[Drama 2015/2016] I Have A Lover 애인있어요

[Dundee]

2 hours ago, Lmangla said:

 

LOL.. @delroyB ~ miss the LOL button; this so needs to be added to the list of kdrama rules.

so Q for folks ~ any funny lessons/takeaways that you got from watching this drama so far? besides finding out the most non-breakable phone that can take angst from everyone....

Hmm.. I vote @chubbychub1966 insightful post about the JE vs the doors (dormitory room door, icu door, hotel room door) LOL 

[Dundee]

6 hours ago, DelroyB said:

 

I use KDRAMA trope.

The dying significant other.  

Be it BF,GF,parent  they will never tell the one they love they have terminal illness.

Instead everyone including the janitor will hear of it.

1) They don't want the other to know 

Because don't want them to see them week

Dont want to be a burden

Want them to be remembered by them in good health

etc etc.

In other word there just somethings you can not tell the one you love the most but it ok to tell  friend or stranger.

The revenge plot.

Keep enemies, friends and accomplices close and lovers distant till the end.

We have all seen it where the lovers break apart so someone can get revenge

yet they confide in the friend,

 

In conclusion in Kdrama land the lover is the last to know.  In fact if you get confided in that a sure sign  You've been Friend Zoned! 

Yeah very true 

[Guest lenet]

1 hour ago, lclarakl said:

 

You and I will NEVER see eye to eye on this topic because it is extremely clear that you have no idea of what I'm saying about JE's behavior. The writer has made this behavior part of JE's character for the past 21 episodes.  No matter how much you like him, his actions are what they are. When I say JE does what JE wants , it is based on facts and what has been shown repeatedly in this drama--manhandling and doing what he wants. JE doesn't know what it means when HK says, no.  The same way he tried to physically force her into his car when she said no. The same way he forced himself in her room at their old house after she told him to live.  First, I didn't like that he just entered the house where he no longer lives and has't lived for 4 years.  He didn't care about respecting the inhabitants of the house by ringing the doorbell.

Also, just because they are in college, doesn't excuse JE's actions. Women think a guy being possessive or showing signs of jealousy is a sign of love. It is to a certain extent, then it could also be a warning sign.  About 43% to 57% dating women in college are in abusive/controlling relationships that starts with boyfriends who disregards their wants and exhibit controlling behaviors.  Again, I know abuse is not the message of this drama and not what the writer intends. However, after working a year with the Department of Social Services and seeing a lot of domestic abuse, the scenes of JE only being able to deal with HK by yanking, pulling and physically forcing her to comply with his will is not romantic to me; most of those scenes are when one or both are angry.

I could have mentioned several scenes, probably from every episode.  I think JE could go a long way in winning HK over if he would allow her to grieve her angry. I'm not saying he doesn't have to try to see her, but he doesn't have to try to force her to accept his presence. They've been divorced for 4 years and he was with SR all those years, whether they were sexually active daily or once a month or 3 months out of the year, really doesn't matter. He immediately leaves one woman and trying to get with the other. He needs to step back and at least show that he's truly sorry to her and SR as he claims.  His actions doesn't seem like a person who is sorry. He seems like a person eager to get into another relationship.

I digress, IMO, noticed I said in my opinion, JE has been depicted in this drama as a person who does only what he wants.

 

It is not necessary to see eye to eye or have similar opinions or interpretation of events/characters in the drama.  It is silly to expect that.  Some of us see one angle and others provide another perspectives.  It is enriching and fun.  Whatever one proffers, one should expect/can expect others may want to challenge one's  opinion.  This is especially so when the challenger believes he/she has a valid point based on sound interpretation of evidence glimpsed.  While our interpretation may be coloured by our prior knowledge, it must also be substantiated by a certain degree of correct reading of evidence shown.  Otherwise like I've said before, white can becomes black and vice versa.  What is simple and straight becomes dark and twisted.  And that is why when reading the character of JE, HK, SR and BS,  I have mentioned before, do take a look and see what the author actually wants to portray.  If one's reading of the character is drastically different from what the author is painting, doesn't it says that one is reading it inaccurately?  

