AS as a character from the beginning but until recent eps, some has indicated their frustrations from their observations. And I am among them. And I am also one that root for the supporting roles, DM included. Hence, I will not be backed down by comments like fangirls or cancerous s***. Please have some respect when writing here. I believe all of us here are grown ups. Soompi is not that much different in purpose than DB since it provides space for kdrama fans to mingle and enjoy sharing their likes and dislikes of kdrama. Let's keep it peaceful in both places. I personally find beanies are a funny bunch where I envy, in a positive way, their articulate and creative minds. It makes reading their comments so enjoyable despite we are not sharing views on some points.

 

 

I would like to hear your thoughts on the defensive remarks made against the AS hating reasoning, rather than trying to pull Soompi down to the level of DB. Because, you really didn't respond to any of them directly. If you want to talk about lack of development for character, DM should spearhead that list.  HS has decided to kick start his very own newspaper business in exposing the truths, EC has taken up the role of royal army trainer, AS has been summoned to royal palace, most probably will be appointed as teacher for the princess and prince. 

DM? Nothing much going on there since day 1. Flirting around girls, piggyback 1 of them, and hugged another, acting all cool and that. Yea, he's been caught and tortured, but which characters in Mr. Sunshine hasn't been tortured either mentally or physically by losing someone precious, got shot etc ? .Hopefully the next EP, we'll get to know more from the gunshot incident, how it gonna change this character's view of things. 

No hard feeling, just trying to initiate discussion that comes in both way instead of 1.

[mistymorning]

@rubie, there's review post from @dcinside I found wonderful about Eushin fishing scene. 

from dcinside, translation by me, let me know this is not allowed.

 

The speed of Eugene-Aeshin's love thru their fishing scene.

 

As soon as the nibbling started, Aeshin grabbed her boyfriend's fishing pole to catch it herself

Eugene was being powerlessly swayed by Aeshin, just saying "wait wait"

 

Just looking at this scene reminds me...

As soon as she saw the good fish Eugene(the hogu/pushover) , she asked him to do love together without hesitation

Hugged him in no time, asked him to go to seashore together,

with his hat on, asked him whether she's pretty, that date master Aeshin

 

That overlapped with Eugene, 

who didn't know to hug his girlfriend back 

couldn't even wipe her tears, just holding his hat, that Choi family Wait Jin(* this is one of the numerous nick name in dcinside internal humors)

 

But, this Choi family Wait Jin turned out as a real fishing master,

Aeshin may think that she caught Eugene, but

Without her really knowing, it's Choi family Wait Jin who actually caught her and holding on.

 

Started love, tempting noble woman who's more interested in shooting than marriage

Made her bet her everything by devoting himself during the relationship

Made her his home, after being a stranger always

Made her wanted to show him to her grandpa, when she just originally planned to cancel her engagement only (* this review is before episode 16 ).

In the preview, there's even a line hinting she may leave Joseon with Eugene

 

If you look at the picture, the fish basket in the reflection actually has Aeshin in it!!

 

So these all means that, 

 

This is all big picture from Choi family Wait Jin who crushed all bowls(dcinside names for board readers) predictions by being slow, enduring and waiting.

 

And in the end

fishing

was also suggested from Choi Fishing Jin

 

Well done by someone who 's close with a boat!

 

 

[miracle23]

@kansas424, you are new here, right? You may want to backtrack a bit. I have mentioned I won't be commenting much in Soompi. Nevertheless, thank you for the invitation. I believe in regard to AS's character development,  I echoed @KDramaLogic. I  have also written quite lengthy about it in DB. Feel free to drop by.

 

I am seeing it differently from many here as you can see from my earlier posts and that is how my mind works. I don't let my love for an actor or actress clouded my judgement in analysing characters and plots though it won't stop me from enjoying the beauty feast as well. I criticised DM before and I will do it again to him and any characters when I just can't relate.

 

I don't see Soompi any different than DB. So I will assume claim of pulling down any site than the other, a non existent. Please understand as I am understanding why people can't relate to other characters than AS or EC. Because we see and analyse things differently. You may analyse e.g. DM on one perspective. I analysed him by others. I have written lengthy before. My views stand that I find HN, HS, Hotaru and DM are more compelling to date. I came to Mr. Sunshine not for the main love story but for the RA, hence it should give you some idea where my stance is. It does not change since then. You may also deem them as a matter of preference in addition to different way of how I am viewing this drama. Cheers!

[KDramaLogic]

2 hours ago, Seoulmemories said:

@KDramaLogic I like what you wrote mostly but I think I don't blame AS for not seeing the plight of the lower class.

