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[Mainland Chinese Drama 2018] The Rise of Phoenixes 凰权·弈天下

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17 hours ago, skibbies said:

no no. Ning Yan is specifically called 5th prince. Shaoning calls Ning Qi, the 7th prince big brother (when he was being nice to her), she's at least younger than him. In the book, she's the youngest and explicitly calls 10th prince big bro too. They don't refer to each other by titles in the drama so it's not confirmed but I think it's somewhat assumed?

 

I'd agree if they kept Helian Zheng's characterisation of straightforward but devoted till the end. When Zhiwei was trying to go back to Tiansheng (ep 64? 65?), he got very upset, which is entirely fair. The scene started out fine but then his chauvinism started coming out, he wish that she would let him handle it, let him check what's going on in Tiansheng. That's not Zhiwei, and she said so as much. I do like this part since it humanised him but then they try to humanised him more where he's selfish and does a really dumb thing, so I just pretend that doesn't exist. I think they can overcome not always thinking at the same speed or along the same lines (although Zhiwei would lose so much fun and I don't want her to settle), but not when he doesn't understand what's vital to her.

 

The scene is from the book, but even then it's not meant to be romantic. Gu Nanyi doesn't understand the world and how people social, it's Zhiwei who taught him that. He has a lot of contemplative scenes in drama, in the one you are talking about, I think he was just sort of musing "this girl is weird. mhmmm". He's essentially the second lead in the book by sheer amount of scenes (he was by her side for 12 years) and like in the drama, he's her family and sort of like her support network at times. He's romantically interested in her in the novel, but to him, it's not just romance, she's his life and his world, basically? damn this sounds really cheesy. But Zhiwei was never romantically interested in him. I'm worried about him in the drama too, he understood where she's going, I think but he's going to be so heartbroken and he has no one else.

 

Re:Chen Kun, he tends to play supporting character (or he's the main character but the focus is on the female lead) in lot of the well known movies he's in, he likes to challenge himself so they are all pretty different. Maybe also try Flying Sword of Dragon's Gate? I think that's one of his more beloved role. His dramas have some memorable characters but I doubt they are translated. Did you try Ni ni's debut movie, The Flowers of War? The general consensus seems to be she did fairly average in terms of roles after that.

 

17 hours ago, skibbies said:

no no. Ning Yan is specifically called 5th prince. Shaoning calls Ning Qi, the 7th prince big brother (when he was being nice to her), she's at least younger than him. In the book, she's the youngest and explicitly calls 10th prince big bro too. They don't refer to each other by titles in the drama so it's not confirmed but I think it's somewhat assumed?

 

I'd agree if they kept Helian Zheng's characterisation of straightforward but devoted till the end. When Zhiwei was trying to go back to Tiansheng (ep 64? 65?), he got very upset, which is entirely fair. The scene started out fine but then his chauvinism started coming out, he wish that she would let him handle it, let him check what's going on in Tiansheng. That's not Zhiwei, and she said so as much. I do like this part since it humanised him but then they try to humanised him more where he's selfish and does a really dumb thing, so I just pretend that doesn't exist. I think they can overcome not always thinking at the same speed or along the same lines (although Zhiwei would lose so much fun and I don't want her to settle), but not when he doesn't understand what's vital to her.

 

The scene is from the book, but even then it's not meant to be romantic. Gu Nanyi doesn't understand the world and how people social, it's Zhiwei who taught him that. He has a lot of contemplative scenes in drama, in the one you are talking about, I think he was just sort of musing "this girl is weird. mhmmm". He's essentially the second lead in the book by sheer amount of scenes (he was by her side for 12 years) and like in the drama, he's her family and sort of like her support network at times. He's romantically interested in her in the novel, but to him, it's not just romance, she's his life and his world, basically? damn this sounds really cheesy. But Zhiwei was never romantically interested in him. I'm worried about him in the drama too, he understood where she's going, I think but he's going to be so heartbroken and he has no one else.

 

Re:Chen Kun, he tends to play supporting character (or he's the main character but the focus is on the female lead) in lot of the well known movies he's in, he likes to challenge himself so they are all pretty different. Maybe also try Flying Sword of Dragon's Gate? I think that's one of his more beloved role. His dramas have some memorable characters but I doubt they are translated. Did you try Ni ni's debut movie, The Flowers of War? The general consensus seems to be she did fairly average in terms of roles after that.

hi, thank you for the correction, perhaps I misread the translation, anyway do you read the Chinese novel version? That’s cool,,I wish there would be English translation very soon, I can’t find it even in Amazon ,, that’s s depressing  :(  

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13 hours ago, tendrilsofwind said:

It's kind of hard to translate 狸猫 to english. For some reason everyone translates it as civet cat/raccoon cat, but in Chinese it just means a little cat or little leopard cat. There is a very popular Chinese legend where a consort substitutes the newborn son of a rival consort, who would be crown prince, for a skinned cat, causing the consort to be lose favor ad be locked up (kind of like Ning Yi's mother's situation). Ning Yi calls Zhiwei 狸猫 because in the beginning, she was an impostor in the sense that she was assuming the identity of her cousin. It must have been kind of weird for people watching the subtitles though. 

