[Drama 2015] Hwajung 화정

[gerrytan8063]

‌@stclaus

"Thank you for taking the time to share with us. I was in Seoul this past April, I wish I had known then all that you've shared with us now... I would have loved to participate on the Royal Tea Ceremony"

I have check on the website, the Darye (다례, 茶禮)  at Jagyeongjeon Hall in Gyeongbokgung palace only start on Sunday, May 17th, 2015. it runs from May to June, mainly on weekends then another in September - October

Line 3. Gyeongbokgung Station. Exit 5

[zenya22]

@gerrytan8063, thank you for all your posts very informative but I find the post below somewhat ironic because it meant protect the throne is the ruler's first and primary duty, stay in power by paying tribute. For South Korea though, they have grown and still are growing by leaps and bounds. Great for them, beautiful country all the scenery in the drama and all your posts.

"Gwanghaegun’s policy of playing the two powers off of one another was effective in avoiding military losses, but violated the traditional Korean policy of "deference towards the greater power (Ming)", the orthodox & widely held to belief of most Koreans at the time. In February of 1623, Gwanghaegun was dethroned in a coup at the Korean court, & first confined to Ganghwa Island, and was later sent to Jeju Island, where he died in exile at the age of 67.

Gwanghaegun’s shift away from the equilibrium of the tributary system placed his throne in danger a threat that would undoubtedly act as a constant deterrent to future Joseon kings to repeat such mistakes, & hence to maintain the stability of the Joseon regime under the tributary system, for next 250 years."

[zenya22]

@gerrytan8063 LOL at below, thanks again for the culinary post but I find this so funny

"Japchae Minister: What...how could it be limp...this is japchae dish"

I call him the "Crispy Lettuce Minister" just because he made a big deal about washing his lettuce properly for the king LOL

[gerrytan8063]

This is unofficial & not accredited

Modern Historian Netizens in cyber sites on the Annals of Joseon Dynasty (appear in 2002) have given their recognition to Gwanghaegun for his achievement

Therefore they had bestowed Gwanghaegun with a temple name (묘호,廟號) of Hyejong (혜종,惠宗) & his posthumous official title is 혜종 경렬성평민무헌문대왕 (惠宗 景烈成平愍武獻文大王- Hyejong Gyeong Ryeol Seong Pyeong Min Mu Heon Mun Dae Wang)

For Queen Munseong of Ryu Clan, she had been bestowed as Queen Hyejang (혜장왕후,惠章) & her posthumous official title is 소온사헌혜장왕후 (昭溫思獻惠章王后 - So Eun Sa Heon Hyejang Wanghu)

The tomb had been upgrade to King's tomb with the given name Yeolneung (열릉,烈 陵)

Poetic Justice, perhaps

Neung class (릉,陵) denotes the tomb for Kings

[haruhi17]

@stclaus  Me too!!! i'm on the JaGyung and Hwa Yi ship too!!! LOL…just as I was on SN and Tal Tal ship in Empress Ki…LOL…always the ship that goes nowhere romantically…LOL

[gerrytan8063]

 

Just for information where the former site of  Hwa Gi Do Gam (Bureau of Arsenal/Firearms, 화기도감,火器都監) where Hwa Yi (Princess Jeongmyeong) & Hong Joo Won's place of occupation is in Seoul, Korea 

Line 3 Anguk Station Exit 1, walk about 100m, turn right, walks 430m towards the library entrance, the site (stone marker) is among the flower bed

If you are interest in these former sites, Seoul have erect stone marker at the former site as indicator, this is also how I found Royal Noble Consort Suk Bin of Choi clan private residence Inhyeongung Palace (이현궁,梨峴宮)

[Guest KangHae143]

Gong Myung practicing for his Role in 'Hwajung' 

 

 

Seems like we're going to see JakYung soon *-------------* 

I'm missing him already

[Guest miguel09]

ep 16 caps

[Hanyeoun]

The intrigue is killing me! Kang In Woo asked Hwa Yi if she's the princess. 

[stclaus]

Yes! JaGyung has to be back very soon, then @Lucel18 and I won't feel so lonely and can be delusional together riding our fantasy ship...hahaha (I was also riding the SN-TalTal ship)

End of Episode 16 was daebak!!! Will she tell? Or is she going to come up with another lame lie... please, she has to save her mother! She has to come out now!!!

