[[Drama 2018-2019] Encounter / Boyfriend, 남자친구]

3 hours ago, gumtaek said:

With all these, Hye In strikes me as a very principled young lady. She has a good head on her shoulders.

 

She consistently worries about Jin Hyuk eversince the scandal broke out

 

She's Jin Hyuk's voice of reason (sometimes Jin Hyuk's lack of nosiness regarding other people's affairs can make him a bit naive with regard to the implications of these people's actions on him and CSH): She pointed out to him that CEO's Jung's surprise visit to their PR Department had everything to do with him and expressed her worry about the possible harm he and his mother will cause JH. She reiterates to him. "I can't watch you get hurt."

 

She is not happy with the confirmation of the pre-relationship stage. Strangely, observing her expression, I don't see it as jealousy but more of sadness and worry (?). 

 

If we were to follow the usual trope, Hye In will retaliate after Episode 6 by conniving the CSH's ex-MIL and her minion in breaking up the JinSoo Couple.

 

But since this drama reverses tropes, I will go by the following scenario:

Hye In will not succumb to any pressure coming from CHH's ex-MIL and her minion to harm the JinSoo couple. Hearing how consistently  Hye In expressed that she doesn't want Jin Hyuk to get hurt, she will protect him up to the end. By what means, I am as clueless as the rest. One guess though is this: By the way she suspiciously looked at the "mole" of Director Choi in their PR Department, I have a a feeling, she will find out that it was he who posted the blind item in their in-house bulletin board and will rat him out to their Department Head

 

 

I agree with you about HI. To me, she is a nice young lady who will not let her jealousy get in her way.

 

Is she sad when JH is with SH? Surely. I can't expect her to be supportive of this relationship now because it is simply almost everyone thinks. Only people like driver Nam who see the change in SH can support her. She has no rights to tell JH not to be with SH but she explains her reasons to him clearly and he understands what she means, though what she says seem harsh.  

 

I still remember the scene where HI thought about the diary. Yes, she tried to please him but in the end, even that didn't work out.  At that moment, I think she finally realizes she is not his type, no matter how hard she tries to adapt to him. 

 

When HI was first asked to post nasty rumors about JH and SH, she refused. At that time, she still thought that the so-called relationship between SH and JH is not true. But she heard what JH told the secretary friend about letting someone into his heart - she must have realized JH's feeling is sincere. And yet, she didn't write a word.

 

HI witnesses how JH is humiliated but still thinks for SH's sake only,  how SH goes public with her pre-relationship even though it means her CEO position is in danger. All of these are very different from what she believed at first, that JH couldn't stand the heat and SH couldn't have his back when she is already in trouble. That may make her change her mind somewhat.

 

JH is a precious person to HI, not just because she likes him but because of who he is. My vote is that HI will have JH's back rather than to stab him with the excuse of doing thing for his sake. She is also not a petty person to the point of alerting JH's mother about his relationship.  

 

JH can be really naive at times, which is frustrating.  But many times, I am just like him. I believe in the good of people. People like WS and HI, they are not perfect but they are good in nature. 

[[Drama 2018-2019] Encounter / Boyfriend, 남자친구]

5 hours ago, bebebisous33 said:

Actually, her alimony was the failing hotel. Donghwa Hotel was on the verge of bankruptcy. CSH said that she had to take loans (episode 6, during the walk) in order to support the hotel. When she asked for the hotel, she thought that chairman Kim would be glad to get rid of that failing business. But you are right, these are just speculations on my part. In my opinion, by asking for the hotel as alimony, she wanted to leave the impression that she never married JWS in order to take advantage of his wealth. By not asking for money was a way to show that she is not greedy and cunning.

As for the fair share of responsability, I have to disagree with you. Chairman Kim would have never agreed to the divorce, if CSH had not accepted the divorce contract. CSH told her secretary, if she had protested about any clause, then Chairman Kim would have never agreed to the divorce. Chairman Kim had such a contract written in order to discourage her from leaving her son. That was the point, she thought thatby threatening her like that, CSH would give up. Kim has the impression that CSH is just like her mother but she is not. Worth, wealth and power don't matter to her.  

 

Of course I know she had to sign the contract if she wanted to get divorced. My point is: she asked for the hotel as alimony, bet at that times she didn't know about the contract. But when she read the contract and saw that disadvantage terms (the scandal terms), she should have known that it is a way of her ex MIL to control her business. She could just change it to money to avoid the ties with her ex MIL in a new contract.  SH is not greedy or cunning but I wished she could pretend like that in front of her ex MIL for once so that she would not be controlled by her. That's why I mean by saying she had her fair share of responsibility when signing the contract - and I don't mean that in a bad way at all. She divorced but maintained her dignity - that is how she is. 

 

In fact, SH received both the hotel and money as alimony, though the money was probably not too much: she used that to take her staff on a world tour of hotels and then to travel alone, like what she told JH during the walk.

[[Drama 2018-2019] Encounter / Boyfriend, 남자친구]

WS is not the right man for SH and HI is not the right girl for JH. Obviously because WS and HI are not the ones, the ways they expressed their feeling are not correct and they missed their timing. These are facts that we don't have to argue about because obviously this drama is about SH and JH.

 

I don't care much about HI; but with WS, it is an interesting case because how different people view him differently.

 

WS is far from a perfect guy or a behind-the-scene knight. He comes from the upper class which include rich people who normally treat people from the lower class with disdain. He knows about power, money, connection and how to get things his way. He couldn't make SH happy: he freed SH from the marriage so that she could breathe easier but she ended up with the status of a divorcee and his mom refused to release her grip. Until now, he can't break free from the cage he was put in from the beginning to have a life from himself. He still habor fruitless hope of a second chance.

