[Drama 2013 - 2014] Prime Minister and I 총리와 나

[hana_b]

Hello everyone, 

I'm sure almost everything has been said on this thread, but I just thought I'd stop by and share my thoughts here, perhaps to honor those early episodes of PM&I and all that this drama could have been, but was taken away from us. I know I sound like angry Oori, abandoned and neglected, but that's how the last episodes and the ending made me feel.

It's LONG, so I'll put it in spoilers:

I have no clue whatsoever of what drove the sudden change of course for this series, but if it was the age gap, then I must say I am disappointed not only at the writers but the K-drama audience as well (which does not include Korea as a whole, but I'm sure reflects somewhat its morals and way of thinking). It really strikes me as a double standard that they accept noona-boy romances but tear their clothes in moral distress when it comes to the possibility of romance between a hot ajjussi - girl. What's funny to me is that in real life, this moral standard is reversed, which makes me think this may be a case of societal compensation or "the revenge of the K-drama watching ajjummas". My sense is that this may have not been the case, though.

I remember watching "The Painter of the Wind", a drama that in my opinion, could have created even more ripples because it was one of the earlier dramas that contested traditional views of gender, but also of age. The actress playing the hero/heroine was born in 1987, and the actor playing her male love interest/mentor was born in 1968 (I think the age gap was even greater in the story itself). But the plot remained beautiful and loyal to itself until the end. You could tell that the writers had the privilege and the pleasure to tell the story they had in mind until the last episode.

To play the devil's advocate (the devil being the twisted moral standards of K-drama viewers), maybe the case was not the age gap being the apple of discord amongst Korean viewers. I am still leaning more towards the theory that this was driven by the sheer desperation of the writers to raise the ratings. So they brought the dead wife to life and made Kang Soo Ho's and her story the center piece for the last two episodes, elbowing out the OTP, and all their journey together.

It was like reading the "One Thousand and One Nights" book, only to find the last 20 pages missing and replaced for a completely different novel, even typed in a different font! )

I will be honest here: my problem with the series was not only the ending.

I was upset at how quickly DJ and PM went into "perfect couple" mode. Perfect couples are never fun in fiction! ~ I loved the fact that DJ was feisty and stubborn, and would have enjoyed the drama much more if the writers would have extended the tension between the OTP a little longer. My favorite episodes were those early ones, when they kept bickering, even if you knew they were going to fall for the other. The whole fun was to watch how they were going to get there... eventually, but not this soon.

IMO this may have been one of the reasons for low ratings: not the age gap, but how soon their romance was solved. Hence, they had to create some serious conflict with the return of PNY. Kang In Ho(t) was no contest for PM in DJ's heart, Joong Ki was not strong enough as a contender.

So in short.

For early PM&I epis: I would have wanted to see a little bit more of those scenes of our OTP slightly annoyed with each other, and way more of feisty Da Jeong.

For late PM&I epis: I did not have so much of a problem with the re-appearance of Park Na Young, but with the disappearance of Nam Da Jeong. It's like she became a ghost! It was painful to see.

In general, and as a YSY fan: I'm sure he's happy he got to act with Lee Beom Soo and in a character that was a complete departure to his previous roles. But next time, I need to see him as a lead or at least in a role that does not get dropped in the last part of the drama after being so pivotal to the story. The rest of my thoughts about YSY and Kang In Ho(t), please visit his thread.

Anyway. Those are my thoughts. Good bye PM&I! You will go down in my K-drama history as that little drama that could, but decided not to.

[Orion]

Thanks for your thoughts, @coastalbreeze. We hadn't seen you in a while. I agree with everything you said and also hope we get to meet in another thread and that Yoon Si Yoon will use everything he learned to become a better actor and keep working on his craft and making lovely works.

Let us hope we will one day get a drama like this drama that could and have it left alone to be the drama that did.

