jechoi1
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Posts posted by jechoi1
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On 3/19/2017 at 0:04 AM, Era Ferawati said:
btw about hyungsik looks in HS found this scene he back to original hyungsik
cute hyungsikPHS coming out of the water is the best. I think it's one of his best looks because it goes back to his original cute image. Not as much makeup, the hair isn't so polished anymore, and he's smiling his normal cute smile. If you've watched his appearance on Law of the Jungle, there's a scene where he's learning to snorkel and he does this same exact move. He pops up out of the water, pushes his hair back, and... smiles. I think it should be his trademark or something.
PHS was Real Men for close to one year. He starts with intensive ranger training and ends with it, which is a really nice way to wrap things up. Someone on this post mentioned that they didn't like Real Men after Henry joined. I just got to the part where Henry joined and I would have to agree that the show seemed to take a different direction with Henry. I think the PD wanted to make it more "entertaining" or something. I agree that it was not a good choice. What I like about Real Men is it gives a brief glimpse of army life. It shows the different divisions, and the hardships that Korea's young men go through. I think it would also make Korean society appreciate the men who are serving in the military more. Then it takes this clueless foreigner idol, a member of SuJu (and let's be honest here that SuJu members are aces at variety shows), and he treats the whole experience like a joke. Sure, his own managers seemed to be treating it as a joke, but once he arrived and realized that it's not a joke, I think he should have started taking things seriously. I can't tell if he's really that clueless, or if he's purposely just going forward with his created image. PHS was loved on Real Men because he was also clueless, but he was so earnest in trying his best. It's also hard to continue watching because Ryu Soo Young, Jang Hyuk, and Son Jin Young left the show and we had already seen the relationship develop between all of them.
On another note, I think that PHS is too skinny. I agree that he looks fantastic in skinny jeans, but a part of that is also because he tends to wear a bulky top. For example, the high turtleneck with a long overcoat, or a bulkier hoodie. These things hide how skinny he is. While I'll admit that I love a man in a suit, that scene where he's getting dressed really highlighted how he's too skinny. When you see him in just his dress shirt, you can see how he's practically swimming in it. He's tall, which means he has the longer arms, which means he needs to get a bigger size. However, he doesn't have enough bulk in his upper body to wear that larger size shirt. But big bonus points to his stylist who figured how that he looks really good in the long coats. He seems to wear them a lot, not just in SWDBS, but also in many of his other appearances and outings. And lastly, he's so skinny that it makes his head look even bigger. I can't figure out if he actually has a big head (despite having a small face, which is something that I've seen in real life on another person), or if it only appears that way because of his hair + he's so skinny. In the bts of SWDBS where they show the scene where DBS is carrying AMH after he gets shot by the BB gun, someone (maybe PHS) cries out, "the head is too big." I think the speaker is referring to PHS's head because it's a closeup shot of just PBY and PHS.
One final note, I'm also currently watching the Shining Eunsoo, which is a daily drama that star's PHS' ZE:A mate Kim Dong Joon. Anyway, there's a side character whose name is Park Hyung-Sik in it.
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@ferily To me, it looks like he wears a lot of makeup. Even in the Free Hugs event, you can see that he has a thick layer of foundation or BB cream or whatever and heavily colored in eyebrows. About Ryewook's stylist, I don't know if it's her/him or if it's perhaps Ryewook's personal preference to be so heavily made up. To me, Ryewook is almost freakishly made up. If you watch Celebrity Bromance, you can see that PHS is also made up--his hair is styled (beautifully), he has make up on because you know that it's just not natural (compare his face to that in Real Men). But, compared to Ryewook, you can almost believe that PHS has no makeup on. That's how much makeup Ryewook wears.
I agree that PHS' default weight tends to be on the thin side. I don't think he's naturally bulky and I don't think he's all that interested in being muscular either. He's always been very skinny and I think a part of him is a little self-conscious about that. Not enough to bulk up, which I understand because I hate exercise, but self-conscious enough that he doesn't seem to enjoy taking off his shirt.
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14 hours ago, Ainee Etp said:
Running Man was his worst hair style, thick and like you said upside down bowl. But now you mentioned it, perhaps he was growing it while stylist still trying to make out what to do with his hair. Even though Ahn Min Hyuk hairstyle is good, nothing beats his High Society's bed head (OK, exclude the sageuk long hair). It had an Edward Cullen feel.
I can't ascertain whether he's wearing a lot of makeup or not in SWDBS. Sometimes he looks natural sometimes not very (with pinkish lips). He seemed 'white' and 'pink' during the sunset scene, so you're right. I didn't notice eyeshadows, are there? The eyebrows, I think, are naturally thick and overly black. He trimmed them down in high society.
I wish he will be less self-conscious about his look. He avoided all the cameras in 2D1N in the morning, after the sleep in. Couldn't catch his face at all in there.
No no no.. please not Ryeowook's stylist.
He shouldn't have an idol-stylist for acting. These kind of stylists are CC cream worshippers.
I noticed that too in his 1N2D appearance. He was totally hiding his face in the morning and it was so obvious that he was doing that. Completely different from his Real Men appearances where there was no makeup and they caught him on camera just waking up in the middle of the night.
To me, the eyeshadow is pretty obvious. At first it was focused on the outer corner of his eyes. A darker taupe that was really noticeable. Now, it seems to have moved over his entire eyelid. As for the eyebrows, I think they colored it in a LOT. I think he needs to be careful with how he makes up his face because of his nose. To me, the angle of his nose is such that people may think he had plastic surgery. Therefore, I think he should try to go a little more natural with his makeup.
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On 3/10/2017 at 1:20 AM, Ainee Etp said:
With all those photos from his debut until now, it's only a span of 6 years plus. How did a cute boy transformed into a charismatic man, especially with only the teeth changed and losing some baby fat.