 

And yet, I can't see him as manipulative or insincere in his feeling towards SH.

 

When WS requests to meet SH after the ramyeon scandal breaks out or asks her secretary friend to tell her to be careful, I see that as being curious at first and then jealous. To me, the word "eccentric" doesn't hurt SH but he purposely uses the word "date" to test her reaction. Obviously WS can't tell SH indirectly because he chose to hurt her when he asked for a divorce and made himself a bad guy; what rights does he have towards her to tell her to be careful or not? His image in SH's eyes is already too bad that even giving her a dress becomes a burden and he doesn't even know what to say. WS knows too well how his mom will try to rob the hotel away from SH so any scandal can cost her; I see no problem when he tries to alert SH through her friend.

 

Love itself many faces and one of it is selfishness. Since WS has not been able to let go, must he be happy now that SH finds a guy she likes? Especially when that relationship can cost SH the hotel she has been working so diligently for and the guy she chooses is so ordinary, unable to help her fight for it? What's is JH's motive, is he a gold-digger or is he sincere? What does JH have that he doesn't? It surely takes time before WS can realize that JH is the one that makes SH happy and she is finally fighting for her own life, away from the invention of others. I can't expect him to realize it now.

 

SH receives the hotel and money as alimony - don't forget that she asked for it herself, knowing full well that Taekyeong is its mother company. "When an unfortunate circumstance arises and tarnishes the image of Taekyeong Group, Dongwha Hotel  will be returned to Taekyeong Group. All of this will be decided by the Board of Directors." - she read that clause and still decide to sign the contract. Why didn't she just change to a huge sum of money instead and not the hotel, then she can have more freedom? I see no proof that WS knows about the contract before he tries to make SH divorce him or he has a say in it. If she simple chooses money, her obligations probably stops at attending her ex-MIL only. Even if she use money to start a business and Taekyeong Group still tries to interfere in it, there is no way the group has a deciding fate in her business like it is now. Sorry to say but SH has her fair share of responsibility in how she is still tied with Taekyeong Group. 

 

There are two scenes about WS that I remember:

 

- The determination in WS when he angrily tells his mom to leave the hotel alone. He knows well how the hotel means to SH and he can't let her effort be robbed away from her. Later, he even told the "bad" director how he doesn't deserve that hotel. 

 

- His face when looking at SH's photo for match-making in his phone. 4 years since the divorce and he still keeps it. Looking at his lonely back is sad.

 

WS is not a perfectly good guy but I don't want to judge him negatively before I can see enough flashback. Is the marriage failed because of his fault only? Or did SH ever open up to him and love him? What made him decide to become to cheater to SH?  

[[Drama 2018-2019] Encounter / Boyfriend, 남자친구]

1 hour ago, bebebisous33 said:

Honestly, if you discover that your husband wants to marry someone else as he fell in love in another woman or cheated on you (because that's what he told her), wouldn't you feel hurt and would you be able to act as if nothing had happened? I wouldn't... Moreover, in a lot of divorce cases, the ex-spouse is more harsh than that, they sometimes try to ruin the life of the ex-spouse. CSH is just cold, distant but firm and I agree with her behavior. He keeps trying getting close to her, to intrude in her life.

I don't feel sorry for JWS because his prison is self-made and not forced by his mother. The latter is using every tricks to force CSH to come back... she knew that her son loved CSH and tormented her for not loving her son back. JWS knows now that his mother knew all along about his feelings, yet he doesn't really stop his mother. He is just doing control damages. JWS has much more power over his mother than CSH over her own mother. He is facing less pressure than CSH. My question is: does he know about the clause in the divorce contract? If not, then this underlines how superficial his care and worrying is because he could have influenced his mother otherwise ... if not, then he is responsible for CSH's terrible situation.

Yes, JWS and HI are similar. They thought, time was on their side, which is quite stupid. There is nothing free in this world. In order to be loved, you need to work for it. JWS and HI never confessed their love to the other and that's their own mistake. JH was just nice to her, he even said that she was a friend. So if she wanted something else, she should have been more proactive. 

 

I think you are too strict on WS. But then, it's what you think and I am not trying to change that.

 

First of all, I already said I don't blame SH for being harsh on WS. I understand why she acts that way towards WS. But WS does try to help her - that's a fact, even though she doesn't want to accept his help. 

 

Secondly, I don't really see signs of WS trying to intrude of SH's life. They barely met in private after the divorce and he did not try being nice to her by saying sweet words. He did what SH asked him to by telling him mom not to mess up with the hotel or get them back. He was worry about his mom interfering in painting issues and try to solve it for SH.  Yes, he brought a dress because he remembers SH's birthday but he doesn't want to make the receiver feel pressure so he makes it seems like he casually picked up on the way without putting much effort - just like how a jerk he is in SH's eyes. When the gift was returned, he didn't seem to be offended by it. Yes, he looked up JH's information, he is just SH's ex and he doesn't have the rights to tell SH to stay away from JH or make JH stay away from SH. But he still has feeling for SH, so it is normal for him to feel upset and jealous. So far, did he even do anything harmful to JH or give JH harsh words like his mother? 

 

Thirdly, you really think he can stop his mother? WS was born in a very wealthy and powerful family - his life was groomed to be the heir of a big corporation from the beginning. Look at how his mom can still go his office to talk about work - WS can be a director but it does not mean he has the full control of the corporation or family wealth. His mom is obviously the one leading everything. Remember when he threatened his mother that he would live his own life - she remarked what own life is that. WS and SH never had their own life because of the environment they live they but also because they made their choice - not to go against their parent's wish, not to abandon their status. SH's prison was self-made too. Her mom forced her to get married but she could say no as an adult and chose her own life - she didn't. SH can't change her own mom's thinking or stop her, what make you think WS can change or stop his mom? These two moms are basically hopeless human-being. WS's life is sad in its own way. What can he do other than trying to solve damages that his mom causes? He can only be free if he abandon everything to choose his own path - it requires courage and a big push. SH finally finds that push in JH in her thirties; WS need his push too. 

