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[Mainland Chinese Drama 2018] The Rise of Phoenixes 凰权·弈天下

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1 hour ago, skibbies said:

He changed because after his mum's death, he's desperately holding onto people he loves, but she feels he's demanding her to stay, because he has that power, because the previous emperor held the same power over her and her family's lives. She loves him a lot, but she also doesn't want to stay I think, there's been too many deaths and Tiansheng isn't really her home anymore, if he wasn't an emperor, it'd be easier, there'd be less obligations.

I'm sure she wants to stay. The girl who loves Ning Yi wants to stay. Yes, she has lost a lot in Tiansheng, but the only person who could make her happy was right there. She would have been willing to go with Ning Yi after Da Yue, had Ning Yi not turned her away (because he was giving up his title, smh). In fact, deep down, she might even wish to be forced to stay so she can have an excuse to be with Ning Yi. This thought has already been presented in multiple ways. By Helian Zheng and by Zhiwei herself.

 

But, because of her conscience she could not do so at the expense of her people. And I understand that. But really, that conversation was dumb. Yes it was dramatic, the words were powerful, and it made for good stage performance, but the logic was out of bounds. Let me put it like this... If I turned off my brain that scene would have been awesome. Otherwise,

it made no sense. They were both Royalty and she knows Ning Yi would never harm her. She should have stood her ground as Empress of Da Cheng and demanded her terms of surrender as that would have been the best for her people. 

 

1 hour ago, skibbies said:

Sobbing to get him to protect her people doesn't really feel like her style. she's too proud. She did negotiate, she did it by sleeping with him. It's why he was so angry with her at the time. He holds it sacred, and he mentioned it in anger but was surprised that she agreed, thought it was a sweet romantic thing, but nope, she used it to negotiate. (and also because she wanted to but still)

Ok. No sobbing, lol. That was actually just an exaggeration because of how stupid I thought that conversation on the bridge was. I am saying she negotiated at the wrong time. She was being somewhat perverse and totally illogical. That time at the bridge would have been the perfect time to negotiate. On the bed with Ning Yi was very bad timing. Did she think he would be happy that she would sleep with him for her people? She was agitating him and smart Zhiwei would have known this. But I guess she must be agitating him on purpose because she was angry he killed Helian Zheng. But then again, was agitating him more important than the safety of her people. Her character has really stooped down to the lowest of levels. Not saying Ning Yi was any better. ~sigh

 

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1 hour ago, skibbies said:

Re: when the emperor finds out about Zhiwei, when her mum and brother were both determined to keep her alive. Zhiwei figured it out, the emperor is even smarter so he would too. Actually Feng Hao figured it out too so everyone knew.

 

Ah alright. The wine scene makes a bit of sense then as he wants to know their reaction to zhiwei dying. But feng hao also figured it out? How was that apparent? So he was being ironic when he said "see I told you im the most important person in our house" then? I thought it was just him trying to be cheery and poke fun with zhiwei last time before he dies. Its really too bad that I don't know a word of mandarin (except shema and wushema - meaning what and why that I learned from the series). I've next to no exposure to the culture and language otherwise I could've understood more nuance and picked up on implied messages more.

 

1 hour ago, skibbies said:

She did negotiate, she did it by sleeping with him. It's why he was so angry with her at the time. He holds it sacred, and he mentioned it in anger but was surprised that she agreed, thought it was a sweet romantic thing, but nope, she used it to negotiate. (and also because she wanted to but still)

 

If he held it sacred, why did he corner her into saying yes? He should've known that she was desperate to save her dacheng subjects and find the truth about helian zheng whom he personally killed.

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45 minutes ago, niniandkun said:

looolll!

 

Yup.

 

 

Definitely.  its easy to just notice ningyi's eccentricity in the beginning but its also the emperor's capricious demeanor and layered fear inducing portrayal of authority that gave us a good counter balance and frame of reference into all the prince's insecurities. Those long drawn out beginning to mid episodes apart from capturing details of the plot also gave us an intimate look into most of the prince's fractured mental states and what mechanism they resorted to cope with it. We could actually see why they were on their toes when in came to their father.

 

Right on the dot!! But my gripe with this is that 

1) they didnt even have to make this a tragedy. There's enough serious artsy tragedies but not enough serious, wholesome, non cheesy, deserving happy endings. We've seen many 'titanics' and 'romeo & juliet' esque ill-fated lovers journeys.(even ill-fated non romantic journeys). Why do serious and meaningful stories need to be sad? I don't normally mind tragedies and I can appreciate the romanticism of it but I thought this show had the potential to make a really classic happy ending. Not just bittersweet but a true happy ending. Ni Ni and Chen Kun could've easily pulled it off without making it look contrived or cheesy. Its easy to make this a sad story but with rich characters and good writing/setting in the beginning it would've been a more impressive feat to realistically and intelligently drive the plot to point where our leads battle against the odds, grow as people and finally reap the rewards. I personally think its easy to make tragedies and even without trying a sad story will have that aura of deepness around it unless its so bad its funny. Its hard to pull off a satisfying and memorable happy ending because then it loses that default aura of seriousness, so the story and characters need to be more compelling.

