[Current Mainland Chinese Drama 2019] Ming Dynasty 大明風華

[CherishHarmony]

8 hours ago, Pia-mia said:

I think Zhu Di's decree would have had RW killed (she's orphan, smart, well-read, ZJ loves her so she may have undue influence, etc). Please correct me if I misunderstood. I don't think ZJ truly wanted to follow this decree. He's using it as a way to test her. He does want her to be with him in death, but seeing her reluctance, I think he realizes that if he were to command her to do so, he would create discord between them. He held onto her so desperately in life, he must have felt that it wasn't right that he will hold onto her in death as well. Again, I'm heavily biased, but I feel like everything he does, he does with her in mind. That is love. 

 

You bring up some interesting points that would be interesting to discuss and look forward to people's thoughts/opinions... Regarding Ruo Wei's burial with ZZJ, potential motivations:

 

1)  ZZJ did not plan to have her buried with him, but used this as an opportunity to test Ruo Wei to ensure that she would be faithful to the country and its people, and not let her past desires of revenge ruin the country after he passes or her ambitions to take over the throne since the monk predicted she would have half an emperor's life and ZZJ was worried about the future of the country 

 

2) Or, ZZJ was worried that Ruo Wei could potentially have a heavy influence on the throne, or take over, as per the monk's prediction and wanted her to be buried with him so that the predictions would not come to pass

 

3) Or, ZZJ really loved and could not part with her, and so wanted to take her with him

 

Given how young their son is, it surprises me that he would want her to be killed and buried with him rather than have her nurture, groom and care for their son.  I know he is selfish at times and with certain things, but ZZJ has also demonstrated understanding, wisdom, and kindness at times.  He allowed Zhu Qiyu to be raised by his mother in the temple... he only regretted it when Zhu QiZhen was sick and seemed of little hope.

 

What do you all think? 

[insertusernamehere]

So interesting fact: in real history, Ruowei's son was the first emperor to abolish the practice of burial of concubines and servants when an emperor died. I wonder if they would work that fact into the story and whether it would be under Ruowei's influence?

 

Re Zhudi's decree: basically, he said Ruowei was both smart and interested in government, on top of that she was originally the Zhu's family's enemy. If she showed any sign of trying to get power for herself and became a female emperor, she should be killed right away. With regards to Zhanji's wanting to bury her with him, I think it's partly his traditional mindset, partly his desire to keep her with him. It kinda came out of nowhere though because we didn't see this discussion between his mom and his dad when his dad was about to die.

 

Also I don't understand how Ruowei is allowed to read and approve court documents given that Zhanji explicitly told his mom he gave her regency. This drama might have suffered from too much cutting

[Takingthehighroad]

I watched the episode about ZJ's death. He really loved & respected RW; it's obvious by the way he looks at her - with respect & concern. His last glimpse - of his brother sitting on the throne is a glance at his tortured soul. Even thought ZJ said "You don't scare me," the guilt he bears towards his brother, I believe, contributed greatly to his declining health & eventual death. 

 

RW seems somewhat strict w/her son (he is a brat/spoiled from all appearances) while her sister's son seems more reserved & prone to being bullied. RW's biggest mistake will be in allowing her sister to come back. If I can rid myself of memories of ZJ,  I might continue to watch the drama. Notice I said "might" - I'm still reeling from ZJ's exit.

 

 

I feel miserable just reading everyone's posts. I'm not one for cutesy dramas so I continue to find myself watching serious dramas that are amazing at first then...I'm going to have to classify this one as another Royal NIrvana - depressing. 

[Le_Amarant]

I am annoyed that ZJ feels so much guilt towards his uncles death. All of them did an unbreakable vow, and his uncles were the first to break it by scheming to have the grandfather and father murdered. The guilt and PTSD is a forced plotline, and one of the reasons I have difficulty watching ZJ's character in the end.

 

I also cant stand the drama turning RWs son into an idiot. Drama for the sake of drama.

 

RW falls into the classic cdrama heroine trap of being forgiving and lenient to a fault. That's a character flaw. One of the reasons Yanxi Palace was so popular was because it's female lead didn't put up with crap. 

[sssf]

5 hours ago, Pia-mia said:

I think Zhu Di's decree would have had RW killed (she's orphan, smart, well-read, ZJ loves her so she may have undue influence, etc). Please correct me if I misunderstood. I don't think ZJ truly wanted to follow this decree. He's using it as a way to test her. He does want her to be with him in death, but seeing her reluctance, I think he realizes that if he were to command her to do so, he would create discord between them. He held onto her so desperately in life, he must have felt that it wasn't right that he will hold onto her in death as well. Again, I'm heavily biased, but I feel like everything he does, he does with her in mind. That is love. 

