Joo Won 주원 [Current Drama 2024 - The Midnight Studio/ 야한(夜限) 사진관]

[kittyna]

7 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

I share the similar opinion. Joo won's popularity is dwarfs when we compare with his peers, like, you mention Kim Young Kwang, he played as supporting role in Good Doctor, but now in terms of popularity he does surpass Joo won.

 

Actually, if you'll forgive the tangent, I think Kim Young Kwang wound up being more a surprise than JW for me in terms of turning out to be a strong actor. Probably it's because I knew about JW's stage background really early on, so I had high expectations for his performance to begin with  

 

7 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

And, like you mentioned he does look stunning in few angles, I got to see it in Alice. In few angles he was looking better than usual and we can clearly see that there are few facial changes(in natural way).

 

It's not a hard and fast rule, but generally speaking, I think JW looks best with the type of hairstyle, makeup, etc. that we got in Alice. Like, I don't necessarily think he could pull off the long "sageuk" sort of hair very well (not without some serious getting used to on my part, anyway), but I like his looks best when he's given a hairstyle that goes down to about his ears. I dunno; there's something about what that does for his facial features and proportions that I just personally like.

 

And, on a slight side note, I think he generally looks better in a mask than most Korean male celebrities.  All the focus then ends up on his eyes, and there's no denying that they're among his most distinctive and alluring features.

 

 

7 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

And speaking of unique scripts, I got to watch a kiss scene in "18 Again" drama where female lead is twice the age of the male lead, and it was like a moment where K-drama broke the class ceiling by reversing the roles. Like, it was always like a female high school student who always falls for a older guy, in this drama it was like reverse thing and it was quite refreshing to see it. Btw the drama is remake of "17 Again" movie.

 

Speaking of the reversed age gap, I'm just wondering whether you've watched Secret Love Affair. It's one of my personal favourite dramas, even if the actual romance involved (between a married music instructor and a student twenty years younger) is a bit sketchy - as you might have figured out from my references to it within my Seolleim in Salzburg series. Mind you, in SLA, the younger guy develops feelings first, but the drama definitely did push the envelope in terms of stories focusing on extramarital relationships, the sort of nepotism/classism that occurs within Korea's classical music scene (it's like what we see in Nae Il's Cantabile, but altogether rawer and grittier), etc.

 

7 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

Whenever I see a drama where the script and characters are complex, I wished Joo won was part of  that drama, at least in a supporting role, and I really think now that he has matured as an actor, he can play complex roles really well.

 

Hm...I can't say I've had that experience yet, but I'd love to hear what dramas you've thought that for  

 

7 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

For that he needs to pick unique script and needs to play complex characters with unconventional looks, I still think his agency wants him to flower boy type, but that phase is over and joo won needs to take lot of dark roles or a character with lot of scars from the past,  which has lot of arcs.

 

Exactly my point. To be honest, in my family at least, we tend to describe actors as being either the "character actor" type or the "idol" type; it's not an absolute sort of thing, but generally speaking, by "idol" type, we mean the "flower boy"/teenage heartthrob type (as opposed to the actual K-pop idol-turned-actor, which is a whole other ball game). 

 

I've banked on JW being more the "character actor" sort from the start, especially given his track record for going outside the box in his roles (as one fan meme-ified once), so here's hoping that continues  

 

 

 

8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

I am secretly hoping that he would take of "John Wick" remake, that would be dope, like it would be lit as hell to see Joo won with a beard killing lot of people, since  he did pretty good job in Alice holding a gun and it was pretty natural.

 

 I'm just having a hard time imagining JW with a beard, but otherwise, I get your point. 

 

Speaking of JW's skills with a gun, though: he's always been pretty good at acting with them (since he's done so a gazillion times over his career), but as a Canadian who lives not too far away from the US border...I try not to dwell on the fact that the majority of Korean men actually do know how to use a gun for very long. 

[kireeti2]

1 hour ago, kittyna said:

Hm...I can't say I've had that experience yet, but I'd love to hear what dramas you've thought that for

Doctor Romantic 2, since he had already done two dramas in medical genre. "The World Of Married", I find conflicts in relationship especially in marriage more complex than love conflicts like "Where female lead is torn between first and second lead". "My Mister", not as male lead, it would be too challenging for him but like the son of the money leader who constantly harass the female lead. And also, in movies like "The Nameless Gangster, The Attorney".

1 hour ago, kittyna said:

but as a Canadian who lives not too far away from the US border

But, you are on near the safer side of the border, like the Norther States have less gun ownership and fewer incidences of Gun shooting when compared to Southern States.

1 hour ago, kittyna said:

.I try not to dwell on the fact that the majority of Korean men actually do know how to use a gun for very long.

Yeah, but shooting incidence are pretty rare in Korea and the fact that we see lot of Police officers from K-drama rarely use gun and rarely display it, tells us that gun regulation is pretty tight in Korea

1 hour ago, kittyna said:

I'm just wondering whether you've watched Secret Love Affair.

It's on my watch list and you have already suggested me when I brought up about "The World Of Married" drama success

1 hour ago, kittyna said:

've banked on JW being more the "character actor" sort from the start, especially given his track record for going outside the box in his roles (as one fan meme-ified once), so here's hoping that continues

Lol! The almost beggar part was apt description of Joo won's character in the "Fatal Intuition" movie, given that he lost his business while gambling with some loan sharks in the movie.

And also, I sort of find the pattern of the success of his dramas. His dramas did well whenever he choose a underdog character and dramas in which he had played a role of cool guy did average in ratings. Maybe that's what he should look in for his next project, a role of Undergo.

 

 

 

 

 

[kittyna]

8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

"My Mister", not as male lead, it would be too challenging for him but like the son of the money leader who constantly harass the female lead.

