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[Drama 2020] Born Again, 본 어게인


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1 hour ago, jeilopes said:

Maybe, remember when Hyung Bin said that was 2, one killed and other painted. It's a possibility, but she is for sure an accomplice.

Part of me hopes that the one killing was JC (under an insanity state without his conscious sane self remembering). I think that would be the best closure for me right now. I think I might be the one going insane if this story ended disappointingly. :sweatingbullets:

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14 minutes ago, fluffyloaf said:

Part of me hopes that the one killing was JC (under an insanity state without his conscious sane self remembering). I think that would be the best closure for me right now. I think I might be the one going insane if this story ended disappointingly. :sweatingbullets:

gosh..i hope its true..its would be the best closure for this drama..nothing against JKY..but for the drama sake..its  the best..

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There was a time when I thought JC was involved, but I not longer believe that, especially since the reappearance of GIW. I think they are leading to clearing JC's name and killing him off as a sort of a hero. They have been doing it for a good few episodes. What would be the point in all of this if they were to turn around and say he is the killer? 

 

HM is in a mental hospital or is it in prison? 

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So now it's SH responsibility to clear off GJC name from being the serial killer? And GJC/JCB will be a hero for "donating" his heart to Sabin? I'm impressed if this is the plot to wrap up this story. GJC killed salon's lady, stabbed HB led to his death & HE death, hurt/killed psychology doctor, a prison officer. CJB instigated SH murder, planned his brother murder, hide murder evidence. And he will get away with all this because he had pitiful live?

 

Why HB/SH need to be responsible for GJC/CJB and clean up his mess? HB/SH had pitiful life as well, the worst part now, the woman that supposed to be his bride in his past life, now siding to his killer (don't tell me Sabin is not HE. If not, why the writer made her remember HE memories). Besides, CB works with STH & get the evidence that end up SH will lose his job.

 

Btw, GJC corpse has been buried immediately after they identified him & Sabin/CJB visited him. What happens to HB corpse after identification? Did the writer having amnesia?

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6 hours ago, violet13 said:

gosh..i hope its true..its would be the best closure for this drama..nothing against JKY..but for the drama sake..its  the best..

Hahaha I am slowly becoming a JKY fan but I think this might be one of the good alternatives for the possible ending. Both for the drama's sake and to complete JKY's role. Otherwise JC/JB's character might end weaker than it started out to be. It might also be one of the easier ways to tie up some of the loose ends thus far. It would definitely fulfill JKY's desire to do a truly truly dark character hahaha.

 

2 hours ago, MVM said:

There was a time when I thought JC was involved, but I not longer believe that, especially since the reappearance of GIW. I think they are leading to clearing JC's name and killing him off as a sort of a hero. They have been doing it for a good few episodes. What would be the point in all of this if they were to turn around and say he is the killer? 

I was warming up to this idea too but the more I think about it, the more it felt incomplete. Like some dots just felt like it did not connect.

 

WARNING: Long speculative theory from crazy drama-watching lady AGAIN. I might have forgotten some key details too because every second in this show has intense dialogue that contribute to hint about the overall plot and I cannot be too sure if I remember every single part of it so feel free to correct me.

 

I will put it inside a spoiler box to avoid flooding the thread hahahaha.

Spoiler

 

What are the loose ends that have not been connected? And why do I draw the conclusion back to JC instead of GIW/HM/CST?

- Final scene of JC stabbing HB where there had been a projection of GIW in that scene that seems to hint JC is not exactly in his right mind. I had previously mentioned in my past postings that this might represent GIW's voice (years of brainwashing) finally taking over JC's sanity and winning over. But he might have had on more than one occasion, had GIW's voice taking over him. And what about his survival after prison? Did he continue in a state of sanity or insanity? Hmm. (Another commenter had mentioned a linkage to schizophrenia)

- JC in present day claims he had only killed the hairdresser. He seems to completely omit the memory of him killing HB and the prison guard? And in the flashback scene with prison guard, JC did look more aggressive than usual. Which is unusual of the JC we know of. I don't think he had purposely omitted the memory. JC in his sane/clear mental state might not have that memory at all. And the aggressive JC might be an alter ego/split personality.

- Someone killed and GIW painted. Who could be the one who killed while GIW painted? If GIW has had HM or someone else to do the killing, why was he fixated on GJC in the past and tried convincing him to kill? (We also need to question some of the crazy events like GJC's cupboard of umbrellas - some of these things were not clearly admitted to be GIW's doing, it might be GJC's doing while he was in a mental haze).