 

As a noblelady, although she goes for physical training, she must have led a very sheltered life. Since I assume in her household, her slaves must have been kindly and fairly treated, she probably thought everyone does the same thing with their slaves. She probably grew up with a tunnel vision of slaves Are slaves and that's the way society is structured, so she couldn't accept at first that EC was actually a slave by background.

 

Her world is fairly black n white, that's why like what you said she can't see DM beyond his facade. 

 

But I don't blame her, a person is a product of their upbringing, hopefully now that she is older and going out more, she grows to see other perspectives in life.

 

......

 

 

 

 

Thanks for your feedback on AS' character growth- something which, I admit, I'll need to step back and remember how far she has gotten along since the beginning.  Despite her grandfather's outward chastisements, he did treat his family, servants, slaves and other members of the household fairly well (even more so, compared to HS' family)- hence, AS' cluelessness over the actual systematic prejudice/discrimination/mistreatment of EC, DM, Seung-gu, and other Joseon people who are not from the noble class.  Not to mention that this drama has at least 5 major characters- AS, EC, DM, HS, HN- all of whom KES, so far, has brought more depth and characterization than I'd normally find in several K-dramas.  So, it'll take a while for each character's full potential to be realized, particularly, in this case, regarding their stance in Joseon.  Since we have 8 remaining episodes, I'll sit back and trust that AS will evolve past her noble upbringing, take up her parents' stead in the RA,  fight alongside EC and others against the Japanese oppression of Joseon Korea, and (hopefully) find ways toward establishing and protecting the rights of all Joseon people of all backgrounds.

 

2 hours ago, miracle23 said:

@kansas424 I think I remember seeing a similar claim about DB being a cancerous site at the comment section. Honestly, if I were to be such commenter, I would claim similarly with Soompi as I have seen and read quite a number of fanatic postings and bashings but thanks and kudos to the mods controlling them before things get really out of hand. Having said that, I am not going to put myself on the same pedestal by making such claim. I refuse to judge people and their preferences. I would rather having the space to discuss why a certain character is flawed in my opinion and why others are more compelling instead of simply accusing the commenters for having views that are evidently in contrast than mine. It is their rights to feel what they feel for any characters or plots. We really should not go to that route. Such attack itself is worst than being cancerous. It just shows how ones can't accept differences in preferences/opinions.  Not everyone can relate with what AS is as of 16 ep than what AS was in the beginning. Many of the commenters are actually rooting for AS as a character from the beginning but until recent eps, some has indicated their frustrations from their observations. And I am among them. And I am also one that root for the supporting roles, DM included. Hence, I will not be backed down by comments like fangirls or cancerous s***. Please have some respect when writing here. I believe all of us here are grown ups. Soompi is not that much different in purpose than DB since it provides space for kdrama fans to mingle and enjoy sharing their likes and dislikes of kdrama. Let's keep it peaceful in both places. I personally find beanies are a funny bunch where I envy, in a positive way, their articulate and creative minds. It makes reading their comments so enjoyable despite we are not sharing views on some points.

 

 @KDramaLogic welcome my dear and thank you for such a good written constructive discussion. You have explained really well on behalf of the majority of beanies frequenting Mr. Sunshine recap section. We discuss thoughts and not who likes what. I hope people understand this. Keep on writing, I look forward to read your views.

 

 

Sorry to cut your post!   Thanks for welcoming me as well, and I'm flattered to hear from you that I am speaking on behalf of the majority of the beanies there too!  While I concede that Dramabeans, Soompi, and other K-drama websites will have some extreme biased comments (because we're human), I was offended to hear on this thread that Dramabeans is a "cancerous" place for "DM fangirls" to "hate" on AS just because AS/DM won't happen.  As far as I saw on the Ep. 15 recap, the majority of comments posting negatively about AS are frustrated about AS' relative lack of character growth/cause for fighting for Joseon compared to EC, DM, HS, and other characters whose actions are further moving the plot than AS'- even some of those who are trying to support AS/EC relationship.  I believe a majority of both Soompiers and beanies gather round to understand and enjoy the characterizations, dynamics, and storyline/context of any K-drama we're watching- something which KES definitely delivers here!

 

I agree with you that both Dramabeans and Soompi provide platforms for K-drama fans to share their likes, dislikes, expectations, etc. of K-dramas they watch.  Some may be insightful, short, or otherwise.  I also appreciate different insights without outright accusations; for, as far as we're concerned, there may be some plot points or characterizations we've missed upon first, second, or other viewing of the same drama/episode until another comment addresses this.  For instance, I missed out the part where AS decided to give up on her revenge quest regarding her parents' senseless murder (in the hands of Wan-Ik) and told off Eun San for assuming EC would act against the RA until kansas424 (again, sorry, don't know how to post the profile link on the posts) responded to my first post.