So I certainly do not see eye to eye with you about JE's character.  I will say that I see more eye to eye with the writers painting of JE's character - a supposedly 'pure', innocent character who ultimately is human and has flaws and is given to making mistakes in life. I see the 'pure', 'innocent' part - now these two terms I do question if it is accurately translated but I think the gist is there, something about being righteous and having no guile and pretense.  I see also his flaws and in particular, his ambivalence in handling SR issue.  I am able to justify his action for the way he treats SR too.  I am able to censured him for the way he treats HK as well.  I am also able to see HK's flaw and her good traits as well as BS's good and weak points.  If anyone wants to challenge me, that's fine by me.  

When I read your comments about JE,  I see an ugly, twisted character, so different from writer's intention.  And so I do want to  challenge your opinion and your reading of events/characters.  When I do challenge you, I do proffer my evidence based on evidence glimpsed from the drama and not coloured too much by outside experience coz that may not be the same experience that writer is referencing.

Take for example : your issue with JE manhangling.  Those are assertiveness and persistence and determination in my opinion to get HG to listen to him, to give him a chance.  They are not bad or sinister.  On the other hand, being neither a husband nor a boyfriend, BS barging into a HK's room in the middle of the night, cuddling her tight, body to back and asking her to let him stay there when she is in a vulnerable situation, that is to me awfully scary(albeit his intention is to calm her)!!!  Now if you have censured BS a quarter as much as you had JE, I should say you are quite fair but really, those censures I have yet to see.  

So have no doubt that I understand what you are talking, just that I disagree because you are not convincing.  So whenever you mention JE, I will take notice, can't help it. So there! Say your piece and be ready to have it challenged

[zagigirl]

55 minutes ago, chubbychub1966 said:

2 hours ago, tambui said:

JE & HK

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

 

 

 

 

So somehow JE manages to get into HK room again... 

I have a feeling he'll get a proof that love hurts...once again...with another slap 

[zagigirl]

5 hours ago, chubbychub1966 said:

Haha so cute. This soon to be family I hope 

Cute in deed ...can't wait...but seems a bit rushed if he really will admit to her tomm already....don't know...we'll see how it'll look 

[iamtaken]

@lclarakl I have so much fun reading your posts. The drama I am seeing is very different from the drama you are seeing. I think the only thing I agree with you is that BS is a good guy. I feel bad for him. I wish him a very exciting romance with another woman but feel that HG because she lived in his house and he was part of her rebirth as YK2 is in his bones. It is going to be hard for him to move on. HG is being unfair in asking him to help her keep JE at bay.

Oh I also agree that there is a reason why JE and HG are across the hall from each other. I wish the two of them would do the deed and defuse the sexual tension they are leaving a thick trail of where ever they go. Then we can move on to solving the CYP issues which are complicated enough to require both of them to work together. Plus unless they learn to work together, they are not going to last this second time around either. Love is essential but not sufficient to hold 2 people together.

@LmanglaI think the funniest scene in IHAL is when JE brings back the dead HG by yelling at her. Although he was shaking her also and that may have counted as chest compressions in cardio-pulmonary resuscitation (CPR) but one important lesson to learn, if a loved one dies in an incompetent ICU (HG’s resuscitation was terrible) then you should attempt to resuscitate the dead person by shaking him/her or yelling. It may work or so says Kdrama Land.

A US Supreme Court chief justice once said about pornography is that you know it when you see it. It is hard to tell you what it is by defining it. So I think JE not taking no for an answer from HG is similar in that it can be harassment or it can be as I see it: an extroverted person (JE) loving an introverted person (HG). They are different people. JE has no problems showing HG he is vulnerable to her. It is one of the things that I like best about that character. He gives her power over himself. It takes a really secure guy to do that. HG is not expressive about anything. That is part of her nature.  If JE waited for her to respond to him in a manner similar to him, he would grow old by himself. That does not mean he is not reading her. He is and several times when she means it, he backs off. I also think HG does not like losing control and JE was the first person in her life who could make it hard for her to hold onto her control. Her daughter was probably the second person. Woo Joo is probably the third. Look at what she did to Woo Joo when the little girl walked into HG’s room in epi 29. Everyone else, BS, JR, her mom, JE’s mom, JE’s dad, MTS, KS, HG can handle them.

