[Drama 2020] Forest of Secrets Season 2, 비밀의 숲 2

[raziela 7,285]

On 8/25/2020 at 11:35 AM, breadstal said:

how are we feeling about this? i do get that tragic backstories are overrated but i wish we could know more about yeojin's life :/

 

Have to admit I'm very disappointed to read that. I would like to learn more about YJ and her background and that was one of the things I was looking forward to in the second series. I can't help feeling they would never write a male co-lead with no background, no family or friends or details of their life before the drama started.  It feels like a very lazy way to treat Yeo Jin's character in my opinion 

[farawayland 629]

I am one of those who don’t want the same trope as S1. As long as I have quality, detailed work and interesting story and so far It’s all up to my expectation. I don’t find it slow in faCt I wish it is longer. The production team including writer and casts No one wants to repeat themselves? We would be complaining if it is the same. They can’t win, can they?  
I understand if season 2 is not some people cup of tea but it’s not fair to ask for the same story telling. Stranger is never action packed and over the top thrilling. It’s dialogue heavy and all in the details as it has always been. It asks us to be active participants to find clues and connect the dots ourselves. It is never an easy watch but that what I love about this show. 

Because it talks about real issues happening in SK, it gives different feel of being more realistic.  Instead of one linear central case,  we have multiple theads weaving slowly together. I was worried about the new director but by episode 4, I am happy with how it is directed. I don’t want exactly the same way of directing. 
i never doubt SM and YJ are always on the same side regardless what situation they are facing. 
i am grateful they come back for season 2. I hope the audience don’t have a wrong kind of expectation.

[nrllee 16,786]

18 hours ago, bedifferent said:

The issue of warrants.  ShiMok has a point.  The power of the prosecutors lies in their power not to pursue a case; either based on their understanding of the laws or their interpretation of the evidences. His concern is that the police must know exactly what to do if is given this power of obtaining warrants on their own.  What will they do with the evidences gathered with the warrant?  Do they have enough legal knowledge to apply the evidences to the crime to decide if such a crime exist?  How about human rights and legal rights?  In order for the police to gain such right,  ShiMok argues that it must state at least one reason why having it obtain warrants directly from the judge is better or different than having warrants obtained through the prosecutors.

 

Can anyone help the police out with this? The police must also prove that they will not misuse suppress the evidences to serve their own purpose, a flaw in the current system.

I agree.  Currently the system (as it was originally intended) has Prosecutors act as the middle men.  They know the law and they also have investigative rights.  So they bridge the divide between the Police who are in the field (on the ground who conduct investigations) and the Judge who just sits away from the melee.  I think the system in Korea is that it is the Judge who issues warrants?  But only Prosecutors can request for a warrant?  That’s what frustrates the Police.  They find out about the crime (eg the rental scam) but they have to bring it to the Prosecutor’s Office to request that they ask for a warrant from the Judge.  So if they are petty (like the Prosecution in the rental scam - I like that WTH called them out for being as such howbeit in the safety of their little council), they can stall and refuse to present the case to the Judge to request for a warrant.  Or the Prosecution closes the case like what happened with the drowning and the case ends.  What the Police want to do is to do away with the middle man (the Prosecution) so they have direct access to the Judge for warrants?  And to be able to close cases.  This I have a problem with because it’s not like they know the law?

 

18 hours ago, bedifferent said:

What do people think Yeo Jin means when she said "It was a suicide but it's a homicide". 

I think YJ believes it still is a suicide (although when we see how SM re-enacted the scene that is debatable?) but the Sergeant was driven to it by the bullying.  So his workmates are culpable.

 

18 hours ago, bedifferent said:

I also can't tell if Woo Tae Ha is sly or he is just faking his intelligence!!!   I mean every single time Choi Moo Sung pauses, shifts his eyes and posture, ahemmm when people attack him... I laughed!  Do you guys think he can be the corrupted prosecutor or one just pivoting his way up the prosecution ladder.  His mannerism, his interactions with his team is downright not intimidating at all!  I can't see him as a leader. LOL

I agree .  He’s like this giant teddy bear.  I can’t buy him being corrupt at all.  

