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[drama 2008] Bittersweet Life 달콤한 인생 (la Dolce Vita)

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Replies

  • rach1rur3rach1rur3 Posts: 204Member
    edited June 2008
    ^ is not more on depressing really. it gets more interesting as the story progress. you get so intrigued by each of the characters' story. although the fist episode can be somewhat of a turn off, i suggest keep watching atleast until ep. 4 and if you don't like how it's going then don't finish it. i'm only up to episode 5, but from what i see from the summaries that are provided here it gets better and better as it goes on... if you like something different from the normal dramas being shown, then this is the one to see! image
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  • baduybaduy UKPosts: 2,543Member

    LEGEND

    edited June 2008
    FWIW, here's a shot at helping people with no Korean out with the first chunk of ep 13. Because I'm pretty short of time right now, I may not be able to post much more on this pair of episodes, so I've mixed in a few forward references as well...

    ALL SPOILERS TO END OF POST

    At the ep 12-13 cliffhanger, we saw DW open the garage door and push HJ roughly inside. She cowers down and covers her face, begging him not to hit her because then the kids will see the marks. He claims she is being hysterical and he had no real intention of hitting her. She responds that what's really terrifying her is not his raising his hand, but her sense that despite all their years together she simply doesn't know him. Just who is he, what kind of person is he? she repeatedly asks. As usual, he insists she's being melodramatic and asking stupid unanswerable questions. Why, what is there to know other than what she knows already, he protests, tearing open his shirt and baring his chest and challenging her to find anything concealed or unknown on his person.

    Then instead of hitting her, he opts for a much crueler and more debasing form of violence, dragging her into the house, then the bedroom and forcing himself on her, plainly believing it's what she needs, or even what she wants, undeterred by her initial resistance and oblivious to why she then just lies there in inert misery. In the script, HJ has a voiceover at this point reflecting that "they say that over half the men in the world believe that a woman being raped actually enjoys it...", and it's plain her husband shares that belief, even thinking that now he's asserted his "rights" in this way she will return to her former devoted subservience. The voiceover was left out in production: the two actors get the point across by their performances without the need for any such explicit pointer to what is happening here.

    00:09:06
    Intercut to DA drinking her way through all those beers JS didn't want. Though she makes no claims to be a paragon of virtue, she can't help feeling she's doing wrong where "that matter" is concerned. MJ correctly guesses what the "matter" is that's giving DA the pangs of conscience she's trying to subdue through drinking: DW's wife. Especially after that chance encounter with her in the pet shop, when she felt she could hardly breathe. MJ reminds her that the true responsibility for any hurt to HJ lies with DW. He's the one who owes his wife fidelity, not DA. DA makes no response to that, and MJ urges her to forget about her scruples. But DA ignores that advice: "Should I go meet her?" "Are you crazy?" says MJ. "If I apologized to her, it would put my mind at rest," DA explains. "Let sleeping dogs lie" MJ advises. [Sorry, I've accidentally dragged a stray canine into the translation which isn't in the Korean , where the corresponding saying is more like "scratch away at an itch and you'll turn it into a sore"]. But DA persists: should she maybe call round at HJ's house?, laughing in her characteristic half-frivolous, half anguished way at the idea. Fatefully, of course, she will actually opt to waylay HJ outside the Hagwon, where a massive shock awaits her, because someone else has had the same idea, and as a result of discovering who that someone is, DA will forget all notions of apologizing as she thinks she has solved the riddle of JS's reluctance to return her advances, thus producing the cliffhanger between eps 14 and 15 where we are currently poised...


    [00:12:11]
    Back to DW and HJ's house the same night, as DW goes into the kitchen to fetch himself a celebratory beer and brings one back to bed for HJ too, seeming puzzled when she doesn't want it, or him.

    Despite HJ's continued refusal to acknowledge his presence, let alone respond to his words and caresses, DW obviously still believes next morning that all is fine and dandy between them again, tells her he loves her (after approaching her from behind with that same "stranglehold" hug that JS gave her when she was frantically looking for him at Otaru, not the only rather ominous physical parallel between DW's and JS' behavior to her that we'll see in this and the following episode) and gives her a smacking kiss to the delight of the watching children "Wowee! Daddy's kissing Mommy!" shouts the elder girl, who comes downstairs at this moment. In English, thanks to inevitable reminiscences of "I Saw Mommy Kissing Santa Claus", this sounds rather twee, but the Korean [와! 아빠가 엄마한테 뽀뽀한다!] is plainer and more poignant, because what the children delightedly see as a sign of their parents' reconciliation is in fact a marker of their irrevocable estrangement, as HJ's voiceover after her husband and children have left the house makes plain.

    "Everything seems strange [낯설다 = unfamiliar, unrecognizable, unknown]. My husband, my children, this house. And then me ... I don't even recognize myself either. What happened to my life and my world I knew before now? ... They seem like just a distant memory". The camera zooms out to show her from behind, standing looking at her own living room as if it were indeed the house of a stranger she'd wandered into. It is a reprise on a much greater scale of her shock on seeing DW emerge from his early morning "jogging" at DA's apartment. And once again, a combination of chance and fate will take her in this renewed state of disorientation into the arms of JS.


    [00:20:28]
    HJ's call to her DW at his office is to tell him he'll need to ferry the kids from school to Hagwon today as well (though Nari specifically asked her to fetch them this time). He asks her in exasperation whether she'll be walking around carrying that silly (tour-guide's) flag today as well (we'll see the significance of that flag to him in the next episode, after she returns from her night in SJ's apartment: overnight, DW has been out and taken away her abandoned umbrella, but left the flag for her to find outside the gate of the house she's about to leave, an emblem of the choice she's made.) No, she says, she's busy looking for a room. Once she's found a suitable place to live she'll be moving out.
    "Where are you right now?" he wants to know. "Please just let me get on with it," she replies. "I asked you where you're calling from", he repeats angrily . "I'm hanging up now" is all she'll say, and we see her going into business premises marked "부동산" -- real estate agency.

    00:22:51

    At the travel agency, HJ tells her boss she's rented a room and is ready to move in. Her boss, too, is divorced, they talk about the shock of moving from a big house to a small rented room, and the prospect of leaving the kids behind. So her boss has kids, too, does she HJ asks. Yes, three of them. It turned out her husband's new wife couldn't have children of her own, so she's bringing up hers instead. Lucky kids I've got, she remarks sardonically. She's going to hold on to her kids, HJ declares, plainly struggling to keep her composure. Her boss warns her that it's tough going for a woman on her own, and she'll have to be tough herself. But plainly she's finding some valuable support here.

