[Drama 2018-2019] Children of Nobody/Red Moon, Blue Sun, 붉은달 푸른해

[cyan5tarlight]

@kumakumo I do definitely understand wanting justice for Eunho himself, and I hope the show gives it to us, especially if his brother was the one who pressured him down the path that he ended up taking, because he's just as much of a victim as the other people who have died because of Red Cry's crusade. My problem with not taking the flashbacks having to do with Red Cry and the murders at least mostly at face value is that if you do that, then you by association have to question every single other flashback we've seen thus far as well. Did Jiheon really have a child at some point? Are Wookyung's recollections about baby!Sekyung accurate? I don't really see anyone questioning those, but if we can't trust the flashbacks about the murders, then how do we know the show isn't messing with us concerning those as well? Either the flashbacks are a reliable source of information, or they're not, we can't have it both ways. Unless the show establishes from the start that every single person is an unreliable narrator, and that flashbacks change depending on who's telling them (as some shows and movies have actually done), then I think it's a safer bet to say that flashbacks are a reliable source of information, meant to clue the audience in to specific key events so that they can have a more accurate picture of what's going on.

 

Because that's the thing with mysteries. Yes, you want to keep the audience on their toes and constantly second-guessing themselves, but at the same time, you want them to feel like they have all the pieces of the puzzle, that they can solve the mystery themselves if only they look hard enough, and if it turns out they were wrong in the end, they at least go "oooh, well, that makes sense, I can't believe I missed that, it was right in front of me all along!" Like the huge twist in the Sixth Sense. All the clues pointing to the reveal are given to the audience all throughout the movie, so when it happens, it comes as a big "AHA!" moment, rather than a "wait, what? That doesn't make any sense, where did this come from?" moment. So I really don't think that deliberately psyching the audience out with the murder flashbacks would be a wise decision on the part of the writer. It actually would come across not only as bad writing in general, but especially bad mystery writing.

 

I agree about Eunho not being the one to kill the dog butcher, though. Like, he still could have done it, not discounting the possibility because I don't trust the writer as far as I can throw her, but as I've said elsewhere, if you look at the murders you can attribute to Eunho, i.e. Hana's mom, Sora's dad, the head director, they were all deaths by asphyxiation. Asthma attack for Hana's mom, carbon monoxide poisoning for Sora's dad, suffocation for the head director. All relatively quick, painless deaths, as far as deaths go. No violent altercations or torture involved. Those seem way more like someone like Eunho's style rather than the death the dog butcher had. That's another thing, though; we never see Eunho kill the head director. We don't see camera footage, or anything like that, yet I have not heard one person say "Well, he didn't actually kill him, someone else came in and did it and Eunho is only saying that he did!" Like, no, we all know he did it, even though we didn't see it. Why then would it be so hard to extrapolate that he also committed at least a couple of the other murders as well, especially if the series showed him kill them? If we all know he killed the head director, then why is it so hard to believe that he might have also killed a couple other people, albeit quickly and relatively painlessly?

 

As for the shoes, I think @liddi posted some pictures of the pictures the police took of the shoes they recovered from Eunho's room, and the laces were indeed tied differently. Those were the head director's shoes. However, I don't discount the possibility of an accomplice also having a pair of those same shoes to hide the fact that there were multiple people at the farm, or something being hidden in the director's shoes (though you'd think the police would have already found it if that was the case).

 

Not sure about the poems or what the writer was trying to convey by using them, tbh. It could possibly be that Eunho picked them because they were sad, and he recognized the tragedy of the situation while still believing that the culprits had to pay for their crimes, but that's just conjecture. It's not like Jiheon or Wookyung can ask Eunho about it now, either way. Maybe the writer wants the audience to decide for themselves what the poems mean. *shrug*

[cyan5tarlight]

45 minutes ago, liddi said:

Was rewatching the end of Ep3, and my heart ached immeasurably to see how LEH tensed up in fearful anticipation when CWK strode towards him in anger, and his shocked gasps as he reeled from her slap. Knowing now what we do about his history of abuse, it pained me all the more, since his body language indicated that despite knowing what was coming, he could no more avoid nor prevent it from happening, and merely accepted it as his due  

 

Ugh, I know, that scene hurts my heart every time I remember it. He doesn't step back out of arm's reach, he doesn't retaliate, he doesn't even cry out, he just stands there and takes it in silence. In fact, he seems shocked when she doesn't continue hitting him. Knowing what we know now about his background, my heart breaks for him all the more. At least she had the good graces to apologize to him later for it (something he was definitely not used to, I'm sure), but still, he didn't deserve that. At all.

[thistle]

14 minutes ago, cyan5tarlight said:

.....deaths by asphyxiation. Asthma attack for Hana's mom, carbon monoxide poisoning for Sora's dad, suffocation for the head director. All relatively quick, painless deaths, as far as deaths go.....