 

[nona88 25,038]

4 hours ago, raziela said:

Have to admit I'm very disappointed to read that. I would like to learn more about YJ and her background and that was one of the things I was looking forward to in the second series. I can't help feeling they would never write a male co-lead with no background, no family or friends or details of their life before the drama started.  It feels like a very lazy way to treat Yeo Jin's character in my opinion 

I want to know her backstory  or at least her family situation  now  so much and I hope they  give us something  too 

But  I never thought it was lazy written, she clearly  had being written  in a right way I had this feeling from season 1 I didn't even  take the cast words of her not having tied  backstory and I know that this writer  who have  a story to even any small roles in his work had already  write YJ  so well 

 

It just as we all know it now,  they decide  to not show it to us to make it part of the mystery  of SEASON 1   a character  who they leave to our imagination  to builed her reasons and love her like that 

 

And it work she was like the most characters  we tried to analyze her and her words and we wrote  so  many different  theories ( nowi dont think any backstory  can challenge  our over-written theories  really can you  tried to see all what we wrote in season 1 forum dear writer)

 

I think at some point where everything  is so dark and dirty and has reasons  they saw it a good things to let one  of the characters  be good cause she is good and dont has to justify it even when they already wrote her story, 

 

i liked it , but let me be honest I am still a fan  and even with all that logic  and understanding  part of me  still I want more about her ( even if not about the past at least to her family life  story now) 

 

 

Edited August 27, 2020 by nona88

[ponderings 2,086]

I think the scenes showing or indicating Yeo Jin having trouble in her workplace are important. It reflects upon the discrimination that females face in a male dominated work environment. 

In ep 4, Detective Jang Gun overhears her colleagues after the meeting. 

Colleague 1: "This is reverse discrimination. She's just a dispatch, but she even brought her old colleague here."

Colleague 2: "Right. We've worked here for years, but she's the one joining the the council."

1. There is no such thing as a reverse discrimination because Korean culture has a strong sense of Confucianism, which severely dehumanizes females. Females are traditionally given the role to bear children, especially sons, and respect and think about males over their own. (In the contemporary world, females in the professional world are not recognized for their worth. They have a lower salary. Questions like, "aren't you going to marry?" "can you work when you are about to give birth?" "can you work when you just gave birth?" are thrown at females. On the other hand, in USA, its system is patriarchal and it must be acknowledged.)
   Spoiler

   Parallel moment: Kim Ji Young: born 1982, starring Gong Yoo and Jung Yumi, is a film that raised questions about female role in a Korean film. It was labelled as "feminist. Hence, it was criticized heavily before and after it aired.

    

2. Clearly, the colleagues are jealous of Yeo Jin because she was chosen to join the council. 

 

What I find admirable is that Yeo Jin continues to ask questions and digs deep into investigating even though she's surrounded by male colleagues.

 

Lastly, someone mentioned earlier in this thread that Yeo Jin's backstory wasn't fully mentioned in the first season. Her character was also not fully fledged compared to Seung Woo who had an intricate back story. And throughout the scene, we had a lot of shots understanding his thinking and perceptive process. 

On a larger scope, the first season aired in 2017. The Me Too Movement in Korea started around 2017/2018. This is when we get Mr. Sunshine screened in 2018; it had a full fledged female lead who had passion and could find and didn't need the male lead to save her. Encoutner(Boyfriend), also screened in 2018, had a female chaebol instead of a male chaebol. Search: WWW, aired in 2019, had a powerful female cast. Be Melodramatic, in 2019, mainly had a female cast. 

Point being: The female representation is improving in kdramaland and what Yeo Jin is facing in her workplace environment is important to highlight because there are many females in the workplace facing discrimination.

 

This is a long post but this highlights what I love about the storytelling. There is an intricate plot weaving many characters together into a web. Then in the micro level, there are many interactions between the characters indicating they are human and possibly, they exist in real life.