 

2) like you guys said, if they had to, atleast make it a worthwhile tragedy that respects the characters personalities and the journeys they'd been on. The story from jinshi flood onwards should have been executed differently to facilitate this. 

 

 

OMG this was really fun to read! thanks for writing this. BUT FZW stabbing Ning Yi?? And xin ziyan feeding her poison? gosh No No No!!! Ning yi will never forgive ziyan!! Pissed is an understatement. I can't imagine ziyan daring to do that, he knows how much NY cares about her. Maybe lie to her so she'll disappear? i doubt he'd kill.

 

My personal idea of a meaningful tragedy (wish I had your imagination and writing skills to make a scenario :() is where zhiwei and ning yi finally get back on the same page, arent distrustful of each other and resolve their differences. Instead of that jinshi goodbye (there shouldnt have been a goodbye there) this is where she says goodbye for the last time after having a genuine 'moment' with him, maybe even cute dialogue (as tribute to their early days). He understands why she can't stay (politics, guilty conscience, depression, responsibility to remaining dacheng etc) and respects her decision. NY thinks its a permanent goodbye because shes going to travel the world. He is happy that she'll be alive and free. But her plan all along was to kill herself because this life was indeed to much to bear. Cue cliff scene.  NY now thinks he shouldve realized her plan in hindsight but its too late and hes got a mission bla...cannot join her until his duty to his empire is fulfilled. Cue imagining they were together on the cliff scene? Perhaps the "older Ning Yi playing his flute, clutches his heart and falls to his knees" scene you mentioned after?

 

Not bad. This I can get with, although I still wish she doesn't die of suicide.

 

As for the happy ending. I definitely would prefer that. The characters deserved it.

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13 minutes ago, niniandkun said:

If he held it sacred, why did he corner her into saying yes? He should've known that she was desperate to save her dacheng subjects and find the truth about helian zheng whom he personally killed.

Because Ning Yi lost his sense of rationality in the last 7-8 episodes, that's why. I tell you, the moment he dropped his title, he also dropped his brain. And he never took it back even when he turned emperor.

 

I just have to add this... The Ning Yi and Zhiwei at the start of the show were two impressive smart people despite their ranks, Ning Yi being a prince without power and Zhiwei just an ordinary girl. At the end, Ning Yi was Emperor of Tianshing, Zhiwei was... Princess of Tiansheng, Queen of Jinshi, and Empress of the previous Empire of Cheng, and they suddenly start acting like children!

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36 minutes ago, Pollen Ainne said:

I'm sure she wants to stay. The girl who loves Ning Yi wants to stay. Yes, she has lost a lot in Tiansheng, but the only person who could make her happy was right there. She would have been willing to go with Ning Yi after Da Yue, had Ning Yi not turned her away (because he was giving up his title, smh). In fact, deep down, she might even wish to be forced to stay so she can have an excuse to be with Ning Yi. This thought has already been presented in multiple ways. By Helian Zheng and by Zhiwei herself.

 

But, because of her conscience she could not do so at the expense of her people. And I understand that. But really, that conversation was dumb. Yes it was dramatic, the words were powerful, and it made for good stage performance, but the logic was out of bounds. Let me put it like this... If I turned off my brain that scene would have been awesome. Otherwise,

it made no sense. They were both Royalty and she knows Ning Yi would never harm her. She should have stood her ground as Empress of Da Cheng and demanded her terms of surrender as that would have been the best for her people. 

 

Ok. No sobbing, lol. That was actually just an exaggeration because of how stupid I thought that conversation on the bridge was. I am saying she negotiated at the wrong time. She was being somewhat perverse and totally illogical. That time at the bridge would have been the perfect time to negotiate. On the bed with Ning Yi was very bad timing. Did she think he would be happy that she would sleep with him for her people? She was agitating him and smart Zhiwei would have known this. But I guess she must be agitating him on purpose because she was angry he killed Helian Zheng. But then again, was agitating him more important than the safety of her people. Her character has really stooped down to the lowest of levels. Not saying Ning Yi was any better. ~sigh

 

Ok "doesn't want to stay" is probably wrong choice of word, it's more she doesn't think she should? I don't really like execution of last 7 episodes for so so many reason, too many misunderstandings for sake of misunderstandings. She's not really the empress of Da Cheng though, she doesn't have any power or leverage to demand her terms of surrender. (She had it in the novel, so she did demand them) There's enough bloody pagoda to cause chaos, but not threaten Tiansheng...I think? The drama is super vague about it.

