[Drama 2015/2016] I Have A Lover 애인있어요

[Lmangla]

Really like the analogy you drew between Jin-eon and Hae-gang and the relationship of a tree and a traveler. It's so heartwarming and touching.

But personally, I think you ennobled Hae-gang a bit too much...

In fact, she didn't have to protect Jin-eon as no-one wanted to 'cut him down'...

His father gave up on him long ago, considering him a wuss, so one may say Jin-eon was just nothing to him. 

His mother initially wanted to help Hae-gang save the marriage until she got frustrated at her regarding the fire accident.

Jin-ri despised her sister-in-law yet didn't take actions against her (and her marriage) till Hae-gang suggested that her father displace Jin-ri in the company.

As for Tae-seok, Hae-gang was in the same boat as him all along and he didn't see her as an overt opponent till recently either.

So, if further analogy with the tree and the traveler is continued, personally, I would say that the tree, which observed the traveler fighting his way, witnessed that he didn't hesitate to play dirty, and ruthlessly eliminated anyone who blocked his path up, which is why it started to dislike the latter...

 Yet since one of tree's ultimate objectives is to give shade, it was still ready to be there for him.

However, when the traveler took the death of the love fruit (Eun-sol), as cold-heartedly as he took the sufferings and deaths of the people he was used to remove, it turned out to be the last straw...

am glad that you liked the analogy @ayselluna. as I was writing it, was wondering if it was too lyrical but that was the image that came into my head. while watching the initial few episodes, have been wondering why HK is still fighting for this marriage and whether it was just for social and job gains. there wasn't much to suggest that she loved JE so deeply -- not the kind of depth we are seeing now with her anguish. so @irilight's observation made think what is going on. not sure if the traveler sounds so ennobled but yea, HK is not that ennobled like you said. kekeke.  but think she did protect JE as she became the lawyer at the company. (or did I misunderstand that? can someone correct me if am wrong) as you said the dad thinks very low of JE and he was opposed to the divorce only because he wants HK for the company. so because she got to be in the dad's good books defending them and doing whatever necessary, JE got to play around in his little lab and be anonymous and do what he liked to do. he wasn't forced into the responsibilities of being the heir of the company because HK was there to fill the shoes. so thats what I meant by her protecting him -- basically he got to shrug off the responsibilities because it was HK who was expected to shoulder them. think thats why it broke her heart when he knelt down in front of his father. I noticed that he never mentioned SR but it was just that he wanted to be free from HK and was willing to take on his role as heir. so basically there was no need for HK anymore. since there was is no use for her and he no longer needs her, how can she stay and wait? so she left.

[ayselluna]

1) Jin-eon wanted to marry Hae-gang while she was against it...

2) Hae-gang openly stated she didn't love him at their supposedly happiest time (when lying together on the lawn and talking about feelings)...

She looked much more joyous on having been promised the position of Vice President though...

3) Later again she was immersed in her work, making her husband feel neglected...

So I wonder how comes she all of a sudden realized that she loves him? 

She didn't love him at his best, then what made her so desperately hold onto him at his worst?

Jin-eon is pig, Seol-ri is too, but Hae-gang is masochist.

It's natural for pigs to enjoy mud, but it's not normal for a person to tolerate humilation and mistreatment unless she/he derives pleasure from it.

I would definitely pity Hae-gang if it wasn't her own choice. 

But what's the point in aching for someone who doesn't mind being spat on?

To me, Hae-gang looks more psychotic than Seol-ri.  And the only rational explanation of her behaviour I can think of is her either doing it for wealth, power etc. or for her ego.

She is used to be first, be it in the court or in life, hence she can't lose to anyone, even if it requires to ignore the second party, who cries out that he can't breath and confesses that his heart is somewhere else, or kneeling down to someone she considers as filthy as toilet (Seol-ri).

As for love, I don't believe she loves Jin-eon (the incident with the toilet water is proof). She treated him the way no decent person would treat their enemy.

And I can't even blame it on a fit of passion, as she was coolly waiting for him to drink it.

 Respect without love? Not in my book.

The case with the fire at the lab was demonstrative to me too...

I believe that when you love someone, your first instict should be wanting to rescue them. As to Hae-gang, she was calculative again, trying to find out Jin-eon's whereabouts to see if it was worth risking her life or not. At least this is how I saw it.

Now looking forward to the next episodes, which may still prove me wrong...

There is a thin line between love and hate. Years ago, a spouse could get away with killing their or wife if they caught them cheating......it was murder in the heat of passion. To find out your spouse is cheating on you is emotionally a very big deal. There are so many different emotions coursing through your body. I have to say that this drama is the first one I've seen where they are truly depicting a scorned woman.  HK is feeling anger, hurt, betrayal and pain. She's also feeling  confusion. Her wanting to strikeout at JE is understandable. When a woman  doesn't express any emotions of hurt or especially anger I think that is a false representation of true pain experienced by a woman who feels betrayed. Giving him a dose of toilet water is understandable to me. In One Warm Word, she tried to smother her husband with a pillow while he slept. In Give Them Something To Talk About, she feed him a family secret sauce used for cheating husband--made him sick. Wanting to retaliate is understandable to a certain degree. Some women/men retaliate by cheating themselves.

