[Drama 2021] Mouse, 마우스

[nrllee]

2 minutes ago, pixiebelle said:

But yes blood all over the cabin in the Ferris-wheel. And a highly decomposed body was found from the river. The silhouette of YH wearing a cap, on a boat was shown (to make us think that YH was the murderer). Then Daniel went missing and his car was found near the Ferris-wheel. Identity of decomposed body never confirmed and highly assumed by characters in the show to be Daniel's.

MC investigated the scene and found something...zipper ? I think he confirmed the blood was Daniel's ?

Did they confirm blood was Daniel’s?  I thought they assumed it was him because they found his wallet at the scene?  But somehow they got Daniel’s DNA?  O yes MC found the bloodied shoes in the garage of YH’s apartment?  I think the zipper came from those shoes?  Which MC tried to “pretend” he found dumped in the clothing bin?  And he tried to get Shin to test the blood sample?  I remember Shin telling him it was a crime to do what he did and that it was inadmissible in court.  But he went ahead and tested it against Daniel’s DNA and it didn’t match?  And it didn’t match the other victims either.  So they couldn’t get a search warrant.  That’s why they concocted that fake accident with Shin’s fiancé to try to check YH’s car for the missing boy.  Ahhh...I remember now.  They busted YH because the blood on the shoes matched the body that was dumped in the sea/lake.  The police went to his place with a search warrant but by that time YH was on his way to BR’s house...where BY was...and BR came later after breaking into YH’s lair and finding the photos of himself.  So body in the sea/lake was the guy killed in the Ferris Wheel.  YH dumped his body and he had the guy’s blood on his shoes as a result.  That’s why he fled after the event to HJ’s, hugged her and said he was scared.  Question is did he kill the guy or was it Daniel who did it and he got YH to dump the body...and Daniel faked his own death?  

[Mahsa Monem]

I think Daniel was really attacked in that ferris wheel and all of the blood was his actually. But, YH being a doctor saved him. Also, In episode 18 preview that was released today, we see Daniel with a bloody collar and I think that scene is a flashback to the attack in the ferris wheel and how he was injured. 

[ferily]

@nrllee @pixiebelle Yeah I'm wondering what exactly happened to Daniel that day because there was blood and everything. Hmmm maybe someone from the OZ organization attacked Daniel in the ferris wheel and then Yo Han saved him like you mentioned...

 

Also I'm wondering how Ba Reum was in the church and attacked Bong Yi during that time.. @nrllee I know you brought that up..

[maddymappo]

23 hours ago, __jesse said:

 

My theory: the female politician is behind the OZ people. Her aim is to pass the law to abort fetuses with the psychopath gene.

 

OZ people are related to victims killed by serial killers. They believe it's their duty to help pass this law, and prevent more victims from being killed in the future. 

 

They didn't clean up after the 7 sins killings because BR has the psychopath gene. If he gets caught, it'll help support their case.

 

But with the twist of events, the public now believes that YH is the serial killer. If YH, who has the psychopath gene as well, is revealed to be innocent and kind, it'll be detrimental to their case. 

 

Interesting. I definitely think that the lady politician (is she Shin's mother?)  is behind some of what is going on.  

The abortion issue is important.  YoHan's girlfriend did not get the abortion, if she did it would have been tragic. He was not a psychopath but even so, it doesn't mean the child would be. And, Daniel said a small percent do not turn out to be psychopaths, they are geniuses.  It seems like Yohand was a genius.  After the brain transplant (it there was a brain transplant)  BaReums IQ seemed to shoot through the roof, he was figuring everything out.  

But abortion in general, do you kill a fetus because it might be a killer? Is it okay to experiment on human children for the "greater good" as HH has said? HH is a psychopath... he does not have compassion for individual human lives.

 

@bedifferent @holyfea  Some of you have pointed out that Michaela is BR' younger sister who we now learn was missing after the massacre.  Also there is a theory that Yohan was visiting her.  He would be presenting himself as her "older brother'.  That is interesting - could be.  I wonder though who brought her to the orphanage, at that time it could have been the boxer?   Wouldn't she be over 18 years old now?  Michaela does have some disability, perhaps her savant's syndrome - autism?  So they keep her at the home. 

