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tiger457_stv last won the day on May 6 2018

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  1. after watching 12 episodes and the highlight for season 3, this is my guess as to what will happen: Tanya became leader of the White Mountain Tribe, with the White Peak Mountain Heart society be allowed to function publicly. Asa Ron has to step down but reluctantly and schemes with his people awaiting his chance to get back his power...with his accomplice Hae Mihol. Tagon uses his power to become king with help of Taealha. They tries to control Tanya by forcing her to marry their "SON" Saya but she rebuff them. She asks for the Wahan tribe to be brought back and found out that Eunseon has already escape into the wild along with the slaves from the mine and has vanished. Taealha holds on to Tanya's father to work in the bronze casting, but also as a hostage against Tanya. Eunseon went to other lesser tribes and cultivate their support waiting for a day when he can come back to rescue the Wahan tribe in Arthdal but that is not possible since Arthdal is too powerful...... until a coup d'état occurs.... some one find out that their king Tagon is an IGUTU, and Hae Mihol and White Mountain Tribe supporters of Asa Ron launch an assassination attempt on Tagon. They failed to kill him but the situation became chaotic with different factions fighting each others. The opportunity arrived for Eunseon to come back restore order. Who will become leader of Arthdal? Will the people accept an Igutu to be leader or many of them have to die or the Igutu done miraculous thing to save Arthdal before they accept such leader? What will happen to Saya? He will probably hate Eunseon and want to kill him for Tanya's affection. Who will live who will die, who will be exiled, and who will remains?....not sure! This reader prefers Tagon and Taealha to remain in Arthdal as king and queen, but doubt that will be the ending.
  2. Saya and Eunseon are basically the same person... identical twins with the exactly the same gene. One grew up alone in an ivory tower, reading strategy books, dreaming of being accepted, dreaming of becoming powerful, in a violent filled world where the better does not hesitate to kill, and where lives are cheap (as long as it's someone else's life). Eunseon grew up in a primitive, innocent world.... granted there are some killing, but within the tribe, there is caring, nurturing and unity where his psych can be nurtured, albeit with some discriminations for his differences. He also had the support of Tanya and her parents. Hence this is like an experiment where the same person is placed in different environments and what is end up? An insecure, violent, vengeful, egotistical tyrant....and a sweet innocent boy... who is trying to right the wrongs.. ...all at the same time!!! the same person looking at his mirror (one raises the right hand, the other the left).
  3. You forgot Tagon the most powerful blue blood of all. Guess no one knows about him. After this he won't need to marry an Asa. It seems he will need to survive a coup d'état. Black to how many neanthals exist, we're not sure. We know of three.
  4. So the old religion had Asa Sin and the messenger Aramun who was an Igutu. Then the latter White Mountain tribe killed him and the old line perished, when Asa Sin departed to the south over the Great Black Cliff, bringing the relic with her. since that time, the White Mountain has suppressed the thought that Aramun was an Igutu…. and brand all believers otherwise (the White Peak Mountain Heart society) as heretics. Until Tanya becomes chief of the White Mountain tribe and is accepted by Arthdal people, there is no way Eunseon or Saya can declare themselves Igutu…. so it would be a while until either of them could wrestle power from Tagon. So it's ok for Eunseon to suffer in the mine.... It's fascinating the expression on Tanya's face when she realizes that power will save the Wahan tribe... how is she going to find the relic?
  5. In every civil conflict (the Dongak uprising is not big enough to be called a civil war) there are the idealists who have zeal and willing to offer their lives for their causes, who persuade other to follow them blindly, and their followers who are often ambivalent and would switch side if they sense their side is losing. We see all of that in this tale. The Baek patriarch was right when he told his younger son... this country was lost long ago... when educated people like yourself go to the other side. The reality of the late Joseon period, is severe illiteracy, wrong education (reading Chinese poetry and Confucian teaching does not help run a country), backward economy based entirely on agriculture, poor tax base inadequate to reform the country.... 1/5 of the population being slaves with wasted human resources for the rich and powerful only...… all of these have to go for Joseon to advance... which eventually it did after the Japanese 35 years of occupation and a Korean War. The Japanese themselves had their own blood letting to progress, during the early Meji period, so it's Joseon turn... then China. It is ironic when the older brother exhorted their demoralized followers for the night attack that they are going to fight as free men and that the last few months of being free as dongak members were worth all their suffering.... then after 20 thousands perished and they are all hunted down like rats, while the bystanders yell banzai banzai to the Japanese soldiers.... did most of the survivors truly relish that few months as free men, as they hide, mend their wounds, betray... trying to survive?