Heirs was in 2013. Two years later High Society and kaboomm, a man was born! Another two years later Hwarang, and a sageuk king was born.
Whoever did his hair in High Society and Hwarang, I want to hug her/him.
It's the hair. His hair in High Society changed everything. OK, I kinda of take that back. I think the transformation started towards the very end of What's With this Family. If you see him in the Running Man episode, you see his hair is starting to take on what will eventually be his High Society hair. It looks a bit more like an upside down bowl, but you can see where it's going. And then High Society happened. If you haven't seen his Celebrity Bromance, you should check out his hair there (which he was in the process of growing out for Hwarang). Personally, I think it beats his High Society hair.
But aside from his hair, I think it's more than just the teeth. He's mentioned in interviews that he gets a lot of skincare, and you can see that he's wearing soooooo much more makeup than before. I'm almost a little worried for him because in Strong Woman, he's extremely made up, so much so that it sometimes detracts from his acting. The eyeshadow and the eyebrows, on top of all the foundation and contouring. It makes me fear that he has a new stylist and she's SJ's Ryewook's old stylist. I'm not very familiar with Ryewook, but watching Celebrity Bromance, you see one beautiful PHS and one very plastic-looking Ryewook.
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Omo! Is PHS a player? Just kidding. But it's cute how much more comfortable he is with "skinship" as the Koreans call it. He's very natural in his interactions with cardboard cutout Bongsoon, and also those lucky fangirls. But, I suppose that's part of his natural personality. His ZE:A members have said in the past that he naturally has a lot of aegyo, and his What's With this Family co-stars mentioned he often greets people with a hug. Actress Kim Hyun Joo also said that he's very natural with his skinship.
On another note, does anyone else suspect that perhaps he's lying about his height? Don't want to anger anyone here, but he's soooo much shorter than Jisoo in the video posted above, and Jisoo is (I believe) listed to be only 6"1' compared to PHS's 6". Also, I was watching the 1N2D Hwarang episode and PHS doesn't seem much taller than Minho, who is supposed to be only 180 cm to PHS 183 or 184 cm. Of course, Minho could be wearing those heel inserts... I've also noticed that PHS tends to slouch, BUT, he doesn't appear to be slouching in the video above. In fact, it's Jisoo that's slouching.
I'm glad that PHS is getting more and more acting roles, but I hope that he still continues with his singing because this boy can sing. My favorite is his duet with Kwanghee of Davichi's Don't Say Goodbye. I feel that with ZE:A and even many of his OST songs, they try to highlight his head voice more (i.e., his higher falsetto). But boy can he belt out a ballad. Hope he keeps lending his voice to the OSTs of the various projects that he's involved in.
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I've recently been watching the Real Men show that PHS was cast on. If you haven't watched it, I highly recommend it. First, it's more fun than I thought it would be to watch men in the military. It's funny to see how they try to have fun even in the midst of dull army life. The really interesting thing though is that PHS was on it from 2013-2014, so you could say that it was just before he started to rise in fame and popularity. The reality is that even though he's an idol, ZE:A was never very popular, and PHS was also in the back. When you watch PHS now, he has a very manufactured "cool" image that you would expect of a successful idol-actor. In Real Men, he is known as the Baby Soldier and you see him kind of as he probably really is. He doesn't seem to be making any effort to look cool or anything. Rather, he's just trying to survive army life. I think in one interview, ZE;A mate Im Siwan even said that PHS is really funny and cute in the group. However, the agency tried to manufacture his image as a "cool" guy. However, in Real Men, you see the real PHS and Siwan thinks that's why PHS was receiving so much love from the public--because Real Men showed PHS as he really is--a nice guy who is confused a lot of the time, but works really hard.
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I haven't been watching this as faithfully recently just because I was fed up with the extraneous story filler and the way that Korean dramas typically cycle downwards as it nears its end. So I finally watched Episodes 47 and 48 last night and I just have to share that I am completely fed up with JE. If this drama is supposed to be about character changes, then JE completely fails.
HK, we see her turning from a shrewd businesswoman to someone who learns to take others into consideration. Honestly, the only real complaint I have about the old HK is that she was somewhat of a robot. Sure, not someone you may want to be married to when you're seeking some sympathy, but you can see why her father-in-law turned her into his hunting dog. She was extremely good at what she did and thought 3 steps ahead with precision. At the helm of company, that's what you want. And despite that, the flashbacks show her being a good and loving mother to Eunsol.
I've never liked JE for being the wuss in the relationship. Poor, little rich boy who dares to scorn his father's money. Wake up! It's your father's money that allowed you to live as you did with your head in the clouds. I can't stand the fact that he criticized HK and told her to learn to live as a human when he lives as a little fairy boy. He's so quick to point out to HK that people get what they deserve, that they are treated as they deserve to be, but he can't swallow that pill himself. Why is BS HK's lighthouse? Why is she only completely honest with BS? Because JE has NEVER been that strong oak that HK can rely on. He has NEVER been a partner to her. He's like that albatross strung across HK's neck that drags her down. Let me count the ways:
- Delicate little momma's boy who won't work at the company, so HK has to fill in for him (OK, so that's my interpretation of the situation, but what else am I to think?);
- Father kills HK's father;
- Instead of supporting HK and grieving with her when their daughter is murdered, he shuts her out. He blames her for Eunsol's death, when hello? It was your father who is really to blame;
- His father turned her into his own personal hunting dog;
- His sister frames her to send her to jail
- Stupid, incompetent little princess (yes, I meant to call to him a princess and not a prince because in my opinion, he doesn't have the cojones to be called a prince) who dares to swim with the corporate sharks and therefore requires HK to watch his back and protect him
Maybe I'm too hard on him, but I just don't see how he's anything to HK other than dead weight. She seems to want him and that's the only reason that I've supported him. And I can live with stupid. But where does he get the nerve to be mad at HK? So mad, in fact, as to not see her even once during the year she spent in jail BECAUSE OF HIS FAMILY? He was mad before her sentencing and I thought he was stupid, but I'm used to his whiny, stupid self by now. However, to learn that he never saw her once? Never wrote to her? And not because of something stupid, like "I don't want to cry in front of her" or "I'll miss her too much if I see her" but because he's mad? What right does he have to be mad? And what right does he have to be concerned for her at this point? If I were HK, I would just throw him away. Continue to take care of mother-in-law but just cut that oozing, gangrenous dead skin that is called Choi Jineon out of your life. He doesn't like HK wearing the short cheongsam? Of course not? Because he wishes he could wear it. Pants have never been comfortable for him because he knows he belongs in diapers and little dress.