 

I never feel sorry for WS for his failed marriage. Not information to know what went wrong but he is obviously not the right man for SH. I only feel sorry for the cage he was put in but he chose to stay in it until now.

 

And being proactive does not guarantee a happy ending; if you are not the right person, you can still fail. You can only guarantee that you don't feel regret for not trying, no matter what the result is. 

[[Drama 2018-2019] Encounter / Boyfriend, 남자친구]

Watching this episode, I feel so sorry for SH's ex-husband WS 

 

I barely understands Korean but I guess that he is still trying to help her behind the scene instead  of venting his jealousy on her.

 

SH is pretty harsh on him. He seems happy to meet her at the tie shop but she barely acknowledges him and walks out quickly. Of course, I know they ended up on a divorce due to his "cheating", his mom and her mom are pressuring them to get back together and it is not a good idea to talk with your ex-husband when you are buying a tie for a guy you like; plus SH doesn't know how he truly feels about her.  Still, poor guy. And he has to witness SH helping JH with his tie and how they smile at each other. I don't blame SH for treating WS like that; just that...if only she is a little bit less harsh on WS.  At least she knows WS tries to help her with the painting issue against his mother's wish; why still so harsh on him.

 

I know WS purposely goes to JH's workplace to size him up, but at least so far WS still has not done anything harmful to JH at all, despite he has a reputation of being scary. He can't just help but being jealous and is curious about SH's new interest. If he is truly obsessive with the idea of owning SH like an object - just like his mom,  both JH and SH should be in much more trouble than now.

 

Somehow, WS and JH's friend HI are quite alike, until now. They are sad seeing the person they love come to like someone else but have not turn their back on that person. Of course we can't hope that they are supportive of such relationship. Maybe their methods of display emotion is not suitable or their timing is off... whatever it is, things don't work because they are just not the right people for WS and JH.

 

WS has the means to make things difficult for JH and SH, if he wants to. I just sincerely hope he doesn't side with his mother and instead will end up going against her wish to gain freedom for himself. He deserves to be free like SH to live his own life - everyone does. And hopefully one day, at least he and SH can have a proper, honest talk with each other.

[[Drama 2018-2019] Encounter / Boyfriend, 남자친구]

I don't understand a lot but after JH is confronted by SH's ex-MIL, he feels very troubled at he has to walk outside and calm down. However, instead of worrying about himself, he wonders how SH could handle all types of pressure all these years. It is the first time he has to hear such words and it is difficult enough but SH endures it for so long. He really thinks for SH's sake only.

 

After the interview with the press for the hotel opening is nearly over, SH is also confronted by a rude reporter about her mystery man. JH is ready to hear SH deny it, he even smiles to encourage her and sadly walk away. But seeing him do so, SH remember when he asked her what their relationship would be (in the rice soup shop); instead of walking out of the interview, she sits down and acknowledges in front of the press, her parents, ex-MIL and ex-husband that it is a pre-relationship with a smile. JH nearly walks out of the room but he stops immediately hearing that. He goes from feeling shocked to extremely happy; these two smile at each other.

 

What a great couple! They can't bear to see the other get hurt. SH is really risking her reputation to be with JH now. 

[[Drama 2018-2019] Encounter / Boyfriend, 남자친구]

Anyone one notices how quickly JH responds to his brother's question if SH is beautiful or not?  Too quick in an instant and so serious that his brother is taken aback.  And how swiftly he defends SH as talented and charismatic. Boy, you are already in deep trouble. How many times you say she is beautiful already? And how natural it is for you to have skinship with her? 

 

In episode 4, I do think JH starts to cross the blurry line between him and SH in an active way. The way he gently corners SH so that she can't disagree they spend time together. How he adds kimchi to her rice soup naturally without even worrying she will turn it down.  How he says SH is like a heater to him and sits very close to her (she does not object to it either). How he leads her to the car and drives her home without giving her a chance to reject it.  How he is kinda deflated after she tries to cut ties with him but does not give up, judging from what he tells her secretary.

 

Is he an alpha male in relationship? Of course what he does comes from his sincerity but boy, you are such a smooth talker and so confident. And so persistent that SH's attempt to draw a clear line in their relationship does not work at all, especially after he hears her "confession" on the beach. 

[[Drama 2018-2019] Encounter / Boyfriend, 남자친구]

7 minutes ago, icyphoenix said:

She just wanted to know who makes him smile like that soo brightly!! I don't think she has romantic kinda interest in it.. It's just her curiosity!! I guess she also wanted that kind of joy.. She wanted experience that kind of happiness in life.. She mentioned abt girlfriend stuff when he gave her his phone number.. She didn't wanna make his relationship to wrong if he was having one.. 

 

Yes, I also think it is not related to romantic motive at all because she is perfectly fine at that point if he has a girlfriend. Just that he smiled like that to her once so she is curious who can also do make him do that.  That is my very first explanation of the scene. I just wonder if JH understands that  or he thinks she has some romantic interest in him  

[[Drama 2018-2019] Encounter / Boyfriend, 남자친구]

Guys

 

There's something I'd like to ask. 

 

I understand JH's behavior so far - it is in line with his character.  But there is one scene about SH that I kinda find rather odd: the scene where she asks JH who he was talking to on the phone. Is she curious and jealous or what?