Thank you for clarifying. I think ZJ’s love for RW was way more obvious and loving prior to them getting married (understand how the war and his position might have changed him). I can’t really see how he held on to her so desperately and I was hoping to see more after he got ride of XB and the uncles.  However, I can see more of how RW’s love for him has grown ...

 

The scene when he went to say goodbye before he went back to the battlefield after his grandfather passed away, he hugged her and she hugged him back but he drew away abruptly ... 

 

The scene when he went onto her bed, ZJ was sleeping on the edge of the bed (perhaps he didn’t want to wake her or he was disturbed of the prior news) and how RW tried to hugged him but he didn’t react. 
 

The scene when he went to his last battle. They said something and he abruptly left (given she said something to him that made him angry)... 

 

When he came back from the battle, he went to see XB’s baby but didn’t go to RW. She brought the baby to come to see him... 

 

The only loving scene I saw was when he found out she was pregnant and how he said he wanted to watch her sleep. 
 

And sadly I didn’t see many other warm loving scenes from ZJ to RW. 
 

Correct me if I am wrong. Perhaps I missed something 

 

 

[Le_Amarant]

31 minutes ago, sssf said:

When he came back from the battle, he went to see XB’s baby but didn’t go to RW. She brought the baby to come to see him... 

 

You're missing the nuances of the scene. ZJ reacted very differently to XB's baby versus RW's. The official clip released by Youku called out his difference in attitudes. He didn't touch XB's baby and referred to the child as 朕’s son (how Emperor's refer to themselves in third person) and was all over RW's child and referred to the kid as "my son". He also put RW's son on the table and said that the child looked like an Emperor (alluding to the fact that he may already be considering that kid as heir), which alarmed RW and that's why she knelt and tried to play off ZJ's comment.

[insertusernamehere]

@sssf I interpreted the baby scene the same way @Le_Amarant said above. The reason why Ruowei had to come over was unclear, but I suspect it's to set up the next scene: Third Uncle came in to report on Hanwang and the queen. Third Uncle would have no business visiting Ruowei's palace so late at night (even if the king was there). The point of this scene was so that RW can see the look on Zhanji's face after the news and became anxious/suspicious when later he told her not to come over to the Queen's palace for baby month-old celebration wine. And if he visited the queen after Ruowei we wouldn't get the dramatic sequence of Zhanji cornering her alone. It could have been done better but they tried to convey the difference in affection through words and attitude, and it was clear that ZJ was much more loving when he saw RW and her son.

 

As for the scene when he said goodbye before going to the battlefield loool it was a weird acting choice but I saw Zhu Yawen on Happy Camp acting out a short scene that's similar ("saying goodbye to your lover before a battle"), he did the same thing of looking wistfully and abruptly turning away. I interpreted that as him trying to steel himself and being determined to leave despite his linger emotions.

 

The scene in bed, he literally said "I don't want to trouble you with court matters" and she comforted him. I think he didn't say anything because he was tired and like he said, didn't wanna trouble her.

 

I haven't watched the scene before he left for the last battle very closely yet, but from what I understand, she was being honest with him by persuading him not to go. He probably wasn't pleased but I think that's what their relationship has been like: she gives him her honest opinion (even if not her honest affection) and he knows he can count on her for that, even if he doesn't always listen to it.

 

Damn I sound like an oppa-apologist lol but besides the lack of relationship development, what they did manage to show us was well done I thought.

[sssf]

@Le_Amarant and @insertusernamehere thank you for clarifying.
 

Oh yes I did notice the difference of how he treated the babies (not touching) to being so excited to carry RW’s baby and proclaiming to be Emperor quality. I just thought it was odd he didn’t rush over to see them but it does make sense with setting up the scene for 3rd uncle. 
 

Did ZJ find out that RW and XB are sisters? 

 

Anyhow I think some of us are having withdrawals of ZJ and RW hence analyzing the scenes they had together hahaha
 

 

[crackaddict]

wow, you guys are so far ahead! i been moping around since Joy of Life ended, so i need some head space before jumping back into Ming Dynasty. too much doom and gloom and especially insufferable characters. 

 

[insertusernamehere]

4 hours ago, sssf said:

@Le_Amarant and @insertusernamehere thank you for clarifying.
 

Oh yes I did notice the difference of how he treated the babies (not touching) to being so excited to carry RW’s baby and proclaiming to be Emperor quality. I just thought it was odd he didn’t rush over to see them but it does make sense with setting up the scene for 3rd uncle. 
 

Did ZJ find out that RW and XB are sisters? 

