☆ 2 P M ★ Official Thread ☆

[Guest readsandgeeks]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6IFd6mfERk&feature=player_embedded

anyone knows when is dis vid from?? i found it on 2oneday...

i feel soo stupid i rewrite my post

sorry i freaked out a bit

hey that video was from afew months back when he went back to Seattle after 2PM finished their album promos.

dun freak out honey.im sure Jay is in good hands now

[Guest luna81]

The difference is surely great....But the message is still there....Jaebeom's image was ruined already...This issue has already left a scar on his heart....

Even if there're thousands of supporters, there will still be this 12000 haters who is scattered in the streets of Korea...How many of these 12,000 haters signed the 3,000 petition for Jaebeom to commit suicide....Maybe the 3,000 plus who signed for Jay's suicide has already signed this petition...

What I am saying is that whether the number is small or great, there is DANGER...

Hiw can Jay walk the streets of Korea calmly, knowing that the person who is behind him/ who is walking before him could possible one of those HATERS that wanted him ousted of this country or wanted him plainly dead

Unless Koreans find it their hearts that they understood and forgave Jay, will maybe be the time safest for jay to comeback

Every country have it's crazy people. I understand why Jay might not want to be there right now but I hope the people who once wanted to visit the country shouldn't change their minds just because of some crazies.

[Guest sksk89]

guys, guys, this is really sad but we have to remember that yes while jay left, 2pm didnt leave with him.

2pm will never be the same without jay. but jay's decision to leave was for the group. whether or not he acted cowardly (i disgaree, i think he was brave enough to sacrifice himself for the group), he left to protect 2pm from being tainted by this. who knows if a part of him just wanted to run away. but i think ultimately he left because he didnt want his past mistake to bring down the rest of the group and also bring down the reputation of JYPE.

ive been reading on korean sites that some Hottests will boycott JYP if 2pm continues as a 6 member group, or if a new member is brought in.

BUT we have to remember why Jay left. if he left to protect 2pm, then we shouldnt let this go in vain! he made a hard choice to let go of his dream so that the rest of 2pm can continue theirs. let's not let this go in vain. we should respect his decision, no matter how hard it is. he will come back when he feels ready to. til then, 2pm needs the fan support to help them through the tough time.

on another note, i bought dried mangoes today for the first time in years and thought of all 7 boys as i ate them while listening to 'You might come back'. i think people on the train must have thought i was weird because i was eating them with such a serious and sad face.... but the mangoes tasted nice....

[Guest kimchigal]

Out of that 12000 so called people who signed the expulsion letter, I can assure you 90% are fans of other groups who are jealous of the success of 2PM and the other 10% deranged nuts likely hoping to have their own 15 sec of fame in the internet world...

People who have never fought a war, never been in treacherous situations whereby being a korean can be a matter of life and death, whats their creds.

You know, the situation is very simple to resolve. Regulating bodies/ broadcasting stations or whoever is planning action in order to 'fulfill' the premise of this expulsion just need to declare the names, the occupation, the passport/ ID numbers of these people and tell them that in order for a vote to be in place, for a possible law to be enforced or looked over, they will need to be genuine signatures... let's see whats the end numbers like...

Have legal advisors peruse the documentation, subject the people who sign it take up the repsonsibility of voicing their opinions to the overall public, PUT a face to the so called anti voices... I'm relaly curious who will still have the guts to take it through... especially when it'll affect tehir lives, their families, their friends...

Start letting these netizens have the hot seat and learn to take responsibility for what thet write... steps must be taken to stop cyber bullying... theres too much blood that has been shed due this this form of coward threats.

Light will always triumph over evil. Seal that with a prayer

[Guest jOLyN_TVXQ]

cassie here~

well, i'm not a big fans but to be honest, i really, really like their AGAIN & AGAIN single..

it's really a great single..anyway,

i have been following this issue since the 1st day..i mean it was supposed to be a small issue but blown out in proportion due to the action of some so-called-netizen..i been reading every page in this thread and even look at the twitter page..

