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OFFICIAL JiAn-Hyuk JoGak-Sculpture-Couple Thread (Shin HyeSun ❤ Lee TaeHwan)

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9 hours ago, titania1000 said:

I didn't come for the promise of subversion, only for SHS that i followed from another drama, Secret Forest,  that i beg you to watch because you'll love it, but i totally agree: there's intelligence and quality in the writing of MGL enough to hook me too until the end!    

I hold on that to convince myself that all isn't lost! It's not the end of JiAn/Hyuk until the end of the drama!

 

I’ll definitely start Secret Forest soon!

 

9 hours ago, titania1000 said:

You made me very curious about the fantasy series that you used for comparison: can you share the title?

 

It’s a Song of Ice and Fire by George RR Martin, best known for its hugely popular (but vastly inferior) television adaptation HBO’s Game of Thrones! 


I’ve been trying to read more classic literature over the past year.  I’ve finished all of Jane Austen’s novels except Mansfield Park (saving that one) and I’m now reading George Eliot’s Middlemarch and Tolstoy’s Anna Karenina. 
 

9 hours ago, titania1000 said:

So i was really disappointed with the way she handled Do Kyung stalker phase, essentially Ji An's reaction to it. I still can understand how it wasn't off putting for her, and didn't end  any lingering feelings that she could have for him. But thinking about it based my experience  on social work, strong attachment and violence in romance can go hand in hand and take time sometimes years for deconstruction,  so i feel most of the time that she's just trying to add a touch of realism here...  

 

We sadly live in a world where better women than Jian have loved worse men than CDK.

 

@cp23

I should really wait for episode 48 to come out but here's my predictions (also indistinguishable from wishful thinking at this point :D)

spoilers for 46/47

Spoiler

In 46/47 we learn that Baker is going to fire Jisoo which will force her to choose between bread and Hyuk. I have a feeling she's actually going to choose bread. Hyuk will argue with her and will bring up the confession note he kept. She'll reveal that Jian actually wrote it. 

 

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On 21/02/2018 at 3:55 AM, cp23 said:

I have also noticed that JA/DK and JS/HK relationships seem to be out of sync since they got together. Even on other forums as noted, some people that shipped these couples, now don't want them to end up together. Some even hope JA does not end up with DK. As soon as DK put back on his business suit, his persona changed back to his original self. He did not inform JA about going back to Haesung and treated HK poorly.  The drama went off track to me also when DK moved into the sharehouse. It seems as though the writer started a new drama from that point, it became the typical rich guy drama of chasing the girl that his family doesn't approve of.  I hope the writer goes down another track with JA not ending up with DK.

 

Thanks for bringing a little hope to our broken hearts! 

It's good to know that we aren't alone after all, thinking that those characters deserve better!

I feel the same about the rich guy and poor girl trope: it's one of the big reasons i have to dislike this ship. The writer put so much emphasize on the difficult social condition of her heroine and the people living in the sharehouse and underlined so clearly the contempt that the rich have for the poor, that it's basically insulting to expect us to cheer for this couple.

No real life royalty example will make it right! 

 

On 21/02/2018 at 8:07 AM, mglthrw8 said:

 

I’ll definitely start Secret Forest soon!

 

I hope you'll post your thoughts on SHS thread or better on the drama thread! 

 

On 21/02/2018 at 8:07 AM, mglthrw8 said:

It’s a Song of Ice and Fire by George RR Martin, best known for its hugely popular (but vastly inferior) television adaptation HBO’s Game of Thrones! 


I’ve been trying to read more classic literature over the past year.  I’ve finished all of Jane Austen’s novels except Mansfield Park (saving that one) and I’m now reading George Eliot’s Middlemarch and Tolstoy’s Anna Karenina. 

 

You took me by surprise because i didn't consider this title! 

I've read the first four books, but since i'm not into fantasy (i prefer sci-fi), i wasnt really sensitive like others fans to the subversion of the tropes. The style is too basic  for my taste but i got very attached to few characters and almost die over their endless misery! Another case (after MGL) of bad plot ruining good characters.:( 

 

Yeah for more good british and russian literature! I haven't read those two classics either but i hope to catch up.  :)   

 

I've watched ep44 and it seemed to me that this episode outlined the writer's plan for the end pretty clearly: i mean that i didn't feel like she was playing us when it comes to the main couples and i didn't felt the fakeness feeling that i used to have during their dates.

 

It seems pretty straightforward for them now with one of two twists to maintain our interest until the very end. Like Do Kyung returning to Haesung and acting like his old self (based on the spoilers), but from what i saw in ep 44, it's probably just a trick: i felt he was serious about selling his shares and might even do it at one point if he can't marry Ji An, though he still doesn't want to cut ties completely (probably to pay for his own factory). 

He's no longer worked up about the company, and though returning here have woke up/triggered his old habits, it's not what he wants to do based on how he seems invested in his new factory and how he acts around Ji An, so i don't think it will last: he will go back to her.

 

The writer even tried to get him act more manly: throwing punch and doing all the hard work while keeping him sensitive: letting his girl drive him.  And the way he waited for Ji An to finish the doll of her father is a sure sign that he's back to his heroic status :rolleyes:

More importantly, Ji An made a step forward with no return back: she opened up to her feelings that she kept bottled up inside until now, so she won't be able to let go of him with her personality. The fact that she was jealous of So Ra and troubled by  their physical contact is the last element missing to confirm that it's definitely mutual.

It wasn't convincing to watch on screen because the writing depicts normal situations in an unnatural way. The fakeness is also a problem of acting/directing, and i include SHS who i don't know why has this shocked look whenever Do Kyung  tries to romance her character as if she doesn't know what to do with herself and with him. Maybe it was supposed to be cute and funny, the truth is : it just doesn't work with those actors and their lack of chemistry. 

    

Back to the thread, there's nothing to say about Ji An and Hyuk, except that i feel sorry that in their only scene ( when he lent her his car to take Ji Soo see Tae Soo), though she praised him a lot, she seemed to have revert to her old habit to infantilize him. He decided to joke about it but still felt the need to confirm that he isn't a child. It made me sad more than the date between Ji An and Do Kyung.:cry:

 

It was an horrible episode for him: not only his screen presence was reduced to the minimum, all he got to do was to fold underwears for Ji Soo, carry heavy charges for Ji Soo, drive Ji Soo to her old home...Basically being Ji Soo's accessory, which wouldn't be so insufferable if she wasn't so full of herself ( the " i can wear anything thanks to my good genes"! line was something) and superficial.

    

The only good scene was the confrontation between Myung Hee and Ji An: that she was been caught up lying was satisfying for me because it's shouldn't be easy for her. Based on their short interaction where she admitted breaking her promise, she obviously left in a big state of  embarrassment and i hope of shame  if she had enough conscience to let the place for a thought for her father....    

 

Apparently, her father is dying for real: that's the only way to let this ship become official. He wouldn't bless their relationship otherwise.

 

I won't lie i'm not excited to watch the rest....      

 

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@titania1000 It is possible that the twist could be about her father and also DKs grandfather if he survives. Both could give their blessing for JA and DK. Not much episodes left.

 

If that is the case, this drama will be like most dramas where all evil deeds are forgiven as if nothing happened.

 

I think it's part of the kdrama template, using the same formulas over and over, just different actors. I was hoping this drama would get out of the box and be somewhat different in terms of the scenarios the writer gave the audience.

 

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@cp23 They both will certainly give their blessings: Do Kyung's grandpa has already done it in the past for his daughter who was in love with a commoner, so he's not above it and the drama made it clear a long time ago that it wasn't the problem, the problem being his controlling way. 

And if Tae Soo is fated to die, he won't bear the shame of facing again the people who threatened his family and hit him and endure them as in law, so he can potentially  let go of his pride for the sake of his daughter's happiness while facing death....

 

But really Ji An and Do Kyung as a couple seem too close to what his parents are (i was truly scared when Myung Hee watched them from afar and started reminiscing about how they looked with her husband when they were younger), and it's not only the controlling grandpa which killed the love between Jae Sung and Myung Hee and made their marriage an empy shell.

If the rumor of an affair is true (she never denied it but never confirmed it either and she doesn't strike me as the type to be unfaithful), it was their doing too. For me Do Kyung and Ji An are taking the same road: not really in sync with each other and prone to have the same kind of miscommunication. Not an exciting couple to root for either way.. .  

 

On 22/02/2018 at 3:14 AM, cp23 said:

If that is the case, this drama will be like most dramas where all evil deeds are forgiven as if nothing happened.

 

This habit to force character to forgive and worse even forget really bugs me big time: we were talking with @mglthrw8 about the abuse and violence suffered by Ji An because of Do Kyung, and all i can think of is what kind of message does it send if the victim ends loving her abuser? That her rejection is just a phase and that she will be ok with it in the end if the man pushes long enough for it?

It seems irresponsible for the writer to still write such dated patriarchal  view in our modern times...

 

On 22/02/2018 at 3:14 AM, cp23 said:

I think it's part of the kdrama template, using the same formulas over and over, just different actors. I was hoping this drama would get out of the box and be somewhat different in terms of the scenarios the writer gave the audience.

 

Usually, the template is not a big problem for me because of the way love triangles in kdrama are written: in the few  romcom that i watched and enjoyed like High School King of Savvy,  everything is made to make us root for the main couple and the girl has really no hesitation about her romantic  feelings and doesn't even double check others guys once her feelings are awakened, especially if she has been badly treated by the guy  who she loved first and was humiliated by him. In this case she won't return to him even if she can accept his apologies and his offer for a friendship after he redeemed himself. So she protects herself, shows self respect and goes for the balanced/healthy relationship.   

 

This time, it's the opposite: Hyuk is a gift from the Gods and full package. Ji An had narratively no reasons to not fell for him and the same could be said for him. They were made for each other on the paper and it worked perfectly on screen.

The writer seems convinced that he got his happy romance, so there should be no frustration for us  but it's not true because the other romance make less sense to say the least.  

We lost everything: the quality of the friendship they had before Do Kyung entered the house and the potential romance...

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I won't lie i'm not excited to watch the rest....      

