[Drama 2020] Born Again, 본 어게인

[Plummpychan]

Text preview for ep 17-18

17-18회 미리보기 

칼에 찔린 사빈(진세연 분)은 응급수술을 하고, 수혁(이수혁 분)은 밤새 사빈의 곁을 지킨다.

자신 때문에 사빈이 다치자 충격받은 종범(장기용 분)은 사빈의 병실로 찾아가는데...

 

 

English translation using app:

Sa-bin (played by Jin Se-yeon) gets emergency surgery, while Soo-hyuk (played by Lee Soo-hyuk) stays by Sabin's side all night.

Jong-beom (played by Jang Ki-yong), who was shocked when Sabin was injured because of him, went to Sabin's room...

 

 

[raziela]

I am really loving the discussions and theories in the thread.  I really enjoyed both episodes 7 and 8 this week especially the way SH and SB's relationship is progressing.  I am rather confused with what the writer is doing with JB's character but will discuss that later.

 

On 5/12/2020 at 11:09 PM, SweetButters said:

Spoiler

 

@jeilopes Couldn't have said it better myself haha!

 

Just watched the episode with subs finally too.....

 

The interaction between SH and JB...wow....haha like SH something along the lines of

 

SH: Don't you think that makes you a stalker?

JB :Don't you think it's wrong to be dating two women at the same time?

^ they were clapping back to each other hard!!!

 

Yea I definitely agree with you on how SH going to the NSF office definitely showed that guy that SB is his weakness. I love the whole similarity of SH wanting to protect SB to that of the same need to do so in their former life! 

 

Did anyone else notice how that song playing in the car which SB turns up the volume is the same song from the window scene in their former life when Ha Eun gives HB a portable cassette player with his favorite song ? SO SWEET 

 

Other thoughts I had about this episode was the central book mentioned over and over again which is Wuthering Heights. Now I haven't read that book in probably a decade now, but I remember the major characters and themes. Basically the book is centered around exploring the different kinds of love and the results of its intensity.

 

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What I thought was pretty cool was when JB asks her about why he likes/loves a man who's prone to change [aka SH]. To which, SB asks him "dont you want to change?" and he says "no". In Wuthering Heights, there is two main parallel love stories: 

 

1) Catherine and Heathcliff: Basically their story ends up with a destructive kind of love that doesn't ever change. Catherine ends up marrying Edgar because she wanted a safer and more quiet life and ends up having a daughter named after her aka Young Catherine/Cathy. 

 

2) Young Catherine/Cathy and Hareton: Their love story ends up being better and more well balanced because at first their relationship was one filled with contempt, but later on grows/evolves/changes to love.

 

So basically the drama is going the route of how their past life was reflective of the love triangle between Edgar[HB], Catherine[Ha Eun], Heathcliff [JC]. Now in their current life, it's going on the route of the other parallel love story of Young Catherine/Cathy and Hareton where SB is Young Catherine/Cathy,  SH is Hareton, and I'm guessing JB is Linton [son of Heathcliff and Isabella Linton] .

 

Haha so just read "Wuthering Heights" if you want to figure out what will happen next lol.

 

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Seems to me that basically Hye Mi is like the puppet master in all of this [from telling SH he should investigate JB to asking JB about Heathcliff in Wuthering Heights to asking her daughter if that's a man that seems to be ready to get married]! Then again her daughter is just as manipulative too with the whole putting that note in SB's father's pocket. Can't wait until next week when SH breaks it off with her !

 

 

Great post!  It was entertaining when they were sparring and, tbh, JB had a point and even SH didn't have a come back to that one lol

I loved all the little ways SH showed his feelings for SB in this episode and the protectiveness we saw in HB.  I loved the HB-HE song playing again the car and the way he was looking at her  I also noticed when he was at the wedding gifts place with his Sang-Ah he was looking at the angel figurines.  I think they must have reminded him of the musical angel HB bough HE.

 

I really love your theory about Wuthering Heights.  Also agree with you and @JelliKelli that I never found Wuthering Heights romantic and it's always disturbed that somany romanticise Heathcliff and Catherine's deeply unhealthy relationship and behaviour.  Another interesting theory I read on another site is that Hye Mi is the Heathcliff character.  I will try to find the p[ost again and post it.

 

On 5/13/2020 at 2:17 AM, JelliKelli said:

Spoiler

 

So, I think that in the 80’s line...JC had multiple personalities kinda like Mr. Robot. His “Father” was really his alter ego, and JC main personality was innocent and childlike. I JB current incarnation is a psychopath of some sort via genetics. His mother is obviously a psychopath, his brother is a psychopath,  and so it is obviously genetic. He is trying very hard to “mimic” human behavior. SB knows he is a psychopath and is trying to encourage him to get in touch with his better nature, and to reject his base instincts. She understands that he literally doesn’t know any better, and can’t help his tendencies but that he can choose a better path. That is what is so sad about JB in his current incarnation. JC was a killer due to trauma. A sensitive person tortured to the point of dissociating with reality. Truly tragic. JB is a born psychopath, but trying to do better. He does not know what love is. He is obsessed with SB, because she makes him feel empathy, and she knows what he is, and tries to embrace him anyway.  I am kinda disappointed that their current incarnations are so similar, and on almost the same trajectory. I hope there is redemption for JB. 
 

