[Official] SPARTACE COUPLE KimJongkook-SongJiHyo

[fs10]

2 hours ago, Swan Solimo said:

Hi! I'm new here and made this account out of curiosity. I personally take things at face value as I don't like to speculate, but I think the analyses in this forum, especially by @linzer03, are really interesting-- definitely made me go down the rabbit hole. Still, I like to believe whatever SJH and KJK say outside RM and MUD-- where they have to play characters. For instance, in the PCIH episode, apart from referring to each other as family, KJK referred to SJH as his dongsaeng. I think that would be extremely strange and inappropriate if there was really something going on between them. That said, I respect the opinions of shippers who do believe there's something going on because no one among fans really knows what's going on in reality anyway-- we're all equally ignorant. So I wanted to ask people who do believe there's something going on between the two: what would convince you that there is nothing going on between them?

The world of variety is so strange to me    I used to think that RM= their working world, so whatever they say can be scripted. While shows outside RM are "real world", where they appear as their genuine selves. Then i started to feel like MUD is part of this "working world" as well. I feel eventually PCIH will become this as well- even though not as much because it's a talk show rather than a variety one like RM and MUD-but still ones where "public persona" is expected. Honestly, since SJH guested in other shows, I gave up this distinction and take everything with a grain of salt 

 

i could never be a celebrity myself. LOL. The thought of putting on persona and having to remember the details to stories is exhausting to me 

[fs10]

2 hours ago, linzer03 said:

 

I'm glad to hear my posts still have use to people after all these years. I cringe when I think of reading back over them lol

Your posts age pretty well i think  I even still read ''it began with a gray sky" like reading an old thumbed through book in my bookshelf  I look forward to your thoughts on SA's names on each other's phones episode 

 

Also, I'm hoping for the reemergence of previously active  writers as well, such as 

@Adora Darkr

[Swan Solimo]

4 hours ago, linzer03 said:

 

I'm glad to hear my posts still have use to people after all these years. I cringe when I think of reading back over them lol

 

SJH starting to post more is interesting, but I don't particularly think it relates to SA. She's mentioned that she's trying to change up her image, which, to me, is a pretty believable reason.

 

In terms of SA... I would think them trying at build a character for her on RM hints that she's not planning on leaving RM on her own soon. Before LKS left, you could see his character being toned down a bit. Now, SJH doesn't have massive presence that LKS did, but she is one of the most popular cast members. I would think RM would place less emphasis on SA and them individually if they were planning on one or both were leaving the show. I personally don't think they'll get married, if they plan to, until RM ends. So this to me would indicate there's no marriage news on the horizon. But also, they could announce marriage tomorrow and I wouldn't be surprised.

 

@Swan Solimo I totally understand not wanting to speculate too much. I think we should always try to understand that celebs are human. They're going to make mistakes, make silly decisions, are going to be petty. They're going to do what's in their best interests and they are going to do things fir profit. Most lovelines are faje and purely for variety. The thing with SA is that we have 12 years to look at of interactions (albiet most of these interactions through the lens of RM). It's not only based on interactions while promoting a drama or even as a loveline. There is a lot of evidence indicating they dated well before it's in their best interests to play a loveline.

 

I'm curious why you don't think KJK and SJH aren't playing characters on PCIH? Their characters may not be the same as their RM characters, but they are still playing up a variety image. What do you think KJK shpuld have said in that situation if he was dating SJH, doesn't want to offend fans, and wants to keep it a secret? 

 

I'm so glad to hear from everyone! I thought this forum was dead lol. I hope you're all doing well and staying safe!

 

You have a point about playing characters on PCIH as well. For one thing, KJK mentioned about SJH learning about his COVID diagnosis late (I think he even said 2 days after), which is really the most unbelievable story the RM cast has come up with in my opinion. There is no way any of the members found out late since they also had to get tested. Still, I had the impression that interviews conducted outside RM would be more honest.

On KJK's response in PCIH, I think saying they're family would have been enough-- as they have used this script for a long time. The mention of "dongsaeng" specifically is what I thought was odd if there is something going on between them. Family is vague enough but I don't think calling a partner or potential partner a dongsaeng is acceptable in any context.