Thanks so much for the clarification. That makes a lot of sense. In Japanese the word 狸/tanuki means raccoon, but also someone sly and sneaky. So in that context, she was a bit of an imposter. But tbf Zhiwei really does resemble a civet cat. She's so long and slender! haha.

 

By the way, I started re-watching the series again on my own, but my sister caught a glimpse of the Princes' elaborate costumes and so I had to restart at Episode 1 (which I didn't mind.) And then her husband decided to join us as well, so we had to restart again at Episode 1 LOL. This is the first time her husband is actually sitting down to watch any costume drama with us and is actually invested in the characters. He usually prefers stuff on HBO or American TV. I think he even enjoys it a lot more than my sister does because he went to work in the evening but forced us to wait until he came home so we could all watch it together. We're now on Episode 15.


The even weirder thing is, my nephew (18) joined us last night too. He honestly couldn't tell whether Ni Ni was a girl or a guy. He guessed correctly that she was dressed as a man eventually. But what made me laugh so hard was that he was seriously confused about Bai Jingting's sexual identity as well. I was like, "You cannot be serious." Eventually when he heard Gu Nanyi speaking, he was like, "What! That's a dude!" 

 

Weirdest experience I'm having ever because none of the men in my family like watching Chinese costume dramas. They always thought it was "meant for women." Whatever that means. I'd like to think that  it's because Chen Kun has that knife-blade edge to him while acting. There's just a bit of dark and crazy in those eyes to make even men fall under his spell.

 

Also, the scene when Zhiwei meets up with Ning Yi after burying the wooden figure for Prince Yan and she kept cracking up even though Ning Yi's all serious and trying to shake some sense into her, like, "Woman! Do you realize you might die?" was adorable to them for some reason. My sister and I thought it was cute too, but we were preferred the one where they were in his carriage and he tells her she looks hideous when she cries lol. No, actually, what I loved was the subtle nuances of the characters in that scene. Ning Yi peeked and noticed she had packed the outer-garment he made, and Zhiwei realizes this and shyly thanks him for it before putting it on him. So we have our differences.

 

Also, my sister makes clothing, and she was so impressed by how detailed and ornate the costumes are. She loves how they don't shy away from decorating the other Princes as well. And now that I've seen these first 15 episodes more than three times, I just can't help but be in awe of the beautiful sets. I think Ning Yan, Prince of Zhao, had the prettiest room of them all. I'd live in it.

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On 10/31/2018 at 2:57 AM, Pollen Ainne said:

I forgive him. When the woman you love keeps on thinking of another man, you might think you can accept it at first but you will get fed up with it. And I think Zhiwei never really gave Helian Zheng a chance. She only kept appearances on the outside as his queen to not humiliate him, which is what Ning Yi saw. But later on, when he aimed a bow at her... that I do not forgive him for, even if he paid for it with his life. I know he had no intention of shooting but his intentions were bad. I admired him more when he became angry and decided to divorce her. He should not have taken that back.

 

For some reason, I am quite indifferent as to what happens to Gu Nanyi.

It make sense he'd take it back though, since that was the tangible link he had with her, and he was desperately holding onto it. It was kind of suicidal move, since he knew Ning Yi would see him and he would die first, I know it's still putting her at risk but yknow. Either way it's a super dumb move and that's not how you get her to remember you! I would have taken it that he waver at the suggestion, but decide not to, then died anyways because of other people's scheme, it'd have similar effect. We didn't really the "mystery" surrounding his death since it lead to more misunderstanding that wasn't dwelled on much, so idk what that was for except making the audience experience worse.

 

Gu Nanyi doesn't get enough scenes for you to really care for him. He's a human background a lot, and gets written out of the plot when Zhiwei needs to be in danger, which is kind of sad. We basically saw his post character development but none of how it happened. He has some really good lines! Since I'm team Zhiwei and he's her support network, he gets lot more points from me.

 

16 hours ago, tendrilsofwind said:

It's kind of hard to translate 狸猫 to english. For some reason everyone translates it as civet cat/raccoon cat, but in Chinese it just means a little cat or little leopard cat. There is a very popular Chinese legend where a consort substitutes the newborn son of a rival consort, who would be crown prince, for a skinned cat, causing the consort to be lose favor ad be locked up (kind of like Ning Yi's mother's situation). Ning Yi calls Zhiwei 狸猫 because in the beginning, she was an impostor in the sense that she was assuming the identity of her cousin. It must have been kind of weird for people watching the subtitles though. 

I think it got translated to racoon because the Japanese tanuki gets (mis?)translated to 狸猫 and is frequently translated as raccoon in English. It was my first instinct when I was thinking up a translation too :sweatingbullets: this case is a good case where footnotes would be helpful, but I've only ever seen them in fansubs, not official subs.