I still don’t know how the “butterfly cult” fits into all this. I know that JB had an obsession with “resurrection “ and that is what the butterfly signifies, but I don’t know how this is gonna tie together in our story.
 

I am enjoying this drama, even though I feel like the writing could be a bit tighter. I find myself rooting for JB, maybe just because his story is the most interesting. SH character is a bit boring. SB character is a bit saccharine. The actors are doing well. I feel like they dropped the reincarnation fossil mystery and we haven’t heard about it again. It’s a shame. The premise is a good one, but poorly executed. It’s a waste of some really good actors. I’m hanging on for them, even though I freaking hated Wuthering Heights. People always talked about how romantic it was, but I thought it was just awful. I hated Catherine, and I ended up hating Heathcliffe at the end. Catherine’s husband was just kind of “there”. Catherine dies in childbirth halfway through the book....I hated it. I hope this Heathcliffe hets a happier ending.

 

 

I agree with your assessment of both JC and JB different mental disorders.  I still would like confirmation that JC was responsible for the other yellow umbrella murders but it is looking more and more likely he was the culprit via another personality.  As for JB, I still would like to know what happened with the student when he was 15.  Then there was the further information revealed this episode that he had already checked out the lake and took a local schoolgirl there, then there's the tracking SB without her permission, taking her phone, setting up SH's attack. I was feeling a lot of sympathy for him (and I still did in the scene where he was practising facial expressions) but in episode 8 he took things too far and I'm really wondering baffled what the writer is doing with JB's character arc.  I thought this life would be a chance for him to make different choices despite his upbringing and redeem himself but currently I feel like his character is following the same trajectory as JC and, if anything, seems to be.

 

I also agree with you. I am enjoying the drama and the premise is a very good one, actors are doing a great job but the writing could have been a lot tighter and stronger. I said previously I think the rookie writer over-extended herself by introducing way too many questions along with too many supporting characters in the modern era who are also full of mysteries and this made the storyline seem disjointed, confusing and sluggish in the earlier episodes. I think it would be better to concentrate on the three leads, the love triangle, JB trying harder to fight his dark impulses, JB-SB friendship and healing, reincarnation, mystery of what happened 30 years ago and add the copycat yellow umbrella murders to link the two timelines.  That would have streamlined things and still have given us plenty of plot!  

 

P.S. I also hated Wuthering Heights

 

On 5/13/2020 at 6:27 AM, whiteclover said:

i came after watching the subbed latest episode. Dude ,i think JB has lost control over himself? He is taking the path JC took in his previous life. He believes getting rid of SH will be the best for SB (Just like how JC thought of killing someone to get a heart for HE). I mean the intentions are right, but the methods are just too extreme!!! Yet again in both lives, JB/JC doesn't care if this was what SB/HE wanted... at this point of time i don't think it will make any sense if the writer makes SB & JB end up together after all that he has done. I do hope he finally comes to realize that he should live for himself and not for others.

 

As for SA, do you guys think she is the person sending the messages (as GJC?). I mean SB's dad reacted so violently after his interaction with her. Even if she isn't the real GJC, i guess there might be a link or a cult involved for the killings? If not, probably she just wanted to threaten SB for being around SH? But it doesn't seem to be that simple...

 

I hope they also reveal the backstory as to how JC survived? And how he suddenly became so vicious? We are halfway into the series but there seem to be increasing dangers surrounding SH/SB. Lets hope for a happy ending everyone  

 

**side note i found it cute when SH ran to the NFS for SB but pretended to be cold once he made sure she was safe + at the end the look he had when he walked towards drunk SB 

Good post!  I don't know if she is the one sending the messages to JB but I do wonder how she found out who SB's father was when not even prosecutor SH was aware until the nurse said SB's name on the phone.  She is very scary and now SH is going to end things with her for SB, she is going to get scarier

We REALLY need an explanation on how JC survived! 

Addthe car scene and the way he looked at her  I loved all SH's tsundere moments in the episode.

 

18 hours ago, Plummpychan said:

Ikr??? I'm weak by all that, hahaha, can't wait to see his soft side & to see him smiling more often.

Also, that hand holdings at the lake scenes to me was to die for, I find it very manly & sexy esp hearing his deep voice too in the background.

Excuse me while adding the view of it 

https://giphy.com/gifs/QTgcqEXJGY3KxYtWDZ

(Idk how to show/ embeded a pic/gif into post)

 

If a simple hand holdings can already make me weak as it is, imagine if we get the OTP romance for real? Hahaha I can't wait for that  but first, why so many obstacles infront of them? sigh

 

 

17 hours ago, rocher22 said:

No words are needed...

No wods indeed.  Such a beautiful scene

 

On 5/12/2020 at 6:11 PM, SweetButters said:

Spoiler

1) JB is creepy AF! I mean he was just as creepy as was in his former past life. However, the only difference is that now its just JC with the power of modern technology so he goes and hardcore stalks her. I mean seriously? If him and SB are meant to be then they will be, but he can't force them to be by installing a tracker app on her phone like what is seriously wrong with him!! Even SH calls him a stalker in that scene!!