Taking everything at face value, to me what they have appears to be a close platonic relationship. Of course, taking things this way can definitely be wrong given that celebrities don't necessarily say the truth about their relationships all the time-- which is why I'm really interested in the forum's take on all of this.

@linzer03I understand your view, but I'm really curious to know if there is anything that will make you think twice about their relationship-- that their relationship may not be romantic.

 

1 hour ago, fs10 said:

The world of variety is so strange to me    I used to think that RM= their working world, so whatever they say can be scripted. While shows outside RM are "real world", where they appear as their genuine selves. Then i started to feel like MUD is part of this "working world" as well. I feel eventually PCIH will become this as well- even though not as much because it's a talk show rather than a variety one like RM and MUD-but still ones where "public persona" is expected. Honestly, since SJH guested in other shows, I gave up this distinction and take everything with a grain of salt 

 

i could never be a celebrity myself. LOL. The thought of putting on persona and having to remember the details to stories is exhausting to me 

 

I completely understand what you mean about distinguishing between the "working" and "real" worlds. I do agree that as long as it's variety, they have to and will put up their personas. With PCIH, I considered it more of a talk show, which is why I thought it would be more real. But yeah, you're right about having to keep a "public persona." Maybe as long as they are in RM, the members will have to stick with their characters to some extent even outside the show.

 

Edited May 6, 2022 by Swan Solimo
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[linzer03]

21 minutes ago, Swan Solimo said:

I understand your view, but I'm really curious to know if there is anything that will make you think twice about their relationship-- that their relationship may not be romantic.

 

 

Lol I question whether they're dating constantly. What could X mean? What are the different interpretations of X? If I think something indicates they're not dating, then I weigh it against the evidence I have that they are dating. If the evidence that they're not dating totals out more than the evidence that they are dating, then I'll believe that they aren't dating.

 

Of course, unless a concrete story comes out about who KJK and SJH were dating in 2013-2015, I'll probably always believe they dated during that time period based on things I've seen and heard. It's not impossible that they dated, broke up, decided to remain friends, and then did a love line for RM. I've discussed this possibility a lot, but based on the timing of things and my own personal experiences with trying to be friends right after a break up, I think is the less likely option than they have dated for a very, very long time.

 

The RM cast definitely lie a lot more than we think. I usually assume there's some grain of truth in most the story they tell (because it's easiest to make up things based on what you know), but they exaggerate and stretch the truth for variety's sake or to hide things they don't want the audience to know.

[fs10]

33 minutes ago, Swan Solimo said:

Taking everything at face value, to me what they have appears to be a close platonic relationshi

I believe this as well-- i think this is the very least, the bare minimum of what they have between them, which is saying a lot already (i think, considering they're not known to have close friends of the opposite sex besides each other).

 

That being said, i ask myself a different version of your question-- with them being close friends, what is it that makes me think they might have a romantic relationship.

 

In the past, my answer for this is the physical contact and the body language. Now, they are closer, but they're not as touchy as they used to be () which could mean that they're at a very comfortable stage in their romantic relationship.  Orrrrrrr they really are just super close friends who are unaware of boundaries because they dont have significant others in their lives to help set the boundaries between friends/lovers. LOL.

Edited May 6, 2022 by fs10
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[Swan Solimo]

4 minutes ago, fs10 said:

Orrrrrrr they really are just super close friends who are unaware of boundaries because they dont have significant others in their lives to help set the boundaries between friends/lovers. LOL.

 

This is honestly what I think. And rather than thinking they are or were in a relationship, I think it's more possible that they can potentially have a relationship in the future-- mostly because they seem to be each other's closest friend of the opposite sex.

[linzer03]

1 hour ago, fs10 said:

Your posts age pretty well i think  I even still read ''it began with a gray sky" like reading an old thumbed through book in my bookshelf  I look forward to your thoughts on SA's names on each other's phones episode 

 

Also, I'm hoping for the reemergence of previously active  writers as well, such as 

@Adora Darkr

 

Oof "It Began With A Gray Sky" is old. My writing has improved since then, I promise.