 

8 hours ago, Lottalove Lottalove said:

hi, thank you for the correction, perhaps I misread the translation, anyway do you read the Chinese novel version? That’s cool,,I wish there would be English translation very soon, I can’t find it even in Amazon ,, that’s s depressing  :(  

Yeah I read the novel, I read that first and then found out there's a drama and followed it from broadcast. Web novels aren't popular enough to be picked up by official companies yet, so it's heavily reliant on fan translation. They get better translators than cdrama do though. Legend of Fu Yao which is set in the same universe is being translated so maybe they'll pick this up later? I don't know. This novel is on the longer side, 1.3mil characters so it's a monstrous task to translate. I think someone on tumblr is partially translating it? Skipping all the appearance description and probably some setting description too. I should probably note that the novel is very different beast from the drama, the characterisation, relationship dynamic and some of the central conflict.

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2 hours ago, skibbies said:

It make sense he'd take it back though, since that was the tangible link he had with her, and he was desperately holding onto it. It was kind of suicidal move, since he knew Ning Yi would see him and he would die first, I know it's still putting her at risk but yknow. Either way it's a super dumb move and that's not how you get her to remember you! I would have taken it that he waver at the suggestion, but decide not to, then died anyways because of other people's scheme, it'd have similar effect. We didn't really the "mystery" surrounding his death since it lead to more misunderstanding that wasn't dwelled on much, so idk what that was for except making the audience experience worse.

Actually, it would have made more sense for me if he had moved on. He was no longer just prince, he was the King of Jinshi. It made no sense to me that as King, he traveled all the way to Tiansheng just to get Zhiwei back. Had they been real lovers, I would shrug it off. But for some girl who was totally in love with someone else? Who is that masochistic and stupid really? Where is his pride? Tiansheng and Jinshi might be at peace with each other but I think it would be some major political move to have the King of another country step into foreign soil. And he does that for a woman who will never love him in return? Who is Zhiwei? Helen of Troy? lol.

 

And then his character is dumbed down further by getting used as a pawn by the 4th Prince of Dacheng. Although he was playful and stubborn in love, I thought Helian Zheng was a person of honor and was actually a responsible person in the inside. He accepted marriage to the Princess of Tiansheng thinking he was marrying Shaoning. That was pretty mature of him. At that time, he thought of his Kingdom first. 

 

But I understand why the writers wanted him dead. It paves the way for Ning Yi getting his united Empire. But still...

 

It's really painful saying negative things about this show when I love it so much. Unfortunately, love is not blind. :D

 

2 hours ago, skibbies said:

Gu Nanyi doesn't get enough scenes for you to really care for him. He's a human background a lot, and gets written out of the plot when Zhiwei needs to be in danger, which is kind of sad. We basically saw his post character development but none of how it happened. He has some really good lines! Since I'm team Zhiwei and he's her support network, he gets lot more points from me.

Maybe because you read the novel, you have more perspective. I too would want more character development on the characters surrounding Zhiwei. But if I were to choose characters to expound on, I would prefer to see more of Hua Qiong and develop a relationship with her and Yan Huaishi. I kinda liked Gu Nanyi as a background character. He was loyal and he supported Zhiwei on who she loved and who she didn't. That was enough for me.

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, sonosong said:

By the way, I started re-watching the series again on my own, but my sister caught a glimpse of the Princes' elaborate costumes and so I had to restart at Episode 1 (which I didn't mind.) And then her husband decided to join us as well, so we had to restart again at Episode 1 LOL. This is the first time her husband is actually sitting down to watch any costume drama with us and is actually invested in the characters. He usually prefers stuff on HBO or American TV. I think he even enjoys it a lot more than my sister does because he went to work in the evening but forced us to wait until he came home so we could all watch it together. We're now on Episode 15.


The even weirder thing is, my nephew (18) joined us last night too. He honestly couldn't tell whether Ni Ni was a girl or a guy. He guessed correctly that she was dressed as a man eventually. But what made me laugh so hard was that he was seriously confused about Bai Jingting's sexual identity as well. I was like, "You cannot be serious." Eventually when he heard Gu Nanyi speaking, he was like, "What! That's a dude!" 

 

Weirdest experience I'm having ever because none of the men in my family like watching Chinese costume dramas. They always thought it was "meant for women." Whatever that means. I'd like to think that  it's because Chen Kun has that knife-blade edge to him while acting. There's just a bit of dark and crazy in those eyes to make even men fall under his spell.

 

Also, the scene when Zhiwei meets up with Ning Yi after burying the wooden figure for Prince Yan and she kept cracking up even though Ning Yi's all serious and trying to shake some sense into her, like, "Woman! Do you realize you might die?" was adorable to them for some reason. My sister and I thought it was cute too, but we were preferred the one where they were in his carriage and he tells her she looks hideous when she cries lol. No, actually, what I loved was the subtle nuances of the characters in that scene. Ning Yi peeked and noticed she had packed the outer-garment he made, and Zhiwei realizes this and shyly thanks him for it before putting it on him. So we have our differences.