 

Fair warning, Hyuk does something extremely cringe worthy in episode 45. I hope you don’t mind me spoiling it for you to lessen the impact. Hyuk and Jisoo are at a dinner date and Jisoo is distracted by her concern for Jian. Hyuk ‘gets jealous’ and pouts and whines that Jisoo should be paying attention to only him. It’s…painful to watch.

 

Quote

It seems pretty straightforward for them now with one of two twists to maintain our interest until the very end. Like Do Kyung returning to Haesung and acting like his old self (based on the spoilers), but from what i saw in ep 44, it's probably just a trick: i felt he was serious about selling his shares and might even do it at one point if he can't marry Ji An, though he still doesn't want to cut ties completely (probably to pay for his own factory). 

He's no longer worked up about the company, and though returning here have woke up/triggered his old habits, it's not what he wants to do based on how he seems invested in his new factory and how he acts around Ji An, so i don't think it will last: he will go back to her.

 

I actually don’t think CDK is going to leave Haesung again. His Grandfather’s health crisis has clarified just how much Haesung really means to him. It’s kind of funny but Jian initially subscribes to your theory that CDK going back to Haesung is just misdirection, that it’s just a temporary thing and that he will leave again for his own company after the situation is stabilized. When Jian goes to talk to secretary yoo she learns that CDK probably is going back permanently. CDK’s treatment of secretary Yoo is very cold and callous. Yoo has been abandoned. CDK doesn’t explain anything to secretary Yoo or have the basic decency to meet with him in person. Instead CDK tells secretary Yoo over the phone that he can no longer work at the company, that Yoo should take over and to pick up his car that he lent to CDK. Let me repeat, secretary yoo has to go and pick up the car that he lent to CDK. 


So I really don’t think CDK is leaving Haesung. The real question now is if Jian still ends up with him. I really don’t know anymore. Or I might just be completely wrong and CDK will renounce Haesung in the end for 'love'. Who knows.

 

Quote

Apparently, her father is dying for real: that's the only way to let this ship become official. He wouldn't bless their relationship otherwise.

 

I know what you mean but Tae Soo goes out of his way to encourage Jian to go to Finland and break up with CDK while he was still under the impression that he was dying. He's apologetic about not being able to support her relationship but clear and firm about his intentions. 

 

I have a real weakness for shows and books that attempt something more artistically ambitious within mass-audience commercial formats. And I don’t mean shows/books that try to ‘rise’ above their genre (which to me is a bit distasteful as it shows contempt/superiority) but those that try to demonstrate that there’s no inherent contradiction in works of art that can appeal to a large audience AND be sophisticated and intelligent. I love watching creators try to work through the difficulties and tensions involved.  And even if it ends in failure I love the nobility of the attempt. That’s why I ultimately admire shows like the Good Wife (which went off the rails in the end) over the Wire. It’s easy to argue that the Wire is artistically superior but it had the freedom of being a prestige drama with few constraints. The Good Wife had to try and be excellent as network television. Same thing with a song of ice and fire. It’s probably doomed but it tried!


So I still have so much sympathy for and investment in My Golden Life (while still of course thinking that it's portrayal of relationships to be deeply troubling). The themes of the show and Jian’s struggles really resonate. That it’s failing almost makes it more poignant. 
 


 

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2 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

Fair warning, Hyuk does something extremely cringe worthy in episode 45. I hope you don’t mind me spoiling it for you to lessen the impact. Hyuk and Jisoo are at a dinner date and Jisoo is distracted by her concern for Jian. Hyuk ‘gets jealous’ and pouts and whines that Jisoo should be paying attention to only him. It’s…painful to watch.

 

Thanks for the warning!

But I, sadly, have already been spoiled on twitter few weeks ago and like you, i found it painful to watch!

It hurts the most when it comes to his character because his nature is so different from what the writer tries to sell for him...

That an arrogant character like Do Kyung could be tamed by his lover and act like a puppy for Ji An seems perfectly legit: he deserves it after how he treated her. But not Hyuk: he had every right to look down on Ji Soo who was convinced that he owed her love and stalked him while never considering his feelings.   

But what is is done.¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

 

2 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

I actually don’t think CDK is going to leave Haesung again. His Grandfather’s health crisis has clarified just how much Haesung really means to him. It’s kind of funny but Jian initially subscribes to your theory that CDK going back to Haesung is just misdirection, that it’s just a temporary thing and that he will leave again for his own company after the situation is stabilized. When Jian goes to talk to secretary yoo she learns that CDK probably is going back permanently. CDK’s treatment of secretary Yoo is very cold and callous. Yoo has been abandoned. CDK doesn’t explain anything to secretary Yoo or have the basic decency to meet with him in person. Instead CDK tells secretary Yoo over the phone that he can no longer work at the company, that Yoo should take over and to pick up his car that he lent to CDK. Let me repeat, secretary yoo has to go and pick up the car that he lent to CDK.

 

So I really don’t think CDK is leaving Haesung. The real question now is if Jian still ends up with him. I really don’t know anymore. Or I might just be completely wrong and CDK will renounce Haesung in the end for 'love'. Who knows.

 

I see the fact that he doesn't explain himself as  one more evidence that it's a trick: he won't abandon the man who gave him all his savings to build his factory when he was at his worst. That doesn't fit at all his personality. He must have a plan somewhere and will come back to explain it. No doubt that he will  be forgiven by Ji An and Secretary Yoo. 

Really after the turn taken in ep 44, the drama can only go in one direction.

 

  

2 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

I know what you mean but Tae Soo goes out of his way to encourage Jian to go to Finland and break up with CDK while he was still under the impression that he was dying. He's apologetic about not being able to support her relationship but clear and firm about his intentions. 

 

Maybe because he thinks the Choi family will hurt her if she persists to stay in a relationship with Do Kyung?

He's obviously driven at this stage of his life by the desire to protect her but if Do Kyung's grandpa greenlights their marriage (after Do Kyung will save the company in way or another), it will be all good for him too.

 

2 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

I have a real weakness for shows and books that attempt something more artistically ambitious within mass-audience commercial formats. And I don’t mean shows/books that try to ‘rise’ above their genre (which to me is a bit distasteful as it shows contempt/superiority) but those that try to demonstrate that there’s no inherent contradiction in works of art that can appeal to a large audience AND be sophisticated and intelligent. I love watching creators try to work through the difficulties and tensions involved.  And even if it ends in failure I love the nobility of the attempt. That’s why I ultimately admire shows like the Good Wife (which went off the rails in the end) over the Wire. It’s easy to argue that the Wire is artistically superior but it had the freedom of being a prestige drama with few constraints. The Good Wife had to try and be excellent as network television. Same thing with a song of ice and fire. It’s probably doomed but it tried!

 

I'm definitely a loyal "the Wire" girl in this discussion: i worship it!  I personally love a show  with a vision, something artistically ambitious and so high confident that the writing can even aims to challenge/change the society! 

It holds all the more a special place in my heart because it's a cult show: a creation of pure genius that never got the recognition that it deserved (they were nominated few times but never won any Emmy awards), which never brought a large audience and fought every year to survive the massive cancellations announcements, but was just happy to only exist.

That the show survived for five years and kept its artistic integrity and radical political criticism of the american society is a miracle which would make me believe in God if i wasn't already...

 

I can't judge The Good Wife: i never watched it for a lack of time and because of my laziness (7 seasons looks very long)!

 

But i don't look down on MGL for not being at this level of quality and ambition. I came to kdrama because of what i couldn't find in western productions in general: this attention to life, to the little details that make happiness like Ji An creating a lamp, Ji Soo enjoying eating bread so much that she spent all her money on it, Hyuk's natural smile and real fun times with the ajhummas in Incheon, the Seo family sharing a simple meal and discussing their favourites dishes, the characters taking bus together and thinking about how their day will be, the slow pace which leaves time to the characters (Ji An, Tae Soo) to reflect on what happened to them...

So i'm enjoying this writing too! 

It's just that i have my favourites and i wanted the best for them! So it's disappointing to get only half of what could have been (and it would have been so easy to write)!         

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32 minutes ago, titania1000 said:

 

I see the fact that he doesn't explain himself as  one more evidence that it's a trick: he won't abandoned the man who gave him all his savings to build his factory when he was at his worst. That doesn't fit at all his personality. He must have a plan somewhere and will come bad to explain it. No doubt that he will  be forgiven by Ji An and Secretary Yoo. 

Really after the turn taken in ep 44, the drama can only go in one direction.

 

Ugh you're right. I hate it. But you're right :(. I just still think it's so selfish of him. Would a few quiet words of kindness and reassurance really be so hard though?  I understand he probably can't explain anything to Yoo yet but I wish he could just be kinder to him. Yoo and Jian of course will forgive him in the end. I sort of get that he has to be cold to Jian and Yoo because he needs to hold himself together and not lose his resolve for what needs to be done but he should still show more care for the people that love him. His coldness is for his benefit, not theirs.

 

An incident from many episodes ago still sticks in my mind. Jian was waiting all night for CDK to come home out of concern for him. He's been working hard at his part time jobs and she's worried about his well being. When CDK arrives back home, he's understandably exhausted and cranky. He barely looks at Jian and tells her not to ask about his day and walks straight to his room. Jian sadly mutters "you're killing me". But would it have been really so hard for him to give her a few brief gentle words to thank her for concern? It's the lack of empathy, the inability to view things from other people's perspectives that hurts.

 

45 minutes ago, titania1000 said:

I'm definitely  "the Wire" girl in this discussion: i worship it!  I personally love a show  with a vision, something artistically ambitious and so high confident that the writing can even aims to challenge/change the society! 

It holds all the more a special place in my heart because it's a cult show: a creation of pure genius that never got the recognition that it deserved (they were nominated few times but never won any Emmy awards), which never brought a large audience and fought every year to survive the massive cancellations announcements, but was just happy to only exist.

That the show survived for five years and kept its artistic integrity and radical political criticism of the american society is a miracle which would make me believe in God if i wasn't already...

 

The Wire is a real work of genius. It's certainly worthy of worship! And you're right, it's a miracle that such a show exists. It's still amazing that HBO gave David Simon and his team the freedom to pursue their vision without constraint. It made the most of the prestige drama format. 