don't hate me but this is part of my opinion

well, first of all, many of you guys had been starting to hate korea and some even say their culture as been scary..here i had something to say, i know i will be hating KPOP if TVXQ are separate..i, myself, do say i will leave KPOP if TVXQ separated, i understand that feeling..since the lawsuit is up!! but then, i wouldnt hate KOREA as in their country..this so-called netizen, are they really the netizen representing the country or it is just mainly the anti-fans using the name of netizen to bash on 2PM..it was such a right time for them to attack...im pretty sure 2PM has a lot of fans themselves and im sure they could overturn those narrow-minded anti-fans..i mean if other fanclub that had been thru the attack of netizen why not 2PM??? SONE WILL BE A VERY GOOD EXAMPLE

im sure the amount of those so-called netizen are not much compare to the fans who want JAY back..gather the unity, show the support and love to JAY..

dont hate KHOTTEST for boycotting the product of JYP..KOREAN CASSIE IS DOING THE SAME ON SME..I REMEMBER THE FIRST TIME THEY DID IT WAS BACK IN 2005 WHERE THE ROTATION OF MEMBERS ARE UP..THEY SUCCESSFULLY OVERTHROW SM AND THE PLAN WAS CANCEL

i believe KHOTTEST is doing this for the sake of 2PM..is not that they neglect the other 6 member...they are trying to put pressure on JYPE...if the 7 stick together, with their fans, they could go thru the problem and still standing strong as a group...

im not putting blame on anyone in particular...if other fanclub could go thru the attack of netizen, why not 2PM..keep on the faith...believe in the boys..gather the unity..korean cassie, international cassie and japanese bigeast is helping tvxq to pull thru the lawsuit

one thing important is that DO NOT LOST IN FAITH..KEEP ON SUPPORTING AND KEEP ON SHOWING THE LOVE..i believe hottest isnt that weak afterall...

like we,cassie and tvxq, KEEP ON THE FAITH!!

7=1, 7-1=0

when 7-1 isnt 6, it is nothing!!! XD i got this from TVXQ fans and i think it suits here..XD

[Guest patjp]

Angry 2PM fans boycott JYP Entertainment

The aftermath of group 2PM member JaeBum’s leaving of the group, after criticisms of his offending messages posted up on his MySpace page before debut, keeps growing.

For one, a 2PM fansite Underground has issued a boycott against JYP Entertainment on 10th September at 9am.

UnderGround members are very unhappy with the fact that JYP is doing nothing when their singer JaeBum, leader of 2PM, leaves the group and even went as far as going out of the country.

With that UnderGround has come up with a boycott against the ticket sales to the ‘2009 Dream Concert’ which will take place next month.

They also talked about their stand regarding other 2PM’s albums and merchandizes. They will start boycotting purchase of albums released by 2PM.

UnderGround also stated that they will not support and boycott any event or advertisement, product endorsement by 2PM without JaeBum back in the group.

They have stated that they will continue with this status until 2PM is a whole group again. And they also stated that what they are doing is for the sake of the group.

Cr: sookyeong.wordpress.com

If you are Hottest, you should to support 2PM members.

[Guest nessesatee]

I'd just like to share a wonderful blog that I found...it was posted a few pages ago but must've gotten lost due to the pace at which this thread is moving.

http://www.soompi.com/content/82511

Although it didn't completely make me satisfied, it's a glimmer of hope. And who knows...Jay could be the next JYP. If (the netizens of) Korea don't want him, the US + the rest of the world will take him.

[edward1849]

^i agree! HOTTEST, don't give up hope!

Warned for one line spam.

[Guest saradah]

After reading JYP's official statement, all the articles that have been pouring out since day 1 of this incident,

K-hottests and I-hottests responses, messages and letters of encouragement/support etc etc...

I am heartbroken and at a loss for words...

I don't even want to blame anyone anymore..

I'm already exhausted from all the chaos..

Before JYP released his official statement, even though I didn't want to admit it,

I was in denial.. I had a tiny glimpse of hope that this was going to be a temporary thing

and Jay was going to come back to 2pm after this died down....

But knowing what I know now....

I don't know if that's going to happen....

It's almost as if the events that played out was from a Greek tragedy...

Everything happened so fast...

there was the rise, the flaw, the hand of destiny that aligned the events the way it did,

the tragic fall, and now realization...

perhaps I'm being a bit too melodramatic here...

but for the last few hours, after reading JYP's message, I felt hopeless and sad...

So instead of dwelling on the depressing matter....

I just want to dedicate this post to my beloved boys...

To the boys of 2pm....

