[Mainland Chinese Drama 2018] The Story of Ming Lan 庶女明兰传 / 知否？知否？应是绿肥红瘦

[lxands]

13 hours ago, darkphoenix123 said:

2nd & 3rd misses are Shulan & her sister from the home town. 1st brother is the cousin brother in the home town

 

It was posted in some of the earlier pages that it is grandchildren who are addressed like that & not the children

Actually tho they werebrefered as cousin ML with her siblings & Pinglan with her siblings are 2 cousins. Their fathers are cousin, their grandfathers are brothers...therefore tho they are related they are not from the same immediate family. Pinglan has 2 other siblings, her eldest brother whom they refered to this Sheng side of family as 1st brother/big brother or Da ge, 2nd sister, Er Gu Niang & the youngest sister Pinglan whom they refered to as 3rd sister, san (3) since she was the 3rd child of her father. I can see why many got confused and jumble up the family because their 2 family siblings numbering seem to match each other. In eastern culture its common to use this kind of numbering for siblings in one family especially if there are many siblings in the family. And for this Sheng, tho they referred as cousin, they are already distance cousin, especially when they dont live together.

[cherubstomato]

I don’t think he was in love with ML yet but he knew she would be the best wife for him.... Just as I don’t think ML is in love with him either even when she agreed to his proposal. They both are making marriage transactions that will benefit them both plain and simple. So the way he went about it wasn’t how one should do it when they like someone. He would’ve been like QH when he was pursuing ML before marriage talk. To elaborate, he never said anything like I love you with all my heart I’ll sacrifice a lot for your love and what not like QH. The way he persuaded ML was to appease all worries she have. That’s why he asked why she don’t want to marry him not why she doesn’t love him.

CB said he knows his sister ML well yet his dad was able to decipher ML is who GTY wanted to marry. CB tells his father he knows GTY well yet he doesn’t know which sister he really needs in his life. After all GTY has always told him everything that he plans even with his prior marriage proposal. Like I said, they made CB completely oblivious just for the sake of the plot and show how GTY will do whatever means to get ML.

 

He did ask which sister it was, if those reason are valid then what’s the point of asking when he knows the only option there was is RL. It was because GTY didn’t say a name and CB didn’t ask for a name so he made the judgement himself. Everything else just seemed to fall right into place like how GTY said thank heavens a Cao cousin popped up and thanks heaven a Wen lover popped up. That’s why ML said it could’ve been a whole mess if his planned didn’t work. I just don’t believe how GTY scheme went effortlessly and CB being oblivious but like I said sometimes I’ll just enjoy the show whatever the plot I don’t understand so I don’t get a headache.

 

I believe the only thing shocking to ML was GTY choosing RL over her. Not the other way around.

[m0us3y]

6 minutes ago, sava2sava said:

@m0us3y  Exactly GTy is direct and to the point.. He's not like ML who seems to be the elborate liar that she is look at how many time she lied to QH..

 

GTY had plenrty of women knocking at his door none peak his interest until ML told him to put Ronger some place to be raised the right way not out on the battled fields.. GTY knew right then that was the women to marry she spoke of his child first before him.. Thst's when he made up his mind I want her.. In GTY mind at that time I'll do whatever it takes to have her. No woman has ever put my childs intrest first before me, Not eben her own mother.. 

Lol. Although I'd say ML's lies to GTY is on a realist basis. 

 

Lol. Well, not even himself! He saw Rong'er was happy the way they were, until ML reminded him that he shouldn't judge a lifetime's happiness based on that moment alone. 

When he was down and out, ML and CB were both there. Cooked him porridge, gave him advice. While others were busy chastising him. 

[cherubstomato]

I want to add that before GTY showed his interest to marry into CB household, the thing with Dr He cousin had already passed and the marriage transaction was not looking so good anymore unlike RL marriage prospects. So there really was two options for CB to choose based on which sisters he have that isn’t married yet. I liked to believe that he never had prejudice view with his sisters as he treated them all equally. So that didn’t convince me either as a reason he would think it is RL. The only plausible reasoning I would think is possibly if he compared the characters of Yanran to his sisters RL and ML. RL would be the most submissive one. Based on the fact that GTY was looking for someone as a main wife that would allow/willingly/submissively let MN to enter the household. But that is not an issue now so based on his current life he would still think GTY needs another Yanran in his life? 