 

 

[Gummi 366]

8 hours ago, nona88 said:

This week for sure 

 

It a scene that catch  my interest even in the teasers not just cause they together, but  cause I never saw YJ  look that sad and having a heavy  heart like that  before even with everything  happen in season1 

 

It a scene with deep burden  talking so I am waiting for it , and I wish too it will be a scene  when they talk about how it felt  for them this past two  years since they both had to suffer alone in that time 

Yes that is true...she looks so sad! I wonder if it is after she discovers CB may be involved in the cases e.g. suicide case. It must be v heartbreaking for YJ who is so passionate about upholding her beliefs and principles, to realise that corruption is all around her. Her ex police chief involved in shady business with an underaged girl and now CB possibly covering up incidents. SM can be her voice of reason, the way he held her back when she was worked up in S1 after PMS's son was beaten up by her colleagues.

[nona88 25,038]

1 hour ago, Gummi said:

Yes that is true...she looks so sad! I wonder if it is after she discovers CB may be involved in the cases e.g. suicide case. It must be v heartbreaking for YJ who is so passionate about upholding her beliefs and principles, to realise that corruption is all around her. Her ex police chief involved in shady business with an underaged girl and now CB possibly covering up incidents. SM can be her voice of reason, the way he held her back when she was worked up in S1 after PMS's son was beaten up by her colleagues.

  Yeh I liked that scene in season 1 

 

Wow how much can you have  different  feeling and understand  to each character and for their connection  together  with one scene   (  that why we cant get out  of that  master piece season) 

 

I really like how much they back up each other, but that scene  the fact he go right away to her station  after he heard about the deal between  the KCJ and her chief, the way he know she would not accept  that and run  to stop her from hurting  herself while  fighting that back, his way to try to convince  her but in the same time his impressed and understanding to  her view and finally backing her up,  if that her choice then let make it in a way she get what she want with minimum damage  for her ( that was really  a scene that ) 

 

 

I like to see that again how SM  using his clamming  and reasonable mind to help YJ fight that pain and injustice she seeing around ( it so painful  to her to believe that the people around her can be that heartless) and I think even without  knowing  yet  about Choi  the fact that Yj  will find how injustice  that police  officer  has to face is painful  to her and the fact that she already  is suffocation for the past two years. 

 

So this two like a cure  to each other's  a place where they can really be what they are without  judgement or suffocation 

 

P.s. and all that dont have to be related  to romance ( okay I want  romance  too) but even without  that,  their connection  in human  level  is so amazing to me and so making me enjoying and be thoughtful of them 

 

 

Edited August 27, 2020 by nona88

[bedifferent 16,286]

The reason why I needed clarification on Yeo Jin's last words in episode 4 is because she is not privy to the infos that are known to us or Shi Mok/Dong Jae.  It's true that her words could be interpreted many ways, we will know in the next episode.  Shi Mok knew about the briberies through Dong Jae who got the info from the policeman who investigated them.  Yeo Jin understood something from reading the case.  However, Song's case was closed 3 months before the police investigation. Unless all they were linked in the report Yeo Jin read, she may not have known about the briberies to figure out the motive.

 

Anyway, I thought it was different compared to Shi Mok.  He is guessing a possible motive, but has not presumed anything without evidence.  

 

18 hours ago, pompyavi said:

Possible. May be, he was killed earlier (remember the bruise on his chest) and someone put him in that position. Also, autopsy was not done, so we do not know whether those bruises appear after or before his death

 

Yes, I think he was injured prior to moving to the shower room.  He was tied to the faucet at the same height as the killer, low for his height.  The scratches on Capt Baek hand indicates he was close to Sgt Song before his death.  Did he choke him to death thus have to fake the hanging suicide?  Theory theory  

 

@nrllee @taeunfighting I have to reply to your posts another time.  

 

[nrllee 16,786]

26 minutes ago, bedifferent said:

The scratches on Capt Baek hand indicates he was close to Sgt Song before his death.  Did he choke him to death thus have to fake the hanging suicide?

yeah that’s my theory too. Why else would Sgt Song scratch his hand?  Makes no sense?  It’s an altercation?  They claim to have discovered his body and commenced CPR indicating he was already dead?  Dead people don’t scratch their rescuer’s hands. 

