[Mainland Chinese Drama 2018] The Story of Ming Lan 庶女明兰传 / 知否？知否？应是绿肥红瘦

[leeza77]

Well

28 minutes ago, cherubstomato said:

Episode 43: 

Their manor is really huge and beautiful. And why they always show them cleaning the bed sheets. Lol We get it already. 

 

I dont see how ML have trust issues. I really can’t, just because she’s not flat out giving her all to GTY yet? I don’t get it. I believe she trust GTY with her life after all he is her life savior.. You don’t tell anyone your biggest darkest secrets if you don’t trust them? She told GTY things she never told even her granny before they got married... She trust him enough to marry him... She won’t marry just anyone... And granny won’t marry her off to an untrustworthy man... 

I think the real issue is that she is probably still shy in showing too much PDA and she is still warming up to GTY who has a big libido apparently LMAO... Because if she had trust issues she wouldn’t be capable of giving trust to anyone in the first place. But she has few people she trust already. She has friends she trust (Yanran) and family she has good relationship with. When it comes to outsiders, trust is a big thing you can give to someone. It’s not a candy. It takes time to build. She was able to trust the two maids introduced to her by her granny because she trust her granny’s words. She trust Xiaotao because she’s been with her for so long. She trust granny trusted maid because she’s been with granny. In conclusion she doesn’t have trust issues because of X factor. She is just someone who doesn’t give her trust like candy. And once you break that trust it’ll be hard to get back. That’s why when QH broke his promise she lost trust in him. It doesn’t mean she will not trust another man again.

 

ML is very clear headed and a very good at first impressions/judge of character. She is not weak. If she was how can she let go of her first love and move on happily?

She said it to granny herself she doesn’t need to get married she can travel the world and find happiness. In other words she doesn’t need a man to be happy. GTY is asking too much from her right now. He wants her to be foolishly in love or being lovey dovey 24/7 like how he is and don’t care about PDA. GTY knows a thing or two about romance. ML is a novice but she tries hard for him (when she’s wiping the rain off him/helping him get dressed/fighting his relatives etc.) but i think PDA it’s just not her thing... Lol But it’s cute how he acts so spoiled. And want to be spoiled by his wife. You can see the difference with ML and QH wife who got so jealous over the dolls. ML has a lot of self esteem. Thanks to granny for teaching her and raising her. She is not weak/fragile girl. 

Gty himself thought ml didn't trust him fully.. And ml also said she can't rely on gty 100% becoz he might like her now bcoz she is young and they are newly married. So, in this situation, both of them are not wrong.. One to eager for the other to trust him completely unconditionally whilst the other, becoz of past experiences has to tread cautiously, not able at this point to give her trust unconditionally and completely. What they need is time to be opened to each other and gradually trust completely. 

[leeza77]

23 minutes ago, Golden Flower said:

The oldest brother is NOT asking GTY to marry his wife. He was asking if GTY would divorce his fa chi (original main wife) to protect GTY’s own family like his kids, his nanny, Shitou (not the others in Gu family). GTY then assume he was asking to divorce ML and he said he wouldn’t even if he is in deep trouble. He would fight himself to start anew. I think we’re assuming he asked GTY to divorce ML but we need to see the whole conversation to truly understand the brother’s intention. Imo, I think he was trying to explain their father’s predicaments when he divorced the first wife (big Qinniang, the oldest bro’s mom) in order to marry GTY’s mom (Bai Niang). Big Qinniang died from sadness after she was asked for divorce/ separation as she was very sickly.

Spoiler

If that the case, then it sh ok. The big brother then may die peacefully. He got a scare in the middle of the night that make him chose side quickly. Luckily for him he chose our general gu and his trusted military adviser aka his little fox (ha ha.. Gty once called ml as his military advisor giving advice from her tent during the war)

 

[cherubstomato]

^ GTY “thought” but she does...

ML is absolutely right. For anyone actually, you shouldn’t rely on someone 100% just as you can’t rely on yourself 100%. That’s just too much pressure.... We know that man can marry multiple wives while woman can only be devoted to one. ML is clear headed and knows it well... She sees how loving and trustworthy GTY is but she will know later how devoted/loyal he is to her... She can’t predict that so to be that virtuous main wife, she already learning to accept the fact of life that man can have concubines. But that doesn’t mean she doesn’t trust him.