- The Yellow Umbrella cases stopped upon GJC's arrest despite GIW still around and admitted he continued murder. Yes, GIW might still be a murderer. But could the Yellow Umbrella modus operandi not be of GIW's style of murder but of someone else's? In specific, JC of the past? And we do not see the same series of painting continued for the rest of his victims after JC's death neither.

- Why was HM so obsessed with creating JB and making him like JC? Was it because she wanted to find back GIW's muse? The one who is the source of inspiration (or source of killing) for GIW's paintings. If HM had been the one killing, why was she so obsessed with JB and wanting to make him a murderer?

- GIW is excited to have SA. Yes they are both the same kind and he might just be excited that somebody is equally as crazy. Or he might also be excited again to have regain a crazy child that can inspire him again after JC is gone. And previously I had mentioned HM being afraid of SA seeing GIW but she herself seems less afraid or unafraid of GIW. This piques my curiosity too.

- GIW's style of killing SB. He did not have an equally meticulous and artistic approach to his modus operandi here. It was utterly dull in fact (seriously, drugs and pushing her off?). If he had enjoyed killing for so long, it seems unlikely that he will miss out on the joy from savouring the kill of SB. It creates a lot of doubt in me that the Yellow Umbrella cases were done by him in the first place.

- Aside from being GIW's son, I really wonder if there are other reasons that keep getting GIW/HM fixated on JC/JB? If he had really not killed anyone as JC, would they continue their fixation on JB in this life and be so convinced that he will be a murderer?

 

But there's also something that is hard to make sense of this theory:

- CST seems to fear of people finding out about GJC in the past. Was it because he feared people would know that GJC did not die and it was he and HM who killed him off afterwards? Or was he afraid that people would find out that JC was wrongly convicted by him? This is something I am unclear about. If it was the latter then my theory and suspicion above does not stand.

 

What would be the point of doing all that and end up with him as the killer?

- Well the show established itself strongly in the earlier stages about how this is about psychopaths and people who are sick in the head (Human VS Beast). So aside from the exploration on psychopathic GIW and SA, the writer might also be bringing in other forms of mental disorder in JC, JB and HM's character. I think we can only clearly conclude the point of the whole story after we complete the entire series.

- The story is about redemption and second chances. So despite what JC has done, JB in his current life can be different. Even if JC was really a monster in the past. I think looking from an angle of maximised inherent drama within a storyline to bring out a theme, him being a true beast in the past and rebirthed with a second chance to change his fate will provide the best effect.

 

 

2 hours ago, MVM said:

HM is in a mental hospital or is it in prison? 

She looks like she is in a straight jacket to me. So there might be a potential for her to be the murderer (but psychopaths still get sent to jail right?) or something so shocking happened that she went straight crazy.

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12 minutes ago, fluffyloaf said:

Hahaha I am slowly becoming a JKY fan but I think this might be one of the good alternatives for the possible ending. Both for the drama's sake and to complete JKY's role. Otherwise JC/JB's character might end weaker than it started out to be. It might also be one of the easier ways to tie up some of the loose ends thus far. It would definitely fulfill JKY's desire to do a truly truly dark character hahaha.

 

Thanks for mentioning the Prison Guard in JC's victim listing.

 

I thought GIW left the country because the investigation was getting closer to him.  That was the scene in the car that some of us thought might have been in JC's head.

 

I think that CST faked evidence on GJC's killing, and if that becomes known he will lose his job or something.  

 

While there are hints that the ending will include JC being crazy/dark I expect a much more traditional ending (which will be disappointing to me because at this point I dislike JB/JC and SB and want SH/HB to get far, far away from them....)

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So good LSH and JSY are having fun, I love when the cast become friends.

 

3 hours ago, nitttss said:

https://instagram.com/stories/jieun._.zzing/2324878621510157654?utm_source=ig_story_item_share&igshid=1il9jpf9060vt

 

Seems like the two actors enjoy playing games today lol

 

Sorry i dunno how to post the picture from insta story.. only can give links haha

 

 

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3 hours ago, fluffyloaf said:

 

I was warming up to this idea too but the more I think about it, the more it felt incomplete. Like some dots just felt like it did not connect.

 

WARNING: Long speculative theory from crazy drama-watching lady AGAIN. I might have forgotten some key details too because every second in this show has intense dialogue that contribute to hint about the overall plot and I cannot be too sure if I remember every single part of it so feel free to correct me.

 

I will put it inside a spoiler box to avoid flooding the thread hahahaha.

  Reveal hidden contents

 

What are the loose ends that have not been connected? And why do I draw the conclusion back to JC instead of GIW/HM/CST?

