Quantcast
Jump to content
sugarplum892

[Mainland Chinese Drama 2018] The Rise of Phoenixes 凰权·弈天下

Recommended Posts

On 2/15/2019 at 6:53 PM, skibbies said:

Sex is rarely shown on Chinese TV. I think it was implied in that scene since they seem sort of content after passage of time shot. But it's debateable.

LAs for Helian Zheng, she volunteered to lead the army for him partially to avoid consummating their marriage, I'm pretty sure (The Queen tried to pressure her for babies before she got married and she looked pretty uncomfortable.) There wasn't enough time (or room in her heart) for their relationship to grow, and Helian Zheng didn't want to pressure her. Until she tried to leave, at which point he was just angry and frustrated and trying to get her to stay.

 

Unlikely, because the story looks pretty done, and the team don't seem the type to milk the story. Unless it's just a vastly different one, but it didn't do well commercially so uh. The OTP could potentially work together in a different project since they seems to get along really well. 

I agree that the bedroom scene could have been edited better and I'm  sure some great stuff ended up on the cutting room floor. Yes they doooo seem content (satisfied?) And there are a few other romantic cues that led me to believe they made love. Body language: First: the very comfortable and intimate physical closeness. Second: Ning Yi  has his neck back in an exposed and vulnerable  position which, in the romance world, indicates complete trust, willing submission, etc. Third: their lovemaking would or could setup the arc to provide the conflict and resolution of Ning Yi's overarching thematic question posed by GuYan, " between the empire and an infant who would you choose?"

 

 

On the subject of Helian Zheng,  it was made crystal clear to him that their relationship would be platonic, FengZhiwei is in love with NY and that's  it. HZ becomes a pawn for FW's brother and fuled by his own male ego loses his life. Sad 

 

 

My thoughts as far as a second season,

Netflix would be smart to get that set up ASAP since there seems to be a rising tide of interest in Cdrama in NA, people want more and RotP  is the top of the crop as a vehicle that is able to " crossover" to western audiences. 

A second season would have to center around the overarching theme of uniting the empire.

Second, resolve NingYi 's personal conflict stated early on, "who are you?" "Between the empire and an infant, who would you choose?" Actually since  FengZhiwei  has a similar conflict due to (jmo) she is pregnant with NY's child, but must assume her role as empress

Secondary  storylines that should be completed: GuNanyi  and GuYan connection.  The outcome of Headmaster Xin Ziyan's dilemma.  The outcome of NingQi's treachery. The education of the youngest prince and of course the death of the Emperor Daddy. I think there are loads  of other unresolved issues that could fuel a second season.  Assembling the remaining cast would be tough but if I were Netflix I would be working hard on the logistics and the negotiations, cracking the whip on the writers  to get a storyline and more hammered out.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 hours ago, KS Willis said:

Netflix would be smart to get that set up ASAP since there seems to be a rising tide of interest in Cdrama in NA, people want more and RotP  is the top of the crop as a vehicle that is able to " crossover" to western audiences. 

I wish Netflix would come up with Netflix exclusive tier or something. Because unlike what its Netflix Original title implied, afaik, netflix had no place in producing the drama, at all. It licensed for worldwide exclusive release and subtitled it, that's it. It's not out of realm of possibility for it to actually invest and produce a sequel, like it funds some anime projects at the moment. The thing is, I don't think the cdrama market is as big as its anime market, it's also incredibly new to the market considering it started licensing cdrama in...last 2 years? and its catalogue is still around 20 or so, which is way below its kdrama selection.

 

Netflix also has zero presence in China, which would be cdrama's biggest market, and it seems little silly for Netflix to invest in a drama and lose out on 80% of the market. Its original anime only works because they are anime specifically targeted towards the international audience, all of them have been scifi and mature, without fanservice (and netflix is actually available in Japan). As someone who's a fan of scifi anime that like a lot of the concepts of these anime, most of them have been mediocre in executions. There's only been one that created lot of buzz and well received, and it's from a very well known director with distinctive style adapting from a manga by a legendary mangaka. So I'm just not optimistic.

 

The big investor is Croton Media (yknow, the one that uploaded all the bts and documentary) which have produced lots of other cdramas, of varying quality. There's four other production companies involved but I only know Chen Kun (and his best friend Zhou Xun)'s K. Pictures. Various supporting characters are tied to K. Pictures, but neither the directors nor the writers are tied to any production companies.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/19/2019 at 5:12 PM, skibbies said:

I wish Netflix would come up with Netflix exclusive tier or something. Because unlike what its Netflix Original title implied, afaik, netflix had no place in producing the drama, at all. It licensed for worldwide exclusive release and subtitled it, that's it. It's not out of realm of possibility for it to actually invest and produce a sequel, like it funds some anime projects at the moment. The thing is, I don't think the cdrama market is as big as its anime market, it's also incredibly new to the market considering it started licensing cdrama in...last 2 years? and its catalogue is still around 20 or so, which is way below its kdrama selection.