 

On 5/12/2020 at 7:39 PM, scarletlover1 said:

 

Spoiler

 

I was really hoping he'd be different this time... That there be some kind of redemption arc for him to make up for the past but...

1. SB drops her journal and knowing it belongs to her, JB decides to keep it instead of returning it. Even goes through it, NOSY SELF!
2. He's more creepy than he was in the past.
3. Attempted murder three times. About the girl who was killed when he was 15? Still not sure about that.
4. Him, his brother and mother are all pyschos.
5. He's stalking her again just like he did in the past!
6. And did he really put a tracker on her? Did he really?
7. Now he sends someone to kill SH?

 

Get out of here! If I was SB, I'm going the other direction. I'm not messing with that.

 

 

On 5/12/2020 at 7:58 PM, kdramafan1 said:

Spoiler

 

I just realize that SB and SH are the only two sane characters, the rest are psychopaths and there are too many of them in this series. 

 

As for SA and JB being siblings, that would explain why SA and JB are so much alike.  Both are supposedly good looking, talented but at the same time sick minded and are willing to commit murder for their obsessions. If SA and JB share the same paternal genes, then the writer is saying that madness and being evil are inheritable traits.  This is also SH's theory and that's why he is so adamant about putting the sick minded criminals behind bars. 

 

I wish the plot can be about redemption too but there is none so far.  As of now, JB and SA are becoming uncontrollable and scary.  This development has taken away the bit of sympathy I developed for JB in the last episode.

 

Looking at the preview, I am happy that SH is breaking off the engagement.  Hopefully SB is not going to accept JB's confession of love.

 

 

On 5/12/2020 at 10:56 PM, Annya said:

Spoiler

Although all actors are doing good job in drama ,but i am not getting the point of drama and where the drama is going ?The preset 2020  is very similar to past 1988, i mean the story of 1st three episode is coming in modern version in recent episodes.I though maybe soul switch was going to happen in current time they did give hint in few episode but suddenly took U turn.Was writer trying to confuse us or he or she is confused herself.Whats the difference between past and present story and character.The story is going same way as past.I am not getting what exactly writer is trying to tell us to watch.What's the purpose of them getting born again ?Already 8 episode are over.

 

 

@SweetButters @scarletlover1 @kdramafan1 @Annya  I agree with your posts regarding JB.  I don't really understand what the writer is saying with his character's arc. I thought the difference in this new life would be that JB wouldn't make the same wrong decisions he made in his previous life, that his relationship with SB would make him a better person, that we would see healing and redemption for the tragedy of his past life but that doesn't seem to be the case so far.  The author spent episodes making us sympathise with JB but his actions this episode were so extreme that it makes it difficult to maintain the same degree of sympathy towards him.  Like @SweetButters said maybe it's the modern technology which allows JB to be more extreme because even with JC stalking Ha Eun for 4 years he was content with just looking and didn't try to interfere in her life or make her love him.  I hope after SB was injured yet again due to his actions that JB will try to get off this destructive path and redeem himself.

[SweetButters]

50 minutes ago, raziela said:

 

@SweetButters @scarletlover1 @kdramafan1 @Annya  I agree with your posts regarding JB.  I don't really understand what the writer is saying with his character's arc. I thought the difference in this new life would be that JB wouldn't make the same wrong decisions he made in his previous life, that his relationship with SB would make him a better person, that we would see healing and redemption for the tragedy of his past life but that doesn't seem to be the case so far.  The author spent episodes making us sympathise with JB but his actions this episode were so extreme that it makes it difficult to feel the same degree of sympathy towards him.  Like @SweetButters said maybe it's the modern technology which allows JB to be more extreme because even with JC stalking Ha Eun for 4 years he was content with just looking and didn't try to interfere in her life or make her love him.  I hope after SB was injured yet again due to his actions that JB will try to get off this destructive path and redeem himself.

 

@raziela Sorry to cut your post short! Yea same, literally not sure where JB's character arc is going either sometimes. Like you said,

hopefully JB will redeem himself, but I dont know I feel like even that incident won't. Instead, its going to drive SB further from him which would make him even more monstrous and extreme! Ekk! I maybe felt bad for him for like 1-2 episodes after that " I was like really dude? There's a certain extent you have to know what you're doing is completely wrong" lol. I mean yea I'd admit some of us (me included) have done the whole IG stalking stuff, but yea definitely not the whole put tracking app or whatever on someone else's phone . Thats on a whole different left of cray cray right there. Also, SB and SH probably have a lot more people to worry about now from JB, SA, Gangster Mob, Butterfly Killer, etc. Their list of people who want to kill/hurt them just keeps growing. Can the powers that be give this couple a break haha? They already died once already lol!!!

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1 hour ago, whiteclover said:

making film is out  

 

@whiteclover Wish there was subs for this ! I was wondering what LSH was saying before he jumped into the waters lol

 

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1 hour ago, jeilopes said:

Jang Ki Yong + Jin Se Yeon’s Relationship Changes After She Saves Lee Soo Hyuk’s Life On “Born Again”

 

Get ready for some dramatic changes in the relationships between the three protagonists of “Born Again”!