 

She didn't seem to be at the right mindset while at the bridge, her only blood relative just died. Yeah he's just some guy, but blood relatives mattered to them a lot, he's also the straw that broke the camel's back. She's definitely illogicalish in the last few episodes in general, she's just really tired about everything? I feel really tired watching her cry so much. Rip girl. I don't think she slept with him FOR her people per se, I think it's for their relationship. She just used their relationship as leverage for safety of other people? That sounds really bad, oops. It's definitely bad timing there.

 

46 minutes ago, niniandkun said:

 

Ah alright. The wine scene makes a bit of sense then as he wants to know their reaction to zhiwei dying. But feng hao also figured it out? How was that apparent? So he was being ironic when he said "see I told you im the most important person in our house" then? I thought it was just him trying to be cheery and poke fun with zhiwei last time before he dies. Its really too bad that I don't know a word of mandarin (except shema and wushema - meaning what and why that I learned from the series). I've next to no exposure to the culture and language otherwise I could've understood more nuance and picked up on implied messages more.

 

 

If he held it sacred, why did he corner her into saying yes? He should've known that she was desperate to save her dacheng subjects and find the truth about helian zheng whom he personally killed.

When he was dragged out of jail to see the emperor, he screamed something along the lines of "If I'm really the prince of Dacheng, I demand you to release me and I surrender" or something. That's more of a hint and up to interpretation but it's more apparent since he snatched the wine, and then he told his mum and sister that "now you can't leave me in the dark anymore". You could say that's ironic, but he is important as a scapegoat too.

 

I think he was desperate. To keep her close, to have some kind of tangible connection to her and what not. I say he holds it sacred because he was surprised she said yes, and then angry. They were just completely out of sync the last few episodes tbh.

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34 minutes ago, skibbies said:

Ok "doesn't want to stay" is probably wrong choice of word, it's more she doesn't think she should? I don't really like execution of last 7 episodes for so so many reason, too many misunderstandings for sake of misunderstandings. She's not really the empress of Da Cheng though, she doesn't have any power or leverage to demand her terms of surrender. (She had it in the novel, so she did demand them) There's enough bloody pagoda to cause chaos, but not threaten Tiansheng...I think? The drama is super vague about it.

 

She didn't seem to be at the right mindset while at the bridge, her only blood relative just died. Yeah he's just some guy, but blood relatives mattered to them a lot, he's also the straw that broke the camel's back. She's definitely illogicalish in the last few episodes in general, she's just really tired about everything? I feel really tired watching her cry so much. Rip girl. I don't think she slept with him FOR her people per se, I think it's for their relationship. She just used their relationship as leverage for safety of other people? That sounds really bad, oops. It's definitely bad timing there.

But she was the last remnant (really the last remnant now) so the authority goes to her, the only living leader of the Bloody Pagoda. Everyone else is dead. The rest bows down to her. And though she has no power as Empress, she has the power of Ning Yi's affections (lol) and she knows this.

 

And using her relationship for her people is not a problem, but she needs to be smart about it, especially since the person before her has also turned into such a friggin baby. Actually... I give up... there was no salvaging them at that point.

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Yee! Ninja Reflections uploaded another part of the novel ending! ;D Totally lightens up the mood. 

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3 hours ago, Pollen Ainne said:

Not bad. This I can get with, although I still wish she doesn't die of suicide.

 

As for the happy ending. I definitely would prefer that. The characters deserved it. 

 

I know but its got that poetic ring of ending her life on her own terms and since only the very end is changing in this scenario (guess, last two episodes) she was already down that dejected path and idk if theres time to make a truly climatic dying scene where she is killed that doesnt look like a freak accident. Maybe her dying while saving Ning Yi during a showdown between him and the dacheng prince. But is he a big enough villain now to die for? I feel that's even more in vain.

 

OR jin si yu manages to slip her a poison that'll kill her only after a while. Could be the plot twist of that drug as in if you try to stop its effect(making you crazy) it'll kill you in the near future. Zhiwei doesn't  know this and after jinshi she leaves helian zheng to go back with Ning Yi. Its unclear whether they are fully back together like ready to marry but she's there with him for his reunion with his mom and shes like part of the family. When yale is kidnapped she helps Ning Yi and realizes her new brother is involved. She comes up with a plan to trick him and save her. Gu nanyi kills the dacheng prince and while he wasn't good she still mourns him because she lost the last of her family. Zong chen dies too in between but she knows the dacheng prince was to blame.

Ning Yi then becomes emperor after NSZ faked his death (yueling is still alive to carry out that plot)

 

Zhiwei stands by him and watches him ascend the palace and become emperor (she's disguised as a male official. Wei Zhi tribute hah!) He looks at her and smiles then looks at the officials and nods. Everyone starts bowing and praising him but zhi wei looks a little uneasy.

