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@homura As always, thank you so much for the sweeping historical background, which has by and large, answered the questions that have been niggling at me. Truly truly appreciate it, and it is really a joy to watch this drama with you, and enjoy the benefit of the knowledge that you have so graciously shared here.

Based on what you say about 本源 本元 Bonwon, does it then mean that JDJ's underground group Milbon was already formed at the time of this drama, and that he had, even before roping YSG to his cause, already predetermined the structure with which the new country would stand on, with the check and balance by the Sadaebu? Yet, from Ep18, it appears that he only came up with the Samsa system after being triggered by HIB's observations on human nature. Can you remember whether JDJ had, at any time prior to this, described his vision of the new government with YSG? 

Edited by liddi
Corrected the Hanja representation of Bonwon, per TWDR
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Ep 50. summary. Gil Seon-Mi was slayed by Moo-Hyul. He was still breathing when Yeon-Hyang came to see him. He apologized her that he lied about the children because he resented her for abandonin

The historical background to help understand Ep. 49~50     ■ Baek Dal-Won 백달원 白達元 (?~?)     ■ The Second Strife of Princes  (January, 1400)

The flow of the events are as I expected. The difference is... Boon-Yi and Moo-Hyul visited Bang-Won's house to say the final farewell to Bang-Won. Lady Min told them Bang-Won already went to sle

33 minutes ago, liddi said:

Based on what you say about 本源 Bonwon, does it then mean that JDJ's underground group Milbon was already formed at the time of this drama, and that he had, even before roping YSG to his cause, already predetermined the structure with which the new country would stand on, with the check and balance by the Sadaebu? Yet, from Ep18, it appears that he only came up with the Samsa system after being triggered by HIB's observations on human nature. Can you remember whether JDJ had, at any time prior to this, described his vision of the new government with YSG? 

 

Not yet. JDJ explained to YSG about his land system for the first time in ep 18. He didn't share his vision with YSG.

JDJ's underground group Milbon was already formed at the time of this drama? It remains to be seen. I'm also wondering if JDJ's organization in SFD is the same as the Milbon in TWDR. King Taejong of TWDR didn't know about the 'tree' reference or 'Milbon' organization until he got old enough, but Yi Bang-Won of SFD already joined JDJ's organization.  What I'm guessing is that Milbon is a secret faction within the organization, and YBW didn't know about the "king is a flower, and sadaebu is the roots" part yet.

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@homura You're right. King Taejong first saw the Milbon tenets on the wall of the underground passage beneath JDJ's brother, Jung Do Gwang's house, nine years prior to the persecution of Prime Minister Shim On. As such, I agree that JDJ kept these tenets even from the royal family, to give them a semblance of power, while the true authority lies with the roots. Would we see this happen because of the power hunger he perceived in YBW? Or could it have been his plan all along? Yet I am loathe to believe the latter, exactly because of the level of trust and respect between JDJ and YSG. So I would then assume that the Milbon faction was set up secretly later, perhaps to counter YBW's demand for absolute monarchy.

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I'm gonna miss Gil Tae Mi so bad...

I read some news back in May or June that Baek Jin Hee was supposed to be the female lead, rite?

what happened to her? any rumored names after Baek Jin Hee dropped? to me Shin Se Kyung still doesn't fit to Boon Yi character, she's too beautiful and her face almost perfect like porcelain to represent Boon Yi from lower class. Anyway I like her with Moo Hyul thou...they're so cuuute together, I want their scenes together more often *can you hear me writer nim* I like Boon Yi's face when she's smile with Moo Hyul. Oh I also like Bang Won with Lady Min, ok this is a weird ship lol but I find myself wondering how these two are making 12 babies together with that kind of convo lol

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9 hours ago, Irish_law said:

I'm gonna miss Gil Tae Mi so bad...

I read some news back in May or June that Baek Jin Hee was supposed to be the female lead, rite?

what happened to her? any rumored names after Baek Jin Hee dropped? to me Shin Se Kyung still doesn't fit to Boon Yi character, she's too beautiful and her face almost perfect like porcelain to represent Boon Yi from lower class. Anyway I like her with Moo Hyul thou...they're so cuuute together, I want their scenes together more often *can you hear me writer nim* I like Boon Yi's face when she's smile with Moo Hyul. Oh I also like Bang Won with Lady Min, ok this is a weird ship lol but I find myself wondering how these two are making 12 babies together with that kind of convo lol

 

  • Mr. Park Sang-Yeon of the Six Flying Dragons writing team is a huge fan of Shin Se-Gyung.
  • He originally wanted to cast SSK as Boon-Yi, and wrote the script fit for her.
  • But SSK was already shooting The Girl Who Sees Smells and it seemed to be difficult for her to rearrange her schedule.
  • So, the SFD production team started to negotiate with Baek Jin-Hee, but failed to make it at the final stage of the negotiation.
  • Baek Jin-Hee went to MBC Saturday-Sunday drama My Daughter, Geum Sa-wol.
  • The SFD writers attended the party before the last episode of TGWSS and persuaded SSK again.
  • SSK accepted the proposal.

