Do universities matter a lot in the long run?

[Crunchyrunchy]

I mean a lot of people are trying to get into the UC institutions, which harbors some of the finest public tertiary education the U.S can offer. However, I feel like while the UC may offer a bit more prestigious value than other universities like CSU's, would it really be much more advantageous over someone that went to a CSU.

For example, I talked to someone that went to a UC, and he works under people that went to a CSU. Obviously the end result is acquiring a good job and I feel like that CSU and UCs don't differ than much in that regards. There are good networking opportunities on both end. I am not sure why people stress to go to a UC rather than a CSU more often than not.

[MissAria]

@Crunchyrunchy I think what matter the most to get your first job is internship and work experience. Maybe the prestige of the university matters in different careers and if you want to work overseas.  I heard mixed opinion for accounting. Keep asking to people that are working in the career that you are interested to know.

Try to watch these videos : https://youtu.be/FrqOM9VPIwQ https://youtu.be/U73TAJP0s1o

 

[Crunchyrunchy]

2 hours ago, MissAria said:

@Crunchyrunchy I think what matter the most to get your first job is internship and work experience. Maybe the prestige of the university matters in different careers and if you want to work overseas.  I heard mixed opinion for accounting. Keep asking to people that are working in the career that you are interested to know.

Try to watch these videos : https://youtu.be/FrqOM9VPIwQ https://youtu.be/U73TAJP0s1o

 

 

Thank you!!

What is your major by the way?

[Guest severus]

I would say yes. I never thought there was a disadvantage in going to my not so prestigious university, mindset was "I'll get what I want as long as I work hard, get good grades, volunteer, am involved in extracurriculars, have work experience"..... Until I tried to break into a competitive industry that has clear cut "target schools" they hire from, and then throw a bone at non-targets like mine.

Slim chance that Goldman Sachs would hire from my alma mater. And people are 100% kidding themselves if they think they have the same job opportunities coming from a non-target school. Not that my career opportunities are bad, but I will have to work my way from a Canadian bank to the international bulge brackets that I want. 

If you want to come out of school and get simply "a job", sure it might not be a huge deal. 

[MissAria]

15 hours ago, Crunchyrunchy said:

 

Thank you!!

What is your major by the way?

Chemistry

[Sommelier]

22 hours ago, severus said:

I would say yes. I never thought there was a disadvantage in going to my not so prestigious university, mindset was "I'll get what I want as long as I work hard, get good grades, volunteer, am involved in extracurriculars, have work experience"..... Until I tried to break into a competitive industry that has clear cut "target schools" they hire from, and then throw a bone at non-targets like mine.

Slim chance that Goldman Sachs would hire from my alma mater. And people are 100% kidding themselves if they think they have the same job opportunities coming from a non-target school. Not that my career opportunities are bad, but I will have to work my way from a Canadian bank to the international bulge brackets that I want. 

If you want to come out of school and get simply "a job", sure it might not be a huge deal. 

 

Depends on what industry.  For industries that care a lot about this stuff, then that's accurate (investment banking, law).  But top international law firms and investment banks aren't salivating over Canadian university graduates anyways unless it's for their satelitte office in Canada.  They're awaiting the Ivy Leaguers and people out of schools like Berkeley, Stanford.  In a lot of cases, they'll seek the Canadians out of those schools.  

Canadian grads are still in a way "being thrown a bone" overall.  The best Canadian students (the students that are the top 1% of academic performers in the country, the ones that max out their math SAT IIs, the student-athletes that win NCAA scholarships, the ones that win international science competitions), end up mostly at American universities for this reason.  I know a few super impressive, Chinese Canadian kids from affluent families that ended up at top notch US universities on merit or sports scholarships at private California schools like Stanford and Caltech.   Joseph Tsai from Alibaba is a good example.  

It's well known that a brain drain happens from Canada to the US, especially among huge well-paying companies that seek employees on H1-B visas (Microsoft, Amazon).  Schools in California and Washington have a skill for taking all the good student athletes.  

As for other lucrative industries such as tech (the industry with the highest high-end payout), or just generally a lot of Fortune 50 companies, you'll see Execs from elite universities, small liberal arts schools, state schools, Canadian universities, schools from all around the globe.  Sure, you're probably better off in those situations out of a school like Wharton or Harvard.  But it's like poker, you can start off with strong pocket cards, and things can turn out badly quite easily.  A couple of these universities have disporportionately high Asian suicide rates.  

Malcolm Gladwell wrote about this, I forgot the specifics, but in many situations, you're better off at a good school over an elite school, especially if you know what you want to major in and enter a competitive program such as Engineering.  Whereas, at elite universities students might lose confidence and switch majors, at a good school the competition is less fierce.  I saw another study that said over 10 years, those that get good grades out of a good school end up in the same situation as those out of elite universities.  