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@lclarakl: I LOVE your starfish story. This is the first time hearing it and it can be used in so many applications. And I did not catch that about SR, although I did wonder why her last name and her first name did not match the other siblings.
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@mdj101: I'm glad you got my reference to the movie. I watched all three versions and I would recommend watching the American and French versions. I liked the Korean one the least because I have a hard time understanding most Korean movies. Not just because of the language, but because I don't understand the art of Korean movie-making. It's different from what I'm used to and I just don't get it. I live in America so, of course, I liked the American version and it had great actors and actresses (including Michelle Pfiffer). As for the original French version, well, it's French and Americans think that everything French is fantastic so there you go.
@lclarakl: Hurray! I'm so glad that you liked my post. Honestly, I was feeling a little bummed out by the recent episodes. I also agree with ALMOST everything you said. The only part I disagree with is the character of BS's father. Is he doing an admirable thing by adopting children? Absolutely. However, he adopted a lot of children and I wonder if he's even able to really care for them. In the earlier episodes, we saw how he would carry the youngest on his back while he worked in the restaurant, and again this is admirable. And he's giving the children a better life (so we presume) than what they would have had. But I've always had an issue with people who have more kids than they can handle (whether it's adopted or foster or natural children). If you can, people should have only as many as they can afford and give sufficient attention to. And in the case of BS's father, I think he adopted too many. It may just be the way it's portrayed, but it seems to me that BS, Amnesia HK, and SR take care of the children more than the father does. He is also too lenient. After all, look at how SR turned out. BS was #1 and he turned out fantastic. SR was #2 and she's a complete mess. Even when she was first on her path of destruction, the father did not handle it well. Children need boundaries. It's how they learn and how they feel safe. Children without boundaries are just feral menaces to society. Sure, SR may have turned out well in terms of education, but I think I can safely say that none of us would want her for a friend. In fact, she has no friends. That should tell you something. Moving on, Child #3 had some issues but she's a teenager so we can excuse that a little. But really, I would say that by Child #3, BS and HK were doing most of the raising. Whether you adopt or give birth to a child, when you have a child, you are accepting a responsibility. Feeding and providing a home? That's what all parents should be doing at a minimum. I don't think any parent deserves a medal just for doing that. Parenting requires teaching a child about morals, boundaries, how to love, how to share, how to be a person that is not completely selfish and can live in the world with others.
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So now that I've had a little time to digest episodes 39 and 40, I'm not sure how I feel about where this drama is going. It certainly has been a lot of ups and downs. In the beginning, it was all just pure rage as I saw everything from HK's perspective. Then the drama became really addicting as we see Amnesia HK with a different perspective on life and JE making a fool of himself as he starts to pursue her. But now, with all different plots going on, I don't know how I feel. Honestly, I've always viewed this drama as being about a married couple that went through an incredibly rough patch and now trying to put their life back together. But now, there's the whole Did-MH-kill-HK's father subplot and I'm just not that interested. I'm not sure what purpose it serves other than to give MTS another weapon. For all that I don't like MTS and think he's stupid, he has a pretty good strategy of divide and conquer. He breaks up any alliances that he sees and bribes or blackmails people into his corner.
But quite honestly, if it weren't for the JE's dad maybe killed HK's dad subplot, can we agree that JE and HK would be completely back together by now? Sure, HK and JE both have a ways to go in their quest for redemption, but it wouldn't be such a big deal. Instead, this subplot is there just to keep things going through Episode 50. This is one of the things that I hate about Kdramas--the unnecessary filler subplots that serve only to drag out a series. Honestly, I would rather reach the conclusion earlier and have the writer create new plots, such as how they continue to live in their happily ever after.
My take on whether or not MH killed his friend is that he did. Otherwise, why all the cover up? And, when JE confronted him, he didn't deny it, which is what he should have done if he's innocent. Instead, he rationalized his actions trying to excuse his murder. Look at what I was able to do with the Ssanghwatang (or whatever it's called). I created a company and lots of jobs and made myself rich. My friend would have just lost it and all his money. If he is reminiscent, it's because he's spent over 30 years excusing and rationalizing his behavior that he now probably really believes it and only remembers the good times with his friend.
HK vs SR. Big sigh. OK. So I understand why HK did what she did and how it showed how much of a bigger person HK is. However, I don't know that I completely agree with her sentiment. Yes, she should have discussed her issues with her cheating husband. But, that seems to almost absolve SR's guilt and buys into SR's excuse of I'm-only-a-victim/pawn-in-this-sick-game-that-you-and-your-husband-are-playing. Seriously. SR makes out like HK and JE are the Marquise de Merteuil and the Vicomte de Valmont from Dangerous Liaisons and they purposely drew SR into a game. What I do find interesting is that SR and HK really do parallel each other in some ways. Pre-JE (including his family), both are bright people focused on their own futures. Once they meet JE and become embroiled in his family's politics, they change into cold, calculating people. Hope SR gets the message, accepts her own blame in a lot of things, and gets down on her knees to beg HK's forgiveness (which she never did. Her asking Amnesiac HK to invite JE to the engagement dinner was not nearly self-effacing enough to compare to HK getting down on her knees and begging SR to leave her husband alone).