Back then, was it common for the Ming Envoys to be fluent in Korean...? And who's "Later Jin" aren't they the Manchus/Qing, why do they call them "later Jin" it sounds funny in English

I have a beef, the translators at Dramafever keep on messing with my head, that relationship between the main lady cook and her assistant, I swear I hear the assistant calling her "Unnie", not "Omma", why do they translate it into Mom!!?? Am I hearing it wrong?

[MadraRua]

No I hear unnie too, and does later jin mean manchu?? 

Meanwhile like your suggestion @stclaus ...... Princess will end up loving  In Woo but marry Joo Won..... it's better than nothing!!! I also like the bodyguard and princess too... basically any ship that doesn't have Joo Won....  

[stclaus]

@MadraRua you're mean with poor Cheona admirer Joo Won... I'm ok with that HY-JW relationship, there aren't much sparks going on, but it may be due to acting... reason I suggested the "arranged/business marriage" route, it's because of the way the writer is playing out their relationship... at the beginning JW despised the King (he had a similar mentality as the princess), but now he's totally on his side; where the princess still hates the King and in order to revenge her brother and be on her mothers' side she may end up supporting the dethronement of GW and vote for Imjo... I don't see the princess going against her mother... so of course this will create a bridge between the two JW-HY... and also, fanwise, I think actor Joo Wan has more followers in Korea, and it seems that actor Kang Joon is getting a lot of criticism for his lacking as an actor... MBC may please the fandom and play that love line with In Woo even though princess will still marry JW... I don't know... I just want some looove 

[MadraRua]

Yes I'm mean... what can I say? There's zero chemistry between the pair, maybe they will step it up a gear in the following episodes. I'll be happy then, I want some lurve too lol 

I can't see her going against the mother either. In Woo is for Injo isn't he? So that'll be something else they have in common. It'll be hard for Joo Won to justify supporting Gwanghae, I mean especially when he finds out the previous King was murdered and the current king facilitated the cover up. You just know that ugly truth is coming out somewhere down the line. Another bone of contention between them.

[gerrytan8063]

‌@stclaus

"Back then, was it common for the Ming Envoys to be fluent in Korean...?"

Technically Ming Envoy should have interpreter or translator besides similar to the present Diplomatic protocol, but most Ming Envoy that were sent to Joseon, are of some Korean descent of or former human tribute from Korea to China

One of the demoralising problem with the Ming - Joseon was a continuation of the traffic of human tribute, inherited from the Yuan Dynasty, (the most famous Yuan Dynasty human tribute is Empress Ki, as for the Ming, although it is also said that the great Ming Emperor Yongle's birth mother is also Korean, Consort Kung 碽妃 or 甕妃, revered by Emperor Yongle by constructing Bao En temple - Temple of Repaid Gratitude in Nanjing in her memory). the Chinese Imperial court will request children for the palace, girls as harem & boys as eunuchs. Requisition numbers at a time is usually small but this tribute is what mattered & Korean's record had bear bitter witness to this bitterness with which the Korean look upon the matter. No other aspect of tributary relationship so clearly demonstrated the abjectness of the Korean submission to the Chinese Emperor or the contempt in which the Chinese held their loyal neighbour.

Usually interpreters furnished from both sides will assist in communication, although the envoy themselves will be skilled in writing (a common skill share between Korean & Chinese at the time), verbally they aren't too good, to rectify the matter, Joseon established the Bureau of Translation (Sayoguan) train as translators & interpreter

From the beginning in 1639 & until 1894, the Joseon court trained a corps of professional Korean-Manchu translators.

[gerrytan8063]

‌@stclaus

"And who's "Later Jin" aren't they the Manchus/Qing, why do they call them "later Jin" it sounds funny in English"

Technically the drama is now circa at 1618, the Manchu/Qing are still not known by that name yet, so historically they are correct

Nurhaci (1559-1626) is the chieftain (last) Jianzhou Jurchen (建州女真) & in 1616 ascended the throne as the First Khan as  Genggiyen (天命) of the "Later Jin" (后金国 - Jin Dynasty was a Jurchen Dynasty in 1115-1234)

It was in 1635, then Nurhaci son Hong Taiji (洪太極 1592-1643, some text refer him as Abaihai) change his nation name from Jurchen (女真) to Manchu (滿族) & in 1636 declare their dynasty as Qing, although Hong Taiji established the Qing Dynasty & the first Qing Emperor, but Nurhaci is posthumously awarded that imperial title as he is acknowledge as the founder of Qing (清) Dynasty. Meanwhile Hong Taiji is usually referred as the 2nd Emperor of the Qing.