[larus 100,757]

Forest of Secrets 2: Episode 4

by quirkycase

The Police-Prosecution Council finally meets, and it goes about as well as you’d expect given the enmity on both sides. Complicating matters, the police catch wind of a prosecutor asking around about an old case, and that very prosecutor is doing some sneaking behind his unofficial partners’ backs. With everyone scheming and working towards their own goals, the situation is becoming increasingly complex. A little teamwork would go a long way.

 

 
EPISODE 4

The prosecutor gang arrives at the Board of Audit and Inspections for the council meeting, and Tae-ha and Sa-hyun foist their bags on Shi-mok like he’s the bellboy as they head to meet the Chairman. While Shi-mok waits for everyone to arrive, he pulls up an article about Chief Kang criticizing Sungmoon Daily. Guess he made his choice.

The police members arrive, and Yeo-jin introduces Shi-mok and Chief Choi. Gun greets Shi-mok pleasantly, and Yeo-jin good-naturedly reprimands Shi-mok for not at the very least asking about Gun’s kids or something. Chief Choi looks surprised by how comfortable they are with each other.

 

more https://www.dramabeans.com/2020/08/forest-of-secrets-2-episode-4/

[nrllee 16,786]

On 8/25/2020 at 4:59 AM, noor1 said:

It's good to see so many familiar forum regulars on this thread but I'm done with this. Spoiler Alert: By Ep. 16, Police and Prosecution will solve something together and learn the lesson kids learn in kindergarten - you don't get anywhere unless you're united. Yeo-Jin will go back to policing, ShiMok will rise through the ranks of prosecutors. Someone's buddy will die. Some one will be behind bars. 

Hmm...Somehow I don’t think this time round the writer is doing a straightforward whodunit like in S1.  So for people who expected a repeat of S1, they will be disappointed.  She’s deliberately put us back in time to 2017 resurrecting old cold cases for a reason.  I have a feeling she will weave some of what happened in S1 here.  There’s a reason why she had Lee ChangJoon narrate the blurb about staying silent.  She’s always been one to ask pertinent questions about what’s happening in our world and to make social commentary on existing systems and entrenched ideologies.  I can see her asking questions of us now.  It’s just harder to fully empathize with it because the whole Prosecution Vs Police turf war seems uniquely Korean.  I don’t think she’s so naive as to paint that it will all end well for everyone.  Her drama Life was the first interesting social commentary I had seen about corporations running service industries.  It was very well done - she showcased both sides of the argument without passing judgement on who is “more right”.  She didn’t sugarcoat S1.  YJ and SM should’ve ended up with big accolades but instead they’ve been sent out to pasture (almost like a punishment).  That’s reality.  I don’t see SM rising up the ranks.  He doesn’t play the political game.  YJ may end up back in the field because that’s where her heart is.  Although she seems pretty content to be where she’s at right now.  Neither SM nor YJ buck the system.  They adhere to the boundaries dealt out to them and live out their moral code where they are placed.  Admittedly it does seem very convoluted right now - I am having trouble remembering which side dropped the ball in which case and the new faces (and the bureaucratic jargon) boggles the mind.  But I usually give a drama up to ep6 to get a handle on all the characters and the dynamics involved.  It took me 2 watches of S1 to fully understand it.  Same with Life.  I have a feeling it will be the same here.

