SailBeneteau
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Posts posted by SailBeneteau
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Thanks for posting the un-cut (or, so-called original) ending! It is a creative, if not poetic, extension of the story. But, it leaves an "open ending" also...
On the other hand, I'm satisfied with what viewers got to see officially (in Episode 62). My main reasons are: 1) the ending/Ep62 and the "voice over facts" matched historical accounts that were recorded for the main characters; 2) Episodes 58-62 really focused on HaoLan's character and aimed to enhance her. This goes hand-in-hand with what the executive producer wanted; 3) I personally believe the drama would suffer, if too much "resolution or closure" was inserted into the drama. The main and supporting characters were portrayed as complex people. They have to make difficult (and at times, very challenging or painful) decisions. This means "closures" are unlikely to happen. True in fiction, as well as in real life.
Footnote:
XiaoChun is a brilliant supporting character in this story! Her devotion to Prince Yi of Zhao was unwavering (though, a very difficult situation). She treated General Bai with the dignity of a physician who abided by her professional honor code. The ending implied that she would continue her life as a physician and her commitment to her life's work. Bravo!!!!!
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On 3/29/2019 at 12:37 PM, SailBeneteau said:
(Please allow me to jump in here and comment...)
This was a such a dreamy scene! Sending lanterns into the sky with poetic imageries.
I found the Chinese characters from Episode 45's lantern scene. Please see below:
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First lantern with yellow flowers -- This set comes from Chinese ancient poems 300 -- The general/paraphrase/translation meaning is the image of "scattered yellow floating hearts (a type of plant = 荇菜)" and " a beautiful gentle maiden and someone who admires and desires her."
参差荇菜，
左右流之。
窈窕淑女，
寤寐求之。
Second lantern with peach blossom drawings -- This set comes from a different poem from the Chinese ancient poems 300 -- The general/paraphrase/translation meaning is the image of "luscious vibrant peach blossoms which are metaphorically compared to a beautiful bride. She comes home and brings good things."
桃之夭夭，
灼灼其华。
之子于归，
宜其室家。
Third set (a group of lanterns) -- The rest here is from the drama's writers (my guess!) --- Each line here is a separate imagery:
1) Fu Ling = a rare herb/plant. 2) mountains with "strength". 3) low marsh land where more herbs are found. 4) clouds who can think/dream. 5) beautiful maiden from the west.
茯岺
山有棒
隰有苓
云谁之思
西方美人
Fourth set (more lanterns!): -- These are also from the drama's writers (my guess!) --- Each line here is a separate imagery:
1) a type of rare/legendary flower (?Name?). 2) a cage-like box (made of bamboo) that can float on the river. 3) a type of mallow/herb.
舜花
游笼
荍
(Ying Yi Ren tells Hao Lan): Literal meaning is not as interesting as the poetic metaphor and sentiments expressed (at least for me):
"to see you is like a gift for myself at last ----(they were apart for years and finally were reunited)".
视尔如荍
贻我握椒
(Hao Lan says to Ying Yi Ren): “ My King, you have shown your deep affections and feelings (for me). But I came empty handed today, without any physical gifts for you.”
王山情深...我两手空空
无椒可赠啊 !
(Ying Yi Ren pinches Hao Lan's cheeks.)
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My two cents!!
Perhaps the other people (= two people are tagged above here) can help with the translations. Please feel free to add to the comments.
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14 hours ago, ices23 said:
His son was emotionally unstable. He made decisions out of anger all the time. Maybe he was just too young on that time but I just don’t like him. I prefer the combination of Ying Yiren and Lu Buwei.
Agreed. The combination of Ying Yi Ren and Lu Bu Wei was really good as King and Head of Government. Even Empress Dowager Huayang commented in the end that they were a "good pair" (with sarcasm and bitterness, of course).
In defense for Ying Zheng (Yi Ren's son), he was really young at the time, and he was portrayed as a young king who lived many years (from birth) as a hostage. I sensed that he needed his mother/Dowager almost as a natural instinct and was probably more emotionally insecure than others of the same age. It is too bad we didn't get to see him become a mature ruler!