I know a lot likes CB character but I’m just dumbfounded he would be made so clueless. GTY scheme wasn’t even that grand. Except for bringing that Cao family back. So what if RL didn’t have a lover. What would he do then. Tell the emperor it’s the sixth daughter of sheng family he wants to marry. Then Big Madam can’t refute?

[leeza77]

2 minutes ago, cherubstomato said:

I want to add that before GTY showed his interest to marry into CB household, the thing with Dr He cousin had already passed and the marriage transaction was not looking so good anymore unlike RL marriage prospects. So there really was two options for CB to choose based on which sisters he have that isn’t married yet. I liked to believe that he never had prejudice view with his sisters as he treated them all equally. So that didn’t convince me either as a reason he would think it is RL. The only plausible reasoning I would think is possibly if he compared the characters of Yanran to his sisters RL and ML. RL would be the most submissive one. Based on the fact that GTY was looking for someone as a main wife that would allow/willingly/submissively let MN to enter the household. But that is not an issue now so based on his current life he would still think GTY needs another Yanran in his life? 

I know a lot likes CB character but I’m just dumbfounded he would be made so clueless. GTY scheme wasn’t even that grand. Except for bringing that Cao family back. So what if RL didn’t have a lover. What would he do than. Tell the emperor it’s the sixth daughter of sheng family he wants to marry. Then Big Madam can’t refute?

So, just conclude that cb was a blockheaded and dizzy. Previous cb encounters with gty show that sometimes he was clumsy and a dork. Gty predict that he can easily make the mistake and gty was  friend with him for more than 20 years. 

[cherubstomato]

Hah. This is a forum we can have elaborate debate after all. I only reply to what I’m interested in not for the sake of arguing. I won’t just conclude it like that because I don’t think CB is a blockhead at all.... 

I guess this is part of the drama where I’m disappointed in, as I would’ve hoped a clearer method from GTY for ML rather then the same replay scheme.... 

2 minutes ago, leeza77 said:

So, just conclude that cb was a blockheaded and dizzy. Previous cb encounters with gty show that sometimes he was clumsy and a dork. Gty predict that he can easily make the mistake and gty was  friend with him for more than 20 years. 

 

[mooose]

17 minutes ago, cherubstomato said:

The only plausible reasoning I would think is possibly if he compared the characters of Yanran to his sisters RL and ML. RL would be the most submissive one. Based on the fact that GTY was looking for someone as a main wife that would allow/willingly/submissively let MN to enter the household. 

 

Kkkkk. This is reaching a bit!

RL has a temper and can be quite schrewish like her mother!

 

Based on appearances, the drama makes it quite clear that ML is the docile and 'submissive' one. Lots of references toML being the well-behaved daughter.

 

CB doesn't know ML's 'other side'. Thought she was too gentle and kind-hearted with her maids. Lol

[leeza77]

Twins??? 

• 

[cherubstomato]

6 minutes ago, mooose said:

 

Kkkkk. This is reaching a bit!

RL has a temper and can be quite schrewish like her mother!

 

Based on appearances, the drama makes it quite clear that ML is the docile and 'submissive' one. Lots of references toML being the well-behaved daughter.

 

CB doesn't know ML's 'other side'. Thought she was too gentle and kind-hearted with her maids. Lol

They both play docile and submissive in public. 

 

 In episode 39 he warned GTY that he sees through ML really well and she is not the docile submissive type he might think she is. But little does he know GTY is not after that type anymore since MN is out of the picture.

[leeza77]

5 minutes ago, mooose said:

 

Kkkkk. This is reaching a bit!

RL has a temper and can be quite schrewish like her mother!

 

Based on appearances, the drama makes it quite clear that ML is the docile and 'submissive' one. Lots of references toML being the well-behaved daughter.

 

CB doesn't know ML's 'other side'. Thought she was too gentle and kind-hearted with her maids. Lol

We can see through cb's, he acted clumsily. Example he felt in front of gty house and again when he saw rulan and the sweetheart, he just didn't kn9w what to do.. Aiya aiya

He just can't handle conflict and excitement. He is  a scholar but nit necessarily a very deep person in thinking. And he might inherit the brain of the father but the perception of the mother. 

[fancia]

20 minutes ago, cherubstomato said:

Hah. This is a forum we can have elaborate debate after all. I only reply to what I’m interested in not for the sake of arguing. I won’t just conclude it like that because I don’t think CB is a blockhead at all.... 

I guess this is part of the drama where I’m disappointed in, as I would’ve hoped a clearer method from GTY for ML rather then the same replay scheme.... 

