[Drama 2014-2015] Valid Love 일리있는 사랑

[Guest snklgs]

@lc85 TBH I really didn't see any chemistry between HT and Ir in a sexual way. And with KJ it was just all about being a woman with a man. Even HT mentioned if Ir ever saw him as one

Even in the last ep after they got back together, I still couldn't see that type of spark. The way they reacted together was more like being comfy in a family sort of way perhaps that was a deliberate move for the writer ? Only due to the dementia turn, I feel we didn't get to see how HT and Ir found that MOJO again. Even without KJ, I feel they need to spice up their marriage

KJ was just too in your face for IR to handle-- both on a physical and deeply existential way. He made her uncomfortable due to the way he would get her to face her fears. He was all about intimacy which obviously she wasn't ready for. HT, on the other hand, was very comfortable and dependable. Being andro in SK is probably being like an outsider, and being married to Jang son in law got her that normal identity. She became " human" in that society. Being with KJ was being with a marginalized middle school graduate "laborer", who brought out the andro in her. Choosing HT she didn't want to go to her untamed andro self, but evolved to andro lite acknowledging part of it with painting. The one thing though is that Ir didn't look happy with HT, we didn't get to see.more of those scenes after they got married. As my yoga teacher said, if it brings you pain, then stop it. If you're not happy and stay that way, why? Perhaps it is the fear of change and the unknown as opposed to being comfortable in one's misery.

[Guest ascsp]

@ascsp‌ - I am curious about what others saw that I didn't see. I feel like I missed out on the beauty. And why should they give their marriage a chance? That's my other question. I really didn't see the point as to why they should - even without KJ in the mix.

Not going to criticize or blame the writer anymore --but if I knew a couple like HT and IR-- I probably would tell them to call it quits, too. I wonder if that makes me a bad friend.

They give their marrige another chance because they love each other. They do, or at least, they tell us so.

We need to trust them on this because we didn't see a lot about their love.

[lc85]

So - that was a meaningful response @snklgs‌ and I have to think about your points (and all valid, substantiated, thoughtful, and I agree, of course) some more -- because now there are more questions.. so I will be back on your post.

@ascsp‌ - you have a point there. I am wondering if IR loves the idea of loving HT. But I don't get HT's "love". This is probably cultural (?) / implied.

[Guest snklgs]

@lc85 thanks, I too am surprised when I end up not posting shallow^^...see, the inconsistency is evidence that I am now demented b-(

I forgot to mention that Ilri also emphasized specifically her family and her sense of identity with place. KJ didn't have those as well. He was a tree without roots. KJ was a living, breathing piece of wood ..part of whom was transformed into that chair. So Ir got to.keep him too^^.

[Guest ascsp]

@lc85‌

I can't tell, because I really don't know. When I was watching Valid Love often I found KJ the most comprehensible among the others, but I know that in korea it's the opposite and the carpenter is the "freak"...

[Guest Manolya]

Can someone please translate the complete interview of LSH, thank you and sorry If I ask that too often, its because I cant get over VL and I really want to know what he said. Thank you!!!!     . ^^

[TeBe]

See, after 4 days we still shocked and in denial writer-richard simmons-nim! We couldn t understand what was that all about ! Everyone is analyzing the characters in their ways. Only HT-IR shipper or to be more transparent HT-shipper are pleased with this richard simmons-up ending. Now again, you,  writer-nim made a mistake by giving KJ so much spot light , even more than HT. And in the end making him look like an immature psycho didn t help much to hate on him and cheer for HT-IR getting back together.and I'm still wondering , if KJ faced death not HT , how would IR have felt? I need an answer from , KIM DO-WOO !
~X(

[Guest snklgs]

@manolya if I remember right, that one was translated in one of the past pages.

[Guest Manolya]

@snklgs could someone post this on this page again. I can`t seem to find it  (

[lclarakl]

snklgs said: @chickfactor
"You can come slowly. Just stay for a long time."

This one really was MAJOR!  Really, Ilri being immune to this was....
a. W*F unbelievableb. explainable due to Ilri's loss of hearingc. Ilri had amnesia and forgot Korean and had no access to subtitlesd. Ilri was REALLY, REALLY, REALLY in love HT...and it was SO OBVIOUS ...and KJ was just a plaything^^e. Ilri was starving and thinking of curry...What? What? Oh wow! awesome cut potatoes!!!f.  Ilri had the attention of an 8th grader...What? WHat? What did you say again?