The ending reminded me that this drama centers around Hao Lan -- her life's stories. Wonder how this drama would be different, if they chose to tell the stories focusing on another character? Or, expanded the timeline?
Glad to hear that you enjoyed watching the drama as much as I did! :-)
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19 hours ago, macaronsandsakuratea said:
It is in regard to episode 45, at its end part or when Zichu took Hao Lan for a birthday surprise with those lovely lanterns. I understand that he was romantically speaking to her through odes. But the translations at around 40.24 mark were cut off or untranslated from the site in which I was watching it. If you could just give me a general idea about their conversation without translating word for word what they said to each other would already make my heart full of gratefulness and glee. Thank you so much! Hugs and Blessings!
(Please allow me to jump in here and comment...)
This was a such a dreamy scene! Sending lanterns into the sky with poetic imageries.
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7 hours ago, ices23 said:
First of all, why Lu Buwei got demoted by the King? As far as I am concerned, Lu Buwei helped the King to kill Lao Ai.
I know Bai Zhong said something to Lu Buwei before Lu Buwei got demoted by the King. But I don't get what he said because the english translation is quite off sometimes. I was suffering reading the english translation to be honest.
One more thing, before the end, Bai Zhong said to the King it was Haolan's 'plan' to get rid of Lu Buwei so that the King will have his own absolute power. Something like that. So, what is her 'plan' actually? To make Lu Buwei killed Lao Ai? If yes, how is killing Lao Ai will make Lu Buwei guilty since the King himself wanted Lao Ai to be killed.
Hi! (hand wave)
"spoilers alert"
Lu Buwei craved power. But, his vision for Qin was different from the young King.. While the King was still under age, Lu Bu Wei spread his power (and wealth) and completely ignored the King's desires. In other words, Lu Bu Wei treated the young King as his puppet. Lu Bu Wei wanted to get rid of Lao Ai for his own purposes only (power, influence, and status in court/government). But, he wanted to use this as a trophy to win the heart of the young King as he becomes of age....But, Lu Bu Wei's strategy failed (as you know from Episode 62). And, subsequently, Lu Bu Wei was demoted.
Bai Zhong (end scene in Episode 62) was telling the young King that 1) Hao Lan employed Bai Zhong to interfere (secretly) and to resolve this "young King vs Chancellor' conflict; 2) Lao Ai was put into a court position in order to balance the power in court and reduce Lu Bu Wei's power/influence; 3) the young King must rely on himself to accomplish his goals for his kingdom (in other words, he must be an independent ruler and can't rely on his mother/HaoLan/Queen Dowager to help him accomplish his goals and ambitions).
Helpful? I hope so! :-)
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11 hours ago, crispachu said:
I actually haven't seen this one - I'm in the middle of Zhao Yao (Legends) and HSDS and just slogged through the Destiny of White Snake so I haven't had time for this one yet
2018/2019 has been a great year for these dramas, I have to say!
How is this one for you so far? Do you know if this is a happy ending?
2018/2019 has been really good. I'm looking forward to watching several dramas! Hopefully, you will enjoy watching Legend of Hao Lan as much as I have
It is a very enjoyable. So good that it is on my "re-watch list" now. The production is very high quality (acting, music, costume, etc). After I finished the last episode (#62), I was satisfied with the ending. (No spoilers!)
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13 hours ago, crispachu said:
I have no idea! I'll ask a friend who grew up in China (I'm overseas Chinese).
Thanks for asking your friend!
Have you finished watching this drama? If so, how do you like it? I presume you don't need translations/subtitles to be added (some people have to wait for that, it seems...)
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Has anyone started to check if the Legend of Hao Lan is still available online? If so, please post your link.
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55 minutes ago, crispachu said:
General translation of that:
Due to strong reactions they are rolling back the ban. Starting April they can start broadcasting online. But they need online broadcast permissions before they do so.
Every month before the 15th, they have to notify local authorities what their broadcast plan is.