 

But while I'm in awe of genius I can never quite relate to it. It's easier for me to relate to the showrunners of something like the Good Wife, talented but ordinary people trying to do their best work under a lot of limitations. Preserving a degree of artistic integrity under the compromises of network television.

 

I love scrappy underdog characters like Jian. She smart and talented but just a regular person. I loved watching her grow from a person so beaten down by life's circumstances that she felt forced to turn her ambition and talent to achieving conventional corporate success to a person willing to stand and fight for her modest dreams of being a woodworker and furniture designer. She was never going to create sculptures worthy of the Guggenheim museum but doesn't mean she had to live a life as a corporate exec. And it was Hyuk more than anyone else who helped her find a realistic path to be true to herself and live her best life. *sigh

 

It's really sad that he's never going to have an honest conversation with her over what she meant to him and what frankly he should mean to her now. One thing I was annoyed to see dropped was his sense of betrayal that Jian never told him about Jisoo's identity. It's not resolved, just dropped.

 

It's also very curious that Hyuk and Jisoo have never had a conversation about Jian. She's been the central figure in each of their lives and she never really is a topic of conversation. During their first date, Hyuk can't even bring himself to say Jian's name. He calls her his first love and  refers to her almost as if she's some random person Jisoo is unfamiliar with. Jisoo herself can't bring up Jian's name as well during that first date, just alluding to Hyuk's type. So strange.

 

We'll see what ep 48 brings :(

 

1 hour ago, titania1000 said:

But i don't look down on MGL for not being at this level of quality and ambition. I came to kdrama because of what i couldn't find in western productions in general: this attention to life, to the little details that make happiness like Ji An creating a lamp, Ji Soo enjoying eating bread so much that she spent all her money on it, Hyuk's natural smile and real fun times with the ajhummas in Incheon, the Seo family sharing a simple meal and discussing their favourites dishes, the characters taking bus together and thinking about how their day will be, the slow pace which leaves time to the characters (Ji An, Tae Soo) to reflect on what happened to them...

So i'm enjoying this writing too! 

 

Agreed! I'm fairly new to kdramas and I love those ordinary aspects. i don't really know what it's come to mind as they're very different from kdramas but have you heard of Eric Rohmer and Richard Linklater? Their films feature long conversations with little plot and somehow they're a pleasure to watch. 

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

Agreed! I'm fairly new to kdramas and I love those ordinary aspects. i don't really know what it's come to mind as they're very different from kdramas but have you heard of Eric Rohmer and Richard Linklater? Their films feature long conversations with little plot and somehow they're a pleasure to watch. 

 

I hate the Nouvelle Vague movement so much! I can't stand watching  Rohmer, Truffaut, Godard and all those others pseudo directors' works. For me they killed the french creativity with their rules. It took decades to the french cinema to get out of the elitism that this school imposed on all the industry, and for a new generation of filmmakers to  dare to affirm their right to enjoy fiction for what it is at heart, to make films for the pleasure to tell good stories. 

French literature as the same problem but it's even worse, since it's still stuck in the same loop and there's no new real talent/author emerging to change the path...   

 

Back to the thread, 

I just finished ep 45 and  i'm really mad that the writer has just purely and simply ERASED Ji An/Hyuk scenes!:crazy:

How a relationship so strong could go to everything to nothing in few blinks while the two persons involved are still important for each other? She still works for him and he dates her sister, that she's seeing everyday so why can't she take the time to meet Hyuk?    

It makes no sense! I can  live with them being only friends but if the writer decides to give us nothing,  it will be too harsh!

 

3 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

It's really sad that he's never going to have an honest conversation with her over what she meant to him and what frankly he should mean to her now. One thing I was annoyed to see dropped was his sense of betrayal that Jian never told him about Jisoo's identity. It's not resolved, just dropped.

 

The writer does often that when she doesn't want to adress more deeply an issue.They went back to their usual mood without transition, and we're supposed to be satisfied with it or to deduce that he forgave her. Hyuk has already forgave so many times (all the times she broke her promises). He always comes back to her...    

 

3 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

I love scrappy underdog characters like Jian. She smart and talented but just a regular person. I loved watching her grow from a person so beaten down by life's circumstances that she felt forced to turn her ambition and talent to achieving conventional corporate success to a person willing to stand and fight for her modest dreams of being a woodworker and furniture designer. She was never going to create sculptures worthy of the Guggenheim museum but doesn't mean she had to live a life as a corporate exec. And it was Hyuk more than anyone else who helped her find a realistic path to be true to herself and live her best life. *sigh

 

I felt with the scene where Tae Soo called Ji An to  push her to go to Finland that the torch have passed between Hyuk and him to keep someone in her life, as a support and a reminder to live her dreams.

I wish the two men would have met: Hyuk used to remember him so clearly! I always thought that he appreciated him a lot since Tae Soo treated the wood classmates so well. It seemed to me that they had a bond by sharing the same desire to protect Ji An even though they didn't talk for years but it was before Hyuk was removed from her life...

 

3 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

It's also very curious that Hyuk and Jisoo have never had a conversation about Jian. She's been the central figure in each of their lives and she never really is a topic of conversation. During their first date, Hyuk can't even bring himself to say Jian's name. He calls her his first love and  refers to her almost as if she's some random person Jisoo is unfamiliar with. Jisoo herself can't bring up Jian's name as well during that first date, just alluding to Hyuk's type. So strange.

   

They don't talk about her but Ji An takes a lot of space in their relationship because of Ji Soo's obsession for her. To the point where she thinks about her during her dates with Hyuk! I watched the  famous and horrendous scene of Hyuk's acting jealous of Ji An during a lunch date with Ji Soo and i was really shocked by how intrusive she was.

She was fixated on  why her father met Ji An to the point to bluntly ask in a text her ex sister and to meet her almost  immediately to get the truth  because she couldn't stand to not know!:blink:

 

And can you explain to me the absolutely delirious scene where she forced Hyuk to follow her to spy on Ji An and Do Kyung during their last date when they went sledging???!!! :crazy: What the Hell was that???!!!  Huyk was literally forcing her to retreat in the car because it was too cold! He looked pissed off and fed up with her stalking. I don't know what's going on with her: did i miss something?         

       

3 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

Ugh you're right. I hate it. But you're right :(. I just still think it's so selfish of him. Would a few quiet words of kindness and reassurance really be so hard though?  I understand he probably can't explain anything to Yoo yet but I wish he could just be kinder to him. Yoo and Jian of course will forgive him in the end. I sort of get that he has to be cold to Jian and Yoo because he needs to hold himself together and not lose his resolve for what needs to be done but he should still show more care for the people that love him. His coldness is for his benefit, not theirs.

 

An incident from many episodes ago still sticks in my mind. Jian was waiting all night for CDK to come home out of concern for him. He's been working hard at his part time jobs and she's worried about his well being. When CDK arrives back home, he's understandably exhausted and cranky. He barely looks at Jian and tells her not to ask about his day and walks straight to his room. Jian sadly mutters "you're killing me". But would it have been really so hard for him to give her a few brief gentle words to thank her for concern? It's the lack of empathy, the inability to view things from other people's perspectives that hurts.

 

Good catch! To answer to your question, i will use another one  when did he ever consider her feelings? He's making efforts since he came back from Incheon with the confirmation of her suicide attempt but it looks so forced, i don't believe it's the real him at heart.

His lack of empathy is real  and will be a big problem with time. He's obviously forcing himself to be more attentive and patient because he thinks it's how people in love act. He also feels guilty over how much she suffered because of him. 

I can see why  it seems to him less hard to do it now  since he really wants to be with her but what will happen once their relationship will be consumed?  How long it will take before he started showing this darker side of his personality? What will happen when those feelings of love/guilt will become old? Or worse if it starts to fade away?

I'm not saying that it's not a reason to try, because in this case very few couple would be together but for me when a relationship starts with so much reasons to give up form the get go, the probability that it won't work on the long term is very high.

I really can see them becoming a happy old couple.

 

Be it for Ji Soo or Do Kyung, I don't see any real evolution in term of character development, and it's very hard for to me to accept the idea that we won't escape them and they will be the final lovers for Hyuk and Ji An.  

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6 hours ago, titania1000 said:

I hate the Nouvelle Vague movement so much! I can't stand watching  Rohmer, Truffaut, Godard and all those others pseudo directors' works. For me they killed the french creativity with their rules. It took decades to the french cinema to get out of the elitism that this school imposed on all the industry, and for a new generation of filmmakers to  dare to affirm their right to enjoy fiction for what it is at heart, to make films for the pleasure to tell good stories. 

French literature as the same problem but it's even worse, since it's still stuck in the same loop and there's no new real talent/author emerging to change the path...   

 

We'll just have to disagree on Rohmer :D

 

Truffaut and Godard leave me cold but I love Rohmer's films, especially his late sixties, early seventies output. You're probably right about french literature. French literature hasn't been relevant for a long time. I was forced to read some Houellebecq for a book club. He's somewhat interesting but a real reactionary. 

 

6 hours ago, titania1000 said:

Back to the thread, 

I just finished ep 45 and  i'm really mad that the writer has just purely and simply ERASED Ji An/Hyuk scenes!:crazy:

How a relationship so strong could go to everything to nothing in few blinks while the two persons involved are still important for each other? She still works for him and he dates her sister, that she's seeing everyday so why can't she take the time to meet Hyuk?    

It makes no sense! I can  live with them being only friends but if the writer decides to give us nothing,  it will be too harsh!

 

I finally understand the appeal of fanfiction. I understood why people liked it on an intellectual level. But now I understand emotionally too :(.

 

6 hours ago, titania1000 said:

I wish the two men would have met: Hyuk used to remember him so clearly! I always thought that he appreciated him a lot since Tae Soo treated the wood classmates so well. It seemed to me that they had a bond by sharing the same desire to protect Ji An even though they didn't talk for years but it was before Hyuk was removed from her life...

