[Drama 2015] Make a Woman Cry 여자를 울려

[Guest ororomunroe]

@jadecloud

Wow, I'm shocked Why is MBC so mean? Dear MBC staffers lurking on Soompi, please give us English Subtitles!! I'm going to send you a PM so we can work things out chingu

[hrkharis]

@gerrytan8063

I would ask you about:

The Hwang family home

On episode 3, mama Hwang met her daughter in front of  a small hair salon. She looked sad when she realized that her daughter who limping must work until night.

Back at home, she asked Kyungsoo whether they should sell the house, bought a small hair salon for her daughter and then they both moved to the countryside.

On episode 6, mama Hwang could not sleep and then she opened the drawer and found a house rental contract.

Is it true that it is the house rental contract ?

If it is true, it means that they live in a rented house. Why does she think that she would sell it?

Whereas if the house is hers, perhaps she feel desperate and realized that peace was no longer in her home since his son had an affair with another woman.

 

Is Yoonseo biological child of Jinwoo?

I feel that during this time he did not get the attention and affection from his big family. His grandparents, uncle and aunt, even his cousins did not show closeness to him.

If he is Jinwoo son, I feel sorry for him. In this case I blame his father and his big family. Those who causes him to grow into a child who always makes trouble at school.

He becomes a child who likes violence, actually he calls for the attention from the closest people, especially his family.

His big family just pay attention to two other boys, as a potential successor to the throne of the family. After the death of his mother, he lost the affection and the attention.

I also do not know why he blames his father for the death of his mother. Is it possible that his father married his mother because of marriage arranged by his grandfather. Hoping that he could find a mother figure in a DI.

[Ldy Gmerm]

@gerrytan8063

Thanks for clearing that up.. I think he will be dismayed when DI leaves.. His reaction to seeing her walking and talking with the Teacher made him upset.

@jadecloud

HGC will realize how badly he treated his ex wife and how he burned his bridges later on in this drama. He is such a nasty piece of work that he and JH deserve one another. There is no reason for him to be so hateful to DI. I don't understand why they always forget to give respect to the spouse that has done nothing wrong. He will find out later that he ruined his own life. And like all of the nasty hubbies that did the dirt and wanted to be free for the new and shiny twit he will realize he made a big mistake!

@hrkharis

I saw some where they said that JinWoo's marriage was arranged by his father I believe. I too hope that DI will become a role model and mother figure to Yoonseo because this kid is a mass of anger, and resentment and hurt.

[-jade-]

​

@hrkharis According to the character description, Jin Woo married his late wife out of convenience as arranged by his parents. Not out of love. And the reason for his son's hatred and bad behavior is supposedly due to mom's death from a suicide, which he attributes to his dad's fault. Also, I don't think YS is not a bio kid of Jin Woo and his late wife cos he married his wife and they had a kid, that's YS. That was what Jin Woo told Duk In as well. But, we haven't seen the flashback, so there may be a twist somewhere....

As for the house... what I understand from chisubbed vid is....It seems what the mom found (in ep 6) was an old rental contract from the initial years when they were rentals. When mom found the old contract, she wondered to her daughter why an old document is still being kept and not thrown away. So I guess since those early years, they were rentals but have already purchased the house, and are owners now. @gerrytan8063 please confirm cos chisubs may differ somewhat from hangul script.

 

 

[-jade-]

Ep 10 - Awesome Script/Dialogue - What an SOB Kyung Chul is!

I'm sorry but I'm so glad the divorce is coming!  

(Btw,  just in case peeps are confused... since the beginning, I've adopted the use of names as per dramawiki, which are markedly different from @gerrytan8063's translation, Asianwiki and Hancinema.)

 

[-jade-]

Ep 10 - Awesome Script/Dialogue - Heartbreaking & Moving Moments of DI/JW

 

 

[gerrytan8063]

‌@jadecloud

In the characters, I am using "The Revised Romanisation of Korean or RR/MC2000 (국어의 로마자 표기법)

 

[-jade-]

‌@jadecloud

In the characters, I am using "The Revised Romanisation of Korean or RR/MC2000 (국어의 로마자 표기법)

 

​

@gerrytan8063

Ahh...I see. That means it is always better to follow hancinema or asianwiki since they seem to conform to similar references like yours.

Thanks for the tip

 

[gerrytan8063]

‌@hrkharis

If you require any clarification from me...please kindly provide me a timing of the scene of request....it will be tedious for me to scan the whole episode to locate the "said" scene....