They have to control historical series quota - contemporary programming should make up 60% of broadcast content.
They need to get all kinds of permissions for doing anything - promotions, etc.
Thanks to you both!
Curious question: what's the underlying reason for all of "these" restrictions on period dramas? Aren't they really popular (just like period dramas in the US/EU, such as Downton Abbey)??
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Thanks for the info and update!!
So many c-drama stories might be postpone. Such sad news...
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On 3/7/2019 at 2:44 AM, dancingbee said:
Hello. I haven't watched this drama yet but was checking to see the comments about it.
I am very interested in what you wrote here especially #3.
3) what can HaoLan's life show or teach people of today about life's purpose, etc. And, in addition, what can the other main characters (YiRen and LBW) tell everyone about life and its journey...Would you mind summarizing in your own words what you learned from this show? I am curious to hear about it. Thank you in advance
Hello! And thanks for your note above. After watching the drama, I also read some notes from the production team on the characters. This drama has several complex hidden messages for the viewers. Each main and supporting character has their own lessons to share.
Without revealing the plot (no spoilers from me!!), here are some thoughts to share:
Hao Lan is portrayed as a strong independent woman who survives life's circumstances (= tragic, dangerous, political, etc). She strives to thrive in every situation and does her utmost. She is a person who lives life to its fullest in her own way. She has a strong sense of commitment (in the good sense and sometimes she is quite stubborn); she is very loyal to loved ones around her. The executive producer mentioned that a key characteristic of Hao Lan is that she cherishes life and herself (portrayed with the underlying message that "one cannot love others if one cannot love oneself"). This is somewhat of an over-simplification for me...I think HaoLan's "sense of commitment (to life, love, family, duty, country, etc)" and her "sense of responsibility (--always doing what she believes is the right thing to do or say)" is the highlight for me.
Lǚ Bu Wei is a smart, resourceful, extremely driven, and ambitious guy. Born into a family of merchants, he has ambitions to achieve more in life. His ultimate goal is to achieve power (political and social) and wealth. In doing so, he abandons personal pursuits (love, friendship, etc). And, I believe that Lǚ Bu Wei lives to regret his choices...
Ying Yi Ren is probably my favorite character in this story. Born into Qin's royalty, he is sent to the state of Zhao as a hostage-prince at an early age. Yi Ren is extremely intelligent and knowledgeable, and he is also a skillful politician and diplomat. The drama shows Yi Ren's transformation from hostage-prince to heir-apparent to the King of Qin. The story shows many sides of this character: intelligence, depth, wisdom, humility, love, kindness, anger, sadness, endurance, commitment to duty/country, shrewdness, diplomatic prowess, mission-driven philosophy, etc. [The actor, Mao Zi Jun, was excellent.] The actor commented about his character (paraphrase): "Think of Yi Ren as a calm bottomless lake."
--This is a high-quality production and a very unique story! Besides the main characters, there are memorable supporting roles and their stories also.
--Hope you will watch the drama and enjoy it as much as I have!!!
Come back to this forum/thread after you've watched the drama.
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Everyone interprets the scenes differently:
1) HL didn't answer LBW's question when she travelled south to save people and LBW b/c she was in the middle of various struggles in the imperial court (= she was experiencing pain and misunderstandings). Then, she found out in Episode 56 what was really happening.
2) HL was portrayed as a person who cherished past memories. So, if she saw someone after 8 yrs, there was probably mixed emotions at first. But, it does not mean anything else...
3) To oust LBW from his position as Chancellor is HL's way of honoring her son and the legacy of the throne. HL knew that as long as LBW was in power, her son (the King) would not be able to execute what Zheng'er wants to do. It was a clear conflict. In this case, HL decided to side with the King.
My two cents.
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On 2/24/2019 at 9:53 AM, SailBeneteau said:
This drama is a success, although some of the supporting roles ended too abruptly (ex: XiaoChun and others) and some of the scenes "wandered off" a bit (ex: Ep 59/60). The main story and its deeper meanings are clear for everyone in the audience to interpret in their own way.