Also, keep in mind that elite universities are chalk full of Asians, especially males, so much that they've basically had to set quotas.  There is a current law suit on the issue against a few elite East coast schools.  Except for the University of California system and Caltech where this practice is banned (Berkeley, UCLA), you can be very qualified for admissions, but rejected for being Asian.  So, those aren't necessarily schools you'd want to go to.  

 

[Guest severus]

I read up to "satellite office in Canada" and stopped... because that's not how IB really works. Investment banking is deal by deal, and whatever teams/ office that on a deal is largely determined by geographic location of the client, head office interference is little to none. Credit Suisse for example, no Swiss team is going to even touch a deal that is North American oil and gas despite being HQ, although the Houston and Calgary office will work together. Same way the Managing Director on the Calgary Goldman team would have autonomy over Canadian O&G deals (they hired a classmate of mine as their first year analyst in June, super rare for my school hence throwing a bone). Queen's is definitely target school for those bulge brackets, and they get first dibs for the Canadian teams.

My bank has capital markets operations all over the world. No way is Bay Street team overseeing deal flow going on in Mexico or Singapore, or here. Deal work is the same in every office if you're investment banking. It's just in Calgary I may be working on oilsands deals, in Toronto I'd probably be doing hyrdo deals. 

[Sommelier]

On December 27, 2015 at 8:24 PM, severus said:

I read up to "satellite office in Canada" and stopped... because that's not how IB really works. Investment banking is deal by deal, and whatever teams/ office that on a deal is largely determined by geographic location of the client, head office interference is little to none. Credit Suisse for example, no Swiss team is going to even touch a deal that is North American oil and gas despite being HQ, although the Houston and Calgary office will work together. Same way the Managing Director on the Calgary Goldman team would have autonomy over Canadian O&G deals (they hired a classmate of mine as their first year analyst in June, super rare for my school hence throwing a bone). Queen's is definitely target school for those bulge brackets, and they get first dibs for the Canadian teams.

My bank has capital markets operations all over the world. No way is Bay Street team overseeing deal flow going on in Mexico or Singapore, or here. Deal work is the same in every office if you're investment banking. It's just in Calgary I may be working on oilsands deals, in Toronto I'd probably be doing hyrdo deals. 

 

I'm not speaking to the issue of whether corporate interferes with the dealings of satelitte offices in Canada.  I'm speaking to, how US companies, especialaly the prestigious ones, will often hire grads from US schools that are Canadian if they can find them (and if a US company in the US hasn't already grabbed them).  

I know they recruit out of Rottman, Schulich and Ivey.  I have friends from there that got into IBs, but not that many got into banks compared to elite US schools (not even close).  And some of their higher ups are Canadians from out of US schools (Columbia, Harvard, Wharton, Stanford).   Especially if you're an Asian male and you want to work in IB, you're far better off at an elite US school where there are Asian American Business Associations and student orgs.  Especially at very Asian schools like Stanford and Berkeley, where a lot of the Asians are from around San Francisco, San Jose or LA suburbs (especially Berkeley).  

[singlebilingual]

I think it depends on what you do after the university. My uncle studied at a university in Chicago. He became a professor at ASU. Nearly a decade later, he moved with his family to Korea. I forgot which Korean university he became a professor of. He thought of what to do after he retires, and decided to start a company with his friends that made exterior parts for cell phones. For some reason, his business didn't do well after the smartphones became mainstream.

[zoo7]

Going to an university in my opinion changes your thinking and allows you to become a more rounded person. However, it depends on what you choose to do. Overall, I think what university/college you attended can affect what job you end up getting and I've heard in some cases, people prefer if you attended a certain university. Does the name of your university trump good, ol' fashioned hard work? Heck no. You've got to be dedicated, work hard, etc. 

I'm not too familiar with the California universities, but if the universities/colleges are close in quality, then it does it really matter which one you attend? Maybe not. I'd choose whichever one has the better quality department I wanted to study in. Example, if I wanted to study Political science and had to choose between two universities of similar quality, then I'd pick the one that has a better Political Science program.

Another thing to think about with the situation where the CSU people working over the UC people, is this a common occurrence or is this situation an outlier? It could be that they just work harder, etc. Another point on the networking piece, which university you attend and who you rub shoulders with can change things as well. Iron sharpens iron, meaning people sharpen people. You could encounter people who will make you a better person at one university in some respects more than if you attended another university. 

However, you can still become a kick butt, intelligent person and attend an university that is not considered "the cream of the crop." These are just my thoughts however.

[Ernie]

I guess they can help.