[hana_b]

@Orion  I'll drink (ok my tea since I'm at work, LOL) to that!  ~O)

Off topic: I'm watching the drama with the cute alien and the crazy noona who's a celebrity, but I'm super late. If you are watching too, we may coincide on that thread! Although you may have to wait for me, because I am usually late or very slow in my drama watching.

Annyong! :-h

[skelly]

Hm. I have read through the threads, and it does make sense that the wife was emphasized to cool off the possibly unpopular coupling of LBS and Yoona. But it was still a fail on the part of the writers - rather than go all makjang, they instead could have focused on issues with the children (internal conflict) or with the press (external conflict) to keep the couple at arms' length. When you add in the death or her father, there is plenty of reasons for the couple to stay at apart without the focus shift to zombie wife and her totally unbelievable and unacceptable redemption.
There are many ways it could have been played, and still be kept satisfying. But then, these are not good writers in terms of romantic conclusions. I still think that When It's At Night is Kim Sun Ah's (usually the queen of chemistry) worst drama. So much possibility, and it all went nowhere, a lot like this show.

[hana_b]

@stuartjmz agreed on the therapeutic properties of that drama.

I think Korean drama audience members have a lot to learn from the adorable alien professor: never interfere in the natural course of events! Each life (and drama) has a destiny to fulfill!

Maybe we need 400 years of K-drama until this understanding dawns on them.

[cyriatan]

I agree there's something to the cultural difference but if considering so one must consider the cultural take on infidelity, breach of filial duties, abandoment of children, possibility of divorce (being Prime Minister's wife...we're talking of 40-50's years old here) etc. and those made by a woman. SK is not easy on this at all. I don't think the NY stuff is explained simply by pointing the biological relationship or age gap, actually I think for being a drama the dishonor theme was ausent, which is weird. 
Also the adopted son was playing basketball with his cousins when they show the new baby-born, Yul and JK appear laughing at their child playing together.

[Orion]

cyriatan said: I don't think the NY stuff is explained simply by pointing the biological relationship or age gap, actually I think for being a drama the dishonor theme was ausent, which is weird. 

[Guest FayeM]

@cyriantan, @orion,

Agreed about NY.  I sometimes think that the writers were so sick of all of the disagreements that they probably just stuck every makjang element at the end, try to make it as bad as possible, so it'll just richard simmons people off to complain.  It's like they're saying "you don't like what we wrote...then we'll give you the things that you want, but it's going to be lazy, bad, and nonsensical." 

But, I do think that the writers were trying very hard to save the couple and their story, up until ep. 15.  And I think In Ho being friendzoned so early on is one of the testaments to that.  The writing was VERY CLEAR that there's no way that DJ and IH will be together.  Same with Hye Joo.  Every single element (aside from NY) was taken into consideration to NOT be an obstacle.  Even how they portrayed NY to be a bad mother is also a testament to that, and it would have been a good reason for the OTP togetherness if they didn't stick the horror of episodes 16 and 17.  Ultimately though, I guess it's a battle that the writers couldn't win.  The only thing that they could do is to give us (definite) hope that they ended up together at the end. I want to believe that the writers' original intention was to promote the idea that stepparents can be good parents, and that families can be very non-traditional but still very functional.  And how two very different people can complement each other in a way that can bring joy and happiness - not just to themselves, but to everyone around them.  Sigh...the possibilities....

Man, I really should stop thinking about it too much, or I'll be more and more disappointed in the ending that they gave us  

EDIT...Hm....I just now realized that they changed a word I wrote to "Richard simmons".  Is that one of the rules that I broke?  I meant "upset" then

[Orion]

FayeM said:

I want to believe that the writers' original intention was to promote the idea that stepparents can be good parents, and that families can be very non-traditional but still very functional.  And how two very different people can complement each other in a way that can bring joy and happiness - not just to themselves, but to everyone around them.  Sigh...the possibilities....

[Guest FayeM]

Orion said: FayeM said:

I want to believe that the writers' original intention was to promote the idea that stepparents can be good parents, and that families can be very non-traditional but still very functional.  And how two very different people can complement each other in a way that can bring joy and happiness - not just to themselves, but to everyone around them.  Sigh...the possibilities....