    00:25:04
    Despite MJ's repeated advice to forget the idea, DA still feels she has to meet HJ and apologize to her, and she's rehearsing in the back room of the store. On her way to wait across the street from the Hagwon where she knows HJ will turn up, DA is still rehearsing as she drives, but she never gets beyond variations on "Hello, do you know who I am?" She decides she will go ahead and play it by ear once they are face to face. "But supposing she grabs me by the hair, what will I do then?" [This is of course why all these seductive young women have long hair, so the outraged cheated wives, when they catch up with them, can pull them off their feet and start hammering them with their shoe in one single easy movement: see last year's movie The Railroad (Gyeongui Seon) for a recent bruising example]. But before DA can find out what sort of reception she'll get, she suddenly realises she's not the only person waiting for HJ there. She's just undone her seatbelt and is about to get out of the car, when she sees Joon Soo crossing the road and going up to HJ. And now an important piece of cultural body language comes into play, which may escape some Western viewers. Because DA sees how JS crosses the street and walks boldly up to HJ without even a hint of the bow a young man of his age would normally give to an older well-dressed woman whom he either didn't know at all or knew only slightly. And she also sees how HJ, though plainly surprised to see JS, isn't at all fazed by his manner. It's that sign of intimacy, rather than just the presence of JS itself, that is behind the round-eyed gaze we see in the close-up of the watching DA. What she can't, of course, hear, is their actual conversation, though if she had done, she might have reacted rather differently herself.
    HJ: Why have you come here?
    JS: You know that friend of mine who fell down a mountain last winter? ... They found his body. Because the snow melted.
    HJ: But that's a good thing, surely? Now his body's been found, there's no need for you to go anxiously looking for it.
    JS makes no reply, but simply looks at her in distress. She breaks her gaze and says she has to collect her kids. When he still shows no sign of either leaving or saying any more, she rebukes him "Joon Soo sshi, don't act like this. If you do, you'll be ruining everything. Like a brief flash of light our two lives grazed each other for an instant. [See what I mean about the literary style of this drama? I somehow doubt you'd overhear a sentence like that on the real streets of Seoul...] We can't hold on to each other, and we mustn't try to."

    Finally, in an echo of his plea to grant him "just one day" in Otaru, JS brings himself to speak: "Just for a little while, be there for me just a little while longer."
    HJ: Don't make me end up hating you. Don't make me feel remorse and self-reproach.

    She turns her back on him. JS turns round himself, crosses the road back to his bike and rides off. The moment he's gone, HJ turns to look after him with a look of anguish: then she hears her kids calling her and brightens up to greet them, but there is still a shadow in her face. Seeing all this from a distance, DA draws her own harrowing conclusions, and drives off in tears.

    [00:33:45]

    JS gets back to his apartment to find DA sitting on the floor outside his door, waiting for him. Plainly she thinks she's just seen the answer to that question she asked JS at the car pound before he rode off without answering: is there someone else in his life? Is that why he repeatedly gets close to her, physically and emotionally, then pushes her away? And that's why her first question now is "Is it because of that woman?"

    "Was it because of that woman? ... Just who is she?" (She knows very well who she is, of course. But she wants to find out how much JS knows about her and how far and exactly why that knowledge has driven his behavior towards her, DA.)

    JS lets himself into his apartment and closes the door behind him, leaving her outside, screaming at him through the glass: You like me, I know you do. So why go after her? What sort of relationship do you have? For God's sake, tell me how long you've been running after her."

    After an intercut to DW and HJ's house, with Seong Sook continuing to busybody her way around the estranged couple thinking she can mediate between them, but with neither of them showing any interest, then a glimpse of HJ visiting her sleeping children, knowing she will soon be leaving them (though unaware that because of what will happen next day, this is the last night she'll be spending under that roof with them).

    [00:38:00]
    We are back at JS's apartment, where in the meantime he has obviously decided to let DA in, but is still refusing to say anything while she keeps up her barrage of questions, though he is recklessly downing glass after glass of liquor. When she grabs the bottle from him and throws it aside, he simply opens another and carries on drinking.

    "Did you know she was that man's wife when you met her? Did you know that? ... You did, didn't you? ... Say something!! .... This is killing me!! You talk about me being an angel, yet you live like this? ... Why don't you answer when I'm asking you? ... Was it in Hokkaido you met her? It was, wasn't it? I called you when I was on my way to Paris and you were in Hokkaido when you took the call, weren't you? So that was your first meeting? ... But no, it can't have been. You went there from Seoul with her, didn't you? ... Fine then, if you won't say anything let's forget the whole thing."

    And she heads for the door. But then stops in her tracks with another question. "Who made the first move? Was it you or she? Did that woman seduce you? I know you liked me, did she steal you away from me? That's it, isn't it? That's why she wants to divorce her husband."

    Which finally induces JS to speak, though only to beg her to say no more. But she's in no mood to heed his plea.

    "The cat's out of the bag now, is it? It's because of that foul woman."

    Which finally provokes JS to say something more, though not something that helps clear the air, though it makes perfect sense to him and us:

    "You of all people have no right to talk like that".
    "What???"

    But he won't explain what he means, and she persists:
    "That woman cheated on her husband!"
    "Just leave off!!" he yells in fury.

    She can't drop it, though. He smashes the bottle on the ground, but she still carries on
    - Do you love that woman? That's why you're in such a state, isn't it? Because you've found someone you love?"
    He leaves the liquor cabinet and walks over to face her.
    - It isn't that kind of relationship. The one I have with her. It's not like you're imagining.
    - So what sort of relationship is it then?
    He grabs her by the arms and shakes her violently
    - Didn't you hear me ask you to stop? Please don't say any more. I'm begging you. Stop it now, I say!!

    - You wouldn't do that, would you? You met her without knowing who she was and even now you were seeing her without knowing...