 

At that point, to her JH is no more than a friend - someone nice who she spends a memorable day with. She seems a little bit dissapointed but then eventually is fine, thinking that he really has a girl friend. That does not stop her from wanting to spend her day with JH because it is not like she expect anything more than friendship from him.

 

I appreciate that SH is honest to her feeling and shows she does care about JH, which makes him find her cute. But is that kinda out of character? Of all the things SH ever says or does to JH, for me this is the one where the boundary of flirting and normal friendship is blurry the most. I can understand other actions, like why she comes to the playground or wants to eat ramen with JH. But that scene where she is curious why JH smiles so happily like that, I am not really sure her motive. I can only think of two possible reasons which I think can be acceptable: (1) he used to laugh happily like that with her during their dance so she is curious who can also make him do so (2) if he does have a girlfriend, it is probably hard to hang out with him since it can make his girlfriend uncomfortable.

 

Can anyone explain that scene to me?

[[Drama 2018-2019] Encounter / Boyfriend, 남자친구]

Oh how I love the final minute of episode 4 when SH and JH smile at each other like there are only two of them in the whole world.

 

They are really brave.

 

JH for being willing to step into SH's lonely world where power and media scrutiny prevail even though he can't even pinpoint exactly what feeling for her is.  The moment he reveals himself, he will forever be associated with SH no matter what he does. Even if he is not her boyfriend now, he will be considered one by the public despite SH so far has only acknowledged him as a friend. JH truly puts SH's interest before his, seeing her being bullied from all sides and even people who do care about her can't explain for her.

 

SH for finally acknowledging her relationship, whatever it may be in the public's eyes - friendship or dating - with JH. With JH coming forward like that, she can no longer keep him safe from the spotlight. But she also cannot rebuke or disregard him as a stalker because it means she lies to herself and hurts JH deeply while all he is trying to do is for her sake. For once, in front of other people - who presents the public, she dares to show her true feeling and reciprocate JH's goodwill, knowing full well how that will further maker her own mother and ex-MIL furious. I believe JH cannot image how hard it will be for him because he is unfamiliar with how politics works. Let's hope that there will be no beating or false crime accusation like what gangsters often do but other people that JH care about may end up getting hurt: his parents and his friends (at least it is highly likely that their business and job will be in trouble). But I bet SH can imagine that to a certain extend: she has been fighting the evil for years and it takes so much hard work, determination and strong will for her to get to where she is now; she may lose everything. This time, JH's pure concern really encourages her. 

 

We already see how SH's effort be easily robbed away from her and how people plot for her to fall down so that she has to live her life the way they want. Soon, I am afraid we may witness JH's world crumble and he can no longer smile innocently and happily frequently the way he does now. But I am also ready to see how these two handle obstacles together. There is no way SH can go back to her old life before JH. 

 

Only 4 episodes so it is too early to tell anything but I firmly believe in a happy ending with these two reuniting in Cuba  

 

P/S: I have no complaint at all so far about the drama. But is it too much to paint SH's mother as a purely power-greedy person like that? I can't believe SH and her father put up with that woman for so long. Hopefully there will be some type of explanation why she becomes that way.

[[Drama 2018-2019] Encounter / Boyfriend, 남자친구]

What I love about Encounter so far is  how the plot is moving very fast.

 

Make no mistake, I love SH - I am sure everyone does.  But the character of JH really surprises me - it is quite unusual in K-drama to have a male lead like him. He is 30 so neither too old or too young. He feels happiness in even the slightest thing around him and open himself to the adventure called life but he is not naive to the point of not understanding the social barrier between him and SH. He probably smiles widely too frequently for other's people liking but he is not an a wide-eyed person as he's been to military and understand his duty as the oldest son of parents who are fruit-seller. Despite his younger age than SH, he acts manly, caring and protective towards her like an equal.

 

JH is one of the most honest characters I have even watched. He acts on his feeling and does whatever he believes is right. Thanks to his positive attitude, he has lived his life happily until now.  

 

No wonder why his friend says once he sets his eyes on something, he never gives up.  4 episode and I already have not been able to predicted his behavior at all. It takes a brave man like him to make SH happy because he is willing to step into her lonely world despite all obstacles. 

 

 

 

[[Drama 2018-2019] Encounter / Boyfriend, 남자친구]

First time posting in this thread, hello everyone :)

 

Regarding  CSH's ex, I do feel sympathy towards him.

 

Yes, his marriage with CSH didn't work but I don't see it as entirely his fault. 

 

He loves her but he cannot make her love him, given the strained living conditions of their life. Before JH's arrival in SH's life, SH and WS pretty much suffered the same way in their life: two ambitious families (mostly the mothers) that sacrifice their children's happiness for their power.  They weren't allowed to live their lives the way they wanted.  Didn't his mom said SH was sulking all the time she was his wife?  How do we know if SH tried to love him for not? Both accepted to get married but It is hard for love to blossom in the suffocating environment they live and the scrutiny of media. None of them had enough determination to break free  and stand up for themselves or they have to turn their back on their families.  Without enough flashbacks about their marriage, I think it is too early to say WS doesn't understand SH or is also a source of misery for her. 

 

At least, for me, WS did something good for SH: he intentionally hurt her so that she could be free from his family. Bet he didn't know his wicked mom could still do whatever she could to tie SH to his family like this. At least, his move allowed SH to breath a little bit easier. That tainted his image in SH's eyes and also the public as a cheater - it's an act of letting go.  He couldn't stand up for SH during 2 years but he did what he thought would be the best for her. 