I think it was @Lmangla who wrote that JE could not understand and was hurt by her HG’s apparent lack of emotion at ES’s loss. When his kind – I think that is what they were at the time – gestures towards KS drew a response from HG, he saw his opportunity to get even with HG for not mourning his daughter. It was extremely stupid. So you are not going to grieve our daughter, let me see if I can hurt you in a way I can see I can hurt you. This is extremely juvenile and one would not want do this but I can see why under his circumstances he did it. If HG cannot bring herself to forgive him, no one can blame her.

I think Writer Bae is exploring the role of physical attraction to hold a couple together in IHAL.  In twinkle twinkle, KHJ and the lead actor’s chemistry is actually lacking. He is described as unattractive and serious many times in the play. The connection there is very cerebral. They both like books and they both hold the same values and that is their connection.

In Scandal, the connection is born out of similar values for the lead couple and also the fact that male lead had helped the female lead in circumstances that left no room for pretenses between them. She was not sure if she was being disloyal to her husband and child for a big part of the drama. The focus was really the two sons - the adopted and the biological son.

In IHAL, JE and HG have different personalities. He is extroverted and warm. She is introverted and cool. They have different values. He cares more for people and doing the right thing. HG has not had too many people she can care for – her mom is a liability and her reserved nature and burning ambition do not invite friends – until she meets JE. HG is ambitious and wants power (not really money) mainly because she has been humiliated in life because of lack of it. She overall just likes power and control.

In some ways, if JE had not been the son of a pharma magnate, HG and JE would have lived happily because the stresses that came into their marriage came from HG having access to the power and status that CYP brings but not having them because JE does not care about them. She genuinely does not get that he is capable of but does not want the power of being the head honcho at CYP. She thinks that if she can get it for him, he will of course want it.

Loss of a child in the way ES died has broken marriages far stronger than JE and HG’s.If that had not happened, they may have been OK.  

I think Writer Bae has focused on physical attraction as a bond and cast JJH and KHJ as the lead pair because in the beginning that was what kept them with each other. HG could fight it until the cows came home but in the end, she could not fight herself against JE’s thrall. No when she was 20 and apparently not now. But Writer Bae also shows that powerful as it is, physical attraction cannot hold people together. It can actually poison a relationship. Because HG was accustomed to JE not being able to say no to her physical allure, she tries to use that to cope with ES’s loss. She did not – still cannot - want to process ES’s loss because it would bring her down, all her values, all her sense of what she had accomplished thus far in life. Bring up that question that she asked JE in episode 27. Is she human?

Since that was not possible for her then, the answer seemed to have been to have another child. At that time JE beheld himself from her on the grounds that what right do you have to have another child when you are not mourning the one who is gone. She then tries to use his attraction to her against him and it back fires.

Now I think JE is sort of doing the same thing. She is very mad at him. Justifiably. They have both grown as people but still their cores are very different. JE is still trying to break through to her. She has multiple demons to fight right now. Her role in her sister’s life, her role in ES’s death, her role in depriving JE of his daughter.  That would be enough but she also has to deal with the fact that she is in love with a guy who had the singular lack of judgement to have an affair for the express purpose of hurting her.  There is tenderness in JE and HG’s relationship. Watch that scene between them in epi 28 when he almost cries when she tells him, I love you. But more importantly watch her face when she leans in and puts her hands on his face and gently tells him, almost as a benediction, I love you again. That is tenderness.