    She wants to believe that, but clearly knows it somehow isn't true. There's nothing JS could say that would make sense to DA in her state of now knowing nearly all the facts but virtually none of the truth. He holds her while she weeps in rage and bewilderment. After a brief return intercut to see HJ covering DW with a blanket as he sleeps on the sofa then going to collapse wearily and alone on her marital bed for the last time, we return to see DA walking wretchedly away from JS's apartment and disappearing into the shadowy distance on the nighttime sidewalk.
  • KyUhNyUnNieKyUhNyUnNie SJ WORLD ^_^Posts: 29Member
    QUOTE (baduy @ Jun 16 2008, 06:49 PM) »
    FWIW, here's a shot at helping people with no Korean out with the first chunk of ep 13. Because I'm pretty short of time right now, I may not be able to post much more on this pair of episodes, so I've mixed in a few forward references as well...

    once more again ^__^ thanks for the recap n trnslation...yeah..ur soiler really2 helps me ^^
    u know, i never pass it...i always read it, almost ur spoiler post...except the earlier post...^^i started to read ur spoiler on ep7 ^^

    n koalabear, once more too...thanks for the pics...
    QUOTE
    more screencaps to be posted tomorrow ^ ^

    iam waiting for the next screen caps ^^


    yeaahhi've heard all of the OST of this drama...n almost of the songs just instrumental music...from 18 tracks there'r only 3 songs with lyrics...^^
    kuttemune...i still like it...^^
  • koalabearkoalabear Whole Hearted Happiness PhilippinesPosts: 3,810Member
    edited June 2008
    thanks Baduy for clearing up things on Episode 13...just a comment for both eps 13 and 14...I could just see Dong-won's reaction seeing Hye-jin and Jun-soo, feeling upset and his ego was all blown up...I think he could possibly do something drastic since he can do anything and it seems like his troubled as it is as Daae and Hye-jin sees one man...

    here are more pics from Episode 14 from La Dolce Vita DC and MBC

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    Episode 16 Preview

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    and...

    La Dolce...My Girl ?

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    I will try to finish to look for screencaps for Episode 14..sorry for being busy lately
  • SchneewitchenSchneewitchen Posts: 263Member
    Thanks for your opinion, evenso I like to watch Lee D.W. but if it is so depressing I will not do it. Also for me The Person I love and Sad Love are not worth watching.
  • baduybaduy UKPosts: 2,543Member

    LEGEND

    edited June 2008
    Thanks to some misbehaving equipment outside my control, it look like I may be able to grab a bit more time during the course of today to do some more attempted light-shedding on parts of the latest eps that are unlikely to make sense to viewers who can't follow the Korean. So here's another chunklet

    SPOILERS AHEAD


    [ep 13 00:46:38]

    (Presumably next) morning at Incheon airport. The party carrying Seong Goo's ashes come out of the terminal with ex-Detective Park following behind. He remains outside the terminal as the rest drive off with the ashes in a convoy of limos. Across the road, JS is waiting by his motorbike. He's dressed in a black suit and tie. Was he intending to pay his respects to the President Kang inside the terminal, but lost his nerve? Or it is just that he has already been summoned to the President's mansion later in the day, and has dressed accordingly?


    [BUT: does JS really have two motorbikes (with matching crash helmets)??. A red bike for stalking HJ and giving rides to DA, and a black bike for funeral occasions? Or can you rent out a mourning motorbike in the same way you can rent mourning clothes?? Or is accessorizing your motorbikes the latest trend in Korean male fashion?.. As if this drama didn't raise enough more serious questions already...]

    Park and JS have ridden/driven out to a deserted spot in the rather bleak reclaimed flatlands surrounding the airport. There Park tells JS that the Japanese police on examining GS's body found no evidence of any injuries that couldn't be accounted for by the fall, and are treating the death as either suicide or accident.

    "Congratulations" he adds, "you're cleared of all suspicion." "Congratulations [좋겠다]" (which he repeats a little later) is a rather strange thing to say in such circumstances, and it re-affirms Park's suspicions that JS had a role in the death which he has managed to keep hidden from everyone else.

    JS asks why SG was cremated in Japan. The body was in such a bad state when found that cremation was the only possibility, Park explains. Why, had JS been hoping to take a last look at his friend's face?

    JS doesn't answer that (sensing that Park already knows what the answer would be) and instead asks "Is that it, then?". "Are you worried it might not be?" Park counters. "I'm not a homicide investigator. There's no need to worry about me doing any more probing without good reason"

    Then, looking thoughtfully at the horizon, not at JS, he continues as if talking to himself. "But there are other possibilities [=than accident or suicide, as the police believe]. For instance, someone might have given SG a push from behind when his attention was distracted. There'd be no suspicious injuries in that case, either." JS gives a slight smile and Park turns to look at him and asks "That's possible, isn't it?" "I suppose it is" JS returns cooly and Park adds "In which case, it would be hard on his family, wouldn't it, trying to figure out why he killed himself."

    JS says nothing to this, simply walking over to his bike, starting the engine and preparing to ride off without any leave-taking. But before he can pull away, Park calls after him. ""Congratulations. Looks like you pulled it off. ... But you know something?...In this world there's no such thing as the perfect crime. ... Even if you deceive the whole world, you can't deceive yourself." With those words, Park has given perhaps the clearest formulation so far of what is at the root of JS's inner torment.

    00:50:50

    We cut from JS disappearing down the highway in the direction of Seoul to his arriving at the entrance barrier to the Kang mansion. Presumably he's ridden straight there. He parks his bike on the front yard lawn, then stands dumbfounded as he catches sight, on the outside coffee table, of GS's ashes, apparently awaiting his arrival.

    Then another cut, surprisingly swift, to a swish cafe (of maybe hotel coffee lounge), with DW entering in his best business suit and being cheerily greeted by an apparently carefree DA, who is sitting at a table waiting for him, sipping a coke, having obviously called him for a mid-morning rendezvous.

    We don't have much time to wonder what's going on, except maybe to guess that DA is in full bounce-back mode having concluded, after the traumatic discoveries of the previous day, that both JS and HJ are hypocritical deceivers, and that she was a fool to have felt so guilty about stealing the husband of a woman who was apparently cheating on him anyway, and with JS to boot. So she is now maybe planning on making a serious move towards becoming the second Mrs DW. Boy is she in for (yet another) shock, poor girl!

    Without any initial greeting, he addresses her quite abruptly and impatiently, plainly not too pleased to be summoned at this hour or to this place.