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I think there are 2 motorcycle guys. One of them (the one that woks at the gas station) is SIS's son. He is the one that left the plant at HK's apartment and threw the rock at her car and punctured her tires. Then there is the motorcycle guy that bashed BS. I think it's two different people. Because there is no reason for SIS' son to want to kill BS, but motorcycle #2 was definitely aiming for BS and not HK.
MTS only found out who motorcycle #1 was (and that this guy even existed) when he found him dropping off the plant at HK's apartment. And just like MTS, he figures that he can frame SIS' son to kill BS. That way, now he has something that he can threaten SIS with after SIS has done MTS's dirty work for him.
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37 minutes ago, deandraluv said:
The Song is Old Love or Bygone Love by Lee Moon Sae. I have posted the link of the original singer and the english translation of the song in this thread p, 512 (?) and some had previously posted it as well.
thank you so much!!!
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20 hours ago, deandraluv said:
-Humility as Webster defines: the quality or state of not thinking you are better than other people, not proud. Wikipedia: is variously seen as the act or posture of lowering oneself in relation to others, or conversely, having a clear perspective and respect for one's place .
Humility is often thought of as being the opposite of pride and in my opinion, JE is full of pride. Pride manifests in different ways. It's said that pride is the greatest of the 7 sins and one that even God or the Devil cannot win against because pride is that deadly. Here is how I see pride manifesting in JE. JE looks down on corporate types, such as his own father, MTS, and even pre-amnesia HK. I hate to keep going back to this quote, but it's just so accurate a description of JE. Remember when JE found out that HK was stabbed and he runs to MTS's office and punches him out? Well, MTS says something along the lines of how people like JE can stay lily white because of people like MTS doing all the dirty work. Dirty work that allows people like JE to live an easy life with money and principals. We all hate MTS (or at least I think we all do), but he's right in this case. JE never had to get his hands dirty because there were so many other people willing to bathe in dung-water (to quote the drama) and allow JE to live his cushy life. JE is blind to all this, and instead, looks down on others because they have gotten dirty. Is it right to get dirty? Of course not. But, it's also pride to look down others and that's what JE is doing. But he's only looking down on people who deserve to be looked down upon. MTS, MH, and HK are despicable and deserve it. It doesn't matter. Humility assumes that you understand that you don't have the right to judge anyone no matter the circumstances. Pride is what drives you to believe you have the right to judge and look down on others.
@lclarakl: Something happened as I tried to quote you. Just wanted to share that I also really enjoyed that documentary and remembered thinking that they had the luxury of going home. And, they "earned" their "income" by drawing a number out of a hat, as opposed to working the fields and trying to sell it and having the discouragement of not being able to sell or earn anything. Still, I was encouraged by the thought that such young teenagers were willing to put themselves outside of their comfort zone in this manner and document their experience for the purpose of highlighting the conditions that these people lived in.
@lclarakl: And one of your other comments about JE being bold and assertive when no-longer-amnesiac HK asked for a timeout reminded me that Koreans love their stalkers. I remember many years ago I was talking to one of my cousins who lives in Korea and we were discussing courting/dating behavior. My opinion was that Korean males tend to act like stalkers and that kind of behavior would be the grounds for a restraining order in the U.S. And yet, culturally, in Korea, it's considered romantic and a sign of the guy's commitment. It's like the Harlequin romance novels and bodice rippers of old where the romance authors write the heroes to sound assertive and all alpha male, when in reality, their behavior is always borderline abusive.
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First, does anyone know the song that plays in Episode 36? It begins with BS singing it as a penalty for losing the drinking game, and then continues with the original singer as JE stares forlornly at HK's apartment. Anyone?
After watching Episodes 36 and 37, I am getting more and more fed up with JE's character. I've always viewed him as a some sort of privileged loser with blinders on. He hated his father's company and business ethics and chose to encase himself in soft cotton doing research at a university. And while he's doing all this, he feeds his wife to the wolves. In the earlier episodes and the recent episodes, he confesses that he was attracted to SR because she reminded him of HK before they got married. To JE, he thought that SR was focused only on her studies to the exclusion of everything else the way that HK used to be. And he wanted to protect that. I wonder if he recognized even then that he failed to protect HK from that, which is essentially his family. So JE whisks SR off to the U.S. away from his family, and leaves HK behind. Did he ever wonder back then, during the affair days, why HK changed so much? Did he ever wonder why she worked for the company that he hated so much? I'm glad that he's "suffering" so much now that he sees just how sinister his family history is. And I'm glad that he's finally realizing what really happened to HK all those years, why she changed so much in personality. But he also needs to see the role that he himself played in Eunsol's death. I think he still thinks that it was all HK's fault--that if only she weren't such a cut-throat attorney, that perhaps their daughter would be alive. But he needs to see that HK was only doing what she thought she needed to do to protect her own family. In hindsight, everything is clear. But I'm sure that at the time, HK thought she was protecting her family's future by protecting CN Pharmaceuticals. She probably thought that the company was her daughter's legacy and inheritance and she needed to protect that. Also, with JR for a sister-in-law,, HK probably dealt with a lot of snide remarks about her background and how she brought nothing to the marriage. So, HK probably felt that she had to work for the company to contribute to the marriage. And, in her own way, I think that HK was tryng to protect or provide for JE as well. She knew that he wanted nothing to do with the company. But what father is going to let that go on forever? I think HK's working for the company (and doing such a spectacular job of it) bought JE more time to pursue his research and academia. It's as though HK was bringing home the bacon and taking on all of the responsibilities while JE was just a spoiled, rich kid indulging in his little research hobby.