 

The preview of Ep 48 shows that they will meet but unfortunately it looks like he'll be introduced as Jisoo's boyfriend. He's no longer even the second lead in terms of presence :(

 

6 hours ago, titania1000 said:

And can you explain to me the absolutely delirious scene where she forced Hyuk to follow her to spy on Ji An and Do Kyung during their last date when they went sledging???!!! :crazy: What the Hell was that???!!!  Huyk was literally forcing her to retreat in the car because it was too cold! He looked pissed off and fed up with her stalking. I don't know what's going on with her: did i miss something?

 

I believe the official answer is that Jisoo wanted to wait for the date to end and ensure that Jian didn't have to go home alone. Yeah that doesn't really make sense. It was a very bizarre scene that I had completely forgotten about. I can't really account for it except as a hamfisted attempt to include some extra screentime for the actors. 

 

6 hours ago, titania1000 said:

when did he ever consider her feelings? He's making efforts since he came back from Incheon with the confirmation of her suicide attempt but it looks so forced, i don't believe it's the real him at heart

 

You'll see him regress again soon in either 46 or 47. In response to his coldness Jian has a brief flashback to the infamous scene where he doesn't let Jian get a word in and humiliates her to the point that she no longer wants to ask for his help with his parents and has to then face them alone. But the flashback doesn't produce revulsion. It just makes her sad for him. 

 

6 hours ago, titania1000 said:

Be it for Ji Soo or Do Kyung, I don't see any real evolution in term of character development, and it's very hard for to me to accept the idea that we won't escape them and they will be the final lovers for Hyuk and Ji An.  

 

The fate of Jian-Hyuk might rest in the hands of Jisoo. She's going to have to choose in ep 48 between her career/bread and Hyuk. Baker explicitly says this to Hee when he tells her that he's going to fire Jisoo. Jian also asks Jisoo about what she values more but Jisoo only says that both are important to her. But she will be forced to choose. Even though we've seen some retrograde attitudes towards relationships in the show, I still think Jisoo will choose bread. My prediction is that Hyuk will argue with her and pull out his possession of her love confession note as a trump card. I still think it's going to come into play as Hyuk is shown to be reading the note in two separate scene and Jisoo is completely unaware that he has it. Jisoo will then reveal that Jian wrote it. If Hyuk becomes single I think it could set up a Jian-Hyuk ending. Hyuk and Jisoo have already broken up once so I don't see them getting back together if they break up again.

 

But I may be getting ahead of myself. Perhaps Jisoo chooses bread, decides to go to France to learn and Hyuk vows to wait for her. 

 

Or everything above will just be completely wrong. I haven't had a great track record with my predictions in this show :(

 

 

 

 

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I wanted to put something something positive on the top of my message so  i went for this tweet:

  

 

 

The rest of my thoughts on ep 46 and 47 will be sadly less positive! Also,  the subs were really badly written this time, so i'm less sure than usual of what i understood ...

 

So Ji An confessed her love to Do Kyung in one of the less memorable supposed love scene ever made! 

I mean: it can be more clear than I love you but at the same time it was  devoid of the passion and tenderness that you can expect from a main couple, despite the emphasize on their physical contact. I don't doubt that he wants "to be with her" considering how long he's been chasing her but he was so cold about returning the feelings: a "me too" and that's all! 

But even the fact that they end their moment of intimacy in the strangest possible way: no hand holdings, they walked away separately and she turned even her back to him to go first without  even looking at him (they were supposed to looked sad and discouraged and they just looked distant,) even  that can't make me deny  that as unremarkable as their relationship is, it's clear that they won't let go of each other.     

 

It means consequently  that Hyuk and Ji An are nowhere to end together one day...

 

The most discouraging for me was that  even in a crisis time where Ji An's identity was exposed to media attention and her family mistreated badly again, they didn't share any significant scene, which consequently means that there's no progression in their relationship: Hyuk is still very loyal to her but has a hard time to stand up for her and to fight for her even whe he is provoked to do it by Do Kyung ("why.didn't you stop me?"). And Ji An is wrapped in her feelings for Do Kyung, the only times she mentions him, it's in relation to Ji Soo and when Do Kyung come back to Haesung and  reverted back to his arrogant attitude, taking out on her the guilt that he felt for his grandpa's heart attack. She asked during their trip in the car  why he didn't let her go with Hyuk to her father's house but it seemed more a provocation fueled by her hurt feelings, she didn't want to go with Hyuk.

 

Oddly too since the triangle is officially dead, the confrontation between Hyuk and Do Kyung shouldn't seem like an opposition between two rivals, so why do i feel that the writer hinted at it?

 If Hyuk invoked mostly the fact that he didn't want Ji An to be hurt, and that a lot of people supported Do Kyung so turning his back on them was a betrayal, he never  answered the very important question: why did he not stop Do Kyung from winning her?  I feel like he's avoiding the issue of his real feelings because he considers that he can't take responsability for her...

 

However Hyuk seemed more concerned by Ji An's feelings than by the fact that Ji Soo was at risk to be forced to go back home by Do Kyung (maybe because she has her father's approval).

Their dialogues in the car while he was taking her to her father's house in the countryside were a real clash carefully written: each time he mentioned Ji An, Ji Soo reminded him of Do Kyung or of her own/personal hurt feelings!  :o

  •  when he said that Ji An would feel more comfortable with them than with Do Kyung, Ji Soo felt suddenly the need to stay alone with him! She justified it by the fact she won't see him for few days and he answered that he will come every day to see her!
  • She then argued that her  sister's feelings for her brother were mutual (this sentence was strange to write but it reflects the state of the drama) and that they needed time together. When he answered that Ji An's will be disappointed and betrayed by Do Kyung's new attitude just like he was, she used their past and reminded him that she never succeeded in getting ride of her feelings for him despite her efforts to forget him and her disappointment.
  • Despite her efforts, Hyuk's mind stayed focused on Ji An: he didn't follow on her feelings for him and revert to his fear that Ji An could be hurt if she followed her heart.
  • In a last and desperate and manipulative  move to make sure she will stay the center of his thoughts: Ji Soo straightforwardly said that she would want to die (because of the revelation of the truth about her identity by the media) if he wasn't with her. He then hold her hand and the argument stopped.:o    

 

Other things:

 

  • When Hyuk mentionned that the house looked two dangerous for two woman to stay alone: Ji An made it all about Ji Soo and promise to protect her as if he wasn't worried about her too!
  • Obviously, Do Kyung forced him to let his car to prevent that he could return alone...   
  • I hate how Do Kyung ordered him around once he came back to his powerful position (he forced him to let his car, reminded him that he's Ji Soo's brother and all that Hyuk can do was taking care of the girl): as dominant as he thinks he is, it's Hyuk who saved the girls at the worst times in their lives: when Ji Soo was depressed during her stay at the Choi House and of course when he brought back Ji An from InCheon....

 

 Now, that the power changed hands inside Haesung and that Do Kyung and his father can make the calls, and will be all in control after driving out the the aunt and her husband, no doubt that his grandpa and  his mother won't oppose anymore the marriage and won't be in capacity to impose their conditions to it. 

Ji An can go freely to Finland and come back to become a famous designer who will marry her chaebol like in every fairy tale! :dissapointed:

 

On 23/02/2018 at 6:00 AM, mglthrw8 said:

 

I believe the official answer is that Jisoo wanted to wait for the date to end and ensure that Jian didn't have to go home alone. Yeah that doesn't really make sense. It was a very bizarre scene that I had completely forgotten about. I can't really account for it except as a hamfisted attempt to include some extra screentime for the actors. 

 

It was indeed explained in ep 46 but the explanation still made no sense!

She knows her ex sister enough to be sure that Ji An wasn't going to break in tears (she doesn't have a sensitive nature) and there was no reason for Do Kyung to abandon her in the middle of nowhere. For me,  Ji Soo had just a misplaced curiosity about what the couple  will do on their last date. I just put it on her unhealthy  obsession for Ji An. 

 

On 23/02/2018 at 6:00 AM, mglthrw8 said:

The preview of Ep 48 shows that they will meet but unfortunately it looks like he'll be introduced as Jisoo's boyfriend. He's no longer even the second lead in terms of presence :(

 

 

It was strange how Ji An refused to let Hyuk enters her home for fear that he would recognize her mother as the woman who pretended to be the new occupant and told him that Ji An moved away. It's all over now; why make a deal of it?

 

On 23/02/2018 at 6:00 AM, mglthrw8 said:

The fate of Jian-Hyuk might rest in the hands of Jisoo. She's going to have to choose in ep 48 between her career/bread and Hyuk. Baker explicitly says this to Hee when he tells her that he's going to fire Jisoo. Jian also asks Jisoo about what she values more but Jisoo only says that both are important to her. But she will be forced to choose. Even though we've seen some retrograde attitudes towards relationships in the show, I still think Jisoo will choose bread. My prediction is that Hyuk will argue with her and pull out his possession of her love confession note as a trump card. I still think it's going to come into play as Hyuk is shown to be reading the note in two separate scene and Jisoo is completely unaware that he has it. Jisoo will then reveal that Jian wrote it. If Hyuk becomes single I think it could set up a Jian-Hyuk ending. Hyuk and Jisoo have already broken up once so I don't see them getting back together if they break up again.

 

I agree with you here: i'm not sure too that their romance will stand. I'm pretty sure about Ji An and Do Kyung being reunited but i have more doubt for Hyuk and Ji Soo. I think there's a real possibility that she could leave him and maybe go abroad like Ji An but for a longer time and who knows then what will happen to them then, unless we got a time jump.....

 

On 23/02/2018 at 6:00 AM, mglthrw8 said:

You'll see him regress again soon in either 46 or 47. In response to his coldness Jian has a brief flashback to the infamous scene where he doesn't let Jian get a word in and humiliates her to the point that she no longer wants to ask for his help with his parents and has to then face them alone. But the flashback doesn't produce revulsion. It just makes her sad for him

 

I'm not sure if i got well this part of the dialogues. At first it seemed to me that he didn't treat her the same: he admitted that his family is terrible, that they are all terrible people and listened and took in consideration her legit fear.

But i wonder now if her outburst didn't come from the fact that she felt he was ironic/mocking her a bit...