There  are many types of love Eros or romantic love is different from the love that we all have for our fellow man or woman.  We see daily, complete strangers risking their lives to save people they don't know. This is more reactive than actual knowing and loving the person personally (although it is a form of love). JE would have jumped in the water to save anyone that was drowning.  HK may have very well been testing him but this was a very poor test and stupid one for a very smart attorney considering he would have done the same thing for a complete stranger.  A part of me feel that at that moment HK truly wanted to die. She didn't have to take in water to prove a point. She has been with him for 20 years or so, so I'm sure she is feeling like she is losing everything.  I've said it before, I believe that she doesn't know what to do and is desperate. 

I think HK does love him, but doesn't really know how to express it. There are families that never tell one another that they love them because they were not raised that way. However, their bond of love is no different than the family that says it all the time--sometimes that love can be even deeper than those saying it. HK comes across as someone who is emotionally starved and doesn't know how to express love. HK didn't suddenly start loving him, I think she always has.

They both have major flaws, but when JE brought another person into their marriage instead of trying to talk to HK who made several comments about him not wanting to have a real conversation with her, he crossed a line. HK trying to be calculating also had a role in bring SR into her house, but JE kept her there.

There is always this wish to take a revenge when you're hurt, regardless of whether you've been cheated on or mistreated in any other way. But there is line you should never cross.

Just as I can't justify adultery, whatever reason may lead to it, I can't accept this horrible deed of Hae-gang, regarding toilet water, either.

And if I am understanding towards an angry wife, then I should be equally understanding towards a husband, who suffered due to his wife's coldness. But I can't.

Besides, if someone is hurt to the extent that they can't help their indignation, they'd better let go of the person or leave themselves.

What's the point in torturing the spouse and yourself? Especially when he openly states he is done with you and wants divorce.

No normal person will put up with humilation and mistreatment unless (s)he is masochist or is pursuing some other purpose.

If you hate him, let him go, and if you love him, do the same.

He cries out that he is coming to the point of hatred and begs you to leave him alone, but because you're Do Hae-gang who's always right, you know his needs better than he does. Absurd.

Indeed, there are families that don't express their feelings but they make it feel it through their actions. 

So, If Hae-gang let him go, instead of holding onto him like a madman, he might have believed that she loves him.

But when you forcibly try to attach yourself to someone, in their eyes you become no more than an egoistic leech.

Edited September 16, 2015 by ayselluna

[zenya22]

Really like the analogy you drew between Jin-eon and Hae-gang and the relationship of a tree and a traveler. It's so heartwarming and touching.

But personally, I think you ennobled Hae-gang a bit too much...

In fact, she didn't have to protect Jin-eon as no-one wanted to 'cut him down'...

His father gave up on him long ago, considering him a wuss, so one may say Jin-eon was just nothing to him. 

His mother initially wanted to help Hae-gang save the marriage until she got frustrated at her regarding the fire accident.

Jin-ri despised her sister-in-law yet didn't take actions against her (and her marriage) till Hae-gang suggested that her father displace Jin-ri in the company.

As for Tae-seok, Hae-gang was in the same boat as him all along and he didn't see her as an overt opponent till recently either.

So, if further analogy with the tree and the traveler is continued, personally, I would say that the tree, which observed the traveler fighting his way, witnessed that he didn't hesitate to play dirty, and ruthlessly eliminated anyone who blocked his path up, which is why it started to dislike the latter...

 Yet since one of tree's ultimate objectives is to give shade, it was still ready to be there for him.

However, when the traveler took the death of the love fruit (Eun-sol), as cold-heartedly as he took the sufferings and deaths of the people he was used to remove, it turned out to be the last straw...

am glad that you liked the analogy @ayselluna. as I was writing it, was wondering if it was too lyrical but that was the image that came into my head. while watching the initial few episodes, have been wondering why HK is still fighting for this marriage and whether it was just for social and job gains. there wasn't much to suggest that she loved JE so deeply -- not the kind of depth we are seeing now with her anguish. so @irilight's observation made think what is going on. not sure if the traveler sounds so ennobled but yea, HK is not that ennobled like you said. kekeke.  but think she did protect JE as she became the lawyer at the company. (or did I misunderstand that? can someone correct me if am wrong) as you said the dad thinks very low of JE and he was opposed to the divorce only because he wants HK for the company. so because she got to be in the dad's good books defending them and doing whatever necessary, JE got to play around in his little lab and be anonymous and do what he liked to do. he wasn't forced into the responsibilities of being the heir of the company because HK was there to fill the shoes. so thats what I meant by her protecting him -- basically he got to shrug off the responsibilities because it was HK who was expected to shoulder them. think thats why it broke her heart when he knelt down in front of his father. I noticed that he never mentioned SR but it was just that he wanted to be free from HK and was willing to take on his role as heir. so basically there was no need for HK anymore. since there was is no use for her and he no longer needs her, how can she stay and wait? so she left.

That is how I understand Hk's character too.