[Sleepy Owl]

Well with the drama having revealed Boxer's murder involving more of a grudge than it being random murder quite early, a lot of us had predicted that he must have killed Jae Hoon's family. I actually believed this theory mainly because I would never buy a kid murdering everyone in the family, especially the father who was much taller and physically stronger than him without injuring his palm with the knife.

 

I do feel for Jae Hoon/BR here though, mainly because when we first saw him, and even in this week's episodes, he sure had psychopath genes, but at the same time he surely knew that he should not be harming others. Which was the reason we would see him often scratch himself when he felt like harming others. When he did tell that he was teaching his brother a lesson and didn't have intention to kill him to his mom, I actually believed him there. As I said, he knew he should not be harming humans. The family murder triggered him actually. Daniel Lee could be right that maybe he saw his family as something belonging to him and their death meant someone stepped over his boundaries, but even then, the Boxer was the reason he murdered a person (at least if as per the drama till now), and that was when he got the taste of murdering people in my opinion. 

 

Coming back the whole experimentation and OZ gang/organization. I really wonder what is happening. I actually feel like the current Government is funding them. But really, cleaning up a scene so soon within minutes seems a bit too much to me. Last time, they still seemed to have some time (I still had lost my brain to see it happen just like BR), but yeah, this group seems to have too much power and backing for this to be happening. We do know that the congresswoman who is currently the President's secretary was among the main people wanting gene to be identified and abortion happening if the fetus was having the dangerous genes. 

 

The main question is, despite the OZ gang being after Daniel Lee, they were kind of helping out his plans here. So just like everyone, I also believe that he must have been part of this gang (or maybe they revealed it, I have been watching the episodes on FF for sometime now). Question is, why did Daniel decide to leave them or why did they try to kill him in that amusement park? Things are confusing, as we know that Daniel also has got some people working for him and is being funded by someone. Is Daniel funded by congresswoman and the OZ gang by someone else? 

 

Poor guy Yo Han, within minutes they turned him into such a good guy. Well we knew that he was actually good, but then I didn't really expect him to be the one saving Bong Yi. Speaking of Bong Yi, I am still finding her annoying. Yes, she did realize that she should not be targeting Hong Ju's kid at least, but still going after that Boxer's grandma and trying her best to dissuade her not to give interview was a bit too much for me. Yes, she must be feeling wronged by Yo Han and even Hong Ju, but still I am not really able to like her character yet. Then again, I do feel sorry for her, since if she ever comes to know BR killed her grandma, it will be too much for her to cope up with in my opinion.

 

Also what is with every psychopath wanting to breed here? I mean honestly, seeing a psychopath dating/married is too rare in dramas/movies, and here we already have 3-4 psychopaths being either married or dating someone 

 

The drama is literally filled with psychopaths and these psychopaths wanting to breed 

[bedifferent]

  @nrlleeWe shouldn't be confused about BaReum's crimes.  Even with his first victim, SSH, Bareum was angry enough to seek him out not to exact revenge for his stepfather.  He was furious that someone dared to violate his territory, thus why he killed SSH.  The 7 sins killing were to carried out to punish the victims for being virtuous claiming he is their judge and executioner.  The things he did toward innocent victims really can't be pardoned, in my opinion not even justifiable in anyway.  BaReum is on a mission to piece together his life, he has the right to punish those who orchestrated his life.  Though when it comes down to it, Bareum or anyone else can't just use his psychopath tendency, whether or not Oz triggered or condone it, as a defense for his crimes.

 

You have a point, could be a paternity test, HH vs. Bareum's DNA.  That's when YoHan found out he's not her biological son... why he went looking for Jae Hee.  

 

On 5/9/2021 at 7:39 AM, pixiebelle said:

Oz stepped in only when BR's life was at risk or in danger of being found out. The kidnapped boy HK body's was left there for years till it was in danger of being discovered. 

If Oz had clean-ed up the 1st sin killing, BR would have been suspicious.

 

On 5/9/2021 at 6:36 PM, __jesse said:

 

My theory: the female politician is behind the OZ people. Her aim is to pass the law to abort fetuses with the psychopath gene.

 

OZ people are related to victims killed by serial killers. They believe it's their duty to help pass this law, and prevent more victims from being killed in the future. 

