[Drama 2016] Moon Lovers ❤ Scarlet Heart Ryeo, 달의 연인-보보경심 려 \^0^/ Soompi Kdrama 2016 Winner

[kingpin]

 

 

 

 

 

[ruzikie]

@qwenli that was closed enough to see you spill the bts with So hold her shoulder in the forced kiss. I was wheeing when I saw the picture lmao xD 

not really sure how i see his mother treated So like bunch of shoot. She gave him birth and she even raised him even though she sent him as a hostage in shinju because he never raised as a son there. I wonder if the king ever felt guilty on him or even remorse to send a little kid like So when he still needs parents in his life but his mother ruined all of it 

[Mona Ys]

19 minutes ago, berny said:

@qwenli

Wow photo of the BTS of the OTP kiss.... would they be releasing the video though? maybe not allowed ?

The very "first" kiss scene that IU did (in a previous drama), it was her very first.....we've been waiting for its BTS hahaha...but it was never shown or have i missed it.? 

 

 

please please PDnim, I'm waiting for the kissing BTS pleassssseeeee

[iloveknovela]

Below are facts I have read recently about Wang So:

Gwangjong of Goryeo

 

Gwangjong (광종 光宗) (949 – 975) was the fourth Emperor of the Goryeo dynasty which ruled Korea from the fall of Silla in 935 until the founding of Joseon in 1392. He ascended the throne just thirty years after his father, King Taejo, founded the Goryeo dynasty, at a time when rival royal clans were vying for political power and the throne was constantly under threat. Recognizing the need to establish a stable government, he enacted a series of laws to centralize the power of the state, weaken the power of the local lords, and liberate slaves and return them to commoner status. In 958 he established a system of civil service examinations to select talented scholars for government posts; it continued in use for 940 years.

Gwangjong eliminated many of his powerful rivals by sending them to prison or having them executed. Later in his life, he appears to have repented, and built a number of Buddhist temples. His son and grandson developed additional policies which allowed Goryeo to succeed under a strong centralized government, and which prepared for rule according to a Confucian state model.

Background: Foundation of the Goryeo Dynasty

 

Taejo Wang Geon (Wang Kǒn태조 왕건) was a descendant of a powerful merchant family at Songdo, which controlled trade on the Yeseong River. He was born in 877 to a wealthy merchant clan based in present-day Kaesŏng. His father, Wang Yung, was leader of clan and became prosperous from trade with China. His ancestors were known to have lived within ancient Goguryeo boundaries, making Wang Geon a Goguryeon by descent.

Rise to Power

 

Taejo began his career during the turbulent Later Three Kingdoms period (후삼국 시대; 後三國時代; Husamguk Sidae). In the later years of Silla, many local leaders and bandits rebelled against the rule of Queen Jinsung, who did not have the qualities of a strong leader, or enact policies to improve the conditions of the people. Among those rebels, Gung Ye (궁예; 弓裔; Kung Ye) in the northwestern region and Gyeon Hwon (견훤; 甄萱; Kyŏn Hwŏn) in the southwest gained more power than the others, and defeated or absorbed other rebel groups as their troops marched against local Silla officials and bandits. In 895, Gung Ye led his forces into the far northwestern part of Silla, where Songdo was located. Wang Yung, along with many other local clans, quickly surrendered to Gung Ye. Wang Geon followed his father into service under Gung Ye, the future leader of Taebong, and began his service under Gungye's command.

Gung Ye soon recognized Wang Geon's ability as a military commander, promoted him to general and even regarded him as his brother. In 900, Wang Geon led a successful campaign against local clans and the army of Later Baekje in the Chungju area, gaining more fame and recognition from the king. In 903, he led a famous naval campaign against the southwestern coastline of Hubaekje, while Gyeon Hwon was at war against Silla. He commanded several more military campaigns, and won support from the public because of his capable leadership and his generosity towards the conquered people who had lived in poverty under Silla rule.

In 913, Gung Ye declared himself King of a newly renamed Taebong and appointed Wang Geon his prime minister. Gung Ye began to refer to himself as the Buddha, and persecuted people who expressed opposition to his religious arguments. He executed many monks, and later his own wife and two sons, and the public began to turn away from him. His costly rituals and harsh rule created even more opposition.