 

Now that you bring him up...yeah, I can see it. Especially since the loanshark's son had quite a mess of conflicting emotions towards IU's character as well: on the one hand, he blames her for his father's death and wants to finish what his father started; but on the other hand, he's got this obsessive crush on her and at least part of his behaviour is because he's lashing out at her for not returning his feelings.

 

I might not have been able to visualize it before Alice, but now that we've seen Evil Jin Gyeom, I could.  

 

8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

But, you are on near the safer side of the border, like the Norther States have less gun ownership and fewer incidences of Gun shooting when compared to Southern States.

 

It's not so much about my own safety as it is that whatever goes wrong in the States eventually affects us as well. In terms of criminal activity, for instance, illegal firearms are smuggled in from the US by street gangs in Toronto, and we have seen a steady increase in gang-related violence here over the years. Or, if you think about COVID-19, the numbers are just terrifying to look at. Not to mention the way that President Trump still refers to COVID as the "China virus" - at this rate, even if he loses the election, I'm not sure if things will get any better for Asian Americans (among whom I do have some relatives), as the general public is so strongly divided and all it takes is one loose cannon with a gun for chaos to ensue.

 

8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

Yeah, but shooting incidence are pretty rare in Korea and the fact that we see lot of Police officers from K-drama rarely use gun and rarely display it, tells us that gun regulation is pretty tight in Korea

 

And am I glad for that! Of course, there's not much that can be done about those who don't abide by the law, but at least both law enforcement and the general public seem to be on board with gun regulations in Korea.

 

8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

Lol! The almost beggar part was apt description of Joo won's character in the "Fatal Intuition" movie, given that he lost his business while gambling with some loan sharks in the movie.

 

Not to mention that at the time, that was probably the most "rough and tumble" we've ever seen JW get with his characters.  

 

8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

And also, I sort of find the pattern of the success of his dramas. His dramas did well whenever he choose a underdog character and dramas in which he had played a role of cool guy did average in ratings. Maybe that's what he should look in for his next project, a role of Undergo.

 

 An underdog, or - if he is cool - in a way that's actually got some sort of reason behind it.

 

New photo shoot

[kireeti2]

26 minutes ago, kittyna said:

by street gangs in Toronto

Spoiler

There are gangs in Canada? Like, I was aware the about gang violence in USA, but never heard about ones in Canada. And when I looked up in online, I got to know that there are variety of gangs, like there are gangs from each community.

32 minutes ago, kittyna said:

if things will get any better for Asian Americans

Spoiler

 

Yeah, there was surge of racist attacks against Asians around the world after  Trump coined the word "China Virus".

 

 

37 minutes ago, kittyna said:

that was probably the most "rough and tumble" we've ever seen JW get with his characters.  

I would like to see more this from Joo won, since he play such roles really well and it suits for his physical traits as well

 

38 minutes ago, kittyna said:

Now that you bring him up...yeah, I can see it. Especially since the loanshark's son had quite a mess of conflicting emotions towards IU's character as well: on the one hand, he blames her for his father's death and wants to finish what his father started; but on the other hand, he's got this obsessive crush on her and at least part of his behaviour is because he's lashing out at her for not returning his feelings.

Yeah, that character was really messed up, more messed up than the Male lead's wife(not the cheating part, but the part where she was angry with his husband that she cheated )

 

53 minutes ago, kittyna said:

I'm not sure if things will get any better for Asian Americans (among whom I do have some relatives)

I hope it will get better, since people have realized that it can be spread by anyone and origin of virus is not that important.

[kittyna]

56 minutes ago, kireeti2 said:

Yeah, there was surge of racist attacks against Asians around the world after  Trump coined the word "China Virus".

 

56 minutes ago, kireeti2 said:

I hope it will get better, since people have realized that it can be spread by anyone and origin of virus is not that important.

 

Where I'm from, things have never gotten really out of hand. Like, you'll get the occasional bad side-eye or racist rant that ends up being posted on social media (and the person being the racist is then chewed out by netizens), but in my own personal experience, the most frequent sort of comment I got was either 1) a hope/wish that people won't turn out racist; or 2) a compliment along the lines of "If only we'd taken this as seriously as you Asians did from the start". Because in Toronto at least, the infection rate among East Asians was disproportionately low during the first wave, and it's argued that it's because, with access to news from China, Korea, etc., we started masking and staying home sooner. Of course, there are other factors at play, too - such as East Asians generally being wealthier and more likely to be able to work from home than other racialized groups - but the point is that I personally have received more compliments relating to COVID-19 than insults.

 

56 minutes ago, kireeti2 said:

I would like to see more this from Joo won, since he play such roles really well and it suits for his physical traits as well

 

Yeah - for someone with what is arguably the most ordinary home life backstory ever (), JW's actually really good at playing characters from the wrong side of the tracks. For me, that's also part of the appeal behind his performance as Kim Tae Hyun in Yong Pal as well; he did a great job juggling Tae Hyun's inner goodness and determination to break out of poverty with his outer appearance as a crass-talking swaggering gangster type.

 

Which reminds me: I think I did bring this up once a long time ago, but I now remember thinking that I could visualize JW playing a character like the conman (i.e. Seo In Guk's character) in Squad 38. Like, SIG nailed that performance, and I wouldn't have had the casting go any other way, but if a similar role for someone slightly older ever came around....  

[kireeti2]

1 hour ago, kittyna said:

Because in Toronto at least, the infection rate among East Asians was disproportionately low during the first wave, and it's argued that it's because, with access to news from China, Korea, etc., we started masking and staying home sooner. Of course, there are other factors at play, too - such as East Asians generally being wealthier and more likely to be able to work from home than other racialized groups - but the point is that I personally have received more compliments relating to COVID-19 than insults.

Not only in Canada, most of the East Asian countries were able to control outbreaks and have low transmission rates despite having densely populated cities like Seoul and Tokyo, suggests that East Asian were more willing to wear masks while they are outside, since it is the only way to slow-down the infection rates. Willingness to wear a mask is also factor in slowing down the transmission rate

1 hour ago, kittyna said:

eah - for someone with what is arguably the most ordinary home life backstory ever (), JW's actually really good at playing characters from the wrong side of the tracks.