 

Spoiler

On the previous episode of the KBS drama, Jung Sa Bin (played by Jin Se Yeon) bravely saved Kim Soo Hyuk (played by Lee Soo Hyuk)’s life by throwing herself between him and an assailant wielding a knife. As Chun Jong Bum (played by Jang Ki Yong) looked on in horror, Jung Sa Bin was stabbed instead of Kim Soo Hyuk.

 

On May 14, “Born Again” unveiled new stills from its upcoming episode that hint at the changing dynamics between its three leads. As the injured Jung Sa Bin recovers in the hospital, Kim Soo Hyuk is unable to hide his emotion as he sits by her bedside and watches over her with a deeply concerned expression. Although the cold Kim Soo Hyuk had previously suppressed his feelings for Jung Sa Bin and rejected her due to his engagement, the sincerity in his gaze suggests that he may be slowly opening his heart to his rescuer.

 

Meanwhile, the relationship between Chun Jong Bum and Jung Sa Bin appears to have taken a turn for the worse. In contrast to the warmth of the affection that was previously developing between the two, Jung Sa Bin is noticeably cold as she turns her gaze away from Chun Jong Bum in the hospital. Meanwhile, Chun Jong Bum looks genuinely hurt at the frosty demeanor of the woman he loves, raising the question of what could have caused such a sudden change in their dynamic.

 

Source: https://www.soompi.com/article/1400165wpp/jang-ki-yong-jin-se-yeons-relationship-changes-after-she-saves-lee-soo-hyuks-life-on-born-again

 

@jeilopes Amazing stills ! Thanks ! Snyone noticed how the vital monitor in the 1st pic shows it flatline? then in the 2nd pic, SB suddenly has vitals again lol. Also love how there's an angel figurine in the 2nd pic (far right). 

 

Can I just say, I wish all of us would like SB after waking up in a hospital haha

 

Whelp as far as I'm concerned, it serves JB right if SB gives him the cold shoulder after that whole stabbing incident since JB essentially was the one that caused it to happen in the first place! Baby girl is got to wake up and smell the coffee now !

[SweetButters]

Question: Is LSH the main male lead or is JKY a male lead too?

[OksanaSiytra]

KBS know what we love in this drama 

 

[OksanaSiytra]

 

[Plummpychan]

I think I need to count how many kisses did SH received from his fiancee so we can demand to the writer/PD-nim to give our Sa bin just as much .

We can't let the fiancee have them more than our Sa Bin, right? who's with me? 

 

As far as I remember, there're 3?

1st. At the morning scenes after bed 

2nd. The crazy forced kiss while he's driving

3rd. The desperate forced kiss at the lake

 

Anything that I've missed? 

 

So does this means we'll get more than that from our OTP?  *clapclap

 

Eng sub for latest BTS making is up!

*specialthankstoLSH88 

 

[rocher22]

 

SH was speechless...SB was sad... JB was happy.  

 

 

 

Poor SH...if the two of them become a couple its clear who will be the boss...

 

 

 

[raziela]

On 5/14/2020 at 4:40 AM, SweetButters said:

 

@raziela Sorry to cut your post short! Yea same, literally not sure where JB's character arc is going either sometimes. Like you said,

hopefully JB will redeem himself, but I dont know I feel like even that incident won't. Instead, its going to drive SB further from him which would make him even more monstrous and extreme! Ekk! I maybe felt bad for him for like 1-2 episodes after that " I was like really dude? There's a certain extent you have to know what you're doing is completely wrong" lol. I mean yea I'd admit some of us (me included) have done the whole IG stalking stuff, but yea definitely not the whole put tracking app or whatever on someone else's phone . Thats on a whole different left of cray cray right there. Also, SB and SH probably have a lot more people to worry about now from JB, SA, Gangster Mob, Butterfly Killer, etc. Their list of people who want to kill/hurt them just keeps growing. Can the powers that be give this couple a break haha? They already died once already lol!!!

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.....

Whelp as far as I'm concerned, it serves JB right if SB gives him the cold shoulder after that whole stabbing incident since JB essentially was the one that caused it to happen in the first place! Baby girl is got to wake up and smell the coffee now !

Sorry to cut your post.  I think what bothers me the most about the way the writer is writing JB is because both JC and JB are victims of serious abuse.  JC was physically, mentally, emotionally and sexually abused and JB has been mentally and emotionally abused.  Both of them are this way because of their upbringing in toxic families. But the author seems to be saying if you are victim of abuse: "oh well. You are screwed.  Even if you are reborn you will still have a miserable life, continue the abuse cycle and go crazy".  

 

I really would have loved if she took a different route with JB and-like you said-SH and SB already have enough enemies so is it really add JB as another antagonist and obstacle on top of that?

 

Maybe I'm too idealistic but I think SB might forgive him if he explains himself and comes clean. I am not excusing the things he did because what he did was very wrong and he clearly has some type of psychological disorder but I truly want to see JB break the cycle of abuse and heal but I think he can only do that with Sa Bin's support.  He has no one else.  If SB abandons him, then I fear he will go completely off the deep end like JC did.  I don't trust this writer though  

 

On 5/14/2020 at 6:44 AM, SweetButters said:

Question: Is LSH the main male lead or is JKY a male lead too?

Everyone keeps asking this question.  I think they are both the male leads in different ways.