Rise to the Throne and Founding of Goryeo

 

In 918, four top-ranked generals of Taebong, Hong Yu (홍유; 洪儒), Bae Hyeongyeong (배현경; 裵玄慶; Pae Hyŏn-gyŏng), Shin Sung-gyeom (신숭겸; 申崇謙; S(h)in Sung-gyŏm) and Bok Jigyeom (복지겸; 卜智謙; Pok Chi-gyŏm) met secretly and agreed to overthrow Gung Ye and crown Wang Kon (Wang Geon) as their new king. Wang first opposed the idea but later agreed to their plan. The same year, Gung Ye was overthrown and assassinated near his capital, Cheorwon. Wang was crowned king and renamed the kingdom Goryeo, thus beginning the Goryeo Dynasty (918-1392). The next year he moved the capital back to his hometown, Songak.

Goryeo Dynasty

 

Wang Geon raided Later Baekje in 934, and accepted the abdication of King Gyeongsun of Silla in 935. The following year he conquered Later Baekje and unified the Korean Peninsula. Wang Geon was careful to placate the Silla aristocracy, and gave former King Gyeongsun the highest post in his government. He also married a woman of the Silla royal clan to legitimize his rule. He drafted ten injunctions for his successors to observe, including strengthening the state to protect against incursions from the northern nomadic states. He warned them that the power wielded by the various clans and warlords over their local areas must be weakened. He urged his successors not to interfere with Buddhist temples, and to avoid internal conflict among the royal clans, because it would result in usurpation of the throne.

When Wang Geon died in 943, he was given the posthumous title King Taejong (“Great Progenitor”). He was succeeded by his son Hyejong (혜종; 惠宗; 943–945, second Emperor) and then by his second son, Jeongjong (정종; 定宗; 945–949, third Emperor). In 949, King Gwangjong took the throne.^[1]

Life and Accomplishments

 

When Gwangjong, the third son of Wang Geon, came to throne in 949, he found that his position was very unstable. He had fought alongside his father and Gung Ye as they revolted against the Silla queen and then conquered Baekje and Goguryeo. The leaders of the royal clans were like warlords, each with a local power base in his home region, and each vying for control of the government. The military leaders who had helped to establish the Goryeo Kingdom were still attempting to dominate his rule and had ambitions to take the throne. Gwangjong’s predecessor, King Jeongjong, had tried unsuccessfully to reduce the power of various royal in-laws, including Wang Gyu and Pak Sul-hui, but lacking the support of the Gaegyeong elites, he had been unable to substantially strengthen the throne, or to move his capital to the newly constructed fortress at Pyongyang.

Gwangjong realized that his first priority must be to create a strong and stable government. Recognizing many similarities between his situation and that of Taizong of Tang (626 – 649), who had ascended the Chinese throne after helping his father to found the Tang dynasty, Gwangjong made a careful study of Taizong’s book Rules for Emperors (How A Ruler Should Act, Di Fan). From this book he acquired many ideas on how to create a stable government.

One of the first challenges faced by Gwangjong was to eliminate or reduce the power of his rivals, many of whom he imprisoned, exiled or had executed. He enacted a series of laws intended to centralize the state government. One of these, enacted in 956, was the liberation of slaves. During the conflicts among the various warring clans, many prisoners had been taken, and these were made to work as slaves on the estates of their captors. By restoring those who had been unjustly enslaved to their previous status as commoners, Gwangjong weakened the power of the local estates and increased tax revenue.

In 958, he initiated a system of civil service exams to select government officials (노비안검법; 奴婢按檢法) from among the most talented and intelligent candidates, regardless of social status or origins. Previously, government appointments had been made based on social status, family connections and favoritism rather than on merit, allowing many incompetent people to occupy top positions, and perpetuating the class system. The civil service examinations ensured a bureaucracy that would remain stable through regime changes. The system continued in use for 90 years, until 1894.

Gwangjong then selected a Korean era name, Junpung, Gwangjong proclaimed himself Emperor, a sovereign independent of any other country. This ended tributary relationships with China. Gwangjong’s successors were also known as Emperors.

Choe Seung-ro (최승로; 崔承老), a historian who served as Prime Minister to the first six Goryeo kings, including King Taejo, wrote a book criticizing Gwangjong for driving the kingdom into debt by being too obsessed with Buddhist activities, rituals, and public projects. He declared that the first eight years of Gwangjong’s reign had been peaceful, because he ruled wisely and did not mete out harsh punishments, but that afterwards, he had become a tyrant, spending money lavishly, tolerating corruption and executing anyone who opposed his policies of centralization. Late in his life, Gwangjong began to build numerous Buddhist temples; scholars speculate that perhaps he had repented for killing so many powerful people and wished to calm the resentment he had aroused.