[Gummi 366]

6 minutes ago, nrllee said:

Hmm...Somehow I don’t think this time round the writer is doing a straightforward whodunit like in S1.  So for people who expected a repeat of S1, they will be disappointed.  She’s deliberately put us back in time to 2017 resurrecting old cold cases for a reason.  I have a feeling she will weave some of what happened in S1 here.  There’s a reason why she had Lee ChangJoon narrate the blurb about staying silent.  She’s always been one to ask pertinent questions about what’s happening in our world and to make social commentary on existing systems and entrenched ideologies.  I can see her asking questions of us now.  It’s just harder to fully empathize with it because the whole Prosecution Vs Police turf war seems uniquely Korean.  I don’t think she’s so naive as to paint that it will all end well for everyone.  Her drama Life was the first interesting social commentary I had seen about corporations running service industries.  It was very well done - she showcased both sides of the argument without passing judgement on who is “more right”.  She didn’t sugarcoat S1.  YJ and SM should’ve ended up with big accolades but instead they’ve been sent out to pasture (almost like a punishment).  That’s reality.  I don’t see SM rising up the ranks.  He doesn’t play the political game.  YJ may end up back in the field because that’s where her heart is.  Although she seems pretty content to be where she’s at right now.  Neither SM nor YJ buck the system.  They adhere to the boundaries dealt out to them and live out their moral code where they are placed.  Admittedly it does seem very convoluted right now - I am having trouble remembering which side dropped the ball in which case and the new faces (and the bureaucratic jargon) boggles the mind.  But I usually give a drama up to ep6 to get a handle on all the characters and the dynamics involved.  It took me 2 watches of S1 to fully understand it.  Same with Life.  I have a feeling it will be the same here.

 

I agree fully! Somehow watching S2 in real time give me more time to slowly digest the episodes rather than binging through and missing the little nuances. This is the kind of show where you would take time to warm up to before it pulls you right in. Being here and discussing the plot and directions with all of you helps heighten my enjoyment as well!

[larus 100,757]

3 hours ago, nrllee said:

  I don’t see SM rising up the ranks.  He doesn’t play the political game.  YJ may end up back in the field because that’s where her heart is.

 

I totally agree. Shi Mok will take any task they give him and he will do the best he can. He is a lonely wolf. He doesn`t make connection or play political games. Like they already said, he is used as a blade when they need him.

 

He doesn`t watch sports, doesn`t have a girlfriend and he doesn`t have a social life. He reads books. Law books. I really want to see Yeo Jin working with him again. I know he doesn`t feel he needs a friend but I want to see Shi Mok with one.

 

 

 

[nona88 25,038]

My wish for this week 

 

1. Fast Yj and SM  backing to work together  

 

2. The really mystery  start ( I know that all that is just opening the writer  having something more heavy and  all what we saw is introduction cting  for the really mystery  game ) 

 

3. I want the sharp , prideful and rude  SM to come I miss his  sexy  and mystery mood when he so focussing  on something  and being so sharply  and not contorable  ( just YJ  can do that) 

 

 

4. Make it heavy,   I will regret asking for that later  ( I know) but I will deal with my feelings  later  I want the heavy social  and characters war like season 1 ( okay  that why i liked the  write he touch a really heavy  issue  in social and the conflict of human  being) 

 

 

I keep having this feeling that they will make YJ  do what she never want to do in season 1 to play along for the bigger  goal  ( not with bad  interest  for sure, just cause she have or did that )

If that happens I will not be mad at all,  she human being after all, it just  me thinking the writer  maybe need her to face that at some point and i have  a feeling that something  big going to happen after that 

 

 But I am not worried  why I should keep worrying when this two come later  and break all the stupid conflict plot on other dramas and stories!!!  , they just out of the ordinary  mind thoughts 

[nrllee 16,786]

Just rewatched the whole Audit meeting arguments again - because first time it just went totally over my head.

 

This is what I gathered from their conversations 

 

The Constitution (specifically Article 12.3 -  Full Constitution here https://www.refworld.org/docid/3ae6b4dd14.html) states that only the Prosecution is allowed to request for a warrant from a Judge.  This change happened as a result of a military coup in May16.  Before this, both Police AND the Prosecution had the right to make that request.  The Police argued that the circumstances surrounding the origins of that rule were dubious at best so it was faulty from the get go.  Prosecution argues that were it faulty, it would’ve been amended by now.  The fact that it’s remained unchanged means that it wasn’t an issue.