I also went to shrieking mode during their last scene when he said that he was still hot^^  My heart also breaks remembering, "What am I to you?".  Ditto when he was addressing her silently in the store, " Are you ok?  pause ...I'm not"?   
...and the virginity part where he went.." Do you want proof?" ^^
---change of topic---
I was talking to my Korean friend yesterday, she usually checks out the last eps and decides then whether to watch the rest or not. For her, VL wasn't bad, but too melo for her taste--she found it depressing^^. She also said that LSH's nose looks abnormal^_~ and prolly plastic surgery. I think it's probably just genetics, I recall, even in his younger pics, his nose has always been like that (?)....

[lclarakl]

As much as I hate this drama and I disliked the lead female character, IR and could care less for KJ, I see why the writer put HT and IR back together--because they had true love for one another. I doubt her love, but the writer tried to show how IR was caught up in a fantasy, that she was a dreamer. When a "handsome" man came along, who had dropped out of high school, who was lonely, who made her do things she didn't want, but at times wanted, to do, she lost her common senses and chased after a man she had only known for 3 days because she felt she was on the same level. Letting him kiss her on day 4. She wanted to do the things that she had not while married to HT because she put her dedication to HS before her husband.

The writer, in my opinion, failed to show how HT caused the failure in his marriage or cause hurt to IR. IR was her own worst enemy.

I really think a lot of the problems with this drama was the lead actress portrayal of her character. Too smiley and happy at the most inappropriate times, not really reflective.

I don't care how the writer tries to paint it, what IR felt for KJ was not love, not even close to it. This entire drama of her romance with him was less than 2 months.  The who KJ and HT "friendship", I don't think so and nor do I buy it.

So IR and KJ shippers, you're not the only ones not happy with this drama. It may be for different reasons, but you're not the only ones.

[lclarakl]

Also, there was an interview in the U.S. with a man from South Africa (I think) who was locked in his own body for 12 years. He's not able to talk now, but can communicate via computer. It was interesting during the interview how he resent when his mother said she wish he would die. They didn't know that he was aware of everything they said and did but he was paralyzed and couldn't communicate. He understood why she felt that way, but it hurt him to hear it.

The book he wrote of his 12 years is called Ghost Boy: The Miraculous Escape of a Misdiagnosed Boy Trapped Inside His Own Body.

His mother was able to see him graduate later in life.

[lc85]

@snklgs‌ - you were on point about IRs marriage and choices as an integral part of her identity in the SK society. Being married to HT gave her certain perks and uplifted her societal standing. She had to suppress her andro- tendencies in exchange for that "normal" lifestyle. IRs mom worshipped HT. She really did. I wonder how much of that factored in IRs decision to go back to HT. It seems contradictory because there were times when she disregarded her mother's advice.

IR seemed resigned (not at all happy) and looked 10 years (at least) older at the end of Ep 20. I think she cried tears of sadness and he cried tears of relief over the bean paste soup.

In addition to staying with HT because it was the more comfortable choice, I also think she carries a backpack full of guilt. Mentally and physically, IR has adapted to all that crap that she's been carrying for years. She feels some pain from the heavy load, she drinks soju. She has found ways to cope. Feeling indebted to someone keeps that backpack full. It's her badge of honor. Guilt validates her existence.

With KJ, she saw a glimpse of what it's like to unload her guilt backpack. She felt free.. I would think this is the best for IR -- to be rid of the crap and start new with KJ. But that's the tricky part about conditioning ones self to carry the backpack full of guilt. It's just as uncomfortable to be with it as to be without it. She would need another coping mechanism if she was to be rid of it. And she wouldn't be the same IR anymore -- she will have a new identity and that's not comfortable at all. I'm not sure if this makes any sense at all -- lol.

I think she was raised to feel indebted, to accept inappropriate guilt, to carry this all her life, and to feel unworthy. It started way before she met HT.

I am fascinated about IR because I am a mama to 2 girls. And I want to understand how things went wrong for IR from the beginning. I want to know the lessons I can learn to help empower my girls - to be who they are, to learn self-acceptance, to not willingly take crap from anybody, and to not carry that for the rest of their lives..I think these are some important lessons.