Legacy

 

Gwangjong’s successor Gyeongjong (r. 975-981) began the practice of allotting lands and forests to officials, a policy that strengthened the central government of the Goryeo Dynasty and ensured its survival. In 982, his successor, Seongjong (r. 981-997) adopted the suggestions in the memorial written by Confucian scholar Choe Seungro and set up a Confucian state model.

Family

 

• Father: Emperor Taejo (태조)
• Mother: Empress Sinmyeongsunseong (신명순성왕후)
• Consorts:

1. Empress Daemok (대목황후), half-sister of Gwangjong
2. Princess Gyeonghwagung (경화궁부인), niece of Gwangjong

• Children:

1. Emperor Gyeongjong (경종), 1st Son of Empress Daemok
2. Crown Prince Hyohwa (효화태자), second Son of Empress Daemok
3. Princess Chonchu (천추공주), first daughter of Empress Daemok
4. Princess Bohwa (보화공주), second daughter of Empress Daemok
5. Empress Mundeok (문덕왕후), third daughter of Empress Daemok

 

[faeriealice]

8 hours ago, MAROSA_JIN said:

 

 

 

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The first picture (of 1st spoiler) is SO PRECIOUS. *SWOONS*

[deabakdrama]

I would like to recommend  you *a rang and majistrate* , both actor and actress had sort of chemistry, cute, loving, desperate,  romantic, sadness, laughing  and etc... 

You wouldn't  regret...

[syeramy]

People care more about rating than enjoying themselves watching the drama. 

ENJOY people. Just ENJOY. 

[redfrommars]

7 hours ago, dhia205 said:

he said he's afraid to be in romantic scene because he's lack of experience and said don't know how to do it...

i doubt him now.. he is such an expert 

 

or he have a lot of chance to practice now? 

@junee22 second with that.. let US them be happy before the angst come, even for a short. at least lets us witnessed happy WS before he back to his beast nature. 

or IU knows how to catch/receive a good kiss. oh this two~~ *swoons 

[Gabi Bros]

I need a BTS of the kiss scene!!! I need it!!! 

[aryugabriel]

Hi moonlovers,I'm newbie here..I'm happy to find this thread.Last time I enjoyed saeguk drama and too much attached to it was the drama Princess's man starring park si hoo&moon chae won.And now I feel the same again..aigoo please come Monday faster.. Tqvm for all the moonlovers here for the comments,gif,etc.I really appreciate it and read it all.Sorry for my poor English.. BTW to kill the day you should try princess's man too really good historical drama.

[Mona Ys]

Spoiler

 

 

I like this fanmade video, very nicely done. it covers WS-HS relationship from ep 1-8. 

[meahri_1]

@Bambiina You're definitely always welcome here. I don't know if you've noticed, but we do have quite a number of chinguduel here that frequent both moon threads, so please don't feel like you can't come back just because you expressed how you feel. 

[Mona Ys]

I thought I'd like to share this c-version link, I don't know if this is has been shared before, anyway, it is full of spoilers, but we don't know the ending of this K-version/adaptation. Enjoy  

Spoiler

http://koalasplayground.com/2011/09/22/discussion-of-the-final-episodes-of-bu-bu-jing-xing/ 

 

[aprilslily]

13 minutes ago, Mona Ys said:

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I like this fanmade video, very nicely done. it covers WS-HS relationship from ep 1-8. 

 

That was such a beautiful video!!!

[Adnana]

Time for a new installment in my ongoing series Courtship, 4th Prince-style.

After Part 1, What does a boy do after realizing that he likes a girl?

Spoiler

here is Part 2, What does a boy do after being rejected by the girl he likes? (Spoiler stills for next week's E10-11)

1) Well, if that boy is Wang So, first he kisses the living daylights out of her.

Spoiler

Again and again.

Even though this is a forced kiss, I'm not holding it against WS, since he is driven NOT by violence or lust but by sheer panic and despair at suddenly (and to him, inexplicably) losing the girl who has become his everything.