[flutterby06]

Am I late to talk about Alice? are you already done? Please don't..Please bear with my late talk.. ha ha...

 

I got lost from soompi after posting about the not so organized ending of Alice.. As I was lost in my interpretation of episode 16. So I thought may be I would see how others would like to explain it.. But what I found was bunch of complain how the show is back on Taeyi Jin Gyeom loveline. Honestly as you guys know I have never really thought this drama is about loveline; even if it is it's definitely not Taeyi and Jin Gyeom's loveline. And I definitly don't get how people see the loveline after episode 15 where there's plenty of evidence Yoon Tae Yi playing the role of 2050 Taeyi for both Jin Gyeom and Min Hyuk. Her intertwined memories with 2050 Taeyi is making her see things in a different light that she previously was unable to explain. So I just thought I should think about my own interpretation however non scientific fiction it may be.

 

At first to think what was I expecting from Alice and what I got.. I was expecting to see a different kind of human relationships.. And I got that. Alice was wonderful at it's interpretation of Human Relationships. I've always loved reading science fiction books mostly from local writer and translated ones of Issac Asimov. But I do not really watch many sci-fi shows. So I was not that invested in the details of SF side of the show, I was just watching and enjoying that aspect. I was on board with Teacher and Book of Prophecy mystery. While we know the identity of teacher, I don't think Alice really tried to really explain the origin of Book of Prophecy or what's teachers interest in it. I was disappointed that Alice never really give us a proper conclusion on that. Because I do love the notion of not believing blindly in a prophecy/future because it can always change, I also do want to know how it was there to begin with because it caused so much chaos.

Honestly I think I've been saying it a lot here and there that I'm really satisfied till episode 15 of Alice. It gave me almost everything I wanted to see..in a melodramatic way..but I do have a love for good melo drama..so yeah I enjoyed that melo side. How Taeyi used to hate Min Hyuk's guts but in the end she's the one ended up as being understanding of his sorrow. She said to him "I don't how close we used to be there.. But you're not in my book yet. You'll not be in the future also." in erlier episodes and in ep 15 she asked him to runaway with her and Jin Gyeom.. If that's not melo i don't know what is. Jin Gyeom went from " She is just a very good friend" to "She is a friend who cares about me a lot." to "I can't promise anything." to " If things go wrong for you, it goes wrong for me." These are my definition of classic melo.. well may not be full kdrama version of melo but I used to be sucker for this kind of literature in my childhood. So yeah I was totally satisfied.. May be for many it's to subtle to talk about. But think I write pages on this subtle changes in one characts action towards another.

What was my problem with episode 16? It ended with too many things for viewer's assumptions. That makes it complicated. Like the reset. Like has 2010 Jin Gyeom and his mother gets to live after Reset or it was just Jin Gyeom's assumption. If Park Sun Young can stay in 2010 even after Reset why can't Min Hyuk and others? Is Min Hyuk even there? Why is Do Yeon Jin Gyeom not friend if Jin Gyeom and his mother survived? Is Architect Park son of Park Sun Young? If he is why is he didn't find Taeyi familier right away? Why Taeyi remembers everything so well? And the list goes on... But I will stop here.

 

So there goes How I see the RESET----

 

According to Omma tae Yi Reset will remove the time travelers. So I think as there’s no time travelers. People who were time traveler at one point of life are again given another life in another setting. They would cease to exist as time traveler but they will not cease to live.

Like Park Jin Gyeom born in another family and he doesn’t even know his old house. Taeyi probably born in her adoptive family. Ajusshi Ko may have died if it was his current self but he is alive at present.

 

Though they have a new life, they’re destined to meet. We saw Nambu Police staffs knows Taeyi even without Park Jin Gyeom(first time Tae Yi knew them or they knew her was becuse Detective Jin Gyeom). Do Yeon ended up meeting Architect Park first even though they’re not friends now ( I assumed they’re not because Jin Gyeom doesn’t seem like he ever lived in his old place..).. But they could be friends again.

So I believe if Jin Gyeom can live in this timeline after reset so can Min Hyuk..If only they could show us that Min Hyuk is living somewhere close by… In my imagination he does.. ha ha..

 

My ending goes like this.. Tae Yi meets Jin Gyeom.. they try to share their good old memories and Tae Yi sets JG and DY up because she knows their history.. She ends up meeting Min Hyuk too.. Min Hyuk was very close by.. May be working in JG's company.. Happy Ending! Ha Ha ha.... Me happy.

 

What do you guys think about my RESET?

 

I also have few questions that are bugging me. Shae your insights if you feel like it----

 

1) Did Old Jin Gyeom went to kill Unborn Jin Gyeom because he wanted to be freed from lonely cruel  fate of time loop?

 

2) What did Old Jin Gyeom want as a Teacher? Did he wanted to be freed from his cruel fate aka time travel loop? Or did he want to save himself from getting killed by Jin Gyeom, the controller of time?

 

3) Did he killed Omma first time? Or did Omma commit suicided at that time too? What's his gain from Killing Omma?

 

(Whatever his goal might be killing Omma do not really serves any purpose of him.. His target either way is Jin Gyeom..I think in every time Old Jin Gyeom travelled time it was to try killing each version of Jin Gyeom he could so he could be freed from this lonely sorrowful state but he failed each time. He couldn't kill High schooler Jin Gyeom because of Omma's Protection.. he couldn't Kill Detective Jin Gyeom because he was the controller of time..Alice made things a bit complicated by making Omma die different time with differnt tools. Alice gun, Mystic Kinif, Old gun... But I am not bothered by last two becuse Alice showed us future can always change.. What I am interested is who killed our Jin Gyeom's Omma first time with Alice gun? Was it Old Jin Gyeom?)