You guys shined the brightest when you were on stage together.....

all 7 of you...

In my heart 2pm will always be the 7 of you....

Even if Jay decides not to come back.. and you guys continue your careers, with the 6 of you,

please know that we love you all just the same..

Even if the hole that Jay had left behind might feel too big to mend, know that you will always

have the support from hottests all around the world..

and I'm sure you understand and know that Jay had left the group to PROTECT the group...

And knowing you guys, you will pull together during these difficult times and work even harder...

for Jay....

for the hottests....

and to show the world what you're made of.....

That's what your fellow brother Jay would want and hope for....

show the world that you guys are strong and dedicated...

and to Jay, I know that it's going to take some time to heal the wounds..

and I know that it is ultimately your decision to go back or not...

and I respect that 100%...

Even if you decide not to go back.. know that you will always be Park Jae Bum of 2pm in my heart..

that you will ALWAYS have a place in every hottests' heart..

that whatever you decide to pursue or do, you will have the support of your loving fans..

DON'T EVER LOSE HOPE...

DON'T EVER LOSE YOUR DREAMS...

AND DON'T EVER LOSE THOSE BEAUTIFUL SMILES....

2pm Fighting!

[Guest mirindalove_1]

Im just hoping that the other members will take care of their health and well being, though this kind of unfortunate event falls on them.

and more importantly, I really want to know their opinion on this matter. How they really feel... ?

Hmmmm

[Guest kokorochoco]

Cr: sookyeong.wordpress.com

If you are Hottest, you should to support 2PM members.

okay...i really cant keep myself away from this thread now...

they're seriously boycotting against JYP n the rest of our 2PM oppas!

omg...PLEASEEEEE....what are they thinking?

poor jay~

now poor junsu, taec, junho, chansung, wooyoung, nickhun~

if this goes on, jay's sacrifice of letting go of his career might b worthless...

not only our 2PM oppas, the whole JYP family is in pain now, can we not make more chaos?

sad...some HOTTEST have very different way of thinkin from me...

[Guest churvaness]

cassie here~

well, i'm not a big fans but to be honest, i really, really like their AGAIN & AGAIN single..

it's really a great single..anyway,

i have been following this issue since the 1st day..i mean it was supposed to be a small issue but blown out in proportion due to the action of some so-called-netizen..i been reading every page in this thread and even look at the twitter page..

don't hate me but this is part of my opinion

well, first of all, many of you guys had been starting to hate korea and some even say their culture as been scary..here i had something to say, i know i will be hating KPOP if TVXQ are separate..i, myself, do say i will leave KPOP if TVXQ separated, i understand that feeling..since the lawsuit is up!! but then, i wouldnt hate KOREA as in their country..this so-called netizen, are they really the netizen representing the country or it is just mainly the anti-fans using the name of netizen to bash on 2PM..it was such a right time for them to attack...im pretty sure 2PM has a lot of fans themselves and im sure they could overturn those narrow-minded anti-fans..i mean if other fanclub that had been thru the attack of netizen why not 2PM??? SONE WILL BE A VERY GOOD EXAMPLE

im sure the amount of those so-called netizen are not much compare to the fans who want JAY back..gather the unity, show the support and love to JAY..

dont hate KHOTTEST for boycotting the product of JYP..KOREAN CASSIE IS DOING THE SAME ON SME..I REMEMBER THE FIRST TIME THEY DID IT WAS BACK IN 2005 WHERE THE ROTATION OF MEMBERS ARE UP..THEY SUCCESSFULLY OVERTHROW SM AND THE PLAN WAS CANCEL

i believe KHOTTEST is doing this for the sake of 2PM..is not that they neglect the other 6 member...they are trying to put pressure on JYPE...if the 7 stick together, with their fans, they could go thru the problem and still standing strong as a group...

like we,cassie and tvxq, KEEP ON THE FAITH!!

7=1, 7-1=0

when 7-1 isnt 6, it is nothing!!! XD i got this from TVXQ fans and i think it suits here..XD

I understand your POV....However, I stand with my opinion...

Just to clarify Korea's culture is not scary....The Korean netizens are the ones that are scary....

On the other hand, I think that what the UNDERGROUND HOTTESTS are doing is not doing any good for Jay...

These hottests are not only pressuring JYPE, most important is that they are PRESSURING JAY...