They just both need to find a balance. If GTY is anything of a real man he should have/practice patience and prudence in their marriage.

[leeza77]

16 minutes ago, Jackie1048 said:

I like it when Ming Lan praised Gu Ting Ye that he had defended her so far whereas although Grandmother had said that Dr He was a good man but on the Cao situation he left her to sort that problem by herself.

 

Qi Heng defended Ming Lan love to eat when his parents gossiped that Ming Lan had made a General into an errand boy for exotic food.

Well the general didn't mind and love to pet and and proudly spoiled his wife. And watching the wife eats with such passion and gusto, his sacrifice of his name and glory (be called an errand boy) is nothing. He got satisfaction from being able to satisfy his wife's love for food. Ha ha

[m0us3y]

Spoiler

33 minutes ago, cherubstomato said:

Episode 43: 

Their manor is really huge and beautiful. And why they always show them cleaning the bed sheets. Lol We get it already. 

 

I dont see how ML have trust issues. I really can’t, just because she’s not flat out giving her all to GTY yet? I don’t get it. I believe she trust GTY with her life after all he is her life savior.. You don’t tell anyone your biggest darkest secrets if you don’t trust them? She told GTY things she never told even her granny before they got married... She trust him enough to marry him... She won’t marry just anyone... And granny won’t marry her off to an untrustworthy man... 

I think the real issue is that she is probably still shy in showing too much PDA and she is still warming up to GTY who has a big libido apparently LMAO... Because if she had trust issues she wouldn’t be capable of giving trust to anyone in the first place. But she has few people she trust already. She has friends she trust (Yanran) and family she has good relationship with. When it comes to outsiders, trust is a big thing you can give to someone. It’s not a candy. It takes time to build. She was able to trust the two maids introduced to her by her granny because she trust her granny’s words. She trust Xiaotao because she’s been with her for so long. She trust granny trusted maid because she’s been with granny. In conclusion she doesn’t have trust issues because of X factor. She is just someone who doesn’t give her trust like candy. And once you break that trust it’ll be hard to get back. That’s why when QH broke his promise she lost trust in him. It doesn’t mean she will not trust another man again.

 

ML is very clear headed and a very good at first impressions/judge of character. She is not weak. If she was how can she let go of her first love and move on happily?

She said it to granny herself she doesn’t need to get married she can travel the world and find happiness. In other words she doesn’t need a man to be happy. GTY is asking too much from her right now. He wants her to be foolishly in love or being lovey dovey 24/7 like how he is and don’t care about PDA. GTY knows a thing or two about romance. ML is a novice but she tries hard for him (when she’s wiping the rain off him/helping him get dressed/fighting his relatives etc.) but i think PDA it’s just not her thing... Lol But it’s cute how he acts so spoiled. And want to be spoiled by his wife. You can see the difference with ML and QH wife who got so jealous over the dolls. ML has a lot of self esteem. Thanks to granny for teaching her and raising her. She is not weak/fragile girl. 

 

Well said. I like that school of thought too. 

But ML has told granny that she doesn't want to get to his bad side, makes life difficult.

 

Maybe lack of trust isn't the right word. 

Perhaps more reserved as a person. More of a closed book. Even with all the people around her, no one truly know what she's thinking most of the time. 

She doesn't say much about her plans, not even to the aunty. 

Even granny said once she can no longer know what ML is thinking (with her revenge) until the very end. 

CB knows that she's intelligent but doesn't like to say much.

During the debate, she has her own thoughts and conclusion about the situation, but would not say a word until she was being pushed to. 

She keeps her thoughts very close to her chest. 

It makes her unreadable, and to a very far extent, that made her dangerous. 

Indeed a lil fox with sheep's skin. 

 

Having said that, GTY is already one person that she actually divulge more to.

She spoke to him about the unfairness she felt, the injustice, her admiration of him to be a free person. Not many gets to see that side of her. 