[Orion]

FayeM said:

Yul will remain my MOST favorite romantic male lead. That's why it is upsetting that they had to mess up at the end, because I don't know if I can ever love any other character any more than I do Yul. 

[akhenaten]

skelly said:

Hm. I have read through the threads, and it does make sense that the wife was emphasized to cool off the possibly unpopular coupling of LBS and Yoona. But it was still a fail on the part of the writers - rather than go all makjang, they instead could have focused on issues with the children (internal conflict) or with the press (external conflict) to keep the couple at arms' length. When you add in the death or her father, there is plenty of reasons for the couple to stay at apart without the focus shift to zombie wife and her totally unbelievable and unacceptable redemption.
There are many ways it could have been played, and still be kept satisfying. But then, these are not good writers in terms of romantic conclusions. I still think that When It's At Night is Kim Sun Ah's (usually the queen of chemistry) worst drama. So much possibility, and it all went nowhere, a lot like this show.

[akhenaten]

Orion said: FayeM said:

Yul will remain my MOST favorite romantic male lead. That's why it is upsetting that they had to mess up at the end, because I don't know if I can ever love any other character any more than I do Yul. 

[Guest FayeM]

stuartjmz said:

This is another example of why I think the creative team should try for a cable network. Both Answer Me  series, and Queen In Hyun's Man feature genuinely nice first leads, and the currently airing I Need Romance 3 has a selfless, mature and caring first lead with a self-centred, repressed and domineering  second.  Dramas like these suggest that cable really is more willing to ignore or subvert the tropes, and since PMAI specialised in doing just that until The Blessed Return of Our Sainted Holy Mother, it does seem like a more supportive home for a similar effort in future. 

[akhenaten]

Orion said: fossilgirl said: so they did Take Care of the Young Lady? i watched that and hated the fact that Yoon Sang Hyun and Yoon Eun Hye kept separating and getting back together.. and the fact that they did not elevate the male lead's status from a butler to something else even after they became lovers was plain weird to me.. so maybe the writers do have their own quirky style of telling a story..my only complaint was why they did not include a bed scene like they did in Take Care.. having that scene in one of her previous drama means the writer is not very conservative.. coz Sang hyun and Eun hye did it even if they were not yet married in the drama.. so i really don't get it why with PMAI, they were so stingy with hugs, kisses and any sort of lovescenes (even if implied and fades to  darkness kind..)

[Guest aisnsd]

didn't the skinship stop after the hug inside the church end of episode 14/start of episode 15 where NDJ was crying due to the shock of seeing PNY? because now that PNY is confirmed alive, KY is technically still a legally married man.

while having an age gap like the one in prime minister and i is not a kdrama staple, it is definitely not something that has never been done before. so even if it is unconventional, it is not such a big issue that would warrant the sudden changes at the last minute (specifically episodes 16 and 17).

and the fact that prime minister and i have such an unconventional pairing as well as airing in the same time slot as a sageuk and a melodrama, and still manages to get both around 6% in ratings and positive reviews – drama production would think of it as encouraging, and not really a cause for concern (compared to recent dramas with age–appropriate pairing that had both low ratings and not so good reviews). so it does not really make sense for the drama production to make a conscious choice to remove the very reason that the people actually watching the show is enjoying it for – which is NDJ and KY together with the children. 

perhaps prime minister and i might just be another case where a plot twist (PNY being alive) ended up developing way out of control. the drama production and/or writers would have been prepared for such an eventuality, but were later overruled with regards to how to appropriately handle it. 

[akhenaten]

Orion said: akhenaten said:

[Guest kdramafanfan]

I watched the last episode. I thought my expectations we low. Unfortunately, they were not low enough. I came here hoping this would be a normal rom-com after my disappointment with AM1994. Whoa, was that a mistake lol. My gripes with AM1994 are child's play compared to this hot mess of an ending. I may stick with cable from now on as a default lol.

