[Drama 2015-2016] Six Flying Dragons 육룡이 나르샤

[AlexandraReid]

8 hours ago, kirak said:

is the writer going to change their role and partnership up to 3o ep?

I see there no arrow btw bang won and BY..and JDJ and  YH...i really like the part where they change btw YH and BJ... i hope they will end up together at the end...

As long as i want them to be tghtr in this SFD drama, Guess it wont happen

As i remembered some spoiler here saying, that writer will make a romance scene of BY-BW, Is that scene already happen??? Am i missed any scene in 30 Eps? 

 

Not sure if this BTS posted here; these two seems pretty close on set 

Spoiler

 

 

 

 

 

[zenya22]

Boy oh boy the preview. I knew CY will have something up her sleeve. I am sure she heard enough from the JDJ/JMJ convo to make a plan of her next move since she is being pressured to find a replacement for JMJ if the Nameless can't use him as a sword like they used Hong Ryun. In the preview CY suggested that they use BW as their sword. I think the Nameless now know that the children of Yeon Hyang are alive and they are looking for siblings hanging out with BW. This is making me nervous for BY. Great preview. I wish there were some stills This is getting good. BW also tells BY that making people smile is just a dream and moves away from her angrily. He is also shown looking at the map of Josoen and saying this will all be mine... gives me the shivers ...I am guessing the ratings will go higher and higher from here... The dragon of dragons is has grown no longer is he a baby dragon... watch out

[hinatashoyo]

Six Flying Dragons Episodes 27 & 28: Hope, History, and Convictions

by Amy Gephart on Fri, Jan 08, 2016

 

Episodes 27 and 28 were full of hope, history, and convictions for our favorite Six Flying Dragonscharacters. Where do you think their hope, history, and convictions will lead them? Come discuss everything with Unni, Taleena, and Amy!

http://www.dramafever.com/news/six-flying-dragons-episodes-27--28-hope-history-and-convictions/

[maryofbethany]

On Tuesday, May 19, 2015 at 10:14 AM, Lids said:

Seconding everything you've said. Plus the writer (tree with deep roots) ....

Seriously, was he behind Deep Rooted Tree. I actually thought that show was One Of its kind. Not just that the Senior King can act well. But the story does bring out many thoughts provoking moments. Revolution is right or wrong , or should be achieved at any costs, depend.I.which angle you see.  Then Remember is in.good hands. 

[SukBin]

8 hours ago, zenya22 said:

 

According to JDJ’s concepts, power is not concentrated in one family and is not inherited and that the king not to be considered omnipotent.  A bureaucratic government with different branches will be created and those who will run those branches of government will be selected from people of achievement and who’ve proven themselves as capable.  From these branches of government will be created to check and balance each other. 

BW is a bright, brave, ingenious and inspired idealist whose dream is to make people smile through politics. He himself is sold on the visions of JDJ. He eavesdropped once before on the conversation of JDJ wanting his father to be king. From that time on he has done everything to make his father acquiesce to the possibility of being king even incurring his father and JDJ’s anger, being imprisoned and tortured then bowing at JDJ’s feet to be accepted as his student

 

@zenya22 I would like to discuss the above two mentioned points on the post you made, if you dont mind....

The fundamental flaw in the system that JDJ designed is that the Prime Minister and the other ministers are not chosen by people , they are selected by individual persons, Prime Minister is selected by King and he in turn selects Ministers, so there is no system to stop people like Yi In Gyeom amd Hong In Bang attaining those positions, not to mention the Queen's family would pressurize the king to get the position of Prime Minister and control the Nation , similar to what happened many times in Goryeo earlier and in later Joseon with Andong Kim Clan.

Therefore if in JDJ's vision Government is a Tree and Sadeabu the roots , the king a flower , surely he would have imagined the Prime Minister to be the strongest i.e the Stem/Trunk.... then if the Stem/Trunk itself is weak from the start the Tree will collapse uprooting even the so called roots from the Ground.

Also JDJ ignored one more fundamental flaw in his Plan, a country's prosperity is dependent on the stability of the Government / the seat of power.... in the system created by JDJ ... the king eventhough a symbol represents the country.... is weak.... therefore the country will be susceptible to more Dynastic Revolutions from within, people who would want to establish a powerful king to rule the nation.... and from outside the country  will be susceptible to the Ming forces who would find an excuse to replace the powerless/puupet/symbolic king with their Ruler.....

Coming to Bang Won , the possibility of his father becoming a king came at a later stage, at the beginning he even mentioned that JDJ would lead the new Joseon with  the support of his father as a General.....