From the image that was provided by @‌jadecloud..it is a Jeonse contract (전세 or 傳貰)

The Korean rental system differs in several ways from rental systems that are common in Europe or other Western countries in specifically, a higher demand for liquidity in the financial plan needs to be considered.

Jeonse (전세) is a rental system that is only found in Korea. In the Jeonse system, the tenancy begins with the initial security deposit of a single amount which is usually about 40% to 60% of the market value of the property. Due to the particular market situation within the private sector in early 2013, this Jeonse security deposit can even be as much as 80% of the current market value of a property.

Unlike in most of rental system known, the interest yield on the deposit will not be paid to the tenant, but the landlord can keep this as income. No additional monthly rent is paid. On expiry of the contract period, the original deposit will be refunded in full.

For us it may be easier to understand this private sector rental system if you know that, for a long time in Korea, it was impossible for individuals to purchase real estate with a bank mortgage. Only within the last two decades or so, did the Korean government begin to allow this. In the past, acceptable housing was scarce, therefore the landlords needed to use the tenants' Jeonse deposits to finance their property purchases.

Therefore the Hwangs might have bought over their Jeonse contract, when the landowner due to falling interest rates on savings & the currently sluggish market situation, in which many market participants expect declining real estate prices especially since the financial crisis in 2008..may have sold the house to them or the landowner couldn't return their original deposit & was force to sell the house to them as compensation

The other explanation that the Jeonse contract was not for the present premises that they are now residing but a former residence that they were under a Jeonse contract

@‌jadecloud

In regards to sleeping arrangement, Miss Hwang is sleeping in her mother (Mrs Hwang) room....Mrs Hwang had kept the Jeonse contract & wonder why is she still hoarding & yet had not thrown the old document away

The Jeonse contract was kept by her maybe as a reminder...how much a hefty sum that she need to fork out for a rented living premises

[hrkharis]

@Ldy Gmerm  and  @jadecloud  

Yes, I still believe that Yoonseo is the biological child of Jinwoo.

Which makes me wonder is why his big families had little contact with him. He and his father met their big families only during the memorial ceremony  of his uncle's death in the temple.

His big families just busy with their own affairs. Poor him.

It seems there are still many other things that we don't know about the background of the real story of this drama.

I'm still curious about, Why YS blamed his father for his mother's death a suicide?, What caused her mother's suicide?, Whether due to marriage without love and then JW ignored his wife and that makes her suicide?. When did it happen?, Whether when YS was a kid? If the incident happened a long time, why JW couldn't control his son? Whether his big families know their problems?, If JW didn't love her, why he had to endure so far? Is it because the divorce was taboo in the family Kang.

Oh, so many things on my mind.

But anyway, thank you for the explanation. Maybe I'm too critical because until now we have not got the English sub. Very frustrating to watch this Interesting drama without eng.sub.

I have to keep watching this drama, and there are good-hearted people such @gerrytan8063 and @jadecloud which will provide translations so that I can continue to understand this story.

[gerrytan8063]

‌@hrkharis

Just word of wariness..enthusiastic you may be....we may not able to response to each & every query that you asked

You just have to follow the flow of the drama & tried not too anticipate or be too analytical over details that had yet to happened or not mentioned

As for English sub...you are at the mercy of the kindness of the subbers...while you may lament...maybe you should tries to master to comprehend the Korean language...as most of us...are also in the same boat

[hrkharis]

@gerrytan8063 

Thank you for your awesome explanation. You really mastered in terms of history and culture of Korea.
A bit confusing to me with their systems, but each country has its own laws and regulations. It adds to my knowledge of home ownership in South Korea. 
Forgive me if I disturb you with no detailed information about the scene in the episode.
The next time will be more detailed. With pleasure we are waiting for your translation for the next episode. Jeongmal gamsahabnida 

 

[gerrytan8063]

‌@hrkharis

Further to the information on Korean property rental system

Jeonse (전세), Korea's unique property rental system, is based on a lump (hefty) sum deposit that a tenant pays to a landlord at the start of a rental contract. Landlords return the deposit to tenants with no interest when the contract expires, typically after two years....the landlord tend to keep the interest of the deposit that they had invested as profit...

But these days, Jeonse is now being replaced more & more by the Western system of monthly rent called Wolse (월세).....as a growing number of people are paying monthly rent for homes instead of paying jeonse amid an uncertain outlook for housing prices & it is natural that more & more landlords prefer monthly rents over jeonse amid a decline in the deposit interest rates offered by banks....Ultimately, monthly rent will replace the jeonse system.