 

2) Next follows the time-honored tradition of kidnapping the girl. On horseback. To watch the dawn by the sea. (And I'm melting... Which is wrong... only I don't want to be right. What have you done to me, 4th Prince? And can you please do it some more? ) 

Spoiler

 

3) After his little snatch and grab, Wang So bares his soul. For his girl, he is even willing to give up being a prince. Which is HUGE for him, as we well know.

 

4) Then he gives her a gift: an actual, physical token of all his hope and love.

Spoiler

The 1st hairpin he ever bought, WS buried it among the prayer stones as he also buried his lifelong yearning for his mother's love. But here's proof that, despite all of life's cruel lessons and blows dealt to him, for only the 2nd time in his life--for the 1st time as an adult--WS has let down his emotional walls and allowed someone inside. He's bought a 2nd hairpin--for Hae Soo. The girl who now has all of his heart. The girl he can never let go in this lifetime.

 

5) Most importantly, when Wang So loves, there are no limits to his feeling, no sacrifice he won't make. He will protect Hae Soo even at the risk of his own life.

Spoiler

WS will drink the poisoned tea meant for the Crown Prince, because it was served by Hae Soo. Because she would have been executed for it.

Spoiler

And Hae Soo is running towards Wang So--not away from him--at long last.

 

6) It must be this juxtaposition (and contrast) between Wang So's incredible depth of feeling and Wang Wook's empty promises that finally moves Hae Soo's heart. 8th Prince will lose her forever.

Spoiler

 

7) Finally, according to lead actress IU (as revealed in her recent fanmeeting), we can expect a very fun episode 11. I know it's too soon for this, but I can't wait for the Wang So+Hae Soo boat to finally sail. Literally. 

Spoiler

As observant soompi-ers have already noticed, that hairpin Hae Soo is wearing sure looks familiar. 

 

Edited October 4, 2016 by Adnana

[junee22]

Just want to share my 2 cents here... @Bambiina I can understand what are you trying to say..but can I ask you a question dear? Did you probably read this thread from the first pages or you just started to read it recently of curiosity? I know I'm new to Soompi and I've only chose to camp in this thread..and sure I'm late on joining the fun in this thread coz I joined when it first aired,I didn't backread all the first commenters (its too long..I don't have many times lol). But if only you could see it from my POV you'd know that many of us who joined this journey from the very first start are now more mature on seeing this drama. Many are already don't care about the ratings,and many too didn't try to dissed other dramas...and those posts that maybe you think dissed another drama either they are new members or new commenters..and there are always senior members here that absolutely will ease those commenters minds..with trying to choose another topics or try to point on the positive sides. I saw moderators here too..some are in and out..and some are active at the thread..and like many had mentioned before the mods will make sure that this forum still in peace (along with senior members). And again I want to let you know that many of us here have been developed in our way of thinking and seeing things.

Sure there are always some who will be dissappointed at the ratings..but then again it's only because of their love to SHR,and with the lightning speed of the thread and the more followers,it couldn't be avoided right? There are always new ppl that would ask the same questions,and we always try to give the same explanation..I'm amazed of the patience of those who would always answer their question over and over again (coz actually I can't..but I learn to be like them). 

Also I'd like to ask you..why do you came to this thread? Of course because you interested in it right?So..if you don't mind my suggest is..just try to have fun and enjoy..and if there are some comments that you don't like..just scroll down and ignore it..at least that's what I did (it really could makes us emotional sometimes). And we'd love to read your comments and analysis of the drama as long as you don't compare it with your bias  

At the end of the day..it's all coming back to our preferences and our different tastes..like many of us had said..we are here gathered in this thread coz we all have the same taste of the dark chocolate..I'm sure you want to taste some of it too,coz you came here..so let's just share our dark chocolate and while we're here let's forget the sweet candy taste (at least for a while). 

Sorry for the long post..and sorry mods if this is OOT (I forgot to put in under the spoiler lol) 

[zi4r]

Hi everyone. Been a lurker here for months now... Actually, for the past week or so, I try not to even READ here or DB/DF comments sections, because many of the complaints regarding this drama really get on my nerves. But I can't stand it anymore, so I read 'em all, here comes my rant...

(Warning: It's going to be loooooooooong. And might sound harsh at times. I have a sharp tongue and no patience for kinder analysis.)

