☆ 2 P M ★ Official Thread ☆

[Guest hanerdang]

i thought their heartbeat mv was off the hooooooook ! :] x

[Guest Bursillys]

I like the new album and music video! I look forward to their performances this week.

I really like Tired of Waiting and the boys look so manly and sexy in the MV.

[Guest Labacookie]

We all want Jay to return and we're waiting for him, but please do not belittle the other boys' efforts in the song and MV. Boycott or no boycott, I think the other boys (whom, may I remind you, have done absolutely nothing wrong) deserve this much respect from the fans. Let's try not to hurt the 6 of them too much while we await Jay's return.

Thank you so very much for this comment. I had wanted to say something to this affect, but couldn't find the words. But I'm glad you could. There are aspects I don't like, but I do very much appreciate the other boys hard work, and I have all the confidence in the world they will put on a great performance. Yes, even without Jay...because that's what professionals do. I think some people have taken the "7-1=0" too literally, in that the other boys, their talents, and their efforts are now non-existent, and it hurts. Yes, Jay is missed, he's the leader and he's a vital part of the group. But there are still 6 other people who are very much apart of that group and working their butts off to keep the group alive and going. Is it really fair to them to let one's longing for someone override their best efforts?

It is possible to support the remaining members and hope that Jay returns at the same time without being spiteful and insensitive to the boys and fans that support them.

Re JYP's statement: JYP is really starting to get on my nerves with this ambiguity. First there's a statement that Jay will be back, but makes it seem like it's not %100 possible he'll be back in 2pm. Now he's saying he would definitely be back in 2pm...IF he comes back. :/

*sigh*

How hard is it to call Jay, get a definite answer, and make a definite statement. I'd settle for a timeline at this point. :/

[Guest htruc]

Their MV was great!!!! I loved the all (okay maybe most) of the scenes - the one with the water ceiling like they are in a tank is really neat. The main one where they were underground with all those diagonal columns and the light shining in was the best. The only set I didn't really like was the white/black one - it (camera) was from the same angle all the time, didn't get to see the other members faces/expressions. I don't know something's lacking here. But I think I like their clothes most for that scene.

Honestly, I think some (or maybe all) of them should get a haircut. O_o At first when Khun was lying down, I thought his hair was awesome, it looked good. But then, Khun, Junho and Wooyoung (?), all had little topknots or whatever they are called. Junsu's hair looked kind of normal to me.

I love the "heartbeat" part choreography. Some of the other parts are kind of awkward... Are they really going to be crawling on stage? Some of the dance moves reminds me of MC Mong's Horror Show. I couldn't help but see such similar moves. But I'm looking forward to see the full choreography.

Really looking forward to watching them perform on stage.

Edit: Does anyone know where I can find this clip on Youtube? The info is from Wikipedia. Before debuting in 2PM, Wooyoung filled in as a dancer partner with Wonder Girl Yoobin when TOP from Big Bang fainted the day before the special performance with the Wonder Girls during the 2007 MBC Music Awards.

[Guest nadeiya]

the MV was great and unique and so dark

BUT everytime Wooyoung's part comes up, he totally reminds me of when he did a photoshoot where he looked like TOSHIO with the pale face LOL

[asth]

Thank you so very much for this comment. I had wanted to say something to this affect, but couldn't find the words. But I'm glad you could. There are aspects I don't like, but I do very much appreciate the other boys hard work, and I have all the confidence in the world they will put on a great performance. Yes, even without Jay...because that's what professionals do. I think some people have taken the "7-1=0" too literally, in that the other boys, their talents, and their efforts are now non-existent, and it hurts. Yes, Jay is missed, he's the leader and he's a vital part of the group. But there are still 6 other people who are very much apart of that group and working their butts off to keep the group alive and going. Is it really fair to them to let one's longing for someone override their best efforts?

It is possible to support the remaining members and hope that Jay returns at the same time without being spiteful and insensitive to the boys and fans that support them.

Please : What if I don't care of the new MV?

This is my choice, respect it.