For me, the flashbacks were supposed to underline two things:

  •  how horrible he can look  when he puts on this suit, which means he will be forced to give up the title of heir of Haseung and just run his factory if he wants to be with her,
  • and to show that indeed he made " progress" since that time where he humiliated her without listening to her.

For her, the flashback meant she was still hurt to relive this memory though she said she forgave him,  but i don't think being hurt by him will stop her to love him. That's the rule of toxic relationship. 

 

 

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Finally happy scenes for us!:heart::heart::heart:

 

Hyuk meeting Ji An's father (and her mother)!

Hyuk cheering Ji An when she got her prize! 

 

It was worth the wait!

 

 

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1 hour ago, titania1000 said:

Finally happy scenes for us!:heart::heart::heart:

 

Hyuk meeting Ji An's father (and her mother)!

Hyuk's cheering Ji An when she got her prize! 

 

It was worth the wait!

 

Finally! :)

 

Hopefully we get one more meal scene just the two of them!

 

Thank you for your thoughts on 46-47. I hope to write a little more later because you've brought up some interesting points.

 

20 hours ago, titania1000 said:

It was strange how Ji An refused to let Hyuk enters her home for fear that he would recognize her mother as the woman who pretended to be the new occupant and told him that Ji An moved away. It's all over now; why make a deal of it

 

We'll have to wait until the subs are out but from the clips of ep 48 it looks like neither Hyuk nor Jian's mother recognized each other. What was the point of the above scene then? I thought it would pay off somehow in 48. 

 

On 2/22/2018 at 12:13 PM, titania1000 said:

Maybe because he thinks the Choi family will hurt her if she persists to stay in a relationship with Do Kyung?

He's obviously driven at this stage of his life by the desire to protect her but if Do Kyung's grandpa greenlights their marriage (after Do Kyung will save the company in way or another), it will be all good for him too.

 

The clips in ep 48 show that Tae soo is now willing to support the Choi's in their move to remain in control of Haesung. He's doing so for the sake of his daughter. Bizarre that he would help the people that have hurt him and has family so much but I guess it's for Jian.

 

20 hours ago, titania1000 said:

I agree with you here: i'm not sure too that their romance will stand. I'm pretty sure about Ji An and Do Kyung will be reunited but i have more doubt for Hyuk and Ji Soo. I think there's a real possibility that she could leave him and maybe go abroad like Ji An but for a longer time and who knows then what will happen to them then, unless we got a time jump.....

 

I'm really curious how ep 48 played out. Jisoo got fired from the bakery but it looks like she and Hyuk haven't broken up yet. I believe she's contemplating it though. There's a clip of them eating noodles that looks a little tense. Excellent observations by the way on their dialogue in the car up to her father's house.

 

20 hours ago, titania1000 said:

 how horrible he can look  when he puts on this suit, which means he will be forced to give up the title of heir of Haseung and just run his factory if he wants to be with her,

 

He's even further from giving up Haesung now. The last scene of ep 48 shows him announcing his candidacy for CEO. I hope we're not headed for the worst possible ending where CDK becomes CEO and Jian still marries him. 

 

20 hours ago, titania1000 said:

Oddly too since the triangle is officially dead, the confrontation between Hyuk and Do Kyung shouldn't seem like an opposition between two rivals, so why do i feel that the writer hinted at it?

 If Hyuk invoked mostly the fact that he didn't want Ji An to be hurt, and that a lot of people supported Do Kyung so turning his back on them was a betrayal, he never  answered the very important question: why did he not stop Do Kyung from winning her?  I feel like he's avoiding the issue of his real feelings because he considers that he can't take responsability for her...

 

Agreed. Very odd scene. CDK throwing that question at Hyuk really angered me. Hyuk's silence is even more puzzling. I believe you're right that Hyuk's avoiding his feelings but are we reading too much into it? There's only 4 episodes left now. Can we really expect any abrupt shifts in the story? 

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On 25/02/2018 at 4:39 PM, mglthrw8 said:

Finally! :)

 

Hopefully we get one more meal scene just the two of them!

 

Thank you for your thoughts on 46-47. I hope to write a little more later because you've brought up some interesting points.

 

I can't wait to read your thoughts!^_^

 

I've watched  ep 48 with subs ( i was super excited to get the dialogues of the scenes i posted) and we've been spoiled with more!

We got a scene of our favourite couple at the wood workplace!  Talking very comfortably about how well her products were selling! 

She was so proud and happy for her achievement! She also complimented Hyuk for being such a good seller!  

I was on the moon because they work so well on every level! They are perfectly complementary when it comes to work: she does the design and creates the product and he sells it! I love their partnership too because he understands perfectly how much efforts, application and details go in creating those furnitures. For him, it's not about selling, but about giving to her an outlet to express herself and her creativity as much as giving people the right product, a quality product made with passion and which will be useful to the owner  :heart::heart::heart: 

 

However, when he tried to be more personal with her and asked about how she feels since Do Kyung left: she seemed to cut out the discussion quickly to his disappointment. Though she seemed to reject the possibility to confide to him, i liked her answer about the fact that she was feeling sometimes good, sometimes not good. It goes with the fact that she said  to Ji Soo that she has lived with Do Kyung everything that she wanted to live and that she was ready to move on. It gave me hope for few minutes (until the end of the episode) that one day she could live without him and, realize that he's not essential to her happiness at all. 

Of course, it didn't stand and  her panic at the end of the episode seemed to prove the contrary....

 

Which answers to your question:

On 25/02/2018 at 4:39 PM, mglthrw8 said:

There's only 4 episodes left now. Can we really expect any abrupt shifts in the story? 

 

Actually,  there has been regular shifts in the story since few episodes now: i made speculations about how Ji An and Do Kyung seemed fated to end together but ep 48 seemed to shake this scenario again. He woke up to the fact that he has taken now for  granted his company because everybody (himself included) considered him the natural heir. Now he's forced to fight to keep it, rediscovering all the way how much his family meant to him despite their flaws. 

 

I don't know where it will lead him but i feel that  his grandpa's heart attack and aunt's coup forced him to reconsider how selfish his obsession for Ji An was: his parents looked to him like oppressors  when they were so worked up about his inheritance and negating his independence and right to date, but now he can see the situation from their point of view and seems to consider in a more detached way his feelings for Ji An.

 

Someone on twitter compared the way Ji An's name was saved on his phone in ep 44 and ep 48: Do Kyung went for her  first name with a heart close to it in ep 44, but in ep 48 not only the heart had disappeared, it's also her full name that appeared when she called him. Clearly this change is supposed to translate the passing from a very intimate/close relationship to one much more formal. But what's left unclear is if he's sincere about it or not. Are his feelings for her fading away or is he just pretending? And if so, what's point to do it on his phone, where nobody is going to check?           

 

A light in the darkness for us: how the scene Ji An shared with Do Kyung in the wood workshop turned out. I cringe everytime he enters this space because it's Hyuk's place for me as much his room, and the fact Hyuk's  father works here adds a sentimental/emotional dimension. So if i always thought that Do Kyung seems out of place at the wood worskhop, for the 1st time the drama seems to agree with me  because it was very much emphasized in the scene when he came to watch her work: his suit, his detached attitude, the fact that he observed her without helping and his frustration that she ignored him to finish what she was doing created an  emotional gap between them,  bigger than ever on his side, at least since his last trip to Incheon...

 

More importantly, he had one line i cherish if only because in any drama it would be a clue for us that there's still a chance for our favourite couple:"you're in love with wood, aren't you.You lose track of time." I have commented so often that Hyuk means  wood in her world through various clues given by the drama, that i still dream that we're  supposed to read this as one additional element that the story can still shift in our favor.

 

Do Kyung knows that she loves wood since few weeks now, because he watched her working before. In this scene he seemed to rethink this bit of info about her in light of the new events which pushed him back to his family, trying to evaluate if her determination to follow her new path and her new style of life would fit nonetheless with his status. He knows that she doesn't want his family, money and luxury style of life, so he shouldn't even ask, but he was still trying to keep her on his side  while himself has decided to give up, for now,  the path he has started with her. There was something very selfish in this attitude, which could be a momentarily  regression  or the indication that he reached the limit of what he can do for love. 

 

 

On 25/02/2018 at 4:39 PM, mglthrw8 said:

We'll have to wait until the subs are out but from the clips of ep 48 it looks like neither Hyuk nor Jian's mother recognized each other. What was the point of the above scene then? I thought it would pay off somehow in 48.

      

Her mother didn't recognize him, but before the meeting Ji An reminded each of them separately (and off screen for Hyuk)  that they already met and what happened between them at that time. However, the point of this scene is left unexplained.

It could be that the writer tried clumsily to remind us that the characters met before because it was so long ago.

It could be too  that the writer tried to draw our attention to this meeting  between Hyuk and her parents, to underline that it has a special importance and a special  meaning for both sides, and that's there is a reason for it to happen so late. I like better this 2nd option,  obviously.

 

I really really love the way the entire sequence was shot: the fact Hyuk informed  personally  Ji An (and not through Ji Soo) that he was coming to her ceremony, pretending it wasn't for her, and how she jokingly argued that it wasn't necessary though she was obviously very pleased that he wanted to be here for her. 

A question that she didn't ask to Do Kyung, i'm certain of that. One more time, he's missing a real important moment of her life...

 

How satisfying was it that Hyuk watched Ji An gets the prize!!!! The completion of the road taken together to bring her physically to her family and mentally to regain her faith in life, her independence, her freedom to define for herself what she wants and the confidence that she has the qualities required to be a designer and so to realize her dream! If it doesn't mean that they're meant to be together, i don't know what else could be necessary...       

 

I loved the emphasis put on the importance of this reunion for Hyuk and her father: the camera took such a clear and carefully framed shot of them when they shaked hands, lingering on their faces/smiles and hands!  Hyuk expressed so strongly with his body language his respect and admiration for Tae Soo. And clearly the Seo parents were impressed by his charisma, his composed attitude and his gentleness. It was like this scene has been expected for a long time by everyone (the characters Ji An and Hyuk but also the director) and carefully shot to look good.  

 

I noticed too that it didn't escape anyone that, though he was presented as Ji Soo's boyfriend, Hyuk knows Ji An since high school and was her wood classmate, that he studied interior design just like she's doing now, and that they were supposed to go together to the same Arts university....