SM’s argument is that if you give the Police the same powers as the Prosecution, then where is the distinguishing line between the 2 departments?  His argument is that warrants actually act against fundamental human rights (actually I never thought about this before but he’s right).  A warrant to search your home, arrest you, go through your files/phone records etc...these are all activities that violate your fundamental human rights (which are listed in the Constitution).  That’s why YJ had to ask the rich guy (in the drowning case) to come to the station for questioning and he had to go willingly.  He had the right to freedom of movement.  She couldn’t “force” him to go to the station.  South Korea has their own National Human Rights Commission (they haven’t adopted the Universal Declaration determined by the U.N.).  He sees the Prosecution as guardians of the public’s human rights.  His argument is that the Police may be so hellbent for justice on cases that they are invested in, they would just request for warrants as a matter of course.

SM’s point. 

Spoiler

the power of the prosecution lies in their authority not to prosecute cases, not in their criminal prosecutorial authority. If the prosecutorial process begins with a warrant, the power should be exercised by the one that can prevent such misuse of authority. This why I must ask you this question. With the power to request warrants, you will face pressure to prosecute or not prosecute certain cases. How do the police plan to tackle this?

His belief is that the whole prosecutorial process begins with the warrant (search and seizure, arrest - all of which infringe on civil rights stated in the Constitution) and is then played out in full in the Court where the Prosecution presents allegations against the accused to the Court.  So if the power to request for warrants is shared and the Police have that authority as well, it would mean that the Prosecution would have to take on the cases that the Police deem worthy of Prosecution.  

 

YJ and CB’x counter argument is that the Judge still has to issue the warrant (Police would only be requesting it) so they have the final authority.  But SM’s comeback is that Judges are too far removed, they will just tick check boxes and issue them as a formality.  Prosecutors act as an extra check point (a point of objectivity) whereby the case can be looked at before a warrant is requested (which usually is then issued by the Judge).  As guardians of the public’s civil rights, they do not take lightly the requests for warrants because fundamentally they violate them.  That is the ideal of course.  And provided they aren’t self seeking or corrupt (which is often the case).

 

Jang points out what about the human rights of the public (eg in the rental scam) who have been denied because the Prosecutors in the Western Office stalled the warrant request.  And this is when they decide to walk out.  Stalemate.

 

I think this is where the divide is.  The Police are looking at the microscopic, molecular level of justice (which tugs at our heartstrings because hey, that’s where most of us live and breathe).  For the oppressed, for the little people.  The Prosecution are looking at the macroscopic level.  Not just justice for the individual cases, but for the whole.  Yes even for the rich and famous.  Everybody, regardless of their economic status or life circumstances have inalienable rights just because they are human beings.  They are looking at the ideal.  Just some thoughts that come to mind. 

[ross27 7,387]

On 8/26/2020 at 7:08 PM, Gummi said:

Welcome @ross27!

I do feel sad for YJ at HQ now with her snooty colleagues. She was much closer to her yongsan team though she had only joined the team not long ago in S1. It is sad not to see any more happy drawings in YJ's current home. Wonder if it reflects how she is not so happy in her current position, seeing her colleague give her a look when he caught her drawing/dooling. 

 

When will we get our terrace scene! I wonder if this is at YJ's home? And they are sharing how they feel with each other

@Gummi Thank you for your welcome. She is happier at Yongsan. The HQ high brow attitude does not suit her at all. Still, despite that environment, she could not hide her creative need to draw, although not as freely. The terrace scene! Yes, I am looking forward to watching that! They look so serious!

[Gummi 366]

7 hours ago, nrllee said:

 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

the power of the prosecution lies in their authority not to prosecute cases, not in their criminal prosecutorial authority. If the prosecutorial process begins with a warrant, the power should be exercised by the one that can prevent such misuse of authority. This why I must ask you this question. With the power to request warrants, you will face pressure to prosecute or not prosecute certain cases. How do the police plan to tackle this?

 

 

I think this is where the divide is.  The Police are looking at the microscopic, molecular level of justice (which tugs at our heartstrings because hey, that’s where most of us live and breathe).  For the oppressed, for the little people.  The Prosecution are looking at the macroscopic level.  Not just justice for the individual cases, but for the whole.  Yes even for the rich and famous.  Everybody, regardless of their economic status or life circumstances have inalienable rights just because they are human beings.  They are looking at the ideal.  Just some thoughts that come to mind. 