[hrkharis]

@gerrytan8063 

Right, maybe I was too enthusiastic. Not on all my Korean drama being so.
It is possible because this drama starring my favorite actress, Kim Jung Eun..
It's been so long I waited for her to come back on the small screen.
When I found out that she took this drama as her first appearance after her hiatus. I highly anticipated ahead of time.

I was glad when she paired with Song Chang Ui. I've seen his drama once, "Dr. Frost", which was enough to make me survive seeing his drama to the end. Things that made me survive because besides he suited for the role as "Dr. Frost", also because its story very interesting about the world of detective, reminded me the story of Japanese comics, Detective Conan.

Hahaha   ..... I'm only able to understand a few words of Korean language, such as:
yeoja chingu, namja chingu, Naneun dangsin-eul saranghabnida, and some of the words that we often hear in Korean dramas.

[-jade-]

@hrkharis Yes, still much to be revealed about each of their backgrounds. And it's true about the lack of communication or concern from the Kang family towards YS. It's also noteworthy that the 3 cousins - the sick-home-bound Hyun Seo, the fatherly-love-deprived Min Seo and the school-thug-and-rebellious Yoon Seo - though not of vast age differences, do not hang out together. I don't remember seeing them out and about together, except for once, during that memorial event you mentioned. 

@Ldy Gmerm So right you are that Kyung Chul will regret his cheating and pressurizing ways that made Duk In leave him eventually. I am now looking forward to their divorce finalization whereby Duk In and Jin Woo can move forward in their relationship without further need for hesitation over morality or legality hassles. As for rebellious Yoon Seo,  I wonder why a rich chaebol fam would not have gotten him some professional student counseling or psychiatric counseling over his late mom's death and the misunderstanding (and resulting bad behavior) he has harbored since her death. Or perhaps they did but was of no help? Here too, I'm hoping Duk In will be of some good help to him in future. Seeing how tough and firm yet also nice and warm she is, Duk In should be able to affect Yoon Seo in some ways in the future.

@gerrytan8063 Thanks for the info on jeonse vs monthly rental. I've long been wondering why the korean property market is so unlike many other places. Some friends of mine who've there to work and live have lamented about the rental deposit and the system which is unfriendly towards property ownership. I'm glad to hear that it is changing and more koreans are able to afford their own property.

[gerrytan8063]

‌@jadecloud

More information on Jeonse

Jeonse is basically the tenants lend significant hefty sum of money to landlords in lieu of rent. (Jeonse is usually translated as "key money"), then the mechanics of how Jeonse works like this. In exchange for access to the property for contracted term which is usually two years, the tenants make a lump sum deposit to the landlord, based on a percentage of what it would cost to buy the property. The transaction is essentially a loan, with the tenant as the lender, the landlord as the borrower, & the house as the collateral.

Jeonse system had a deep roots in Korea, going back several hundred years to the Joseon Dynasty. But their popularity grew sharply in the 1960s & 70s. Amid the country’s rapid transformation into an urban, industrialised economy, Korea faced two large problems - Housing where rural Koreans arriving in cities, & financing economic activity. The Jeonse system was an elegant solution to both. On the one hand, it is a household rental system but in actual fact it is an informal lending scheme.

Jeonse system might have been something of a hint as a secret weapon powering Korea’s rapid economic development. The Korean savings rates surged from 1960s into the 1990s, is part & parcel on why the reason people socked away significant sums for Jeonse money. The system efficiently channelled that money to Korean landlords, many of whom were also small business owners & entrepreneurs, and happy to forgo monthly rent in favour of a lump sum to invest in their businesses. During the financial crisis of the 1990s, the system only became more entrenched as it allowed Koreans to bypass a deeply troubled banking system.

But in recent times (as of present trend), had somewhat change, household savings had collapse, the levels of household debt have moved sharply higher (it hit 163.8% in 2012, higher than the OECD average of 135%)...the household debts is now hurting the growth of Korea

The cause that in the wake of the Asian financial crisis, Korea’s banks started lending big, as it was gotten easier to borrow, Koreans have had less of an incentive to save, therefore that has completely transformed the Jeonse from a vehicle to build savings into something quite different. If you don’t have the Jeonse deposit you actually go & borrow it from the bank & that never use to happen before but it does now

Now Jeonse system is now a problem....Jeonse’s are not risk-free. They are in fact loans & there are times loans don’t get paid back. Now, Jeonse tenants have some protection. In fact, they are living in the collateral. If the landlord defaults, and doesn’t give them their money back, they are entitled to get it when the house is sold,

You may be wondering why any landlord would be willing to continue on a Jeonse system with tenants when they could potentially make more money by collecting monthly rent. Well the fact, the share of Korean apartments rented under Wolse (monthly payment) is increasing, though Jeonse contracts still account for a little over half. But many landlords simply don’t have the cash they need to pay back their tenants. In other words, they are stuck in the Jeonse system, because they need to find another Jeonse tenant, and use that deposit to pay off the previous occupant

[-jade-]

Ep 10 - Awesome Script/Dialogue - More Heartfelt & Moving Moments of DI/JW

I really like the character development of this OTP. DI is frank, fierce and brutally direct,  yet nice, warm and accommodating. While Jin Woo is forthright and clear in expressing his thoughts and feelings, while appearing to be gentle, hapless and meek.