    DW: So what's up? Why did you call me?
    DA: I just wanted to see you.
    DW: You wanted to see me?
    DA: Yeah. What's wrong with that?
    DW gives her a searching look: as ever, he's uneasy when he realises he doesn't understand someone else's motives [OK, he hardly ever understands anyone else's motives, because he's too self-centered to see what's in front of his nose, but occasionally he does catch on that there's something going on he isn't quite on top of, and that always makes him edgy and defensive or aggressive by turns. Maybe that's the reason why the only people he gets on with really well are his kids, because as yet they have no hidden agendas beyond wangling occasional trips to pasta joints, and he can just about make sense of those.]
    DA: No ulterior motive. I felt like seeing you, so I called. That's all.
    DW: But I thought you weren't keen on open dating like this. Too many watching eyes.
    DA: I don't think that way any more. Makes life too complicated. So I'm going to try something different.
    DW: Sounds like good news to me. [But in that case why does he cross his arms so defensively across his chest before saying so?...]
    DA: Depends on how you look at it.
    DW: So, what sort of changes do you have in mind? What's going to be different about how you live?
    DA: I've got an more comfortable way of life in mind.
    DW: I thought you were comfortable enough already.
    DA: Ah but I wasn't. I was still feeling a bit guilty and uneasy.
    DW: Feeling guilty toward who? My wife?
    Without answering directly, DA lowers her eyes and plays with the rim of her coke glass for a moment. Then, without looking at him, she continues
    DA: Don't you like that idea?
    Which provokes yet another bombshell for DA. In a clipped, choking tone (but not choking with suppressed emotion, more choking on an unpleasant morsel of food he'd rather spit out and have done with) he says "Let's not meet any more" [The exact way he says that: " 우리 -- throat-clearing noise -- 그만 만나자" defies all my attempts to put it into an English sentence of anything like the same impact].
    DA abruptly stops playing with her glass and raises her eyes to look at him again. From suave femme fatale to a lost and utterly bewildered little girl in a microsecond.
    "You mean... end our relationship? ... But I don't want to..."
    DW smiles as though the whole thing was a trivial distraction. "I was in the middle of something when I left the office. I have to get back." And he stands up to go.
    DA: So we're really breaking up? ...
    HW: Yup!
    DA: Just like that?
    DW: Would you prefer to throw a splitting-up party?
    (DA stares at him in devastated disbelief)
    DW: Any other suggestions? [I know that's a very free translation of his "어떡할래?" but I think it catches the tone and implication better than a more literal rendering]
    (DA manages, just about, to keep control of herself)
    DA: Fine! Let's just call the whole thing off. I'm not bothered. Off you go.
    [Whereupon DW has a line that is a sure fire nominee for Most Stupid Kdrama Question of 2008. In fact, it's such an overwhelmingly strong candidate that we might as well stop taking nominations and give it the award right away]
    DW: Are you sure you're OK?
    DA: Of course!
    And though she's looking as if she's at death's door, DW regards his Duty of Care as duly satisfied, gives a smug little grin and heads at a brisk pace back to the office and out of her life.

    [One further irreverent/irrelevant aside here. After DW has left, DA produces a large handkerchief and energetically blows her nose. Now, this drama is clearly aimed at selling into the Japanese market. But will Japanese viewers really stomach a scene where a smart young woman sitting in a smart establishment BLOWS HER NOSE in full public view?? Or will that be edited out for the Japanese version?]

    [00:54:44]

    [Additional warning to my usual general one about my "creative" approach to translating patches where I'm out of my depth in the language. In the later portion of the exchanges I'm about to spot translate there is a lot of indirect speech (stuff like "I heard that he said that you said that I said..."). And indirect speech is maybe the most fearsome region of Korean grammar. In fact, although all native speakers can of course "do" indirect speech, a large proportion of them are at a loss to explain to anybody else exactly how and why they do it. So there are quite a few shots in the dark in the rest of this post. I just hope they don't wipe out too many innocent bystanders, but body armor is strongly recommended.]

    Cut back to the outside of the Kang mansion, where the President is now sitting at that outside table, his son's ashes in front of him, with JS standing deferentially opposite. The both stare silently at the enshrouded urn for a long time. Then the President speaks
    KANG: Your hand shall scatter his ashes. You were his one and only friend. I also give all Seon Goo's possessions into your hands.
    JS: SG also placed a little [!!! wow, I thought understatement was a British characteristic!!] money in my care.
    K: Keep it. SG's money, apartment, car; don't come consulting me about them. I don't want to deal with any of that, do you understand?
    JS: Very well.
    K: Go now.

    But JS doesn't go. The President looks at him expectantly
    JS: I don't know what I can say. Except that I should have taken better care of SG. ... I'm sorry.

    And with that, he bows deeply to the President, who looks away with the same impassive expression he has worn all through the scene (despite his words and actions, there is not the slightest note of warmth or gratitude toward JS in his manner or voice; but this may just be the effect of grief). JS picks up the urn and is about to leave when the President addresses him again, still looking away into the distance, but this time with more intensity

    K: When did you say was the last time you saw SG?
    (JS is clearly taken aback, expecting maybe some very awkward questions. But it turns out that what is really on the President's mind is exactly what Detective Park anticipated: a father's dismay at discovering that his son, quite unbeknown to him, was apparently suicidal)
    K: You say he called you before Christmas last year?
    JS: Yes he did
    K: When you last saw him, what sort of thing did he say? ... Did he not say anything about why he was going to Hokkaido?
    JS: I don't quite understand what you mean...
    K: Did he ever say anything about wanting to die in your hearing?
    JS: Well, yes sometimes. But only in fun.
    K: Maybe no-one listened carefully enough.
    JS: Maybe not.
    K: I don't want to dig over my dead child's life, but... Ah well, let's let him go now. Fortunately, his body was found and is safe in the hands of a friend... Depart in peace, Seong Goo my child.