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@lclarakl: I think your point about expectations is right on point. How viewers feel about the affair may depend on their own personal experience with cheating spouses. I think many, who have not had any experience, want to believe that a couple can pull through an affair and find love again. It's almost like a source of comfort for women who fear that their husbands will cheat. "See? JE was terrible about his affair, but look at how much he regrets it now." There seems to be so many drama and romance novel plots about the cheating husband who then realizes what a jerk he was and learns to grovel at this wife's feet. And when you have no personal experience with it, it's possible to watch or read something like this in a safe vacuum and think that the couple should get back together. But you're absolutely right that affairs have real and lasting consequences.
I agree with you that this drama has grossly glossed over JE's role in this whole mess. SR is guilty, but JE also actively encouraged her. And he needs to grovel much more before he should be forgiven. The only reason that I'm willing to forgive him is that it's ultimately HG's decision and if she wants him back, then well, she should have him back.
On another note, why, why, why the preemption of another episode? Is this drama doing so poorly in ratings? And why it is always this one that is getting preempted? Why can't they preempt a different Sunday or Saturday drama? So frustrating! I'm almost ready to stop watching this until it's finished. I hate you SBS! Air your lame special at a different time. What's wrong with 6:00? Better yet, what's wrong with 6:00 a.m.? Families are gathered together and everyone can watch your lame special as a family if you air it earlier. By 10:00 p.m., everyone has gone home and is too tired to watch tv.
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8 minutes ago, Lmangla said:
am still puzzled by SR's obsession over the hurt caused by HK giving her shoes. did she feel like an idiot because she was an orphan and people often made fun of her for lack of shoes or clothes? did she feel ashamed of her desire because people told her that as an orphan, she should not aim high. while I can understand her pride being hit, what exactly HK did that was so bad is still a mystery. SR was also humiliated by GN, JR, MH and mama choi. but she is not gunning for them. so it is all a bit weird.. hope the writer explains a bit about SR so that we can put it into perspective.
Yes! What is the obsession behind shoes in this drama? I thought I missed it because I fast-forwarded through the earlier episodes, but JE is also rather obsessed with shoes, shoelaces, and feet. Can anyone explain?
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@seungshin: Great insight into jondaemal vs bandaemal. My 2 cents: I thought the writer had Dr. Min always speak in jondae to emphasize how socially awkward he is. Actually, I'm going to go a step further and say that he's not just socially awkward, he's almost socially impaired. It seems to be me that the only personal relationship that he has is with his brother. He begins to feel some sympathy and responsibility towards HG's mother when she was locked in her shock and depression, but he really has no notion of how to interact with other people.
6 hours ago, sweetpeaga said:I'm of the firm belief that this is when Hae Kang should have called it quits with Jin Uhn, but she didn't. It made me question why? Where was her self respect? This man had been treating her horribly for about a year, why was she hanging on to him? It made me think back then that she saw him as some type of personal toy only devoted to her that she didn't want to lose; I never equated it to love for some reason.
My take on this is that HG was still dealing with the shock of her daughter's death. Imagine that your life begins to change uncontrollably. We see the flashbacks to how happy HG and JE were in their married life. Then BAM! Your daughter is killed right before your eyes and you know it has something to do with you. Moreover, you know it has something to do with what you did for your FIL, whose company you have been working for while your loser husband goes off and lives forever in the glass tower that is a university environment (I know that college can be hard and competitive but any university environment really is a glass tower that is separate from the real world). So, I bet that a part of HG was also mad at JE and blamed him in part for their daughter's death as well. Also, her own guilt prevents her from dealing with her loss and guilt and so she tries to lock it all away and becomes more of a robot than a person. Then, BAM! Not only have you lost your daughter, but now you're losing your husband as well. I can see why she would try to cling onto the remnants of her happier life. Should she make JE suffer? YES. I would want to make him suffer. In fact, I didn't really feel bad for him when he thought HG died and later when HG pretended to have lost 4 years of her recent memory.
5 hours ago, Kfan7172 said:@irilight I agree with your "call out" of me and the mixing of apple and oranges - ref American vs Korean law and the fact that we are discussing a Kdrama. I truly hope that a Korean lawyer also has a means within the legal system to protect their personal beliefs, should they wish to exercise it.
I do not have any legal professional background, but would like to believe that a lawyer is not "locked" into doing things against their basic nature, because of client privilege. I do believe that based on the rule I discussed in my postings page 520, 523 that they do, at least in American legal system.Again, the code of ethics per the ABA is not that simple. And, despite the recognition between any differences between the American and Korean system, differences in basic legal concepts between differing countries are not that different. Why? Because many legal systems are based on already existing systems. And Korean dramas are often ridiculous and written in a vacuum. Although IHAL is not written as a makjang, there are certainly makjang elements in every Korean drama. One of my pet peeves with Korean dramas has always been that the writers rarely seem to conduct any research into what they are writing. Korean dramas love to use the cellphone recording as the endgame of all mysteries and conspiracies. In my professional opinion, good luck getting a voice recording entered as evidence, at least in an American court.
Also, I still stand by my position that we (or me, anyway) don't know what pre-divorce HG knew. Personally, it would surprise me if she knew everything. Lawyers often get a bad rap because it's assumed that they know everything and only work to help their clients cover up their bad deeds. Yes, this happens, but not always. Precisely because there is a point where we have to talk about what we know. And the reality is that the legal system, and our own code of ethics (laugh if you will) requires us to maintain confidentiality. I don't think it necessarily means that lawyers lose a piece of their humanity just because they maintain confidentiality.