 

[hrkharis]

@jadecloud said : 

@hrkharis Yes, still much to be revealed about each of their backgrounds. And it's true about the lack of communication or concern from the Kang family towards YS. It's also noteworthy that the 3 cousins - the sick-home-bound Hyun Seo, the fatherly-love-deprived Min Seo and the school-thug-and-rebellious Yoon Seo - though not of vast age differences, do not hang out together. I don't remember seeing them out and about together, except for once, during that memorial event you mentioned. 

 

That's why I have thought that he was not the biological son of JW. As we know anything can happen in the Korean drama .
Maybe formerly Kang Sr indebted to his acquaintance. To repay the kindness, he arranged a marriage between his son with the daughter of his acquaintance who at that moment she was pregnant from another man. Since then it was kept secret from the YS. He only knows that JW is his father.

Ah, maybe I am too much imagining and too much involved in this drama. Like what @ gerrytan8063 wrote that I just have to follow the storyline and do not need to analyze it too deeply.
Yes, let's keep watching this drama.

[gerrytan8063]

11회

Text preview to Episode 11

어머니 정신 차리세요!

KJW: Eomeonim...come to your sense (trying to regain consciousness)

For the preview, there is no revision or additional of scene that is given at the end clip of Episode 10

Preview to Episode 11 (a cut & paste)

On the train ride for Chuncheon, Gangwon-do, Kang Jin Woo peels a hard boiled egg for Jung Deok In then pass her the peeled boiled egg & a can of cider

Kang Jin Woo: Now I could really open my mouth naturally at such an ease, able to say such goose bump words in meeting you

The train station to take to Chuncheon (Gangwon-do) is from Seoul....is Cheongnyangni Station, it is a slow train (normal) not the KTX....Why do Korean eat hard boiled eggs in trains?....Boiled eggs on a train is a sort of Korean tradition. Korea operated its first train line in 1899, & train has been the dominant mode of long distance travel in Korea all the way until the late 1970s. Trains are extremely popular even today, as the high-speed KTX (traveling at 190 mph) covers Seoul to Busan under three hours. Riding a certain mode of transportation for a century would inevitably engender some associated habits. In case of a train, the habit is to have boiled eggs & a soda, it is either cola or lemon-lime known in Korea as 사이다 (saida) or cider. Why boiled eggs? Why not? It is a good source of protein especially when one considers the early days of train travel, boiled eggs make perfect sense as a snack on a moving train. They are delicious, filling, portable and not overly odorous, plus, eggs come in their own casing, but if someone brings an accompanied kimchi for their boiled eggs...that is another story

Kang Jin Hee brings Hwang Gyeong Cheol to her house as Chairman Kang & Kang household greets them

Chairman Kang: As an accountant, is there no requirement for you to have a wife anymore?

Hwang Gyeong Cheol clenching his fist as he takes in the "harassment" from the Kangs

Hwang Gyeong Cheol: You don't have to keep repeating 2-3 times on the same subject....I already understand & take your hint on the matter 

Choi Hong Ran is displeased with Hwang Gyeong Cheol attitude

Choi Hong Ran: This kind of person is really a despicable brat

Jung Deok In finds her mother in law had take an overdose of medication in the state of unconsciousness...as Hwang Gyeong Tae asked his elder brother Hwang Gyeong Soo to call for the ambulance

Hwang Gyeong Tae: Hyeong...call for 119 (ambulance services)...at once....quickly

Jung Deok In tries to call out to her mother in law to regain consciousness & she is near panic

Jung Deok In: Eomeonim....come to your sense...Eomeoni!....Emeonim!!!

Mother in law in a state of unconsciousness

[gerrytan8063]

In regards to Hwang Gyeong Ah (Hwang youngest daughter - the beautician) walking gait...it look like she had "club foot"....or medically know as CTEV - congenital talipes equinovarus....it could be cause that Mrs Hwang suffered from high blood sugar hyperglycemia mellitus during her pregnancy with her daughter