My little brother, who never watched any Chinese or Korean drama ever got hooked into it as well. I was re-watching from episode 1 and he was shaking his head at seeing I was watching the same show again. I gave him my headphones so he can try and see what it is about. Ning Yi was not even at the scene. It was about the 3 princes talking about what his release from prison implies for them. And he was like "That's enough, I'm gonna watch this show." He is not done watching yet but it's all we talk about during breakfast. 

 

This show is really stellar. The fact that the romance is kept at minimum makes guys enjoy it because they don't feel it's too cheesy. I still haven't convinced my boyfriend of watching it, and probably never will because I am too obsessed with Ning Yi at the moment for him to even want to see the character at all. Maybe when I mellow down he will give it a chance. lol

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16 hours ago, tendrilsofwind said:

It's kind of hard to translate 狸猫 to english. For some reason everyone translates it as civet cat/raccoon cat, but in Chinese it just means a little cat or little leopard cat. There is a very popular Chinese legend where a consort substitutes the newborn son of a rival consort, who would be crown prince, for a skinned cat, causing the consort to be lose favor ad be locked up (kind of like Ning Yi's mother's situation). Ning Yi calls Zhiwei 狸猫 because in the beginning, she was an impostor in the sense that she was assuming the identity of her cousin. It must have been kind of weird for people watching the subtitles though. 

Thanks a lot! This is why I love forums. Thanks for the context. 

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Oh good, so I'm not the only one who has been tempted into re-watching this show YET AGAIN... :lol: I even tried to re-watch some other shows that I found mildly entertaining whenever I had a bit of free time, but alas, the pull was too strong! I promptly hopped onto Netflix as soon as I was able to sit down and relax (I spent my dinner staring at the tiny screen that is my phone, obsessing over the little details). I've been following what people have been posting on various sites (here, instagram, tumblr, weibo, you name it...) and the small tidbits of information that jump out now and then just make it increasingly difficult to move on. 

I also found, to my delight and annoyance, that they've released more OSTs, BUT THEY'RE BLOCKED on qq... I only managed to bypass it once and they were loveelyyyy... 

Again, it's an absolute pleasure reading new posts! :D I hope to find some time to properly give my two pennies in the next few days! 

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@sonosong  That nickname might seem a little cringe worthy if it were applied to anyone else, but as soon as Ning Yi said it, I just thought it fit Ni Ni so perfectly.

 

I'm glad your family ended up liking this drama. My dad also pretended to think the show was frivolous nonsense, but then I went home for break and saw that he had finished watching the entire show. Some guys believe themselves too pragmatic and sophisticated for anything girls like, but that is predicated on the assumption that girls only like silly things. This show, especially the first half, very much echoes HBO prestige dramas. I started it kind of apprehensive because of what a train wreck Tribes and Empires turned out to be (with some of the worst, flattest female characters I have seen in a long time might I add) despite visually looking stunning, but I was blown away by the intricacy of everything. The plot isn't as tight at the end, but it really was obscenely tight in the beginning. 

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Im on 22 and lmao, when the Princess Shongning ran to protect Ning Chun is funny, I feel like they could have done the scene better, it was just funny!!! Ning Chun is a crazy richard simmons!!!! He is full of evil and craziness, and of course, the Royal King always deny how he doesnt see it coming why his son is the way he is!! CK is really good as NY, he portrays all the emotions right. I love the scene where his brother Ning Qiao got proven innocent and all the work that the puts over the year to prove his innocence pays off!! So sad but so good.

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On 10/30/2018 at 4:05 PM, morganian said:

As for Gu Nanyi, yeah, you're right: very little romantic undertone at all. Though, sometimes I get confused in some scenes, like the show wasn't sure what direction FZQ and GNY's relationship should be taking. Like what was he doing, sleeping on her bed, and then rolling over to look at her look at the moon? Is there more romance between these two characters in the book? Did the show make a decision somewhere along the line to tone down the hint of romance between these two so that they could focus on NY and HZ? That final scene with GNY having a flashback; what was that? I wonder what happened to him in the end. So messy! 

Hmm...interesting... but I didn't get any romantic or physical attraction vibe from Gu Nanyi as we knew him in that scene. If it was a standalone scene I saw somewhere it would've looked more lustful(I did perceive him as more grown up for a moment) but in that context I only saw it as boyish curiosity. Sort of like a young child curious about the opposite sex...or even just curious about this new person. Their sibling chemistry is really strong and his aloofness about the ways of the world was established by then. I'm really glad they didn't take the romantic route for his character. He filled a much needed non love interest gap in zhiwei's life. It's kindof exhausting watching a character like zhiwei because you have to be wary of people liking her. I was worried Yan huaishi might develop feelings for her too. Can't trust any red blooded young man just deciding to be loyal lol. Especially in a historical setting where men and women don't interact much and women are usually thought of as mother figures, potential wife/mistresses or little girls.

Its a relief knowing Gu Nanyi  is entirely immune to that (with regards to zhiwei anyway). Huaishi eventually became safe too. phew.