 

On 5/14/2020 at 6:51 AM, Oksana Sutra said:

KBS know what we love in this drama 

 I just love this couple.  They have lovely chemistry. I love seeing the evolution of Mr cold prosecutor over these past few episodes.  K-fans pointed out he even waits for her to buckle her seatbelt now before he stars reversing  unlike the first time when he just started reversing and almost jerked SB out of her seat!

 

On 5/14/2020 at 12:40 PM, Plummpychan said:

I think I need to count how many kisses did SH received from his fiancee so we can demand to the writer/PD-nim to give our Sa bin just as much .

We can't let the fiancee have them more than our Sa Bin, right? who's with me? 

 

As far as I remember, there're 3?

1st. At the morning scenes after bed 

2nd. The crazy forced kiss while he's driving

3rd. The desperate forced kiss at the lake

 

Anything that I've missed? 

 

So does this means we'll get more than that from our OTP?  *clapclap

 

Eng sub for latest BTS making is up!

*specialthankstoLSH88 

 

Hahaha Your reaction to the first kiss.  I think that's all their kisses.

I'm with you!  We need our OTP to have an advantage of kisses and the first "experiment" kiss doesn't count! I hope we get some kisses and I'm looking forward to romantic Soo Hyuk.  It's so much fun seeing his tsundere side come out and how his character is slowly changing and softening towards Sa Bin

Thanks for posting the English translation of the making video

 

On 5/14/2020 at 12:50 PM, rocher22 said:

SH was speechless...SB was sad... JB was happy.  

 

Poor SH...if the two of them become a couple its clear who will be the boss...

 SH's reaction and JB's smugness made me lol!

 I do love their bickering scenes a lot. SB will definitely be the boss and SH will do anything for her.

 

I was just rewatching the most recent episode and noticed the picture JB is painting is a smiling Ha Eun.  She has the long straight dark hair and is wearing the outfit (white coat, pink scarf) from the snowy mountain.  Since he realised his feelings for SB he has stopped with the creepy paintings he was drawing before and is working on this happy picture.

[sweetestbliss]

I am usually a lurker on here, but wanted to just share my general thoughts on this drama since it doesn't seem like many places are discussing/reviewing this drama. 

 

This drama is a mess lol. I am only watching to see if Soo Hyuk gets the girl (he better!!!). I have a love/hate relationship with this drama because they kept confusing us with who the male lead is...by now, though, I think it is pretty clear that Jong Beom is cray and is not the traditional male lead. I just hope that this drama does not end tragically...although I am afraid that is where it is headed a la "The Smile Has Left Your Eyes." That was kind of bittersweet though...

 

Jong Beom is straight up a stalker and I laughed when Prosecutor Kim called him out on that...and then Jong Beom saying "it's better than being a two timer." Wow what a burn on both their parts lol. That scene cracked me up. But seriously, Sa Bin needs to stop with this "You can change blah blah blah. I'll help you not become a murder by thwarting your attempts." This does NOT help, girl. And please recognize the warning signs in your head about him being obsessive and a stalker...there can only be so many "coincidences" of him bumping into you. People should not be romanticizing his character.  

 

Soo Hyuk's fiance is cray and deranged. She's going to go (further) off the deep end after he calls off their engagement. Also, I thought it was weird that Soo Hyuk thought the note that Sa Bin's dad had was from Seo Tae Ha. I guess it's just because I know his fiance is cray and that she put it in his pocket, but yeah. 

 

Give me more Soo Hyuk/Sa Bin scenes, please and thanks. He is playing the tsundere character well (which is why I want him to get the girl!...and because he never gets the girl...). If the drama is going to end tragically, at least give me some good romance scenes between the two beforehand.  

[Plummpychan]

Annyeong!

I just rewatched the first two ep (out of 16) of  Born Again as I'd like to preserved every precious moments of HB & HE more longer 

But, instead, some theory regarding GJC case occurs to me while rewatching it.

 

So here it is (i've posted this on other platform, but I'll post them here as well, because.. Ehm..why not? lol, I have no life) 

 

Spoiler

So I think Gong In Woo (GJC's father) was never existed. It's just GJC's portrayal of the beast's face inside of him.
My take was, when little GJC was abused by his mom, he sort of create an alter ego/ other personality (beast) who loves to kill. While the original GJC remain as an innocent lil' kid & this was the GJC we're seeing in the drama.

When GJC was prosecuted for the 11th victim case, we were shown that GJC got a seizure whenever he suffered an extreme situation and his lawyer plead that he won't remember what happened after that, thus later he was sent to mental hospital because he can't be punished for something that he can't remember.

So, from original GJC perspective the 11th victim is his first victim (because the other 10 victim were done by his alter ego & he was "unconscious").
The beast (with GIW face) keep persuading him to kill, but GJC refused by saying he's different as unlike him, he can feel love.

That day, when he accidentally killed HB, his alter ego did the following multiple stabbing to HB.
Right after that, HE cursed him & GJC shot himself in the head.

BUT, I think he never actually shot himself, but it's morelikely just a methapore in his mind that he had killed/thrown his original ver and have been taking over completely by his alter ego (the beast).

That's why he survived the shot & sentenced in jail.