First of all, I love this drama probably for EXACT reasons that most people hate it for. It is gritty. It's ruthless. It doesn't get too tropey; it doesn't care about fan service (for the central characters; most fan service is dedicated to younger princes... which I am glad for). I avoid most K-Dramas (I mostly live in film land) because they try so hard to please the fans that they compromise the plot/pace. My love for LJG made me sit through Scholars (which gave very beautiful OTP moments but plots went dead by 3/4 way into the story; see what I mean?) and now I thought I would do so again with this one. BUT I am pleasantly surprised by how much the production team is willing to take risks.

So... let's talk about various complaints, shall we?

 

1) Not enough OTP time/moments (a.k.a "Why is HS not falling in love with WS already?!!! ")

I've talked in the intro about this drama's lack of pandering with tropey OTP moments so I won't touch on that anymore. But let's look at the logical flow of the story.

Okay, in a typical romantic drama, WS would have been a second lead, who sought to break up the beautiful OTP of WW/HS. But this is not a typical drama, is it? Our male lead is an anti-hero (a very very VERY damaged & dangerous one at that). And our female lead is a girl who never seemed to have gotten a real sense of emotional security in relationships, and found it in WW. And WS cannot offer that. Yes, his physical prowess get her out of various troubles, but his own emotional turmoil makes it near impossible for her to emotionally depend on.

Previously, HS was seeing the whole world with rose-tinted glasses. She made everyone happy; she thought WW is the perfect guy; she thought WS is just misunderstood (like, "Yes you killed, but it's to defend yourself, right?" Erm... no, he killed to try and gain his mommy-dearest's affection... yes, understandable but completely misguided... if she knew that, probably she would have run screaming since then) and thinks she can save/change him.

Now, her rose-tinted glasses her off when she looks at WS after the visions. She knows now that he is capable of "evil". She thinks, because of that, he is not salvageable. (Many people feel she's too changeable; I will talk about this later about #3. Just fruit-for-thought: If you think HS is being unreasonable, just look around and see how all the viewers easily forgive WS's earlier crimes: killing horse/monks... and then scream bloody-murder about a "force-kiss". We are ALL very fickle.)

What needs to happen next (and I am pretty sure it would), is that her glasses will be off towards EVERYONE. The fact is: everyone is capable of "evil", and her definition of "evil" is not evil in those times and just the way of life for the royals/monarchs. Yes, it was a kill-or-be-killed world; she kinda understood that. But it's even more complicated than that (And I will talk about that in #2). Once she sees the flip-side of everyone (WW especially), all bets are off, and she can see WS with a new set of eyes.

So, it's a logical progression. HS lives in our world -- "civilized" and capable of romanticizing/sensationalizing every single tiny act of "evil" or compassion. WS is seen as a savage even by the savage world of the past. We needa give them time.

 

2) WS is evil  (a.k.a "Please, writer-nim, don't make WS kill the princes!!" or "Hopefully, it's only in self-defence")

Okay, first of all, I am a sociology-nut... and this complaint makes me wanna kill myself. Why are we imposing our societal expectations on a man living in the society of a different era?!

HS has already touched on the "kill-or-be-killed world" part. So I won't go into details. But it's even more complicated than that.

The greatest monarchs of the past are "evil" by today's standards. Whenever we study them, we end up looking at them with both awe and revulsion. Even what we would consider a compassionate act (For example, emancipation of slaves, which Gwangjong would do later in his reign) involves killing or hundreds, if not thousands. Civilizations are born out of bloodied battles... So we are okay if he commands armies to kill people, but not okay if he kill his own brother (which might result in fewer real battles)?

WS would have to do whatever he thinks is necessary for the future of his family/kingdom (as in, the future as HE wishes to be, whether or not it is justifiably a good future in others' eyes). That's what would make him an effective King/future king. Do we like that such a thing was necessary in the past? No. But we should be glad that the drama is not sugar-coating the reality of life.

And the viewers who think the savagery of WS is overly dramatised... maybe watch a bit fewer dramas and consider reading some historical accounts.

 

2.1) The "force-kiss" (a.k.a "I thought we're past force-kisses in K-Dramas" or "How can you, writer-nim, it's their first kiss!!" or "This is really NOT OKAY!!! Understandable or not, it's not okay. Our ship has sunk!")

I'm categorizing this in the same category as "WS is evil". Because apparently, for us drama viewers, a force-kiss between OTP is now a bigger crime than killing a horse just for symbolism or killing people for the sake of getting approval from his treacherous mother.