 

On 10/30/2018 at 5:52 PM, Pollen Ainne said:

Ning Yi in his hunting gear lounging in his chair... I think some beauty is just universal, he has mastered the art of "lounging". :D

Ahahaha....no where has a better lounger existed. He is so majestic and the way he fans himself...damn. I think the reason all those 'feminine' and soft quirks work so well on him is because his core is very rugged and masculine. So his refined body language and vulnerable moments make him really well rounded.

 

Speaking of character and looks, I found Heliang Zheng physically very attractive from the very first scene. By looks alone, he's my fav. But then I saw him in the documentary... yikes WTF....so ugh... He sounds so soft spoken and the pruned facial hair didn't help. Changed his whole vibe.

Looking good helps but character is king when it comes to attraction (for females anyway). Someone said that Chen Kun is most attractive as Ning Yi and I have to agree. His offscreen persona is interesting but nothing beats NingYi. Maybe too early for me to judge now (because I've yet to see his other works) but Chen Kun as Ningyi is a good example of the tremendous power character has in raising someone's attraction quotient.

 

On 10/31/2018 at 8:45 AM, tendrilsofwind said:

It's kind of hard to translate 狸猫 to english. For some reason everyone translates it as civet cat/raccoon cat, but in Chinese it just means a little cat or little leopard cat. There is a very popular Chinese legend where a consort substitutes the newborn son of a rival consort, who would be crown prince, for a skinned cat, causing the consort to be lose favor ad be locked up (kind of like Ning Yi's mother's situation). Ning Yi calls Zhiwei 狸猫 because in the beginning, she was an impostor in the sense that she was assuming the identity of her cousin. It must have been kind of weird for people watching the subtitles though. 

So theres a clear meaning and legend behind this nickname as well. This fits the situation so well because she did appear in his life as an imposter. Thats deep. I thought it was just little cat that they translated as little racoon because they wanted to convey a more mischievous, troublesome vibe rather than a purely cute one. I respect this show even more now. I like how a lot of what I thought was more abstract or vague is very straightforward with obvious significance. When I watch a subbed show I get that I'm not going to understand everything so I just surrender to the grays and fill it in with a general estimation. I don't really mind it for other shows even when people say "oh it specifically meant this not that...the translation isn't perfect blah..." because the differences seem like nitpicking. But ROTP is very dialogue and idiom heavy with a lot conveyed in a single line. I remember reading an imdb review that said the subs are like "cerulean, teal and azure" translated as "blue, blue and blue". Thats really sad. Even through the dull subs the dialogue was still very interesting in tandem with their voices and expressions.

I desperately want to watch this again with better subs (and footnotes to explain context or any details that non-chinese viewers might miss).

Can't rewatch it again right now though, I'm still in a hangover. Even the early episodes sort of make me sad. This show is like a watershed moment for me, I hadn't given a second thought to asian shows before but now I can't stop. Its a whole new world! I'm also someone who needs to keep watching stuff so another c-drama caught my eye and I can't believe I'm enjoying this too since its in direct contrast to ROTP....light, fluffy, modern. Definitely not missing much through subs either. I tried to watch NIF but the setting reminds me of ROTP and that kindof hurts lol. I don't think I'll be watching anything deep for while. Part of me is still in mourning :cry:

-----

My take on the "I like you" (instead of love you) was easy to understand as cultural difference because in my mother tongue as well people say 'like' instead of 'love'. Actually we don't have an equivalent of the word 'love' as its understood in english. Ex: no one says I love music just I like music a lot. Theres a word for romantic love but it has a really different vibe. Kindof corny. Theres a word for affection too that can be used between couples or other close relationships. But for most intents and purposes "I Like you" or "I like you a lot" carries enough weight especially for first time admission.

I think in english the word 'like' is perceived very lightly. Hence all those dialogues that go "hey..I like you"..."yeah I like you too"..."no I mean, I like like you"..."OH...um....er...." lol.

 

 

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oh my heart <3333!! The end of ep 24 and beginnning of ep 25, when NY teased ZW slightly touching her face when he falls on top of her <<33!!! I wish that could have been their first romance scene!! Such a tease!!! Will we see more romance, or at least some kisses as the drama develops on??? I like the plot, so I don't mind if there is not a whole lot of romance in the drama, but it wouldn't be so bad to see some romance here and there ;)!!! They have great chemistry! And when will we see Yuan Hong's character? I like him from BBJX!!!! Will his character have a romance with ZW??? Is he going to be second lead?? I also like Gu NanYin, and he is a very cute actor!! I totally forgot when Huashi appears in the drama??? Again, there's always have to a be naive princess fighting for the bad guy, Princess Shoning needs to go~

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22 hours ago, sonosong said:

Weirdest experience I'm having ever because none of the men in my family like watching Chinese costume dramas. They always thought it was "meant for women." Whatever that means. I'd like to think that  it's because Chen Kun has that knife-blade edge to him while acting. There's just a bit of dark and crazy in those eyes to make even men fall under his spell.