So why does HG feel so guilty then? Because she does. It's human nature to feel guilt over the fact that you had any involvement in the murder of your sister's fiancee. Does it mean she is guilty? No. What about the female plaintiff that committed suicide? HG feels guilty because she's finally unlocked from her pre-divorce stasis where she felt no emotions. Was she completely honest in her presentation of evidence? No. But you know what? Her job is to defend the company, not be an advocate for the plaintiff. The plaintiff had her own lawyer and it's not HG's fault that she's a better lawyer, who did all this research into the plaintiff's background. The plaintiff's lawyer should have known all this information about his own client and he should have objected to the evidence, as presented, or re-examine the plaintiff to explain the evidence. The thing is, I don't know how it is in Korea, but in the U.S., people don't go to trial. If a civil matter goes to trial, it's because someone is being unreasonable. Why? Because it's too expensive to go to trial and the outcome can never be guaranteed, absent exceptional circumstances. Hence, you settle. Therefore, if a case goes to trial, then my attitude is that the gloves are off and it's each attorney's job to their very best. As an attorney, every piece of evidence or precedent that you present or cite to is done with a twist that is most favorable towards your client. And it's up to the other side to their job and counter your evidence.
Lastly, the attorney is merely an advocate, not the judge and jury. Therefore, a part of the code of ethics is that you represent and advocate for your client to the best of your ability and leave the judging to another party. Maybe that sounds like a cop out to some, but this is how we maintain the system. It's not about an individual client, it's about upholding a system that you believe in. The system is not perfect, but what would happen if every attorney decided that their client was guilty and each time changed his or her behavior to suit their own judgment of guilt? Attorneys are not infallible in their judgment and have prejudices of their own, and I think the American society saw what happened when attorneys allowed their own prejudices to affect the type of representation they gave their client.
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Can anyone clarify whether or not YG is still working for SR? I know that YG has some issues to work through regarding her mom and dad's divorce, her fiancee's death, etc., but I feel like most of her problems and resentment is due to misinformation fed by SR. I think we all need to remember that SR is telling lies to YG. She was first doing it to keep the two apart so that HG wouldn't realize her true identity. And then I wonder if SR continues to tell the lies because she starts to believe her own lies, or if she's just doing it out of spite now.
My take on the mom "leaving" her husband and YG behind. Back in those days in Korea, if parents divorced, the children always stayed with the father. Different from today's society and certainly from American culture and law where young children are usually always given physical custody to the mother. But in Korea, the children were assumed to go to the father because the father, as a male, had rights and the mother did not. So I say good for the mom that she was able to at least maintain one child. And, YG should also consider that HG was essentially "abandoned" or discarded by her father and paternal grandmother.
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14 hours ago, Kfan7172 said:
Recent discussion of HK Corporate Lawyer responsibility towards her client CNP
GOOGLE search "Lawyer Code of Conduct" pulled up American Bar Association ABA
Confidential of Information--rule 1.6
Basic Results as applies to recent discussionA Lawyer can reveal information about clients IF
- It would prevent certain death OR substantial bodily harm
- If it has do with a crime or fraudThe lawyer's code of ethics is actually more complicated than that. There are classes that lawyers have to take, including a separate ethics exam, and lawyers have to take continuing education that includes specific hours in ethics because the situation is not black and white. If someone comes to you and seeks legal advise, that act triggers the attorney-client privilege. Even then, there are other rules that affect what the lawyer can tell and what the lawyer cannot tell. Because the reality is that even criminals are allowed to seek legal advise. Now, a lawyer cannot help someone commit a crime, but if someone intending to commit a crime seeks legal advise first, you can be sure that this is not an average dumb criminal. He's not going to say to his lawyer, "hey, I plan on killing my friend and I was thinking of doing it this way because then I wouldn't be in trouble. What do you think? Is there anything that I overlooked that could send me to jail?" No. More likely, the criminal will couch it in different terms. Perhaps say that he heard a discussion where someone was talking about hurting someone and what should he do? And that's only in a criminal matter. In I Have a Lover, you're dealing with a corporate, in-house attorney, who is given limited information. I personally don't think that HK had all the information at this stage. She only knew that there were allegations of problems with Pudoxin and she gave her advice based on what is best for the company. Even in a criminal situation, you have to KNOW for CERTAIN that someone is going to walk out of your office and go kill someone. Vague suspicions don't count. And in HK's case, she didn't know enough. Someone mentioned that she had started gathering information on Pudoxin before her accident. I think she started doing that after the divorce because that is when she started getting suspicious, or as even part of her information gathering before advising the company.
10 hours ago, mdj101 said:2. HK admits that "We had already framed him (KSY) with embezzlement and gambling. If I took care of a few holes, I could win easily" and "I cruelly pressured him and trampled over him, not knowing he was my sister's lover".She said for her winning or to be the winner "was the lawyer's ethic, conscience, and truth" back then.
I think when HK says "we had already framed him with embezzlement and gambling..." she was referring to the company as a whole, and her use of "we" does not refer to her and MTS personally. She is speaking from the present about the past and she is associating herself as being part of the company that committed this act. She is explaining her thoughts and actions in the past with the benefit of hindsight. So, in essence, she is explaining to BS that she feels guilty for having pressured KSY because even though she thought KSY may have some merit to his case, she knew that she could easily win in a court of law. To me, what she's saying ("if I took care of a few holes") just sounds like typical lawyer-speak. You evaluate a situation and see that the case is not 100% defensible. Of course not, because no case is. However, you look at the weak spots and you know that it's really not a problem. Especially, it looks like HK was tasked at that time to resolve the matter out of court, be it by way of a monetary settlement or just getting the guy to go away. One way you do that is to talk to the guy and explain that no one is going to believe him once you reveal that he embezzled money from the company to gamble. Most people facing that situation will see the merit in that statement and decide not to pursue anything.
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@lolly84: What I love best about this drama is the type of discussions that it generates. As you can see, we have quite a variety of discussion. Our pages has some eye candy in it, but the discussion goes beyond fangirling over how hot someone looked. Even better, we don't discuss how much the drama sucks. Sometimes I get stuck watching a drama that is terrible as it ends and I (along with other soompiers) watch it just to see how it ends.