    What little dialog remains in the episode is I think pretty obvious from the actions; and most of the remainder is wordless anyway, so I think that's that for ep 13. I will try to do something for ep 14 as well, but no promises...
  • canyayasiscanyayasis Colorado Rocky MountainsPosts: 1,969Friend of Soompi

    ROOKIE


    I have been reading your posts intensely, BADUY...
    though rarely with enough time to comment.
    But a deep and wide basket full of appreciation for
    your time and insights into this series!
  • marimari Posts: 58Member

    IDOL

    HELP!! Am desperate. Can't download Ep 12. Tried Aigoo and all the club boxes but just refused to download. Also tried the links for bigmail but NO result!! Can someone help me???? Thanks
  • EnDlEsS88EnDlEsS88 Posts: 360Member

    TRAINEE

    nice one koalabear ... it is soo funny ... my girl and la dolce vita ...

    thank u 4 d pics
  • koalabearkoalabear Whole Hearted Happiness PhilippinesPosts: 3,810Member
    edited June 2008
    ^ You're welcome ^ ^

    last set of screencaps from Episode 14

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    src: Seattle @ La Dolce Vita DC

    and a fanmade video

    Sad Love Song

    http://uccfs.paran.com/PUD/dc/mov/SWF/1213...swf?autoplay=ok


    Episode 15 Preview

    http://www.imbc.com/broad/tv/drama/sweet/p...8092_26940.html
  • baduybaduy UKPosts: 2,543Member

    LEGEND

    edited June 2008
    Right, I'll try to drip feed some stuff about ep 14 into this post, though I don't know how far I'll get. So here goes with the first 15 mins or so...

    100% SPOILER WARNING


    I'd been wondering about the rather interesting layout of that house, with the cellar garage opening at street level and the huge picture window high above it in the living room. We've already seen how that window makes an ideal viewing spot for unauthorized impromptu firework displays, and how convenient that remote controlled garage door is for giving ready access to a discreet wife-beating area out of sight and earshot of kids and nosey house guests.

    But the architecture really steps forward as a main player in the drama in the 13/14 cliffhanger sequence. I suspect most eyes will be on blood and rain-soaked JS as HJ helps him totter into the relative shelter (warding off rain as well as the view from the living room) of the garage entrance. But to grasp what's really going on we also need to take a careful look at DW (as the camera repeatedly hints we should) observing the scene from the comfort of that well-lit living room high above.

    I found myself reminded of all those Ben-Hur/Spartacus-ish movies where the Roman Emperor sits high up in the Coliseum, observing with blasé dispassion the gladiatorial carnage in the arena below him, occasionally condescending to make the imperial thumbs-up or down signal to decide the loser's fate. Whether or not that Hollywood epic reminiscence is valid here or not, there's no doubt that DW is in this sequence not only an observer, but an disturbingly cold and remote, and even maybe gleeful one.

    OK, he's had a Bad Day at the Office, not to mention the effort of dumping his pretty but too independent-minded young plaything during an unscheduled coffee break (though she's not that easy to dump, as he'll find out later in this episode) then he's had to do a double school and hagwon run yet again, and presumably fix his own and the kids' supper, since we know from the Tokyo scenes that the house-guest has a low domesticity rating and that annoying ajumma seems to have disappeared from the cast altogether.

    But wouldn't you think that when from that privileged dry vantage point of his, he sees his wife approaching through the worst that a monsoon climate can throw at her flimsy borrowed umbrella, then witnesses her being accosted by a blood-streaming stranger dressed in black on her own threshhold, he would do something other than just watch (oh, and break off to make himself a coffee before returning to his observation post, cup in hand)?

    Meanwhile, JS is trying to collect enough breath to explain what he's doing there. He hadn't intended to disturb HJ, he swears. He just needed to set eyes on her so badly that he thought he would stand outside her house in the dark, hoping to be able to see her at the window inside without her being aware of his presence. But that was thwarted by her working late and so coming face to face with him in the street. "But I'm OK now. I've seen you, so I'm OK". But he's plainly anything but OK "Wait a moment, I'll go fetch my car keys and drive you to hospital", HJ says, and makes to go into the house, but he holds her back, saying that hospital isn't what he needs. "Just a bit longer, then I'll leave. Just please stay here with me for a little while more."
    HJ: How did you come to get hurt?
    JS: I got injured, that's all
    HJ: Were you in a fight with someone?
    JS: No.
    HJ: Come on, tell me! How did this happen?
    JS: Even if I told you, you wouldn't understand. So please let's not talk about that.

    Instead, JS talks about how he's repeatedly asked himself what would be the one memory deep within his heart that he would look back on and treasure in the face of impending death; and always getting the same answer: his meeting with HJ.

    He takes her hands from his face and looks her straight in the eye with a question that deliberately rephrases and resumes what she said to him the previous day outside the Hagwon: that theirs was a unique chance encounter during which their two different lives happened to cross and touch, but which neither of them should try to hold on to. "Was it just the snow? The pure white snow of Otaru covering the world and creating an illusion? If we'd met somewhere else, would we have just passed each other by without noticing. ... Would we??!!"

    What HJ says in reply to that is the turning point of this whole scene; and maybe, though of course we can't decide it yet, of the whole drama. It's a single Korean word [그랬겠지] that is maddeningly difficult to translate, because it's one of the rich repertoire of tentative answers to awkward questions that Korean makes available to people who feel unwilling or unable to commit themselves to either a "yes" or a "no", but who nevertheless want to say something rather than just make a totally noncommittal noise or stay silent. In its perhaps more common basic form it can often be translated as "maybe", but here it is decked out with additional qualifiers for which English has no real equivalent. In some ways, modifying Korean verbs and adjectives is a bit like customizing your own pizza. Here we have a "maybe" base with a generous helping of extra toppings, which tip the balance a bit further towards the "maybe we wouldn't [have passed each other by]" side rather than "maybe we would".

    JS seizes on that with a feverish eagerness that for a moment makes him forget his injuries, seizing her hands again and breathlessly begging her as if his life depended on it: "Well then, let's start over again. As if we'd first met right now. Because I'm someone who can love you." When she says no more, indeed bows her head and signals she can't take any more either, he tries to get to his feet - "OK then, I'll leave" She implores him again to let her take him to the hospital, but he ignores her plea and addresses her once more, as he stands in the street getting still more drenched while she is in what little shelter the garage overhang affords.

    "On my way here there was only one thought in my head: it's raining. And when it rains or when it snows people who are in love stand looking out the window, sheltered from the world outside. Because it's dark outside, someone looking out wouldn't see me. But it I'd be able to see her standing there." He smiles painfully then staggers off down the road, but stops a few yards away and turns to face her.

    We intercut to DW, warm and dry, observing the abandoned umbrella and guide's flag by the entrance.