 

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BY holding JDJ  - Governing system

Photo published for ‘육룡이 나르샤’ 신세경, 백성을 대표해 묻다…‘갈수록 흥미진진’ - #육룡이 나르샤

cr: http://www.dizcul.co.kr/40751

 

the system JDJ wrote is vry much like todays system - at least in my country

and BY showing her farseeing ways - added what about the citizen? - which will become elections 

BW say citizen cant be trusted YET and BY say but later promise\assure me that it will happen

again out of everyone she is the most farseeing way into the future  - wanted to reassure her at that moment

i think LM was more "jealous" of being left out of the political plot - even offended as she did help secure the victory for her husband 

and always will - therefor deserve the courtesy of being part of the discussion also we see that BW is now understanding her level of complex and thorough thinking and how much he will need it in the future - should be more considerate BW

and last but not least my favorite part was YH words about BJ

so RIGHT he did endanger JDJ and with that the whole plan sabotaging the dream of his both loved ones that he promised to help

her wrods were spot on and her chastising JDJ for not being on her side

its like he lose reason thinking when with YH & BJ together 

also i do think that Milbon is not JDJ's it doesnt fit the man he is he is not an elitist nobe

and follows Mancious? and not Confucius belief in status, so...

 - sorry that i write only about the women

im impressed with all the male actors but when i come to write at the end i write only about the women -sorry 

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@nevill Hehe... thank you for the Moo Hyul~Boon Yi compilation. Unfortunately, it looks to be all in his head only... poor boy, not that I expect him to be able to keep his head on his shoulders for much longer if it were otherwise... certainly not if YBW gets any whiff of it :D 

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hi, just want to drop by....its just sad gil tae mi died in latest ep. he's such a great character. my favourite villian after mishil and hong sena. love how the master tells the story when gil tae mi was a kid....and how he died in snow its so beautiful and perfectly tribute ending for him..including his last saying regarding strong and weak....also his last wish to know the name of his own killer.

does anyone know which timeline of history this drama will end? the start of taejo or taejong reign or their death? would they show baby sejong as well? they not going to show all the 12 babies of taejong right? lol though its interesting if they show why taejong choose sejong instead of his older brothers but dont think they gonna run that long would take hundred episodes to complete that

any further information regarding yi ji ran? tried google but almost no convincing facts found

oh one more, any english translation for muyiyiya song? so glad finally they released the song with even yohan singing the song

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First off... so much happened in these two episodes, I'm still dumbfounded. So thank you @liddi for saying almost everything I wanted to say, and with more eloquence than I could ever muster, as well. And wow @homura, your background historical explanation for Ep 17-18 as usual just blew me away. The history is truly interesting, and the writers are really clever to create such a story out of that known history. As with all of the world's histories, there are always the blind spots - details we will never know for sure, and this allows for artistic licenses and interpretations that, with the right people and most creative minds, would create a mind blowing story. As the SFD writers have done so far. Every week I feel like I'm transported on a journey through time and space to another time, another age, another existence. I am truly enjoying this magic carpet ride to witness the birth of this new Joseon nation. 

As so many have voiced on this thread, I too am saddened by the end of GTM and HIB, two worthy adversaries. Yet that amazing dancelike swordfight between two equally skilled opponents was magnificent, and it was a just and apt ending for a great swordsman like GTM. As his brother eulogised, at least he died as a warrior and not a corrupt official. And the acting by the two actors was truly moving - I've watched the sequence 4 times, twice without subs and I was moved everytime. Even as the people shouted out with joy, the almost-regret and sadness etched on LBJ's face was telling. GTM earned his respect as a great swordsman, and even at the end, he died admirably. It was a moment to ponder for LBJ, and even though he told MH otherwise later, I do think that he never did learn to feel pleasure from killing. Especially one as skilful as GTM. Even as he seemed to proudly claim the title of the Greatest Swordsman of SamHan. I also felt a certain sadness witnessing the end of HIB, staring into the distance with that tinge of regret in his eyes. He had two wonderful confrontational scenes with LBW and JDJ with such meaningful dialogue and an almost acute foretelling of future events.

Which brings me to LBW and BY:

15 hours ago, liddi said:

By the same token, YBW's last words with HIB, while perhaps not as spectacular or flashy, are no less potent. YBW's cocky surety of being a better man than HIB, is experiencing stirrings of self-doubt, when the older man's foreboding words finally hit home. And the moment he sees the world JDJ envisions and recognises the sibilant voice within - that of ambitious hunger to own that country - is a foreshadowing of what is to come, his dread of being swallowed up and losing himself to the darkness is real. His conversation with BY is telling... when he asks that she stops him if he ever does change... again, we see just how reliant he is on BY to keep him from giving in to his darker self. From here, his spiral downwards in terms of humanity in later years can only mean one thing... that somewhere along the way, he lost her. 