 

So, the obvious thing about the phones is that SA have different names for each other compared to their phone names for everyone else. That is a flag that their relationship is unique compared to their relationships with the rest of the cast. You could argue that they're just really really close friends, but the fact that not even HH, who has been KJK's friend since Turbo days, gets a nickname like that indicates to me that there's sonething more there.

 

My initial thought was actually that KJK lied about what SJH's name on his phone was. I don't know how to explain it.. When someobe's lying they tend to cover their mouth, they tend to repeat the lie (as if convincing themselvrs it's true), leaning away can be a sign of lying. It's just a combination of things that gives me that vibe.

 

Now, he could have lied for the sake of the love line. SJH actually has a boring name on his phone, he needs to make up something to stand out, and Mong is what he comes up with. It's also possible that's she's saved as something he can't say on air. Either way, Mong is her RM nickname. It's an easy one to cone up with on short notice. Because usually when under pressure you go with what you know: which would be her famous RM nickname.

 

When it's SJH's turn, and the cast members start questioning her name for KJK, she then switches tune and wonders if it "orabeoni". She's acting like she doesn't remember, but she literally named the other older men as orabeoni and KJK, in the middle  was specifically oppa. So it's not like she started listing orabeoni, got distracted and switched to oppa. She used orabeoni, then oppa, then back to orabeoni. To me, it appears she's starts backtracking when the others point out only KJK is oppa.

 

The segment was judged by the crew on how truthful/sincere the cast were, but really, if you're going to make a secret couple answer those type of questions, you should expect lying on related topics. The crew also play into the cast's characters. Such a voting JSJ to be the loser of the honesty round. HH the loser for not convincingly loving RM enough, etc.

 

So anyway, I think KJK lied about what name SJH has on his phone and what's actually on there is something he can't share. Obviously, I think that's because I think they're dating and his name for her is probably a give away, but it could also be him playing along with the loveline. 

[Swan Solimo]

33 minutes ago, linzer03 said:

Now, he could have lied for the sake of the love line.

 

Interesting take, I never thought about KJK intentionally playing into the loveline...

[Juni Asat]

2 hours ago, Swan Solimo said:

 

This is honestly what I think. And rather than thinking they are or were in a relationship, I think it's more possible that they can potentially have a relationship in the future-- mostly because they seem to be each other's closest friend of the opposite sex.

and what Ji Hyo said just last week about opposite sex being close friend??

[<3Spartace]

2 hours ago, linzer03 said:

So anyway, I think KJK lied about what name SJH has on his phone and what's actually on there is something he can't share. Obviously, I think that's because I think they're dating and his name for her is probably a give away, but it could also be him playing along with the loveline.

agree ... he could easily say that she’s saved as Song Jihyo and nobody will question it. It could be he changed it to make it more interesting or make it less interesting (‘cause he can’t say it on air). What stood out for me was haha’s reaction. What is it that he can’t say? Whatever cheesy nickname he says can be taken as plain teasing like yjs and jsj comments. why hold back? 

2 hours ago, Swan Solimo said:

 

Interesting take, I never thought about KJK intentionally playing into the loveline...

he does ... i think he and jh talk about up to what extent they will play along ... so both of them sometimes do intentionally play along just to make things fun 

[Juni Asat]

44 minutes ago, &lt;3Spartace said:

What stood out for me was haha’s reaction. What is it that he can’t say? Whatever cheesy nickname he says can be taken as plain teasing like yjs and jsj comments. why hold back? 

I even suspect that maybe Ha Ha know what he saved her name in his phone as for sure, they are close even before RM

[Adora Dark]

I see I was tagged. The truth is I am always around the fandom and periodically return to this thread, which is a place for those interested in Spartace to come together away from anyone purposely shedding doubts.  In fact, I am one of the fans with whom @linzer03 mentioned earlier she discusses old and new theories. And with that said, I'm seconding the great arguments she made.