Hong Taiji was the Qing Emperor who personally conquest Korean into submission in the 2 Manchu invasions

[zenya22]

‌@stclaus

One of the demoralising problem with the Ming - Joseon was a continuation of the traffic of human tribute, inherited from the Yuan Dynasty, (the most famous Yuan Dynasty human tribute is Empress Ki, as for the Ming, although it is also said that the great Ming Emperor Yongle's birth mother is also Korean, Consort Kung 碽妃 or 甕妃, revered by Emperor Yongle by constructing Bao En temple - Temple of Repaid Gratitude in Nanjing in her memory). the Chinese Imperial court will request children for the palace, girls as harem & boys as eunuchs. Requisition numbers at a time is usually small but this tribute is what mattered & Korean's record had bear bitter witness to this bitterness with which the Korean look upon the matter. No other aspect of tributary relationship so clearly demonstrated the abjectness of the Korean submission to the Chinese Emperor or the contempt in which the Chinese held their loyal neighbour.

Usually interpreters furnished from both sides will assist in communication, although the envoy themselves will be skilled in writing (a common skill share between Korean & Chinese at the time), verbally they aren't too good, to rectify the matter, Joseon established the Bureau of Translation (Sayoguan) train as translators & interpreter

From the beginning in 1639 & until 1894, the Joseon court trained a corps of professional Korean-Manchu translators.

​@gerrytan8063 as usual a very enlightening post regarding Joseon history. That is why I think this drama is special as it aspires to show some of the historic events such as the contemptible behavior of the Mings as they demand tribule within the storyline of the drama. I also like that they includes the story of Gwanghae making a covert deal with the Jin's to send troops just to show the Mings that they did their part. It was a political move to appease both the Mings and the Jins as mentioned in your post. For me it makes me understand more, the struggles of Gwanghae and his overwhelming desire to be free of being a vassal state of the Ming dynasty or any other dynasty for that matter. 

Come to think of it a lot of your post about historical events are being shownin the drama.I wonder why.... LOL

[gerrytan8063]

‌@zenya22

"Come to think of it a lot of your post about historical events are being shown in the drama.I wonder why"

It is because it is a historical timeline

Korean Dynasties throughout history preserve their longevity because in subscribing to suzerainty policy

[zenya22]

Officially I am Gwanghae shipper sink or sail LOL. If only I can go bump Gae Shi to move over. Anyway let see about Joo Won. He is a scholar who has deep insights regarding the political and economic climate of his country and supports the more progressive policies of his king. But dealing with women brings the rigid Confucian in him. He becomes conservative and prude as a dead wood. That makes him insensitive to Hwa Yi’s feelings or even her intentions and her body language. How can he send her to live in the men’s dormitory even if she had her own room? He thinks she is safer there than staying with him in his own house? Besides as @st.claus posted “he's totally on his side; where the princess still hates the King and in order to revenge her brother and be on her mothers' side she may end up supporting the dethronement of GW and vote for Imjo... I don't see the princess going against her mother... so of course this will create a bridge between the two JW-HY”.

Now leaves us with Ja Geung if he ever makes his way to Joseon. He does not have any Joseon attachments, except for Hwa Yi whom he cared about dearly. So yes Let him arrive in Jo Seon. Now as In Woo and Joo Won fight for her, Ja Geung will quietly steal her heart from them.   

 

[gerrytan8063]

Joseon item of tribute to China

Levy of Gold tribute to the lesser extent of silver tribute, was more than the Korean could supply. Korea produce very little gold & silver domestically, but tribute levy runs to hundred of ounces each year, substitute weren't allowed. Taejong resorted intensive searches of Korean houses for the precious metal in order to raise the required amount.

Later Sejong appeal without any success, to substitute with valuable Korean paper for the precious metal likewise failed, the Korean had to melted down Buddhist temple object to obtained the needed gold, Joseon envoy had to buy from Chinese merchant & even plans to buy them in Japan

Finally in 1429, tributes list for precious metal was revised to quantity of Ginseng, linen, woven mats & hemp cloth.

Hemp cloth fell on the laps of the Korean commoner women who had to weave cloth as a form of tax

[Misstwilightfan1416]

Here's Some Charts

I Think These Prove That Both the Princess And Joo-won Will Have Mutual Feelings! Poor In-woo He Will Only Have A One Sided Love:(