But he wanted more. And she's simply not ready, or not the kind that would show all her cards...

 

[leeza77]

Qh's father and mother are right that

Gty and ml are perfect for each other

and wrong that  it's  Ml's  fortune not to be their daughter in law

[Suzzy San]

3 hours ago, m0us3y said:

I do wonder. 

I actually felt she does love him with her heart.

We see her concern for him. See how happy she is with him. 

We see how she's actually capable of acting like a child, being petulant and all with him...

But her mind wouldn't trust him fully knowing full well that she has everything to lose...

 

Exactly.. It's her mind that's not accepting the fact that she is in love, her heart is already in love with him.. But her rationality is that she can't fully rely on him.. I think it's not that she doesn't trust him she just doesn't want to rely or be dependent on him too much but they way she expresses her inability to rely makes it look like she doesn't trust or love him.. ML is complicated .. 

And truly she was really jealous about all those concubine issue but was trying hard to keep smiling and keep saying 'as long as they are good'. She is just deceiving herself at this point when it's clear to us viewers that she is jealous, it's not clear to the characters 

[dito]

6 hours ago, matrim said:

Firstly, by getting SH's daughters a good education I mean when they were taught for several years by Mr. Zhuang, a famous scholar along with their brothers, QH and later GTY. What Kong Momo taught them was very important for ladies but it hardly count as a good education in normal sense. As for SH's words, if I remember correctly GTY only said SH loved his honor more than his wife and children, he didn't say he would turn down GTY's proposal flatly. For a civil official, family honor and reputation was vital politically, so it's natural for SH to place honor above family affection, and that's why he got livid when he discovered Molan and RL's love affairs. He even tried to kill RL, hoping in this way to redeem family honor. Once the honor and family reputation got ruined, his career was then finished, so were his family prospects. For SH ignoring ML's marriage, I wouldn't say so. He knew ML was actually brought up by Grandma, so it's up to her to decide ML's marriage. Finally, I didn't say SH was a good father, only a reasonably good father, for he fulfilled his duty as a father reasonably well like I stated before, but failed in treating them fairly and hurt their feelings. And I did mention a prerequisite: judging from the standard at that time. I feel it's not quite right to judge a character in a period drama without considering the historical context. 

 

This is mostly what ML in the book thought about SH..... 

 

ML in the book was from modern times and after spending some time observing, she felt SH was actually not a bad father. He did care for all his children....not equally obviously...and he was also at times biased. But he was also a product of his upbringing. Still, he sincerely wanted all his sons and daughters to have a good life. Like spending time with his children after coming back from his work....looking over his son's lessons and essays from the class. Even the wives he chose for his son's were all sensible and kind women. 
His own wife was uneducated and ignorant in many things thats why he wanted his daughters to learn and become aware of the world outside of the house. While looking for the grooms for his daughters, the first thing he looked for was not the family wealth and titles but if the man was a good and a kind person. So that his daughter may have an easy life with him. 

He never desired something out of his reach and station. And this also made him a good and honest official in the eyes of the world.

Yes he cared a lot for his family honor and his personal honor because his career, his life, his family's life depended on him having a clean and honest reputation. And a man who didn't care about his family name and honor would be despised by world. 

Look at GTY, remember how his life was before he turned himself around. He was a pariah....no family was willing to marry their daughters to him. Even Sheng family advised their daughters to stay away from him. Not to forget SH telling CB to keep his distance from GTY.

So for me, SH may not be the best father or even a good father but he was not a bad one either. He took his responsibilities as a father and as the head of Sheng family seriously and fulfilled them to the best of his abilities. 

[dito]

3 hours ago, shem1 said:

Given ML's track record with the others who have tried to win her heart and her feelings towards her own father... the accumulated pain and disappointment has taken a toll on her fragile being. For the first time, she sees things in GTY that she had so desperately wanted to see in the men that were in her life before marriage. Now that "it's" in her hands and staring her right in the face... it's a miracle she hasn't run away already. 

What episode is this please?

 

I agree.