What I was waiting for is only what JYP wanted to say about Jaebeom. That's all, for now I don't care of the new MV. Did I say that I don't care of the remaining boys? Srly... Some poeple show that they don't care of Jaebeom, it changes nothing in 2PM as if he never existed during one year, it hurts but I say nothing... This is what they think that's all.

I'm finally glad to see they are successful. For ALL poeple who work for this & NOT only the 6 PM (that's why it hurts mm?).

-__-

& sorry for my bad grammar.

[dothat36]

Love the mv and the song. I think its such a genius work, I can't stop watching and listening.

The boys made me proud again, and I'm happy to see them evolve as well.

My favorite part has to be Chansung's and Junho parts....oh my gah...But I can see they all

sang it like JYP would sing a song. I find that quite interesting.

I already pre-ordered my album, I can't wait for it to come!!

I think no matter how many statements JYP makes, people will never be content. He said, if Jaebum

wants to come back, he will be back as a 2PM member. Isn't this the answer Hottest have been waiting

for? I though Hottest said they were going to wait, but they just wanted to know that he still had his place on

the team? Well, JYP says he does. So what seems to be the problem ?

[Guest hypocrite]

so far those people who don't like the song have similar comments that

- background music is too soft

- rapping part feels off

As for the background music, I think it is expected that people will not like it because it is very opposite to the trend nowadays.

Let's compare it to other hit songs recently:

Ring Ding Dong from Shinee has very strong beats that resemble African folk music.

Muzik by 4Minute is the load of autotunes

GDragon's Heartbreaker and Breathe rely a lot on powerful techno beats.

Even 2PM's own songs Tired of waiting, which is on top of various online chart right now, is overloaded with autotune.

What is the conclusion? The Korean public right now favors heavily manufactured songs with complicated beats and autotunes. JYP is obviously ignoring the taste of the public and chose Heartbeat over the more popular Tired of Waiting as the title song. I think he wants to say something through this choice of title song. It's like a statement against the kind of music that is popular right now. I feel that unlike the other companies, JYPE tends to experiment a lot more boldly, and that is why its artists' music is always trendsetting.

Example:

GOD: meaningful ballads (dance pop was popular at that time)

Park Ji Yoon: unique dance pop (when ballads were dominating the pop scene)

Rain: American R&B/ dance pop (at that time no one has done this genre)

Wondergirls: catchy bubblegum pop (set the stone for the invasion of girl bands)

2PM: funky pop (10 out of 10) -- the type that has been extinct since NRG

beastly trendy dance tunes (Again and Again/ I hate you)

And now they came back with a totally different genre: soft background music, soft beats, whispering-like rapping, slower melodies.

JYPE's artists have always captured not only their fans but the public in general.

No one in Korea don't remember the touching song "Ja jang myeon" by GOD

Everybody in Korea imitates Park Ji Yoon's "Coming of age ceremony" on variety shows all the time'

Rain:.. no need to talk more about the world star. His song "Bad guy" has been on Mnet Heroes segment for way too many times

Wondergirls: do I even need to tell you how popular they are?

2PM: beast beast beast. Everyone now wants to be beastly.

I have to applaud JYP for always bringing something new to the Kpop world full of trend-followings.

OMG...I completely agree with U!

Better not underestimate JYP, he's the Anna Wintour of KPop.

and see, the statement that we've been waiting for so long was finally here...

HAVE FAITH! I believe Jay will back..till then do support the 6 members, they've showed us a great teamwork and ability to stand after obstacles. They deserve our supports.

[Guest everybodyshout]

Please : What if I don't care of the new MV?

This is my choice, respect it.

What I was waiting for is only what JYP wanted to say about Jaebeom. That's all, for now I don't care of the new MV. Did I say that I don't care of the remaining boys? Srly... Some poeple show that they don't care of Jaebeom, it changes nothing in 2PM, it hurts but I say nothing... This is what they think that's all.

I'm finally glad to see they are successful. For ALL poeple who work for this & NOT only the 6 PM (that's why it hurts mm?).