 

I am not sure why people think he waits for SH to fall in love with him after that move. He does not show any act of pursuing her nor explain his reason for fear that his mother will make it worse. He does not even use kind words when meeting her. For years, he puts up a show with his fake mistress for SH. Only when the so-called scandal breaks out and he knows that his mom is actively trying to get them back together that he shows his true concerns and tries to protect her from behind the scene. Note that he doesn't even try to let SH know he helps her.

 

There are many different ways to display love. For me, WS really loves SH. He is just not the right man for her. He can't stand up for her the way JH does or make her happy because his life is also miserable in its own way.  I hope he will find his comfort afterwards.

[[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner]

Just now, wenlhy said:

 

 

Me too!!!! So I waited till 5 am in the morning for dramafire subtitle, and I cry even in the beginning scene and I can't watch clearly because tears in my eyes.

I cry so hard when the last part where IU said "I'm sorry for leaving you alone" It's SUPER SAD.

I mean it has been so long since i cried over a drama, I think the last time is chinese version on 2011.

And I wonder if Wang So even know the child is his?

So after watching this until morning and I was crying so hard until my eyes swollen, but I must force myself to sleep.

 

If you watch the SBS version, he knows for sure about his child It makes his life so tragic.

The picture in the gallery where So is all alone in the palace yard...it is just damp depressing. Now HS realizes how lonely GJ's life was.

[[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner]

I didn't expect myself to cry a river after watching last night's episode but I did because of So. The pain and loneliness he has to endure...he doesn't deserve that.  One by one, the people he love and care for leave him. Even his daughter, for her sake and HS' wish, he cann't acknowledge her.

HS wasn't alone and heart-broken when she died. She had her daughter and Jung was besides her. She also learned how Soo felt for her during the birthday song. So was left all alone in the cold palace, not wanting to come near even his son.

How come his life is just tragic like this?

Farewell WS ah. Thanks for the memories and even the tear.

 

 

[[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner]

Hm, I don't really understand why GJ is so mad at HS for having loved WW before. Is this because he assumes HS has always cared for WW from the beginning until now, judging how she asks him to save his life? Since GJ didn't know about their relationship, he couldn't know the reason these two broke up. He is mad because he is jealous that HS stills care about WW even until now? 

Rather, I think GJ is angry that HS doesn't even want to deny or explain - it's like she is totally giving up their relationship.

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7 hours ago, blue003 said:

Did WS actually understand HS? I mean what did he actually think by offering to make HS concubine n then make her a second queen when a kid comes in the picture? HS wanted to leave the palace but why was WS being obsessed with keeping her with him when she clearly said so? Imagine if she had a kid then... WS would have told her-ok you go but leave my child

 If she had wanted power, none of this would have happened. She could have married the king in the first place. I understand WS was desperate but the HS he loved didn't want any of this in the first place.why did he alienate her even more?

 

WS , actually GJ, asked HS to be his queen first and foremost and she refused. At that point, he was ready to risk everything and made her his queen. He always wants to have kids and build a family with her but she is not comfortable with this idea until she gets married. When HS refused to become GJ's queen, she already accepted her fate of sharing him with someone else - especialy with GJ saying she is forever the only Queen in his heart. Him asking HS to marry him is a way to desperately keep her besides him.

Becoming a King's concubine in HS's case was never about power.HS has no backing to use as a leverage to YH anyway. Only GJ's love to her will prevent YH from doing anything bad to her. 

You say that GJ obsessed with keeping her by his side? This is what he means in the beginning until now - even when she didn't love him back he still tried to hold on to her. Because he wants her in his life, despite her defying his orders times and intervening in his decisions. He is trying to hold on to the very very few people he trusts and he even promised not to let her go. Didn't she say she wouldn't leave him too? If she is tired of living in the palace and wants a quiet place to live where he can visit her - that is one thing. But getting married to Jung, becoming another person's wife in a place where is not entitled to go anymore is totally a different thing. HS is tired of everything in the palace - so talk with him through. Tell him how she is tired of seeing all the dead people around her. Tell him how she is scared of the king he becomes.  Tell him everything before taking the drastic action with Wook and Jung. GJ could take her refusal of marrying him if she tells him she loves him enough to not need a status in the palace - instead, she brushes him off coldly.

The GJ I know was never the one who will favor his child over HS or force HS to stay by using her child. Until now, GJ was never cruel to her. 

"I didn't let her go. She was letting go of me" - eventually, GJ did let HS go because he knew she was letting go of him. He still loves her even when knowing about Wook, even after she married to Jung for years. But it takes 2 hands for a relationship. You know what is true obsessiveness? Not letting go until the end even though the other party totally gives up. And you still blame him for holding on to her before letting her go? Trying to hold on to her is what WS must do. Unlike HS, he did try what he could to savage the relationship until he knew there is no point in trying anymore. 

[[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner]

It is hard being GJ.

True, he is not the type of king HS expected. He is crueler.  But has HS  really asked herself why GJ becomes that cruel?

- He is cruel to YH, asking her to give up her brother if she wants him to sleep with her, help her have a son and let that son become the future king. It is like he "sells" himself for this deal. But this is the situation WW and YH puts him in. Since he is forced to marry YH to build his power - or else he will be thrown out of his throne and ruin the nation his father builds soon - I have no problem with him making the best out of this deal - just an eye for an eye.  YH told him how she has feeling for him and I believe her, but her ambition makes GJ want to stay away from her, despite them being brother and sister.

- He is cruel to WW and Won. But really, they deserve to die. Just because HS doesn't want to see WW die doesn't mean she can blindly forget the crimes WW did. She doesn't want GJ to kill his brothers but they are people who harm others for their benefits. She doesn't want GJ to be remembered in the history as someone who kills his brothers so does she want these two to team up and scheme against GJ over and over again? 