 

I think GTY said it directly to CB that it's RL who he wanted to marry; it's just not shown/cut in the drama and showed directly to CB talk about GTY wanted to marry RL to his parents. Since it's just wasting time to show it twice, repetitive and it's to keep the suspense on who he wanted to marry so the shock effect is much more real and funny to watch. 

[dito]

Basically it's the fault in the writing thats causing confusion and questions about CB's intelligence and knowledge of his sisters.

If they had stuck to the novel in this instance then this confusion wouldn't be happening. In the novel GTY sent the proposal through Hualan's husband and there was no question in their minds that it was RL he was asking for. But they can't do that in the drama since CB and GTY are such good friends.

The writers also added to the confusion by having various characters ask to confirm which sister GTY was asking for. Obviously since 4th daughter Molan got married so the next to marry would be RL, the 5th daughter.

Another thing,  the family may already know Granny's intentions regarding HHW and ML....but they may not know that the situation had changed because of the Cao cousin....so for them ML won't be in contention.  Therefore there was no need to have them question who GTY was asking for.

[m0us3y]

Spoiler

50 minutes ago, cherubstomato said:

I don’t think he was in love with ML yet but he knew she would be the best wife for him.... Just as I don’t think ML is in love with him either even when she agreed to his proposal. They both are making marriage transactions that will benefit them both plain and simple. So the way he went about it wasn’t how one should do it when they like someone. He would’ve been like QH when he was pursuing ML before marriage talk. To elaborate, he never said anything like I love you with all my heart I’ll sacrifice a lot for your love and what not like QH. The way he persuaded ML was to appease all worries she have. That’s why he asked why she don’t want to marry him not why she doesn’t love him.

CB said he knows his sister ML well yet his dad was able to decipher ML is who GTY wanted to marry. CB tells his father he knows GTY well yet he doesn’t know which sister he really needs in his life. After all GTY has always told him everything that he plans even with his prior marriage proposal. Like I said, they made CB completely oblivious just for the sake of the plot and show how GTY will do whatever means to get ML.

 

He did ask which sister it was, if those reason are valid then what’s the point of asking when he knows the only option there was is RL. It was because GTY didn’t say a name and CB didn’t ask for a name so he made the judgement himself. Everything else just seemed to fall right into place like how GTY said thank heavens a Cao cousin popped up and thanks heaven a Wen lover popped up. That’s why ML said it could’ve been a whole mess if his planned didn’t work. I just don’t believe how GTY scheme went effortlessly and CB being oblivious but like I said sometimes I’ll just enjoy the show whatever the plot I don’t understand so I don’t get a headache.

 

I believe the only thing shocking to ML was GTY choosing RL over her. Not the other way around.

 

I don't know. I think they do love each other. Just a very different kind of love than what QH/ML.

 

QH was in a way, ML's ideal/ dream. Good looking, honorable, kind. Every girl's dream. Butterflies in the stomach, unicorns and rainbows. All consuming (on QH's side anyway).

Until we realised there's no such perfect person in such imperfect world. 

 

As we mature, we look for practical love. Marriage love. 

For characteristics that we would like. And bad traits we are willing to tolerate. 

 

And that's what GTY and ML was looking for...

A person that he/she could trust, someone that could have his/her back, someone he/she could rely on. 

And in return, someone they would protect till the very end.

And that's what GTY understood about ML. It's not about love..hence he sees Dr.He as more a threat than QH. Despite probably knowing that ML does love QH more than she does Dr. He. 

So to win ML over, it's never about who she loves. But the hurdles those marriage could pose for her. 

For both GTY and ML understand, that while love is good, it's not the major consideration. 

Hence asking why doesn't she want to marry him is a lot more practical than asking why doesn't she love him. Because she could love him, but couldn't see a future with him, for various reasons. 

This is a more mature love. Slow, steady and lasting. 

It's never about sacrifices one is willing to make for the other, but compromises. 

 

To go down QH's path to declare his love could end up just hurting her, if his plan fails at any point. As we can all see, heaven and luck was on his side for it to happen the way he planned for it. 

 

 

[cherubstomato]

23 minutes ago, dito said:

Basically it's the fault in the writing thats causing confusion and questions about CB's intelligence and knowledge of his sisters.

If they had stuck to the novel in this instance then this confusion wouldn't be happening. In the novel GTY sent the proposal through Hualan's husband and there was no question in their minds that it was RL he was asking for. But they can't do that in the drama since CB and GTY are such good friends.

The writers also added to the confusion by having various characters ask to confirm which sister GTY was asking for. Obviously since 4th daughter Molan got married so the next to marry would be RL, the 5th daughter.

