[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner

[Gabi Bros]

@antiherofans I remember that the writer's mom passed away when the cast was filming. They had almost 3 months of filming. Probably intense feelings influenced her script. 

Spoiler

 

 

[antiherofans]

21 minutes ago, 40somethingahjumma said:

Although I support Su's decision to leave the palace for many reasons... some I've listed on previous posts, the person I really, really feel for after re-watching Ep. 18 is So. Watching him forced to reinvent himself just so he can avenge the woman he loves truly breaks my heart. All his old ruthlessness coming to the fore as he plays the political game with people more experienced in it than he is, is undoubtedly breaking his heart too. And now of course he's grappling with his greatest fear of becoming a monster in her eyes, all done for the love of Hae Su. The irony is not lost on him, I'm sure. There's a part of me that wishes that the Chunju and Hwangbo clans hadn't pushed him so hard to give Su up... they should have tried to make a deal with him... making the way for him to marry both women but giving YH the higher status. Now he's majorly pissed about having to break her heart again, he's embarking on a rampage. But maybe it wouldn't have worked anyway because he really wanted to be totally devoted to her and not have her share him with someone else. Everybody wants what they want... nobody wants to share or compromise especially when they think/know that they have the upperhand.

It is this all or nothing scenario that I'm interested in. Sometimes it's referred to in the drama as "greed". It has certainly been a recurring theme all throughout the drama but especially in these last couple of episodes. And it's tied to the theme of the sovereignty of fate. 

I call it the law of the zero-sum game. 

Many of you have been so kind in your comments about my posts but I don't really have any special insight into these episodes. All I've really done is considered the drama in its entirety and looked for patterns and recurring themes within individual episodes and throughout the series. That allows me to connect the dots and make sense of the big picture and where the writer's going. The big picture I see is that nobody can get everything they want no matter how much they want it.

The thing I liked about the ending of Ep. 16 was So's declaration that he wanted to have both the girl and the throne. It was a bold declaration in the face of what he's always been told by his elders that to gain the throne he had to "throw someone away". It was bold of him to eschew long standing political orthodoxy. Certainly I wondered if things would go his way. Now 2 episodes later, it appears that that declaration was pure defiance against the sovereignty of fate and it was always going to be a lost cause. Apparently Father's been right all along... no one can have both. Something's got to give.

One of the great myths of our time... perhaps the great lie... is that a person can have everything. I think it is the great lie often told to women... that they can have everything. A career, kids, marriage blah blah blah. In one sense it's true that women in modern contexts have more choices today than their grandmothers ever did but the reality is that no one can have everything. At least not all at the same time. Trying to have everything has brought about incredible stress to women in our day with the demands of child raising and keeping to a job pulling us in a hundred directions. And I say that from painful experience. The only reason why I can do a little bit of both is because I have an incredibly supportive husband. But to be honest, I don't do either as well as I would like.

There is a similar theme going on in ML. I noticed overnight that many of us have identified fate's hand in pushing Su and So together while pulling them apart. There is also a sense that inherent in love is a kind of greed. To love is to be greedy... in that it is all consuming and all-encompassing in its focus on the object of one's affections. When So only cared about Su, he could be the devoted suitor with no thought for anything else. But now that he is King as well, he cannot be entirely considerate of all her sensitivities lest he be thought weak. He has to make hard choices with larger considerations at play.

I think we saw that first with Uk. When he fell in love with Su, he was greedy enough to set aside his usual consideration for his wife and openly show his regard for Su (as open as a guy like Uk is capable of being). It should have been a hint to us and to him that the trajectory he was embarking on was potentially destructive but those were the early days. It's telling too that Uk has continued to be the primary instrument of thwarting So and Su’s coupling. 

So and Su have both been mugged by reality and have been forced to play the zero sum game. It was put to them that So had to choose… the throne or the woman, although for Su it was probably more the man she was supporting than the throne. I suppose she made his job a lot easier by pulling out first but she chose him over her own desire for personal happiness. There didn't seem to be any room for a middle ground. It was this or that, and it did make sense for the throne to come first because there were larger things at stake.

 

What struck me about Uk the second time I watched 17 was how he saw himself as some kind of arbiter of justice. He just couldn’t accept what he thought was the injustice of one being able to have it all. As everyone knows I'm hardly a fan of Uk but he did have a point. If he had to give up the girl to pursue the throne, why shouldn't So have to as well. Therefore to make a statement about the injustice that he had to suffer, he forced So to make a zero sum choice. A choice that So was recalcitrant about making... one he fought kicking and screaming... one he didn't want Su to make so he refused to talk to her about it.