The rest is JE using whatever leverage he has to get to her. Her physical attraction to him is a significant part but not the whole of that leverage. Unfortunately the other leverage they have over one another – they have practically grown up together form young adults to almost 40 – is mined with ES’s loss and JE’s infidelity. It comes through when they read each other to the T. He can tell she is inviting him into her hospital bed without her saying a word – (That is another funny moment. Anyone who has ever been in a hospital bed knows how uncomfortable that must have been but the visuals were great.) He can tell she is overreacting when she calls the police on him.  He knows when her no means yes and when no means no. She knows how much her colluding with KS to bring him to the family meeting would have hurt him (It was betrayal. She had just used the power he had given her over him to make him do something he did not want to do) and hence she goes to see him in his office. She knows her seeing BS will completely mess with JE’s head and hence poor BS is being dragged into her scheme.  This is really not right on HG’s part but the problem is her only other friend is JE who has royally screwed himself up.

 

[-jade-]

6 hours ago, lenet said:

 

@lclarakl when I comment on a post, I comment on whatever I see or read that was mentioned in the particular post.  That post mentioned college scenes to justify JE's not asking HK and only wanting to do whatever he wants and making HK comply with what he wants and the pulling, yanking. There were no other examples so it is not right for me to comment on what was not mentioned.  I only commented on the college scene and I also don't embellish my comments at that point or later with any other facts or pov etc.

So I racked my brain to find the college scenes and I can remember only the particular three.  The first 2 scenes of 'library'  and 'chasing bus' as I mentioned there was no issue of   "Even in college, JE did whatever JE wanted to do--he never asked HG, he just took what he wanted and forced HG to comply. He didn't ask HG, he just did it--which we've seen a lot of in the past 30 episodes; especially the yanking and pulling HG around."    Those are courting scenes and I believe nobody would have issue with him not asking HG first.  HK wasn't upset by it or is she forced to comply with anything.  HK was amused in fact and I don't think she sees any problem with it.  The third hostel scene is the one I thought you are referring to and there is some ground for you to quote it but that ground is filmsy if the scene is seen in entirety and context again is important.  And I gave a reason as to why it is debatable - why he has to not listen to her saying no. Not because he does not respect her but because he is leaving for enlistment - I don't think I need to explain why he feels it is imperative that he must see her face to face.   And I showed how he was respectful, he was willing to do what she wanted after letting her know his important message. 

You answered that you only want to look at the first part and so I said it is not fair to judge looking at partial scene only.  That was my point regarding the 3rd college scene.  Just that according to the first post, to the point.  If you have quoted other better examples, that I won't perhaps comment but the college scene, I feel that it is debatable.

 

@lenet That's exactly how I understand that dorm scene too.  

Entering the military for a young man that JE was at that time, it's a very important phase of a young man's life. For 26 months, he was going to be shut out in some regimentary place, and so it's a no brainer that the last person he wants to see, and be seen, was his 'love-at-first-sight' HK. There was no impropriety in his behavior (and I'm not referring to him bribing the dorm master to open HK's door), esp in that scene. And with the response HK gave upon hearing what JE had to say, it was clear she was surprised and also sad, and hence the backhug and her reluctance in not being able to see him (or rather be seen/visited by him) for that long a period. HK was so buried in her studies, she was oblivious to everything that's happening outside of her books. 

In college days, JE's world was all about HK and her world, but HK's world was all about her pursuit of education, about getting out of the poverty hole she was in. JE was indeed tenacious even at that age, at that time period, in pursuing the love of his life. And, it was precisely that show of love and tenacity that, I believe, moved HK, and ingrained in her the belief that JE will do anything for her, that JE will turn around for her, just as HK told MH post-divorce.

[Lmangla]

56 minutes ago, iamtaken said:

I think it was @Lmangla who wrote that JE could not understand and was hurt by her HG’s apparent lack of emotion at ES’s loss. When his kind – I think that is what they were at the time – gestures towards KS drew a response from HG, he saw his opportunity to get even with HG for not mourning his daughter. It was extremely stupid. So you are not going to grieve our daughter, let me see if I can hurt you in a way I can see I can hurt you. This is extremely juvenile and one would not want do this but I can see why under his circumstances he did it. If HG cannot bring herself to forgive him, no one can blame her.