[ayselluna]

am glad that you liked the analogy @ayselluna. as I was writing it, was wondering if it was too lyrical but that was the image that came into my head. while watching the initial few episodes, have been wondering why HK is still fighting for this marriage and whether it was just for social and job gains. there wasn't much to suggest that she loved JE so deeply -- not the kind of depth we are seeing now with her anguish. so @irilight's observation made think what is going on. not sure if the traveler sounds so ennobled but yea, HK is not that ennobled like you said. kekeke.  but think she did protect JE as she became the lawyer at the company. (or did I misunderstand that? can someone correct me if am wrong) as you said the dad thinks very low of JE and he was opposed to the divorce only because he wants HK for the company. so because she got to be in the dad's good books defending them and doing whatever necessary, JE got to play around in his little lab and be anonymous and do what he liked to do. he wasn't forced into the responsibilities of being the heir of the company because HK was there to fill the shoes. so thats what I meant by her protecting him -- basically he got to shrug off the responsibilities because it was HK who was expected to shoulder them. think thats why it broke her heart when he knelt down in front of his father. I noticed that he never mentioned SR but it was just that he wanted to be free from HK and was willing to take on his role as heir. so basically there was no need for HK anymore. since there was is no use for her and he no longer needs her, how can she stay and wait? so she left.

 

@Lmangla, by 'ennobling Hae-gang', I actually referred to the part of your statement, which said 'she was protecting him from anyone, including his family' 

I'm still not sure if she wanted to be in dad's good books for Jin-eon, as he'd never asked her for it, or just followed her own ambitions.

Moreover, she knew his attitude towards her power, position and money hunger, yet she overlooked it, even though it was one of the reasons which gradually drifted them apart.

Edited September 16, 2015 by ayselluna

[valsava]

I'm so sick of the adultry mess let's move on 

[myonenonly]

Arghh!  This weekend's episodes is so heart breaking! Adultery will drive any wife to the roof esp. when you caught the act! I would act like a mad woman too & will do things unimaginable at that instant. I would pee on my husband's coffee probably..  

When JE kneeled down & beg his Dad to let go of HG, it was the last straw for her. She felt all alone, betrayed, hurt & numb. At that moment for her (as a last "say") setting him free would save the hurt & pride she has left on her. I think JE still love HG but his anger/contempt towards her is overpowering. What he feels for SR is peace.

I hate what SR said to HG in the hospital. It's not ok to love someone who's taken & flirt with him. Yoo!-Wait until the guy is free! She's selfish & only thinks of what she wants/feels. There are rules to be followed or else the world would be in chaos. That's why "Don't covet thy neighbor's wife/husband" is in the Ten Commandments. 

Love all your post. 

Edited September 16, 2015 by myonenonly

[zenya22]

am glad that you liked the analogy @ayselluna. as I was writing it, was wondering if it was too lyrical but that was the image that came into my head. while watching the initial few episodes, have been wondering why HK is still fighting for this marriage and whether it was just for social and job gains. there wasn't much to suggest that she loved JE so deeply -- not the kind of depth we are seeing now with her anguish. so @irilight's observation made think what is going on. not sure if the traveler sounds so ennobled but yea, HK is not that ennobled like you said. kekeke.  but think she did protect JE as she became the lawyer at the company. (or did I misunderstand that? can someone correct me if am wrong) as you said the dad thinks very low of JE and he was opposed to the divorce only because he wants HK for the company. so because she got to be in the dad's good books defending them and doing whatever necessary, JE got to play around in his little lab and be anonymous and do what he liked to do. he wasn't forced into the responsibilities of being the heir of the company because HK was there to fill the shoes. so thats what I meant by her protecting him -- basically he got to shrug off the responsibilities because it was HK who was expected to shoulder them. think thats why it broke her heart when he knelt down in front of his father. I noticed that he never mentioned SR but it was just that he wanted to be free from HK and was willing to take on his role as heir. so basically there was no need for HK anymore. since there was is no use for her and he no longer needs her, how can she stay and wait? so she left.

@Lmangla....

That memory of the painting on the bench, I thought was revealing of their perceptions about of their relationship.

In his family JE is looked down by his father, loved by his mother and hated by his half-sister. His only refuge was his mother who does love him dearly but also conditionally as she also sees him as the only son and heir to the father’s fortune and the means to hold on to her husband and position. I am basing this again on Scandal where the mistress in that drama calls herself the second wife even when the real and legal wife was alive and lived with the husband. Even the people who associated with the husband called her the 2^nd wife. Also in other Kdramas and Taiwanese dramas the long time mistress has children and is called the 2^nd wife. The first episode in this drama Ms Korea ’75 had her crown on and was parading in front of her husband and she said to the husband “I am the second wife” it has since been edited to “I am not your first wife anyway”. However the conversation between stepmother and Jin Ri where Jin Ri snarls at stepmom and said “my mother had a hard time because of you and your son. She died without having the chance of to slap you.” So I deduced that meant Jin Ri’s mom was the first wife who lived sadly resenting the 2nd wife/mistress Miss Korea and her son JE. So here is JE growing up being resented by his sister and seen as the usurper son of the concubine and disdained by his father as a weakling.  It is no wonder that he avoids his family and resents his father as much as the father disregards him. He learns of his father’s unscrupulous business deals and his resentment festers. Then he meets HK when he was 20 and falls in love with her and she with him. For him, it was the sweetest day of his life. Here is a woman who loves him back, young and innocent love and he pours his love to this woman. He has an ideal of a woman, an image of what that woman should be and therefore limited himself or his love to only this ideal of a woman. He never adjusted his perceptions to changes. Otherwise why would he have an affair with a younger woman who seems to adore him, whose personality seem to reflect his ideal of a woman? He never really opened his eyes to get to know HK nor his arms to accept her for who she was. He judges her according to his standards.