ML is just too wary of trusting another man so easily. She has only faced pain and loss by putting her trust in the men in her life. She put her trust in her father and lost her mother. She trusted QH and faced heartbreak and ridicule. Now it doesn't matter that she can see GTY's sincerity, her heart will remain on guard until GTY can break through it and convince her. And that is going to take time.

 

about bold....

I think next episode previews showed GTY's brother giving up the title to GTY.  

[fra8]

I don't think it's about PDA. I think  she doesn't trust that he will love her no matter what and that he will keep treating her like this. He sees this and he takes it as lack of love, while it's much more complicated. 

At this point however she is sort of right. She saw the men around her, she knows him but not enough to predict if he gets tired of her and falls for another woman. So she tries to be the right wife, saying and doing the right things in order to make him happy and she tries to keep her distance not to get hurt. It was heartbreaking when she said that showing jealousy was what CL did to her father to get her way. And it explains a lot of her views.

And at this point he says he will wait patiently, because he wasnt' talking about the rain thing clearly.

But he is a man that was never really and openly  loved , so it's clear that after a while it won't be enough for him. And Ml should realize that no matter what at this point even if she keeps her distance she will be hurt anyway if he stops loving her. Also not opening up is the best way to make him distance himself.

[m0us3y]

7 minutes ago, fra8 said:

I don't think it's about PDA. I think  she doesn't trust that he will love her no matter what and that he will keep treating her like this. He sees this and he takes it as lack of love, while it's much more complicated. 

At this point however she is sort of right. She saw the men around her, she knows him but not enough to predict if he gets tired of her and falls for another woman. So she tries to be the right wife, saying and doing the right things in order to make him happy and she tries to keep her distance not to get hurt. It was heartbreaking when she said that showing jealousy was what CL did to her father to get her way. And it explains a lot of her views.

And at this point he says he will wait patiently, because he wasnt' talking about the rain thing clearly.

But he is a man that was never really and openly  loved , so it's clear that after a while it won't be enough for him. And Ml should realize that no matter what at this point even if she keeps her distance she will be hurt anyway if he stops loving her. Also not opening up is the best way to make him distance himself.

It's a bit of a self fullfilling prophecy isn't it?

She keeps herself guarded because she doesn't think he would love and dotes on her forever. After all, which men of such status has no multiple women in their harem during their time? 

But because she guards herself so much, it will eventually drive him away, or creates the rift between them. 

I guess sometimes, we all need to be reminded what it's like to have lost before we gain it back. 

[gleek49]

GTYu (GTYe's brother) only ask GTY if he was willing to divorce his wife, ML, because he was trying to explain their father's situation to his younger brother, you know, try to clear Ye's misunderstanding towards the old Marquis. Its only a question, not a request, the question was in the book actually, I think the whole conversation will go exactly like it did in the book. To me, this part was really touching, because Ye finally understood how his father loved him (he turned out to be his favourite child). I still remembered I was balling every time Ye talked about his father with ML or when I get to read snippet of the old Marquis's letter that he wrote about Ye. It's so sad, I don't know why, but this father-son pair has even more impact on me than ML-grandma pair. At least ML and grandma know that they love each other. 

[fra8]

7 minutes ago, m0us3y said:

It's a bit of a self fullfilling prophecy isn't it?

She keeps herself guarded because she doesn't think he would love and dotes on her forever. After all, which men of such status has no multiple women in their harem during their time? 

But because she guards herself so much, it will eventually drive him away, or creates the rift between them. 

I guess sometimes, we all need to be reminded what it's like to have lost before we gain it back. 

 

I completely agree. But we are in for a bumpy road.

I guess everything might happen around the same time (the rift  between them, his downfall). It's hard to imagine a timeline since they are changing from the novel. 

Spoiler

I guess soon she will get pregnant, then the fire. And his reaction will make her keep her distance even more, fight, downfall, rise and then granny's poison when she expects the second baby.

However I still bet on QH palying a role in both as antagonist.