- Final scene of JC stabbing HB where there had been a projection of GIW in that scene that seems to hint JC is not exactly in his right mind. I had previously mentioned in my past postings that this might represent GIW's voice (years of brainwashing) finally taking over JC's sanity and winning over. But he might have had on more than one occasion, had GIW's voice taking over him. And what about his survival after prison? Did he continue in a state of sanity or insanity? Hmm. (Another commenter had mentioned a linkage to schizophrenia)

- JC in present day claims he had only killed the hairdresser. He seems to completely omit the memory of him killing HB and the prison guard? And in the flashback scene with prison guard, JC did look more aggressive than usual. Which is unusual of the JC we know of. I don't think he had purposely omitted the memory. JC in his sane/clear mental state might not have that memory at all. And the aggressive JC might be an alter ego/split personality.

- Someone killed and GIW painted. Who could be the one who killed while GIW painted? If GIW has had HM or someone else to do the killing, why was he fixated on GJC in the past and tried convincing him to kill? (We also need to question some of the crazy events like GJC's cupboard of umbrellas - some of these things were not clearly admitted to be GIW's doing, it might be GJC's doing while he was in a mental haze).

- The Yellow Umbrella cases stopped upon GJC's arrest despite GIW still around and admitted he continued murder. Yes, GIW might still be a murderer. But could the Yellow Umbrella modus operandi not be of GIW's style of murder but of someone else's? In specific, JC of the past? And we do not see the same series of painting continued for the rest of his victims after JC's death neither.

- Why was HM so obsessed with creating JB and making him like JC? Was it because she wanted to find back GIW's muse? The one who is the source of inspiration (or source of killing) for GIW's paintings. If HM had been the one killing, why was she so obsessed with JB and wanting to make him a murderer?

- GIW is excited to have SA. Yes they are both the same kind and he might just be excited that somebody is equally as crazy. Or he might also be excited again to have regain a crazy child that can inspire him again after JC is gone. And previously I had mentioned HM being afraid of SA seeing GIW but she herself seems less afraid or unafraid of GIW. This piques my curiosity too.

- GIW's style of killing SB. He did not have an equally meticulous and artistic approach to his modus operandi here. It was utterly dull in fact (seriously, drugs and pushing her off?). If he had enjoyed killing for so long, it seems unlikely that he will miss out on the joy from savouring the kill of SB. It creates a lot of doubt in me that the Yellow Umbrella cases were done by him in the first place.

- Aside from being GIW's son, I really wonder if there are other reasons that keep getting GIW/HM fixated on JC/JB? If he had really not killed anyone as JC, would they continue their fixation on JB in this life and be so convinced that he will be a murderer?

 

But there's also something that is hard to make sense of this theory:

- CST seems to fear of people finding out about GJC in the past. Was it because he feared people would know that GJC did not die and it was he and HM who killed him off afterwards? Or was he afraid that people would find out that JC was wrongly convicted by him? This is something I am unclear about. If it was the latter then my theory and suspicion above does not stand.

 

What would be the point of doing all that and end up with him as the killer?

- Well the show established itself strongly in the earlier stages about how this is about psychopaths and people who are sick in the head (Human VS Beast). So aside from the exploration on psychopathic GIW and SA, the writer might also be bringing in other forms of mental disorder in JC, JB and HM's character. I think we can only clearly conclude the point of the whole story after we complete the entire series.

- The story is about redemption and second chances. So despite what JC has done, JB in his current life can be different. Even if JC was really a monster in the past. I think looking from an angle of maximised inherent drama within a storyline to bring out a theme, him being a true beast in the past and rebirthed with a second chance to change his fate will provide the best effect.

 

 

She looks like she is in a straight jacket to me. So there might be a potential for her to be the murderer (but psychopaths still get sent to jail right?) or something so shocking happened that she went straight crazy.

 

Wow what an attention to detail, interesting, insightful and made me wonder indeed. There are a couple of things though.

 

Originally I thought CIW was a figment of JC's imagination, but once I realized that he isn't I dropped the idea that JC was the murderer.During  GIW's conversation with JC that you've mentioned, wasn't  he egging him on, telling him that he needs to kill somebody to truly understand what it feels like? He also admits to killing the girl on the painting, talking about her being an evil witch, how she was cruel to her father. There is also a 2 year gap between that case and the case before it, seemed like an important fact to me. Of course some of the things were ambiguous, so it might have been misinterpreted...

 

Then as you've mentioned there is JB's father. Why is he so afraid of JC's case? Why did he want JC dead in the first place? I thought it was because he didn't want people to find out that he put somebody else's crimes on JC. However more importantly, why did HM want JC killed if he was such an inspiration to GIW? 