A few points:
~ I'm also contemplating the possibility KJK lied about using  a nickname coined up in a variety show for his longtime friend (and perhaps lover) on his personal cellphone. Additional details that may or may not point in that direction: a) It's YJS who first says he has saved SJH as Mong Ji Hyo. In the event that KJK needed fast a funny answer, it was easy to be inspired by options already heard. b) According to some body language guides "Fingers above the mouth in the philtrum area can mean low confidence, anxiety, or shyness. This is also a blocking behavior that covers the mouth, which may mean someone is hesitant to speak."  Although there is no skin contact, this is the motion KJK does when talking about SJH. Why would he exhibit hesitancy or anxiety if SJH was saved with her own name or an innocuous sobriquet every fan knows? c) There's a contrast to how KJK speaks when he's revealing the names of HH, JSM and YSC. Then he's straightforward, the answers flow easily past his lips, his eyes don't waver. Conversely, both KJK and SJH sideglance when he's talking about her. Breaking eye contact like this can indicate pondering what's being said, recalling a true sound, or fabricating a lie. Of course, all these are just theories to expand our discussions and should be taken lightly.  If we are truly searching for romantic Spartace hints, there have been other much more substantial incidents throughout the years.
 

~ Dogmatic statements (i.e. KJK would never do/say X for SJH, YJS would never question SA etc.) have no place when talking about people we don't personally know while they prioritise the demands of largely or partly scripted shows. If they need to keep aspects of their personal lives hidden from us, yes there's a good chance they won't speak or behave as expected from couples, especially when confronted with the accusation they are one. They will have to use words that don't point to a romantic relationship. It's of no surprise that the majority of suspicious Spartace moments in and out of RM emerge when the loveline isn't the main topic (i.e. bts kitchen scene in Outrun, Byul whispering SJH's name on Big Picture and many more).
 

~ Various, sometimes contradictory, versions of the same story usually conceal one or more lies. Recently, we've been presented with such stories involving SA (the 2015 flight incident, the timeframe SJH learnt about KJK's covid-19 positive test) and their different recountings don't really add up. Regarding the NY trip, the monitor of SJH's seat not functioning, subsequently obligating her to move closer to KJK and his mother, is such a specific detail to have been omitted all the previous times SA brought up this incident. Especially when on Crazy Recipe Adventure KJK insisted they were sitting separately and this important detail could have justified why if it was true. As for the covid-19 situation, fans have already highlighted the inconsistencies in  both KJK and YJS's stories. What I would like to add is that, as a KJK admirer first and foremost, I find it hard to believe that such a thoughtful, and appreciative of his closest people, individual wouldn't inform his unvaccinated family member soon after his positive self test, before any PCR results. This suggests SJH may have actually been among the first people to know.

~ Between speculating whether SA are two harmonious friends with a future lovers potential, if they open their eyes to romantic compatibility that they currently deny, because they fail to realise what I, somehow, identify from my couch, based on my own views of these people's innermost desires and thoughts  AND speculating if SA are/were lovers based again on my personal interpretations of, this time however, actual incidents and facts while any denial on their part fits the common practice of couples in the Korean entertainment industry, I choose the second option. I tend to repeat this like a broken record, but KJK and SJH are two mature individuals with wide social circles working in a demanding, sexualised industry and bonding over meaningful time spent together every week for years. They aren't two ill-fated romantics in a novel waiting a decade to make a move.

~ Watching PCitH, what immediately stood out to me was how KJK cordially assists SJH in building her image. It is something we had already noticed as fans, YJS is always the one to allocate time, ensuring the members are engaging in a joke or discussion topic, but KJK often seems more accomodating towards SJH, diverting the attention to her. It is interesting how they are candidly talking about it now. Per their words, he instructs her to talk more during the opening segments, he urges her to show bigger reactions and so on. KJK joked that 12 years later she still tries to find her place in the show, and I think his statement harbors all the worries fans have been voicing too about her lack of screentime or her passiveness. Combine this with RM editors' choice to use KJK's silhouette when SJH mentioned her staff is helping her to improve her image. An unusual choice indeed to outline KJK if he had no involvement because it concerns personal photos unrelated to RM and the hint was too subtle to count as part of their loveline. There's absolutely no variety value in adding details the majority of the viewers will miss.