  6. @aren_117 said: By the way, I am really confused on why Saya decided to join hands with Tanya after he found out that she has been fooling him. Isn't he supposed to be hurt about it? I thought that there's going to be a rift in their relationship because of that. Saya is a desperately lonely individual with a terrible secret that he cannot reveal (if saram finds out, he will be killed on the spot). He when was young had a confidant who was killed by Hae Tuak at the order of Hae Taealha…. my guess is because the girl found out about Saya's blue blood. All his life he was either hidden away, or furtively walk outside, not talking to anyone less they find out about his being Igutu. In Tanya, he found some one who understands him, understands his needs (to be free) and his frustration (of being imprisoned). She also taught him to use the sling, and open his world some what to the outside. She despite her simplicity is not stupid. She can think and make up her mind and can be quite rebellious (hence the various punching by Hae Tuak). Saya admires people who are strong and intelligent. She also reads his mind, or so he thought. She saw him as a vulnerable boy hating birds for their freedom to fly, yet wanting to be like them so he can escape. So when he found out about the secrets she kept from him, he was hurt, but at the same time he needs her! Without her his oppressive world has no meaning, no joy. In reality he would forgive her for almost any betrayal. Plus, she put a spell on him at the end of episode 8 after she lifted it from Eunseon. Tanya is a good influence on Saya... teaching him right from wrong.
  7. It wouldn't be surprising that the 2 neanthals came there because they are protected by the White Peak Mountain Heart Society. Soompians' theory that the Chaeeun little sister Nunbyeol could be an Igutu is quite plausible. that may explain why Chaeun, without hesitation, help Eunseon when she met him in episode 3. When told by the farmer he accidentally killed, Eunseon was distressed that he is a disgusting Igutu spawn of the even more disgusting Neanthal...Chaeun said : Neanthal are beautiful. That kind of familiarity must come from personal experience, i.e. having family member who are like that or protecting friends who are like that. Plus the White Peak Mountain Heart society worship Aramun as an Igutu (a half saram half neanthal). Well time will tell. Also they are quite well dressed and obviously well fed and obviously comfortable with Arthdal city...so some saram must protect them. the most intriguing question for the ending is if there will be a world full of saram ONLY, or a world full of saram and igutu and maybe even a few neanthals? This reader, being cynical, picks the former! so sorry @lebeaucouple
  8. thank you for the above.... Ultimately the reformation in Germany split it into catholics and noncatholics camps... so I guess the Pope lost too! Hope this arthdal political struggle won't split them into little bickering tribes again or else it's the stone agge again!
  9. thanks bebebisous33 what happened to the cathars of southern france as part of the crusade was truly regrettable. Unfortunately with the religious zeal of the crusade period, nothing short of orthodoxy was tolerated. Every religion went through such period, even peaceful one like buddhism (during Japan's Sengoku warring era of the 15-16th century so many militaristic sects abound). It is unfortunate but when a group feels threaten they often use religion as a pretext for mayhem.
  10. @Gumiho9 said Saya looks like a vampire. Saya is a creature of his environment, seeing how the elders kill without regret (he saw Tagon killed his own soldier when they found out that Saya is an Igutu), as long as it serves their purpose. So killing other doesn't bother him. Note that he always looks so weak, letting Tanya beat him up and not practicing martial art when Hae Tuak was trying to teach him... but he is a sly Igutu (who is not as weak as he pretends). He was able to learn to kill bird with a sling shortly after Tanya taught him. In many way he is an innocent child who doesn't know right from wrong (he is not sure why Tanya was horrified that he kill some one unimportant, because it's not in the strategy book that he has read)...much like a young boy would burn an ant or step on a lizard without 2nd thought. Tanya who came from a simpler and fairer background, and had suffered brutality at the hand of the strongs, is slowly teaching Saya to do the kind thing. Guniho9 is right. Saya does look like a vampire! The 2 neanthals at the end of episode 10 are well dressed in modern Arthdal clothing. One of them may be the child that Asa Rin talked to in the 1st episode after her her neanthal husband was killed. Who fed, clothed and taught them civilized habits all these years? Probably the Society of White Peak Mountain's Hearts who seemed more peaceful (like the Wahan themselves) and probably opposed to the extermination of the neanthals. This sect is probably the original religion which was hijacked by Asa Ron and his group. Tanya would fit in well with these folks. Kind of remind this reader of early Christianity during 1st century Roman time where it's teaching of love thy neighbors was suppressed. The irony is that what they practice was probably the original religious teachings!... but how can you expand an empire and enslave others with that kind of religion?
  11. Poor Tanya. With what she knows (that she is probably the representation of Asa Sin) she becomes a very sought after commodity! Some would want her alive to increase their power (Tagon and Taelhae and Saya and probably Mubaek). Other would want her gone to preserve their power (Asa Ron and his people). So who to trust and who should not be trusted? People can betray, double cross even triple cross to get what they want! Look what the Asa clan did by suppressing the ancient religion from the original founder which some members of the White Mountain Tribe still practice (medicine woman cha-eun). To go from laughing and dancing painting one's face..., to being motherless, enslaved and treated like a dog/ punching bag,... to power play in the complicated world of Arthdal simply to survive!... all in a few months!!!