For me this drama started to spiral around ep 10/11 when we had our first instance of DJ leaving and Yul's subsequent stabbing but picked up some of its old charm by ep 14, and even ep 15.

I think theme and plot wise the story was relatively consistent and I felt as a whole the drama made sense. Certainly not as a rom com but perhaps as it is also classified in Korea as a family drama. I already said this before but I am not happy at all with how the kids were treated with regards to various parents coming in and out of their lives, but then again, it's not like they should be kept from knowing bio mom either.

About the last stretch, I was fine with NY being alive as long as they didn't botch up the drama which they managed to do, of course lol. Still, I'm happy that DJ was able to step away from everyone else and come to a decision about her own happiness independent of everyone else. This was one of the few instances I did not mind the growth time jump. I did not exactly like how it was executed (because DJ's character was def inconsistent somewhat at the end), but generally, I'd rather have it then not.

As to the specifics of the last episode I pretty much agree with everything @akhenetan said a few pages back

The only think I think worth mentioning about the last ep for me was DJ telling her father that she and Yul loved each other. Of course, then he died there was the guilt/Dad's death mini-arc but the extend of her guilty pretty much made me agree with/understand what @aisnsd said that this is mainly a cultural thing where DJ could not be seen to have influenced Yul in any way with regards to how the integration of bio Mom back into their lives played out. I guess I knew Korea was conservative, but I didn't realize it was that conservative.
 
In the end, I appreciate what the drama attempted to do, but it just didn't quite work in reality. Naturally, most bothersome was the strange moral message that came with the rewarding a complete and abdication of maternal responsibilities in the ending NY got vs the Yul/DJ/ ending. Of course, the drama managed to make me question DJ with kids because she left them in such an abrupt manner, but perhaps, in a cultural context, it wasn't as bad as it appears to my Western eyes.

And the handshake 8-|  We don't need any silly things like embraces or words. Our OTP is above such pathetic devices to convey their love. (Sorry, I'm being snarky.....lol)

Unfortunately, enjoyability wise this drama It was a real slog to get through the latter half and I may have used the FF button a few times. Normally, the OTP will make up this for me, but while I loved DJ/Yul's chemistry I never felt like the show truly ran with the potential of the couple. If only the drama had kept the magic of eps 1-9. The romance was always held at arms length (frequently literally) and what was hinted at never was actualized. I don't mind the end and I like the integration of the Arabian Nights story but it's not enough to make up for switching the focus to NY central at the end.

It's interesting there are not more negative comments in those articles from Korea about the finale. Maybe we just have different expectations? I guess my idea of a satisfying resolution is different then theirs?? Regardless, I loved this thread and enjoyed all the insightful analysis and (warranted) nervousness about the end. It wasn't nearly as bad as MRC so I'm happy about that lol. Unfortunately, this thread was probably more enjoyable then the drama for me lol. LBS definitely saved this drama for me and I will continue to follow him where ever he may go before he gets to old to be leading man . I liked Yoona too but as a superficial female; it's the leading men who get my loyalty. However, I'm not so sure I will follow the PMAI writers.

Orion said: Another valuable lesson from this. Jerks who force, abuse and disrespect women get all their love and being a decent man only gets you pain. Yool is more like many second leads. It's as if being a nice, caring, respectful man is a crime in kdrama. Only horrible future abusive husbands deserve all the happiness. ) But I agree. Yool was a wonderful man and he got the least twisted personality in the last two episodes. Although they did make him very cold and eventually someone who just did not communicate or try enough, but then they did very few things right in those last two episodes anyway. He's the one who remained most admirable and decent and consistent, at least.

[yoonghana]

Source: as tagged 

[akhenaten]

Anyway, what do PM&I lovers recommend I watch after this? I need to get over the shock. And to think I decided to give PM&I a try coz I was just so disappointed with the awful writing of "When A Man Loves".

Would you recommend "Sweet 18"? A friend told me "You're Beautiful" is also good. I'm also curious about "King 2 Hearts". What about the ongoing dramas?