On the other hand there is HK who never got to know his father. It seems mom did not tell her that the father died but the father left them. She asked her mother how did you cope when he left you, then left you once again? Her mother said I saw my daughter and coped and then looked at my daughter again and coped some more. So it seems that HK has learned to cope by trusting herself most. She is a fatherless child and basing on other dramas, single mother and their children are regarded as rootless and the child considered an orphan even if she had a mother. She must have witnessed her mother doing the best she could and struggling to support them both. As a young girl she must have thought a lot of how and why her father left and may have even put the blame on herself. Her trust has been broken very young and she learned to put up her shields early on in life, and to be so independent so she will not need anyone.  

In many ways SR and HK are similar and yet different. Both their wanting for love are immense but they display their wanting differently. SR wants to be grounded on a foundation of belonging by holding and being dependent on someone she falls in love with no matter who it is and how she gets it and she is not satisfied when she gets what she thought she wants because she wants more and she will cling with all her might not realizing that she will destroy the foundation she so wanted to be grounded on because she has to build the foundation on herself. HK is the opposite while her wanting is also immense, she expresses that by being so independent and making herself so pragmatic, dependable and necessary. “You need me so you will not leave me” kind of mentality. For her to do that she needs to thump down on her emotions and not be moved by sentiment. It is not that she does not have any feelings. She feels very deeply, and loves deeply but she just can’t show it, she cannot trust that it is for real. She has trained herself to be that way. It is her way of protecting herself. And yet she feels burdened by those that have come to depend on or need her especially those she calls her family. But she does what she has to do and keeps going. And so when she realizes that she is not needed nor what she is doing is not appreciated, she breaks and finally all those emotions rush out in waves of despair. Like the child who may have blamed herself for dad’s leaving, she blames herself for her husband’s affair. It is my fault, I will do better and judgmental finger pointing and driving her away and kneeling before his father to make the person go away. I don’t need you, l can do without you. So finally she left. It may seem from the outside that it was JE who loved more but from the way I see it, it was HK who did. In the end the family she protected, all blamed her and turned their backs on her. No one in that family stood up for her not even her husband. All the blood family members threw her out after all and the one other family member not of blood was was gunning for her.

It was very telling when JE said in the painting memory, I love you more now than when we were dating and HK says, can you try your best to love me less? She already feels suffocated.

I read what I thought was a very apt comment in VIKI. These 2 have been living together not as a married couple but as roommates with privileges. They say that they both love each other but yet they don’t seem to understand each other. 15 years is a long.

It is a blessing that HK has left that family and maybe a blessing still that she loses the memory of her name, where she lives etc. It happens when there is trauma to the head and she was in a car accident. However memory loss caused by trauma is usually short lived so hopefully she does lose her memory for long but still keep her real identity hidden so she can exact revenge. kekeke

As for your question of BS, he has the same last name as the poet. The poet also told KGN that his son is a lawyer. SR does not have the same last name. So maybe he is the biological son

 

 

Edited September 17, 2015 by zenya22

[mcdc]

Iclarakl said:

 

There is a thin line between love and hate. Years ago, a spouse could get away with killing their or wife if they caught them cheating......it was murder in the heat of passion. To find out your spouse is cheating on you is emotionally a very big deal. There are so many different emotions coursing through your body. I have to say that this drama is the first one I've seen where they are truly depicting a scorned woman.  HK is feeling anger, hurt, betrayal and pain. She's also feeling  confusion. Her wanting to strikeout at JE is understandable. When a woman  doesn't express any emotions of hurt or especially anger I think that is a false representation of true pain experienced by a woman who feels betrayed. Giving him a dose of toilet water is understandable to me. In One Warm Word, she tried to smother her husband with a pillow while he slept. In Give Them Something To Talk About, she feed him a family secret sauce used for cheating husband--made him sick. Wanting to retaliate is understandable to a certain degree. Some women/men retaliate by cheating themselves.

There  are many types of love Eros or romantic love is different from the love that we all have for our fellow man or woman.  We see daily, complete strangers risking their lives to save people they don't know. This is more reactive than actual knowing and loving the person personally (although it is a form of love). JE would have jumped in the water to save anyone that was drowning.  HK may have very well been testing him but this was a very poor test and stupid one for a very smart attorney considering he would have done the same thing for a complete stranger.  A part of me feel that at that moment HK truly wanted to die. She didn't have to take in water to prove a point. She has been with him for 20 years or so, so I'm sure she is feeling like she is losing everything.  I've said it before, I believe that she doesn't know what to do and is desperate. 