  12. the whole story is not done yet so we are not completely sure.. but 200 years earlier Arthdal was found with the help of Asa Sin (is it a myth or did it happen is not important,... what matter is these superstitious people believe in her existence). The Asa at that time was so powerful that even one of the gods ...Aramun Haesulla (they have 8 gods) was a man (or igutu) who became god with the blessing of the Asa clan.... and the myth they believed... is one day Aramun will come back (kind of like the messiah story in Judaism/Christianity). Then Ara Sin disappeared... they thought that she descended the great black cliff into the land of Iark. The Wahan tribe which speaks the same language have a line of priestess who dream that a great white wolf descended from the great black cliff to protect and govern their lives. They dream of a symbol that look like the mix between a swastika and a ninja shuroken, and practice dance that is done by the earlier Asa clan... dance that have become much more civilized and refine in the modern Arthdal (Tanya saw that in episode 9 when pretty Saya had the same paint on his face as the ritual dance of her tribe, the Wahan). Because the Asa clan was founder of the Arthdal tribal confederacy, they are held in great esteem and get food offering and taxation from the other tribes. Unfortunately the main Ara line died out (or disappeared) with the current Asa clan being controlled by branch line, not direct descendant of Asa Sin (Tagon called them beogeumbari ---illegitimate child, and other people have questioned their authority). As you notice, Arthdal despite its warlike and patrilineal governance,... on the religious side tends to be dominated by female (there are a lot more female priestess than male priest) and the legend is about the godlike mother of arthdal (Asa Sin). The man-like god Aramun is beneath her (in Christianity they talk about god and the son of god jesus).
  13. @lebeaucouple said: "While everyone wishes to have an utopia society, which unlikely happen in this era due to the human nature, i am sure the key message take away from this drama is to “accept the diversity and encourage people to embrace otherness" so that all human can stay in harmony. My wishful thinking." These saram accepted harmony by exterminating the neanthal whom they think are dangerous to them and block their expansion into new land and compete with them for resources. Their tolerance is once they exterminate the neanthal, some saram scholars may write books lamenting the passing of their competitors while other saram go on with their lives and exterminate other saram competitors. This reader hopes for a realistic ending, not an utopian one where the tribes break up and each go their ways happily ever after. That just doesn't happen. @sadthe1st said: said neanthal + saram = igutu (50% neanthal) igutu + saram = ?? (25% neanthal) ?? + saram = !! (12.5% neanthal) !! + saram = ¥¥ (6.25% neanthal) ¥¥ + saram = && (3.13% neanthal) && + saram = ££ (1.56% neanthal) ££ + saram = €€ (0.78% neanthal) sadthe1st calculation above, is based on the theory that igutu only have saram to mate with. In reality, if the original population of igutu was 2% of the total population, assuming equal mating since the igutu or their descendants look like saram, and there is no net gain or lost due to some genetic advantage or disadvantage,.... then 1000 years later the % igutu genes mixture is still around 2% in the population, although there will be many more diluted saram with some neanthal genes. If however, there is a disease resistance advantage, then the % neanthal genes will grow greatly. Asian and Europeans have about 2% dna from neanderthals which originally lived in Europe during the Ice Age. This occurred when homosapien sapien walked out of africal into Eurasia and mixed with the Neanderthals. In constrast Sub-Sahara black africans got none of these neanderthal genes. These dna appears to be code for immunological traits that helped homosapien sapien thrives in cooler environment outside Africa. Hence these genes are preserved because they are advantageous against diseases. At least Neanderthal blood was not blue! @vangsweetie637 asked about the complicated Asa clan.... The original Asa clan line disappeared and the current Asa clan of Arthdal Asa Hon (mother of the Igutu) and Asa Ron (head priest of White Mountain Tribe) are all from branch line relatives of the original founder. Asa Sin 200 years earlier was the original Asa Clan woman who descent the Great Escarpment and whose gene lie with the Wahan tribe. So Tanya is technically Asa Tanya! God help Hae Tu-ak for punching her again and again! That woman may be boiled by Taealha or Tagon, even though she is Taealha's confidant! Strange how life goes, one moment you are top dog, next moment the mutt that everyone shoo and kick.
  14. It is so difficult to build a nation out of 300 tribes with each one thinking of themselves as independent! then the scheming of which tribe should be top dog! Tajon is truly cunning... I accidentally kill my father during the fight since that dujeumsaeng was too fast (a half truth which is very believable)! Even when he tricks them to revive the ancient ministerial positions...it is to lock up the leaderships of all the main tribes in Arthral where he can control them (you shall be guarded by the Guard, and my troops so that no one can sneak in and kill you like they did my father)! He is cunning enough to become king! this matter of blood line of the original Asa tribe leading to the dirty savage Wahan tribe, leads directly to Tanya... the future priestess??? Here is her chance to finding out the meaning of power … after they use her to dethrone Asa Ron.
  15. @stella77 this reader didn't like scarlet heart IU but MyMister IU looked very pretty. Probably because of my sympathy for her. As for Kim Ji Won as Tanya... the more she suffers the prettier she looks! Maybe she needs a scar on the forehead like her father Yeolson.
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