This theory is consistent with what HB had said in the interview room, according to him GIW has been pronounced dead 15th years ago, never married & doesn't have a son.
Also, when GJC visit his father at that abandoned school, we see him stabbing his dad & his dad's painting, but later we see his dad was fine & the painting still in a good condition when HB found it.

So, continuing the snow scene at HB&HE wedding day, I think it's possible that GJC, who was already taken over completely by his alterego, was the one who smashed HB skull & performed some ritual so that he can be reborned as HB.

 

But luckily, earlier at church HE had tied her fate with HB & later she cursed GJC back too, so I think GJC wish to be HB was ungranted as it has been countered by HE

 

 

With that being said, now I think, whether their fated will be repeated in an infinite cycle loop or not will all be depend on Sa Bin. Will she able to change JB?

 

[kdramafan1]

I too agree that SB should stop trying to be "the angel".  She is naive in thinking that she can change JB.  It is so true that she should know that JB is a stalker.  There is just way too much coincidence with JB, and with his behavior and past history, it really should raise a red flag.  When HE ignored HB's advice to distance herself from JC, she indirectly caused HB's death.  I hope the same mistake is not going to be repeated this time around.  

[raziela]

On 5/15/2020 at 3:45 PM, sweetestbliss said:

I am usually a lurker on here, but wanted to just share my general thoughts on this drama since it doesn't seem like many places are discussing/reviewing this drama. 

 

This drama is a mess lol. I am only watching to see if Soo Hyuk gets the girl (he better!!!). I have a love/hate relationship with this drama because they kept confusing us with who the male lead is...by now, though, I think it is pretty clear that Jong Beom is cray and is not the traditional male lead. I just hope that this drama does not end tragically...although I am afraid that is where it is headed a la "The Smile Has Left Your Eyes." That was kind of bittersweet though...

 

Jong Beom is straight up a stalker and I laughed when Prosecutor Kim called him out on that...and then Jong Beom saying "it's better than being a two timer." Wow what a burn on both their parts lol. That scene cracked me up. But seriously, Sa Bin needs to stop with this "You can change blah blah blah. I'll help you not become a murder by thwarting your attempts." This does NOT help, girl. And please recognize the warning signs in your head about him being obsessive and a stalker...there can only be so many "coincidences" of him bumping into you. People should not be romanticizing his character.  

 

Soo Hyuk's fiance is cray and deranged. She's going to go (further) off the deep end after he calls off their engagement. Also, I thought it was weird that Soo Hyuk thought the note that Sa Bin's dad had was from Seo Tae Ha. I guess it's just because I know his fiance is cray and that she put it in his pocket, but yeah. 

 

Give me more Soo Hyuk/Sa Bin scenes, please and thanks. He is playing the tsundere character well (which is why I want him to get the girl!...and because he never gets the girl...). If the drama is going to end tragically, at least give me some good romance scenes between the two beforehand.  

Welcome to the thread @sweetestbliss  I agree with you about the messy plot and romanticising about JB's character.  Sometimes he will have a cute scene with SB, complete with whimsical music, warm lighting and it seems like a fun little rom-com moment then the next second he is doing creepy stalker stuff like hiding her phone, using a tracker on her, setting up an attack on the guy she likes It's like the drama itself is confused on how to present his scenes.  I'm not sure if this is on purpose and a narrative technique where we are seeing things from JB's perspective or something.

 

I think SH assumed it was Seo Tae Ha because he knows he has it in for him and he has made it clear he will threaten the people SH cares about.

 

SB is sympathetic to JB because she saw for herself how miserable his home life is.  She just sees him as a lonely, troubled young man with potential and wants to help him.  She doesn't realise yet how disturbed he actually is. She thought the confrontation with his brother was the heat of the moment.  She doesn't have the same information the audience does that he apparently planned it.  Ditto about the stalking.  His excuses are actually pretty plausible. I think once she knows about his stalking behaviour and setting up HB she will see things in a different light and realise he is more messed up than she  realised.

 

Yes, please give us more SH/SB scenes!  I am enjoying seeing him melt and fall for SB.  A few episodes ago I didn't think SH was capable of acting as lovey-dovey as Hyung Bin was but now I think he could for the right woman (Sa Bin!)

 

On 5/15/2020 at 6:17 PM, Plummpychan said:

Annyeong!

I just rewatched the first two ep (out of 16) of  Born Again as I'd like to preserved every precious moments of HB & HE more longer 

But, instead, some theory regarding GJC case occurs to me while rewatching it.

 

So here it is (i've posted this on other platform, but I'll post them here as well, because.. Ehm..why not? lol, I have no life) 

 

  Hide contents

So I think Gong In Woo (GJC's father) was never existed. It's just GJC's portrayal of the beast's face inside of him.
My take was, when little GJC was abused by his mom, he sort of create an alter ego/ other personality (beast) who loves to kill. While the original GJC remain as an innocent lil' kid & this was the GJC we're seeing in the drama.

When GJC was prosecuted for the 11th victim case, we were shown that GJC got a seizure whenever he suffered an extreme situation and his lawyer plead that he won't remember what happened after that, thus later he was sent to mental hospital because he can't be punished for something that he can't remember.