Not only that, the way the infos was revealed  caught also my attention: when Hyuk praised Jian and said that she was acclaimed by everyone at the wood workshop,  it's Ji Soo who, without reflecting much on it let everyone know that they promised to go together to Arts university, forcing Ji An to take a pensive, maybe embarrassed look, as if everyone would wonder why she did end up with him, since they fit each other so well!       

 

This emphasis put on Hyuk and Tae Soo's meeting for me was all in relation with Ji An: considering how Tae Soo is currently invested, even entirely devoted  in helping and protecting her (to the point to help the man whose family is his enemy, and not for Ji Soo like he pretended) and how Hyuk is currently all worked up/angered by Do Kyung's attitude toward Ji An, i have a hard time to imagine that it could be important because of Ji Soo. She's secondary in this relationship from the start.  

Of course LTH and the actor playing Tae Soo have been probably waiting for their characters to meet on screen since they never shared a scene before, so all this work was maybe a way to aknowledge it too....     

 

 

On 25/02/2018 at 4:39 PM, mglthrw8 said:

I'm really curious how ep 48 played out. Jisoo got fired from the bakery but it looks like she and Hyuk haven't broken up yet. I believe she's contemplating it though. There's a clip of them eating noodles that looks a little tense. Excellent observations by the way on their dialogue in the car up to her father's house.

 

She didn't seem that much distressed by being fired, which surprised me since it was her dream. I feel like she was prepared to this moment by Hee's coldness to her. She doesn't seem to know what she will do next but since she tends to imitate a lot Ji An, i think more than ever that she will go abroad to study pastry and come back as Choi Eun Seok.

For the 1st time since a long time, she mentioned  her other name and what's new is that i felt a feeling of attachment  in her tone for her bio family and  regret that she isn't a part of it enough to get include on what's going on for them.  

 

She still refused to break up with Hyuk but the fact that she rejected his offer of help put a a real distance between them: he really didn't like that she treated him like a stranger and tried to tell him what to do. Bonus for us: Ji An seemed very concerned by the fact he was angry!

 

On 25/02/2018 at 4:39 PM, mglthrw8 said:

He's even further from giving up Haesung now. The last scene of ep 48 shows him announcing his candidacy for CEO. I hope we're not headed for the worst possible ending where CDK becomes CEO and Jian still marries him. 

          

Objectively, if he wins and become the CEO, that would mean that the people concerned (shareholders) trust him to be their leader and he wouldn't be able to quit in favor of his father. 

But i think it can also be easily overlooked once the battle will be won  and his parents reintegrated in their functions.

I can see him returning to  Ji An and to what he left behind: the factory and his secretary/best friend. And we know that sadly both would still take him back happily.

 

On 25/02/2018 at 4:39 PM, mglthrw8 said:

Agreed. Very odd scene. CDK throwing that question at Hyuk really angered me. Hyuk's silence is even more puzzling. I believe you're right that Hyuk's avoiding his feelings but are we reading too much into it?

 

Probably, but i can't stop myself!

He's still silent: even if he considers that Ji An is better without Do Kyung like he seems to think, it's not enough to push him to make a move, so does he deserve to end with her if he can not show his feelings?  

The fact that Ji An is lying to herself is important too:  she confirmed  to her father that she has feelings for Do Kyung after telling Ji Soo, she was on her way to move on! . 

 

On 25/02/2018 at 4:39 PM, mglthrw8 said:

The clips in ep 48 show that Tae soo is now willing to support the Choi's in their move to remain in control of Haesung. He's doing so for the sake of his daughter. Bizarre that he would help the people that have hurt him and has family so much but I guess it's for Jian.

 

It's disappointing too that she's forcing him to accept her love for Do Kyung after all he went through because of the Choi family: her face literally lightened up when he told her he was helping Do Kyung also  because he is the man that she loves. I took it as she believed that he forgave everything, which is really impossible. That's why his cancer is so convenient. 

I can understand that he feels like he has a debt to pay, which won't leave him live or rather die in peace  until he pays it, as the way the chairman treated him proved it, but the fact that his death is used to help to make this couple possible, while this relationship is wrong on so many levels is really bothering me a lot. The old man deserved better... 

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On 2/26/2018 at 11:38 AM, titania1000 said:

However, when he tried to be more personal with her and asked about how she feels since Do Kyung left: she seemed to cut out the discussion quickly to his disappointment. Though she seemed to reject the possibility to confide to him, i liked her answer about the fact that she was feeling sometimes good, sometimes not good. It goes with the fact that she said  to Ji Soo that she has lived with Do Kyung everything that she wanted to live and that she was ready to move on. It gave me hope for few minutes (until the end of the episode) that one day she could live without him and, realize that he's not essential to her happiness at all. 

 

She’s not willing to confide in him but it’s interesting that she’s actually more honest with him than with Jisoo. Jian at least is willing to admit to Hyuk that she sometimes isn’t fine. But with Jisoo, Jian says that she has no reason to be upset. Even when Jisoo presses her and says that emotions don’t work that way, Jian still insists that she understands why DK did what he did and that she’s fine with it. It seems that even though the sisters are close again, Jian no longer quite trusts her as before. I also wonder if Jian is suppressing anger towards DK. When both Hyuk and Jisoo ask how she feels about DK going back to Haesung, Jian’s face takes on a strange blank look and her words become airy and glib, as if the matter were of no consequence.

 

I might be remembering this wrong but if I recall correctly, when Jisoo first informed Jian that DK was headed back to Haesung in ep 47, Jian acted very relaxed and reassured Jisoo that it was just a temporary measure and that he would be back with Yoo soon. When Jian later finds out that DK at least appears to be going back permanently it doesn’t alter her attitude in the slightest. We now get blank looks and glib speech. So strange.  Jian must be suppressing intense anger towards DK.

 

Despite the wonderful scenes in Ep 48 with Jian and Hyuk, it sadly looks like Jian is still deeply in love with DK. It wouldn’t surprise me if Jian has an epic blow up in one of the last episodes followed by DK grandly revealing that he’s permanently severed ties with Haesung to be with her.

 

On 2/26/2018 at 11:38 AM, titania1000 said:

How satisfying was it that Hyuk watched Ji An gets the prize!!!! The completion of the road taken together to bring her physically to her family and mentally to regain her faith in life, her independence, her freedom to define for herself what she wants and the confidence that she has the qualities required to be a designer and so to realize her dream! If it doesn't mean that they're meant to be together, i don't know what else could be necessary...       

 

 

We were both upset when we found out that DK would be bringing her back to her parents place so I’m so glad we got the awards ceremony scene along with Hyuk meeting her parents.

 

On 2/26/2018 at 11:38 AM, titania1000 said:

Not only that, the way the infos was revealed  caught also my attention: when Hyuk praised Jian and said that she was acclaimed by everyone at the wood workshop,  it's Ji Soo who, without reflecting much on it let everyone know that they promised to go together to Arts university, forcing Ji An to take a pensive, maybe embarrassed look, as if everyone would wonder why she did end up with him, since they fit each other so well!       

 

 

The fact that this drama is still keeping close track of details like this is why I cling to a sliver of hope. Why even mention that they were to go to the Arts University together this late in the show? Have you also noticed how many broken/unfulfilled promises Jian has with Hyuk? Feel free to add more but the below are what’s off the top of my head.

Broken/Unfulfilled promises:

-Hyuk’s lamp! He made the carousel! Where’s his lamp?

-To study at the Arts university together

-To let him know what’s going on in her life (after she leaves home to go to the Chois’)

-To stay in touch (after she loses her phone she doesn’t reach out to Hyuk. She later tracks him down at his office to have lunch and of course he forgives her)

-To let him know what’s going on after a week (when they were having lunch near the sea just before the Haesung anniversary)

-Not really a promise but Hyuk asked her to go for a coffee and walk by the sea and she assures him that she’ll go with him next time

 

On 2/26/2018 at 11:38 AM, titania1000 said:

She still refused to break up with Hyuk but the fact that she rejected his offer of help put a a real distance between them: he really didn't like that she treated him like a stranger and tried to tell him what to do. Bonus for us: Ji An seemed very concerned by the fact he was angry!

 

Jisoo is making the same mistakes with Hyuk that led to their first break up. She’s withholding important information that is relevant to their relationship. What is she thinking? How has she not learned anything? It’s only going to be a matter of time before he finds out what Hee told Jisoo. It already infuriates Hyuk that their relationship is marked by a lack of openness. After everything he’s done for her she still doesn’t trust him and is keeping him at a distance. When Jisoo said “we’re just dating” to Hyuk, he must have been very hurt. He’s not the type of man to treat relationships superficially. I do wonder what the fallout is going to be. EP 49-50 might finally kill off Jian-Hyuk for good if Hyuk and Jisoo reconcile and they reaffirm their commitment to one another, this time with a promise from Jisoo for full transparency and honesty.

 

Another huge problem with a Jian-Hyuk ending is that I really can’t see Jian accepting Hyuk, knowing that Jisoo still loves him. Hyuk and Jisoo would have to break up in a permanent way that leaves no lingering feelings or resentments on either side.

 

On 2/26/2018 at 11:38 AM, titania1000 said:

Objectively, if he wins and become the CEO, that would mean that the people concerned (shareholders) trust him to be their leader and he wouldn't be able to quit in favor of his father. 

But i think it can also be easily overlooked once the battle will be won  and his parents reintegrated in their functions.

I can see him returning to  Ji An and to what he left behind: the factory and his secretary/best friend. And we know that sadly both would still take him back happil

 

I can’t quite decide whether the remaining episodes will be a test of DK’s values or a test of Jian’s. I firmly believe that Jian should only accept DK if he permanently severs ties with Haesung. It’s the only way to remain true to the integrity of Jian’s character. Any sort of half measures are unacceptable. DK taking a leave of absence from the Haesung and then going off to play at being president of a small company all the while knowing he could leave immediately for Haesung again would be unacceptable. It would indeed be a repeat of the last few episodes. Anything less than DK appointing professional management (a very plausible idea raised by someone on the main thread) and selling his shares would be unacceptable. If he is to win over Jian he needs to leave his world and join hers. I would be very sad not to get a Jian-Hyuk ending but if Jian-DK is to happen we may as well hope for the best possible way.