I think HK does love him, but doesn't really know how to express it. There are families that never tell one another that they love them because they were not raised that way. However, their bond of love is no different than the family that says it all the time--sometimes that love can be even deeper than those saying it. HK comes across as someone who is emotionally starved and doesn't know how to express love. HK didn't suddenly start loving him, I think she always has.

They both have major flaws, but when JE brought another person into their marriage instead of trying to talk to HK who made several comments about him not wanting to have a real conversation with her, he crossed a line. HK trying to be calculating also had a role in bring SR into her house, but JE kept her there.

Bravo! Great Post!

I totally agree with your analysis.  How a person reacts when they realize the person who has always loved them unconditionally is gone can be very irrational.  The cool, calm HK became totally unhinged.  Her confession in the hospital as JE lay in his bed was very enlightening.  She admitted to taking advantage of him, depending that he would always love her.  I am in no way condoning HK's selfish attitude but I can understand her desperate reaction to letting him go.  

Signing the divorce decree is the first step to her freedom....she just doesn't realize it yet.  Loving someone who doesn't love you anymore even if I think JE does still love her but is looking for his own revenge right now, is crippling HK.  Future amnesia and the chance to start anew, is the best thing that could ever happen to her.  Her marriage is obviously lopsided and was headed for destruction.  

JE is in major revenge mode right now...taking the power in the company away from her, forcing the divorce decree, pushing his affair with a much younger woman in her face... he's telling her....just look what you lost.

If the synopsis is true and HK falls back in love with her husband the writer will be showing their relationship in reverse.  HK, as a new person will reveal all the love and caring she can have for JE but could never demonstrate before.  The feelings have always been there and as Iclaraki said in her post, she didn't know how to express it.  With a new lease on life HK can become the person she always yearned to be and it will be fun to watch her relationship with BS develop.  

 

[lclarakl]

 

 

There is always this wish to take a revenge when you're hurt, regardless of whether you've been cheated on or mistreated in any other way. But there is line you should never cross. 

Just as I can't justify adultery, whatever reason may lead to it, I can't accept this horrible deed of Hae-gang, regarding toilet water, either. 

And if I am understanding towards an angry wife, then I should be equally understanding towards a husband, who suffered due to his wife's coldness. But I can't.

Besides, if someone is hurt to the extent that they can't help their indignation, they'd better let go of the person or leave themselves.

What's the point in torturing the spouse and yourself? Especially when he openly states he is done with you and wants divorce.

No normal person will put up with humilation and mistreatment unless (s)he is masochist or is pursuing some other purpose.

If you hate him, let him go, and if you love him, do the same.

He cries out that he is coming to the point of hatred and begs you to leave him alone, but because you're Do Hae-gang who's always right, you know his needs better than he does. Absurd.

Indeed, there are families that don't express their feelings but they make it feel it through their actions. 

So, If Hae-gang let him go, instead of holding onto him like a madman, he might have believed that she loves him. 

But when you forcibly try to attach yourself to someone, in their eyes you become no more than an egoistic leech.

You are correct that there is always the wish to take revenge.  What I have found is you have two groups of people when it comes to revenge, those who take action and those who daydream about it and take none. You find these people everywhere. I never send a meal back at a restaurant because of the possible revengeful waiter or cook that may spit in my food--it happens daily. HK is a person who takes action. So she gave the man cheating on her toilet water. The man that had sex with another woman who he could have inpregnated with a child.  The number one reason for wives contracting an STD is due to cheating husbands (AIDS is one of the biggest diseases). When JE had sex with SR, he brought that possibility into their marriage. So she giving JE toilet water doesn't bother me. He would have never gotten toilet water if he had not been cheating. 

In regards to a person putting up with mistreatment and humiliation, that's done every single day by women all over the world--every day and especially women and even more single mothers. They put up with a lot for the love of there children. I won't even get into women who endure domestic violence thinking that the person abusing them really love them.  Women in love will lie to themselves until cold, hard truth hits them squarely in the face as it did HK. I'm always saying there is no way I will put up with this or that, but until I actually am in that same situation, it's just talk. Talk is a lot easier said than done because the biggest traitor I would have to fight against is my heart. In the movie Grease, Olivia Newton John sings a song Hopelessly Devoted. Part of the song goes, "my head keeps saying fool forget him, but my heart keeps saying, don't let him go" later in the song she says she's going to hold on to him. 

HK loves this man and one thing is very true, he can never say she didn't fight for their marriage and to keep him. He didn't help her in this fight, he fought against her--she gave her all. I hate her pain, but I am glad she has left him. I hope she never takes him back. She seemed more like the head of the house because he wouldn't step up to the plate. He seems to live in fantasy and she seems grounded in reality.

 

Edited September 17, 2015 by lclarakl

[valsava]

These last two episodes I have know words but hope JE and SR gets whats coming for them especially SR Just when she finds that man she's really ready to spend the rest of her life with karma is coming for her in the worst way to bad we won't get to see it

[tunquat]

New HK's life after she lost memory. Happy and funny like this. Can't wait next ep 

 

cr;naver

Edited September 17, 2015 by tunquat

[zenya22]

Speaking about KGN, how did the twins get separated? Why was YK with HK separated? How did HG end up with KGN and YK with Dok Go Jin Hoon? So many questions to be answered. YK lost the USB but she has the GPS. I know it has been said that the husband died but was it ever said that a body was found?