I believe JYPE wants Jay to be back also, but what could they do if JAY don't want to go back himself...

Isn't it irrational to blackmail JYPE for something that they don't have control over...JYP and JAY aren't Robots. In contrast, they have 2 different individualities.

Surely, if things get worse, JYPE would surely contact JAY asking him to comeback because they've been loosing money, because the other 2PM members aren't getting enough support...

Then, let us say that Jay comes back....BUT IS THIS WHAT HE WANTED? IS THIS HEARTFELT? DID HE REALLY WANT TO COME BACK OR WAS HE JUST FORCED BECAUSE THESE FANS ARE destroying WHAT HE WANTED TO PRESERVE IN THE FIRST PLACE....2PM's career....

It seems to me that these underground Hottests are not 2PM fans, they are just JAY's fans....

They proclaim to love JAY when the truth is, they only love themselves...

IF YOU REALLY LOVE SOMEONE, YOU GOT TO SET HIM/HER FREE...it's a cliche but it's the truth....

Surely, we want them to be 7...They're incomplete by not being 7...But the other 6 are PEOPLE, too...They are hurting because JAY left, but wouldn't it hurt them more that because JAY wanted to go-----NOBODY WANTS TO SEE THEM PERFORM ANYMORE...

2PM without Jay is NOT Nothing....It is just 2PM without the Jay we loved....

[Guest carol76]

I am watching Idol Show now on time2sub.

It just made me think of the other 6 boys. I love them as much as I love Jaebeom.

Jaebeom has made his own decision, JYP and I respect it.

I will continue to love the other 6 members as much as I love Jaebeom, I'm totally laughing at Chansung now when he asked the dokkbuggi ahjumma "Nan nyugyu?" in ep7 (instructions given by Boom, haha)

Let's make the situation happier, let's go watch Idol Show and stop thinking about Jaebeom at the moment, it may be tough, but let's silently give the rest of 2PM some support.

[Guest cheezychunnie]

i found it interesting how these boys deal wif sooo many attacks or rumours juz after they

got really famous wif again and again...

1) netizens saying wooyoung being rude to Junsu in one of their radio interview

(woo looked sad in almost all interviews after this incident-but soon back to his normal behaviour)

personal thought only-no bashing

2)Waii shamelessly saying that junsu and her are in a relationship(baseless accusation)

3)Netizens get furious over chansung littering during wild bunny

4)junsu and his so called plastic surgery rumours(again baseless accusation)

5)jay myspace comment-no need clarification

conspiracy???

JAY,

EVERYTHINGS GONNA BE ALRITE

BABY DONT U CRY

DONT U WORRY ABOUT A THING

I SEE A RAINBOW AT THE END

ITS GONNA BE ALRITE

(frankie j)

FOREVER 2PM - NRG [Friend]

credit: Ad0RkAbLEriceBALL

[Guest haiphuong]

After following this thread for 5 days, my feelings are so complicated: sad, angry, helpless.... This time, I don't talk about Jay but I wanna talk about something else.

Instead of sad, crying and blaming everywhere, why shouldn't we think of any way to prevent this kind of situation won't happened in the future again? I know that the Korean netizens have a super power that even their government's scared of them too. It's easy to kill people by a knife or a gun but "kill" people by word of mouth is scarier, don't you think so?

I'm not going to compare the way American or Western people treat their celebrities with the way Korean people treats Korean celebrities because it's a huge different of culture. This is such a serious problem that international fans like us cannot do anything because it's Korean entertainment industry's problem. Don't you feel hurt when one day, you see a news that a celebrity die because of bad netizens? This will be a big fight between the TRUE fans and the ANTIS but you should do a "revolution" to change it. I believe Korean fans can change it as long as you have the faith and you want to protect your idols.

[Guest jjjannia]

JAY PARK..

WHAT GOES AROUND COMES AROUND.

DONT LET UR DREAMS BE JUST DREAMS.

KEEP FIGHTING FOR WHAT YOU WANT.

To > heartless person

The deepest resentments are wrapped up in a lot of hurt and pain.

They think they're protecting themselves by not forgiving.

Acknowledge that and go easy on yourself.

Forgiveness means that you've decided not to let it keep festering

inside even if it only comes up once in awhile.

Forgiveness is a powerful yet challenging tool that will support and honor you,

even in the most extreme circumstances.