 

yea @iamtaken, it is my view as well as many others here that her lack of public mourning aroused his anger as a father and he basically took revenge for that in the form of an affair. can someone who paid more attention to the earlier episodes or re-watched them answer this Q ~ how long was ES dead when we first meet JE and HK at the beginning of the series? had the one year anniversary been celebrated yet?

not sure what exact are the korean mourning rituals but it looks like she didn't follow them which further angered him. think it was ES birthday that he spent at her grave listening to music from howl's castle on a loop while she was working. she did not show solidarity by arriving at the grave and it looked to him like she had forgotten or didn't care. so her absence on such an important day would have come across as insult/disrespect to his daughter and unacceptable since she was the mother.

also if she asked for a child within the 1 year anniversary, again that may have come across as disrespect for the dead and especially worse since she was the mother. in my place, some families will not celebrate any good events during that year -- no birthday celebrations, engagements or weddings. so if a wedding date was fixed and a death in the family occurred even a few months prior, there can be a lot of confusion and debate on whether to postpone the wedding. the other party/family usually may try to gently persuade to move on since invitations have been sent and money already sent but some bereaved families will not budge due to deep emotional attachment or simply a strong belief that the dead must be given their due respect regardless. so some weddings do get even cancelled due to such dramas.

so anyone have any idea about korean/Confucius mourning rituals -- is there rules like that in other places regarding one-year anniversaries and other specific rituals??

[oyeleyeolusina]

2 hours ago, iamtaken said:

In some ways, if JE had not been the son of a pharma magnate, HG and JE would have lived happily because the stresses that came into their marriage came from HG having access to the power and status that CYP brings but not having them because JE does not care about them. She genuinely does not get that he is capable of but does not want the power of being the head honcho at CYP. She thinks that if she can get it for him, he will of course want it.

I very much doubt that she would have been happy with JE if he wasn't the son of a pharma magnate, she probably would have long broken up with him if he had nothing to offer to satisfy her hunger for power and i feel HK is too much like GN and when GN discussed her relationship with HK's dad, It felt her parents had exactly the same relationship as JE and HK.

One of HK's biggest flaws is that she didn't listen to JE and just did what she wanted, maybe their life together would have be more happy if only HK listened to JE, JE made it clear to her that he wanted nothing to do with the company but using the excuse that if was for his sake while fulfilling her greed to own the company as if JE would gladly receive the company when she gets the company, of course JE is a grown man and already knows what he wants and needs so he was never going to appreciate HK efforts in trying to own the company as he never wanted it in the first place.

[mdj101]

@tambui --- Thank you for the video of KHJ (RL vs TV drama).  The video from the Viet Nam fan was so funny.  I checked out 2 more BTS videos on that fans site. See them under the Spoiler.The scene in the rain was such a revelation for me.  The number of times they redid the scene, the many crew all around them, the director shouting things to KHJ/JJH, the noisy traffic in the street, the passersby, ---- AND NO MUSIC!  How do they manage to "get into the role"?  AMAZING    Then the scene in the tall, silvery grass --- they shout their names out loud.   Rehearsing in the cold, then the "for-the-camera shots", just as it appeared on TV --- with 2 crew per actor holding big reflector screens in their faces, huge lights, again NO MUSIC to create the mood --- and still they are acting tenderly the real scene.

Spoiler

(1) https://www.facebook.com/ihavealover/videos/1657234767863472/       

(2)  https://www.facebook.com/ihavealover/videos/1657011111219171/   

 

By th way, I accidentally clicked on a video clip of "the arm lock" scene ---Korean spoken, Vietnamese subs --- so I was gazing only at HK/JE face & hearing JJH's voice.   And JE had gotten so far into his line of argument, then "off-track' as he felt her heartbeat, then became aware of his own thumping heart, and the effect on him of her dark, intensely shining eyes, ---he totally lost track of his original purpose & what he meant to say --- and was so startled when HK said, "I'll eat!"  "HUH?" was all he could say!!!  R-rated  JE for a minute there!   