 

 Jian has made it very clear in so many episodes that she wants absolutely nothing to do with that world. The writer cannot ruin Jian’s character. It would be beyond horrific if her fate is to be a Chaebol wife who also gets to dabble in a little woodwork, a silly little thing that DK indulges her in. The show will try to treat it as a good ending but I won’t be fooled!

 

If the remaining episodes are to be test of DK’s values, we’ll probably see him struggle and then finally decide to give up Haesung to be with Jian.

 

But if it’s her values that are being tested then I can easily see either a Jian-Hyuk ending (the best one!) or a Jian alone ending (not the best but acceptable). What may happen is that DK will attempt to convince her to marry him now that he’s in sole control of Haesung. He will tell her that she no longer has anything to fear now that he’s in charge. She won’t be subject to the rule of his mother or grandfather. And as the new head of Haesung he will promise her that things will be different and that he will institute real reforms. He will tell her that their relationship will be based on equality and that he will honor all her needs, especially her love of wood. Jian must refuse. Even assuming that DK is completely sincere when he offers this to Jian, she must refuse because his offer is not one that he can fulfill. We’ve seen in the last few episodes the kinds of pressures an institution like Haesung can exert on the individual. We’ve seen Jaesung attempt to resign his position and break free only to return and reassume his role. We’ve seen DK stand up to his grandfather and refuse the presidency only to completely reverse himself. Haesung will ultimately control DK more than he can control it. I have no doubt that he will make some reforms. He won’t repeat the corruption and tyranny of his grandfather and aunt. His own personal household will be an improvement on his own upbringing. But he will be bound by all kinds of pressures. Pressures from shareholders, clients and customers. Pressures from the other members of elite society. DK will not be able to wall off Jian from all that. She must refuse him.

 

In episode 11, Jian mentions another painter named Egon Schiele. She says that he left his longtime lover for a rich woman. What she doesn’t mention is that Egon Schiele still expected to maintain a relationship with his lover even after he got married. Apparently he wanted to have yearly holidays with her. That ex-lover of course refused him and never saw him again. Jian must refuse him if he still wants to keep Haesung.

 

Random thought - Jian still doesn’t know that DK’s grandfather assaulted her father right? I will continue to believe it was an unintentionally horrible choice to have DK withhold that information and instead ask her to date.

 

On 2/26/2018 at 11:38 AM, titania1000 said:

That's why his cancer is so convenient. 

I can understand that he feels like he has a debt to pay, which won't leave him live or rather die in peace  until he pays it, as the way the chairman treated him proved it, but the fact that his death is used to help to make this couple possible, while this relationship is wrong on so many levels is really bothering me a lot. The old man deserved better... 

 

Poor TS. He’s spending his last days trying to help Jian move forward with her life. I really really hate the whole real cancer-fake cancer-real cancer plot.

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On 02/03/2018 at 5:44 AM, mglthrw8 said:

She’s not willing to confide in him but it’s interesting that she’s actually more honest with him than with Jisoo. Jian at least is willing to admit to Hyuk that she sometimes isn’t fine. But with Jisoo, Jian says that she has no reason to be upset. Even when Jisoo presses her and says that emotions don’t work that way, Jian still insists that she understands why DK did what he did and that she’s fine with it. It seems that even though the sisters are close again, Jian no longer quite trusts her as before. I also wonder if Jian is suppressing anger towards DK. When both Hyuk and Jisoo ask how she feels about DK going back to Haesung, Jian’s face takes on a strange blank look and her words become airy and glib, as if the matter were of no consequence

 

Nice observation! 

I can't express how happy i am to find any details which prove their closeness since the drama is so  not exactly overflowing with affection marks between them.   

 

She's without a doubt angry though she's used to it:  how many times did he let her down?

And he's never going to make up for it obviously because it's always for the same important cause: his family. 

She can't spend her life being a second thought and i think it's time she admits it and just give up on him. 

 

 

On 02/03/2018 at 5:44 AM, mglthrw8 said:

Another huge problem with a Jian-Hyuk ending is that I really can’t see Jian accepting Hyuk, knowing that Jisoo still loves him. Hyuk and Jisoo would have to break up in a permanent way that leaves no lingering feelings or resentments on either side.

 

I would add that Ji Soo must be the one breaking up, to make a romance between Hyuk  and Ji An ok because of the fact she felt inferior to Ji An and she needs to feel like she didn't lose again against her.

And in order for the couple to find its balance, she must  let them be and go abroad for few years, before returning as Choi Eun Seok. 

 

The fact is that writing about this otp at this stage is essentially about finding  ways to keep their stories connected.

I'm looking for clues which would support their relationship because i need to remember they were important and meaningful for each other and not just let it die as if it was never relevant.

 

On 02/03/2018 at 5:44 AM, mglthrw8 said:

I can’t quite decide whether the remaining episodes will be a test of DK’s values or a test of Jian’s.

 

It should be about Ji An if only because it's her story: MGL is supposed to be about how she finds "happiness in a pit of hell".

 

 

On 02/03/2018 at 5:44 AM, mglthrw8 said:

I would be very sad not to get a Jian-Hyuk ending but if Jian-DK is to happen we may as well hope for the best possible way.

 

On 02/03/2018 at 5:44 AM, mglthrw8 said:

Jian has made it very clear in so many episodes that she wants absolutely nothing to do with that world. The writer cannot ruin Jian’s character. It would be beyond horrific if her fate is to be a Chaebol wife who also gets to dabble in a little woodwork, a silly little thing that DK indulges her in. The show will try to treat it as a good ending but I won’t be fooled!

 

I don't think there's  a Ji An- Do Kyung ending that could be satisfying for me, i would stay bitter because i can not relate to this kind of relationship.

His character development was so forced, and nothing seemed earned or natural between them. It was all jump of logic where Ji An went suddenly from" I don't want to see you ever again" to "i like you" and from "i can't date you because we have  nothing in common" to "i date you because i feel sorry for you". 

The writer wasn't even trying, why should i feel comforted by the less horrible option when she purely and simply  dismissed the best option without a logical explanation?

 

On 02/03/2018 at 5:44 AM, mglthrw8 said:

If the remaining episodes are to be test of DK’s values, we’ll probably see him struggle and then finally decide to give up Haesung to be with Jian.

 

It looks sadly this way to me but only the drama can tell....

Ji An doesn't seem to have  been confronted to a crisis, or exposed to the temptation to hold on her feelings for him after dating him or after his return to Haesung, so her values doesn't seem to have been put at test...

 

 

On 02/03/2018 at 5:44 AM, mglthrw8 said:

But if it’s her values that are being tested then I can easily see either a Jian-Hyuk ending (the best one!) or a Jian alone ending (not the best but acceptable). What may happen is that DK will attempt to convince her to marry him now that he’s in sole control of Haesung. He will tell her that she no longer has anything to fear now that he’s in charge. She won’t be subject to the rule of his mother or grandfather. And as the new head of Haesung he will promise her that things will be different and that he will institute real reforms. He will tell her that their relationship will be based on equality and that he will honor all her needs, especially her love of wood. Jian must refuse. Even assuming that DK is completely sincere when he offers this to Jian, she must refuse because his offer is not one that he can fulfill. We’ve seen in the last few episodes the kinds of pressures an institution like Haesung can exert on the individual. We’ve seen Jaesung attempt to resign his position and break free only to return and reassume his role. We’ve seen DK stand up to his grandfather and refuse the presidency only to completely reverse himself. Haesung will ultimately control DK more than he can control it. I have no doubt that he will make some reforms. He won’t repeat the corruption and tyranny of his grandfather and aunt. His own personal household will be an improvement on his own upbringing. But he will be bound by all kinds of pressures. Pressures from shareholders, clients and customers. Pressures from the other members of elite society. DK will not be able to wall off Jian from all that. She must refuse him.

 

This argument is so well written!!! It summarizes very well all the risks that this relationship could create for Ji An and how it will weigh on everything that she tried patiently and carefully to build for herself and with Hyuk's efforts to help her, but goes also beyond their relationship. It embodies perfectly why @meechuttso saw so much parallels with the state of the country.

The parts in bold is essential for me to understand the real dynamics at work in the relationships inside the Choi family.  I really hope the writer won't ignore it and in the worst case if she tries to overlook those issues, that she will at least address/aknowledge them.

 

On 02/03/2018 at 5:44 AM, mglthrw8 said:

In episode 11, Jian mentions another painter named Egon Schiele. She says that he left his longtime lover for a rich woman. What she doesn’t mention is that Egon Schiele still expected to maintain a relationship with his lover even after he got married. Apparently he wanted to have yearly holidays with her. That ex-lover of course refused him and never saw him again. Jian must refuse him if he still wants to keep Haesung.

 

You keep fueling my hope with those examples! But i'm not complaining. In fact i love it, whatever the outcome :lol:

 

I know So Ra is married and ran away from her family, but she's been mentioned few times by the Grandpa and Jae Sung, who seem fond of her. So i can't help but wish that her marriage won't work and that she could come back  with more wisdom and maturity to handle Do Kyung and his family...

 

On 02/03/2018 at 5:44 AM, mglthrw8 said:

 Have you also noticed how many broken/unfulfilled promises Jian has with Hyuk? Feel free to add more but the below are what’s off the top of my head.

Broken/Unfulfilled promises:

-Hyuk’s lamp! He made the carousel! Where’s his lamp?

-To study at the Arts university together

-To let him know what’s going on in her life (after she leaves home to go to the Chois’)

-To stay in touch (after she loses her phone she doesn’t reach out to Hyuk. She later tracks him down at his office to have lunch and of course he forgives her)

-To let him know what’s going on after a week (when they were having lunch near the sea just before the Haesung anniversary)

-Not really a promise but Hyuk asked her to go for a coffee and walk by the sea and she assures him that she’ll go with him next time

 

I noticed it indeed and used to consider it an obstacle to their relationship. He adressed the issue few times and while it looked like her way to tell him to not hold on his feelings for her, to discourage him, this part of their relationship seems to me behind them. 