More "stills" (images) of this drama are being released on Twitter. Follow hashtag #LegendOfHaoLan to check them out!
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20 hours ago, therewillbeddl said:
@SailBeneteau Actually thinking about it, I agree with you that >>> Ep 59-62. I’d like to forget how things ended because this drama could’ve been good if things were written differently after YR’s death. While I prefer scenes from Zhao because they were less depressing and dark compared to Qin, I thoroughly enjoyed some Qin scenes like Lord Anguo’s and Hua Yang’s.
Yes, agreed: the scenes with Lord Anguo and Huayang --earlier as "FuRen" and later as "Dowager"-- were quite good. Even the very last scene with Dowager Huayang was really memorable (Episode 61/62?) when she confessed her journey in life.
I miss scenes with XiaoChun, especially in the last episode (Ep 62). Supposedly, what happened to her?
Re: Episodes 59-62 (contains minor spoilers below)
The characters from the younger/next generation didn't really have enough time to develop or mature. Felt rushed and abrupt. But, I understand that the plot had to give an ending to Dowager Huayang and Dowager Xia's stories. Also, they had to find a way to oust LBW from his position/power.
(Need more Episodes?? Why stop at 62?)
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8 minutes ago, therewillbeddl said:
While the official weibo promoted HL-YR more, I feel like they intended to make HL-LBW the official ship. But then again, Yu Zheng tried to be fair with both, one with that boat scene art and the other posting a long message in regards to HL-YR and admitting she did love him.
People keep saying this drama has duo first male leads, but screentime wise, Nie Yuan seems like the male lead. Yet, Mao Zijun was always billed first, after WJY, while NY was always the 3rd billed.
@SailBeneteau I can’t say specifically on top of my head, but I think everyone agrees that any scenes from Zhao > Qin right?
While I'm not sure what Yu Zheng intended to do with the "boat scene art", my suspicion is that the production team has tried to please everyone in the audience who waited for a "happy ending for HaoLan-LBW" but didn't get that in the ending.
Yu Zheng has made it clear that the story is about HaoLan. However (during many/12+ episodes) I have felt strongly that the story is about Ying Yiren (partly due to the actor's excellent performance and interpretation of Yiren).
@therewillbeddl: Scenes from Zhao > Qin, you mean? Why?
For me, Zhao = Qin (or, Zhao scenes are just as memorable as the Qin ones). That's probably due to Ying Yiren's story line. The drama after Yiren's death can't measure up at all. There were many disappointing scenes around Episodes 59-62...until the very end when Zheng'er finally shows up to "beg" his mother to return to the palace and he is received by Bai General only.
p.s--The story's inserted historical credits --with a voice-over -- were memorable. Enjoyed both inserts. Quite dignified.
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What are your favorite or most memorable scenes with each main and/or supporting character? @therewillbeddl @insertusernamehere
(open discussion for anyone to jump in here!)
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Just finished Episode 62...
Personally, I can appreciate the reasons behind why the writers/producers veered away from Zhao Ji's historical accounts about her life (possibly, just rumors and slanders). I am glad this drama did not stick to "history", especially if there is some historical evidence (yet un-explained or unknown to the general public) that would argue against the slander.
In a statement, Yu Zheng (the executive producer) said that what attracted him to the script 6 years ago were:
1) a woman (Hao Lan/Zhao Ji) could endure years as a hostage in Zhao with a son, become the Consort to the King of Qin, and then the first officially recognized Dowager Empress (Qin Shi Huang named himself the first Emperorf a unified China).
2) questions regarding what she was like as a person to be able to survive and thrive under life's circumstances.
3) what can HaoLan's life show or teach people of today about life's purpose, etc. And, in addition, what can the other main characters (YiRen and LBW) tell everyone about life and its journey...
For >10 episodes, I wondered why Legend of Hao Lan was the title. Now, I understand why.