[iamtaken]

@oyeleyeolusina In my humble opinion, you are mixing up HG with KS. If JE's money had mattered to her, we would not see her trying to resist his pursuit of her in their college days. HG is smart and JE is not a philanderer. His pursuit was single minded and it was clear he wanted marriage. HG would have done what KS did. Free ride on his money. Live in an apartment provided by his family's money and go to school on his money. She is ambitious. She wants to succeed on her own. She wants control and respect. If JE's family had been a regular middle class family who had welcomed her into their family, she would still have been a very successful lawyer but the warping we see in her personality from all the humiliation her MIL and SIL heaped on her especially in the earlier years - before her FIL takes her under his wing and her own hard work and intelligence made her the "executioner' - would not have happened. 

The other proof for this IMO is that when that pernicious influence is gone by loss of her memory and she is among the Baeks, she morphs into the warmer side of her personality. In episode 12 or 13, JE tells Hyun Woo that HG is warm and she sings and that hurts him. So JE had always known that part of her existed and he must have seen it when she was with ES but it was gone when ES died. JE was hurt that someone other than him had been able to tap into that part of HG. This is the main reason JE is so insecure about BS because otherwise he is a pretty secure guy. SR even now lives in the officetel. She wanted her name in the paper before JE even though JE did most of the work. HG does not want JE to get her an office even though they fought over her joining BS's office. 

She is not money hungry or power hungry for the sake of being power hungry. She likes control. And she wants to achieve stuff with her own effort. She wants respect. She has her own ethic. She was willing to put up with the humiliation of being cheated on but not JE humiliating himself before his father. Compare that to KS who is OK with JE being wrecked by HG's loss and OK with not having JE as long as HG does not get JE. Just my 2 cents worth!

[DelroyB]

Now for something completely different,

The hing about this drama is that one thing builds on another.  What hard lessons has JE learned from HK/HG.

1. She often says things she does not mean and those words need to be taken with salt content of the dead sea. This he learned in the year after ES death.  He believed her words and her actions about not caring or grieving for ES.  He realized he falter by not staying true to the HG he knew and loved.  Therefore to not make the same mistake again he cannot be exhausted he has to keep trying to pursue her even when her words hurt him.

2.If he leaves her side for any reason she get in trouble or DIES.   He leaves the house she follows and attempts suicide.   He leave the country she gets amnesia.   He drops HG off at the house leaves with BS learns she died going to China.  He wants to walk her she says no.  He worries puts a body guard on her she gets attacked.  He goes to the hospital turns away and dead again.    

3.  He is  the only one who can protect her.  He asked BS to watch over her when he felt she was in danger and what happened.

4. No body tells him the truth.  BS was lying to the end JR and TS kept lying to him and well HG lied to him for a long while.

Therefore JE knows only one thing he can not get exhausted this time.  HE has to stick it out.  He also knows it not going to be easy but he dealt with cold detached HK for a year a couple of days is nothing.  In the past the center did not hold because of his fear, doubt and grief over shadowed his love.  He feared the person he gave is all to was no longer the person he knew.   He knows he was wrong and knows that his actions caused more pain and hurt to everyone around him.  So he not going to make that same mistake twice.  He going to try and endure.  After is that what YK/HG told him to not give in.

After all the JE she knew could not close his heart and mind to her that was something she could do not something the JE would do.

Not being the determine dauntless  person he was with HG in the beginning  caused him to loose her.  He will not let that happen a second time.

JR also learned that when good men do nothing evil wins.   He tried ignore what was happening in the company het strived to life without it.  However he now sees the harm it done to everyone, employees, consumers and how power and blind ambition can corrupt.  So he can no longer go softly into the night.

He has do something. 

His father says HG is shooter but JE has seen her die.  That happened when he swallowed his pride and entrusted her safety to another man.  

JE knows he cannot sit out this fight for the sake of HG and the company.  He can no longer be passive he has seen that it only hurts everyone.