-__-

& sorry for my bad grammar.

dear asth... i think jyp has his own difficulties as well. (his POV: http://sookyeong.wordpress.com/2009/11/11/...return-as-2pm/) we are not him. we don't understand what he's thinking, and we have no idea what he has communicated to jaebeom. did he fly to seattle for superficial reasons, or to genuinely comfort jaebeom? we will never know. people continuously made jyp out to be the bad guy in this story, but i think we have no right to judge him as such.

jyp deserves to be respected for grooming these boys into where they are today. i understand that many are angry at him for his lack of clear communication to the public. but such decisions are hard to make, and people are sensitive to what he says. he knows that netizens will criticise him no matter what he says, so why bother making a statement that will not appease everyone?

in a matter of time, jaebeom will be back. jyp is not that evil as people make him out to be. he is human, just like jay. he understands that jay must be rightfully given back this opportunity to shine. i'm just offering a separate point of view. (though i'm not jyp heh)

i think we need to be patient. there is no use commanding and forcing jyp to satisfy our demands like we're spoilt children demanding for milk bottles. (bad analogy i know)

right now, let's appreciate 2pm as true artists. they're truly shining right now and even without jay physically with them, 2pm can feel his presence whatever they do and jay will always hold a special place in their heart. i shudder at the thought of making the MV without jay, it must be so hard.

go 2pm you are so loved!

[Guest chimeraspunk]

Okay last post!

You guys have to go check out the real vid from the show.

I can't fully understand, but I'm crying. I don't know how good an actor JYP is but I really feel his sincerity. And I feel like he really understands Jay.

And I'm beginning to understand why Jay is beating himself over this. Because he's a singer and debuted in Korea. Because his primary fanbase is korean. His colleagues are korean. His instructors, teachers, past classmates are korean. And his past words sounded insulting to these people and hurt them. People who didnt know what he went through thought differently of him from then on.

But I don't think it was so much that he expressed this when he was 18. But that the 21 year old him didnt remove those comments when he debuted. And that until the exposure happened, he didnt fully understand that it could be hurtful.

If you guys think I'm being overly critical, its cause I'm trying to understand it from Jay's perspective. I couldn't understand why he felt so deeply sorry. But I guess even this little things start mattering - like not removing those past entries.

But I like how he responsibly handled it. I don't think he escaped or ran away. He just left to reflect and he didnt wanna hold back the rest. It was something he had to do to understand what just happened then and grow from it.

Gosh I miss jay so much. Hope he's doing good. And Im sure he will come back, cos the Jay I know, as Junho said it, never gives up.

[Guest ephedrinity]

Okay last post!

You guys have to go check out the real vid from the show.

I can't fully understand, but I'm crying. I don't know how good an actor JYP is but I really feel his sincerity. And I feel like he really understands Jay.

And I'm beginning to understand why Jay is beating himself over this. Because he's a singer and debuted in Korea. Because his primary fanbase is korean. His colleagues are korean. His instructors, teachers, past classmates are korean. And his past words sounded insulting to these people and hurt them. People who didnt know what he went through thought differently of him from then on.

But I don't think it was so much that he expressed this when he was 18. But that the 21 year old him didnt remove those comments when he debuted. And that until the exposure happened, he didnt fully understand that it could be hurtful.

If you guys think I'm being overly critical, its cause I'm trying to understand it from Jay's perspective. I couldn't understand why he felt so deeply sorry. But I guess even this little things start mattering - like not removing those past entries.

But I like how he responsibly handled it. I don't think he escaped or ran away. He just left to reflect and he didnt wanna hold back the rest. It was something he had to do to understand what just happened then and grow from it.

Gosh I miss jay so much. Hope he's doing good. And Im sure he will come back, cos the Jay I know, as Junho said it, never gives up.