[leeza77]

2 minutes ago, gleek49 said:

GTYu (GTYe's brother) only ask GTY if he was willing to divorce his wife, ML, because he was trying to explain their father's situation to his younger brother, you know, try to clear Ye's misunderstanding towards the old Marquis. Its only a question, not a request, the question was in the book actually, I think the whole conversation will go exactly like it did in the book. To me, this part was really touching, because Ye finally understood how his father loved him (he turned out to be his favourite child). I still remembered I was balling every time Ye talked about his father with ML or when I get to read snippet of the old Marquis's letter that he wrote about Ye. It's so sad, I don't know why, but this father-son pair has even more impact on me than ML-grandma pair. At least ML and grandma know that they love each other. 

They lost the chance becoz both of them were too proud to be open toward each other. And the interference of the evil stepmom made the matter worse. Their last interaction where gty open his heart to his father, and his father was coughing blood after hearing his plight. Then, he was prevented to see his father.. Such a devastating moment for gty.. 

7 minutes ago, gleek49 said:

GTYu (GTYe's brother) only ask GTY if he was willing to divorce his wife, ML, because he was trying to explain their father's situation to his younger brother, you know, try to clear Ye's misunderstanding towards the old Marquis. Its only a question, not a request, the question was in the book actually, I think the whole conversation will go exactly like it did in the book. To me, this part was really touching, because Ye finally understood how his father loved him (he turned out to be his favourite child). I still remembered I was balling every time Ye talked about his father with ML or when I get to read snippet of the old Marquis's letter that he wrote about Ye. It's so sad, I don't know why, but this father-son pair has even more impact on me than ML-grandma pair. At least ML and grandma know that they love each other. 

Thank you

[m0us3y]

3 minutes ago, fra8 said:

 

I completely agree. But we are in for a bumpy road.

I guess everything might happen around the same time (the rift  between them, his downfall). It's hard to imagine a timeline since they are changing from the novel. 

  Hide contents

I guess soon she will get pregnant, then the fire. And his reaction will make her keep her distance even more, fight, downfall, rise and then granny's poison when she expects the second baby.

However I still bet on QH palying a role in both as antagonist.

If the ending theme painting is of any indication, the part where ML hit the gong and tried to save GTY is a bit later...

So, during her pregnancy theres fire, and also an assassination? 

Because in the trailer, there was a scene where ML seem to have a complete meltdown and trying to shield something, with someone trying to stab them or something? 

[leeza77]

5 minutes ago, m0us3y said:

If the ending theme painting is of any indication, the part where ML hit the gong and tried to save GTY is a bit later...

So, during her pregnancy theres fire, and also an assassination? 

Because in the trailer, there was a scene where ML seem to have a complete meltdown and trying to shield something, with someone trying to stab them or something? 

Ml just giving birth at that time.. Seem like a crazy woman try to stab the baby and ml try to protect her son with her body. 

[Jackie1048]

Just loved Ming Lan's counter attack on the Empress Dowager's suggestion to take on her palace maids as concubines.

 

Ming Lan told her that Gu Ting Ye had ordered her to match make his bachelor soldiers with their housemaid so the palace maids will come in as handy candidates.

 

A little tick off at first the Dowager but gave in to the idea hence Ming Lan is to take them all back and find spouses for them.

 

I guess what won the argument is the chances would be the palace maids had a chance to be principal wives instead of being a concubine.

[leeza77]

6 minutes ago, Jackie1048 said:

Just loved Ming Lan's counter attack on the Empress Dowager's suggestion to take on her palace maids as concubines.

 

Ming Lan told her that Gu Ting Ye had ordered her to match make his bachelor soldiers with their housemaid so the palace maids will come in as handy candidates.

 

A little tick off at first the Dowager but gave in to the idea hence Ming Lan is to take them all back and find spouses for them.

Ha ha.. Very clever

[m0us3y]

16 minutes ago, leeza77 said:

Ml just giving birth at that time.. Seem like a crazy woman try to stab the baby and ml try to protect her son with her body. 

And the fire was right after the child birth?? That's extreme! 

[leeza77]

3 minutes ago, m0us3y said:

And the fire was right after the child birth?? That's extreme! 

Spoiler

In the novel the fire happened during the birth of ml 2nd child.. In the drama i think there will be changes.. Bcoz it seems ml gives order to her guards to defend the house during the fire. She didn't seem to be pregnant at that time