 

Ning Yi and zhiwei are playing go in his informal throne room (fengyun palace?) He hints her about his desire to make her empress in a non straightforward way like...maybe zhiwei is criticizing the decor of his palace and he's like "you know the empress's quarters have _____*something she likes*____" and she's all "what? nah I hate that. Remind me never to go in there". And he asks " well what do you think will make you go in there?"  (I know this is some crap dialogue but the idea is that he doesnt ask or command explicitly)

 

We don't get a clear answer from her, she says some thing poetic that's neither here not there then looks wistful. He changes the topic and camera pans out.

Then Wei wang meets NSZ and you know, same theatrics we saw.

 

Zhiwei then meets NSZ and the exchange is even more charged than the one in the show. He shows his true colours but this time when he says, "Are you going to be his empress? ...Do you think the officials will accept you etc same bs" She smiles and says yes to richard simmons him off. This makes him really mad and he says something that makes zhiwei plunge the knife in her hand and kill him for good. While he dies she says something scathing like, "you are responsible for your children's deaths and they wont treat you well when you reach the next world" or "You'll go down in history as a laughingstock and mediocre emperor"...

But after he dies she bursts out crying. And suddenly shes coughing blood and turning red in the face.

 

Guards come rushing in followed by Ning Yi. NY screams "Father!" (fugha?) when he see him dead. Rushes to him, turns to give his classic threatening, maniac look to zhiwei but sees her dying and screams for the imperial doctor with even more urgency. He lays her down on the bed as the doc comes to examine her. She can barely speak but she apologizes for killing his dad, says maybe she deserves this. He shushes her, asks her to rest.

Imperial doc doesn't know whats going on. But yale takes a look at her and says there was a spell attached to the poison. That only people from her tribe could make.

 

When she wakes up he says sweet stuff to her, then for the last time they put their heads together to figure out how this happened. Zhiwei wonders if NY's cousin was involved (held captive at jin si yu's). Ning Cheng finds out that she was killed by jin si yu's men (before the flood i guess). Ning Yi basically mobilizes all his resources for a cure.

Gu nanyi caught yueling in hiding somewhere and noticed she intercepted a letter from NY's cousin to zhiwei. The letter explained how she was tricked into the making the poison that once she gets this letter she has to immediately do (some ritual type thing) to be cured.

But this should've been done two weeks earlier, now its too late.

Nanyi was going to kill yueling but he decided to take her to trial to be prosecuted because thats what zhiwei would do (apart from killing NSZ)

 

NY and FZW spend their last few days with each other away from everyone, they visit places in the capital play their flute. She says she wants to be free and travel the world like Zhu Yin. Last convo they have is at the cliff and its snowy (a.k.a the dream scene cut from the show but this time they really are there). FZW makes NY promise to look after the dacheng subjects and look after his empire fairly. She says she'll wait for him to do his duty on earth as emperor and then if they are fated to be together in another lifetime, "let it be as ordinary people"

 

FZW starts playing her flute. NY catches a rare flower poking through the snow so goes to pick it up. He stops hearing the flute, gets up and runs to her, holds her, places the flower in hand and cries .

 

Helian zheng commits suicide after he hears of her death. Or drinks himself to death. idk choose.

LMAOOO>>>>

but it makes sense because apart from the grief, he also felt really guilty because the whole jin si yu incident happened because he allowed zhiwei to go into battle. Ning Yi can't take the easy way out though (he says as he climbs those snowy stairs). He owes it to his subjects to rule their empire fairly and feels he deserves to live with his guilt. Ziyan had to be prosecuted for killing lady wang.

Atleast his mom is alive.

He opens a school for women in Feng Zhiwei's honour.

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5 hours ago, Pollen Ainne said:

Oh no, no no. Let us not torture Headmaster Xin some more. He already killed Lady Wang, that is too much burden on him already. Killing Ning Yi's beloved without his knowledge is completely out of the question. And if Zhiwei has to die, I would prefer Ning Yi to remain emperor. If Ning Ji becomes emperor before Ning Yi realizes his dream, there is no point to all of it. The entire story might as well be erased. Even if Ning Yi doesn't realize everything, he needs like at least 2-5 years to lay out foundations for Ning Ji. I am sorry but I would almost prefer the butchered ending to this one. It spells total defeat.

 

As for Zhiwei dying. I would prefer to stir out of suicide and have her die a valiant death which would be suitable for her character strength. Preferably to protect Ning Yi. She could also die for her people but we will need like 10 more episodes for that, because at this point, her connection to her people is very flimsy at best. She needs to be crowned Empress of Da Cheng to start sacrificing for them and make it look heart wrenching instead of an "smh" moment. And they definitely need to have a last honest conversation so we can cry about it and get it out of our system. lol

Hehe, sorry. That was a bit cruel of me. But I kind of like the ambiguity that Headmaster Xin giving FZW poison as an out. Is it really going to kill her or allow her to fake her own death? FZW/the Dacheng remnant must disappear for Dacheng to stop fighting. Ambiguity around her death (at least for the audience) could be created so pessimists would see her as dead while optimists would see her as alive as per novel. 