So, from original GJC perspective the 11th victim is his first victim (because the other 10 victim were done by his alter ego & he was "unconscious").
The beast (with GIW face) keep persuading him to kill, but GJC refused by saying he's different as unlike him, he can feel love.

That day, when he accidentally killed HB, his alter ego did the following multiple stabbing to HB.
Right after that, HE cursed him & GJC shot himself in the head.

BUT, I think he never actually shot himself, but it's morelikely just a methapore in his mind that he had killed/thrown his original ver and have been taking over completely by his alter ego (the beast).

That's why he survived the shot & sentenced in jail.

This theory is consistent with what HB had said in the interview room, according to him GIW has been pronounced dead 15th years ago, never married & doesn't have a son.
Also, when GJC visit his father at that abandoned school, we see him stabbing his dad & his dad's painting, but later we see his dad was fine & the painting still in a good condition when HB found it.

So, continuing the snow scene at HB&HE wedding day, I think it's possible that GJC, who was already taken over completely by his alterego, was the one who smashed HB skull & performed some ritual so that he can be reborned as HB.

 

But luckily, earlier at church HE had tied her fate with HB & later she cursed GJC back too, so I think GJC wish to be HB was ungranted as it has been countered by HE

 

 

With that being said, now I think, whether their fated will be repeated in an infinite cycle loop or not will all be depend on Sa Bin. Will she able to change JB?

 

Ooooh!  I'm very impressed with your detailed theory.  It does seem very plausible. What do you think was the significance of the Wuthering Heights book left with Hyung Bin's corpse?

 

On 5/15/2020 at 7:09 PM, kdramafan1 said:

I too agree that SB should stop trying to be "the angel".  She is naive in thinking that she can change JB.  It is so true that she should know that JB is a stalker.  There is just way too much coincidence with JB, and with his behavior and past history, it really should raise a red flag.  When HE ignored HB's advice to distance herself from JC, she indirectly caused HB's death.  I hope the same mistake is not going to be repeated this time around.  

I don't think that it's at all fair to "indirectly" blame HE for HB's death. I really dislike this trend of blaming innocent women for the bad things men do. That is victim shaming. Unfortunately, JC had some severe psychological issues that made him behave the way he did and led to his obsession with her but to place the blame on HE just because she tried to be kind to him is wrong. JC was the one responsible for HB's death.  HE visiting him in jail does not make it her fault he broke out of a secure mental facility and chased her halfway across the country.  This is the same guy she was kind to once and proceeded to stalk her for four years!  Even if she hadn't visited him in jail he most likely would have done the same thing anyway.  

[thistle]

Since this drama essentially has two male leads, it is bound to have polarized reactions from viewers. 

 

At this point, I seem to be in the minority here because I am rooting for something good to happen for JB because I believe that change is possible.  A person who has stalked once is not doomed always to be a stalker.  A person who has had a bad former life should be able to change his karma when he changes his ways.

 

I'm also thinking that the writer of this drama is messing with our heads and making us think one thing while another could be true.  We don't know all the facts.  We are at the mid-point in the drama.  Usually at this time, something happens to spin a drama around at episode 10.  Rather than fully making up my mind about what is black or white or even red, I'm waiting to see what happens next.

 

And, yes, I am hoping that JB turns out to be a better guy than anticipated.

[Plummpychan]

2 hours ago, raziela said:

What do you think was the significance of the Wuthering Heights book left with Hyung Bin's corpse?

I think he feel connected with Heathcliff story thus referring himself as Heathcliff. The hero from Wuthering heights, as they shared similiar backround. HC is obsessively in love with Catherine and HC & Catherine was initially in loved with eachother but in the end Catherine marries Edgar, HC love that was portrayed on WH was rather destructive there.

 

So I think he put the book on HB body as a medium to represent himself at the soul switching ritual.

 

Here's some summaries of Wuthering Heights if anyone is curious, but I think I don't see any similiarity in any character other than Heathcliff.

Catherine & Edgar is nothing like HB/HE or SH/SB

 

https://www.sparknotes.com/lit/wuthering/summary/

[raziela]

1 hour ago, thistle said:

Since this drama essentially has two male leads, it is bound to have polarized reactions from viewers. 

 

At this point, I seem to be in the minority here because I am rooting for something good to happen for JB because I believe that change is possible.  A person who has stalked once is not doomed always to be a stalker.  A person who has had a bad former life should be able to change his karma when he changes his ways.

...

And, yes, I am hoping that JB turns out to be a better guy than anticipated.

Sorry to cut your post.  I agree with you and have said similar in my previous posts.  IMO, HB/SH and HE/SB reincarnation is about finding their way back to each other and JC/JB reincarnation having a chance to redeem himself and choose a better path.  I feel sympathetic towards JiCheol and Jong Beom because I don't think either of them are inherently evil.  They are abuse survivors who developed psychological disorders as coping mechanisms.  It doesn't excuse their actions but it does make them more understandable.  JC couldn't be saved but maybe JB still can.

 

1 hour ago, Plummpychan said:

I think he feel connected with Heathcliff story thus referring himself as Heathcliff. The hero from Wuthering heights, as they shared similiar backround. HC is obsessively in love with Catherine and HC & Catherine was initially in loved with eachother but in the end Catherine marries Edgar, HC love that was portrayed on WH was rather destructive there.