 

As a person who suffers from asthma and other respiratory problems, I kinda disagree about asphyxia being painless.  Being unable to breathe is painful, and it is terrifying.

[cyan5tarlight]

9 minutes ago, thistle said:

As a person who suffers from asthma and other respiratory problems, I kinda disagree about asphyxia being painless.  Being unable to breathe is painful, and it is terrifying.

 

My mistake then, I apologize. I don't know anyone with asthma or respiratory problems, so my experience with/knowledge of the condition is limited. My point was that it seemed like Hana's mother expired quite quickly when the inhaler was withheld from her, and Sora's father was so sloshed that he didn't feel a thing when he suffocated to death, so it wasn't like Eunho was trying to make them suffer or prolong their deaths. That's all I was really trying to say.

[thistle]

23 minutes ago, cyan5tarlight said:

My mistake then, I apologize. I don't know anyone with asthma or respiratory problems, so my experience with/knowledge of the condition is limited.  My point was that it seemed like Hana's mother expired quite quickly when the inhaler was withheld from her, and Sora's father was so sloshed that he didn't feel a thing when he suffocated to death, so it wasn't like Eunho was trying to make them suffer or prolong their deaths. That's all I was really trying to say.

 

All is well, no misunderstandings taken.    I'm very, very glad that no one in your life has had to deal with this problem.  

 

I agree about Sora's dad.  He wouldn't have known much about it.  And I very much agree that LEH would not have wanted anyone to suffer.

 

I actually had an issue with the staging of the scene of Ha Na's mother's death because it was much too fast.  She would have suffered for quite a long time without the inhaler, unless maybe she was having allergic anaphylaxis along with the asthma attack and that was never mentioned. 

 

When a person is having an asthma attack, the inhaler will ease the symptoms but not necessarily alleviate them; breathing treatments at a hospital may be necessary for that.  Even without an inhaler, it is possible to get enough oxygen to stay conscious for a very long time.  But the harder it is to breathe, the more it hurts because the victim will continue to struggle in desperation trying to get even just one more breath.

 

 

[mushforbrains]

The issue about the shoes...

Thought it was just to show that he had taken the director's shoes and planted the bloodied ones in the director's home

The director n him had very distinct ways of tying the shoes.

So he later returned the director's clean shoes with the note...to indicate that the bloodied shoes were placed in the home and were not the director's. 

Now i just need to rewatch the scene when the cracked piece of the cctv fell from the sneakers in eunho's room...how were they laced...if they were laced in eunho's way... then there is a 3rd person in hana's dad's killing 

 

 

[liddi]

@mushforbrains The sneakers with the cracked CCTV piece JSY found in LEH's room are Director Song's shoes (note the way the shoes are laced). This makes sense since these are the only shoes the police ever found prior to discovering the bloodied shoes in the director's home.

 

[Ahmad Kamil]

Preview of final two episodes.

 

 

[cyan5tarlight]

9 hours ago, thistle said:

I actually had an issue with the staging of the scene of Ha Na's mother's death because it was much too fast.  She would have suffered for quite a long time without the inhaler, unless maybe she was having allergic anaphylaxis along with the asthma attack and that was never mentioned.  

  

When a person is having an asthma attack, the inhaler will ease the symptoms but not necessarily alleviate them; breathing treatments at a hospital may be necessary for that.  Even without an inhaler, it is possible to get enough oxygen to stay conscious for a very long time.  But the harder it is to breathe, the more it hurts because the victim will continue to struggle in desperation trying to get even just one more breath. 

 I was wondering about that myself, actually! Even to my uneducated eyes, it did seem like she went down... really quick. I chalk it up to artistic license and the drama not wanting to make us sit through 10 minutes of her wheezing and choking and gagging. The reason I say this is because I watched a drama where someone got strangled to death on screen once, and it was over in, like, 15 seconds. It takes waaaay longer to choke someone to death in real life, I looked it up. So yeah, either she was also having an allergic reaction to something (quite possible, given all the dust and mold that was likely in such an environment), or the drama didn't want to make us watch a woman die for 20 mins straight. Or, I mean, could be both. *le shrug*

I have so much anxiety from that teaser, tho, ngl. I have a feeling Wookyung mayyyyy be about to do something she'll regret regarding Stepmom. Don't do it, girl, resist the urge! Stay strong!

[dhplsa]

I wonder if there's a reason why CWK is wearing a red coat all of a sudden. From what I recall, she has mostly gone for pretty neutral coats up till now?

[liddi]

Wow... intense preview! Does the red symbolise CWK's acceptance of Red Cry's ideology? From the looks of it, she is trying hard to find little CSK's body, and perhaps demanding her stepmother reveals the whereabouts and receive her judgment. As for YTJ, his cold, flippant attitude during the interrogation when questioned in conjunction with LEH pretending to be Red Cry in his place, could either be his mask to the outside world, or his true colours on how he views LEH  Is it Wednesday already? However it ends, please let it maintain its standard of excellence. Definitely going to miss this drama when it ends...