It may have been a false choice on some level but with the Chunju clan scratching at his doorstep, it was clear that trying to hang on to girl and throne was a much bigger challenge than he had been ready for. 

Yeon Hwa put the same kind of zero sum option to Su. "We can co-exist", she said. Well, we know that she had no intention of co-existing but it was a negotiation tactic. Apparently she wants it all too... the throne, the man and his love but she plays her cards close to her chest. However, even if she has won the first round, winning the second and subsequent rounds is not going to be as easy. She herself is now forced into her own a zero sum game. She has to choose between the powers that threw their weight behind her and the King. To get what she ultimately wants, she cannot entirely rely on the power of those who got her through the first hoop. Now she has to bargain directly with the man who put the proposition to her because the terms of the game has changed.

So creates a similar scenario for Won... spill your guts or have your guts spilt... or boiled. I don't imagine that Won wanted his guts cooked so he talked. In the end CR was the scapegoat.

CR worked on similar principle. "I loved, I had no choice, so I did whatever he told me to."

Of course everyone has a choice even CR, the slave girl turned maid. In Won's case, he didn't like the alternative and in CR's case, she wasn't ready to abandon a long-term crush.

As I've said, I don't have any real serious issues with Su leaving So and the palace after recent events. She obviously feels that she's compromised too much and risks being swallowed up by dilemmas she didn't think she had signed up for. However, I have grave misgivings about her leaving with Jeong. Not only because he's a first class self-righteous dill but because Jeong represents everything that So couldn't have... a happy childhood with a loving mother. If she were to go with him, it will be the ultimate slap-in-the-face for So. Jeong may seem to represent a straight-arrow kind of dumb simplicity that will suit Su to the ground in terms of a quiet, peaceful existence. I imagine that's why he's being set up in that role BUT he also comes with family baggage. This is what really troubles me about this particular zero sum game. 

It's clear to me that the recent turn of events has awoken a sleeping dragon. Or to use the show's own metaphor, a napping wolf. Time and time again we see that people underestimate So, not only as a warrior but as a political opponent. Backing him into corners and tightening nooses round his neck aren't really that great in the long run. I think we're definitely witnessing his evolution as a politician in the way he triangulates with his adversaries. In a way I fear for them because they've unleashed a powerful weapon that they will have no control over. I imagine that once he starts, there's not stopping him. But frankly, I have a really tough time feeling sorry for any of them because they have brought this largely upon themselves.

 

Great post as always. This is why we have to prepare for Gwangjong ultimate rage in the next episode.

Oooh my poor heart.

[ilovecoffeeandbooks]

2 hours ago, MoOnLoVeRz said:

still cuts!

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

Spoiler

 

NOOOOOOOOOOO

 

I mean I knew it was going to happen but seeing pictures!!

 

Edited October 30, 2016 by LyraYoo
please do not quote images

[liddi]

@MoOnLoVeRz Thank you for sharing the latest still cuts. Looks like that would be Jung with Yo's decree bestowing Soo in marriage to Jung, just as 14th approached 4th in front of all the officials, declaring that he had a decree from the late emperor Kangxi to take Ruoxi to be his secondary consort. If it continues to follow the original, So would totally refuse to submit to the decree, which would be when Wook confesses about his relationship with Soo, to finally enable Soo to leave the palace. With all the parallels that are becoming increasingly apparent, will we see the same bitter end for So and Soo as well?

Point to note... all these incidents happened over 4-6 episodes in the original. Truly hope that we will not see a rushed ending, seeing we have 2 episodes left, and Woo Hee's death not even covered yet.

[antiherofans]

Just now, Gabi Bros said:

@antiherofans I remember that the writer's mom passed away when the cast was filming. They had almost 3 months of filming. Probably intense feelings influenced her script. 

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OMG, I am so sorry to hear that. That must be very hard.

Maybe that is why we can feel all the pain.

 

[kiinn]

10 minutes ago, MoOnLoVeRz said:

still cuts!

  Hide contents

 

That's the decree! He smashed it.

oh no, this is torture.