 

So, thanks, and let's wait out the next 4-5 days until Ep. 17 of Mr. Sunshine! 

Edited August 28, 2018 by KDramaLogic

[rubie]

Have to say that I'm in complete awe at members who write with such precise and thoughtful accuracy, no matter which side you're on! *Salute!* I'd always every so often stop halfway to check the words I'm using will not mean something else (LOL) and in the process, forgets what I'm suppose to write after that. Hah! 

 

@KDramaLogic to answer your query.. to reply to a specific member without quoting his or her comment, all you have to do is to type '@' followed by the name correctly-spelled (no spaces) which prompts a list of similar usernames to appear. When you see the person you wish to reply to, click on that and it'll appear in reversed bold and they will get a notification which I'm sure you have received a few by now. 

 

@mistymorning thanks so much for the DC Gall sharing, I totally get the fishing review.  So funny and very creative indeed! The Korean version of Soompi forum must be bustling non-stop with so much sharing and tidbits of MR.SUNSHINE. If only we could read and understand Korean but .. I think as of now, every forum regardless of languages have their own way of actively sharing the drama.. English, Chinese, Japanese, Thai, Indonesian, Arabic and many more on twitter especially. Nonetheless, it'll be awesome to know what the Korean fans think of the drama.

 

We are of course such fiery fans of MR.SUNSHINE but unlike the scorching heat.. let's all keep our cool, ok. This is such a special thread because we are here. 

 

Art by nonomiho_illustration

 

[charray]

17 minutes ago, kansas424 said:

HS has decided to kick start his very own newspaper business in exposing the truths, EC has taken up the role of royal army trainer, 

DM? Nothing much going on there since day 1. 

 

Dong Mae did help to uncover the plot to intercept the secret letters sent by Ae Shin’s Grandfather to all the scholars and informed Ae Shin’s Grandfather of this. He also killed the lackey of Hiyashi. 

 

Just for discussion purposes, the way I see it, the above actions of Dong Mae are driven or motivated by his desire to protect Ae Shin and her family as well as for his personal revenge. He is not driven by any grand or noble cause of saving Joseon or making Joseon a better place for people of all walks of life. Same can also be said of Eugene. That their actions happened to have the effect of helping Joseon’s cause is besides the point. 

 

Not sure if we are realistic here in making this big ask of Ae Shin to bear the burden of saving Joseon and making Joseon a better place for people of all walks of life to live in by herself? Based on what I googled, the roles and rights of women were reduced in Joseon compared to previous eras in Korean history. Yangban women had it worse as they were completely hidden from the outer world and every woman had to conform to Confucian ideals of purity, obedience, chastity and faithfulness. Women were subjects of male dominance throughout their lives, obliged to listen to their fathers, husbands, fathers-in-law and firstborn sons. Homes were divided into male and female quarters to separate the sexes. 

 

So far, her role in the Righteous Army is a sniper who take on the odd mission here and there at the order of Gunner Jang. Unlike Grandfather who can command and galvanise scholars and commoners to his cause.  Ae Shin has not reached the level yet to galvanise and command anyone except her fanboys and right hand and left hand men. Not sure what we can expect her to do?

[aurelionsol]

 

Aeshin, Eugene and a few other characters are just a few interesting people in this period and are unable to stop Japanese domination in the region. The question is whether they will fight until the end and they will die buried in nameless graves or maybe they will fight until they realize that they have the right to live (after many terrifying experiences - war) and decide survive and they will choose different places (Japan, Joseon, America, China, Europe). 

 

Some soompiers do not notice that someone may want to live

[mistymorning]

2 hours ago, charray said:

Not sure if we are realistic here in making this big ask of Ae Shin to bear the burden of saving Joseon and making Joseon a better place for people of all walks of life to live in by herself? Based on what I googled, the roles and rights of women were reduced in Joseon compared to previous eras in Korean history. Yangban women had it worse as they were completely hidden from the outer world and every woman had to conform to Confucian ideals of purity, obedience, chastity and faithfulness. Women were subjects of male dominance throughout their lives, obliged to listen to their fathers, husbands, fathers-in-law and firstborn sons. Homes were divided into male and female quarters to separate the sexes. 

 

So far, her role in the Righteous Army is a sniper who take on the odd mission here and there at the order of Gunner Jang. Unlike Grandfather who can command and galvanise scholars and commoners to his cause.  Ae Shin has not reached the level yet to galvanise and command anyone except her fanboys and right hand and left hand men. Not sure what we can expect her to do?