From the very beginning he worked hard to bring Joseon, eventhough there was no mention of father at that time.... Bang Won was frustrated with the corrupted Goryeo and wanted to protect the innocents, bring Justice to society by bringing the Society that JDJ  designed.

In that his selflessness and passion for the common people and his ideals of Justice for all shows.

[zenya22]

7 hours ago, nevill said:

@zenya22 beautiful

i agree with JDJ summery although i think its not they werent in sync it was us who were stupid and unable to recognize good revolution

about BW reading your post suddenly i felt like BW goes from one place to another and still he has not fully developed his own political venue and now he will combine and assemble his own way of doing things  

If the drama follows history though, even as BW forms his own political base, he will still do more missions for his teacher and his father. However the preview is interesting as it shows the nameless looking for the children of YH near BW and CY suggesting Nameless to use BW

[SukBin]

46 minutes ago, zenya22 said:

The dragon of dragons is has grown no longer is he a baby dragon... watch out

 

The Dragon of Dragons is no longer a Baby Dragon....ha ha....nice line....

But did you know that until the very end the scales of winning were heavily tilted towards Jung Do Jeon and his Team.....

He became the Prime Minister and the whole Government was filled with his people, his followers and friends..... whereas Bang Won was effectively isolated by him with no power or position....

Even the land that Bang Won inherited was also taken away from Jung Do Jeon......

And if that was not enough.... he finally planned to kill Bang Won and his supporters and eliminate the opposition completely.....

Under such massive odds, Bang won showed extreme boldness and survival instinct, he gathered the last remaining people loyal to him and launched a counteroffensive killing JDJ and his supporters including his half brothers who were going to be shown as the reason by Jung Do Jeon for killing Bang Won... to his father. 

For over 6 years or so Bang Won opposed JDJ  politically... but when JDJ was going to kill him... he had no other option but to kill his asassins and their backers before they kill him....

[zenya22]

1 hour ago, SukBin said:

@zenya22 I would like to discuss the above tow mentioned points on the post you made, if you dont mind....

The fundamental flaw in the system that JDJ designed is that the Prime Minister is  and the other ministers are not chosen by people , they are selected by individual persons, Prime Minister is selected by King and he in turn selects Ministers, so there is no system to stop people like Yi In Gyeom amd Hong In Bang attaining those positions, not to mention the Queen's family would pressurize the king to get the position of Prime Minister and control the Nation , similar to what happened many times in Goryeo earlier and in later Joseon with Andong Kim Clan.

Therefore if in JDJ's vision Government is a Tree and Sadeabu the roots , the king a flower , surely he would have imagined the Prime Minister to be the strongest i.e the Stem/Trunk.... then if the Stem/Trunk itself is weak from the start the Tree will collapse uprooting even the so called roots from the Ground.

Also JDJ ignored one more fundamental flaw in his Plan, a country's prosperity is dependent on the stability of the Government / the seat of power.... in the system created by JDJ ... the king eventhough a symbol represents the country.... is weak.... therefore the country will be susceptible to more Dynastic Revolutions from within, people who would want to establish a powerful king to rule the nation.... and from outside the country  will be susceptible to the Ming forces who would find an excuse to replace the powerless/puupet/symbolic king with their Ruler.....

Coming to Bang Won , the possibility of his father becoming a king came at a later stage, at the beginning he even mentioned that JDJ would lead the new Joseon with  the support of his father as a General.....

From the very beginning he worked hard to bring Joseon, eventhough there was no mention of father at that time.... Bang Won was frustrated with the corrupted Goryeo and wanted to protect the innocents, bring Justice to society by bringing the Society that JDJ  designed.

In that his selflessness and passion for the common people and his ideals of Justice for all shows.

@SukBinThe drama did not go into detail of the formation of the government except the comparison to the tree the flower and the roots. And the way I envision what he meant was like the parliamentary government in UK or in modern Japan (I am not sure of Japan still has monarchy). Like i said I am only basing my post on what little I know of the works of JDJ from the drama postings. I am discussing the characters in the drama. I said that It would not have been acceptable nor worked in that era where monarchy was the only known way of governing. According to the plan the hierarchy was not inherited but was given to those who got the position through there own efforts. The kind of revolutionary change he was embarking will not come about fast. Change especially radical change will not happen easily nor speedily and not without a steep cost. Even in modern day democratic countries wars were fought for decades for the government to stabilize and laws change all the time. The system can't be blamed for it's flaws because most of the time human beings working the system are the ones who are flawed. JDJ died in 3 years after he established the government not even enough time to stabilize it to see how it works. Yet his code of laws became the constitution of Joseon. Any elected government official is given at least 4 to 6 years to make his mark. Now let me say it here again as my original post said I am posting about characters in the drama so I appreciate your enthusiasm for discussing and let us stick to the characters and how the characters are played in the drama..