[NitaA]

1 hour ago, Evelyn C said:

My feelings exactly...  Why do we have to see these kinds of things? it's like rubbing salt into our wounds...

There'd better be some kind of pot of gold at the end of this journey..... I want to be compensated for weeks of emotional roller coasters and the next day of nervous breakdown...... I am holding on to the fact that fan meeting would mean the end is not as bad as what I think.

Now I don't hate Kang Hanna for playing YH but her IG update made me think she is going to that LJK fan meeting and may give her message to him which made me suspicious.... and unhappy...... sigh.... yes, I am a goner too...

 

[liddi]

@Gabi Bros Am truly sorry to hear that the writer suffered a personal loss during the filming. Was the script unfinished at the time? Is this the reason why people feel she was lifting off the original lock, stock and barrel towards the end, and not creating her own spin of the story as she did in the first half of the drama? Or was this her original vision all along? Either way, I am personally not as concerned about the increasing parallels, as long as it ultimately makes sense in this universe. I still cannot see how this version of 8th Prince could have escaped any form of punishment, especially death, for his hand in Moo's poisoning and Eun's death, with or without Soo begging for his life. I simply cannot justify it even to myself at this point in time.

[ilovecoffeeandbooks]

4 minutes ago, kiinn said:

 

That's the decree! He smashed it.

oh no, this is torture.

Does it look like Jung might have the hairpin in his hands behind his back. I zoomed in but I can't tell. I hope not That will be too harsh to WS.

[antiherofans]

1 minute ago, NitaA said:

There'd better be some kind of pot of gold at the end of this journey..... I want to be compensated for weeks of emotional roller coasters and the next day of nervous breakdown...... I am holding on to the fact that fan meeting would mean the end is not as bad as what I think.

Now I don't hate Kang Hana for playing YH but her IG update made me think she is going to that LJK fan meeting and may give her message to him

 

 

 

Kang Hanna, please bring some security with you. We love you but we hate Yeon Hwa .

[liddi]

1 minute ago, ilovecoffeeandbooks said:

Does it look like Jung might have the hairpin in his hands behind his back. I zoomed in but I can't tell. I hope not That will be too harsh to WS.

I think Jung would use every arsenal in his disposal to fulfill Soo's wish... and the hairpin would be proof that she wanted to leave, and this is not just Jung acting on his own. Certainly would be devastating for So. 

[irene123]

Please DO NOT show us any love scenes between YH and WS...but from the preview, it looks like there might be...Why don't you let those be after HS dies so we don't have to see it!!!! I just can't chingus....

[Evelyn C]

6 minutes ago, NitaA said:

There'd better be some kind of pot of gold at the end of this journey..... I want to be compensated for weeks of emotional roller coasters and the next day of nervous breakdown...... I am holding on to the fact that fan meeting would mean the end is not as bad as what I think.

Now I don't hate Kang Hana for playing YH but her IG update made me think she is going to that LJK fan meeting and may give her message to him

 

I agree, it wouldn't make sense to risk LJG's life by potentially putting him at risk of being crushed by rampaging angry fans.  KHN 's done well - see how we all hate her character - I'm cautiously optimistic that it'll be good - Again risking both of them with a bloody series finale can't be good.

[Gabi Bros]

2 minutes ago, liddi said:

@Gabi Bros Am truly sorry to hear that the writer suffered a personal loss during the filming. Was the script unfinished at the time? Is this the reason why people feel she was lifting off the original lock, stock and barrel towards the end, and not creating her own spin of the story as she did in the first half of the drama? Or was this her original vision all along? Either way, I am personally not as concerned about the increasing parallels, as long as it ultimately makes sense in this universe. I still cannot see how this version of 8th Prince could have escaped any form of punishment, especially death, for his hand in Moo's poisoning and Eun's death, with or without Soo begging for his life. I simply cannot justify it even to myself at this point in time.

I really don't know if it was finished or not.  She talked in the press conference but I don't know what she said about the drama. 

[JJChastity]

1 hour ago, Evelyn C said:

It's ok @dears, we've pretty much all lost our minds and are happy to be this way! There was a show with Ha Seok JIn - I think it's called 'After the Show ends' where it's a drama in a drama (the drama is about actors & actresses shooting a real drama) - the cast could totally be in that - the drama will be them in the show acting and then saying 'Why is all of this familiar?', 'Why do I have this unnatural hatred towards this person like in the drama?', then they figure out they are all reincarnations and try to right the wrongs of the past?? 