 

4) What's Oh Seok Own's goad? Did he knew what he was doing? or was he just puppet of Teacher.

 

 

 

On 10/26/2020 at 6:43 AM, kittyna said:

I know an actual win is being a bit greedy, but I hope we'll get at least one credible Daesang nomination come year's end (unlike the "let's just nominate everybody" mess that was 2017's SBS Drama Awards).

 

I was in 'at least one nomination' that is for KHS's phenomenal acting as Jin Gyeom's mother until I saw JW playing multiple role.. I would at least like two nomination from Alice.. ha ha..

But definitely don't want to see everrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrybody getting in the nomination.. That's such a joke done by SBS DRAMA AWARDS 2017. 

 

But Honestly SBS should specially recognize how KHS and JW perfectly portrayed the emotions in all those death scene of Omma.. Those scene were so intense and it made me cry every time. They were so phenomenal.. Though they performed those again and aging but emotion was never lacking.. I cried in every such scene, I looked forward to each of Omma-son scene. The Omma Tone KHS use for her child of both age was very moving... woah.. Joo Won was asked in a radio show before Alice that if Alice had more emotional scene than Gaksital because the Host Lee Joon remebers how intense Gaksital was. JW said there are more than Gaksital. I know what JW means. Though gaksital had many emotional scenes none of them are this physically/mentally straining where same characters had to go through death again and again and each time the intensity of emotion grew...No matter how good of actors they are, it must have took lots of effort from KHS and JW.

 

On 10/26/2020 at 6:43 AM, kittyna said:

These aren't all the things I liked (for instance, I like to think that Jin Gyeom can count as K-drama representation for platonic relationships everywhere), but you get the idea.

 

So true...  He is epitome of Platonic relationship.

Though I feel Jin Gyeom might end up having feelings for Doyeon given a bit relaxed time where he didn't have to spend his life after his mothers killer.. I can see it..Do Yeon can make it... She has JG wrapped around her finger.. But they doesn't know it with surety..I just see their possiblities are endless.. What do you think @kireeti2? Wanna talk about Jingyeom-Doyeon?

 

On 10/26/2020 at 5:31 PM, nina_mitrokhina 5misnina said:

3. In terms of DNA, Professor Tae Yi remains Jin Gyooma's biological mother. Then how can incest be allowed between these two characters ?!

It seems that the writers went to the violation of common sense and logic for the sake of the notorious "happy ending".

 

Kim Hee-sun interpreted the relationship between Yoon Tae-yi and Park Jin-gyeom as a relationship that is not a love line.

"To Park Jin-Gyeom, Yoon Tae-yi looks just like his mother Park Sun-young, so he has the desperation and sorrow that he doesn't even want to lose Yoon Tae-yi, who looks the same as his mother.

As Yoon Tae Yi I thought I was in favour of Park Jin-gyeom, who protects me so much, but i didn't feel the love line."

 

You will find this in the transaltion of 11th Para:

http://m.koreadaily.com/news/read.asp?art_id=8788601&referer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2F

 

 

So I hope KHS's interprtation will help you to be relived that there's no incest going on in the characters mind. 

 

On 10/26/2020 at 6:57 PM, kittyna said:

If it were up to me, I think I'd be happy with the drama ending after Jin Gyeom and Tae Yi first run into each other again - when, after realizing that Jin Gyeom doesn't recognize her, Tae Yi finally starts to think that it might be better for him this way. I loved that bit about her just being happy that he's happy, because I think that's what love (romantic or otherwise) should ultimately be about.

 

And if the story really had to continue past that point so that Tae Yi could also be happy? As fine as I am with the actual ending, if it were entirely up to me and my writer's imagination, I'd have the second meeting play out differently. K-dramas often have some sort of concept of a "new beginning" in their finales; and rather than a reunion based on subconscious memory, that's the approach I would go for.

 

So, rather than Jin Gyeom starting to remember Tae Yi, I would have written him as someone who doesn't remember, but who ends up meeting Tae Yi again in a different context. Maybe she ends up buying the old house and commissions him to renovate it or something, I dunno. And then they officially introduce (or, in Tae Yi's case, reintroduce) themselves, and a new working relationship or friendship could start.

 

lol - I dunno, guys. It feels sort of sacrilegious to start thinking of an entire alternate ending so soon after the drama's own finale, but..should I?  

 

You're not the only one.. Me guilty here.

Sorry Alice.. As much as I loved you I need my Alice alternate Epilogue to have ultimate satisfaction. ha ha...

On 10/27/2020 at 5:36 PM, kittyna said:

I just realized, after rewatching the ending a few times, that it's actually a really intriguing reversal of Episode 1/2: where Tae Yi is the one who's obsessively searching for Jin Gyeom and who now claims to know him from somewhere, and he's like, "Uh...what?" It's resolved by the subconscious memories floating up in his mind afterwards, but if he does recognize her now, he'd also recognize that it's because of her connection to his mother....Point is: romance is still highly unlikely, in my opinion.

 

I also noticed it how they replaced their position after REST. Before it was Jin Gyeom and now it's Tae Yi who ended up being the one with memory.

 

 

On 10/27/2020 at 7:33 PM, kittyna said:

By the way, there's one detail from the first half of Episode 16 that I didn't comment on before, but that I thought was really brilliant. When "our" Jin Gyeom goes back in time to 2010 again, he checks his arm when he first tracks down his mother and starts to follow her. I actually love that they included that touch.  

 

I also noticed it.. He was checking if he was under trance of Old Jin Gyeom or not so his mother may not get danger because of him.. That was such a nice touch. In fact there are many of such little little touch of Jin gyeom's thoughtfulness here and there which shows how he feels for people and things.. I already have some in mind.. may be we can talk more about it later. 