:-')

[Guest chopper!]

dear asth... i think jyp has his own difficulties as well. (his POV: http://sookyeong.wordpress.com/2009/11/11/...return-as-2pm/) we are not him. we don't understand what he's thinking, and we have no idea what he has communicated to jaebeom. did he fly to seattle for superficial reasons, or to genuinely comfort jaebeom? we will never know. people continuously made jyp out to be the bad guy in this story, but i think we have no right to judge him as such.

jyp deserves to be respected for grooming these boys into where they are today. i understand that many are angry at him for his lack of clear communication to the public. but such decisions are hard to make, and people are sensitive to what he says. he knows that netizens will criticise him no matter what he says, so why bother making a statement that will not appease everyone?

in a matter of time, jaebeom will be back. jyp is not that evil as people make him out to be. he is human, just like jay. he understands that jay must be rightfully given back this opportunity to shine. i'm just offering a separate point of view. (though i'm not jyp heh)

i think we need to be patient. there is no use commanding and forcing jyp to satisfy our demands like we're spoilt children demanding for milk bottles. (bad analogy i know)

right now, let's appreciate 2pm as true artists. they're truly shining right now and even without jay physically with them, 2pm can feel his presence whatever they do and jay will always hold a special place in their heart. i shudder at the thought of making the MV without jay, it must be so hard.

go 2pm you are so loved!

i agree. i don't know why fans start to have the blame game on JYP. but i understand that at that time i was also angry, but looking back, JYP didn't do anything wrong.

he was shocked and confused just like the rest of the boys when jay left. it's better for him to stay quiet and hidden than to start up something trobulesome with a statement again. everything he says will just be burned by the hatred of fans. he was a very busy man, thinking of jay, rest of the boys, their album and all twisted with wonder girls US debut. it's all hectic and i believe he couldn't do anything or say anything. i don't think he is the mad genius everyone claims him to be. if he was wouldn't wonder girls have been number 1 or something quickly in the US.

i know he cared for jay and knew him more than any one of us. so i believe in JYP's words. he could never say anything two months ago. fans would have ripped him up for that. no one is to blame. all that's left is jay's decision on coming back, and no 'if's' b/c i know he does, but not at this moment in time. probably next promotion..

[skelly]

It was very soothing to hear assurances from JYP that there is a place reserved for Jay in 2pm. I wish he could have been more definite about when that is going to happen, if it is going to happen, but then this is JYP who excels at not giving a straight answer.

But it is OK, I am content to wait. I am glad that the current releases by the 6-who-are-currently-in-Korea are so popular, because that means I don't have to support them. I think they are doing a great job, and it is obvious they are working very hard and are overcoming their trials and tribulations admirably, but as far as I am concerned they are still, as a group, missing something - an energy, tension, joie de vivre, the sharpness and forward drive they got from Jay. That's my opinion - that they were a better group with Jay.

As far as I can see, they are getting plenty of love and interest, so I can wait for Jay without worrying that the rest of the group are suffering from a lack of attention or lack of cash. I thank the other fans - and I happily wait for Jay, for when he returns there will be something that I feel is worth buying.

[Guest Labacookie]

My third and final post for the day

asth, my comment was not directed at YOU specifically, or even at all. I did not read the comment that the poster i quoted was responding to. I replied to that comment because I felt that the person said what I was feeling in regards to certain comments made. After your little conflict started, I even contemplated adding an edit to say so, but figured that my feelings were clear, but I guess not. :/

Bottom line, you're being paranoid. I didn't write that with YOU in mind, but certain comments and ideas that I feel are detrimental to the progress and achievements of the other boys.

jyp deserves to be respected for grooming these boys into where they are today. i understand that many are angry at him for his lack of clear communication to the public. but such decisions are hard to make, and people are sensitive to what he says. he knows that netizens will criticise him no matter what he says, so why bother making a statement that will not appease everyone?

^

^

Yeah. I am upset at the ambiguity, but I understand the likely reason. People just want someone to blame. Ironically you have more fans blaming JYP for this than the netizens that started this whole thing in the first place. People are acting like all that has to happen is JYP magically stops everything and produces Jay and everything will be right with the world. As nice as that sounds, things don't work that way.

And beating up JYP (and to a lesser extend the other 2pm members) isn't going to make this happen. I want Jay back. I doubt there is a real fan anywhere that doesn't, but it's getting ridiculous. People are acting like JYP forced Jay out of the group, kicked him out of the company, and that Jay is the victim of JYP, and not, oh, a netizen who released very damaging screencaps in regards to Jay from a few yeas ago.