This.

 

Even if AS just fight for Joseon's freedom, it'll take her whole life. Liberation happened on 1945, so she will be 73? Realistically, she probably will not see liberation in her life. Also, I don't think outside world was that free either. Remember this is 100 years ago.

 

For social advancement, the thing is, trying to get her love of life who was a nobi(slave) against her granpa's wish is a gigantic step forward. It's still not long after Gabo reform. Before reform, if Eugene wasn't an american marine captain he'll get killed and/or along with her. Or he can get accused of raping her( to save her reputation) and then killed. She could be asked for suicide due to ill reputation she will bring to her family. In that sense, the declaration of love between AS and EC is a huge deal. And grandpa Go is being really, really nice actually. So you could say AS is doing big favor for social cause thru her personal life too.

 

Finally, I feel sometimes that some of those people who wants to make AS to look at lower class hardship, is actually wants AS to look at DM's hardship and understand him. Thus have more stories developed between them. We don't know whether KES will write about this or not, but let's not trivialize AS because we didn't get what we wanted.

[KDramaLogic]

2 hours ago, rubie said:

Have to say that I'm in complete awe at members who write with such precise and thoughtful accuracy, no matter which side you're on! *Salute!* I'd always every so often stop halfway to check the words I'm using will not mean something else (LOL) and in the process, forgets what I'm suppose to write after that. Hah! 

@KDramaLogic to answer your query.. to reply to a specific member without quoting his or her comment, all you have to do is to type '@' followed by the name correctly-spelled (no spaces) which prompts a list of similar usernames to appear. When you see the person you wish to reply to, click on that and it'll appear in reversed bold and they will get a notification which I'm sure you have received a few by now. 

 

 

Sorry to cut/paste your post into two parts: one above, and one below. 

 

In response to the first part above, thanks for the info on how to reply to or refer to a specific Soompi user without quoting.  I'll make sure to do so from now on.  Likewise, I always have to step back and check if I'm using the words and/or phrases to emphasize my original point without inadvertently losing my train of thought. 

 

2 hours ago, rubie said:

 

@mistymorning thanks so much for the DC Gall sharing, I totally get the fishing review.  So funny and very creative indeed! The Korean version of Soompi forum must be bustling non-stop with so much sharing and tidbits of MR.SUNSHINE. If only we could read and understand Korean but .. I think as of now, every forum regardless of languages have their own way of actively sharing the drama.. English, Chinese, Japanese, Thai, Indonesian, Arabic and many more on twitter especially. Nonetheless, it'll be awesome to know what the Korean fans think of the drama.

 

We are of course such fiery fans of MR.SUNSHINE but unlike the scorching heat.. let's all keep our cool, ok. This is such a special thread because we are here. 

 

 

 

 

2 hours ago, miracle23 said:

@kansas424, you are new here, right? You may want to backtrack a bit. I have mentioned I won't be commenting much in Soompi. Nevertheless, thank you for the invitation. I believe in regard to AS's character development,  I echoed @KDramaLogic. I  have also written quite lengthy about it in DB. Feel free to drop by.

 

I am seeing it differently from many here as you can see from my earlier posts and that is how my mind works. I don't let my love for an actor or actress clouded my judgement in analysing characters and plots though it won't stop me from enjoying the beauty feast as well. I criticised DM before and I will do it again to him and any characters when I just can't relate.

 

I don't see Soompi any different than DB. So I will assume claim of pulling down any site than the other, a non existent. Please understand as I am understanding why people can't relate to other characters than AS or EC. Because we see and analyse things differently. You may analyse e.g. DM on one perspective. I analysed him by others. I have written lengthy before. My views stand that I find HN, HS, Hotaru and DM are more compelling to date. I came to Mr. Sunshine not for the main love story but for the RA, hence it should give you some idea where my stance is. It does not change since then. You may also deem them as a matter of preference in addition to different way of how I am viewing this drama. Cheers!

 

Off topic, like @miracle23, I won't be commenting that often on Soompi.  Today just happened to be my free day to post my thoughts on the overall progression of Mr. Sunshine here, and I couldn't be happier to receive insightful responses, corrections, and/or advice here.

 

Back to the subject at hand: for the most part, I wouldn't let my bias (love, hate, etc.) towards an actor/actress and his/her "unrelated" personal life issues affect my analysis, judgment, etc. of the characters he/she plays in any TV drama or movie he/she stars in.  The few times that I would have issues with the actor/actress include if he/she comes up short (or fails) in embodying his/her character role, the context of the storyline and characterizations, and so on in a drama/movie/etc. that is mostly well-directed, well-written, and well-portrayed by a majority of the strong cast ensemble.