As for Bang Won the same thing the post was about the character in the drama and the drama he did know that his father was approached to be king because he eavesdropped and he was the one who forged the his father's signature by signing the ABC plan with his father's seal then hightailed it to Gaegyong and made a deal with it with HIB and conned HIB to bring it to the Do Dang and it passed. He even told his wife about it. I don't know if you saw that episode. So as per the drama, his father and JDJ knew about it and even Jo Joon knows about it. Haryun suspects it, he was the one who make it known and got YSG in trouble by making the children sing a song about the 8th heir of the Yi family. In the last episode Jo Joon even talked to BW about it. So I have no idea what you are trying to say here. Because my post of BW was a summary of the episodes of BW's life from the first episode.My question is are we watching the same drama?

[hinatashoyo]

Wonder why there's no statue of King Taejong in korea??

Is the 5 rules the reason why Jo Joon later opposed Jeong Do Jeon?

So there is a place named T'aejong in South Korea? Is it derived from YBW?

Is it true that Confucianism is the reason why the Joseon was never westernized before?

Amazing, how loyal Queen Wonkyeong was to her husband after the purging of her brothers.. I have read that her clan was considered one of the most powerful during Koryo-Choson transition but decline after the purging of her brothers.. It must be sad life for her cause she wanted prosperity of her clan but then in exchange for that she is revered as a wife of the great kings in korean history and a mother of one of the great kings in korean history until now and thousand years to come. I don't know if it is good or bad.. I wanna know what korean people think of her and King Taejong? I also wonder which was important at the time, Prosperity of the clan or being respected for thousand years to come? 

[SukBin]

24 minutes ago, zenya22 said:

@SukBinThe drama did not go into detail of the formation of the government except the comparison to the tree the flower and the roots. And the way I envision what he meant was like the parliamentary government in UK or in modern Japan (I am not sure of Japan still has monarchy). Like i said I am only basing my post on what little I know of the works of JDJ from the drama postings. I am discussing the characters in the drama. I said that It would not have been acceptable nor worked in that era where monarchy was the only known way of governing. According to the plan the hierarchy was not inherited but was given to those who got the position through there own efforts. The kind of revolutionary change he was embarking will not come about fast. Change especially radical change will not happen easily nor speedily and not without a steep cost. Even in modern day democratic countries wars were fought for decades for the government to stabilize and laws change all the time. The system can't be blamed for it's flaws because most of the time human beings working the system are the ones who are flawed. JDJ died in 3 years after he established the government not even enough time to stabilize it to see how it works. Yet his code of laws became the constitution of Joseon. Any elected government official is given at least 4 to 6 years to make his mark. Now let me say it here again as my original post said I am posting about characters in the drama so I appreciate your enthusiasm for discussing and let us stick to the characters and how the characters are played in the drama..

As for Bang Won the same thing the post was about the character in the drama and the drama he did know that his father was approached to be king because he eavesdropped and he was the one who forged the his father's signature by signing the ABC plan with his father's seal then hightailed it to Gaegyong and made a deal with it with HIB and conned HIB to bring it to the Do Dang and it passed. He even told his wife about it. I don't know if you saw that episode. So as per the drama, his father and JDJ knew about it and even Jo Joon knows about it. Haryun suspects it, he was the one who make it known and got YSG in trouble by making the children sing a song about the 8th heir of the Yi family. In the last episode Jo Joon even talked to BW about it. So I have no idea what you are trying to say here. Because my post of BW was a summary of the episodes of BW's life from the first episode.My question is are we watching the same drama?

Looks like you took offense .... sorry then.....

I will just end discussing by just stating the objective of my post... since you are saying you didnt get what i am saying or trying to point out.....

You mentioned that Bang Won started working hard after listening that his father would be king, thats not true....

He worked hard even when he assumed JDJ will lead it.You can  go through previous episodes..... Bang Won mentions to someone that JDJ will lead the new Joseon and his father will support him as General.So in the end Bang Won worked hard for the ideal of Joseon without greed that his father would be king.