[irilight]

 

I have this thought and trying to figure out on how the writer are going to make HG become and live as YK, will YK be killed off and what'll happen to her baby. The inquired mind would really like to know.

@suchadiva42 chingu..  I pray that the writernim does not kill YK. I'd be very disappointed if she does. I also think it is pretty unlikely, as we have too few episodes that have aired, and there was a lot of publicity about Kim Hyun-Joo taking on this double role as the twin sisters.

@ayselluna, I agree with most of what you wrote about JE/HG/SR.   I think also that HG has taken JE's love for granted for many years. @lclarakl made an analogy that JE looks at HG as a dog that he can give away. I think similarly HG looked at JE as a pet that belonged to her. And all of a sudden that pet wants to run away to a new owner and she does not like it. It was as if she want him to continue heeling by her side obediently. And maybe the fact that he has left her, awaken her to realize that she loves him, or loves the perks of being his wife (money, prestige, position).  It is also possible, that now that she had lost him, she actually realized that she loved him? or at least fancied that thought?  Just like JE and SR - her character too, is full of contradictions. That lemonade water and toilet toothbrush, acts made me greatly dislike her character.  I was shocked by her actions. And she calls herself a wife? I would not do that to a dog!  (since @lclarakl started with the dog analogy.    )

And yet, when JE is take to the ambulance her expression is of a woman devastated. I could not believe it is only because of monetary comfort and prestige. (If it were so, she could be possibly better off with him dead, and her as his widow....)

 

BTW - I wonder why so many here feel angry at JE for moving ahead with the divorce?  So many have said time and time again, for him to get a divorce instead of being unfaithful in a marriage, and now that he did exactly that, people are still pissed off at him? That leads me to believe they did not really want him to get a divorce. They wanted him to stay in the marriage and be faithful, no matter how miserable he became in this marriage. Also, if that were to happen now - that would be the end of the drama, unless people want to turn it into a happy family drama... 

@evea    Thank you for knocking some sense into us... .  I thought the ending was supposed to be good in that JE and HG reconcile? But from the look of it so far, seems like nobody on this thread would be pleased with this news.

@nearsea   I agree with you. I think the writer wants to show us that each character has his/her own both negative and positive; At least, so far that is the case with the 3 leads. I also agree... I wish to move on to present time, after the accident...

@Larybattz  Thank you for the reminders about the pills.

@Lmangla   My feelings are that HG herself was not aware of her feelings until lately, when she is about to lose JE.  I agree with you. I am so very impressed with Kim Hyun-Joo's acting. I LOVE your analogy of the tree and the traveler; But I like  @ayselluna's addition to that interpretation.        I like your observation of the women in the drama, including Yong-Ki and HK's mom, but I would also add that HK's mom, after that cool behavior goes to SR's coffee shop and attacks her physically. (pretty funny from a woman who was a mistress herself.... Isn't there a saying about people who live in glass houses, should not throw stones? ) I also totally agree with you about HG protecting JE by being in the company. In fact, in light of your observation, I better understand JE's action to his dad that he will come and work for the company if his dad would allow the divorce.

@lclarakl , I always love reading your thoughtful posts!   Yes, I remember that scene in Warm Words as well; and even there, I could not personally relate to her. Don't get me wrong - I do understand anger, but not such horrible action, even in the face of anger.  But I do agree with you that we certainly get a depiction of a woman scorned.  While it is true that people tend to try to save anyone who is about to die in front of their eye - when you question why HG jumped into the water, and did she want to test JE; My feelings are that it was not only a cry for help, but also combined with spite, to make sure to make him feel guilty. I'd say she wanted him to feel guilty more than she really wanted to die. And that is why his response after the fact - that he would never again intervene, was right on, in my opinion.

Your statement "I think HK does love him, but doesn't really know how to express it," makes me feel so very sad for JE. He had been stuck in this marriage for 15 years, with a woman who does not know how to express her love - while his love was so deep for her. That is why I cannot help but feel compassion for him, even as I dislike his act of infidelity.  Even through the actual divorce, as she was stamping the papers, as someone else already mentioned - he was still torn emotionally.

I also agree with you that there are families who never tell each other they love each other; And I also think that in some cultures they tend to not talk about loving each other. However, I believe, as @ayselluna also wrote,  - they show it with their actions. And I do not mean kisses and hugs, but in the way they take care of each other. One film that come to my mind that illustrate it, is by Mira Nair called "The Namesake." We never saw an act of love between the parents, but we felt how deeply their love for each other was, in the way they cared for each other, and even in the way they looked at each other.

I agree with you that HG may have loved JE all along, but did not realize it until now, that she had lost him. But that fact does not erase the fact that JE himself was in a marriage with a cold woman for so long. I am actually shocked that he hung in there for as long as he did. I think JE has tried to talk to HG many times with no results. Now that she finally wants to talk with him, she had already missed the boat so to speak.

 

I'll post this, while I catch up on the last page.

I thought JE's face here, is of one who had just saved the love of his life..... Someone very precious to him.

Makes me think, when I see both of their expressions when the other was about to die,  that they both love each other deeply, but do not know how to communicate anymore.