- He is cruel to CR. Well, actually he tried to let CR live until she repeatedly crossed the line

- I haven't really understood GJ's involvement in WH's death but I am sure GJ knows how BA loves her. Unless he is forced to punish her, I don't think he deliberate try to kill her. He even let CR off before, it doesn't make sense when he directly wants to aim at WH - is this a writing fault or what.

- He did order to kill people who petition against him when he first got the throne but that is understandable since he needs to consolidate his power and makes people scared of him.

- His revenge towards his mother is completely understandable  - I don't think I need to explain that.

- His behavior towards Jung: Jung always blame him for what happened. Even though GJ never did terrible things like Yo,Wook or Won, Jung thinks of his return as the bad sign of all that happens - despite the fact that GJ saved his life before. Jung is among people who questions GJ's rise to the throne and he never fully accepts GJ's king anyway -like GJ does not deserve of that. Give him his power to led an army again and he may team up with Wook. So, giving Jung the exile treatment is not really cruel - at least Jung won't die in his effort against GJ. Not letting Jung meeting his mother is part of GJ's revenge and he actually does not punish Jung at all for coming to the palace.

Through all the terrible things that happened, GJ still only has his heart for HS - that never changed. He has to change to stay as a king but it is what has to happen in the beginning. He was powerless, he was alone without necessary support in is quest to bring peace to the nation - after all, he has to endures the first few year of turbulence  before he can make things right again and reign for 25 years.

But HS just can't wait. She can't wait unti GJ's power is stable and can finally control things fully. She has a limited amount of years to live and she just can't let GJ be a a part of it. She feels suffocated in the palace, she can't understand why GJ has to do the things he does so she has to leave - fine. But she tries to hurt GJ badly so that she can cut the ties. While I understand HS feels painful, she deliberately hurt GJ too much by agreeing to marry Jung and petitioning for Wook. 

What is with telling each other the truth. Just yell at GJ's face that he is not the king you want. Tell him he is a killer and cold-blooded person in your eyes. Tell him you are about to die and you can't stand being in this palace to witness him kill people and have children with YH. Threaten him with a hairpin or whatever you can. But how can you just simply leave a scar like his? Just tell GJ your true feeling - at least it will hurt him less.

So,girl, you actually have a few years of living quietly with Jung without any politics involved but you will miss GJ terribly. That is the hell you create for both. So I will not feel sorry for you.

[[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner]

3 hours ago, enigmaticangel said:

Ok, I have to take this out of my system..

Note: This is NOT a hate post..this is just my perception about the recent episodes.

First of all, I can't see my "Wang So" anymore..Really,Whenever I watch the recent episodes , i wonder where that playful at the same time brave "Wang So" is lost?I am seeing only "Gwangjong" nowadays..The way he is treating things is not the way Wang So treats..!! All i could see now are some traces of WS here and there in "GJ"..I can't understand what is the reason? may be because of the clothes or hairstyle?  or LJG 's amazing portrayal as WS/GJ?

Where is that WS who used to NOT CARE about anyone and acts according to his will, BUT he never intended to HURT anyone?

Where is that WS who used to care for Jung(He saved him from the goons and built a tomb of stones which he destroyed) ?

Where is that WS who proposed HS  "n" number of times only to protect her, even though he was rejected everytime?

Where is that WS whose only intention for throne was to STOP THE BLOODSHED  and to protect the person he loves ? 

Where is that WS who didn't even care about the person HS loved yet he loved her unconditionally? 

Where is that WS who distanced himself from his love of his life, just to protect her?

I am still searching for answers..

The power is NO JOKE..it is slowly consuming him, and he is letting it get the best of him too!

Now he feels like the whole world is IN HIS CONTROL , he is allowed to do anything to anyone and no one dares to speak against him.He finally feels the FREEDOM which he was thirsting for all these years..His freedom lies in his THRONE! He got tired of obeying all the others from others..now he wants the others to obey his!

Actually I am not against him becoming the king, I am against the consequences of it..

He is slowly becoming ruthless..he didn't allow Jung till the last minute during his mother's death? Was WS really this cruel?..No..It's the power. Whose fault is this? Was it Jung's for being ignorant about how much caring brother  WS was? or is it WS's fault for not showing his caring side to him?

Why is  he getting so mad on knowing that "Wook" was the person HS loved..even though he was ignorant in knowing about that all these years?!

I can understand that Wook played his part in  getting him married to YH..BUT BUT BUT..what is HS's fault in this? Was she responsible for the past happenings? 

 

I don't like how WS is now but I will cut him some slack. I still see WS in GJ. The moment I feel truly sorry for GJ is when he sits in an empty chamber with just BA and JM by his side. No court official appears until WW comes with the marriage proposal. He didn't tell HS all of his hardship in being a king.

No, GJ does not feel that the whole world is in his control. If it is the case, he does not have to marry YH to build his power. He knows now how helpless it is to be a king and that his hands are even tied more firmly. The people that he has killed so far since he became a king are not exactly innocent.

About Jung, I know it is cruel for Jung to not being able to see his mother for the last time. Well, Jung and So's relationship will get worse after this, but then it can never be mended even before that anyway. Jung was never actually considerate of So's feeling. So surpressed his frustration over his mom's favourism towards Yo and Jung for so long; remember he used to wish if Jung were not around to receive his mother's love. His action to Jung is quite cruel but it is in line with So's insecurities and pain regarding his mother all these years. To be honest, he sent Jung away so that Jung woulnd't cause trouble - that's not a bad idea - and he didn't punish Jung for coming back to the palace.