Yu Zheng said one of this friends/collegues who normally wouldn't watch his productions thought this is a good drama and she cautioned that people who like The Legend of Hao Lan may not like his other works, and vice versa. Yu Zheng said that's too bad, but he cannot let it stop him from making future productions he believes are good stories.
This drama is a success, although some of the supporting roles ended too abruptly (ex: XiaoChun and others) and some of the scenes "wandered off" a bit (ex: Ep 59/60). The main story and its deeper meanings are clear for everyone in the audience to interpret in their own way.
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3 hours ago, danielassny said:
. In the end, I agree that the boat scene doesn't need to make in into the final cut. I don't think that HL ever loved LBW at all. She isn't worth his love either.
Though I haven't reached the end-Episodes yet, I can't help but feel that HL isn't worthy of either YR or LBW...It is such a strange feeling towards the main female lead of the story...Something is missing about HL.
This drama's name/title is misleading...As an audience member, I think that the separate but intertwined stories of LBW's and YR's outweigh HL's and the two men drive the story. Thus, after YR's death, the story falls apart...
Yes, we agree on the important historical aspects (you described below).
2 hours ago, therewillbeddl said:I think the historical aspects were done decently well, at least the most important parts. For example, the dialogues between LBW and YR when they first met and when LBW tried to explain to his father why he wanted to help YR become king actually happened and made an impact in history after Qin. Also the ongoing Zhao-Qin tensions and battles
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1 hour ago, therewillbeddl said:
@SailBeneteau yes, ep 29 I think? When Zhao lost in the Changping battle and decided to execute YR as revenge.
@danielassny I had been looking forward to Ying Zheng’s portrayal but this is disappointing. Not sure if it’s the actor (the younger one was SO much better) or more the writing, but he is so awkward, I’m actually embarrassed for the historical Qin
Shihuang.
After Zhao Ji was imprisoned, many officials were killed by Qin Shihuang for begging to release her. One last person tried and succeeded by mentioning filial piety being an essential criteria to rule a unified country in the eyes of the public. They tried to insert this major event in a scene in the drama but it was poorly executed because of how Qin Shihuang was written there.
The ending was bizarre, it was going nowhere for everyone else after YR’s death but YR’s character was well portrayed as a whole so at least there’s that.
This drama had so much potential given the time period with 3 interesting characters that shaped the Qin empire, but the potential was not met. However, there were plenty of scenes that I found enjoyable and made this redeemable imo.
Did you enjoy watching the historical aspects (such as the Changping battle, Qin's expansion plans, etc)?
Although I haven't gotten past Episode 52 yet, the older Zheng'er has already replaced the "little one" (Agreed! The little Zheng'er was portrayed quite well.)
You guys are making me think that this drama without YR's character and story line falls apart.....Not too surprised perhaps. In a way, HL's voice was stronger in the first part of the story (Zhao) and, for the 2nd part of the story (including the 8yrs in hiding), there is something "missing" about Hao Lan....
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It is good to see some historically revelant scenes regarding Qin's territorial expansion plans and ministers' debates!
What's with General Bai? My pulse stopped for XiaoChun when prince Yi of Zhao died in her arms.
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5 hours ago, therewillbeddl said:
@SailBeneteau agree with your observations especially about Han Qionghua, I think she has one of the most pleasantly memorable scenes in the drama. As for Princess Ya, she is a lost cause. I feel like she might be unhinged. She is so mentally deranged that she cannot see how toxic her one sided “love” for YR is, despite numerous instances where she has suffered the consequences, where she should have learned her lesson. Everyone else tried to reason with her, she has been giving many chances, but she sacrificed everything precious to her (her country, her family, her dignity, her morals, her self) for the sake of something she knows damn well will never come true.
interesting recollection:
QiongHua laughingly said that "Princess Ya became insane b/c of her love".
Do you remember the scene? Episode?
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Just finished Episode 50! Will catch up with you all
Thanks for your patience.
Can we continue to discuss QiongHua vs. Princess Ya?