파이팅.. 박재범

[Guest iiamhellokitty]

I don't know where else to say this..

I feel like all the anti's don't understand where Jay was coming from.

In America, you don't mean what you say all the time.

For example, I call my best friend a richard simmons, a wh*re and sometimes even worse. Vice Versa.

Not because I mean it, but because we know I don't mean it.

Although Jay said some nasty things, he never truly meant it.

When I go back to Taiwan in the summer, I always complain it's too humid, it's too hot. I hate it here.

Do i REALLY hate Taiwan? No.

I wish those anti's in Korea would understand this.

[Guest kiwiflavour]

People are really going off about Korea at the moment and at JYP. This is a long opinion post so skip it if you want.

Is Korea is a racist country?

People are saying that the same situation wouldn t have happened in THEIR country. The only difference between Korea (and this includes other Asian countries) and 'the rest of the world' is that Korean nationality is alot more uniform and widespread than in say 'western' countries. I ve lived in Korea and I ve travelled there a number of times, it s a great country and you don t mock it in front of a Korean. As a whole the people are excellent very welcoming and open, ready to help if they can. But like most countries where they lack a multiracial society they think their way is best. Add to that an inferiority complex about the larger more powerful asian countries surrounding it and the situation becomes explosive sometimes. I come from NZ a small country next to the much larger and more powerful Australia. We constantly compare ourselves because we are small. My mother is still really protective of NZ s reputation and when someone says something bad publicly about us she gets really angry too. My pride is also hurt, but having lived in other countries I understand that there are things not to love about my country so I let it go. I ve met alot of Koreans who have a bad impression of foreigners and foreigners who have a bad impression of Korea (usually after working there) but after listening to their stories it always comes down to not understanding the others culture and not being able to be understood or to communicate effectively.

Korean Netizens = Korea as a whole

We re also forgetting that if a number of netizens spoke harshly about Jaeboem, not all of them spoke about suicide or deportation. Most wanted him to apologise publicly and accept responsibility for his past actions without giving excuses. We re also forgetting the enormous number of people (probably not all fans) who said they understood his mistake and that he should be forgiven. If you want to believe that a small part of a nation represents the total, then don t forget these people who were kind and caring towards our Leadja.

Forgiveness

Statements like, 'he apologised already, they should just over it', 'he was a kid', 'he made a mistake' work for us international fans ( I can only speak for more western fans as I m not familiar with all the asian cultures), but I get the feeling and I saw the proof in Korea, that when you make a mistake you re not supposed to apologise and think that sorts everything out. Also no one is supposed to 'cover' for you by giving excuses. If you re truly sorry you re supposed to let the other person vent their anger without flinching. This happens in my culture too. All the fans giving excuses only made people think he was trying to hide from his responsibility.

JYP

JYP IS THE MAN. He took a brat and made him into a man, he looked beyond the 'gangster' outside and the rude talking to see a kid with potential and energy to spare. He taught him respect, hard work, dedication and love for the people around you. If he hasn t given an official position on Jaebeom or 2PM for the moment it must be because he s thinking deeply about what to do. This is the man who wouldn t kick Jaebeom out even when his most important staff members were in constant conflict with him. Look at him and Rain, even when you leave the company he still cares. Especially for people who, like JYP himself, work their asses off to get somewhere. Will he sacrifice 2PM for Jaebeom, no he won t, Jaebeom would never allow it anyway. I believe he ll do what s best for everyone involved, as people, as artists. I have faith in him.

Anyway I m wasting internet space with my babbling. Peace all, and 2PM fighting, where ever you are in the world.

Edit

Sorry if the mods misunderstood the first title point I made. I did not mean to imply that Korea is a racist country I was merely highlighting the opinion I was discussing. An opinion I found very often in other users posts. An opinion I m discussing, hoping to change other people s minds about the bad impression of Korea that this issue has given them. But I m not going to hide that while I lived there I found Korea to be very challenging as a foreigner. I m changing the title to avoid confusion.

[Guest kokorochoco]

i found it interesting how these boys deal wif sooo many attacks or rumours juz after they

got really famous wif again and again...

sorry to cut ur post short...

i guess itz part of the outcome of their concept of "actin-true-to-themselves" rather than the usual idol-like concepts other celebs appear in...

as HOTTEST, as 2PM fans, we all love them more bcoz of their upfront straight fwd personalities, being true to fans and all that..but i dunnoe, maybe for those netizens, who're tryin to use every chance to torture idols, they might be a good target for all these attacks...