 

For the most part, all of the Mr. Sunshine cast, including those playing the villains, portray their characters and emphasize their plight in the historical context very well that not one actor/character sticks out like a sore thumb.  When I heard that KES is releasing a drama that will tackle the not-often-seen Joseon period just before the Japanese annexation of Korea, I had to see out she (and the actors) would carry out such a sensitive, heartbreaking moment of Korean history that have had K-net viewers protesting and petitioning out of outrage over the historical "inaccuracies" and lack of disclaimer during the first few episodes of Mr. Sunshine.  Like @miracle23, I'd rather see how AS, EC, DM, HS, and others (including Seung-gu and perhaps HN) would put aside their past grievances/prejudices/traumas and join together alongside the RA (which will need resetting of their priorities) in their fight for the future of Joseon.  While I'm not really here for the romance overall (though those exchanges are cute, funny, and welcoming in lieu of this dark historical context), I acknowledge that AS' relationships/encounters with EC et al. do compel them to re-prioritize their personal positions in Joseon, further driving the plotline amidst the impending Japanese colonization.

 

I continue to look forward to more insight on this drama here as we reach the light at the end of the tunnel (no pun intended, at least)!

 

 

2 hours ago, charray said:

 

Not sure if we are realistic here in making this big ask of Ae Shin to bear the burden of saving Joseon and making Joseon a better place for people of all walks of life to live in by herself? Based on what I googled, the roles and rights of women were reduced in Joseon compared to previous eras in Korean history. Yangban women had it worse as they were completely hidden from the outer world and every woman had to conform to Confucian ideals of purity, obedience, chastity and faithfulness. Women were subjects of male dominance throughout their lives, obliged to listen to their fathers, husbands, fathers-in-law and firstborn sons. Homes were divided into male and female quarters to separate the sexes. 

 

So far, her role in the Righteous Army is a sniper who take on the odd mission here and there at the order of Gunner Jang. Unlike Grandfather who can command and galvanise scholars and commoners to his cause.  Ae Shin has not reached the level yet to galvanise and command anyone except her fanboys and right hand and left hand men. Not sure what we can expect her to do?

 

Once more, sorry to cut your post.  Obviously, it's an extremely tall order for AS to bear the burden of ensuring the safety and future of the Joseon people on her own, with her only support being EC, her servants/slaves and fanboys (DM and HS).  But, considering AS' grandfather's predicament (preferably not death sentence by Wan Ik but, given the Ep. 17 preview and spolier pics, doesn't look promising ), someone will have to take his position in bringing together the scholars and Joseon people of all social backgrounds in their fight against Japanese rule.  And who better to do it than AS, EC, and other current (Eun San?) and would-be (DM, HS, etc.) RA compatriots?

 

Now, I do realize that all women,- yangban/noble, slave, butcher, etc.- have been undermined in the patriarchal society in Joseon; hence, AS may have more difficulty publicly declaring her position as a Joseon independence fighter.  However, one thing I would like to point out (which may or may not explain why some Soompiers and beanies from Dramabeans are frustrated with AS' current character trajectory compared to the AS fanboys- EC, DM, and HS), is that AS' grandfather, despite his apparent admonishment of AS' rebellious, "unladylike" streak, allowed her to be recognized as part of his family despite being born out of wedlock (with a woman whom he might not have approved of), receive rifle training from Seung-gu for over 10 years, and even just argue about whatever he says.  Not to mention that AS' grandfather does not appear to wield any (homicidal) tyranny over his servants/slaves like HS' grandfather has done.  In typical yangban households, AS would never receive any of the privileges and end being treated no better than the servants or slaves.  Furthermore, as a noblewoman, AS did not have to suffer extreme social injustices and mistreatment like HN, EC's mother (i.e., offered as a pawn by HS' grandfather for political purposes despite being married), and DM's mother (i.e., being raped while her butcher husband helplessly goes on with his work).

 

Given that there are 8 remaining episodes with 4 other major characters at hand (EC, DM, HS, and HN), only time will tell if AS will either renounce her fight for Joseon and flee from the Japanese rule for her personal safety and happiness (with EC, assuming he or both survive), or renounce her noblewoman upbringing and join EC, the RA comrades and others and fight for Joseon while staying there during the next 30-40 years Japanese oppression.

 

As always, if I missed any other plot point or characterization, please let me know!  Darn these long posts! 

Edited August 28, 2018 by KDramaLogic

[aurelionsol]

@KDramaLogic

 

I respect you for shedding thoughts in this thread. I wonder whether to join the discussion or to put up a passive attitude. 

A little more and everyone will write such essays