 

Anyhow I think some of us are having withdrawals of ZJ and RW hence analyzing the scenes they had together hahaha
 

 

XB is Xu Bin, Ruowei's "ex". Shanxiang is the sister (SX). Just wanted to let you know in case other readers get confused (we've been using XB for Xu Bin

[sssf]

2 hours ago, insertusernamehere said:

XB is Xu Bin, Ruowei's "ex". Shanxiang is the sister (SX). Just wanted to let you know in case other readers get confused (we've been using XB for Xu Bin

Cool thanks @insertusernamehere this drama has so many names .. so many similar names too hahaha 

[Takingthehighroad]

The more I think about it the more disappointed I get. There's still the part about the son having to abdicate, being captured & kept hostage by the Mongols & the part about his brother keeping him a  prisoner. The quirky grandmother & twisted sister will be in power - where is RW during this time? The only thing that would keep me going is the final blow to the twisted sister & quirky grandma's  realization that she was wrong about RW all this time.

 

Is everybody still watching? If so, is it still worth the watch?

[insertusernamehere]

16 minutes ago, Takingthehighroad said:

The more I think about it the more disappointed I get. There's still the part about the son having to abdicate, being captured & kept hostage by the Mongols & the part about his brother keeping him a  prisoner. The quirky grandmother & twisted sister will be in power - where is RW during this time? The only thing that would keep me going is the final blow to the twisted sister & quirky grandma's  realization that she was wrong about RW all this time.

 

Is everybody still watching? If so, is it still worth the watch?

It has gotten a bit more light-hearted again. It feels similar to the early days of the show: we're watching a family drama again, with the difficult mother in law, the hard working daughter in law, her troublesome son, and the probably scheming other daughter in law. It's less harem ish because there are court matters involved, and there are only two ladies not really fighting for an emperor but fighting for power. I expect this to also be about the growth of RW's son: from a spoiled brat to a good emperor, and probably cunning too. In history when he was captured he befriended the Mongol leaders lol I suspect that's how he survived the whole ordeal. I'm kinda looking forward to that. 

[roli]

4 hours ago, Takingthehighroad said:

The more I think about it the more disappointed I get. There's still the part about the son having to abdicate, being captured & kept hostage by the Mongols & the part about his brother keeping him a  prisoner. The quirky grandmother & twisted sister will be in power - where is RW during this time? The only thing that would keep me going is the final blow to the twisted sister & quirky grandma's  realization that she was wrong about RW all this time.

 

Is everybody still watching? If so, is it still worth the watch?

I am not watchig it...I am going to wait for the las 2 episodes. By the way is it 60 or 70 episodes. 

[insertusernamehere]

Omg I'm actually excited about Lay's story:

This is a preview of his story. He's gonna go through some stuff! I hope his acting can hold up  but the trajectory of bratty teenage emperor who led the most disastrous military campaign of Ming, got kidnapped, grew up, then led a coup (and looked like he also kinda went crazy) is full of drama! Now that I've set my expectations for no romance (except for some subtle BL undertone between him and an eunuch), I'm content watching this as a family drama.

[sssf]

6 hours ago, Takingthehighroad said:

The more I think about it the more disappointed I get. There's still the part about the son having to abdicate, being captured & kept hostage by the Mongols & the part about his brother keeping him a  prisoner. The quirky grandmother & twisted sister will be in power - where is RW during this time? The only thing that would keep me going is the final blow to the twisted sister & quirky grandma's  realization that she was wrong about RW all this time.

 

Is everybody still watching? If so, is it still worth the watch?

Sadly now I just fast forward the whole episode. I find TW’s acting alittle odd at some of the scenes ... like the eating scene with the generals... sorry maybe I am nitpicking... or perhaps is good acting on her part. I just find her character development has gone from defiant, cute, free spirited
to submissive, constrained, boring

to now old, bland.

 

Sorry maybe this is what the director is aiming for but I feel her character has not been developed very well or perhaps, there has been a lot of editing and we have missed out on the development.

 

[Pia-mia]

I’m still watching the show, and I’m interested in QZ’s (Qi Zhen) story. He’s no ZJ, but that’s ok. It’s probably safe to say that none of the emperors in the show will have a happy life. More blood and guts to come. I like that RW has a more prominent role now. Remember, she never wanted this life in the first place. She tries to endure whatever comes her way. I think the person who breaks her heart the most is her son. There was a preview where she was sick and was dreaming of ZJ. She sounded so miserable, and I felt it when she called out “Huang Shang!” If he was alive to take care of everything the way he usually does, she wouldn’t be suffering the way she is now.

[insertusernamehere]

At least we can watch for Lay's surprising hot beard.

[sssf]

Omg! TW’s speech to the army was epic. I had goosebumps watching that scene. Well done. Epic! 

[Takingthehighroad]

There's nothing to watch so having sworn off this drama I'm lost. I'm depending on this forum to keep me abreast of what's going on now that I'm going through ZJ withdrawal. I've tried some of the new dramas out there but the nothing grabs me as this one did. Please keep posting -