He knows he deserves the chastisement from HG, but this time he must endure it till the end.  He also knows that they will need to talk about SE.  He gave up on that in the past and look where it got them.

 

 

 

 

[trust71]

@chubbychub1966....@tambui......thank you for feeding us those still photos.....

i can wait for tonight ep.......it seem like DHK will continue punishing JE...

 @chubbychub1966.....your theory of them staying together in one hotel the writer give us hint whats come ahead?     @iamtaken..@Lmangla..@lenet..@mdj101..@oyeleyeolusina...@Iclarakl...@jadecloud...........even thought we have different pov of this drama....overall conclusion; we enjoying it....

[DelroyB]

I keep thinking how great an actress KHJ is.

HG and YK wear the same dress.  As HG she sexy confident and out to kill.   She wears it  to get the attention of the man she loved.  To get Lustful JE back.   

YK tries it on and it just look uncomfortable on her and her son-in-law laughs at her look.

HG power look vs YK2 (IDK what that dress was about thank you BS) .

She has nailed 3 different characters.

 

[-jade-]

Love it when pros help each other during work...JJH-ssi, thumbs up!

 

@trust71 Agree. Differences aside, IHAL is truly enjoyable. Writernim Bae is very good at creating debatable scenarios to build upon her theme and finale. BUT, debatable doesn't equate to seeing( or rather misreading) with skewed eyes or tinted shades.

Anyhow, a daebak script/visuals/acting/even styling!-love KHJ's styling as HK/aso. Love it all!

[mdj101]

@Lmangla --- I surely can estimate very closely how long it had been since Eun Sol"s death.   I figured it to be within 2 weeks of the one year anniversary. And I think that is why Jin Eon visited her memorial burial site that day. Because it is a year since they buried the child. But he probably goes there very often.

My calculations:

September 26, 2011 --- HK's "accident"

June 26, 2011 --- "Three Months Prior" and the 1st of the 9 episodes begins.

June 15, 2010 --- Death of Eun Sol.

[thegoldbug]

In my opinion you can't equally compare JE's relationship to HK whom he met in there twenties with all of her childhood baggage to overcome with BS's relationship with with YK2 (HK with post accident amnesia) because they simply didn't start with the same person.

HK in her twenties already has a lot of baggage: raised by a single mother, being harassed by creditors, trying to get through school (financially speaking) so that she can escape her poor past and become empowered.

YK2 after the accident without memories may have had the initial cold demeanor but she did not, at least consciously, have the baggage.  She didn't have the same barriers and was able to be more receptive to finding her warmer side. Would her reaction have been the same as HK with full memory...No, probably not...we can only speculate but I suspect it wold have been different

HK and JE had enough of a relationship to last close to 14 years (up to the death of the daughter or there about) where they had a relationship that worked for them both, they had a child and appeared to be happy.

BS is a decent person and he has had a positive impact on HK but he really didn't start with the same person, it's like comparing apples to oranges.

Yes, the relationship she has with BS is different the relationships we all have various people are all different and each of those relationships for us as individuals fulfills something for us. Though people on the outside looking in may say one is better than the other (and in some cases that may be true) they are looking at it with their experiences.

I also think it is somewhat unfair to compare JE to serial cheater that is also abusive.  He cheated on HK and then divorced her.  He went about it in a really cruel way because he was hurt and angry. I don't get the impression he was physically abusive and I most definitely don't thing the writer is trying to portray it that way.  I also don't think she thought he would be seen as such a polarizing character to the degree that he is.

Though I have not experienced divorce personally I do have family members that have and a couple that experienced true abuse.  I don't think that they would even think JE's behavior as portrayed is even in the same ballpark. 

[DelroyB]

4 hours ago, jadecloud said:

 

@lenet That's exactly how I understand that dorm scene too.  