I honestly think that certain fans have lost touch, with the fandom and with reality. They have become blinded by their despair and their sadness that they can no longer tell reality from fantasy, fellow fan and Hottest from enemy, and rather than simply hope for the best, and hold onto each other, and support the remaining members, they've created a war, a non-existent conspiracy where everything is ambiguous, and as if they are knights in armor rescuing Jay, a damsel in distress, from JYP, the evil dragon. They think that if they can run through the dragon with their sword, Jay will be saved and we'll all live happily ever after.

...I just don't understand this. I try, and I try, but this makes no freaking sense and I feel like I have to keep backtracking, because the events that lead up to this, absolutely do not match the response and this fandom is getting to be scary and creepy. :|

agree. i don't know why fans start to have the blame game on JYP. but i understand that at that time i was also angry, but looking back, JYP didn't do anything wrong.

he was shocked and confused just like the rest of the boys when jay left. it's better for him to stay quiet and hidden than to start up something trobulesome with a statement again. everything he says will just be burned by the hatred of fans. he was a very busy man, thinking of jay, rest of the boys, their album and all twisted with wonder girls US debut. it's all hectic and i believe he couldn't do anything or say anything. i don't think he is the mad genius everyone claims him to be. if he was wouldn't wonder girls have been number 1 or something quickly in the US.

i know he cared for jay and knew him more than any one of us. so i believe in JYP's words. he could never say anything two months ago. fans would have ripped him up for that. no one is to blame. all that's left is jay's decision on coming back, and no 'if's' b/c i know he does, but not at this moment in time. probably next promotion..

This is pretty much what I feel. I think it's gotten to a point where fans are just angry and want to blame JYP and lash out at him because they are hurt and feel helpless and don't know what else to do.

I remember watching the footage where Jay was leaving and how helpless I felt for him and for fans. It was really heartbreaking circumstances.

I think the activism spawned out of this helplessness and anguish. Unfortunately, I feel it's becoming counter-productive.

[Guest DongBangShiDae]

o dam i guess im a bit late

but omg i love Heartbeat mv!!!

the dance is so good and dam i just love the setup

[Guest marshed]

Please : What if I don't care of the new MV?

This is my choice, respect it.

What I was waiting for is only what JYP wanted to say about Jaebeom. That's all, for now I don't care of the new MV. Did I say that I don't care of the remaining boys? Srly... Some poeple show that they don't care of Jaebeom, it changes nothing in 2PM as if he never existed during one year, it hurts but I say nothing... This is what they think that's all.

I'm finally glad to see they are successful. For ALL poeple who work for this & NOT only the 6 PM (that's why it hurts mm?).

-__-

& sorry for my bad grammar.

Asth> As Labacookie has mentioned, which I thought so too, her comments were not directed at you but a general thought on the current situation. There are people who refuse to acknowledge the effort put in by the other 6 for the new album or MV etc. just because Jay was not a part of it. This acknowledgment of their efforts is a separate issue from the boycott of their album (which is in such a gray area that there's no definite right or wrong about this). It's just that given that the other boys have been working to put this together amidst the whole saga without their leader, we can imagine how much more draining and painful it has been for them so all I really hope is for people to be able to see this and not put them down just for the sake of doing so. Disliking the album or MV because they do not appeal to your music preferences is essentially different from being spitefully indifferent to their efforts (and even existence altogether).

So, don't start taking things the wrong way since your intentions were not that to begin with. I see where you're coming from, your decision to not care about the MV is also being respected so breathe, relax and let's move on. Although may I suggest that you ignore people who feel that Jay's departure has ZERO impact on 2PM as a group, because it's not worth anyone's time to debate with these people. You will be happier, trust me.

[Guest donnie_d]

finally a word form JYP himself, all i can say is finally a spark of hope, and ill take it at facevalue.

if Jay comes back (if is the operative word) or not then so be it...

what is important now is we support whatever his decision is and continue to support our 2PM!!!

so that if Jay comesback..they are still on top of their game...

competition is really rising in the world of KPOP nowadays and we shouldnt let 2PM to be in the shadows...

after all they are the hottest group 2day!