Unfortunately, I still haven't watched some of the recent RM episodes. I shall share more thoughts once I do. Meanwhile, please enjoy this throwback photo of KJK. The assumption that the Spartace fandom has no primarily/solely KJK supporters floats around and this could not be more wrong.

[linzer03]

15 hours ago, Swan Solimo said:

On KJK's response in PCIH, I think saying they're family would have been enough-- as they have used this script for a long time. The mention of "dongsaeng" specifically is what I thought was odd if there is something going on between them. Family is vague enough but I don't think calling a partner or potential partner a dongsaeng is acceptable in any context.

 

I am confused as to why you think KJK wouldn't refer to SJH as a dongsaeng. Dongsaeng can refer simply to a younger person. Couples don't use the word so dongsaeng, but KJK and SJH, if in a relationship, are not public. There isn't another word KJK could use. So I don't see how this is evidence that they are not partners/potential partners.

[Swan Solimo]

2 hours ago, linzer03 said:

 

I am confused as to why you think KJK wouldn't refer to SJH as a dongsaeng. Dongsaeng can refer simply to a younger person. Couples don't use the word so dongsaeng, but KJK and SJH, if in a relationship, are not public. There isn't another word KJK could use. So I don't see how this is evidence that they are not partners/potential partners.

 

I just think that even a couple hiding their relationship wouldn't be comfortable using the term dongsaeng as it means younger sibling. While it is being used to refer to younger close friends, from what I understand, this refers to a younger person who is like a sibling. But I do see your point that there may not be a better alternative term.

[linzer03]

1 hour ago, Swan Solimo said:

 

I just think that even a couple hiding their relationship wouldn't be comfortable using the term dongsaeng as it means younger sibling. While it is being used to refer to younger close friends, from what I understand, this refers to a younger person who is like a sibling. But I do see your point that there may not be a better alternative term.

 

I think this might be a difficult concept to understand because there's no real translation to English. Dongsaeng does get translated to little bro or little sis, but it does not necessarily mean siblings. I talked over this with my friend who understands Korean just to be certain, it really just refers to someone younger. There's no "like a sibling" context to it in this case with SA. It simply is how he has to refer to someone younger. There's no word like this in English because we don't have an age heirarchy in English-speaking cultures, and you're not going to type out "younger female I'm comfortanle with" every time they use the word "dongsaeng" when tranating.

 

I think this page explains the different uses of dongsaeng:

 

https://linguasia.com/dongsaeng

[fs10]

6 hours ago, Adora Dark said:

I see I was tagged. The truth is I am always around the fandom and periodically return to this thread, which is a place for those interested in Spartace to come together away from anyone purposely shedding doubts.  In fact, I am one of the fans with whom @linzer03 mentioned earlier she discusses old and new theories. And with that said, I'm seconding the great arguments she made.

My apologies for tagging  Your old posts and linzer03's are ones I keep rereading whenever I trawl the thousands of pages in this thread. So I was too excited when linzer03 and anticipate your presence any time soon to share some insights 

[Xonos]

If they are real, there won't be any moving forward unless RM ends or KJK / SJH leave RM, nuff'said.

 

I don't really know the view of both of them regarding marriage, family and even kids.

 

I mean, between just get marriage only + live as couple and get marriage + having kids are kinda 2 diff things.

 

Reason being if end game just stay as couple, they can announce it even when they 50+ years old a.k.a still long time to go, can RM many more years.

 

But if want kids, I just don't think they are eager either.

 

But SJH does mentioned on 600th episode that she had no idea what else to do in RM in which of coz members quickly jump on it and said the opposite. But is that the subtle sign on she is showing fatigue and perhaps want to leave like LKS? Since LKS leaving RM he is doing just fine on what he want to do as actor, and perhaps more healthy too. Perhaps seeing LKS good condition after leaving RM will let SJH evaluate her current situation.

 

I also read on some news saying that KJK want to get married in these 2 years...

 

All in all, if they are true, well, time eventually will tell.