 

 

[kireeti2]

11 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

My ending goes like this.. Tae Yi meets Jin Gyeom.. they try to share their good old memories and Tae Yi sets JG and DY up because she knows their history.. She ends up meeting Min Hyuk too.. Min Hyuk was very close by.. May be working in JG's company.. Happy Ending! Ha Ha ha.... Me happy.

Lol! I like this version of ending Especially the part where TY setting up PJG and KDY , like in episode 15 we sort of get a feeling that TY(2020) gave blessings to the union of PJG and KDY , so I wouldn't be surprised if she tries to set up them up in this dimension

 

11 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

What do you think @kireeti2? Wanna talk about Jingyeom-Doyeon?

I think the writers did give us hit by making DY do an interview with new PJG in the end, that there is possibility of their union, just like you mentions TY, will be the one to initiate things between them. Lol! In the end everything has been reversed TY  is the one who wants DY to date PJG, earlier she really didn't like DY, perhaps this will be alternative of Spain trip,like, I can imagine how TY(2020) will ask PJG to meet up for lunch or something and also call DY to also come on the pretext of talking about time travel and introduce each other formally, even though they have met before new PJG had no memories of DY, and after meeting TY(2020) he was able to regain his past memories, so, in the next meeting with DY, new PJG will try his best to impress her

 

[kittyna]

@flutterby06, @kireeti2 - I like how everybody's coming up with their own versions of what things are like for the Alice characters post-reset - you guys will know from my version that I tried to keep as much from the pre-reset storyline as possible (because I personally really like the possibility of the reset being a do-over for Jin Gyeom), but you guys went for something completely different, yet still plausible, so kudos 

 

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

Though they have a new life, they’re destined to meet. We saw Nambu Police staffs knows Taeyi even without Park Jin Gyeom(first time Tae Yi knew them or they knew her was becuse Detective Jin Gyeom). Do Yeon ended up meeting Architect Park first even though they’re not friends now ( I assumed they’re not because Jin Gyeom doesn’t seem like he ever lived in his old place..).. But they could be friends again.

So I believe if Jin Gyeom can live in this timeline after reset so can Min Hyuk..If only they could show us that Min Hyuk is living somewhere close by… In my imagination he does.. ha ha..

 

My ending goes like this.. Tae Yi meets Jin Gyeom.. they try to share their good old memories and Tae Yi sets JG and DY up because she knows their history.. She ends up meeting Min Hyuk too.. Min Hyuk was very close by.. May be working in JG's company.. Happy Ending! Ha Ha ha.... Me happy.

 

So...basically, rather than a familial relationship, we somehow end up with a four-person group of BFFs who may or may not also form two dating couples (Jin Gyeom + Do Yeon; Tae Yi + Min Hyuk). Sounds like fun - and I imagine there's tons of comic gold and cute/fluffy shenanigans to be had with this group 

 

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

1) Did Old Jin Gyeom went to kill Unborn Jin Gyeom because he wanted to be freed from lonely cruel  fate of time loop?

 

2) What did Old Jin Gyeom want as a Teacher? Did he wanted to be freed from his cruel fate aka time travel loop? Or did he want to save himself from getting killed by Jin Gyeom, the controller of time?

 

3) Did he killed Omma first time? Or did Omma commit suicided at that time too? What's his gain from Killing Omma?

 

For me, I don't know what the Teacher's goal was at first (btw, I'm calling him that to minimize confusion with Jin Gyeom), but by the time any of our main characters see him (Park Sun Young in 1992, or Jin Gyeom in 2010/2020), he's become a really messed up version of himself. Let's forget the sci-fi for a second and just think about his actions from the perspective of normal human nature - and if we do that, I think there are three basic assumptions I can make:

1. He believes he's fated to kill his mother according to the prophecy - and he has enough feelings for her that he hates himself for it and wishes that he'd never been born
2. However, rather than trying to stop the cycle on his own, he's decided to place all the blame on his mother for letting him be born to such a fate in the first place
3. He's desperate to hold on to his ability to control time because he thinks it's the one part of himself and his life that he can control - and since his mother is now actively trying to close the door of time, he has to kill her in order to hold on to that part of his identity, even if it ends up with him hating himself (and her) more every single time the cycle repeats itself

Is it circular logic? Yes. But people are seldom completely rational, especially when it comes to reflecting on their own wrongful actions and beliefs. So that's the cycle that - it's implied - the Teacher has been repeating in each parallel universe he ends up in.

 

I, too, noticed that he tried to kill Jin Gyeom at the end of Episode 15. Personally, I think it's because he senses (from JG's reaction to meeting him) that he's now dealing with the one version of himself that won't follow the pattern - and he knows from the prophecy that that means that this Jin Gyeom will be the one that could kill him and stop time travel for good. So, in terms of the conflict between the Teacher and Jin Gyeom, it's a simple matter of "kill or be killed" from the Teacher's perspective.

 

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

4) What's Oh Seok Own's goad? Did he knew what he was doing? or was he just puppet of Teacher.

 

I mentioned this in a comment that's probably buried by now, but my guess is that Seok Oh Won - and most of the other time travelers among our antagonists - really only knew or understood that Tae Yi (in any incarnation) and Jin Gyeom were trying to stop time travel, and they couldn't allow that. Seok Oh Won stands out for having read the final page of the book of prophecy, but even his motive seems to just boil down to "Anyone who tries to stop the time travel I had a part in developing must die."

 

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

What I am interested is who killed our Jin Gyeom's Omma first time with Alice gun? Was it Old Jin Gyeom?

 

My best guess is that with the main timeline that we see in Alice, we're dealing with the one parallel universe that deviated from the cycle. It's likely that someone from "Alice" - either acting independently (because there were tons of people from 2050 who wanted Sun Young dead by that point) or on the Teacher's orders - killed Sun Young in Episode 1, as evidenced by the weapon involved and by Oh Si Young's claim in Episode 14 that Gi Cheol Am was the murderer. 