 

So I think he put the book on HB body as a medium to represent himself at the soul switching ritual.

 

Here's some summaries of Wuthering Heights if anyone is curious, but I think I don't see any similiarity in any character other than Heathcliff.

Catherine & Edgar is nothing like HB/HE or SH/SB

 

https://www.sparknotes.com/lit/wuthering/summary/

Thanks for replying  @SweetButters had a great post on the previous page about some of the similarities between the characters in Wuthering Heights and Born Again.  I also saw a very detailed theory from a K-fan which puts Hye Mi as the Heathcliff character.  I need to search for the post again and I will post here.

[jeilopes]

1 hour ago, thistle said:

 

At this point, I seem to be in the minority here because I am rooting for something good to happen for JB because I believe that change is possible

 

I don’t think you are in minority. I also want the redemption path for him. I always thought the reincarnation happened for: 1. HB/SH and HE/SB find each other again and live what They couldn’t live before; 2. JC/JB’s redemption

 

We still don’t know if JC killed all the girls or It was his daddy, If It was his daddy I also expect JB could clean in part JC’s name. JC is still a murder in this scenario, but not a serial killer.

[innrukia]

 

 @Plummpychan Somehow your theory might be plausible. I re-watched episode 1 again and there was a scene the stepmother abused GJC and there was a guy as well. Could it be GJC real father instead of the GIW as the writer depicted till now? 

And CHB finding of GIW died without a son. But at the same time, I wonder about the scene where GIW in a car with Hyemi /a guy to board a ship. They picked up GJC and GIW asked Hyemi to take care of GJC & find him a place. We saw GIW physically present at that time; else should we assume the one who talked to Hyemi in a car was GJC in his alter ego? If GJC, why Hyemi following him?

 
And before GJC killed the lady, she held a scissor, and GJC seems fine. But he got a seizure in a court during the trial. Slightly confusing with the narration here. For the snowy field scene, I did not think GJC shot himself at the head and held a ritual to CHB so that he could be reborn as CHB. I incline to believe GJC was alive till HE died. 

[Plummpychan]

5 hours ago, innrukia said:

else should we assume the one who talked to Hyemi in a car was GJC in his alter ego? If GJC, why Hyemi following him?

Actually at first I had the thought that GIW is just only GJC imaginary/delusion mind.

 

But then there's this scene where there's no way this scene would happened if GIW is only his imagination, a scene where GIW told Hye Mi to take care of his son while GJC wasn't even presented in that scene as the person who imagining the scene.

So, the only explanation is if GIW is GJC alter ego himself, so GJC was presented there as GIW.

 

The painter whom Hyemi known may not GJC father after all, but GIW/GJC alter ego = GJC himself. We never seen GJC ability to paint, but CJB (whom we assume GJC's reincarnation) had this talent. It'll make more sense if GIW is indeed GJC alter ego, thus he inherits his talent from his past self.

 

5 hours ago, innrukia said:

And before GJC killed the lady, she held a scissor, and GJC seems fine. But he got a seizure in a court during the trial. Slightly confusing with the narration here.

Yes, this drama is confusing af ㅋㅋㅋ it could be that they didn't show us the whole scene

 

5 hours ago, innrukia said:

For the snowy field scene, I did not think GJC shot himself at the head and held a ritual to CHB so that he could be reborn as CHB. I incline to believe GJC was alive till HE died. 

I think GJC had never shot himself that day, it's just a metaphore that he has surrender his original self & his alter ego had taken fully control. He was alive that day & later being captured and sentenced in jail.

And yes, if we see SH-SB-JB age as a reference, then GJC is the latest who died with 10 years gap from HE.

 

My theory, GJC alter ego took HB dead body & keep/burried it elsewhere until later performing some ritual for switching souls, that's why HB's dead body was preserved by formalin and his skull was damage so that no one could recognize his identitly.

Moreover, we see a flashback when Ha Eun looking for Hyung Bin (HB's body) in the snow.

 

Because I don't see any other suspicious person who's as obssessed as GJC in regards to Wuthering heights & reborn concept other than GJC himself.

 

If there's one, it'd be Ha Eun, but why would she do any of that? (Tied HB body with rope & all)

Besides, if Ha Eun were there besides HB's body the day when he was burried, I believe HB soul will let HE received the ring from his hand (dropped the ring).

 

I really pity Ha Eun if these were true, she must be living in hell & tormented until the day she passed away, for surviving alone on her suppossed wedding day & HB's body even went missing 

 

 

But ofc, this is just me trying to guess 

 

[SharkDudu]

5 hours ago, Plummpychan said:

The painter whom Hyemi known may not GJC father after all, but GIW/GJC alter ego = GJC himself. We never seen GJC ability to paint, but CJB (whom we assume GJC's reincarnation) had this talent. It'll make more sense if GIW is indeed GJC alter ego, thus he inherits his talent from his past self.

actually in one of the ep before (i dun remember which ep), hyemi mentioned to JB that she once rent the house to a genius painter (the house that JB is currently staying) which i assumed could be GJC. so thats mean GJC does have the ability to paint hence could be that the painting HB saw in school is all painted by GJC and not his father.