 

Netflix also has zero presence in China, which would be cdrama's biggest market, and it seems little silly for Netflix to invest in a drama and lose out on 80% of the market. Its original anime only works because they are anime specifically targeted towards the international audience, all of them have been scifi and mature, without fanservice (and netflix is actually available in Japan). As someone who's a fan of scifi anime that like a lot of the concepts of these anime, most of them have been mediocre in executions. There's only been one that created lot of buzz and well received, and it's from a very well known director with distinctive style adapting from a manga by a legendary mangaka. So I'm just not optimistic.

 

The big investor is Croton Media (yknow, the one that uploaded all the bts and documentary) which have produced lots of other cdramas, of varying quality. There's four other production companies involved but I only know Chen Kun (and his best friend Zhou Xun)'s K. Pictures. Various supporting characters are tied to K. Pictures, but neither the directors nor the writers are tied to any production companies.

 

 

Thank you very much for enlightening me, I had assumed Netflix was a big player in production, bad me.

I had a chance to binge Croton's Eternal Love, and JMO although nicely done will never become the crossover vehicle for the NA market that Croton is seeking for many reasons, especially the acting, the dubbing, sound quality, the depth of fantasy, I found it difficult to suspend reality and fall into the story. That surprised me since I'm a longstanding fantasy  adventure fan, getting ready to say goodby to GoTs and not soon enough,lol. I'm  motivated to send a pro RotP comment to Croton Media  and hope enough people do the same. 

 

Back to RotP.  The Emperor  tells NingYi  that if his name is in the golden box he will be attacked,  NingYi  responds that he will also become a weapon to be used. Was this what his father had planned  all along?  NingYi  is crushed.  Later when NingYi  asks XinZiyan

" what am I  to you?", he answers "one hundred birds are not as good as one osprey." I found this equal in cruelty to the Emperor 's plan for NY and was taken aback by Headmaster. Does anyone else sense that XinZiyan's motivations are not as clear cut and altruistic as he first presents?

 

 

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, KS Willis said:

 

 

Thank you very much for enlightening me, I had assumed Netflix was a big player in production, bad me.

I had a chance to binge Croton's Eternal Love, and JMO although nicely done will never become the crossover vehicle for the NA market that Croton is seeking for many reasons, especially the acting, the dubbing, sound quality, the depth of fantasy, I found it difficult to suspend reality and fall into the story. That surprised me since I'm a longstanding fantasy  adventure fan, getting ready to say goodby to GoTs and not soon enough,lol. I'm  motivated to send a pro RotP comment to Croton Media  and hope enough people do the same. 

 

Back to RotP.  The Emperor  tells NingYi  that if his name is in the golden box he will be attacked,  NingYi  responds that he will also become a weapon to be used. Was this what his father had planned  all along?  NingYi  is crushed.  Later when NingYi  asks XinZiyan

" what am I  to you?", he answers "one hundred birds are not as good as one osprey." I found this equal in cruelty to the Emperor 's plan for NY and was taken aback by Headmaster. Does anyone else sense that XinZiyan's motivations are not as clear cut and altruistic as he first presents?

 

 

 

 

Xin Zyian gave his promise to Ning Yi's brother, to make Ning Yi an Emperor, plus Xin Zyian has his own ambitions too and its quite fitted to be ambitious since he is such a clever man.

We also see him talking to himself on some point (i think in later episodes), where he 's wondering about his own dreams and ambitions.

After all, its a great achievement for a royal councilor to prepare the next emperor. There's a lot of stuff to be completed and side stories left untold and most important, the couple. There's a comment of the scriptwriter which leaves an open door to the ending with the phrase: "Zhiwei's body wasnt found, so we may think that she's not actually dead", which also happened in the original novel. 

So i think there's strong possibility to have a second season.

 

As for the Emperor himself, i think that he always uses Ning Yi to unveil others intentions, or to confront without exposing himself, or to do the "dirty work" instead of him (not that he doesnt love him-on the contrary, Ning Yi is the son of the woman he was so in love with, and he feels a special bond between them, i also think that Ning Yi reminds him of his younger self)

 

<I strongly believe that season 2 is on its way. TroP is getting higher on ranking (both in douban and imbd), though they didnt buy views, blogging, no marketing at all-we can hardly find any officially translated interview of the cast and crew).