 

Point is, if the Teacher had killed Sun Young in Episode 1, then the prophecy would already have been fulfilled. However, if we look back at the death scene in that episode, there are some pretty strong clues that the prophecy hadn't been fulfilled:

1. Sun Young's rather cryptic comment when she sees Jin Gyeom: "He's left, and my son's okay." One of the most intriguing things about this line was that, depending on where we were in the drama, it could be interpreted a gazillion different ways. At first, it sounds like whoever killed Sun Young was actually going after Jin Gyeom. Then, after Episode 5, it sounds like she meant that the 2020 Jin Gyeom had made it back to the present in time before the young Jin Gyeom ran into him. But once the whole prophecy was revealed, what I'd argue was the true meaning of that statement becomes clear: my son still has a chance of staying good and stopping this cycle, because the person who just attacked me (and left) was not him
2. Sun Young's warning about Tae Yi. If the Teacher had been the one to shoot her - thus fulfilling the prophecy by having some version of Jin Gyeom be her killer - then she wouldn't have to be as worried about the prophecy potentially being fulfilled in the future. However, she's aware that there are two versions of herself in this timeline, which means that Jin Gyeom is still vulnerable to the prophecy in the years to come - just with 2020 Tae Yi instead of her.

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

So I hope KHS's interprtation will help you to be relived that there's no incest going on in the characters mind. 

 

Yeah, I also shared that earlier (or at least an Instagram post about it). Mind you, I don't fault viewers for seeing romance there and being put off by that - again, we've all been strongly conditioned by films/dramas/etc. to expect romance out of plot devices like fated meetings, male/female leads living together, etc. I just never saw it that way myself.

 

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

But definitely don't want to see everrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrybody getting in the nomination.. That's such a joke done by SBS DRAMA AWARDS 2017.

 

I kind of feel like 2017 was the year that networks like SBS were scrambling to find a way to work around the massive number of celebrity enlistments. Because the general unspoken rule with the drama awards is that a large prize like the Daesang can't be given to someone who couldn't attend the ceremony, the actual pool for actors who could get rewards that year was really small - but not giving all these big Hallyu stars any recognition at all would have led to a general uproar from fans. So my guess is that they decided to compromise by giving out all of these empty nominations just to be able to say, "See? Your Oppa got nominated - happy now?"

 

Yeah, I don't expect to see a repeat of that particular PR mess anytime soon  

 

By the way, on a slightly more random (but infinitely more heartwarming) note, I just stumbled across this ad that little Moon Ju Won (i.e. mini-Jin Gyeom) did recently. And I can't be the only one thinking that his bored look in the first half of the ad is probably what mini-Jin Gyeom looked like most of the time 

[kireeti2]

Well, today I have found an interesting fact, apparently Boa and Lee Da In share same birthday that is toady, what are the odds? Anyway I wish these two wonderful women a very Happy birthday

https://www.instagram.com/p/CHLE8fQpy_f/

https://www.instagram.com/p/CHKCPifgnx3/

[flutterby06]

8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

I think the writers did give us hit by making DY do an interview with new PJG in the end, that there is possibility of their union, just like you mentions TY, will be the one to initiate things between them. Lol! In the end everything has been reversed TY  is the one who wants DY to date PJG, earlier she really didn't like DY, perhaps this will be alternative of Spain trip,like, I can imagine how TY(2020) will ask PJG to meet up for lunch or something and also call DY to also come on the pretext of talking about time travel and introduce each other formally, even though they have met before new PJG had no memories of DY, and after meeting TY(2020) he was able to regain his past memories, so, in the next meeting with DY, new PJG will try his best to impress her

 

Ooooh.. It will be a sight to see how he will try to impress her.. his life or that life he'd probably gonna make a fool of himself or anger her by saying something short... ha ha... But like this idea as everything is in reverse why not him being a bit more active in perusing her. 

 

I also didn't think Yoon Tae Yi would dislike Do Yeon unless she was always aggravating her. Do Yeon was always ready to attack whenever she saw Tae Yi. And Tae Yi seemed to be finding it competitive. She seemed genuinely curious without hard feelings when she asked Jin Gyeom what's the nature of relationship with Do Yeon, when she asked Do Yeon since when she liked Jin Gyeom. I say, Do Yeon is mostly the reason why they ended up cat fighting and woman sometimes do feel like to a cat-fight when they're provoked regardless of a interest in the same man or any man. ha ha..

 

When I first started Alice I felt kinda sad that Do Yeon's feeling might be ended up being treated as totally one sided.. But then there were scenes where Jin Gyeom took special care of her, his tone for her through out this journey was real soft except that one time he raised his voice and how he would cater to her needs and demands, letting her stay with him at his regular plus old place like it's the most natural thing for him in the world.. This little little touches to their relationship spoke to me.. That they're not yet there, but they can be.

 

Ha ha I think I will have to write another post about this "A bit more than Best Friend" relationship later..

 

But is it just me or you guys noticed Jin Gyeom's soft tone for Do Yeon..? I thought that was a nice detail added by him him in Park Jin Gyeom. I mean Jin Gyeom as a apathetic person can't be really lively while talking to a friend he cares for dearly... so he tried to express it with his soft expression and tone for Do Yeon.. So far JW has only talked anything close to this soft for Ja Eun Ojakgyo Brothers but it was only done after he started having feelings for her.. So I thought Jin Gyeom's tone change from person to person was a really nice subtle touch to his character in Alice. Loved the tone he used for calling "Do Yeona" while hair drying scene "Anee" with a touch of kid Jin Gyeom tone in the car ride with Twice music, when Do Yeon was hitting him for going missing, when he asked her if she felt okay in the morning after Karaoke Night. I loved the soft voice of Park Jin Gyeom. 