 

Do you know where I can watch it? Ah, nevermind, soompi does not allow link to site. I forgot. I'll look it up myself.

 

1 hour ago, moonangelcake said:

 

Yup, I agree with you in all this. Sigh, if only this drama can have more episodes ._.

 

LOL! Into their real actors, you say? Damn, that's a really interesting idea. I wonder how that would turn out?~ It would be a realllyyyy unique ending. I wouldn't mind for a sequel too! Some of the actors have very different personalites from their characters (e.g Kang Ha Na and her character, YH. Heck, I'm pretty sure her and IU are good friends!! xD)

If someone made a fanfic about this, I would definitely be invested into it. I could write about it, but I'm already working on two stories (one of them has yet to be published, but will be soon) + school + lel I would have no idea on how it would go. x_x  I hope this gets turns into a fanfic, such an interesting sequel

Hehehehe, everyone is nuts about our otp! *points at shipping thread*

 

Glad you find it interesting idea as much as I do. I rarely read fanfic but it's nice to know that you write one. Perhaps you could be a scriptwriter later on.

 

37 minutes ago, Killa92 said:

  I knew IU already have bf. But how I wish they could be real couple in real life. Their chemistry is Boom!!!!

 

Yeah, she has a boyfriend, it's just that my imagination runs wild.

[kiinn]

6 minutes ago, ilovecoffeeandbooks said:

Does it look like Jung might have the hairpin in his hands behind his back. I zoomed in but I can't tell. I hope not That will be too harsh to WS.

Now you mention it, o no o god. the hairpin would be like an ultimate blow. Poor So       

 

11 minutes ago, NitaA said:

Now I don't hate Kang Hanna for playing YH but her IG update made me think she is going to that LJK fan meeting and may give her message to him which made me suspicious.... and unhappy...... sigh.... yes, I am a goner too...

Spoiler

 

 

Please don't push it Kang Hanna  must you torture us in real life too. No, i don't want to see you, soon, or later, in this life, or in next life. teehee

[krysyuy]

I already know the final episodes will be depressing, but the pics being released just make me feel even worse about all of it. But I'll still be watching!! lol This drama has taken over my life, I CAN'T.

[Evelyn C]

2 minutes ago, dears said:

 

Do you know where I can watch it? Ah, nevermind, soompi does not allow link to site. I forgot. I'll look it up myself.

 

 

Glad you find it interesting idea as much as I do. I rarely read fanfic but it's nice to know that you write one. Perhaps you could be a scriptwriter later on.

 

 

Yeah, she has a boyfriend, it's just that my imagination runs wild.

I was only able to find the first episode  - Couldn't find fully subbed versions anywhere...

[chrissydiva]

lololol WS threw the decree like "F that ish!" and Jimong looking at him hoping he won't go Hulk on Jung's butt. 

They are really killing everyone. Forget ships! Whatever ships you are in, either they both die or one dies while the rest wallow in misery. 

I honestly don't think YH will be a winner at least not in this drama.  She's queen, yes, but she'll be a miserable one. You can tell that no matter how she tries to act, she cares about having at least a small portion of WS's heart and WS basically told her to stay in her lane on their freaking wedding night lmao (I'll never get over his leaning over her and be like "nah you won't get the d" lol) Then even when drunk, the guy is still able to tell her apart from his lover by I think their scents lol the way he leaned over like looking at the lips first then smelling at least that's what it looked like. Anyway that definitely hurts her pride. She just like Queen Yo. She had 4 kids with Taejo, but dude gave her the biggest F U in the history by saying another woman's name as he died, right as she was standing next to him. Let's not forget what led her to slash my boy's face. Jealousy! She thought she was a winner, but just like Lady Oh told her, she never won because that one person will always remember her lol Same karma will happen to YH but in worse way since So is way more cruel than Taejo. So really gives a new meaning to an eye for an eye. You mess with him then he'll f you back tenfold. I'm game if she's at least emotionally tortured.

[xoxoforme]

HELLO GUYS! I HOPE IT IS MONDAY TODAY SO I CAN COME AND SEE THIS AWESOME SHOW.

There are still a lot to happen with the 3 remaining episodes. PD, PLEASE BE GOOD TO ME!

So, before anything else, here's a sneak peak before our hearts explode. Lol. Keep it tight, HOLD ON!+