The fact that she ended up embracing everything that he offered her and that she initially refused when they went for the 1st time at Hee's Café: to pick up their relationship where they left it in high school, to work in a small company, to go back to her dream to work with wood and be a designer made it up for Hyuk, i think.

 

However  to forgive completely her lack of loyalty, i need more:  the most important point is that she must stick to her new path and doesn't become like you said "a Chaebol wife who also gets to dabble in a little woodwork"  

 

      

On 02/03/2018 at 5:44 AM, mglthrw8 said:

Random thought - Jian still doesn’t know that DK’s grandfather assaulted her father right? I will continue to believe it was an unintentionally horrible choice to have DK withhold that information and instead ask her to date.

 

I can't remember exactly the scene and the episode but in my memory Mi-Jung told Ji An.

She knows if only because Ji Soo knows: she told Hyuk on their way to hide that her Grandpa  came to the Seo House and that her adoptive mother tried to step in to stop him to beat Tae Soo. I don't imagine her hiding this fact from Ji An.

 

Add this fact  to the long list of things that make Ji An-Do Kyung impossible for me: Tae Soo has been slapped by the father and the grandfather. How can Ji An  become the wife of the son in those circumstances?

    

When i compare it to the respect showed by Hyuk during ep 48 in their 1st meeting decades after  he left high school where Tae Soo used to be so kind to him, there's no discussion possible.   

 

Quote

 Why even mention that they were to go to the Arts University together this late in the show? 

Quote

Poor TS. He’s spending his last days trying to help Jian move forward with her life. I really really hate the whole real cancer-fake cancer-real cancer plot.

 

I forgot to mention that the two were linked in my mind: Tae Soo really deserve peace and the emphasize put on his meeting with Hyuk makes me believe that the possibility to see Ji An and Hyuk living happily together is a big part of it and the condition of the acceptation of his death for Ji An.   

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Ep 49 was disappointing for us<_<

 

Hyuk was pushed away completely from the subplot related to Ji An's new career path as if he wasn't the one who suggest her to become a designer, offered her the opportunity to show her skills and to succeed by selling her creations. A big disappointment!!:dissapointed:.

In the same way,  he seemed surprised but not really troubled when she announced her early departure! Does he still care about her?:cry:

 

The only consolation for me is  that her father took his place and was 1000% invested in protecting her opportunity to do something for herself, independently, and in separated  way of Do Kyung.      

 

I felt that Hyuk and Ji An's scenes  were really emptied of any substance: not only they were short,  their dialogues were also badly written, they talked as if they were just acquaintances having ramdom conversations. 

 

Jae Sung refusing to come back to Haesung and asking for a divorce is obviously opening a path for Do Kyung to come back to Ji An too.

And based on the spoilers pics posed on insta of the final days of filming, where Do Kyung appeared to have give up the suit for everyday clothes, lt seems almost certain now that he's going back to Ji An. 

 

A long time ago, when we were happy shippers, this happened:

 

 

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Just finished watching episode 50. I’m genuinely stunned by what I just watched. Did my DK as Kokoschka theory just get confirmed by the writer?

 

Halfway through the episode I was in such despair. Hyuk pulled out the love confession note like I had long predicted but only as way to reaffirm his love for Ji Soo! The exact opposite of what I thought was going to happen. It was truly agonizing to watch. He still doesn’t know that Ji An wrote the confession note! Hyuk not knowing and possibly never knowing that Ji An wrote the note is such a cruel and sick joke by the writer.

 

But then the ending! My God the ending! The writer confirmed that we were right all along about DK’s awful character. We weren’t crazy. We weren’t being overly sensitive. We’ve been vindicated! Long live the drama revolution! It took way way way way too long and the writer badly stumbled after episode 26 but she has a chance at salvaging the ending.

 

Ji An’s devastatingly simple question for DK at the end of the episode: What did you do for me?

 

Such a simple question that exposes the selfish nature of DK and his boundary-violating possessive love for Ji An. Now Ji An obviously should never have fallen in love with him in the first place but unfortunately we live in a world where good women loving bad men is not without precedent.

 

To @titania1000  @meechuttso @Ni Wen  and everyone else who kept the faith. WE WERE RIGHT!

 

Unless the writer pulls a truly insane plot twist in the next two episodes and destroys Ji An’s character we’re at least going to get a Ji An alone ending.

 

On 3/3/2018 at 8:47 AM, titania1000 said:
On 3/1/2018 at 11:44 PM, mglthrw8 said:

Random thought - Jian still doesn’t know that DK’s grandfather assaulted her father right? I will continue to believe it was an unintentionally horrible choice to have DK withhold that information and instead ask her to date.

 

I can't remember exactly the scene and the episode but in my memory Mi-Jung told Ji An.

She knows if only because Ji Soo knows: she told Hyuk on their way to hide that her Grandpa  came to the Seo House and that her adoptive mother tried to step in to stop him to beat Tae Soo. I don't imagine her hiding this fact from Ji An.

 

Add this fact  to the long list of things that make Ji An-Do Kyung impossible for me: Tae Soo has been slapped by the father and the grandfather. How can Ji An  become the wife of the son in those circumstances?

 

 

It’s funny that we had lost so much faith in the writer that we barely analyzed the implications of DK’s grandfather assaulting TS, DK finding out about it and then asking Ji An to date instead of informing her. Putting DK’s actions in plain language like that we should have been incredibly horrified. But I guess I’ve been so burnt by the writer that it just registered as faint disgust and a “random thought”.

 

On 3/3/2018 at 8:47 AM, titania1000 said:

I don't think there's  a Ji An- Do Kyung ending that could be satisfying for me, i would stay bitter because i can not relate to this kind of relationship.

His character development was so forced, and nothing seemed earned or natural between them. It was all jump of logic where Ji An went suddenly from" I don't want to see you ever again" to "i like you" and from "i can't date you because we have  nothing in common" to "i date you because i feel sorry for you". 

The writer wasn't even trying, why should i feel comforted by the less horrible option when she purely and simply  dismissed the best option without a logical explanation?

 

Yeah who was I really kidding. I was just desperately trying to reconcile myself to a Jian-DK ending. I was in the bargaining stage of grief. I absolutely would have been very bitter. I will be very bitter if we somehow still get a Jian-DK ending. To the bitter end as I always say.

 

But a Jian-Hyuk ending doesn’t look good. Is there still time for it? Hyuk unfortunately appears to be firmly committed to Ji Soo. Ji An may not end up with DK but she’s never shown any overtly romantic feelings for Hyuk. Hyuk and Ji An have superb chemistry and they’re so completely right for each other but is it just going to end as platonic love? Even though Ji An alone is the second best ending it would still make me very sad if it happens.

 

The early promo pic with Hyuk’s arm around Ji An. All the wonderful Hyuk-Ji An scenes throughout the show, especially Incheon.  The parallels with Baker-Hee and  the fisherman and his wife. Ji An being the true author of Ji soo’s love confession note. SHS’s recent instagram pic. Please be clues! Please writer! I want to believe!

 

Ji An asked DK what he ever did for her after he left Haesung. Now she needs to ask herself, who in her life has actually done things for her? Who are the people in her life that have always risen to the occasion? Clearly it’s Tae soo and Hyuk.

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On 2/19/2018 at 11:13 PM, mglthrw8 said:

If I was more confident that the writer was actually trying to subvert and twist her genre, I would say that the feeling of “fakeness” was intentional; that it was to subtly alert the audience that those relationships were “wrong”. Unfortunately we’ve been burned way too many times. But I want to believe!

 

On 2/19/2018 at 11:13 PM, mglthrw8 said:

The fantasy writer I mentioned before tries something like that in his novels. He introduces a new character more than half-way (thousands of pages) through his series that is presented as extremely important. But it all feels subtly wrong somehow. There’s no build up. The character is completely bland and generic. He’s supposed to be this new hero/savior type but feels assembled out of the laziest fantasy tropes. In fact his backstory is basically a composite of two other main characters that we’ve been following from the beginning of the series. The essay I read argued that it’s all intentional to show that the character is a manufactured fake. There are strong suggestions that this ‘fake’ protagonist is going to soon come into conflict with one of the ‘real’ protagonists. And the real protagonist is going to reclaim her hijacked narrative by destroying this fake protagonist. A hard earned well-executed trope defeating a lazy one!

 

Wow, @mglthrw8 , your crystalline gems of thoughts and ideas introduced here deserve my going back on my goodbye to at least give a 'like', it's so novel but helpful to me. Thank you and @titania1000 for your thoroughly enjoyable exchange here.

 

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2 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

Just finished watching episode 50. I’m genuinely stunned by what I just watched. Did my DK as Kokoschka theory just get confirmed by the writer?

Congrats!

2 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

But then the ending! My God the ending! The writer confirmed that we were right all along about DK’s awful character. We weren’t crazy. We weren’t being overly sensitive. We’ve been vindicated! Long live the drama revolution! It took way way way way too long and the writer badly stumbled after episode 26 but she has a chance at salvaging the ending.

Yes beyond badly stumbled, but she's trying to do something in spite of her failings.

2 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

Ji An’s devastatingly simple question for DK at the end of the episode: What did you do for me?

I feel a gif coming on for the first time in a long long while.

2 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

Such a simple question that exposes the selfish nature of DK and his boundary-violating possessive love for Ji An. Now Ji An obviously should never have fallen in love with him in the first place but unfortunately we live in a world where good women loving bad men is not without precedent.

Well said for the umpteenth time, but can't be said enough no matter how many times repeated.

2 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

  and everyone else who kept the faith. WE WERE RIGHT!

I can't say I kept the faith. I had given up on the writer.

2 hours ago, mglthrw8 said:

Unless the writer pulls a truly insane plot twist in the next two episodes and destroys Ji An’s character we’re at least going to get a Ji An alone ending.

JiAn alone is sufficient for me.

 

I shall take up these points in the main thread where they belong now, but will take some time to compose the thoughts properly.

I encourage you guys more articulate than me to also feel free to express your thoughts there again, even if in short summary.

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