I have seen a lot of people trying to defend him, so I'm not going to elaborate on why it is understandable that he did it. Short version: He's overwrought by his encounter with mom; or he feels loss of control of everything so it's his assertion of control; or he trusted her and now he feels she is betraying his trust, and he just snapped; or he just wants to shut her up... etc etc. Yes, it's understandable; and even as a hardcore feminist, I might say it's even justified. Afterall, in his eyes, she's suddenly acting like a lunatic and just threw him aside after he bared his soul to her. But moving on... 

I am pretty sure he's going to feel a lot of regret about this later on... but even if not, come on! People make mistakes. We sometimes hurt the people we love. I don't understand people's obsession of trying to ignore WS's failings. Can we all just accept that he's a very flawed man (as we all are), and HS will come to love him as he is?

And by the way, that force-kiss is not a screw-up by the writer. For one, it is very in-character for WS in this very moment. But most importantly, it's necessary for HS to wake up to the reality. In this world, if he really wants her body, he can take it. Now, he's favoured by the king; she's just a court-lady. He owns her. If he took advantage of her, he wouldn't be the one to be punished. The stolen kiss is an indicator of the vast difference in their station and the vast distance their love is supposed to go through. Despite all the advantage he has, he would choose to woo her... and that would be the symbol of love. Giving up control and putting yourself in the mercy of the one you love.....

As for those who feel "force-kiss" is "never okay" and should never be included in a drama... Well, killing, stealing, breaking out of prison, affairs, sex out-of-wedlock... they are all not okay. If we have to make sure our protagonist avoids all that, we'd better watch some show meant for audience under 10, not over 15.

 

2.2) Taejo is a disgusting pig (a.k.a "Ewww... that wrinkly old man wants to marry a 16yo girl?!!" or "So many wives... How disgusting!")

This is a smaller complaint but I feel the need to touch on it.

Many say that Taejo married so many... and not for love. Marriage is only a political device for him. And as such, he should be reviled. Erm.... no. The fact that he is using marriage as political device makes him a very good king. And of course, the fact that he sired many heirs and spares... ensuring the future of his newly founded kingdom.

Political marriage was a very common and effective way of life, not just in the past but in today's world. If a marriage can stop a civil war from erupting, why are we complaining about it? Do we really think that marriage out of love is something many kings can afford to do? Not to mention, when royals put their love/lust before their kingdom, it usually did not end well.

As for the many wives part, producing many heirs and spares IS the duty of a ruler. Please remember that back then, life expectancy is short and infant mortality is high. A King may lose many issues to war, disease, etc. Not to mention, he may lose many wives to childbirth too. Ensuring the bloodline survives is imperative to the peaceful transitioning once the King passes.

And marrying a 16yo? We are making judgement of the era where life expectancy was like <30 (It was 24 for males and 26 for females in Joseon, not sure about Goryeo)... with the mindset of a modern era where life expectancy is >80 (apparently, 81.3 now in Korea). Marriages had to be done young, especially for females... so that successful conception/childbirth can happen. And... since Taejo seems utterly uninterested in marrying for love/lust at least in this drama, it is obvious that he doesn't know whom he's marrying... let alone, how old she is.

 

3) HS is out-of-character/too changeable

The complaint mainly stems from the fact that she was willing to overlook that he's killed in the past... and yet, now she's freaking out "just because of a few visions".

I have already touched on HS's naive view of the world, how she seemed to think WS kills only for "good" reason, and how that worldview has begun to change in #1. So I won't touch on that anymore.

More importantly, HS is actually very much in-character, especially for us modern women. We deal with news of wars and corruption everyday, yet we find ourselves more outraged by abuse of pets, sex scandals of our idols, drama plots () etc. etc. Why? Because we are more affected by the things that we feel close to. She would care less about him killing people she doesn't know. But Eun is someone she's very close to -- the very picture of innocence in her eyes. So of course, she freaks out. Another thing to remember... she's still in love with WW. What if Gwangjong kills WW? Yes, WS is a friend... but WW is her love. The thought of one killing the other would be impossible for her to bear.