 

On the one hand I agree with your analysis here, @liddi. This is the obvious direction that the writers would be leading us to. This is what we would expect, from the history that we have read. It's what I would put my money on as to where the writers are going. But on the other hand, I do have this other thought, or rather, a tiny hope. Its borne from the fact that the writers have proven that they think out of the box, and quite frequently pull that elusive rabbit out of their hat. It is also borne from the bits and pieces of information that I have read of King Taejong online. On the one hand he apparently is power hungry, as he got rid of anyone who could challenge him for the throne. But he was also well loved by the people - as you mentioned liddi, he did introduce a channel for the people to direct their problems to the king, and from wiki we read of the many changes he made to governance that benefited the people and improved their lives, and strengthened national defence and increased the nation's wealth. He seems like such a contradiction in terms, that it fascinates me. It would be interesting if the writers could put in a new twist. Instead of us seeing him as the good person that succumbed to the overpowering hunger for power - because that would be so straightforward and a given, how more mind blowing it would be for us to understand the reasons behind his act of killing his two brothers, his brothers-in-law and his son's in-laws as well. Could it be that they all had designs on the throne, and on his life for their own power hungry reasons?- and we know how much politicking, plotting and backstabbing can go on behind close doors amongst the kin of the royal families (see Lee In Gyeom for example), that Taejong had strong reasons to show emphatically that no one could step on him? Also, the story goes that his brother Lee Bang Gwa or King Jeongjong made him heir out of fear(?), but could it be that his brother honestly felt that LBW was the best candidate amongst his brothers to become the king? Anyway those are just my thoughts... and perhaps a little tiny hope... that perhaps instead of losing BY, she is the only one who will understand him until the end? After all even Sejong and MH seemed to despise him (based from TWDR)... so really he just ends up as the one misunderstood by all those close to him. 

So that romantic part of me is kind of also hoping, in that way, it is really BY who stays loyal to him till the end. And of course the fangirl part of me just thinks that YAI is playing LBW so splendidly that I don't want him to end up the villain. :)

 

 

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@azzurri Love your thoughts, especially about the relationship between YBW and BY... thank you for sharing them! And I agree. I believe BY is the one who understands him.. the only one he can be truly vulnerable and honest with... stripped bare of all pretenses and bravado. Actually, contrary to what I think you thought I was saying, I never meant that his losing her was because she left or spurned him for what he became in his power struggle.. at least voluntarily. Rather, my feeling... reinforced by having seen the outcome of TWDR... the scriptwriters' total lack of compunction in killing off well-loved characters... is that niggling fear that she will die perhaps for or because of him. Going forward, allies would turn into enemies... and with YBJ being firmly in JDJ's camp... BY will most certainly be torn between the two men she loves, as well as the well-drawn line of alliances. Would this result in a conflict that ends in her death? I hope not... but I do not hold much hope that something of that nature will not play out. And with her passing, YBW loses the one person who could rein him back... his moral compass if you will, in particular against those whom he see as a threat to all that he has fought and sacrificed for. 

Can I just say that I am so so grateful the instrumental soundtrack of this drama is released along with the songs.... because they capture the essence of each scene they are in perfectly. Which makes me truly regret, not for the first or last time, that we never saw the instrumental soundtrack for TWDR released. That drama has so many instrumental gems... hearing each piece brings scenes flooding back so vividly, and the raw emotions accompanying those scenes are relived once more. I guess there is no hope at all that with the airing of SFD, SBS would consider releasing the complete soundtrack to TWDR as well? :( 

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i think BW is a true romantic he is motivated by BY and at first  - to me - it seems that his search for power is for him to give her the world she craves.

he wants to gift her the world  - and that to me is a very unselfish romantic gesture - that maybe later will turn into the man we know 

at first i thought it was power more than BY - but the more the episode i watch the more a romantic he becomes to me 

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Happy Birthday to SFD makeup artist

 

im not sure if SSK baked the cake herself although she is an armature baker and loved to bake cookies and gift them to stuff and in fan meeting

but im not sure she has time now, but maybe? 

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Six Flying Dragons: Episode 18

by HeadsNo (dramabeans)
sixflyingdragons18-00414_1.jpg
This is only the beginning of the political purge set to take place, and it turns out to be a rather violent affair for the two baddies we’ve come to know thus far. But getting rid of them can only mean that we’re paving the way for something much worse, and we’ll probably find ourselves missing the kind of evil we could spot just by how opaque someone’s eyeshadow was. Now comes the hard part; let’s just hope Jung Do-jeon and his team are up to the task.
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Guest chulakok
On 12/3/2015 at 6:53 AM, nevill said:

Happy Birthday to SFD makeup artist

Don't quote pictures, gifs, videos

im not sure if SSK baked the cake herself although she is an armature baker and loved to bake cookies and gift them to stuff and in fan meeting

but im not sure she has time now, but maybe? 

  Omg the way YKS flipped his hair was soooo hot!!!

Edited by chulakok
Don't quote pictures, gifs, videos
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@liddi and @azzurri Thank you both for you analysis and thank you for sharing. You both said what I was thinking but much better.

I like your thoughts about LBW and BY and may I add a wild guess about how BW will lose BY, not because of political differences?  The secret that the young Dae Sang now Yi Bang Ji was told to never utter or he and his love ones will die? Whom can that secret be used against most and who will gain the most? 

 

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  • Guest changed the title to [Drama 2015-2016] Six Flying Dragons 육룡이 나르샤

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