 

They didn't clean up after the 7 sins killings because BR has the psychopath gene. If he gets caught, it'll help support their case.

 

But with the twist of events, the public now believes that YH is the serial killer. If YH, who has the psychopath gene as well, is revealed to be innocent and kind, it'll be detrimental to their case. 

Both of your points are good. I am curious on the end point of the experiment.  When does BaReum's experiment supposed to end, it can't go on forever?  Is there a time which they supposed to end this experiment?  Is it when the law is passed? What is their plan once the law has passed, will they use the dashcam recordings/evidence of BaReum's crimes to punish him?  But they can't ever publicize those videos cuz it would incriminate them and their involvement as bystanders/accomplices to the murders? What are they going to do to BaReum?

 

18 hours ago, nrllee said:

Did they confirm blood was Daniel’s?  I thought they assumed it was him because they found his wallet at the scene?  But somehow they got Daniel’s DNA?  O yes MC found the bloodied shoes in the garage of YH’s apartment?  I think the zipper came from those shoes?  Which MC tried to “pretend” he found dumped in the clothing bin?  And he tried to get Shin to test the blood sample?  I remember Shin telling him it was a crime to do what he did and that it was inadmissible in court.  But he went ahead and tested it against Daniel’s DNA and it didn’t match?  And it didn’t match the other victims either.  So they couldn’t get a search warrant.  That’s why they concocted that fake accident with Shin’s fiancé to try to check YH’s car for the missing boy.  Ahhh...I remember now.  They busted YH because the blood on the shoes matched the body that was dumped in the sea/lake.  The police went to his place with a search warrant but by that time YH was on his way to BR’s house...where BY was...and BR came later after breaking into YH’s lair and finding the photos of himself.  So body in the sea/lake was the guy killed in the Ferris Wheel.  YH dumped his body and he had the guy’s blood on his shoes as a result.  That’s why he fled after the event to HJ’s, hugged her and said he was scared.  Question is did he kill the guy or was it Daniel who did it and he got YH to dump the body...and Daniel faked his own death?  

I think Daniel did get attacked by Oz people cuz Oz people saw him watching YoHan.  That night, YoHan's shadow attacked Daniel and left him half dead in the ferris wheel?  Yo Han arrived at the time of the meeting and rescued Daniel from the amusement. Two different sources of blood, one is Daniel/ferris wheel and the other one is linked the dead body/Yo Han's shoes as he faked Daniel's death.  The decomposed body may have came from his hospital morgue or one of his patients.  

 

What if the zipper came from the body bag of the decomposed body!!!! LOL  

 

In the stills of episode 18, Bareum was seen devastated, clutching a photo or paper in his hand?  What do you think it is?  Is it his birth certificate or a picture of young YoHan/JaeHoon?  Something to make Bareum realize Yo Han is his kind childhood friend?

[nrllee]

@bedifferent  I agree about BR crimes.  Actually I would much rather the writer pens him out (he is incarcerated or dies) of the last 2-3eps and leaves MC to solve the rest.  BR needs to stop being portrayed as the protagonist?  As if somehow his newfound desire to vindicate YH absolves him of his previous crimes?  Or mitigates it in any shape or form?  Because it’s really YH’s brain ticking in that’s changed him?  The brain transplant was a mistake really on the writer’s part because it really confuses the whole issue.  BR had zero remorse as a serial killer.

 

I am not entirely convinced that the Lady Politician is behind Oz.  She seemed to be too clueless to be the mastermind?  She begged HH to save BR?  She was baffled by HH’s change of mind?  She seemed to be a step behind most of the time?  She’s too front and forward to be the mysterious Oz. 

 

I need to check the zipper again.  I think it was revealed where it came from but I forget. I seem to remember the shoe being the source...because like most of us here I thought it was a jacket or something.  And then when it was revealed I was like “huh?”.  
 

O I just went to look .  The zipper...was in a photo?  Was it an actual zipper or just an imprint?

 

And when MC found the shoes

 

The zipper was probably stuck to the bottom of the shoe?  That’s why it was in the box?  That’s why it was an imprint?

 

EDIT - wait there was some Mouse theatrical ep last night?  What was that about?