Especially in the west, fans are increasing tremendously, so its very possible. 

  • Like 4

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 hours ago, KS Willis said:

I had a chance to binge Croton's Eternal Love, and JMO although nicely done will never become the crossover vehicle for the NA market that Croton is seeking for many reasons, especially the acting, the dubbing, sound quality, the depth of fantasy, I found it difficult to suspend reality and fall into the story. That surprised me since I'm a longstanding fantasy  adventure fan, getting ready to say goodby to GoTs and not soon enough,lol. I'm  motivated to send a pro RotP comment to Croton Media  and hope enough people do the same. 

That drama to my knowledge is mostly a romance drama is the thing? I hold them to a way different standard to what I hold RoTP to be. But as of now, it has much bigger audience than RoTP, because it's easier to get into.

 

I never watched it because the original web novel plagiarised and the author was unapologetic about it. I'm actually actively annoyed that it, along with several other dramas that had plagiarising source are amongst the more popular cdramas that international audience Princess Weiyoung was the worst offender, I think Princess Agent was pretty bad too and it super sucks because they both feature badass female protag. There's other plagiarism claims thrown around, some were due to tropes within subgenre, some I never actually looked too closely into. 

 

For fantasy epic (?), be on the lookout for Novoland which has finished filming and due to broadcasted this year. But the government seem pulling an even tighter reign on historical/costume dramas this year, even if they are web dramas so WHO KNOWS. Tribes & Empire (2017) is set in the same world but about different people (and different period of time I think), but the reviews say it suffered from pacing problems, char development and other writing issue, one of those everything is pretty great EXCEPT for the writing. *facepalm*

 

Ever Night which is fantasy adventure was pretty well received iirc, from both adaptation and storytelling wise. I'm still at the beginning though. Ashes of Love which more similar Eternal Love since it's a romance and a xianxia was pretty good, somewhat cliche story, but incredibly well executed, its issue is there's some padding out with supporting characters during latter half of the drama.

 

As for Croton Media, it'll be nice if they invest in another drama like this, how well a drama end up being seem like luck of draw at times. I haven't watched enough of their dramas to say what would be a good focus, though I don't think RoTP is the best choice. It doesn't cast a wide enough net, long historical dramas isn't that accessible, and it's a deeply flawed drama.

 

9 hours ago, KS Willis said:

Back to RotP.  The Emperor  tells NingYi  that if his name is in the golden box he will be attacked,  NingYi  responds that he will also become a weapon to be used. Was this what his father had planned  all along?  NingYi  is crushed.  Later when NingYi  asks XinZiyan

" what am I  to you?", he answers "one hundred birds are not as good as one osprey." I found this equal in cruelty to the Emperor 's plan for NY and was taken aback by Headmaster. Does anyone else sense that XinZiyan's motivations are not as clear cut and altruistic as he first presents?

To the emperor, Ning Yi is first a subject then his son. As a prince, he has responsibilities, just like the emperor have responsibilities (such as sacrificing your son when it comes to it). It's pretty tragic but also something that's standard fare for royalties. Their relationship is one of the best parts of the drama.

 

As for Xin Ziyan, he never came across as altruistic to me. To me he was extremely goal oriented and focused, to the point of willing to sacrifice other people, or himself for it. Anyways, he would be honoured as councillor to the emperor, and he would have proven that he could do something, to leave a legacy behind so there's some benefits to him doing all this. He came to care about Ning Yi and wanted to help his friend achieve his ambition later of course.

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Can anyone explain what the headmasters last saying meant to Ning yi? I'm guessing there friendship is done? Which is a huge downer! 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
5 hours ago, Hazeykun said:

Can anyone explain what the headmasters last saying meant to Ning yi? I'm guessing there friendship is done? Which is a huge downer! 

 

He meant that even if they are close in distance terms, they are far away from each other, as Ning Yi is emperor and he is just a royal councilor. Their friendship is over. An emperor doesnt need friends, according to what he said (and according to reality).

 

The only thing that was left unsaid, is what actually happened to Xin Ziyan. Did Ning Yi punished him after all? To me, seems that he didnt. Ning Yi seemed broken when Xin Ziyan cofessed his crime, although they both repeated the main principle of Ning Yi's dream: to punish everyone that commits a crime, despite his position. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
8 hours ago, skibbies said:

That drama to my knowledge is mostly a romance drama is the thing? I hold them to a way different standard to what I hold RoTP to be. But as of now, it has much bigger audience than RoTP, because it's easier to get into.