 

I can see a conversation happening between Headmaster Xin and NY afterwards that goes something like this:

NY: she didn't have to die. I could have saved her.

Xin: would you have locked her up then? Like your father did to you? Or to your mother? Do you think she would have seen it as saving her? How long would it take before your love turned into hate?

NY: (says nothing but there is a lot of conflict in his expression)

Xin: Your Majesty, do you still have that dream in your heart? Of a Tiansheng governed by the law? No crime can go unpunished. Besides, I promised that I would protect her people...I can only do that if there is no remnant of Dacheng. Forgive me, Your Majesty, you are usually very good at making plans that suit your heart but you must put Tiansheng first, before friends, before family, before loved ones. Only then will the dream exist.

NY: I will be just like my father.

Xin: You will truly be the Emperor.

NY: If only Ning Qiao was still alive. Then I could have been just a useless prince, making silk, drinking wine, chasing a stupid girl.

Xin: Erhua and my child would still be alive.

(They give offerings of wine to the departed.)

Your Majesty, I am a criminal who murdered Lady Wang for revenge. You must prosecute me also...

 

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1 hour ago, niniandkun said:

Zhiwei then meets NSZ and the exchange is even more charged than the one in the show. He shows his true colours but this time when he says, "Are you going to be his empress? ...Do you think the officials will accept you etc same bs" She smiles and says yes to richard simmons him off. This makes him really mad and he says something that makes zhiwei plunge the knife in her hand and kill him for good. While he dies she says something scathing like, "you are responsible for your children's deaths and they wont treat you well when you reach the next world" or "You'll go down in history as a laughingstock and mediocre emperor"...

But after he dies she bursts out crying. And suddenly shes coughing blood and turning red in the face.

 

Guards come rushing in followed by Ning Yi. NY screams "Father!" (fugha?) when he see him dead. Rushes to him, turns to give his classic threatening, maniac look to zhiwei but sees her dying and screams for the imperial doctor with even more urgency. He lays her down on the bed as the doc comes to examine her. She can barely speak but she apologizes for killing his dad, says maybe she deserves this. He shushes her, asks her to rest., they visit places in the capital play their flute. She says she wants to be free and travel the world like Zhu Yin. Last convo they have is at the cliff and its snowy (a.k.a the dream scene cut from the show but this time they really are there). FZW makes NY promise to look after the dacheng subjects and look after his empire fairly. She says she'll wait for him to do his duty on earth as emperor and then if they are fated to be together in another lifetime, "let it be as ordinary people"

 

FZW starts playing her flute. NY catches a rare flower poking through the snow so goes to pick it up. He stops hearing the flute, gets up and runs to her, holds her, places the flower in hand and cries .

 

Helian zheng commits suicide after he hears of her death. Or drinks himself to death. idk choose.

LMAOOO>>>>

but it makes sense because apart from the grief, he also felt really guilty because the whole jin si yu incident happened because he allowed zhiwei to go into battle. Ning Yi can't take the easy way out though (he says as he climbs those snowy stairs). He owes it to his subjects to rule their empire fairly and feels he deserves to live with his guilt. Ziyan had to be prosecuted for killing lady wang.

Atleast his mom is alive.

He opens a school for women in Feng Zhiwei's honour.

I can't imagine Ning Yi forgiving anyone for killing his dad. I know his dad is horrible but Ning Yi has a lot of abandonment issues. But yeeeeesss to the flute scene and Ya le being still alive. I think Ya le would have totally given everyone a level-headed 'let bygones be bygones'. 

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36 minutes ago, morganian said:

I can see a conversation happening between Headmaster Xin and NY afterwards that goes something like this:

NY: she didn't have to die. I could have saved her.

Xin: would you have locked her up then? Like your father did to you? Or to your mother? Do you think she would have seen it as saving her? How long would it take before your love turned into hate?

NY: (says nothing but there is a lot of conflict in his expression)

Xin: Your Majesty, do you still have that dream in your heart? Of a Tiansheng governed by the law? No crime can go unpunished. Besides, I promised that I would protect her people...I can only do that if there is no remnant of Dacheng. Forgive me, Your Majesty, you are usually very good at making plans that suit your heart but you must put Tiansheng first, before friends, before family, before loved ones. Only then will the dream exist.

NY: I will be just like my father.

Xin: You will truly be the Emperor.

NY: If only Ning Qiao was still alive. Then I could have been just a useless prince, making silk, drinking wine, chasing a stupid girl.

Xin: Erhua and my child would still be alive.

(They give offerings of wine to the departed.)

Your Majesty, I am a criminal who murdered Lady Wang for revenge. You must prosecute me also...

 

 I love this convo!! It actually sounds like ziyan! Damn I miss them. And I like the reference to Ning Qiao and him being a useless prince, it sort of comes full circle in contrast to the beginning. I suppose Ning Yi could forgive him eventually but it'll take a long while before this convo can happen. He has a temper too remember.