 

[ayselluna]

You are correct that there is always the wish to take revenge.  What I have found is you have two groups of people when it comes to revenge, those who take action and those who daydream about it and take none. You find these people everywhere. I never send a meal back at a restaurant because of the possible revengeful waiter or cook that may spit in my food--it happens daily. HK is a person who takes action. So she gave the man cheating on her toilet water. The man that had sex with another woman who he could have inpregnated with a child.  The number one reason for wives contracting an STD is due to cheating husbands (AIDS is one of the biggest diseases). When JE had sex with SR, he brought that possibility into their marriage. So she giving JE toilet water doesn't bother me. He would have never gotten toilet water if he had not been cheating. 

In regards to a person putting up with mistreatment and humiliation, that's done every single day by women all over the world--every day and especially women and even more single mothers. They put up with a lot for the love of there children. I won't even get into women who endure domestic violence thinking that the person abusing them really love them.  Women in love will lie to themselves until cold, hard truth hits them squarely in the face as it did HK. I'm always saying there is no way I will put up with this or that, but until I actually am in that same situation, it's just talk. Talk is a lot easier said than done because the biggest traitor I would have to fight against is my heart. In the movie Grease, Olivia Newton John sings a song Hopelessly Devoted. Part of the song goes, "my head keeps saying fool forget him, but my heart keeps saying, don't let him go" later in the song she says she's going to hold on to him. 

HK loves this man and one thing is very true, he can never say she didn't fight for their marriage and to keep him. He didn't help her in this fight, he fought against her--she gave her all. I hate her pain, but I am glad she has left him. I hope she never takes him back. She seemed more like the head of the house because he wouldn't step up to the plate. He seems to live in fantasy and she seems grounded in reality.

 

 

 

You're correct in terms of not sending back a meal at a restaurant when you already came there. If one is concerned about getting food that may be spat on by a waiter or a cook, one shouldn't go to the restaurant in the first place.

 

Hae-gang served her 'beloved' spouse with the toilet water before he had sex with Seol-ri. But even if it'd happened after it, there would have been almost zero possibility of her contracting an STD, as Jin-eon had been rejecting her sexual advances for quite a while, and wasn't interested in her sexually either.

Besides, if you're afraid of contracting an STD, you'd better leave the cheating spouse (just as in the case of a restaurant), instead of holding onto him/her. 

 

Regarding humiliation... Only because something is done by the majority on a daily basis doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. 

It is one thing to put up with abuse when you can't do anything about it but endure, and it's another to face maltreatment on your own accord. There is difference.

And as you said there are always two groups of people… One takes action against the abuser, including for the safety of their kids, while the other chooses to bear anything for fear of being left alone or changing something in their lives. 

By enduring domestic violence, for whatever reason, women enable their maltreaters to dump on them more.

In fact, this is when one should take revenge… But not by serving with toilet water, but by protecting one’s dignity.

If every victim of domestic violence did something about the offenders, instead of deluding themselves into thinking that they’re still loved, there would be less such cases in the world.

You can’t expect anyone to respect you unless you respect yourself. And you shouldn’t expect much of your marriage, if you have to beg for love.

It’s better to be single than hold onto 'family' based on constant fear (of losing incuded), (self-)abasement or selfishness.

 

Edited September 17, 2015 by ayselluna

[irilight]

@myonenonly, I tend to agree with your statement:

I think JE still love HG but his anger/contempt towards her is overpowering. What he feels for SR is peace.

@lclarakl, you wrote: So she giving JE toilet water doesn't bother me. He would have never gotten toilet water if he had not been cheating. 

Actually, I disagree. It is a conclusion that is not supported by evidence.  A wife who finds it OK to give her husband toilet water because he is cheating, may find it OK to give her husband toilet water for any other reason, any time his action do not please her.

As far as your point about STD, you are quite correct in general, but not in this case, because we have already been shown that JE avoids physical contact with HG, even before he had met SR.

ah... @ayselluna already answered it all, and better than me....!

@ayselluna said:   So, If Hae-gang let him go, instead of holding onto him like a madman, he might have believed that she loves him.

I totally agree. That is why I said from the beginning, if you love someone let him go.  HG's kind of love, is selfish love looking for her own needs only.

@zenya22, Really good analysis by you about HG vs. SR. BTW, why do you think that at the Scandal thread people were not so pissed at the infidelity as they are here? We sort of came to accept it that is the way that jerk lived, even though we did not like it.

@ayselluna   said:   

In fact, this is when one should take revenge… But not by serving with toilet water, but by protecting one’s dignity.

If every victim of domestic violence did something about the offenders, instead of deluding themselves into thinking that they’re still loved, there would be less such cases in the world.

You can’t expect anyone to respect you unless you respect yourself. And you shouldn’t expect much of your marriage, if you have to beg for love.

It’s better to be single than hold onto 'family' based on constant fear (of losing incuded), abasement or selfishness.

Very well said!  Thank you. I so much agree with you.

More of JE trying to save HG.

These two in love? Hard to imagine.