 

7 hours ago, kittyna said:

So...basically, rather than a familial relationship, we somehow end up with a four-person group of BFFs who may or may not also form two dating couples (Jin Gyeom + Do Yeon; Tae Yi + Min Hyuk). Sounds like fun - and I imagine there's tons of comic gold and cute/fluffy shenanigans to be had with this group

 

Yeah they end up being Mutual Friend, thus having a possibility of dating couples.

 

Why I think they're all mostly given a new life to live is mostly because I can't see Architect Park Jin Gyeom as son of Park Sun Young. If RESET allows them to live in this time that doesn't feel very natural and fair when all others are sent back to their original timeline. That's why I see them as being born as separate individual but intertwined by destiny because they shared memories of each other before. because they couldn't see the end of it due to time travel, nature is giving them a chance to be live this time with all those people without the influence of time travel..

 

That's why Taeyi-Jin Gyeom both not remembering previous memory seemed quite appealing to me.. They could still be friends without having those flash backs.. But it's not bad either. Their memories can help them to prevent time travel for the time being.

 

I recently saw a comment on Naver in this scene's section which I found reasonable:

 

 

Like Min Hyuk has regret of not being able to be there for his love and son how his thought at the end was what could have happened if he stayed with them.. This is Jin Gyeom's regret.. If his mother was alive may be could be happy.. May be she could be there for him at moment's of his happiness...

 

7 hours ago, kittyna said:

Point is, if the Teacher had killed Sun Young in Episode 1, then the prophecy would already have been fulfilled. However, if we look back at the death scene in that episode, there are some pretty strong clues that the prophecy hadn't been fulfilled:

1. Sun Young's rather cryptic comment when she sees Jin Gyeom: "He's left, and my son's okay." One of the most intriguing things about this line was that, depending on where we were in the drama, it could be interpreted a gazillion different ways. At first, it sounds like whoever killed Sun Young was actually going after Jin Gyeom. Then, after Episode 5, it sounds like she meant that the 2020 Jin Gyeom had made it back to the present in time before the young Jin Gyeom ran into him. But once the whole prophecy was revealed, what I'd argue was the true meaning of that statement becomes clear: my son still has a chance of staying good and stopping this cycle, because the person who just attacked me (and left) was not him
2. Sun Young's warning about Tae Yi. If the Teacher had been the one to shoot her - thus fulfilling the prophecy by having some version of Jin Gyeom be her killer - then she wouldn't have to be as worried about the prophecy potentially being fulfilled in the future. However, she's aware that there are two versions of herself in this timeline, which means that Jin Gyeom is still vulnerable to the prophecy in the years to come - just with 2020 Tae Yi instead of her.

 

@kittyna thanks for your insights on those questions. 

I have similar thought regarding Omma's actual death and that the time of fulfillment of Prophecy wasn't there yet when Mom died. I think I've previously shared in this thread somewhere when people were given impression that young JG is the one who killed his Mother.

 

"my son still has a chance of staying good and stopping this cycle, because the person who just attacked me (and left) was not him" 

That's interesting take..

 

7 hours ago, kittyna said:

I kind of feel like 2017 was the year that networks like SBS were scrambling to find a way to work around the massive number of celebrity enlistments. Because the general unspoken rule with the drama awards is that a large prize like the Daesang can't be given to someone who couldn't attend the ceremony, the actual pool for actors who could get rewards that year was really small - but not giving all these big Hallyu stars any recognition at all would have led to a general uproar from fans. So my guess is that they decided to compromise by giving out all of these empty nominations just to be able to say, "See? Your Oppa got nominated - happy now?"

 

Yeah, I don't expect to see a repeat of that particular PR mess anytime soon  

 

I remember some us JW fans became surprised from Tweet that Joo Won got nominated for 2017 Daesung.. I was like "Joo Won was amazing in MSG and it was overall enjoyable drama but it's not enough for Daesung.. So who else got nominated?" And then someone uploaded the whole nominee list for Daesang... And we're like "ooh..that's why!'' ha ha..

 

7 hours ago, kittyna said:

By the way, on a slightly more random (but infinitely more heartwarming) note, I just stumbled across this ad that little Moon Ju Won (i.e. mini-Jin Gyeom) did recently. And I can't be the only one thinking that his bored look in the first half of the ad is probably what mini-Jin Gyeom looked like most of the time

 

It feels like it was a CF for Min Jin Gyeom.. so cute.

[kittyna]

3 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

I also didn't think Yoon Tae Yi would dislike Do Yeon unless she was always aggravating her. Do Yeon was always ready to attack whenever she saw Tae Yi. And Tae Yi seemed to be finding it competitive. She seemed genuinely curious without hard feelings when she asked Jin Gyeom what's the nature of relationship with Do Yeon, when she asked Do Yeon since when she liked Jin Gyeom. I say, Do Yeon is mostly the reason why they ended up cat fighting and woman sometimes do feel like to a cat-fight when they're provoked regardless of a interest in the same man or any man. ha ha..

 

Yeah, I got that sense in Alice, too: in their interactions with each other, Do Yeon tended to be more aggressive - or she tended to assume that Tae Yi's feelings for Jin Gyeom were romantic. But more importantly, both girls were naturally competitive, with Tae Yi having tons of experience bickering good-naturedly with her family, and Do Yeon just being that gung ho journalist whose job requires her to always be able to fight for the last word (reporters need to be good with words in general, and really good at comebacks).

 

3 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

Like Min Hyuk has regret of not being able to be there for his love and son how his thought at the end was what could have happened if he stayed with them.. This is Jin Gyeom's regret.. If his mother was alive may be could be happy.. May be she could be there for him at moment's of his happiness...

 

So an imagined do-over (like Min Hyuk's) rather than an actual one? I hadn't thought of that before, but now that you bring it up, I can see it. It probably won't replace or supplant my own interpretation in my head, but I do find it a very satisfying alternative  

 

Given how there are so many different ways to talk about the ending, though, I think I can say this for the time being: if/when I end up writing Alice fanfics, they probably won't be sequels or alternate endings. My sense right now is that the drama's ending is so controversial that any one interpretation I could give probably would as well. Bouncing ideas with you guys like this is one thing; writing a fic of my take feels too "permanent" right now  

 

Instead, the ideas I'm currently developing are of the alternative perspective variety: i.e. revisiting drama events from the point of view of a different character. I'll leave you guys to guess which character(s) specifically.