About WS's revenge with his mom, I think the author in this site says it best:

https://breathlesssurvival.wordpress.com/2016/10/25/too-little-too-late/

So’s revenge on his mom is diabolical in every sense. His so-called planned revenge is what he has been yearning for and fantasising all his life. It also struck me that So was the only son and child at the deathbed of both his parents. Is it symbolic in any way? Maybe. For the late king, So was the son who unconditionally loved him and thus he being the son to send him off seem right. The couple was accompanied by the son they abandoned in the last stage of their lives. Atonement or retribution? I don’t know whether the writer wrote the scenes this way with a hidden symbolism in mind but I would like to think that it was meant that way.

Being a king is totally different from being a prince. There are people protesting and scheming against you all the time. People want to use you for their benefit.  People who fear you. Even BA can no longer think of WS as his dear brother anymore - he is more of a loyal subject now.

We have to wait until next week to understand the circumstance/context when Wook tell GJ about his relationship with HS. It is already a thing in the past so the context for that conversation to happen must be very serious or Wook intentionally provoke GJ. I don't want to judge GJ before I know for sure what drives him to be mad at HS like this. We may see GJ frame Wook but we don't know if Wook will be dead or not. Yep, GJ will break his promise of not harming his brothers but honestly,  don't Wook and Won deserve to die after they commit all types of crimes?.

Whatever HS decides to do, aka leaving GJ, she will feel regretful. Because her life without GJ is even more miserable than she imagine, no matter what he becomes.

A King is, afterall, a human. And WS can be very dangerous, given all the pain he has to go through. It is about time he unleashs his pain and frustration on someone. I just feel that some part of WS already died the day he has to kill Eun.

[[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner]

Just now, violet90 said:

 

you did't know and even i did't know what will happen if So did not fall in love with her.. but the history surely will unfold differently like Jimong said Yo not supposed to be the king and its supposed to be So..

i already said this before So will be a great king whether Soo is in his world or not but the fact that he will kill a lot of people to be on the throne is going to happen.. but with Soo he actually felt compassion toward all people that treat him less than a human and yes if Soo do not change him i don't think he will cry on Soo shoulder at that point..

she never change his nature but she changed his heart.. without her i think So will slowly changed into the dark KG that Soo knew from the future... and i still firmly hold that without Soo So will be a dark person whether his nature is good because throne battle make people go insane.. e.g WW... 

but its my opinion and its the way i see this drama..

 

Yah, actually we never know how WS will be without HS

HS got on my nerves a number of time so I think I was kinda harsh on her earlier. After all, without her, we might never see the awesome WS in the drama

[[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner]

Just now, violet90 said:

 

in my point HS changes everything since the day WS fall in love with her.. i don't know whether you already read what Pat Pat said about the point HS is there.. she is there to change how So getting the throne.. if she not there WS still will kill Eun and have a pleasure doing that but next week WS still have to kill Eun but he devastated doing that..

HS not changing the history at all but she change WS.. so my take is everything is going to happen eventually brother killing brother for throne but HS make it different circumstances she make that what WS have to do is torture instead of pleasure doing that... because of how miserable and regret WS have to do that he will set eyes to the throne and end up being KG...

 she being there cannot stop the killing because it have to happen so she not changing anything but just changed WS... 

well that's my opinion and if she did't be there we cannot have this drama at all... kekekeke

 

 HS doesn't change WS's nature. I can never see WS have pleasure in killing his brother. From what you observe about WS so far, do you actually think the man who cries on HS's shoulder thinking he kills his brother is because HS changes him to be so?

She may make him love himself the way he is and can now show the world his face. But the man who defends Baek Ah in front of Yo, who feels sympathy for his little niece is always there.

[[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner]

13 minutes ago, dramu51ch0c10ve said:

I'd have to disagree with you here.I don't think HaeSoo caused things to change for the worse.She is a catalyst for the changes that we are watching.I think things were meant to change even if she wasn't present.There were already underlying tensions that were simmering and were going to surface.The princes already had their own agendas just that they were hidden.Besides,her presence might have actually made things better.Who knows if WangSo could have continued to kill people viciously for the sake of his mother if HaeSoo had not been present?Without knowing,HaeSoo is actually altering the way WangSo is getting the throne.His intention is not to kill to get the throne but to get the throne to defend/protect others.

 

Well, if it is not due to HS's presence, Wook's underlying ambition doesn't really have a reason to unfold. With his wife's passing, he will get re-married to another wealthy wife to ensure his family's safety. Lady Hee loves her husband and HS but it can't be denied that it breaks her heart seeing her husband fall in love to another girl in front her eyes.

Sure, HS saved Jung's arm. But Jung later will be a force against So and if the character description is true, he will cause troubles and may even die (he has to die before he burns everyone elese - he is the fake sun...basically something like this). He retains his arm but his life will be miserable when he is swept up in politics. And he will also compete for HS's love, which starts on the day she saves him.

Yo is a bastard who is always after the throne, sure. But he is not smart enough to become a king without Wook's help. Won's idea to put mercury into the bath - I'm not sure but is this from Wook? We all know in real history, Yo will be a king. But in the drama's context, without HS's appearance, Yo cannot become a king - he is born under the star of a traitor.

WS is a man of conviction. He did kill assasinators to save his mother but like he said, these men are worth killing anyway. WS knows right from wrong; he doesn't kill for pleasure. It is not like his mom tells him to kill the Crown Prince or do evil stuff and he would, no matter how he wants her love. HS makes him love himself the way he is but since he is start to become a force to reckon with, he is pulled into the palace battle. Before, WS has no weak point. No one, not even Yo can threaten him to kill his brothers. Now that he does have one, he is forced to become a dog until he is fed up with that. He has to hunt down and even kill people just for her sake. In his quest to become a king, he will change. He will become ruthless. Before he knows HS, his life is miserable but he starts to take control of his fate when he decides to come back to the palace and kills the horse to cut his relationship with his foster family. WS is the one who never cares about politics before - he would not suffer from a fate of hunting down his brothers like it is now.