Most importantly, though, I think it's the manifestation of the guilt she feels. Let's say your friend harmed someone... you would feel sad/outraged but it would be nothing compared to the scenario where YOU gave your friend the gun that he/she uses to harm someone. WS was a powerless outcast... HS feels she changed that by removing the one thing that was holding him back... THE SCAR. She has now given him the power to achieve greatness... and that greatness will involve bloodshed. I don't know about you all, but I would want to kill myself if I were given such a responsibility.

 

4) The scar

The most major plotpoint to the story, and yet no one (not even the fans) seems to be able to wrap their head around this. "Why is that tiny little thing so important?" Unbelievable, isn't it?

First of all, let me talk about the visibility of the scar. Many feel that the childhood scar should be very faint by now, and as such, it is impossible for him to be that effected by it. Erm... have you guys ever seen a scar from infected wound in childhood? I have. On myself. Just above my knee. I fell on a jagged fence when I was 6 and got a half-cm deep and 2-inch long wound, and I didn't have proper access to medical care for 3 weeks because I was stuck in a freaking village, and it got infected... and now, 20 years later, it's still puckered and raised and frankly, kinda disgusting (Don't worry, I'm not ashamed by it). We live in an era where small injuries rarely get infected; if they do, they're easily cured; and then, we use all sorts of washes and treatments that renew our skin faster and thereby, making scars fade faster. Even then, many of us still suffer from the woes of acne scars, don't we? Now, think of the era where chance of infection was almost unavoidable and personal hygiene was not a primary concern of anyone, not even princes. Long story short, yes, scars can be very visible and pretty disturbing after years. Of course, the production team should have made the scar more grotesque to make a point, but hey, I for one don't want my dear LJG's face to be more marred than it is.

Now, about stigma against scars... I don't claim to know about Goryeo specifically (so correct me if I'm wrong), but I understand how monarchy works. Royals claim the RIGHT to rule, which is favoured to them "by the Heavens". Any imperfection in the royals can be seen as a sign of loss of favour by the higher powers, and as such, questions their right to rule. In my homeland, during the era of Kings, birth defects/birthmarks/grotesque scars were always seen as the sign of a low-breed and thus, were often exiled.

And from a more logical/reasonable perspective, scars/marks on skin/sores can be indicators of more serious diseases. People shun those with visible defects in the past because they are scared that it's contagious.

Lastly, I suspect WS has been wearing the mask almost all his life. He probably showed his face only when he was very young and was abused mercilessly for it. So he hides it all the time --> people think it must be worth hiding, so must be worse than it actually is --> they shun him --> he continues hiding... and the cycle continues. The fear of the unknown is what makes him an outcast. My guess is... even if he did the ceremony without mask/makeup on, people would have realized he's not a monster after all.

Oh, one more thing... I've been reading various comments on DB and DF that production team made a mistake... WS's scar is completely gone now. I think people are not watching HD and maybe, can't see... but production team has made a herculean effort to show a faint scar even when he's supposed to have makeup on. Sigh... seems they can't do anything right for the viewers. 

 

5) Choppy editing and ridiculous OST

I totally agree with these complaints. Editing is choppy... mainly because it's easily a 30-episode length drama and they have to try and squeeze it to 20. I feel the ones who made the decision did the cast and writers and the story great injustice, by giving them an impossible task of covering all the grounds in 20 episodes. And well, I have given up on OST. Yep, nothing to say.

 

All in all...

I think this drama is probably too mature and gritty for drama viewers. It's a sad fact, but we watch K-Dramas to feel "comforted"... and there's nothing comfortable about epic romance that is seemingly doomed to fail. K-Dramas have anti-heros in the past, but they usually tried their very best to sugar-coat the worst part of the lead characters.

I am very grateful that MLSHR has chosen to go the riskier path... although the ratings suffer from it. If I were the one writing, I'd take the risk to the very end... Make HS's rejection of WS as the reason for Gwangjong's ruthlessness... Her time-travel is predestined, and her attempts to change the past are the exact catalysts of the past... Make her the Helen of Troy -- "A face that moves a thousand ships (in this case, a thousand men)". Yes, I'm cruel that way. Aren't you guys glad that writer-nim is so much kinder?

 

Anyway, I should end this rant now. Gonna go back to lurking.

Edited September 23, 2016 by zi4r
grammar

[frostfire]

8 hours ago, dhia205 said:

he said he's afraid to be in romantic scene because he's lack of experience and said don't know how to do it...

i doubt him now.. he is such an expert 

 

or he have a lot of chance to practice now? 