    Then back to the street with JS rushing back first to kiss HJ then to drag her by the hand into the children's playpark. To see what fine acting we are watching in the sequence that follows, compare HJ's reactions to JS's passionate advances here with her behavior the night before when her husband forced her on to the bed. Watch how Oh Yeon Soo moves her neck, her shoulders and, above all, her hands in those two scenes. Out here in the rain, pressed up hard against the frame of the slide instead of flung on the bed, HJ is to some degree as uncomfortable, both physically and psychologically, as she was under her husband's assaults. But here she has caught the spark of JS's passion and her body is moving in consort with his, beyond the control of her will. Until, as once before in Otaru, after JS had dragged her by the hand into the back seat of the car in a similar burst of shared desire, she calls a halt.

    In the script, she does so here in exactly the same way as she did in Otaru, with the single word " 그만". But rather wonderfully, in the actual shoot of this scene, Oh Yeon Soo achieves the same effect simply by dropping her hands (with the camera following them as they hang limply in front of her, then cutting to a more distant view where her whole stance in DJ's arms indicates her withdrawal in sharp contrast to his still-writhing fevour) For a second, JS doesn't notice that they are no longer in the same flood of feeling. But then, very unlike DW, he senses that her body is signalling that she wants to stop, and he obeys, though not without some puzzlement and pleading.

    "You know you can't go back. You're like me. You have nowhere to go back to."

    "Let me go", she says, and it's not clear either to her or to us how far she is simply asking him to release his grasp and how far she wants a less literal release as well. "How much more miserable do you want to make me? You know very well if you carry on like that I won't be able to refuse you." They stand apart for a while, until HJ asks "Where do you live", then in case he takes that to mean "let's make it your place then", she adds "I can't go home in this state". And so we cut to HJ standing in the entrance of that apartment we now know so well.
  • barneyashleybarneyashley Posts: 98Member

    ROOKIE

    Thank you Baduy for all of the spoilers as you are so detailed in explaining on each action of HJ and JS . ( Comparing the way JS stopped when he knew that HJ did not want to continue and yet with her DW is another level ) .

    Please keep up with this good work . You sure will have many silent lurking fans reading your spoilers with this series . THis series is not that easy to watch . But once you got a bit of understanding of the dark sides of each characters , it is such an addicted series . Looking forward to reading more of your hard works in giving us all the spoilers .
  • baduybaduy UKPosts: 2,543Member

    LEGEND

    edited June 2008
    QUOTE (barneyashley @ Jun 18 2008, 10:54 PM) »
    Please keep up with this good work.


    Thank you for the appreciative comment. I just hope it hasn't brought you too many PMs yelling DON'T ENCOURAGE THAT WINDBAG!"

    Here now is something about the next 15 mins or so of screentime.

    ALL SPOILERS


    [ep 14 00:13:45]

    The dialog is quite sparse during the first part of HJ's visit to JS's apartment, and it's fairly easy to guess what it's about. But as in so many other scenes, there's a whole lot of vital interaction between the characters in bits I may appear to be skimming over, so I repeat my reminder that I'm mainly writing this to help out people who want some insight into what's being said before the subs are released, not as a full summary or recap. If I don't mention something that's purely visual, it doesn't mean I think it doesn't matter. I do go into gestures, looks etc where they are very much tied in with the dialog, but other parts I skip. That's especially the case towards the end of this post, between DJ's last quoted words and HJ's voiceover as she waits for a taxi. There are massively important wordless shots between those two points which I don't go into at all.

    Once HJ has, tentatively and uneasily at first, followed JS into the apartment, he invites her to have a hot shower and says that while she's doing that he'll take her clothes and dry them. [And so we discover another unique achievement of Korean technology. It seems that in the residents' laundry room of these modern apartment blocks there are these marvellous electric drum driers. You sling in an entire woman's outfit, drenched with rain and no doubt also sweat, generously smeared with blood and well-rubbed against wet muddy playground apparatus and just press a button, with not so much a glance at the fabric care labels. You've just time for a a plot-significant chat with the janitor (of which more in a moment) then the whole lot is ready to return to the wearer, stain-free, unshrunk, and dry, though the collar of the blouse could indeed do with a quick run-over with an iron. All this plus touchy-feely cellphones! How does the rest of the world survive without such marvels?]

    He adds that he'll go buy some food, because the refrigerator is completely bare (but doesn't seem to do that).

    [00:17:43]
    Back briefly to DW, who to judge from the debris in the right foreground of the shot has got through quite a few cans of beer by now, taking down a bottle of what counts in Kdrama land as malt whiskey. As if swigging the stuff from the bottle weren't bad enough, he anaesthetizes his taste buds (come on, Black Label isn't that bad, though there are a lot better malts to be had for the same price) by crunching ice cubes between swigs. Or maybe this is one of the bottles that the vanishing ajumma's boyfriend topped up with cold tea...]

    [00:18:36]
    Meanwhile, JS has showered and changed, and HJ is looking rather fetching in some white shorts and a shirt of JS's (or rather SG's) -- see koalabear's screencaps just above -- and is visibly morphing into a semi-domestic role. Again the sheer skill of Oh Yeon Soo's acting. In the interim the nervousness and air of anxious intrusion into an unpredictable stranger's space that marked her entrance into the apartment has been replaced by an almost homey familiarity with the kitchen,its equipment and the apartment's occupant as she begins to settle into Joon Soo's domain)
    HJ: How do you like your coffee? With sugar and cream or black?
    JS: With sugar and cream
    HJ: Hey, seems we have the same tastes ... I've not put a lot of cream in. Too much chloresterol is bad for you.
    JS: Yes, mommy.

    [Sorry, I made that very last line up, so don't go searching for it on the soundtrack, but I'm not being completely frivolous here. I don't want to give ammunition to the Tweenies-versus-Ajummas Hands Off Our Hunks Campaign, but there is plainly, within the extremely complex emotional cocktail of JS's and HJ's relationship, a mother-and-little-boy component. Just as there is a romping-with-my-favorite-sister component in his interactions with Da Ae. And this can hardly be accidental in someone whose real-life "sister" is in fact his mother, a crucial component in JS's psyche which he revealed to DA but, we are about to observe, he conceals, for now at least, from HJ, even when he is telling her other decisive things about his traumatic past that he refused to tell DA. There are things a man will tell his sister that he won't tell his mother, and vice versa...]