 

[nearsea]

I think we are forgetting one thing here that nobody is perfect and so is HK..yes she is not respecting her ownself and trying madly to hold on to her gradually estranged husband here...but it's just because it's happening all so fast.Jin eon says he kept loving her while she was being cruel and putting career in the front zone and becoming more money and position oriented..but I wonder how he can just make a comment like that.It's because he dint attend his father's business and just loitered around his labs with little responsibility towards his family that HK had to get hold of what he could not.His coming to hate HK just dint sound very convincing to me[neither the writer is giving us a good explanation of his reasoning].Does he hate her determination? As he says while she was building her career he kept loving her as he thought she needed the protection..but why he did not preach her then? Where was his good will and conscience at that point of time and now when he has got a comparatively young and supposedly naive girl beside him...he can see HK's young counter part in SR? I don't think when HK sed don't love me too much ..she actually meant it..it was just a tease and nothing else and I think she just loved him as her own all the time.As @iclarakl sed earlier,introvert people find it hard to express what they feel ..but not everyone is good at expressing.Words are not necessarily important when you've stayed with someone for close to 15 years.They should be basically each other's clothes, if not anything else.I like the analogy from@zenya22 ' These 2 have been living together not as a married couple but as roommates with privileges. They say that they both love each other but yet they don’t seem to understand each other'.At this point,even if they broke apart, I think their equation is and would be there, a continuous process,unbreakable and undeniable. Just that,jin eon crossed a line when he went ahead and slept with SR,if HK would have been in her sane mind,she would have broken off this relationship as soon as jin eon entered SR's apartment.Jin Eon should not be left to get away with this,there are so many breach that he has caused  that I've almost forgotten about,that I seriously wish HK gives him some serious payback.

[ymiss]

I don't think I would give my husband toilet water! But I would definitely, totally explode in his face (and hers') the moment those elevator door opens! Hae Gang was able to hold it in for that long! And gave him toilet water the next day! I would of die, curse like h e l l at the both of them right there!

I don't know what's worse! B i t c h i n g, going all out and crazy at them right after they kissed or wait till the next day and secretly give him the toilet water!

[zenya22]

I think we are forgetting one thing here that nobody is perfect and so is HK..yes she is not respecting her ownself and trying madly to hold on to her gradually estranged husband here...but it's just because it's happening all so fast.Jin eon says he kept loving her while she was being cruel and putting career in the front zone and becoming more money and position oriented..but I wonder how he can just make a comment like that.It'sause he dint attend his father's business and just loitered around his labs with little responsibility towards his family that HK had to get hold of what he could not.His coming to hate HK just dint sound very convincing to me[neither the writer is giving us a good explanation of his reasoning].Does he hate her determination? As he says while she was building her career he kept loving her as he thought she needed the protection..but why he did not preach her then? Where was his good will and conscience at that point of time and now when he has got a comparatively young and supposedly naive girl beside him...he can see HK's young counter part in SR? I don't think when HK sed don't love me too much ..she actually meant it..it was just a tease and nothing else and I think she just loved him as her own all the time.As @iclarakl sed earlier,introvert people find it hard to express what they feel ..but not everyone is good at expressing.Words are not necessarily important when you've stayed with someone for close to 15 years.They should be basically each other's clothes, if not anything else.I like the analogy from@zenya22 ' These 2 have been living together not as a married couple but as roommates with privileges. They say that they both love each other but yet they don’t seem to understand each other'.At this point,even if they broke apart, I think their equation is and would be there, a continuous process,unbreakable and undeniable. Just that,jin eon crossed a line when he went ahead and slept with SR,if HK would have been in her sane mind,she would have broken off this relationship as soon as jin eon entered SR's apartment.Jin Eon should not be left to get away with this,there are so many breach that he has caused  that I've almost forgotten about,that I seriously wish HK gives him some serious payback.

I totally agree and I dislike his character the most. I even understand SR being who she is. He only loved the person he had in his head. He has never grown and he was never man enough to love HK. Like his father said he is an irresponsible son of a richard simmons.  She loved him, in her own way and everything of him. And this is her response to his affair, anger. Very understandable. I am not sure I would not do the same thing. JE is the kind of person who will throw anyone under the bus. I am clean you are dirty. What a load of crap. I hope that they never end up back together. JE and SR good for them.  They deserve each other. Now he has his "pretty, young and innocent" ideal woman. I can't wait to see JE have a drag out fight with his sister and brother in law. That bother in law has something on his father and the father is afraid. Let us see how good and innocent JE will be. That BIL and sister will ground him and that father will never be satisfied with him no matter what he does. The mother will be caught in between. And the pretty young thing he dragged to that house will be hairless after the sister is done with her. 

[nearsea]

 'And the pretty young thing he dragged to that house will be hairless after the sister is done with her'--Hahah..hope so!

[zenya22]

 

@zenya22, Really good analysis by you about HG vs. SR. BTW, why do you think that at the Scandal thread people were not so pissed at the infidelity as they are here? We sort of came to accept it that is the way that jerk lived, even though we did not like it.

@irilght I only mentioned Scandal to clarify the 2nd wife reference by 2nd wife in this drama. I don't want to give spoilers just in case anyone wants to watch the drama, so I would rather not have a discussion of the characters in that drama, so sorry

Edited September 17, 2015 by zenya22