39 minutes ago, morganian said:

I can't imagine Ning Yi forgiving anyone for killing his dad. I know his dad is horrible but Ning Yi has a lot of abandonment issues. But yeeeeesss to the flute scene and Ya le being still alive. I think Ya le would have totally given everyone a level-headed 'let bygones be bygones'.  

 

Yeah its a tough sell but im sort of counting on everything happening quickly to sort of stun him. I can't imagine him not attending to zhiwei while she is on the brink of death. And i'm hoping he compartmentalizes his anger and grief of losing his father for the time being because losing zhi wei is painful too. He knows his dad wasn't a saint and his own mom has suffered at his hands. Maybe like you said she could influence him too to take the high road.

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6 hours ago, skibbies said:

First I want to applaud you for translating these lyrics because just the thought of translating them makes me want to cry, I think you did a fantastic job.

 

Just some additional notes: 奈何 naihe can also reference Naihe Qiao, the bridge that every soul have to pass and drink Mengpo soup to forget their previous lives before reincarnating. It's actually what I thought of when I first heard the song even though even though helplessness fits better. The segment in both of the song can be taken as them being separated by life and death. Interestingly enough in Ning Yi's "I traverse alone" 渡 implies he's crossing a river or bridge, even though from context, it should be him living his life alone? Is it a typo? Or I suppose both songs could be from when they died, at different times, rather than when FZW died.

 

轻生's literal meaning is making light of one's life, usually a euphemism for suicide, though it doesn't make sense in context. It's just lots of death? they directly and indirectly caused a lot of death? I'm not sure about disdain?

 

  Reveal hidden contents

The World of Ning Yi part 1 & 2: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekx7yHGxqS8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juEMm07pYi8

Getting to know Zhi Wei part 1 & 2: (the title is an idiom pun...)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZTH_yWOU8lY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6iJppAQGBck

Older supporting characters part 1 & 2: (the title is reference to a sword from Return of Condor Heroes, something like plain looking sword can exert lot of power as long as the sword holder is powerful enough?) There's no interview with the emperor for some reason, sad face.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipIuK2H4J0Y

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCzBOp5HrOs

Younger supporting characters part 1&2: 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFXRwPVEZ2I

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ney9wyBPwXU

 

The beginning/inception: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XmgoWUZsk7Y

The creators (mainly about the directors): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHa6DTmyR6Y

Theme: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aDKc1gkqNPU

Costume: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WKugxYi9Pw8

Art/Set: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=btTrFoPIO0M

Action (the action director is a very well known one from hk) : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VVbC9Csp0AQ

Etiquette (he's also responsible for etiquette in NiF, Legend of Mi Yue and Tribes & Empires: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UM5_vVn944E

Special Effects: (it's mostly about the lake scene): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=krhJXtvV5bM

Imaging? (this is more a general one, director mentions sending initial cut to SARFT): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4-f1SNc-D_I

Post Productions (OST, editing and CG): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y85lYEPItVg

Extras: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGXZnovWYx8

Closing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3aQkusSK9OA

 

 

 

Thanks for the tip about the bridge! There's so many double meanings footnotes are probably needed haha. It makes more sense since there's so much bridge and water imagery along with stuff about the realm of the living and dead. I translated 轻生一剑知 as disdain for death because it was taken from 送李中丞之襄州. The context for that was the retiring general spent his life devoted to his country, fighting fiercely on the battlefield with complete disregard for his own life, but is ultimately unrecognized for his efforts (only his sword knows of his bravery). I guess I used disdain to mean unafraid of/contemptuous of death, but it does seem a little ambiguous looking back.

 

Shout out to the scriptwriter and song writer for such beautiful lines though. It's been so long since historical dramas had dialogue with any semblance of poetry while still remaining understandable to the audience. 

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2 hours ago, niniandkun said:

Zhiwei then meets NSZ and the exchange is even more charged than the one in the show. He shows his true colours but this time when he says, "Are you going to be his empress? ...Do you think the officials will accept you etc same bs" She smiles and says yes to richard simmons him off. This makes him really mad and he says something that makes zhiwei plunge the knife in her hand and kill him for good. While he dies she says something scathing like, "you are responsible for your children's deaths and they wont treat you well when you reach the next world" or "You'll go down in history as a laughingstock and mediocre emperor"...

But after he dies she bursts out crying. And suddenly shes coughing blood and turning red in the face.

 

I wish she could have killed NSZ before dying. It would have been so epic, but there is absolutely no way the Chinese government would have let that air. 

 

1 hour ago, Wotad said:

still unsure if ill invest in this so hard to decide suppose ill watch a few episodes and see.. 

 

That's how it gets you. You casually start with a few episodes and then 70 episodes later, you are wrecked and obsessively watching Chen Kun interviews and variety shows while all the work you have to do collects dust in a corner.