Instead of sad, crying and blaming everywhere, why shouldn't we think of any way to prevent this kind of situation won't happened in the future again? I know that the Korean netizens have a super power that even their government's scared of them too. It's easy to kill people by a knife or a gun but "kill" people by word of mouth is scarier, don't you think so?

I'm not going to compare the way American or Western people treat their celebrities with the way Korean people treats Korean celebrities because it's a huge different of culture. This is such a serious problem that international fans like us cannot do anything because it's Korean entertainment industry's problem. Don't you feel hurt when one day, you see a news that a celebrity die because of bad netizens? This will be a big fight between the TRUE fans and the ANTIS but you should do a "revolution" to change it. I believe Korean fans can change it as long as you have the faith and you want to protect your idols.

yes, being international fans, we can't do anything except feeling the pain and the loss for our fav idols...

these problems about netizens should be dealt with, soon...before more of our idols get attacked again...

to jay,

HOTTEST wish you the best

You'll always be with us

with 2PM

with 2Oneday

with JYPE family.

[edward1849]

Korea is a racist country

People are saying that the same situation wouldn t have happened in THEIR country. The only difference between Korea (and this includes other Asian countries) and 'the rest of the world' is that Korean nationality is alot more uniform and widespread than in say 'western' countries. I ve lived in Korea and I ve travelled there a number of times, it s a great country and you don t mock it in front of a Korean. As a whole the people are excellent very welcoming and open, ready to help if they can. But like most countries where they lack a multiracial society they think their way is best. Add to that an inferiority complex about the larger more powerful asian countries surrounding it and the situation becomes explosive sometimes. I come from NZ a small country next to the much larger and more powerful Australia. We constantly compare ourselves because we are small. My mother is still really protective of NZ s reputation and when someone says something bad publicly about us she gets really angry too. My pride is also hurt, but having lived in other countries I understand that there are things not to love about my country so I let it go. I ve met alot of Koreans who have a bad impression of foreigners and foreigners who have a bad impression of Korea (usually after working there) but after listening to their stories it always comes down to not understanding the others culture and not being able to be understood or to communicate effectively.

Korean Netizens = Korea as a whole

We re also forgetting that if a number of netizens spoke harshly about Jaeboem, not all of them spoke about suicide or deportation. Most wanted him to apologise publicly and accept responsibility for his past actions without giving excuses. We re also forgetting the enormous number of people (probably not all fans) who said they understood his mistake and that he should be forgiven. If you want to believe that a small part of a nation represents the total, then don t forget these people who were kind and caring towards our Leadja.

Forgiveness

Statements like, 'he apologised already, they should just over it', 'he was a kid', 'he made a mistake' work for us international fans ( I can only speak for more western fans as I m not familiar with all the asian cultures), but I get the feeling and I saw the proof in Korea, that when you make a mistake you re not supposed to apologise and think that sorts everything out. Also no one is supposed to 'cover' for you by giving excuses. If you re truly sorry you re supposed to let the other person vent their anger without flinching. This happens in my culture too. All the fans giving excuses only made people think he was trying to hide from his responsibility.

JYP

JYP IS THE MAN. He took a brat and made him into a man, he looked beyond the 'gangster' outside and the rude talking to see a kid with potential and energy to spare. He taught him respect, hard work, dedication and love for the people around you. If he hasn t given an official position on Jaebeom or 2PM for the moment it must be because he s thinking deeply about what to do. This is the man who wouldn t kick Jaebeom out even when his most important staff members were in constant conflict with him. Look at him and Rain, even when you leave the company he still cares. Especially for people who, like JYP himself, work their asses off to get somewhere. Will he sacrifice 2PM for Jaebeom, no he won t, Jaebeom would never allow it anyway. I believe he ll do what s best for everyone involved, as people, as artists. I have faith in him.

Anyway I m wasting internet space with my babbling. Peace all, and 2PM fighting, where ever you are in the world.

Warned for inappropriate comments. How in the world can you stereotype Korea as a racist country just because of this incident??? This forum is for Korean entertainment. Your comment is way out of line.