 

I never watched it because the original web novel plagiarised and the author was unapologetic about it. I'm actually actively annoyed that it, along with several other dramas that had plagiarising source are amongst the more popular cdramas that international audience Princess Weiyoung was the worst offender, I think Princess Agent was pretty bad too and it super sucks because they both feature badass female protag. There's other plagiarism claims thrown around, some were due to tropes within subgenre, some I never actually looked too closely into. 

 

For fantasy epic (?), be on the lookout for Novoland which has finished filming and due to broadcasted this year. But the government seem pulling an even tighter reign on historical/costume dramas this year, even if they are web dramas so WHO KNOWS. Tribes & Empire (2017) is set in the same world but about different people (and different period of time I think), but the reviews say it suffered from pacing problems, char development and other writing issue, one of those everything is pretty great EXCEPT for the writing. *facepalm*

 

Ever Night which is fantasy adventure was pretty well received iirc, from both adaptation and storytelling wise. I'm still at the beginning though. Ashes of Love which more similar Eternal Love since it's a romance and a xianxia was pretty good, somewhat cliche story, but incredibly well executed, its issue is there's some padding out with supporting characters during latter half of the drama.

 

As for Croton Media, it'll be nice if they invest in another drama like this, how well a drama end up being seem like luck of draw at times. I haven't watched enough of their dramas to say what would be a good focus, though I don't think RoTP is the best choice. It doesn't cast a wide enough net, long historical dramas isn't that accessible, and it's a deeply flawed drama.

 

To the emperor, Ning Yi is first a subject then his son. As a prince, he has responsibilities, just like the emperor have responsibilities (such as sacrificing your son when it comes to it). It's pretty tragic but also something that's standard fare for royalties. Their relationship is one of the best parts of the drama.

 

As for Xin Ziyan, he never came across as altruistic to me. To me he was extremely goal oriented and focused, to the point of willing to sacrifice other people, or himself for it. Anyways, he would be honoured as councillor to the emperor, and he would have proven that he could do something, to leave a legacy behind so there's some benefits to him doing all this. He came to care about Ning Yi and wanted to help his friend achieve his ambition later of course.

 

The main reason for not making a TROP season2, is the targeted audience. Unfortunately, they are used to more cheesy and easy to follow, dramas. Trop is in another level, in terms of acting, cinematography, character development etc.

 

But i can see that despite of the lack of marketing, it keeps raising fans in the western audience as time goes by, so it may happen.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 3/23/2019 at 10:41 PM, skibbies said:

For fantasy epic (?), be on the lookout for Novoland which has finished filming and due to broadcasted this year. But the government seem pulling an even tighter reign on historical/costume dramas this year, even if they are web dramas so WHO KNOWS. Tribes & Empire (2017) is set in the same world but about different people (and different period of time I think), but the reviews say it suffered from pacing problems, char development and other writing issue, one of those everything is pretty great EXCEPT for the writing. *facepalm*

 

As for Croton Media, it'll be nice if they invest in another drama like this, how well a drama end up being seem like luck of draw at times. I haven't watched enough of their dramas to say what would be a good focus, though I don't think RoTP is the best choice. It doesn't cast a wide enough net, long historical dramas isn't that accessible, and it's a deeply flawed drama.

 

 

It pains me to talk about Tribes and Empires. The costumes, the sets, the acting, and the cinematography were all phenomenal, but the script and the editing (oh my god the 20 minute flashbacks whyyy) were complete trash. The female characters were so poorly written it was almost offensive. They also wasted 70+ episodes on complete filler--the plot doesn't truly start until the emperor dies and he just refused to die. I actually spent 50 episodes trying to brainwash myself into liking it because of how visually sumptuous it was, but my brain kept interrupting to remind me that the plot was beyond stupid. 

 

With regards to tROP, I agree that they are most likely not going to film a second season. I don't think they have the budget and investors for it, especially considering tROP set a record for the lowest ratings in the history of the channel. I still believe that the first 50 or so episodes of tROP were as close to perfect as it gets though. If only it were possible for a director's cut of the ending to be released :')

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 2/16/2019 at 7:53 AM, skibbies said:

Sex is rarely shown on Chinese TV. I think it was implied in that scene since they seem sort of content after passage of time shot. But it's debateable. As for Helian Zheng, she volunteered to lead the army for him partially to avoid consummating their marriage, I'm pretty sure (The Queen tried to pressure her for babies before she got married and she looked pretty uncomfortable.) There wasn't enough time (or room in her heart) for their relationship to grow, and Helian Zheng didn't want to pressure her. Until she tried to leave, at which point he was just angry and frustrated and trying to get her to stay.