[Ellander88]

"What will you do when you found your sister's body? Will you pass a judgement to your stepmom?"

 

" Let's go home mom. There is someone you must meet"

 

Who? Dead or alive? Aaaaaaa... I don't want to think of anything 

I just want to wait for Wednesday, and sit back and enjoy the final episode. 

 

Okay, bye. See you'all again on Wednesday 

[foreverempress]

I have two lines of thought on this, if CWK turns to Red Cry or becomes Red Cry for punishment, I will be so disgusted and disappointed. If she is going to become Red Cry, it would be funny to see what punishment she's going to give her husband.

[cyan5tarlight]

All I can say is, if this show ends on a downer or completely open ended note, I'm going to compose several angry letters to the writer. I mean, I'd hope they wouldn't do that and give us some sort of satisfying resolution while still keeping a few things open ended, but you never know. Too many dramas have crashed and burned during their last episode for me to feel completely at ease right now.

 

I'm... really worried about Wookyung right now, tbh. Multiple people have pointed out how she's wearing a red coat in some of the shots when she's mostly worn neutral colors throughout the whole drama, and the way she carries herself and speaks to the stepmother... it really has warning bells going off in my head. I really hope someone will be able to pull her back from the edge before she swan dives right off of it. Maybe little brain ghost Sekyung will show up one more time, like she did when Wookyung was thinking about running over Sukwoo's mom. Perhaps it will be Jiheon, where he finally tells Wookyung what happened to his own child (since that's a plot thread that never went anywhere and needs some resolution). Either way, I really hope the series doesn't end with her taking up the mantle of Red Cry and carrying on his crusade, because that would feel like a huge letdown for sure. And I mean, Jiheon is no fool; if Eunho is dead and YTJ is behind bars, and Red Cry STILL is going after people, who is he going to suspect first? It'd be a short second season, is all I'm saying.

[thistle]

The more I think about it, the more concerned I am that there is no way Children of Nobody can tie up every thread satisfactorily within just one episode.    And I want answers!  I want ALL the answers. 

 

They better not just give us a White Truck of Doom or a time jump.  

[liddi]

@thistle I agree. I can't see any way the drama can tie up all the loose ends. Based on Kim Sun Ah's message to the director, I believe there will be unanswered questions (at least sufficient to justify a sequel), but at least please give us closure with regards to the main arcs in this season. More than anything, I am afraid of plotholes in the finale, reminiscent of the writer's previous work.

 

And yes, I concur with everyone that for CWK to totally give in to her dark side would defeat the message that the drama should be trying to deliver - that one does not have to be dictated by the past, that one can choose to rise above it, and find hope even in the bleakest of situations. I think at the critical moment, CWK's guardian angel will appear once more... and save her from losing herself completely to the hell that threatens to engulf her once more.

 

One more hour! Do you think we will get an extended episode, as is the norm in other dramas I've seen?

[thistle]

19 minutes ago, liddi said:

One more hour! Do you think we will get an extended episode, as is the norm in other dramas I've seen?

 

I really wish we would but the ratings have been low on this drama so it seems unlikely that the production team would risk the expense of making an extension or another episode or a second season.  That really is too bad.  The writing on this drama has been excellent, and the cast have given it all they've got.

[ktcjdrama]

1 hour ago, liddi said:

And yes, I concur with everyone that for CWK to totally give in to her dark side would defeat the message that the drama should be trying to deliver - that one does not have to be dictated by the past, that one can choose to rise above it, and find hope even in the bleakest of situations. I think at the critical moment, CWK's guardian angel will appear once more... and save her from losing herself completely to the hell that threatens to engulf her once more.

 

 One more hour! Do you think we will get an extended episode, as is the norm in other dramas I've seen?

I'd rather that CWK decide how to act on her own without the little guardian angel appearing or influencing her. That will be more powerful for me. 

 

I doubt there will be extension. We would have heard of it by now if there is. 

[0timelost]

I'll just buckle up my seat belt and strap myself in for the ride. The preview looks crazy. It looks like this episode would address two questions, at least: 1. How broken is CWK now that she has regained her memory? We always ask about LEH and his brother, but what about CWK. 2. Would she have done the same thing LEH did after she has opened the "white room?"

 

I don't think CWK would be Red Cry because as she cried out to LEH, she remembered she had a daughter who needed her. I don't think she would deprive her daughter of a mother.

[liddi]

I guess the signs indicate we will have only one hour left, in which case I really hope it will be one hour well spent.

 

Still no news of the release of the instrumental soundtrack... really hope they will make it available...