Also some kind soul translated little YH’s report card.  Sigh...he was such a sweetie.  And a genius at IQ164

Spoiler

 

 

Edited May 11, 2021 by ferily
Maximum of 3 images/Tweets per post, please put any other images/Tweets in spoiler tag. Thanks!

[pixiebelle]

3 hours ago, Sleepy Owl said:

Well with the drama having revealed Boxer's murder involving more of a grudge than it being random murder quite early, a lot of us had predicted that he must have killed Jae Hoon's family. I actually believed this theory mainly because I would never buy a kid murdering everyone in the family, especially the father who was much taller and physically stronger than him without injuring his palm with the knife.

It was revealed the Boxer accidentally killed BR's mom (could be biological or swapped mom) AND that boxer wailed all night so it seems to want us to think boxer was remorseful and wasn't evil. He was hired as BR's bodyguard and accidentally killed BR's mom to protect him. I don't think he killed the stepfather or younger brother and burnt the house - likely Oz did those.

There was a hint that boxer and detective Lee (MC tagged him as "mole) were helping Oz  for the "greater good" and not due to personal greed. So I guess this had to do with the point of the experiment : possibly it is to gather sufficient evidence to push-ahead with legalizing forced abortion of foetus with predator gene. The Oz team thinks they are on to something to rid the world of psychopaths.


In predators special ep 1 & 2, BR was shown as completely evil and beyond redemption. In the main story, after the brain surgery, he exhibits righteousness and emotions. Not sure what's the writer's point but I think BR has to die for sure - maybe it will be like suggested in one earlier post - MC will kill HH infront of BR (his son) and then BR will kill himself or MC will kill him, then MC will be released from his own emotional-jail and have peace. Eeekkk, maybe he will also help raise YH's son ! And the final twist to the ending scene will be a report containing the DNA test of YH's soon....eeriee music in the background 

----------

I can't figure out the Daniel in Ferris Wheel and zipper issue. The scenes were too dark and choppy and subsequent scenes strangely knitted together.

The Tie-Knot Murders' - not sure how it helped developed the story other than make it more confusing and dragged out more episodes and to tell us other than the 3 babies of ep1/2, there were other psychopaths ?!

 

[nrllee]

1 hour ago, pixiebelle said:

There was a hint that boxer and detective Lee (MC tagged him as "mole) were helping Oz  for the "greater good" and not due to personal greed. So I guess this had to do with the point of the experiment : possibly it is to gather sufficient evidence to push-ahead with legalizing forced abortion of foetus with predator gene. The Oz team thinks they are on to something to rid the world of psychopaths.

O I like this theory too.  But honestly is that a plausible outcome to expect?  I mean even if they were to reveal their test results (which frankly isn’t statistically significant  .  And no scientific journal is ever going to publish their work), how can they gather enough momentum (public sentiment and government backing) to push ahead with the Bill to abort all fetuses with the gene?  Unless they convince the general public that serial killers are everywhere and need to be stopped somehow.  This would generate enough fear in the public to possibly justify killing potential serial killers before they are born.

 

EDIT - I kinda want some sort of reprieve for poor BY in the end.  She’s endured so much?  And she’s all alone?  HJ has her baby and potentially 2 sets of grandparents for the baby (when she finally acknowledges her real parents).  I don’t know if MC will get together with HJ.  Which leaves MC and BY - 2 lonely people...but I am not sure they can pair up as a couple?  He’s a lot older than her?  But hey, he’s been nothing but kind and thoughtful towards her all this time.  Always worrying about her welfare.  If nothing at all, they can at least be each other’s emotional support because of everything they’ve endured together.

[Shajoona]

In next episode's preview we see HJ crying in her car and saying :" My poor YH what should I do ?"

So it seems that things will be revealed and it will be confirmed that YH is innocent..I'm  so happy for HJ and her poor kid they can now at least live in peace..I want HJ to slap BY in her face when she comes to apologize after knowing the truth..her attitude with HJ was so lame and unacceptable at all sorry but I have zero sympathy with BY's character

I keep remembering that scene when YH hugged HJ in front of her house and said  " I'm sacred" is it the same night that Daniel was supposed to be killed at the Ferris wheel  ? I wonder why he felt like going to see HJ  ..what made him so desperate to see her face and hug her ..sigh, I feel sorry for YH

 

[Fatemeh Rahemi]

8 hours ago, pixiebelle said:

The Tie-Knot Murders' - not sure how it helped developed the story other than make it more confusing and dragged out more episodes and to tell us other than the 3 babies of ep1/2, there were other psychopaths ?!