 

[hinatashoyo]

 

 

 

http://www.topstarnews.net/detail.php?number=172258

[nevill]

12 hours ago, homura said:

WELL, because the chart is not about love/hate relationships but about the political battle between Nameless vs. King vs. Yi Seong-Gye? There is no mention about father/son, teacher/pupil, love/hate, etc.

its a political chart? in the chart there is no longer a relation between BY JDJ & BY BW  - BY only has a relationship with her mother will she become a nameless person? leave both JDJ & BW ideologies?

[nevill]

9 hours ago, hinatashoyo said:

Thanks for the info.I am reading the Roman Empire history.. People who keeps saying he's a tyrant and not so good ruler make a big deal out of it.. It's just natural to happen in the ancient times.. there's nothing wrong with it as long as he is loved by the people and he made the kingdom prospered..Julius Caesar was a great ruler but was assassinated by his senators.. And then that's the start of the fall of the Roman Republic and rise of Roman Empire..After Julius Caesar's death, Octavian founded the Roman Empire. He was similar to BW, he wanted Absolute monarch. He retained his autocratic power as a military dictator.. so this leads to relative peace called " Pax Romana". Historians said that it's a miracle cause there's never been peace before that..It lasted for 200 years of peace. Same with the Joseon. It only lasted 200 years of peace despite Joseon kingdom lasted for 518years.. Because they have been replace by the weak kings so ministers have the control of the kingdom over the king. Sedo politics also been introduced where the Queen's maternal relatives control the politics.. So the kingdom had been decayed by the corruption, and internal conflicts. You can't blame YBW for killing his enemies or those people who he viewed as the threat cause everything is justified. So if JDJ wins, I don't think there will be peace and prosperity.. Only BW can do that because he clean the kingdom from corruption, he also stabilize it, he increased the kingdom's income into two fold, and also promote slaves to become official for example Jang Yeong Shil....

i love the roman empire and believe it or not love sula - but because his character was flamboyant not for his leading

as for Julius   Caesar he wanted to concur the world wanted to rule it - the places he concurred had to live under the roman empire rules although usually roman was better for ppl if you remember his encounters with druids and his conditions - he was "good" for the roman empire in showing power which he loved -  and he almost never stayed in rome and didnt really care about the small ppl - didn need to that much as the roman empire was the closest we have to democracy but it wasnt on his part they lived or 500 years without a king bf Julius came 

but his sole motivation was power, roman and his own  - and historians see Julius as a tyrant = absolute ruler 

[nevill]

@MiAmour the chart apparently is a political one and therefore the romance still could happen

[nevill]

8 hours ago, SukBin said:

The fundamental flaw in the system that JDJ designed is that the Prime Minister and the other ministers are not chosen by people , they are selected by individual persons, Prime Minister is selected by King and he in turn selects Ministers

i agree this is the main flaw bau if you go back youll see an explanation of who can be elected and for how long inherited and such

the most important thing to me about it is temporary no one can give his position to his sons and they have to pass tests (right @homura  - on this specific point)

even today although any one theoretically can be chosen to rule only ppl with adequate resume are actually chosen

and opposition - one of the most important characters for a good country is opposition and changing the sides from time to time

what keeps you in check is the opposition 

at those times te ppl only cared about  basic living more or less (actually like today - not everyone goes to the streets) and although they were lucky to have BW & LD one after the other the problem with absolute ruling that it is a matter of luck 

BW did great things it could have come out differently if he was of a different disposition and not that intelligent he did eliminate opposition and demanded total submissiveness from the ppl that could be his opposition  and in general

we are talking about the system as a rule not the individuals that use it

  

[nevill]

8 hours ago, zenya22 said:

If the drama follows history though, even as BW forms his own political base, he will still do more missions for his teacher and his father. However the preview is interesting as it shows the nameless looking for the children of YH near BW and CY suggesting Nameless to use BW

i didnt mean politicalbase i meant his own ideology up till now he wasnt sure and searched for the specific ieology that suits him the most he heardd and liked a bit of JDJ also BY helped with shaping and of course HR and LM but i think something clicked and he formed a fully his own ideology and from now on even if he helps others his justification and reasoning would be his completely own -  assembled and newly form ideology or political view  

[bodashiri]

7 hours ago, hinatashoyo said:

Wonder why there's no statue of King Taejong in korea??

Is the 5 rules the reason why Jo Joon later opposed Jeong Do Jeon?

So there is a place named T'aejong in South Korea? Is it derived from YBW?

Is it true that Confucianism is the reason why the Joseon was never westernized before?

 

1. Why there's no statue of King Taejong in korea?

Well, I've never seen any Joseon king's statue except for King Sejong the Great.