@junee22 second with that.. let US them be happy before the angst come, even for a short. at least lets us witnessed happy WS before he back to his beast nature. 

 

That jaw line though 

[arabela]

Good morning everyone 

I enjoy reading your comments, and get confort in knowing I am not so lonely being in love with this drama!!!!

Being in the middle of the drama, I try to make up my mind and have some conclusions . 

I clearly love this drama because of WS - not only he is different from other kdrama's leaders, but he is indeed a charismatic, mesmerizing and complex character. I like both of his sides: the warm part and the cruel one. I like that he is changing and is more mature and more balanced than he was when he first arrived in the palace. I like the most his intelligence, boldness, determination and courrage.

I never saw him as a monster, even in the beggining, when his ruthless and violence were never out of the blue or without reason. He is impulsive, can be cruel and can kill if HE thinks is necessary, but he was never a psychopath or a beast - not even in the first episode.  My feeling is that HS has indeed a calming effect on him and can bring up his bright side - the smiling, good, generous, warm part - a part that showed up also when he was with his brothers, 13 prince, father trusting him , but is true she can bring it up even more and at a deeper level!!!. But he was never the man who can kill his brothers or anyone out of the blue or just because he get angry or cannot control himself, and this is one of the reason I dont think she will change the history, cause there is nothing to change - there is no way he could kill his brothers if he doesnt NEED to do it.  I never see him protrayed as a man who kill for pleasure, for being out of control, or just from cruelty. Despite his impulsitity and hot temper he is not a capricous man!!!! But is true he is not having a guilty conscious and dont have to a hard time to take the decision to kill someone if HE thinks is necessary. And has the potential to kill his political rivals and reign thourgh fear, as we know he did. She will not change that.

Loving and being loved transform each of us and WS is going to experience this influence too, but I dont think HS will change him like she is hoping, just because I dont think he is that kind of person she thinks he is in this moment and he will never be how she wants him to be - someone who will never kill someone from his family no matter what, who will never be crue to his enemy, a good and generous king. I think this is a fantasy from her part and even her will realise this. General is the one who know him best as he was in the past, when he was more ferocious and violent that he is today and I never have the impression that he consider him a "monster" . JM also knows him before HS and like the general he has a  great consideration for him and respect, even if he knows WS has to improve and mature. Noone consider him to be someone so violent as to commit crimes for pleasure or impulse. But both of them seems to know that he will be able to kill someone if he thinks this is a better solution - and, yes  , unfortunate, he doesnt have moral delicay to not do that  I also think that both of them and he himself consider this as a strength for those time and as a guarantee that he will be able to keep the state stable and this is for them more important than moral sensibility. I also think HS will go to realise this too, but for her, political reasons and the importance of state issues, will not weigh as much as her moral modern sensibilities and her sensitive and good heart. So, MY GUESS is that even if she will know that killing is a necessity and he is not a monster , the cruelty of his political decisions will be too much for her and want to leave him. My believe is that this is an inherent conflict of love between a strong king from a turbulent past and a sensitive and loving woman from present.  None of them can escape it and there is some inevitability in their separation and only in modern time, when he will not be a king, they can be happy. 

So put it more simple my reason is this: Either he killed his brothers - but then he must have reasons for that, and if he did, HS cannot change his mind, cause those reasons would be a necessity for him, or either he didnt kill his brothers and she does not have what to change. She could make him not kill his brothers only if she would have a better political plan to defeat them (something that seems hard to believe) or only if he was someone to kill without reason, lets say because he is just too impulsive, too violent temper, cruelty free which he is not! 

[Nymeria289]

@zi4r its not too gritty, I don't know what demo watches it but honestly speaking, I watched Cruel City, Punch, Signal and My Beautiful Bride, Last...its moderately dark with humor and romance mixed in it.....As for male lead with glaring flaws and deep seated anger and revenge in mind, there's always Ji Sung in Secret..It just suffered from a shaky start and never really recovered. It is like every other drama this year, has highs and then has lows. Like 8 was good then 9 sort of let a lot of people down. Time-slot matters, Monday is the first day of work after weekend. I think people do watch it, just not while it airs. They probably watch it at a later time.

Also, it came while MDBC had already attracted audience from good word of mouth and Monster had established a steady followers. Now that Monster's done, maybe some will shift to this. I hope so.