[Guest qweqwe]

Yeah. I am upset at the ambiguity, but I understand the likely reason. People just want someone to blame. Ironically you have more fans blaming JYP for this than the netizens that started this whole thing in the first place. People are acting like all that has to happen is JYP magically stops everything and produces Jay and everything will be right with the world. As nice as that sounds, things don't work that way.

And beating up JYP (and to a lesser extend the other 2pm members) isn't going to make this happen. I want Jay back. I doubt there is a real fan anywhere that doesn't, but it's getting ridiculous. People are acting like JYP forced Jay out of the group, kicked him out of the company, and that Jay is the victim of JYP, and not, oh, a netizen who released very damaging screencaps in regards to Jay from a few yeas ago.

I honestly think that certain fans have lost touch, with the fandom and with reality. They have become blinded by their despair and their sadness that they can no longer tell reality from fantasy, fellow fan and Hottest from enemy, and rather than simply hope for the best, and hold onto each other, and support the remaining members, they've created a war, a non-existent conspiracy where everything is ambiguous, and as if they are knights in armor rescuing Jay, a damsel in distress, from JYP, the evil dragon. They think that if they can run through the dragon with their sword, Jay will be saved and we'll all live happily ever after.

...I just don't understand this. I try, and I try, but this makes no freaking sense and I feel like I have to keep backtracking, because the events that lead up to this, absolutely do not match the response and this fandom is getting to be scary and creepy. :|

Labacookie, I agree with you on the above points said.. I think many Khottests are so engrossed with trying to "rescue" Jay from the evil clutches of JYP or more specifically JYPE. I have nothing against the idea of asking JAY to be brought back, of course.. And I salute them for their endurance & perseverance. But at times, i am also perplexed as to why are all the daggers and arrows going towards JYP / JYPE? I mean, it was that stupid netizen/s who splashed the nonsense on the net in the first instance.

And seriously, what actually had transpired between Jay, JYP, JYPE and the other 2PM boys are for them to know only.. No one else knows the details. And it might very well NOT be their wishes that every decisions and every matter to be announced to the public.. What goes behind closed doors are not for us to demand to know.

Anyway, hope with the latest statement from JYP, KHottests will be appeased.. But i can foresee that there will be questions again about his sincerity and also demanding the timeline. But if i remember clearly, what KHottests are asking is for confirmation that whenever Jay is feeling ready again, he will be allowed to return to 2PM and not as solo act. JYP had promised that now.. As long as he keeps his promise, we will see Jay again once he is ready to take the stage. And i will be looking forward to THAT DAY!

[Guest haze1nut]

i love the vid

i love 2pm but i miss jay even more!

i feel like the song is missing the color of his voice

anyone else think that half of chansung's rap solo in the beginning is too long and that part of that should've been split with Jay?

let's play a game

let's play

which part used to be Jays?

the beginning rap was probably split two ways

2:38 junho's part - something makes me think this should've been jay's

at 3:01 when woo and junsu work the song, it really reminds me of jay's and junsu's duo part in I Hate You

Junsu's and junho's parts seem longer? anyways, i'm not saying Junsu doesn't deserve these parts bc I love him (he looked so hot at 1:54)! but I feel like both junho and junsu have longer parts?

gosh, maybe i'm just bitter bc my favorite boy isn't there but I swear I feel a certain emptiness to this song bc of his absence..i can't help but think, oh this is where jay's part could've been or jay could've danced that ending better than woo.......ugh, i sound really ugly but I really miss Jay

anyone else think that naming their album 1:59 is sorta weird? like the company is trying to turn the negative publicity into profit?

anyways, JYP says Jay might be coming back and if it is it'll be with 2pm (source golden fishery) but still...that could be a looooooong time. will he forgotten by then? I know I won't forget him

anyways, cool idea scenario. wouldn't it be awesome if they performed this live and Jay comes in at the end doing woo's ending dance?

[Guest obession2pm]

I loved it, personally i love the video, i thought it was very different and entertaining !