[Guest snklgs]

@lc85  Daddy issues too play a huge role in Ilri's development. HT was also a father to her...while KJ was not going to be her daddy at all. 
I think it is just hard to think otherwise about oneself especially if that has been one's truth for years even if that truth really wasn't reflective of what the person can be or truly is deep down. But the self cannot deny itself otherwise what we get is breakdown or a quiet self-destruction within. Ilri was dead set on burying her Andro. Kim Joon wanted to peel off the pretention. Ilri was drawn not merely because KJ was hot^^, but because he could see through the BS.  
Oftentimes, the society we belong to ( society in our personal context and not necessarily the country we live in) puts so much pressure on what women "should be" that we actually convince ourselves that what is expected of us is what we really want or the identities that are imposed on us by systems are actually who we are. It is also hard to see what our options are without fear of repercussions. It is just difficult to say F* this and pursuit our "true" selves, especially if we got to the point where we lost ourselves or forgot who we are. Often, we also do not know who we are. The comfort of the known, even if hellish, appears to be preferable compared to the fear of change or going back to our selves--which is really strange, because why wouldn't we want to be who we are?  Why choose misery? Why choose boredom? Why choose the less than hawt husband and not that super hawt carpenter?  The way Ilri was written reflects reality more than if she had chosen KJ.  
But I do think that majority of K-drama watchers both in SK and beyond prefer fantasy.  Because in our daily lives, we all have our version of HTs...not enough KJ! 

[Guest Manolya]

[sooyoungdaebak]

I am trying to forget the drama called Valid Love and what did I see? I found a can of mackerel in my pantry that I don't remember buying and while I was LOL-ing watching a variety show, the host mentioned Andromeda...wth?! Aigoo....such a tough life...  b-( [-( 8-| :-<

[sooyoungdaebak]

lclarakl said: snklgs said:
I was talking to my Korean friend yesterday, she usually checks out the last eps and decides then whether to watch the rest or not. For her, VL wasn't bad, but too melo for her taste--she found it depressing^^. She also said that LSH's nose looks abnormal^_~ and prolly plastic surgery. I think it's probably just genetics, I recall, even in his younger pics, his nose has always been like that (?)....

[lclarakl]

sooyoungdaebak said: lclarakl said: snklgs said:
I was talking to my Korean friend yesterday, she usually checks out the last eps and decides then whether to watch the rest or not. For her, VL wasn't bad, but too melo for her taste--she found it depressing^^. She also said that LSH's nose looks abnormal^_~ and prolly plastic surgery. I think it's probably just genetics, I recall, even in his younger pics, his nose has always been like that (?)....

[Guest snklgs]

Ok, this is not 100% evidence of his butt bowls...of course like @sooyoungdaebak said, we have to take Shin Dong Yup's word for this, which by the way he mentioned 2X on both Strong Heart and Hello Counselor.  SDY also said that LSH had the best bod in the whole of SK---ahhhhm, his words not mine. But here in his previous drama, we do see a bit of a "lift".  1"07.
Btw, this is one awesome FMV which mashes up KJ + the LSH shower scene BTS...

Yeah, me too, I really didn't find LSH personally hot until this drama.  I remember when he first came out on Vampire Idol and Tree with Deep Roots--thought that his looks were very distinctively sharp; and that overall, he was totally super model.  I also watched parts of What's up? But totally wasn't focusing on him. I also didn't watch High School King of Savvy before I watched VL because the synopsis wasn't really appealing to me.  But after ep 3,  "hello shirtless KJ", I decided to watch ep 4, then after ep 4, it was like, "WHERE WERE YOU MY ENTIRE FANGIRL LIFE?"
PS:  I am updating on the Soompi LSH forum. It is rather lonely there. But my love is just too much right now, I need to share...also too lazy to do a tumblr or blog or anything like that.

[sooyoungdaebak]

@snklgs I know the gal that made that mv you posted... ) She was spazzing uncontrollably when she saw that washboard abs in the shower...sweet mother of abs, have mercy on our ovaries...jaebbal!! She had to mash those two videos and I don't think she is fully recovered...  ) Knowing SDY's personality, if he said  LSH has the best body, that is for sure true cos that man has a good eye on fine looking bodies...haha. He is well known for his good pair of eyes...hahaha. @manolya too is having LSH's fever. Aigoo, it's hard to recover from KimJooningitis. No cure.
Btw, @lclarakl Won-freakin'-Bin is another epitome of hawtlicious. He can do nothing and yet still make me spazz. Interesting to see your namjhas list. I guess it all depends on a person's taste.