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2 hours ago, tendrilsofwind said:

That's how it gets you. You casually start with a few episodes and then 70 episodes later, you are wrecked and obsessively watching Chen Kun interviews and variety shows while all the work you have to do collects dust in a corner.

OMG, this sounds like me! I already got to episode 34 in lost in 1949... I will have to find another one after this.lol

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4 hours ago, morganian said:

Hehe, sorry. That was a bit cruel of me. But I kind of like the ambiguity that Headmaster Xin giving FZW poison as an out. Is it really going to kill her or allow her to fake her own death? FZW/the Dacheng remnant must disappear for Dacheng to stop fighting. Ambiguity around her death (at least for the audience) could be created so pessimists would see her as dead while optimists would see her as alive as per novel. 

 

I can see a conversation happening between Headmaster Xin and NY afterwards that goes something like this:

NY: she didn't have to die. I could have saved her.

Xin: would you have locked her up then? Like your father did to you? Or to your mother? Do you think she would have seen it as saving her? How long would it take before your love turned into hate?

NY: (says nothing but there is a lot of conflict in his expression)

Xin: Your Majesty, do you still have that dream in your heart? Of a Tiansheng governed by the law? No crime can go unpunished. Besides, I promised that I would protect her people...I can only do that if there is no remnant of Dacheng. Forgive me, Your Majesty, you are usually very good at making plans that suit your heart but you must put Tiansheng first, before friends, before family, before loved ones. Only then will the dream exist.

NY: I will be just like my father.

Xin: You will truly be the Emperor.

NY: If only Ning Qiao was still alive. Then I could have been just a useless prince, making silk, drinking wine, chasing a stupid girl.

Xin: Erhua and my child would still be alive.

(They give offerings of wine to the departed.)

Your Majesty, I am a criminal who murdered Lady Wang for revenge. You must prosecute me also...

 

Actually the only thing I can imagine would happen is Ning Yi cutting off Xin Ziyan's head then regretting it afterwards. The guy is temperamental and has no qualms about killing. He almost killed Zhiwei when she poisoned his friend by accident. He will see red and competently forget that he is facing a friend. I tell you, Xin Ziyan is good as dead, he won't even get a word out. lol!

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6 hours ago, niniandkun said:
Spoiler

 

I know but its got that poetic ring of ending her life on her own terms and since only the very end is changing in this scenario (guess, last two episodes) she was already down that dejected path and idk if theres time to make a truly climatic dying scene where she is killed that doesnt look like a freak accident. Maybe her dying while saving Ning Yi during a showdown between him and the dacheng prince. But is he a big enough villain now to die for? I feel that's even more in vain.

 

OR jin si yu manages to slip her a poison that'll kill her only after a while. Could be the plot twist of that drug as in if you try to stop its effect(making you crazy) it'll kill you in the near future. Zhiwei doesn't  know this and after jinshi she leaves helian zheng to go back with Ning Yi. Its unclear whether they are fully back together like ready to marry but she's there with him for his reunion with his mom and shes like part of the family. When yale is kidnapped she helps Ning Yi and realizes her new brother is involved. She comes up with a plan to trick him and save her. Gu nanyi kills the dacheng prince and while he wasn't good she still mourns him because she lost the last of her family. Zong chen dies too in between but she knows the dacheng prince was to blame.

Ning Yi then becomes emperor after NSZ faked his death (yueling is still alive to carry out that plot)

 

Zhiwei stands by him and watches him ascend the palace and become emperor (she's disguised as a male official. Wei Zhi tribute hah!) He looks at her and smiles then looks at the officials and nods. Everyone starts bowing and praising him but zhi wei looks a little uneasy.

 

Ning Yi and zhiwei are playing go in his informal throne room (fengyun palace?) He hints her about his desire to make her empress in a non straightforward way like...maybe zhiwei is criticizing the decor of his palace and he's like "you know the empress's quarters have _____*something she likes*____" and she's all "what? nah I hate that. Remind me never to go in there". And he asks " well what do you think will make you go in there?"  (I know this is some crap dialogue but the idea is that he doesnt ask or command explicitly)

 

We don't get a clear answer from her, she says some thing poetic that's neither here not there then looks wistful. He changes the topic and camera pans out.

Then Wei wang meets NSZ and you know, same theatrics we saw.

 

Zhiwei then meets NSZ and the exchange is even more charged than the one in the show. He shows his true colours but this time when he says, "Are you going to be his empress? ...Do you think the officials will accept you etc same bs" She smiles and says yes to richard simmons him off. This makes him really mad and he says something that makes zhiwei plunge the knife in her hand and kill him for good. While he dies she says something scathing like, "you are responsible for your children's deaths and they wont treat you well when you reach the next world" or "You'll go down in history as a laughingstock and mediocre emperor"...

But after he dies she bursts out crying. And suddenly shes coughing blood and turning red in the face.