Thanks for the blow by blow breakdown of the council meeting! Though Ive rewatched, i think i missed some of the takeaways you reflected here! Blame my slow reading of subtitles lol

I fully agree with your point that the divide is by the different perspective each side is taking. And both are not wrong in their own arguments. Which i find it great the way the writer always reflects things very realistically rather than a clear cut right/wrong or black/white. I dont fully agree with the police in that they are fully ready to deal with all implications of being able to request for warrants just by bringing in some legal reps. But prosecutors would also have to review the way they are currently handling the process as custodians of prosecution process. They themselves are not 100% confident that they do not further their own agenda i.e. the way CTH immediately suspected that West Prosecutor office could indeed be deliberately making things difficult for police side by witholding the arrest warrant.

 

In real life, i am not sure if there may be no win-win middle ground for both unless both sides are willing to make concessions. 

 

Side note, it is the weekends soon! Cant wait for E5-6 for more SM-YJ action!

 

[bedifferent 16,286]

7 hours ago, nrllee said:

I think this is where the divide is.  The Police are looking at the microscopic, molecular level of justice (which tugs at our heartstrings because hey, that’s where most of us live and breathe).  For the oppressed, for the little people.  The Prosecution are looking at the macroscopic level.  Not just justice for the individual cases, but for the whole.  Yes even for the rich and famous.  Everybody, regardless of their economic status or life circumstances have inalienable rights just because they are human beings.  They are looking at the ideal.  Just some thoughts that come to mind. 

 

 Excellent points you brought up.  Shi Mok approaches the accused from the presumptive viewpoint of innocent until proven guilty since his role as prosecutor is to foremost uphold the law and constitution. That which includes protecting every citizen's basic human rights and those under the constitution. I am not in law but I agree that protecting human rights can be a contentious point depends on whether you are guilty or innocent.  It boils down to whose right you are protecting and advocate.  In countries where citizens are subjected to a police state or dictatorship, having the warrants go through prosecutors ensure that there is a check and balance in place to prevent abuse.  The argument by Choi Bit, Jang Gun and Yeo Jin is that the power to obtain warrants need to be practical and useful to law enforcements.  They must be issued in  a timely manner, free from political maneuvering and be a tool to help law authorities. The divide between police and prosecutor seems to be widened by the perception that prosecutors cannot relate to the general public from their high in the sky offices or do they have the same priority and urgency as their police counterpart.

 

20 hours ago, nrllee said:

 I don’t see SM rising up the ranks.  He doesn’t play the political game.  YJ may end up back in the field because that’s where her heart is.  Although she seems pretty content to be where she’s at right now.  Neither SM nor YJ buck the system.  They adhere to the boundaries dealt out to them and live out their moral code where they are placed. 

 

My feeling is that SM and YJ do believe the system is not corrupted but rigged with certain people who tend to exploit it for their own gain.  I think they haven't lost hope because they are still in it.   Especially YJ who, despite not a good fit for the Intelligence Bureau, keep working at her job because she knows how important it is to have good people like her there.  Perhaps both feel they are meant to be like the Avengers, assemble when needed to fight the good fight.   When done, return to obscurity.  You're right, neither SM or YJ is ambitious like Dong Jae.  However, for the same reason, they don't have to sacrifice their principles or beliefs.

 

@taeunfighting About Dong Jae, he's perfectly written so far.  LOL  Seems like he did take LCJ's advice to heart. With Yeon Jae, he has found someone to lend support to.  Dong Jae has always been searching for security, a place to belong, someone that can give him protection.  When Yeon Jae complimented him, Dong Jae was genuinely touched.  I mean he always look for rewards in exchange for his service.  Now I realized that he is as human as us, he wants to be recognized on a personal level.  