 It also revealed that the girl body they thought is Hong ju's, is not. and Bareum killing the man made him realize that something's wrong about his head

12 hours ago, bedifferent said:

In the stills of episode 18, Bareum was seen devastated, clutching a photo or paper in his hand?  What do you think it is?  Is it his birth certificate or a picture of young YoHan/JaeHoon?  Something to make Bareum realize Yo Han is his kind childhood friend?

 

He realized at the ep 17 that Yo han is his childhood friend. 

[airgelaal]

42 minutes ago, Shajoona said:

In next episode's preview we see HJ crying in her car and saying :" My poor YH what should I do ?"

So it seems that things will be revealed and it will be confirmed that YH is innocent..I'm  so happy for HJ and her poor kid they can now at least live in peace..I want HJ to slap BY in her face when she comes to apologize after knowing the truth..her attitude with HJ was so lame and unacceptable at all sorry but I have zero sympathy with BY's character

I keep remembering that scene when YH hugged HJ in front of her house and said  " I'm sacred" is it the same night that Daniel was supposed to be killed at the Ferris wheel  ? I wonder why he felt like going to see HJ  ..what made him so desperate to see her face and hug her ..sigh, I feel sorry for YH

 

HJ is not that innocent, so I have zero sympathy with her too.

[partyon]

 EVENT: Quick Poll: The Truck of Doom !

 

Chingus, time for a new Quick Poll - this time dedicated to the dreaded Truck of Doom. Please vote!

 

 

Your Event Organizers,

@partyon @Lmangla @Sleepy Owl

[Shajoona]

2 hours ago, airgelaal said:

HJ is not that innocent, so I have zero sympathy with her too.

 

I’m sorry my dear but I don’t think that I talked about HJ or BY’s innocence in my post I talked about BY’s attitude towards HJ 

And regards HJ I don’t see why anyone thinks that she isn’t innocent!! She is innocent and on the top of that Just like BY she’s a victim..she was kidnapped by HH who made her help him in his crimes ..she was used by him, her childhood was destroyed by that monster and she felt guilty at her young age that she decided not to go back to her family ..I don’t know why people are blaming her for this ..she’s the one who’s suffering the most but she has her own reasons for not coming back ..also she did nothing but going after the truth and helps people with everything she can especially  BY

What was her guilt ..Loving YH the HH’s son ? She gave him a chance and saw good in him, is this a big mistake ? Yes I found the fact that she knew that BR killed that molester and hide it is wrong but I think it’s the writer’s fault for not talking about this matter..so many scenes were left without explanation like when BR hugged HJ then she pushed him away, they never mentioned this again ..seriously it was so random like how BY wiped the wall with a wet tissue and how BR accidentally found YH’s phone ..you’re saying it’s possible since it’s dramaland okay fine I agree but it’s the writer mistake my head is going crazy sometimes because of some illogical scenes

I have been watching Korean dramas for 17 years now and I have always felt irritated when something seems off in the drama ..And how BY is figuring out everything even before MC doesn’t make any sense to me sorry about that but she stole the light from MC, I know she's smart and clearly she will go to BR's house next episode and dig for the truth there but she's not a detective ..please let MC do his job 

So yeah at the end of this long post I’m not trying to offend anyone it’s just my personal opinion..you can sympathize with whoever you want my dear it’s your opinion and I respect that

All I’m saying is HJ’s character has so much depth and a potential to shine but the writer didn’t do justice to her character because she’s the second lead..she was buried in the story and now the writer is rushing things out ..god only knows if we will have a good closure for her or not ..