 

Guards come rushing in followed by Ning Yi. NY screams "Father!" (fugha?) when he see him dead. Rushes to him, turns to give his classic threatening, maniac look to zhiwei but sees her dying and screams for the imperial doctor with even more urgency. He lays her down on the bed as the doc comes to examine her. She can barely speak but she apologizes for killing his dad, says maybe she deserves this. He shushes her, asks her to rest.

Imperial doc doesn't know whats going on. But yale takes a look at her and says there was a spell attached to the poison. That only people from her tribe could make.

 

When she wakes up he says sweet stuff to her, then for the last time they put their heads together to figure out how this happened. Zhiwei wonders if NY's cousin was involved (held captive at jin si yu's). Ning Cheng finds out that she was killed by jin si yu's men (before the flood i guess). Ning Yi basically mobilizes all his resources for a cure.

Gu nanyi caught yueling in hiding somewhere and noticed she intercepted a letter from NY's cousin to zhiwei. The letter explained how she was tricked into the making the poison that once she gets this letter she has to immediately do (some ritual type thing) to be cured.

But this should've been done two weeks earlier, now its too late.

Nanyi was going to kill yueling but he decided to take her to trial to be prosecuted because thats what zhiwei would do (apart from killing NSZ)

 

NY and FZW spend their last few days with each other away from everyone, they visit places in the capital play their flute. She says she wants to be free and travel the world like Zhu Yin. Last convo they have is at the cliff and its snowy (a.k.a the dream scene cut from the show but this time they really are there). FZW makes NY promise to look after the dacheng subjects and look after his empire fairly. She says she'll wait for him to do his duty on earth as emperor and then if they are fated to be together in another lifetime, "let it be as ordinary people"

 

FZW starts playing her flute. NY catches a rare flower poking through the snow so goes to pick it up. He stops hearing the flute, gets up and runs to her, holds her, places the flower in hand and cries .

 

Helian zheng commits suicide after he hears of her death. Or drinks himself to death. idk choose.

LMAOOO>>>>

but it makes sense because apart from the grief, he also felt really guilty because the whole jin si yu incident happened because he allowed zhiwei to go into battle. Ning Yi can't take the easy way out though (he says as he climbs those snowy stairs). He owes it to his subjects to rule their empire fairly and feels he deserves to live with his guilt. Ziyan had to be prosecuted for killing lady wang.

Atleast his mom is alive.

He opens a school for women in Feng Zhiwei's honour.

 

 

53

 

Does the book say what happened to Gu nanyi?:rolleyes:

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2 hours ago, Pollen Ainne said:

Actually the only thing I can imagine would happen is Ning Yi cutting off Xin Ziyan's head then regretting it afterwards. The guy is temperamental and has no qualms about killing. He almost killed Zhiwei when she poisoned his friend by accident. He will see red and competently forget that he is facing a friend. I tell you, Xin Ziyan is good as dead, he won't even get a word out. lol!

 

6 hours ago, niniandkun said:

 

 I love this convo!! It actually sounds like ziyan! Damn I miss them. And I like the reference to Ning Qiao and him being a useless prince, it sort of comes full circle in contrast to the beginning. I suppose Ning Yi could forgive him eventually but it'll take a long while before this convo can happen. He has a temper too.

I keep on forgetting about that OTT temper of his. And I totally forgot about the poisoning incident with his friend. He was also pretty awful towards Nanyi when his mum died too.

 

Does anyone get GoT vibes when they watch this show? Okay, not the plot arcs so much (Game of Thrones has set up villains in the first season that only now are being killed off), but the RotP characters just make me think GoT. Ning Yi makes me think of Arya Stark and her kill list. Both characters have a strong sense of justice but are still capable of murderous revenge. And NSZ is like a male version of Cersai Lannister...loves his kids in a twisted kind of way.

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7 hours ago, tendrilsofwind said:

Thanks for the tip about the bridge! There's so many double meanings footnotes are probably needed haha. It makes more sense since there's so much bridge and water imagery along with stuff about the realm of the living and dead. I translated 轻生一剑知 as disdain for death because it was taken from 送李中丞之襄州. The context for that was the retiring general spent his life devoted to his country, fighting fiercely on the battlefield with complete disregard for his own life, but is ultimately unrecognized for his efforts (only his sword knows of his bravery). I guess I used disdain to mean unafraid of/contemptuous of death, but it does seem a little ambiguous looking back.

 

Shout out to the scriptwriter and song writer for such beautiful lines though. It's been so long since historical dramas had dialogue with any semblance of poetry while still remaining understandable to the audience. 

Ahhh yeah I got complete disregard of his life, disdain just seemed lot stronger/active negative emotion than what I thought of. I didn't know the context though, thanks :D

 

Unrelated I'm kind of half in the shipping Chen Kun/Nini hell, this is such a terrible idea ahhhhh. 

 

Oh, and I found my favourite behind the scene video! They were acting seriously for about 30 second for the video then it goes to ?!?! I shoddily translated the video but idk when it'll be up, you don't really need them though.

 

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