 

Plus now that picture of HM in a mental hospital. I would have understood why she was put in a prison, but a mental facility? 

  

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On 6/5/2020 at 4:02 AM, fluffyloaf said:

Yeah this was bad. Although the kissing scene she did struggle and tried to push him away, I thought the hand holdings scene in the cinema was worse. I know SB did say she will hold him until his bad memories go away. But if that's the reason she is allowing JB to hold her hand in the cinema, I am so angry for this very forced connection that the writer is trying to execute between the dialogue said and the actions taken.

 

Actually I didn't mind the hand holding as SB was crying about the film so it seemed like he was just comforting her

 

Thanks for the Hye Mi picture @jeilopes  :hushed: I'm surprised she posted a potentailly big spoiler! 

 

On 6/5/2020 at 6:19 AM, jeilopes said:

Maybe, remember when Hyung Bin said that was 2, one killed and other painted. It's a possibility, but she is for sure an accomplice.

Yes!  This seems to point to Hyung Bin's initial theory being correct.

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There are many possibile ending for this drama and I will share them

1- the most likely ending as I said before both men will die and JB will give his heart to SB and SB will live with memories of both men 

2- JB will die and give his heart to SB and SH will enter the prison and SB will wait for him until he is discharge then they reunited 

3- SB will be with JB until he die and give his heart to her then after  years passed she can start new relationship with SH ( so she will end up with both men:D)

4-JB will die and give his heart to SB and after he die SB realized the one she love is JB and she will promise this time she will be the one who will wait for him

 

 

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3 hours ago, saya2 said:

There are many possibile ending for this drama and I will share them

1- the most likely ending as I said before both men will die and JB will give his heart to SB and SB will live with memories of both men 

2- JB will die and give his heart to SB and SH will enter the prison and SB will wait for him until he is discharge then they reunited 

3- SB will be with JB until he die and give his heart to her then after  years passed she can start new relationship with SH ( so she will end up with both men:D)

4-JB will die and give his heart to SB and after he die SB realized the one she love is JB and she will promise this time she will be the one who will wait for him

 

 

 = provoking the screenwriter

:mrgreen:  

 

JKY 4 years ago...wow! He forsaw the character in BA?

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5 hours ago, saya2 said:

There are many possibile ending for this drama and I will share them

1- the most likely ending as I said before both men will die and JB will give his heart to SB and SB will live with memories of both men 

2- JB will die and give his heart to SB and SH will enter the prison and SB will wait for him until he is discharge then they reunited 

3- SB will be with JB until he die and give his heart to her then after  years passed she can start new relationship with SH ( so she will end up with both men:D)

4-JB will die and give his heart to SB and after he die SB realized the one she love is JB and she will promise this time she will be the one who will wait for him

 

 

I wish you had at least 1 option where JB stayed alive :bawling:

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34 minutes ago, Swatkats said:

I wish you had at least 1 option where JB stayed alive :bawling:

 

Ok I'll give you one

 

5) JB survives, then him, SH and SB form a very modern family and live together :P

 

Honestly though Sabin will not stay with JB, she will either remain alone or with SH. JB has absolutely nobody, but her. His family is horrible, he doesn't really have any friends, even if he was to survive he doesn't have anywhere to go, so for him it'd not be a happy ending either if SB isn't in it. Unless of course he ends up helping SB's uncles to run the restaurant. They seem to adore him and ship him with SB :D 

With the way things are now I hope we get to see that JB is happy in his next life or a hint that it's going to be the case. 

 

BTW I would love to be proven wrong, as I want him to survive. 

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1 hour ago, MVM said:

 

Ok I'll give you one

 

5) JB survives, then him, SH and SB form a very modern family and live together :P

 

Honestly though Sabin will not stay with JB, she will either remain alone or with SH. JB has absolutely nobody, but her. His family is horrible, he doesn't really have any friends, even if he was to survive he doesn't have anywhere to go, so for him it'd not be a happy ending either if SB isn't in it. Unless of course he ends up helping SB's uncles to run the restaurant. They seem to adore him and ship him with SB :D 

With the way things are now I hope we get to see that JB is happy in his next life or a hint that it's going to be the case. 

 

BTW I would love to be proven wrong, as I want him to survive. 

I'm curious what SH/CB's sins are? If that is going to alter HE love for CB? In 2 episodes I dont know how much they would be able to show it. I dont want JB/JC to die again, the guy has been reborn so many times. 

But I dont think If JB/JC die, Sabin will ever be happy with SH as she said she cant be happy with SH until JB/JC is happy. Now him dying can't be happy for Sabin, unless JB/JC tells her he would be happy if she takes his heart:(.