[linzer03]

13 minutes ago, Xonos said:

If they are real, there won't be any moving forward unless RM ends or KJK / SJH leave RM, nuff'said.

 

I don't really know the view of both of them regarding marriage, family and even kids.

 

I mean, between just get marriage only + live as couple and get marriage + having kids are kinda 2 diff things.

 

Reason being if end game just stay as couple, they can announce it even when they 50+ years old a.k.a still long time to go, can RM many more years.

 

But if want kids, I just don't think they are eager either.

 

But SJH does mentioned on 600th episode that she had no idea what else to do in RM in which of coz members quickly jump on it and said the opposite. But is that the subtle sign on she is showing fatigue and perhaps want to leave like LKS? Since LKS leaving RM he is doing just fine on what he want to do as actor, and perhaps more healthy too. Perhaps seeing LKS good condition after leaving RM will let SJH evaluate her current situation.

 

I also read on some news saying that KJK want to get married in these 2 years...

 

All in all, if they are true, well, time eventually will tell.

 

I've also had thoughts that SA are not particularly interested in having kids. The difficulty with this is that they have both in interviews mentioned wanting kids, so we would have to accept that they were not being entirely honest in those interviews. That doesn't mean it's a complete lie, there may be various factors as to why they wouldn't gave kids. But despite shippers' wishes, if they are dating, KJKand SJH don't seem to want that "get married, have kids, blissful family" life. 

 

If having kids was a high priority, then I don't think even Running Man and the fans would have stopped them. There's only so much of your personal life you can put on hold for career and fans. They've both been in the industry for a long time and have probanly figured out what balance between personal and public works for them. Basically, I'm saying if they really wanted to have kids, they wouldn't wait this long, to the point where it is dangerous for the mother and child's health. Of course, they are rich and therefore have access to the medical technology that can make a late pregnancy easier, so I wouldn't rule out wantung kids just yet, but it certainly looks as though they don't plan to have children to me.

 

Once the idea of having kids is out of the picture, there's no reason for SA to rush to get married, not when it would result in one or both of them leaving RM. Celeb couples in South Korea don't appear as regulars on variety shows together; in fact, a lot of them remain distant on social media and rarely talk about one another. While there's a first for everything, there's probably a lot of cons to having your real life relationship thrust into the spotlight every week on a show that can get physical. I've never really thought SA would both continue the show if they announced, and given everything weknow about them,if only one was to leave RM, it'd most likely be SJH.

 

About KJK saying he'll get married in 2 years... he's said that he'll het married in 2 years every year since I joined the fandom in 2016. He's missed countless 2 year deadlines lol. KJK has said he'll lie up until the moment he announces, so I just ignore anything he says about his relationship status and marriage plans. I'm shocked TV show hosts don't get bored of asking him such uselesa questions. If SA don't announce in 2 years bc RM is still going, I won't be surprised. If SA announced tomorrow, I also won't be surprised. 

[Xonos]

11 hours ago, linzer03 said:

About KJK saying he'll get married in 2 years... he's said that he'll het married in 2 years every year since I joined the fandom in 2016. He's missed countless 2 year deadlines lol. KJK has said he'll lie up until the moment he announces, so I just ignore anything he says about his relationship status and marriage plans. I'm shocked TV show hosts don't get bored of asking him such uselesa questions. If SA don't announce in 2 years bc RM is still going, I won't be surprised. If SA announced tomorrow, I also won't be surprised. 

 

Who knows the reason on why the deadline delay were due to KJK want to get married but SJH feels not yet, then after 2 years KJK turn to say no LOL...And vise versa afterwards...

 

SJH actually already 40 years old this year, so I would think if having children still in their plan, this one or two year should see some reveal, well if they are really together...

 

If not, then we just wait la haha~

 

Edit: To add on, SJH seems like no working schedule at the moment? Meaning no drama or even movie atleast in this year up till now...So err, half retirement? Or just fatigue from filming RM...?

[Juni Asat]

all these leaving RM things reminds me of Ji Hyo said she hope will get new opportunities this year (the new year episode if I'm not wrong), did that a hint that she's considering to leave RM??