    [00:19:44]
    DW waiting half asleep and semi-drunk on the living-room sofa, eyes on the house entrance door, talking to himself. "What is she playing at? Doesn't come home to bed. Keeps me wide awake all night racked with jealousy waiting up for her in a terrible state. Gets a job in a travel agency and rents a place of her own, embraces a young man in the street outside the house. She's going to ruin my life this way. Jealousy? Can that really be it? Yes... You don't need to love someone to feel jealous."

    [00:21:09]
    Back to JS's apartment again. And now some rather more important dialog as they sip their low-chloresterol coffees.

    Things have turned out well in so far as his friend's body's been found, JH begins, but why did he have a passport in his friend's name, but with his own photograph (the passport JS forged, then later burned, but which HJ found in his bag at the Otaru hotel, where he'd used it to check in)? JS noticeably fails to answer that question, simply telling HJ that the apartment, his car, his motorbike, and even the clothes both of them are wearing right now, are his friend's.

    HJ appears not to notice at first how he ducked her first question, because she's trying to make sense of this latest piece of information. So, was he acting as a kind of caretaker for his friend's property in his absence? She breaks off her question, realizing how strange a notion that would be and that there's probably a more questionable explanation for JS "taking over" SG's belongings. JS doesn't even pretend to answer that one. Instead he comes up with a pretext to escape further questions. "I'll go see whether your clothes are dry yet". HJ sees through that one: "You can check that out later. I'm not going home just yet in any case" meaning she's not going home till she's found out more about him and his strange situation. JS simply ignores that remark and walks out of the apartment regardless.

    [00:22:45]
    We find JS in the laundry room sitting by that magic drier, where the janitor has some news for him. The tape recording the beating up that the gangsters took from the CCTV system wasn't the only one. There's a backup recorder that still has a complete tape of the events, which could be used in evidence. JS seems to be worried rather than pleased about that. Get rid of that tape, too, unless you want to get hurt, he tells the janitor. Forget all about what happened and get on with your job.

    [00:24:24]
    JS seems to decide he'd even rather face more questions from HJ than feed the janitor's curiosity about why he doesn't want the men who beat him up identified, and goes back up to the apartment, where to his alarm he finds HJ playing with the remote control picture changer behind his bed. [Again, something a well-mannered woman would hesitate to do in a complete stranger's apartment, but the sort of thing every newish girlfriend gets up to in her boyfriend's pad when he's popped to the bathroom...] She's just switched the picture over to Seong Goo when JS comes back in, and she shows she's not going to let the matter she first asked about drop. "So is that the man that passport belonged to?" "Your clothes aren't quite dry yet. Just a little while longer" is the only response JS gives her.

    So she presses the control again -- and up comes the picture of Da Ae. She stares at it for a long time, then gives a momentary edgy laugh: "This is fun" she says, but she's clearly not really amused.

    "Why did you break up with her?" Yet again, no reply from JS, but this time HJ has a follow-up question:
    - Was it because of my husband?
    - I already told you so, didn't I?.
    - I shadowed my husband and found he had a prettier, younger woman than me. But for more than a year I couldn't bring myself to say anything about it.

    She presses the control again, bringing back Joon Soo's picture, then Seong Goo's again. Joon Soo in sudden fury snatches the control from her hands and hurls it at and through the picture. He turns on her angrily:
    - What else do you want to know?! Tell me what else you want to know, I'll give you all the answers.

    For a moment, taken aback and puzzled by the barely-supressed fury in his voice, JH seems uncertain where to start, and JS turns on his heel and begins to walk away as if to escape while the going's good, but she calls after him
    - Tell me! Just what sort of a person are you, Joon Soo? [This is the selfsame question she asked her husband of 12+ years the previous evening in the garage; but then she didn't really expect an answer, since he was already giving it by his actions. But she badly wants an answer from JS now.]
    - After all, you know a lot about me, don't you?

    This time, she gets some answers, but delivered in a strange way. Still with his back to her, Joon Soo rattles out what sounds more like a terse extract from a personnel file than his own life story, and one that we know, for all its brevity, contains a significant falsehoood.

    "After I was born both my mother and my father passed away. Until I was six I was raised by my elder sister. After my sister married and left home, my maternal uncle took me in. Then while I was hanging out south of the Han river I met Sang Goo. Thanks to that friend I lived the high life of the super-rich. "

    He breaks off his breakneck recital and turns round to face HJ. With much more feeling, he goes on:

    "But that's not really what you want to know, is it?".
    "What I..." she begins, but can't continue.
    He goes up to her and grabs her by both arms.
    "You want to know how evil a man I seem to be? Whether I wanted to enjoy these things enough to commit murder?"

    He leaves go of her again and sinks down on to the bed.

    Once more he reverts, initially, to monotone rapid fire recitation, with his eyes to the ground, but this time in a way that suggests that what he is recalling and admitting is so appalling that he wants to get it said and over with as fast as humanly possible.

    "I didn't know what sort of things it would come to involve. ... I used to drive girls to Seong Goo's country villa. Almost every night I had to take some girl or other by car to his country place. [...] But on one occasion a girl repulsed SG and he got very angry. (The flashback rolls) Drunk and not knowing what she was doing the girl in the car started struggling. And then..." He pauses, and now the self-protective recitation mode is replaced by one of anguished recollection and confession, and the flashback sequence is replaced by a closeup of JS as he finishes his story. "...she fell out of the car. ... SG ... looked back at the girl who had fallen from the car lying seemingly dead in the road ....and laughed. ... Yes. I wanted to kill him. Not so much SG himself as his arrogance, his reckless way of life, things I hated enough to want to kill him for."

    He now looks up at JH, who is standing looking into the distance, trying to come to terms with what she's hearing, and asks her "Do you know what sort of things I did? Every morning I used to drive discarded girls home from that country villa.. I wasn't a human being...."

    HJ moves over towards him. Still standing, she puts her arms round his shoulders and draws his head towards her as he continues, weeping more than speaking:
    "...I was a hyena living on rotten meat, no better than a brute."

    Still with her arms round his shoulders, but not looking at him, as though she were addressing herself, fighting her own unease and suspicions about him, as much as trying to console him, HJ says "You didn't do anything wrong yourself. After all you didn't take any pleasure in things like that."