 

There's 3 things Sabin/HE doesnt know and I'm curious how she would react when she gets to know about SH/CHB's sins and that JB is JC's  reincarnation and JB has bullet in his head. Only 2 episodes to go:P

 

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1 minute ago, Swatkats said:

I'm curious what SH/CB's sins are? If that is going to alter HE love for CB? In 2 episodes I dont know how much they would be able to show it. I dont want JB/JC to die again, the guy has been reborn so many times. 

But I dont think If JB/JC die, Sabin will ever be happy with SH as she said she cant be happy with SH until JB/JC is happy. Now him dying can't be happy for Sabin, unless JB/JC tells her he would be happy if she takes his heart:(.

 

There's 3 things Sabin/HE doesnt know and I'm curious how she would react when she gets to know about SH/CHB's sins and that JB is JC's  reincarnation and JB has bullet in his head. Only 2 episodes to go:P

 

 

Well we are about to find out. I'm very curious too, because she could potentially cast JB aside, because she has her memory back.

 

However even if it was to happen I doubt she'd stay this way for long as you are right we only have 2 episodes to go :)

 

If JB dies from the bullet in his brain, technically it means SH killed him, so yes I'm not sure how SB will deal with it. That is why I think there is a potential that she will remain alone, plus I don't think her feelings towards SH are strong enough. I've stopped believing in their eternal love about 4 episodes ago. Prior to that I didn't ship them either, but I thought their connection is strong, so it's only fair for them to end up together. 

 

We are only guessing what is going to happen, for all we know JB is going to live and will have a happy ending. I mean this drama has surprised us so many times, so who knows...

 

My hope is that all 3 of them are happy in the end, not sure whether that's even possible given the way things are in the drama now. 

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For me, Born Again ideal ending in episode 10. However, given we have 2 other episodes, I think of a few scenarios;

  • Soohyuk dies, kill by STH after he clear off GJC names. CJB recover after the operations and live together with Sabin & her annoying uncles.
  • CJB dies due to the bullet in his head & he donates his heart to Sabin. Soohyuk & Sabin get together and continue to remember CJB/GJC.
  • CJB recovers from the bullet lost his memories and lives happily with his family. Sabin & Soohyuk move on with their life separately.
  • Three of them die.
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After watching the past 2 episodes in KBS World with Eng. Subs, there are scenes that were sub differently from other sites, like in the kissing scene, other site used "sting" but in the official translation it was "ache", so it just confirmed my earlier post that I said that SB does not love JB but only pities or sympathises with him because of what happened to him . . . wherein he was shot by SH. In short, SB was still protecting SH by being nice to him and cannot in a way antagonize him in order for him to pursue his intention again of killing SH.

 

Also, in he scene when SH was drunk, there is again a different translation wherein other sites translated "You hate me, that's why I can't go near you" but in the KBS World translation it was "You hate me that's why I cannot express my feelings to you" --- which explains why SH never attempted to talk to SB for a year because he thought that SB hates him, but in SB does not hate him, she is just mad and she is beginning to soften her heart to SH by answering his calls. Maybe some interpreted her actions everytime she answers her phone that she does not like SH but I don't think so (maybe JSY can't express needed for the scene or maybe it is in the script or the direction of the scene, no offense meant to the actress).

 

I realized after watching the last 2 episodes, that SH is busy resolving/fixing the mess created by GJC/JB while the latter (GJC/JB) is busy dating SB/HE and still GJC/JB wants to be first in terms of love with regards to HE, however, he is already late because in HE heart, it will always be HB who is first. Maybe GJC/JB wants to prove that he will be the first one who will be remembered by SB but SB said after the kiss that even if SH does something bad, he will still remember him first and he might go back to him.  As for the movie scene and the holding hands, I don't feel any love vibe watching them. It is one sided only on the part of JB and SB just lets him hold her hand while she was busy watching the movie. As compared to the scene with SH.

 

As to the last scene, where SH gave the rings to SB, I got teary-eyed in this scene.  SH saying that he wants her to give the ring to him when the right time comes and he will wait even if how long it will take. SH wants to first fix or resolve the murders then he can go back to SB. I hope and pray that SH will be given a chance to do that with SB. In fact, even the dad of SB likes SH.

 

I am excited for the next 2 episodes. Watching till the end.  I hope and pray for a happy ending for SH and SB which did not happen with HB and HE.:):heart: As for JB, i hope he resolves his issues too. Maybe he will die or not?? But I hope he resolves all his issues in his life.

 

 

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