What do they think Chinese men watch? XD I mean, it's true that there's more dramas marketed to the female audience because they are more likely to participate in fandom and generate buzz/contribute to ratings, but there's a lot that's just for general audience! Alhough the subbed dramas tend to be the romance-y ones, Netflix imported good balance of them. Day & Night and Burning Ice are both mystery thriller, they were both pretty well received. Tientsin Mystic have some major flaws but is also pretty interesting mystery. Qin Empire is a political drama, The Disguiser & All Quiet in Peking which have been removed but is on youtube (?) are also political dramas. Wait Burning Ice isn't on netflix, my bad. tRoP in similar to NiF in how wide it casts its audience net.

 

Glad you got so many of your family to watch the drama and they are enjoying it a lot. LOL about Bai Jingting, I gueeeess he just fall into pretty face category, but he always looked pretty masculine to me. Show your sister the costume part of the documentary later, it's too short but I'm sure she'll love it! So far I've only got my grandpa and a friend to watch it. My other family either watched bits and pieces before or don't have time. 70 episodes is so hard to rec!! I spammed some costume and set pics from first 10 ep to friends and there was some interest but, we'll see

 

@Pollen Ainne I think it'd be better for him to move on, but that didn't seem to be his character, devoted second lead and all. They didn't get to the uniting part though!! Bahhh.

 

Yeah I'm more likely to know what they were attempting with a character because of the novel, relationship and motivation and all. Hua Qiong would definitely been my no.1 choice to expand on, they did a good job with making Zhu Yin likeable, I'm sure Hua Qiong would have been the same, but then. 

 

@niniandkun Gu Nanyi have decent romantice chemistry with Si Yinlun's sister (i can't remember her name...), they didn't seem to have time to expand on it though. It's definitely nice to have non-romantic relationship for Zhiwei since a lot of other dramas have female lead surrounded by potential love interests. For Yan Huaishi, he's basically friends with Zhiwei because she's competent and he needs power and connection in the capital, but that wasn't dwelled on much. 

 

For Helian Zheng's actor, I think they filtered it too much so his skin look flawless and it looks bizzare. Make up might have helped too but other people looked relatively normal so it was bit odd.

 

@rosierosie The drama's romantic scenes are kind of different, they aren't conventional kisses and such. It's more dialogue (not between them, when they are talking to other people), looks, how well they match in terms of thoughts and very small gestures. Yuan Hong is going take aaaages, he appears around 58? 60? He's not the second lead, his appearance was cut a fair bit and have something that amounts to a guest role I think. He appears less than Ning Yan/5th prince. Helian Zheng probably count as the second lead (romance wise) and I think he has less scenes than Crown Prince lol.

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Former art teacher now fully engaged in RotP. Have always had a special interest in Chinese art, culture, music etc. Watched the first 15 epis without subs to familiarize  myself with the nuances  of the language. Rewatched with subs and was really hooked.

The sets, costumes,  makeup ect were head and shoulders above. The acting was outstanding from the whole cast. Wonderful chemistry between the leads. Would enjoy chatting with such a knowledgeable  forum, thanks for being here to support this refreshing creation.

Edited by whisper1
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On 10/29/2018 at 1:11 AM, tendrilsofwind said:

 

Same. I've watched much more explicit shows, like game of thrones, but to be perfectly honest, those scenes leave me cold. I know it's going to happen and I've seen it played out so many times that it's devoid of any anticipation. I'm all about that buildup and unresolved tension.

I totally agree. The subtle erotic notes in RotP allow a viewer to fill the blanks. For example as FW is undressing behind the screen she asks NY to put out the candle, code for bed time. Couple that with the sound of silk falling or being drawn over the screen, and NYS expression ...well that's  the stuff of dreams. 

Or as they avoid attack falling to the floor NY whispers I'm  so tired. Aren't  you tired? Very hot stuff.

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On 11/1/2018 at 8:01 AM, galea said:

Again, it's an absolute pleasure reading new posts! :D I hope to find some time to properly give my two pennies in the next few days! 

Looking forward to it. Hope you get some free time :D

 

17 hours ago, niniandkun said:

Hmm...interesting... but I didn't get any romantic or physical attraction vibe from Gu Nanyi as we knew him in that scene. If it was a standalone scene I saw somewhere it would've looked more lustful(I did perceive him as more grown up for a moment) but in that context I only saw it as boyish curiosity. Sort of like a young child curious about the opposite sex...or even just curious about this new person. Their sibling chemistry is really strong and his aloofness about the ways of the world was established by then. I'm really glad they didn't take the romantic route for his character. He filled a much needed non love interest gap in zhiwei's life. It's kindof exhausting watching a character like zhiwei because you have to be wary of people liking her. I was worried Yan huaishi might develop feelings for her too. Can't trust any red blooded young man just deciding to be loyal lol. Especially in a historical setting where men and women don't interact much and women are usually thought of as mother figures, potential wife/mistresses or little girls.

Its a relief knowing Gu Nanyi  is entirely immune to that (with regards to zhiwei anyway). Huaishi eventually became safe too. phew.

I totally agree wit this. It is refreshing to see different kinds of relationship. Zhiwei's more brotherly relationship to Gu Nanyi and her friendship to Yan Huaishi felt more natural and entertaining. Relationship is not always about romance.