    "True. I don't even know for sure whether I killed him [That's such an important sentence that I'd better quote the Korean for the benefit of those who know the language better than I do, in case my ignorance is leading me astray: it's "내가 죽였는지도 몰라요"] SG was clinging to my hand over the edge of the precipice. I don't know who let go."

    [00:31:55]
    HJ's voiceover as she waits to catch a cab home next morning:
    "It's something I have to understand. Something that means getting into the heart and mind of someone else. A fear that takes my breath away... "

    Aw shucks guys, the last few words of her voiceover after that have me floored (well, just the very last word to be precise: "내가 살아있다는 이 설레임..." That defeats even my massive capacity for shameless bluffing. But I hope the general drift is clear enough.


    [00:32:07]

    Cut from HJ trying to catch a cab in the early morning rushhour to Detective Park driving along the highway looking pretty worked up, unlike his usual impassive self, changing lanes in VERY Korean fashion (though he does briefly signal, maybe a remnant of his police training, before lunging/swerving), reaching the Kang mansion entrance barrier and hitting his hooter very impatiently. The putative second wife (AKA the hostess with the leastest) doesn't exactly welcome him: "But it's the crack of dawn! You do realize you're going to have to wait?". "Fine, I'll wait", says Park unabashed.

    [[00:33:24]

    HJ arrives home, retrieving with a smile and carefully stowing away the tour guide's flag still lying in front of the gate. Then it's music-facing time. If she feared a big row, she needn't have worried: DJ is in ice-man mode as he fixes breakfast at the stove. "Come and do this, please. ... Since you're back, take over this job." " But before he relinquishes his cooking post, he rather pointedly asks for information about making an omlette, Korean style (= virtually anything vaguely edible plus a couple of eggs).
    - I've already done most of the work. Just finish this off while I go shower.
    - Are the kids up?
    - They're showering. (Shouts upstairs) Na Rae, your omlette's ready, come down and eat it quick! (Then, quietly, to HJ alone) I told the kids you were still asleep in the bedroom because you were sick. So pretend you're sick.

    [00:35:18]
    Back at the Kang mansion, the President has now come downstairs in his dressing gown to talk to Park. But although they have plainly already been talking for some time when we rejoin the scene, its noticeable that Kang hasn't asked Park to sit down opposite him at the table. [We know that, and that it's significant, because in Korean etiquette you just can't say "No thanks, I'd rather stand, if that's OK with you." If someone as important as President Kang invites you to sit, you jolly well sit, even if you've got a sore butt and there's a coil of barbed wire on the chair. So Park is still standing because the President is signalling he's none too welcome.]

    "And so...?" the President is asking.
    PARK: The way that friend suspiciously used a false identity should perhaps be officially investigated [or maybe 친구 here is just "guy" not "friend", but since the reference is to JS anyway it doesn't really matter]
    KANG: Our little talk is over.
    Ignoring that attempt to send him away, Park takes a video tape from his inside pocket and lays it on the table [So that janitor isn't half as stupid as he pretends to be, even if he was so scared by Da Ae's outburst after her car was towed away that he thought it might have been she who set the gangsters on to JS...]
    PARK: It's all recorded on here ...Even if Lee Joon Soo did kill your son, the matter can't be resolved by methods like this. It has to be by proper legal processes.
    KANG: Legal processes?!
    PARK: Yes indeed, sir.
    KANG: Now you listen here! I lost my one and only son. Compared to that, exactly how the kid died isn't such an issue. Whether it was murder or an accident. What's the point of proclaiming the whys and wherefores of it to the world in general? ... I know full well the sort of life my son lived. Why should so many people who have no business knowing about his private life learn anything beyond the fact that he's dead and laid to rest? ... Let it drop.
    PARK: But if an investigation revealed that your son had been murdered, what would you do? Would you send people to carry out private retribution in that case, too?
    KANG: If that guy was sent to jail or killed, would that bring my son back to life? Just bury it.

  • KyUhNyUnNieKyUhNyUnNie SJ WORLD ^_^Posts: 29Member
    thanks to baduy and koalabear for the spoiler n pics...
    QUOTE
    Please keep up with this good work . You sure will have many silent lurking fans reading your spoilers with this series . THis series is not that easy to watch . But once you got a bit of understanding of the dark sides of each characters , it is such an addicted series . Looking forward to reading more of your hard works in giving us all the spoilers .


    QUOTE
    I have been reading your posts intensely, BADUY...
    though rarely with enough time to comment.
    But a deep and wide basket full of appreciation for
    your time and insights into this series!


    yeaaaa...u're right
    iam one of that people who always read it ^^
    n i dunno what to say, except..many thanks to you...^^
    like barneyashlaey said " KEEP UP WITH THIS GOOD WORK"


    btw...koalabear...I wanna ask request ^^there's someway to DL that vid fancam, that u posted??
    i like it MUCHH!!! image
    thanks again for all of ur update..^^
  • koalabearkoalabear Whole Hearted Happiness PhilippinesPosts: 3,810Member
    baduy...you won me already with your spot translations...funny that I watch it raw and as much as it is hard to watch the drama, as well as I was trying to understand what the characters are all saying...I still hope you don't stop doing them...anyway just realized that Dong-won is realizing how important or feels so insulted that his wife had dumped him for a much younger guy who loves her more...we'll know in the next episode though if Hye-jin will accept Junsoo's proposal...

    KyUhNyUnNie...I have no ides as well on how to download the fan made vid...as I can't download it as well but it was nicely done
  • gerryggerryg Posts: 4,468Friend of Soompi

    IDOL

    QUOTE (barneyashley @ Jun 18 2008, 05:54 PM) »
    Thank you Baduy for all of the spoilers as you are so detailed in explaining on each action of HJ and JS . ( Comparing the way JS stopped when he knew that HJ did not want to continue and yet with her DW is another level ) .

    Please keep up with this good work . You sure will have many silent lurking fans reading your spoilers with this series . THis series is not that easy to watch . But once you got a bit of understanding of the dark sides of each characters , it is such an addicted series . Looking forward to reading more of your hard works in giving us all the spoilers .

    I think it's only fair that I fess up and admit that I am one of your silent lurking fan image
    I'm not even looking at the videos! I am merely enjoying your insightful, informative comments.
    Keep up with the excellent work! image

    Thanks!
  • alfredoalfredo Posts: 438Member
    Thanks Baduy for the insights.
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