It is not like I hate on HS. But I am not sure if she changes thing for the better. In the short term, maybe. But in the long run?

[[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner]

Casting aside the romance between HS and WS, which I do not invest in anymore, my favourite moments in episode 15 were the flashback among baby WS and teenagers JM + Moo and also the death of Moo.

When WS was a kid, Mo was so nice to him. There are times their relationships are strained, like before WS drank the poison or when Moo became paranoid. Yet, they still have a good relationship.  WS hates being a "dog" for any and yet he is willing to do so for Mo (of course, he is not comfortable about that because he has to take on a wife). 

Mo is a gentle person, maybe too soft even. Like WS, he has weak points: the low-ranking of his in-laws and his illness. His life and Crown Prince position are constantly under threat. Just because he is destined to be a king, his life is so tragic. If he is not a Crown Prince, his life is probably better since he does not have good in-law backing to start with. WS's life is terrible but I think Mo's life is tragic too. Being betrayed, being poisoned, being killed...poor Mo. I didn't not really feel anything about him until this episode. 

Also I never realize Mo and JM actually are actually childhood friends. I just thought JM sticks to him because he knows the future. When JM comes into the water bath and tries to call him, I really cried.  This is the first and also the last time JM calls him Mo. Baek Ah is right: JM can now forget everything and rest in peace.

I didn't even shed a tear when Lady Oh died. She chooses to stay near Taejo in a dangerous place like a palace, knowing fulll well the consequence.. Any bad thing can happen there and her unborn baby is the collateral damage. She will die because of illness. But by the time she dies, she has no regret. Like JM says, she left without grudges or bitterness so she was lucky. She chooses to die so that another life can be saved. It is touching but I feel like Lady Oh finally gets the peace she wants. So I didn't even cry.

But Mo...he doesn't even have a choice in how he wants to die. He is slowly dying already under the hand of one brother and is killed by another. For 2 years, his life is pure torture. Farewell Mo, you will be missed. 

Moon Lovers has leave me many things not satisfied. But I love the way they handle poignant moments like Mo and Lay Oh's deaths. 

[[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner]

1 hour ago, fuyukoneko said:

Why do we only blame HS for her decisions? We don’t blame WS for being so obvious that he’s willing to do anything for HS, which is why Yoo, Yo, YH, and WW use HS. What happened to the WS who was clever enough to pretend that he didn’t care if the assassin/fallen monk killed HS?

So now WS can be blamed for loving a girl too much? That is simply his way of loving someone wholeheartedly. 

By the time he told WW he drank poison to save HS, WW already knew he could do everything for that girl so Yo and YH would know too. In fact, after he stopped the guards from hanging HS and shared his coat with her, everyone knows. Being straight, sincere and loyal, it is just how he is. 

Everyone has a weakness because they are simply human. It is not just HS. Baek Ah is also someone WS cares for deeply and will try to save at all cost.

My problem with HS is mostly about her trying to do her own way, even though she means well. The late king Taejo and Ji Mong already warn her to stay out of the history course and let things unfold but she never does that. In fact, she is the one who drives history to happen exactly like in her vision.  Say, she thinks she can save the 10th prince and saves WS from the misery of killing his own brother; but she fails. Just because she is willing to take risks to save people doesn't mean she is competent in doing so - she really needs to realize that. In the 10th prince's case, he has a real shot of staying alive if WS helps him. Or at least, WS would know he had done everything he could for his brother in case of failure.

HS herself is already a hostage, she can't even help herself, left alone saving others .  Good people still die. So just like Rouxi in the novel,  her selflessness just spells troubles. What makes me scratch my head is that she is always the damsel in distress.- how many times WS has to save or help her in the drama? 

I don't hate Rouxi. I don't hate HS. They are all good people. But their good intentions back fire big time, causing pain for themselves and people around them. Because of their selfless traits, they find love in a terrible period but in the end, they have bad ending. They are pitiful characters (like a tool or device for the history wheel) but their actions also lead to their own demise so it is hard to solely blame anyone for that. And personally I don't find pitiful characters interesting.  They are actually the most troublesome.

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11 minutes ago, fuyukoneko said:

 

Since she was in the body of 15-16 year old, her cognitive abilities weren't fully developed. So it make sense that her impulsive and self-control was lower. It kind of makes more sense why she would fall in love with Wook so easily. For example, if we're drunk or taking drugs that changes how our brain works, we make stupid decisions even when we normally wouldn't make those choices.

 

I don't think so, actually  

When HS first woke up, she immediately notices how her face and skin are different and that she is now in a younger body. Her lack of knowledge about history, her expertise about cosmetics, her personality remain the same.  In the original novel, Rouxi 's mind is the same; only the body strength is weaker because she woke up in a child's body (so she couldn't fight as much as she wanted to). I don't see any indicator/sign to prove HS's cognitive abilities are affected  

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13 minutes ago, sunshinefate said:

Be patient, dear. Just root for our wangso if you can not root for his lover. What can we do when she is the lead character lol. We have to try to understand her POV for the sake of our WS

WS (and LJK)  is my sole reason to watch this drama from the start. HS gets on my nerves quite a lot of times already  and I never actually thought she deserved to be loved that much by him. He loves her more and considers her his everything. He can't even live without her.