Entering the military for a young man that JE was at that time, it's a very important phase of a young man's life. For 26 months, he was going to be shut out in some regimentary place, and so it's a no brainer that the last person he wants to see, and be seen, was his 'love-at-first-sight' HK. There was no impropriety in his behavior (and I'm not referring to him bribing the dorm master to open HK's door), esp in that scene. And with the response HK gave upon hearing what JE had to say, it was clear she was surprised and also sad, and hence the backhug and her reluctance in not being able to see him (or rather be seen/visited by him) for that long a period. HK was so buried in her studies, she was oblivious to everything that's happening outside of her books. 

In college days, JE's world was all about HK and her world, but HK's world was all about her pursuit of education, about getting out of the poverty hole she was in. JE was indeed tenacious even at that age, at that time period, in pursuing the love of his life. And, it was precisely that show of love and tenacity that, I believe, moved HK, and ingrained in her the belief that JE will do anything for her, that JE will turn around for her, just as HK told MH post-divorce.

 

in Ep 1 & 2 we get a peek in the dynamics of JE and HG relationship.   Where HG basically says that JE been the giver and the person has expressed love the most.  We also get foreshadowing that this couple will be in pain.

HG: Closing your lips, closing your ears, closing heart, That's me, not you, Choi Jin eon

After JE is lying down crying for ES.  HG comes out and offers him a drink like no biggie (Another fine time to drop the act)

JE tells her lets break up before we dislike and hurt each other.

HG comes close to say I always but stops herself.

HG:You did more than your share, I know, I know so from now on, I will love you to death

HG: You know my  time has come

HG say she will be the one to love more, to take care of things. 

We also see why they are in such a state.  JE cannot get past ES and HG after seeing JE crying out on the lawn for  ES. Comes out and say drink with your wife.  To JE she wife and mother but never admits it later she confirms it by saying she forgot ES.   She says she knows right now that JE hates  her but they will grow old like that. 

HG does want to move on with JE.  However JE needs her to have an honest dialogue about SE passing.    The caring sensitive person he is cannot understand HG utter lack of emotion and almost disdain of their child.  In fact they she said it was like was  the neighbors pet dog.

We see him breaking down at home and at crematorium.  We see him composed at work. The only one he can be vulnerable to is  HG.  

As was said by @jadecloud that fishbone was there. Until was out neither could move on.

HG fist confession to JE was never heard because he was behind a wall of grief.  The other thing is HG knew that her actions made JE hate her (HG says I know you hate me) but she thought he would get over it and they would grow old pitting each other.   I think that was her self delusional  hope in never having to deal with ES death. 

This when i believe it "dead Jim"   when one person wants out and the other believes a life together of pity   and hate is preferable to talking about your true feelings. Then to think of bring up child in that environment?  Yeah it is exhausting and painful. The truly sad part was both were talking and neither was listening. 

Je wanted to deal with ES.  HG wanted JE to tell her how to be like him.  She was going to try but she needed to know how.  The truly sad thing is HG is trying to clean a white suite with mud on her hands.   The relationship cannot be repaired without dealing with core issue.

Edited:  All the above was before the affair.

A final aside  JR is like a serpent whispering bad advice.   Would HG have focused on SR if not for JR words?   Remember in ep 1.  JR goes to the hotel to get TS.  she enjoyed ruining that marriage with FUD.  (fear uncertainty and doubt)

[-jade-]

6 hours ago, 12blbl said:

Hmm.. I vote @chubbychub1966 insightful post about the JE vs the doors (dormitory room door, icu door, hotel room door) LOL 

 

 Me too. That's insightfully hilarious @chubbychub1966 

JE and the door...  

 should we...

Spoiler

 

5 hours ago, iamtaken said:

Oh I also agree that there is a reason why JE and HG are across the hall from each other. I wish the two of them would do the deed and defuse the sexual tension they are leaving a thick trail of where ever they go. Then we can move on to solving the CYP issues which are complicated enough to require both of them to work together. Plus unless they learn to work together, they are not going to last this second time around either. Love is essential but not sufficient to hold 2 people together.

And @iamtaken I agree. Defuse....  ...THE TENSION...kkk  

 

[kikotaichou]

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