1) A memorable thing about QiongHua is her singing. When Zhao and Qin were in a state of war (Ep 26/27?), she would sing at night. One time XiaoChun commented on her singing (while HL was admiring QiongHua's singing) that she --a princess from Han--was the only person in Zhao who could sing when Qin/Zhao engaged in war. QiongHuang understood that, as a princess, she had to be gifted to the King of Zhao as a peace gesture. And, QiongHua remained a patriot in her own way! Another element of her singing was that her song was sweet but melancholy and, before she died, she explained to HaoLan that she missed her home/Han and brother (= foreshadowing her brother's character in Episode 50).
2) Another memorable thing about QiongHua was her comment to HaoLan: (just to paraphrase) "I would rather be a wildflower found in the mountains than become a peony in the palace garden." She was a free spirit.
3) In comparison, Princess Ya has/had no sense of her duty to Zhao and its citizens!
The Queen of Zhao warned her really early on that the marriage of a princess is a matter of the state (and not of personal preference alone). HaoLan fiercely criticized her at some point earlier also...(right? episode?) Who else?
4) To pursue "her so-called love for YR", princess Ya actually gave up everything (country, family, birth rights, etc) including her own sense of self. And eventually her emotions drove her to such an intense level of hatred that it probably became insanity....
From what happened in Episode 50, she can't possibly have a good ending...[Will she ever get punished for stealing someone else's life and identity to come to enter Qin?]
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2 hours ago, therewillbeddl said:
And IMO that’s what mattered when it comes to his character as a whole. He did not lose. Also interesting to note that during his first meeting with LBW, he was seen playing chess by himself in prison, a foreshadowing?
yes, that chess scene in prison is very memorable.
It is ironic that (while in Zhao) LBW used to make fun of HL for regularly playing chess with YR —the master chess player— AND for losing most games (she claimed that she won 1 in 3-5 of the games, but probably b/c YR let her win... teehee). LBW knew YR is an excellent chess player, but he didn’t realize that YR played “the game of life” and “the game of thrones”.
To echo the theme:
Dowager Huayang said that, in the palace, it was a “game of survival”.
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27 minutes ago, insertusernamehere said:
Lol then he achieved his goal by making you mad
I think this was precisely the point: he made her mad. Like LBW said during their last meeting, until the end, YR wanted to have it all. It's not noble idiocy, it's manipulation. I'm not defending him in any way, just want to clarify the difference between noble idiocy ("I did it for your own good", misguided but arguably with good intentions) vs. manipulation ("I did it so you will have to remember me forever", misguided but with knowingly bad intentions). I don't think anyone here disagrees with you on this point; where we differ is his action makes him an interesting character that I enjoyed watching, whereas his action makes you hate his character, which makes perfect sense as well (I'm pretty sure the writer didn't write him to be sympathetic, they almost present him as is, with all his dark sides.)
I love Hao Lan and Princess Ya's last chat, where HL admitted that both of her options in the past were crappy: LBW loves power too much and YR loves the throne/country too much. I appreciate that the writer never tries to make us believe that either of them is "the right one" for her. It's all about timing: LBW was the one for her when she needed a partner for revenge, and YR was the one for her when she needed to survive (and take revenge for LBW). Neither of them was right for her forever, and that's ok (with her and me!)
Just finished episode50 and will continue!
As suspected，Yiren is the most intriguing and complex character...He also knows HaoLan very well ( = better than she knows herself perhaps?? LOL).
Since you are ahead ( past episode 62?), does HaoLan figure out what she wants in life? She has what she *thought* she wanted: respect from others, live with dignity, etc. This is a missing link for me throughout the drama so far.
About XiaoChun and HL: their friendship is pure and has endured so much over the years. A rare gem.
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2018/2019 has been a great year for these dramas, I have to say! 
[Current Mainland WebDrama 2019] The Legend of Hao Lan / Beauty Hao Lan 皓镧传
in Mainland China
Posted
@bLaZe2
Hi (hand-wave)!
My personal interpretation is that an open-ended story line for XiaoChun says that she doesn't have "emotional closures" with BZ, mainly, because she doesn't need it and has moved passed the situation with BZ.