I’m still hoping to see more of her and her meeting with HH and her reunion with her parents and how she’s gonna prove YH’s innocence to the world ..I don’t mind seeing MC working hard to gain her forgiveness and please writer I wanna see MC carrying HJ's child in his hands for once , it's gonna be adorable 

 

Have a nice day everyone 

[airgelaal]

2 minutes ago, Shajoona said:

 

And regards HJ I don’t see why anyone thinks that she isn’t innocent!! She is innocent and on the top of that Just like BY she’s a victim..she was kidnapped by HH who made her help him in his crimes ..she was used by him, her childhood was destroyed by that monster and she felt guilty at her young age that she decided not to go back to her family ..I don’t know why people are blaming her for this ..she’s the one who’s suffering the most but she has her own reasons for not coming back ..also she did nothing but going after the truth and helps people with everything she can especially  BY

 

She was a victim when she was a child, but she is not a child long ago. As an adult, as someone who is going after the truth, she must tell the truth about herself first. She must tell where is HH lab located. Who knows, maybe he killed more people and all the evidence are there. All those videos also can be helpful. And I don't even want to talk about her poor parents. She is a mother herself now, so how can she be so cruel to them? She knows that BR killed raper, but ignored that fact. No matter how noble this murder looked like but it's still a crime.

I don't really like BY either, but she is mush more younger and inexperience then HJ. being a victim doesn't give you an indulgence for everything. It's a common sense.

[Shajoona]

2 minutes ago, airgelaal said:

She was a victim when she was a child, but she is not a child long ago. As an adult, as someone who is going after the truth, she must tell the truth about herself first. She must tell where is HH lab located. Who knows, maybe he killed more people and all the evidence are there. All those videos also can be helpful. And I don't even want to talk about her poor parents. She is a mother herself now, so how can she be so cruel to them? She knows that BR killed raper, but ignored that fact. No matter how noble this murder looked like but it's still a crime.

I don't really like BY either, but she is mush more younger and inexperience then HJ. being a victim doesn't give you an indulgence for everything. It's a common sense.

I think it's the writer faults for not focusing more on HJ ..If only we knew more about her we would know why she chose not to come back to her family and not to talk about HH..maybe she's scared to come back to her family when he's still alive that's why before she was trying to kill him but she couldn't ..she is traumatized ..she is an adult yes but she is not like any other adult out there, she is carrying a trauma inside of her ..all of them actually MC,BY and even HJ I don't know how they managed to grow up as normal people..so yeah I blame the writer for not focusing a little on HJ's side of story to let us know more about why she made that decision..? why she's not talking about  HH's crime or his lab but only used it to help in BR's surgery ..

I do feel like you I wish that HJ will talk and confess  about the truth soon

[nrllee]

 looks like the writer has only succeeded in getting a number of people disliking most if not all of her characters.  Bar MC.  Even YH had his fair share of that when he was the main suspect for the 7Sins kills.  If not by us, then certainly by the make believe general public in the drama .

 

I hope the writer spares MC that “fate”.  Thus far he’s been the only one who has held that torch of “Good” by refusing to kill perpetrators even when they “deserved” to be killed.  I would really dislike it if the writer finally gets him to kill BR in the end.

 

But I do agree with some here who feel let down by the fact that so much time has been spent in the mind of BR but precious little on the other characters Eg HJ, YH, YH’s friend (?) - he was dispensed with so quickly - why did he decide to be YH’s friend, nobody else did, the mothers for their cryptic dealings/comments with their respective children. I really want to see how the writer is going to pen the baby swap (if she does).  What mother willingly swaps her baby with another?  Even if JiEun wanted her baby dead, the other mom was dead set on “proving Daniel wrong” by raising hers so he wouldn’t be a psychopath?  That already shows me she really wanted the child.  Her child was the reminder of her nice husband who gave his life to save another?  That’s a seismic shift of priorities for her to give her child up for some social experiment.  

[airgelaal]

We'll have 20 or 21 episodes?

[cherriesblue]

I also don't get how BaReum could "inherit" Yohan's emotions, since turns out it's the amygdala is the one responsible for emotions, not the frontal lobe.

[nrllee]

4 hours ago, airgelaal said:

We'll have 20 or 21 episodes?

I thought it was 20?  But if you count the special eps then it would be +3?  And this week there was some other theatrical special on another night so that would be +4?  
 

2 hours ago, cherriesblue said:

I also don't get how BaReum could "inherit" Yohan's emotions, since turns out it's the amygdala is the one responsible for emotions, not the frontal lobe.

Beats me. 
 

Apologies @ferily for too many pics in my earlier post.