 

Unlikely, because the story looks pretty done, and the team don't seem the type to milk the story. Unless it's just a vastly different one, but it didn't do well commercially so uh. The OTP could potentially work together in a different project since they seems to get along really well. Ni ni could use the help.

 

There's lots of rumours about his sexuality and who knows? Does it matter? He self admitted is pretty bad at English, but I presume he knows simple stuff to get by since his kid study in NA.

I have seen him speaking in English in movie Qian Xue Shen.  The first part of the movie is mainly in English. To me, he is quite fluent in English. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This was the first Chinese drama series I have watched.  I do not speak nor understand mandarin.  This drama series was absolutely fantastic!! Loved the main characters! They did an awesome job. Their chemistry were unbelievable.  One can tell they got along very well and they may have become very good friends because of the series.  The behind the scene YouTube videos showed they had a lot of fun working together. The whole cast did a wonderful job too.  It was unfortunate they mess with the ending.  It was heart wrenching that the NingYi and Zhiwei were not able to be with each other.  The costumes and setting were beautiful! Everything was nicely done including the music and songs. If there were deleted scenes, hope they will release them and make them into a short season 2 with a good ending.  Love, love the drama series. It is in a class of its own!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 9/16/2018 at 11:03 AM, yunmo19 said:

 

I guess based on the TV broadcast version. I just checked it out on Netflix, the DVD version was superb (although some subtleties and accuracies of the dialogues were lost in translation....)

Where did you find the DVD version? 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
23 hours ago, kavkumocitrus said:

Where did you find the DVD version? 

It's the same one as Netflix version. DVD version is only relevant if you are watching from Chinese sources, in which case, iQiyi have it labeled. If it's other streaming sites, the TV version have unfortunate huge-richard simmons subtitles and varying length instead of consistently about 45mins.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Everyone's recommending to watching this despite the sad ending for the couple. I'm just a bit hesitant because it's 70 episodes?! Oh my. How long am I going to finish this?!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 hours ago, vintage_chutzpah said:

Everyone's recommending to watching this despite the sad ending for the couple. I'm just a bit hesitant because it's 70 episodes?! Oh my. How long am I going to finish this?!

Take it easy and see if you like it. Doesn't necessarily work for everyone tbh. I was super intimidated by 70 episodes too, but after finishing it, I want stuff they cut lol. It can be separated into arcs too, the first one is 22 or 23 episodes?

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, skibbies said:

Take it easy and see if you like it. Doesn't necessarily work for everyone tbh. I was super intimidated by 70 episodes too, but after finishing it, I want stuff they cut lol. It can be separated into arcs too, the first one is 22 or 23 episodes?

 

I think I can do 4 episodes a day. I just finished the first 4 episodes last night. Ni Ni has more depth in her character here than in Love & Destiny (well, L&D is all fantasy romance anyway so really lighthearted).

 

With all the political scenes, this is going to be one heavy journey of 70 episodes but what seems to keep me is the acting, cinematography and costume. You know that it’s well-produced so the story’s got to be great if they invested so much on it. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
50 minutes ago, vintage_chutzpah said:

I think I can do 4 episodes a day. I just finished the first 4 episodes last night. Ni Ni has more depth in her character here than in Love & Destiny (well, L&D is all fantasy romance anyway so really lighthearted).

 

With all the political scenes, this is going to be one heavy journey of 70 episodes but what seems to keep me is the acting, cinematography and costume. You know that it’s well-produced so the story’s got to be great if they invested so much on it. 

Ahhh yeah, it can get heavy and use lots of brain power, it's why I said take it easy. Ni Ni's character definitely have more depth here. I hope you have fun with it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I started watching this beginning of August on Netflix and couldn't stop.

Prior to this I  had watched Princess WeiYoung, my first Chinese drama of this type, and enjoyed it so was looking for more. I watched Love 020 and a couple episodes of Ashes of Love.

Then I checked out The Rise of the Phoenixes and it blew me away on so many levels; the acting, the costumes, the sets, the story [except a certain part]. I've watched most of it twice or more. I am definitely not used to so much emotion being portrayed and shown in a movie/TV show.

I had never heard of Chen Kun or any of these actors, but now I want to see more. Amazon Prime has about 4 or 5 movies with Chen Kun.  At the beginning of August, most of his movies listed on IMDB were in Chinese and now almost of the titles have English equivalents.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.




×
×
  • Create New...