 

17 hours ago, niniandkun said:

Ahahaha....no where has a better lounger existed. He is so majestic and the way he fans himself...damn. I think the reason all those 'feminine' and soft quirks work so well on him is because his core is very rugged and masculine. So his refined body language and vulnerable moments make him really well rounded.

 

Speaking of character and looks, I found Heliang Zheng physically very attractive from the very first scene. By looks alone, he's my fav. But then I saw him in the documentary... yikes WTF....so ugh... He sounds so soft spoken and the pruned facial hair didn't help. Changed his whole vibe.

Looking good helps but character is king when it comes to attraction (for females anyway). Someone said that Chen Kun is most attractive as Ning Yi and I have to agree. His offscreen persona is interesting but nothing beats NingYi. Maybe too early for me to judge now (because I've yet to see his other works) but Chen Kun as Ningyi is a good example of the tremendous power character has in raising someone's attraction quotient.

Yeah, the actor that plays Helian Zheng is totally different from that of his character. But I love it actually. I like how calm and professional he was in the interview. He also looked really relaxed. He was so goofy and loud as Helian Zheng, it surprised me that not an ounce of his real personality was in the character. But then again, Chen Kun was so different in the interviews too. Maybe you can see some of Ning Yi's arrogance and "playfulness" in some of his other interviews, but on the BTS interview, he was more relaxed and it felt more like we were talking the writer/director/crew member, rather than the actor who played the lead role. NiNi was so different as well. She looked so mature, I was so surprised because she acted so young during shooting and in the show itself. But during the interview, her maturity showed. They were really professionals.

 

17 hours ago, rosierosie said:

oh my heart <3333!! The end of ep 24 and beginnning of ep 25, when NY teased ZW slightly touching her face when he falls on top of her <<33!!! I wish that could have been their first romance scene!! Such a tease!!! Will we see more romance, or at least some kisses as the drama develops on??? I like the plot, so I don't mind if there is not a whole lot of romance in the drama, but it wouldn't be so bad to see some romance here and there ;)!!! They have great chemistry! And when will we see Yuan Hong's character? I like him from BBJX!!!! Will his character have a romance with ZW??? Is he going to be second lead?? I also like Gu NanYin, and he is a very cute actor!! I totally forgot when Huashi appears in the drama??? Again, there's always have to a be naive princess fighting for the bad guy, Princess Shoning needs to go~

The peak of the romance is on episode 43-47 I believe. But after that, it gets lesser. And the leads definitely have great chemistry. Their chemistry is built up intellectually too as opposed to just physical. 

 

7 hours ago, whisper1 said:

I totally agree. The subtle erotic notes in RotP allow a viewer to fill the blanks. For example as FW is undressing behind the screen she asks NY to put out the candle, code for bed time. Couple that with the sound of silk falling or being drawn over the screen, and NYS expression ...well that's  the stuff of dreams. 

Or as they avoid attack falling to the floor NY whispers I'm  so tired. Aren't  you tired? Very hot stuff.

They definitely has those moments. Although the most favorite of mine is just them talking.

 

When Zhiwei finally found out he was the prince of Chu and Ning Yi completely deduced why she was looking for him so that she can break off their engagement by revealing herself as an impostor. But because of that, Zhiwei completely broke through his veil of feigned lack of ambition, by deducing that since he was so intelligent, then he was already a thorn on the other princes, and that someone like him would never settle for less than what he deserves. They already saw through each other, and they were still strangers at the time.

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Good Day!

 

I've just finished the drama and I can say that overall I did like it. As others have said, Chen Kun and his portrayal of the Pince of Chu is alone worth the watch with his outstanding acting. Let's say that all the main actors/actresses did a remarkable job and - in my opionion - should be awarded with a prize.

 

About the ending, I totally understand  Zhiwei's choice. She couldn't bear to leave him yet she couldn't be with him either, with all that happened (oath apart). They were different people at the end. She wasn't the bright and genius girl anymore and he wasn't the dark and scheming Prince of Chu but the Emperor. An emperor who eventually would have to make difficult choices, let her suffer, maybe marry a pair of consorts and four/five concubines. Zhiwei would have liked to travel the world, maybe with her lover, with a light heart and no worries at all safe for learning and explore different countries, different cultures. The palace was a too constricted place for her, she would have felt suffocated.

 

So thank you for reading my thoughts. I have to go know, read you soon!

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9 hours ago, Pollen Ainne said:

They definitely has those moments. Although the most favorite of mine is just them talking.

I love it whenever they're talking too! But I think the one scene that gave me so many feels was the one in Episode 30-something(?) where they're not even talking and it's OTHER people who felt uncomfortable around them LOL. After the guy pretending to be the leader of the Minhai pirates got shot in the heart with an arrow and Zhiwei grazed her arm?

At her residence, Gu Nanyi tried to make her clean up her wound first, but she was so determined to draw the notches on the arrow correctly because "Prince of Chu is on his way here." Oh my goodness. The way she said it was so full of tenderness. But that's not the part that got me. 