 

2. Is the 5 rules the reason why Jo Joon later opposed Jeong Do Jeon?

No, I don't think so. Jo Joon objected to Jung Do-Jeon's reckless Liadong expedition plan. Didn't you say you watched Jung Do-Jeon (2014, KBS)?  

 

3. There is a place named T'aejong in South Korea? Is it derived from YBW?

There is a seashore cliff named "Taejong-dae (태종대)" in Busan city, but it  bears no relation to Yi Bang-Won. It named after King Taejong Muyeol (태종무열왕 太宗武烈王) of Silla (* Kim Chun-Chu. Queen Seon-Deok‘s nephew who unified the three kingdoms in the 7th century.)

4. Is it true that Confucianism is the reason why the Joseon was never westernized before?

I don't think so. King Jeongjo (정조 正祖) of Joseon is a great Confucian scholar himself, but Christianity (Roman Catholicism) and many western products had been introduced during his reign (1776~1800). This period is called Joseon's Renaissance, and even Confucian scholars did flexible thinking. You can see Westernized guns, telescopes, eyeglasses, alarm clocks, Christian bibles, and Caucasian Catholic priests in King Jeongjo-era Sageuks.

However, after the king died, Andong Kim clan seized the power of the court, killed all Christians, and destroyed Western imports. As I said before, the problem is lying not on the ideology itself but on the people who had blind faith in it. Joseon's ruling class had carried out a closed-door policy during the 19th century, which led to the failure of modernization.

* King Jeongjo ear Sageuks
Sungkyunkwan Scandal (2010 KBS), Yi San (2007~2008 MBC), Conspiracy in the Court (2007 KBS),  Painter of the Wind (2008 SBS), Warrior Baek Dong-soo (2011 SBS), Untold Scandal (2003 movie), Blood Rain (2005 movie), Detective K series (movie),  The Fatal Encounter (2014 movie) etc.

 

1 hour ago, nevill said:

its a political chart? in the chart there is no longer a relation between BY JDJ & BY BW  - BY only has a relationship with her mother will she become a nameless person? leave both JDJ & BW ideologies?

 

Yes, it's a simple chart about 3 political parties which has been formed up to now. We don't know anything about the upcoming changes yet.

[nevill]

but maybe it will take one or two more eps - but i think this is the beginning of his his own way of seeing things

[nevill]

7 hours ago, hinatashoyo said:

Amazing, how loyal Queen Wonkyeong was to her husband after the purging of her brothers.. I have read that her clan was considered one of the most powerful during Koryo-Choson transition but decline after the purging of her brothers.. It must be sad life for her cause she wanted prosperity of her clan but then in exchange for that she is revered as a wife of the great kings in korean history and a mother of one of the great kings in korean history until now and thousand years to come. I don't know if it is good or bad.. I wanna know what korean people think of her and King Taejong? I also wonder which was important at the time, Prosperity of the clan or being respected for thousand years to come? 

well there are rumors she loved him but also that BW took a lot of concubines just to unbalance her power make her fear for her position and he did accept the helpof these brothers and only killed them when he thought they became to big for their shoes 

at this point i think LM as scared for her and her children position and also liked her own status and tried protecting them - i dont think its loyalty i think its fear 

[hinatashoyo]

46 minutes ago, homura said:

 

However, after the king died, Andong Kim clan seized the power of the court, killed all Christians, and destroyed all Western imports. As I said before, the problem is lying not on the ideology itself but on the people who had blind faith in it. Joseon's ruling class had carried out a closed-door policy during the 19th century, which led to the failure of modernization.

 

Yeah ,I know that.. after reading king Yeongo's history. He is a great king but the problem was he married again.. he was too old to be married, and he married a young lady from the Andong Kim Clan.. i think that's the start of the sedo politics of Andong Kim Clan. She became the queen of King Yeongjo, and as a queen dowager of King Jeongjo and King Jeongjo's son, so she had the control of politics. After that, the Joseon started to decline.. The queen dowager persecuted the catholics. And i think she and her clan was behind the sudden death of Jeonjo of Joseon..I noticed how the next queens were from the Andong Kim clan and the weak kings rule..

JDJ was born ahead of his time, he had the idea how the modern society works. but too bad he was born 600 years ago.. while King Taejong possessed the ability to read the people, that must have been why he killed his in laws to prevent sedo politics. He must have the idea that sedo politics again will be the cause of the decline of Joseon dynasty just like what happen in the Goryeo dynasty. I pity those two.. Similar to Julius Ceasar, Pompey, Alexander the Great and Octavian were great leaders of their own empire but been betrayed by those people around them..