There seems to be a difference of opinion on whether or not you need to watch it from the beginning. I watched it starting from episode 10. I think starting at episode 9 will give you a good idea of what is going on. One of the reasons that I was able to not feel lost was that I read a recap on the internet that gave a general summary of what happens in episodes 1-10 or 1-9. If you haven't realized yet, there is a 4-year time jump, which happens at the end of 9 and beginning of 10. And everything that happens before 10 was very upsetting to me. I did eventually go back and speed-watched through certain portions, but I don't think that I'll ever go back and watch the whole entire thing. It just took too long to set up everything.
Good luck and I hope you enjoy it.
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1 hour ago, sweetpeaga said:
The point about the other woman being evil and will never win, again shows to me how this drama is written in a vacuum. Jin Uhn to me is an evil man. Sul Li wasn’t an evil woman, but a very immature young woman. The writer has made her ‘evil’ over the past few episodes. Hae Kang to me was a very evil woman for which she’s now regretting with all her heart.
Again, in my personal opinion, Hae Kang’s home life doesn’t compare to what Sul Li went through. She was abandoned as a baby and bounced around between orphanages and ‘adopted’ parents. The fact that she was willing to take off her clothes and have sex with Jin Uhn the first or second night he came to her home, tells me what she had a pretty rough life before she moved in with the Baeks.
Sul Li is my least favorite character, but also think she’s the character the writer has just thrown the kitchen sink at when it comes to personalities and reactions. I don’t like the way the writer used her in this drama. It’s as if she has to make Sul Li so bad in order to make Hae Kang and Jin Uhn look good.
I think that most Korean dramas are written in a vacuum. And, they are first and foremost dramas. There is rarely ever any real "reality" in them. Even knowing this, they are my drug of choice and I view them knowing them for what they are. But, some are worse than other at being completely unrealistic.
Just 2 things and I promise to move on from this topic: (1) Hae Kang as evil. Yes, she was a very cold and logical woman, but evil? Brother-in-Law Min Tae Suk is evil. He developed a bad drug, knew that it was a bad drug, covered it up, and killed people to cover it up. It's still unclear to me just what exactly Hae Kang knew. And, if she knew that there were some problems with Pudoxin, just how much did she know? Min Tae Suk once said to JE that the only reason he gets to be "clean" is because there are others to do the dirty work for him. I agree with this. JE got to go off and be the perpetual student. Other than my financial worries, college was a great time. Who wouldn't want to live the carefree student life that JE was living? And why did he get to? Because his wife was doing all the dirty company work. As a lawyer, as in-house counsel, Hae Kang had duties to the company that I think non-attorneys do not understand. It goes back to the question of how can an attorney defend a guilty criminal? Because that attorney's job is to represent his or her client to the best of his or her ability. Hae Kang also had limited authority in the past. As a company lawyer, not the VP, all she could do is to advise on courses of action as opposed to making the actual decisions. For instance, she could have advised to settle with one claimant and then slowly start pulling the drug off the market as opposed to going into full recall mode. Is that unethical? No, because she's doing what's best for the company, including all of its employees. (2) SeolRi taking her clothes off--personally I saw this as just another sign of how far she is willing to go. JE is not innocent; that is not what I am saying at all. But SeolRi is not the victim she is claiming to be. She made conscious decisions to act in a manner to take away another woman's husband.
But I also agree that the writer is going too far with having SeolRi partner up with Min Tae Suk. But then I think that this act is in line with her character because she refuses to see her own guilt and thinks she is only a victim.
JE and HK: do I want them to get back together? Yes. But why? Hae Kang deserves better than a husband who cheated on her and did so in a very hateful and hurtful manner. JE is no saint and I think he deserves whatever pain that Hae Kang is inflicting on him right now. I was talking to my mom and another married woman about why we want HK to end up with JE when JE is a cheater. And their answer was that married people, as they live together and go through a difficult time, forget their past and how to communicate. They were saying that the problems between JE and HK resulted from their miscommunication. I don't know if I fully understand or buy their explanation. I guess I want HK to end up with JE because she still loves him. And, if she doesn't love him anymore, then I'm happy for JE to follow her around like a puppy for a very long time as penance.
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6 hours ago, sweetpeaga said:
to be honest, I really don't like the way the writer is using Sul Li in this drama. She's an extremely intelligent woman who really cares about her adopted family and willing to give her last to them. This character does not connect with the evil revengeful Sul Li who will stand back and let a person die or wants revenge on the man she once loved. This part of the drama is truly ruining it for me. That she would be upset with Hae Kang and not Tae Suk in regards to Pudoxin is terrible writing to me; the same goes for her expecting Hae Kang to tell her, the woman who is cheating with her husband, that that she is taking a drug that would harm her; in light of the fact that she left Hae Kang to die. I don't know why the writer would try to make Sul Li this irrational character, who is very childlike to not understand how her actions impact others. I'm really disappointed in this element of the drama; it's too far fetched and a silly. The same with her having all the insight into Jin Uhn's feelings for his wife and sharing this insight with him, yet still trying to hold on to him. Even being abandoned as a child, she has also learned when to let go and move on with life. Her being stuck on Jin Uhn is too much of a crazy mix bag that really doesn't work for me.
I guess I just don't really remember this SeolRi. What I remember is a young, conniving girl. It was easy for her to focus just on her studies and her family in the beginning because that was the extent of her universe. However, she meets JE, she decides to fall in love with him, she feels disrespected by HK and so decides to exact her revenge by taking her husband away. And after 4 years, we see what she's truly like. Obviously, HK continued to haunt their relationship during those 4 years, hence her little tantrum when she returned to Korea.
As for her being extremely intelligent, well, she's book smart. And even then, I wonder just how smart she really is. She was smart enough to get into university in Korea, but I have a feeling that all of her overseas work was obtained through JE's mother--specifically through her money and her connections. Because this is how Korean chaebol society operates.