 

The exact moment was when Nanyi was wrapping up her wound, Zhiwei shyly peeked through the divider to observe Ning Yi, and then realized Nanyi had seen her. And on the other side, Huaishi noticed Ning Yi looking concerned over Zhiwei. The look on both of their faces was so precious.

 

And the icing on the cake was when they called for each other at the exact same time. Hnnngh.

 

I love the subtle scenes, and I don't mind that they aren't as "physical" with each other as characters in other dramas.

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3 hours ago, mspilgrims said:

I've just finished the drama and I can say that overall I did like it. As others have said, Chen Kun and his portrayal of the Pince of Chu is alone worth the watch with his outstanding acting. Let's say that all the main actors/actresses did a remarkable job and - in my opionion - should be awarded with a prize.

 

About the ending, I totally understand  Zhiwei's choice. She couldn't bear to leave him yet she couldn't be with him either, with all that happened (oath apart). They were different people at the end. She wasn't the bright and genius girl anymore and he wasn't the dark and scheming Prince of Chu but the Emperor. An emperor who eventually would have to make difficult choices, let her suffer, maybe marry a pair of consorts and four/five concubines. Zhiwei would have liked to travel the world, maybe with her lover, with a light heart and no worries at all safe for learning and explore different countries, different cultures. The palace was a too constricted place for her, she would have felt suffocated.

 

So thank you for reading my thoughts. I have to go know, read you soon!

 

Spoiler

Although I was completely enraged at the ending at first, with the oath and all, I can understand why it had to be so. But I still believe that they should have done it better. They indeed have become different people. But I wanted the show to at least play homage to their past selves. A conversation that alludes that deep down, their love for each other have not changed, and that the same people live within them, but have to remain in the past as they have new responsibilities for the future. The imaginary scene in the mountains might have accomplished this. But since it had been edited out, the last moments we see them together will be Zhiwei giving Ning Yi a forced smile and NIng Yi not understanding her predicament. Zhiwei's death felt empty instead of tragic to me because of that.

 

1 hour ago, sonosong said:

I love it whenever they're talking too! But I think the one scene that gave me so many feels was the one in Episode 30-something(?) where they're not even talking and it's OTHER people who felt uncomfortable around them LOL. After the guy pretending to be the leader of the Minhai pirates got shot in the heart with an arrow and Zhiwei grazed her arm?

At her residence, Gu Nanyi tried to make her clean up her wound first, but she was so determined to draw the notches on the arrow correctly because "Prince of Chu is on his way here." Oh my goodness. The way she said it was so full of tenderness. But that's not the part that got me. 

 

The exact moment was when Nanyi was wrapping up her wound, Zhiwei shyly peeked through the divider to observe Ning Yi, and then realized Nanyi had seen her. And on the other side, Huaishi noticed Ning Yi looking concerned over Zhiwei. The look on both of their faces was so precious.

 

And the icing on the cake was when they called for each other at the exact same time. Hnnngh.

 

I love the subtle scenes, and I don't mind that they aren't as "physical" with each other as characters in other dramas.

 

That scene was definitely cute. I have the urge to re-watch again after you reminded me of it. I just remembered that there was something I was wondering on that scene. Ning Yi said, "There are some things that only exist in the dark." I wonder if he was pertaining to "light can only shine when there is darkness" or that "some things can only be hidden." Was kinda confused about it.

 

There are so many scenes that I can think of that made me fluffy inside by just watching the two of them interacting, but one of the best ones was definitely in Minhai when Zhongxin gifted Ning Yi a cat. He was talking about how his "little raccoon" was fiercer than a tiger and could not be replaced. Then he was talking about good and evil and Zhiwei was just smiling at his words.Then he teased her about getting concubines, and she said "Don't you dare." And Ning Yi was like "I'll have as many concubines as I want." But he was clearly happy that Zhiwei didn't want him to have any. I loved how he tried to change the topic and called on Chunyu Meng and then Zhiwei just waved him away. It gives us some insight to the "power play" in their relationship. They already felt like a married couple. I think Ning Yi would have been a really loyal husband to Zhiwei.

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4 hours ago, Pollen Ainne said:

Ning Yi said, "There are some things that only exist in the dark." I wonder if he was pertaining to "light can only shine when there is darkness" or that "some things can only be hidden." Was kinda confused about it.

He said that after Zhiwei wondered how come it's just now that she's seeing a "sliver of light in his heart." I took it to mean that he chose to keep his true and personal feelings hidden. I remember that, previously, Zhiwei didn't understand why he did certain things before and blamed him for it, even though Xin Ziyan tried convincing her otherwise. Ning Yi does things that may seem to be cruel to her (and to us), but he isn't a cruel person, and he wasn't hurting people because he was lusting after the throne either. He was defending himself, and letting people know that they can't keep undermining and humiliating him. This line of thought was supported by Chen Kun's interview in the BTS on how he chose to portray his character.


I'm not 100% on this either. I hope someone else has more thoughts on it because I'd like to know as well.

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