 

Like you, I root for Yeon Jae to succeed at her bid for control of Hanjo.  Everyone has underestimated her strength as a businesswoman and even more so, her intelligence.  She has to hide her vulnerability from many but I think this still human part of Yeon Jae will help her gain sympathy and understanding from even her enemies.  It's a humility trait that her father and brother don't have.  Maybe we'll see her make a friend or two by the end. 

 

@nona88 @larus  I can tell you are Yeo Jin's biggest supporters!   Bae Doona will always be Yeon Jin to me, no matter how many works I have seen her in.

 

 

[Sleepy Owl 41,945]

I just finished watching the 4th episode. Have been going through this thread. Someone had asked what Yeo Jin when she said "it was suicide, but it is homicide", in my opinion she simply meant that it was ruled as suicide while it being homicide. 

 

As for the Srgt. Song Gi Hyeon's death, it was a proper planned murder for me. The bruises on his chest could be as a result of being beaten up before tying his neck with the rope, or could have been because of being just beaten up before. I place my bet on the earlier on. I believe he was beaten up, when he became semi-conscious, tied his neck on the rope (that's when he scratched the Team Leader's hand). All were involved that's why they could over power him, like a couple of them actually holding his arms from back, while was being beaten.

 

Then they made it look like a proper suicide scenario. He was already depressed because of all the bullying they were doing, committed suicide, the chief tries to save him, he scratches his hand. Then the chief performs CPR on him which could be the cause for the bruise on his chest. When they all said the same story, it was decided that it was suicide. Even the autopsy was not done for the same reason. At the same time I think Choi Bit decided to bury the case as same and not investigate it then (she was the chief there, right?). We have seen countless times in different dramas that prosecutors and police force have always tried to protect their own people in order to avoid public backlash. 

 

About the police-prosecutor debate, I still feel like the prosecution acting in between is required. If the police gets the authority to request warrants, they'll definitely abuse their power more as argued by the prosecutors. The judges already have a lot other important tasks to do than checking the details about the warrants requested. If the prosecution acts in between and requests, the judge does know that they have checked the main points regarding the warrant and just do follow the procedure by check listing certain things. If the police get to do it, they'd literally start requesting warrants every now and then too. It would give them more ease to abuse their power. Prosecution sure is corrupt, but police force is not that innocent. They could even sometimes prevent some warrants being requested now that they get the authority to do it. Things would not change that much, but could get worse.

 

As for Choi Bit and Woo Tae Ha, they both look shady to me. They both have had their share in burying some cases (could be same or not, I think it'll be different). Right now they made us look like both of them making Yeo Jin and Shi Mok to go after each other and check what they are doing. But we all know that what's gonna happen. Neither Shi Mok nor Yeo Jin are the type to be ordered by others and follow them blindly. Shi Mok is infamous for being not following orders blindly. He stays silent while observing every single details and does what he thinks is right. Same is Yeo Jin, she also does not blindly follow or trust others. So we can see them both investigating things very soon. 

 

Also someone had pointed whether Shi Mok will blindly follow Choi Bit because he trusts Yeo Jin and Yeo Jin trusts her. i don't think that's gonna happen. As I said this guy is a keep observer. He does not necessarily just trust anyone even if Yeo Jin does. Also I think even Yeo Jin does not trust Choi Bit that much. We saw that she decided not to tell her about Shi Mok seemingly investigating something about Segok Station. Also regarding Srgt's suicide, her suspicion regarding her being involved in it will make her more not trust her.   

[pompyavi 9,063]

1 hour ago, Gummi said:

I fully agree with your point that the divide is by the different perspective each side is taking. And both are not wrong in their own arguments. Which i find it great the way the writer always reflects things very realistically rather than a clear cut right/wrong or black/white

Loved what you said here. Yes that's the beauty of this writer, instead of showing one party as right or wrong, she leaves it to the discretion of the viewers and I as a viewer agree with both police and prosecution. But the fact "To the victor belong the spoils" is applicable. Both police/prosecutors are bound to misuse their power unless there are more people like HSM, HYJ. Even if laws are made to balance and check, people will always find some loopholes and take advantage of that