And you have to remember that Korean dramas like this love to make a point. One of the points in this drama is clearly that a cheating husband will come to regret his cheating ways. It's a great plot and it will certainly explain why this drama is so popular with the ladies. Another point or lesson is that the "other woman" is an evil woman who will never win. We see that with SeolRi's character. Sure, she seemed like a nice and innocent kid at first, but that's for the purpose of driving home the fact to men that these "innocent" other women that you are thinking of having an affair with only appear that way on the surface. But keep watching and we'll show you what she's really like.
In my opinion, SeolRi really is just a pale imitation of Hae Kang. Both come from "difficult" backgrounds and are intellectual. Only, Hae Kang came from a really bad home environment and she really is super smart. SeolRi, yes she's an abandoned orphan, but she had a loving family supporting her. On the surface, I can see how JE thought he found another version of Hae Kang, only when you look deeper, Hae Kang has SR outclassed in every respect. It's funny because SR is even jealous of HK's relationship with the Baek children, but what does she expect? SR was just an older sister who was absorbed in her own studies and her own life. HK, as YK, was more like a mother who devoted herself to their needs.
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In HK's case, she needs to forgive first in order to forgive herself. Why? Because until she forgives SIS, she cannot recognize her own guilt. It's not that she doesn't know that she played a role, but that it's too painful to recognize. Right now, there is someone else to blame for her daughter's death. So, until she forgives that other person, she can't confront her own guilt.
I'm still really enjoying this drama, but I find what the author is doing with SR to be kind of boring. Quite frankly, she was almost written completely out. But now, she is back with a vengeance with what seems to be almost a contrived plot. I understand that SR is in shock and disappointed about her health and her life path, but she is acting as though she is just an innocent victim. The only area where she is a victim is with the Pudoxin that she took. On the other hand, that's a risk you take when you participate in a drug study.
What's really sad about SR is that the note her birth parent left with her is true: she is a child to be pitied. I'm not sure what the entire story is with the other Baek adopted siblings, but I imagine that they were all also abandoned at one time or another. However, they all seem to have gotten over it. Not so with SR. She never loved JE--rather, she was motivated by her anger because she felt that HK belittled her when she brought her shoes. Well, duh! You're a tart going after another woman's husband. From that day, she became, to quote JinRi "Do Hae Kang's slave." SR lived with no other purpose than to get back at HK. And now she has the nerve to act as though she was just an innocent victim in some twisted game perpetrated by Hk and JE. Please! Grow up, find yourself first, and start taking responsibility for your actions.
Also am not sure what role JE's mom's Alzheimer's has in the plot. It originally seemed that it was potentially going to tie in with some company medicine that she was taking, but it seems they used that plot on SR instead.
I think that Kim Hyun Joo is doing a fantastic job in this series. Forget about the fact that she is playing two roles. Her portrayal of HK alone is fantastic. I know that Ji Jin Hee was probably the bigger name but I think that Kim Hyun Joo is doing a much better job than he is. Not to say that he's bad, just that he's not as great as she is. Of course, the roles are also so very different. As for Park Han Byul (SR), I hope she will stop getting typecast into these roles of "the other woman." It seems that she is always cast in dramas as the younger, other woman. I guess she just does it so well.
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I was discussing this drama with a non-Korean co-worker who watches the slightly delayed aired SBS (subtitled) version that plays in the U.S. And I asked her this question: Who do we want HG to get back together with? JE? (Yes). But, why, when he was such a jerk and cheated on her? Not just the cheating, but the flaunting of it.
I think that because HG is the "innocent" one in the marriage, we tend to side with her. She gets all of our sympathies. Not to mention, that the drama's portrayal manipulates our emotions in that direction. But my co-worker had to remind me that HG was a cold person. And, in JE's mind, it's HG's fault that their daughter died. Should he have cheated on her? No. If he wanted out, then he should have just divorced her. But, HG is not completely blameless when it comes to the end of their marriage.
Personally, I still think that JE bears more blame. Yes, HG was always very ambitious, blah, blah, but think of the enormous pressure on her. I'm sure that she wasn't fully accepted as JE's wife. His parents would have wanted him to marry another chaebol princess, not a poor no one. Then there's JE himself who was (in my opinion) such a little girl with his I-don't-want-to-work-in-my-dad's-company attitude, which forced HG to take his place. She had to be extra tough in order to prove herself and in order to try to take the place that JE should have. Had he been more of a "man" (in my opinion), then perhaps HG could have been a softer person and paid more attention to him.
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cute hyungsik
He shouldn't have an idol-stylist for acting. These kind of stylists are CC cream worshippers.
Go Ara 고아라
in actors & actresses
Posted
Agree that it's not her fault that the Hwarang writer (and director) were so horrible. But, in all fairness and objectivity, all of the actors were written poorly. Aro's character received the most hate and part of that is I think because: (1) she took away too much attention from what should have been the real plot, and (2) Go Ara's acting didn't do anything for an already poorly written character. PSJ worked with the character he was given, PHS worked with the character he was given, the rest of the Hwarang actors did the best they could despite the fact that they had such minimal roles. No one in that drama had a decent role; that writer certainly can't be accused of favoritism in creating better roles because they were all bad. So to me, the fact that Aro's character was written poorly doesn't excuse, but rather highlights, the fact that she needs a lot more training. And I agree that it's a good thing that she left SM because let's me honest here that SM does not produce good actors. What they excel at is producing idols that excel in variety shows. Go Ara had the extreme luck to work with such talented actors, and yet, her acting is still subpar. Even Park Hyungsik, who in my opinion, is able to create chemistry with a cardboard cutout, and yet we got almost nothing from Go Ara. So, best of luck to her with her graduate studies and her new agency. I agree that it's unfortunate that she was probably scouted by SM for her pretty face, and then they failed to provide the training. I still wonder how she got to stay on an actress track instead of being pulled into a girl group, given that she was with SM for 13 years. Seriously, why does SM even bother to "promote" actors?