Another thing,  the family may already know Granny's intentions regarding HHW and ML....but they may not know that the situation had changed because of the Cao cousin....so for them ML won't be in contention.  Therefore there was no need to have them question who GTY was asking for.

That would’ve made more sense for me. In that way he would’ve not schemed his best friend who would’ve seen through him. CB would be an outsider in the situation and GTY nanny would be the one to see RL and her lover. That would make GTY scheme more diliberate rather than the heavens bestowing him such good luck and timing. 

[cherubstomato]

11 minutes ago, m0us3y said:

  Reveal hidden contents

 

I don't know. I think they do love each other. Just a very different kind of love than what QH/ML.

 

QH was in a way, ML's ideal/ dream. Good looking, honorable, kind. Every girl's dream. Butterflies in the stomach, unicorns and rainbows. All consuming (on QH's side anyway).

Until we realised there's no such perfect person in such imperfect world. 

 

As we mature, we look for practical love. Marriage love. 

For characteristics that we would like. And bad traits we are willing to tolerate. 

 

And that's what GTY and ML was looking for...

A person that he/she could trust, someone that could have his/her back, someone he/she could rely on. 

And in return, someone they would protect till the very end.

And that's what GTY understood about ML. It's not about love..hence he sees Dr.He as more a threat than QH. Despite probably knowing that ML does love QH more than she does Dr. He. 

So to win ML over, it's never about who she loves. But the hurdles those marriage could pose for her. 

For both GTY and ML understand, that while love is good, it's not the major consideration. 

Hence asking why doesn't she want to marry him is a lot more practical than asking why doesn't she love him. Because she could love him, but couldn't see a future with him, for various reasons. 

This is a more mature love. Slow, steady and lasting. 

It's never about sacrifices one is willing to make for the other, but compromises. 

 

To go down QH's path to declare his love could end up just hurting her, if his plan fails at any point. As we can all see, heaven and luck was on his side for it to happen the way he planned for it. 

 

 

Well said. 

I think that they both see in each other the potential of a harmonious marriage/relationship and for ML, I believe she still have some lingering feelings for QH. However she sees in GTY as a man she can potentially fall in love with. After all most arrange marriage is not in the name of Love. Because love is not enough. 

[leeza77]

6 minutes ago, cherubstomato said:

Well said. 

I think that they both see in each other the potential of a harmonious marriage/relationship and for ML, I believe she still have some lingering feelings for QH. However she sees in GTY as a man she can potentially fall in love with. After all most arrange marriage is not in the name of Love. Because love is not enough. 

Well at the polo games gty told ml, i'm very happy. I'm never feel happy for several years. Ml replied i'm happy too. 

[Jackie1048]

Gu Ting Ye explained that the whole elaborate scheme is becauss the one who has the big say in Ming Lan's marriage is her Grandmother. Gu Ting Ye said she is indeed one formidable woman. If he cannot get through her then his request for Ming Lan's hand is a total loss.

 

He knew from Chang Bai all the characteristic of the whole Sheng family. He knew from Chang Bai because of the mourning period for the late Emperor no one is allowed to arrange any marriages so Ming Lan and Doctor He has not set a formal proposal yet.

 

But he was called to war when it was okay and start to worry that preparation might proceed and then the news of the Cao cousin was a blessing in disguise to get the He family into some distraction while he tried to finish up winning the war.

 

No wonder Gu Ting Ye said marrying Ming Lan he need to bring in the Art of War.

[leeza77]

Not too tired to fight

Spoiler

http://p.weibo.com/show/channerWbH5/1034:4330499078873307

 

[Lunkera]

Finally we are back to 2 episodes a day for 5 days  . Friday and Saturday are hard...

[fra8]

1 hour ago, cherubstomato said:

Well said. 

I think that they both see in each other the potential of a harmonious marriage/relationship and for ML, I believe she still have some lingering feelings for QH. However she sees in GTY as a man she can potentially fall in love with. After all most arrange marriage is not in the name of Love. Because love is not enough. 

I think that love is not a single emotion . It is based on many feelings: respect, admiration, passion, understanding, reliability.  And it happens that in different stages of your life you value these feelings in different ways.

gty offers ml what she values most in that moment after years of hiding herself and the disappointment of qh. So I think there is love or a strong foundation for love. What imo lacks is that they realize they are in love. They likely don’t care about love or they are afraid of the weakness that love implies.And the realization might happen in different stages hence the drama.