 

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

But is it just me or you guys noticed Jin Gyeom's soft tone for Do Yeon..? I thought that was a nice detail added by him him in Park Jin Gyeom. I mean Jin Gyeom as a apathetic person can't be really lively while talking to a friend he cares for dearly... so he tried to express it with his soft expression and tone for Do Yeon.. So far JW has only talked anything close to this soft for Ja Eun Ojakgyo Brothers but it was only done after he started having feelings for her.. So I thought Jin Gyeom's tone change from person to person was a really nice subtle touch to his character in Alice.

 

I think we've gotten that same soft tone in other dramas as well, but you're right that JW uses it with each character for a different reason:

• Ojakgyo Brothers - in his relationship with Ja Eun, especially after they are a couple
• Nae Il's Cantabile - mostly just with Nae Il, and mostly just when he goes past their usual banter and he actually opens up and becomes vulnerable
• Yong Pal - whenever Tae Hyun's trying to have a serious conversation/discussion with Yeo Jin; he knows that using a hard tone of voice would just make her want to fight back, so he uses this tone when he wants to persuade her
• Alice - as you've pointed out, @flutterby06, Jin Gyeom uses this tone to show who he actually cares about; we see it with Do Yeon, but we also see it with Go Ahjussi and Tae Yi (eventually) as well.

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

I remember some us JW fans became surprised from Tweet that Joo Won got nominated for 2017 Daesung.. I was like "Joo Won was amazing in MSG and it was overall enjoyable drama but it's not enough for Daesung.. So who else got nominated?" And then someone uploaded the whole nominee list for Daesang... And we're like "ooh..that's why!'' ha ha..

 

I think I missed that particular series of events, because I didn't know JW had been nominated for Daesang until the whole list was shared online. But I do remember being happy for him on the one hand, but also being like, "Yeah, he's never gonna win that!" on the other. I hadn't actually watched My Sassy Girl yet at the time, so I couldn't comment on JW's performance then. But after watching it myself...yeah, it wasn't really a Daesang-worthy performance.

[flutterby06]

10 hours ago, kittyna said:

I think we've gotten that same soft tone in other dramas as well, but you're right that JW uses it with each character for a different reason:

• Ojakgyo Brothers - in his relationship with Ja Eun, especially after they are a couple
• Nae Il's Cantabile - mostly just with Nae Il, and mostly just when he goes past their usual banter and he actually opens up and becomes vulnerable
• Yong Pal - whenever Tae Hyun's trying to have a serious conversation/discussion with Yeo Jin; he knows that using a hard tone of voice would just make her want to fight back, so he uses this tone when he wants to persuade her
• Alice - as you've pointed out, @flutterby06, Jin Gyeom uses this tone to show who he actually cares about; we see it with Do Yeon, but we also see it with Go Ahjussi and Tae Yi (eventually) as well.

 

May be I should make myself more clear in this regard.. Joo Won has used softer tone in other dramas as well but that changed depending on situations of his emotional state and his relationship status with the said character.. But I feel like Jin Gyeom's tone for DY is a bit more softer side.. and it has been constantly that way throughout the show except that one time when she said Tae Yi rude for the first time.. but after that he never really told her anything whenever she was in fighting mode with Tae Yi even if it was taking place in front of him. May be because he thought "let those women sort out their own problem, me telling something will just add fuel to fire." May be because he himself tried to think that Tae Yi is not his mother and truthfully he did find out later that Tae Yi can be quite impatient and rude unlike His mother (well Jin Gyeom.. only if you knew how bad RickRoll'D your mom used to be before having you!).. So what I'm trying to say he used a different kind of more softer tone to show Jin Gyeom's care for DY that is not really romantic and full of emotion but would show how much he values her and be engaging with her.

 

He did use softer tone time to time for Ajusshi, Tae Yi and even to Min Hyuk in their last scene together.

 

But I do understand your point of view.

 

Also I think both you and me are not considering Park Si On in this regard because there were countless moment he talked softly with many different people that's because he is just so sweet and generous soul for everyone. So he's the outlier.

10 hours ago, kittyna said:

Nae Il's Cantabile - mostly just with Nae Il, and mostly just when he goes past their usual banter and he actually opens up and becomes vulnerable

 

He never really talked with Nae Il in softer tone other than when he felt vulnerable that's why I didn't include her in the list until in last 2/3 episodes. But there were moment he used softer tone for Nae Il in his head.

 

Also read while back tracking this thread that a recapper from Dramabeans interpreted Yoo Jin and Naeil as old married couple who skipped the dating part. I find that analogy quite right. 

 

He did sing for Nae Il with softy tone... ha ha...

 

 

Also because we were talking about Daesung here I felt like going back in 2015 December 29th to see how people in this thread were being hyper.. And I do sometimes visit random pages in thread to see to learn more things and see what was going on back then.. It's fun... But I don't remember if I have particularly read the post from awards day..Loved most awaited for JW's Daesung but still were afraid from pervious disappointment in 2012 and 2013 from KBS. Fun read.

 

So I was taking about the radio show where JW talked about how Alice had more emotional scenes.. There host asked him what role he wants to play next.. Though there are times JW says that he doesn't have any particular roles in mind.. But this time he actually said "I have done apathetic character this time, how about doing a sensitive character next..." Just thinking about that makes me excited. A Joo Won character who strongly reacts and expresses everything and is not cool in traditional sense. I think JW fans will be delighted if he were to play such character. I wish he gets to do such a role even if it's a cameo.

 

Any character close to this one I can think about is Seo Ki Woong from Clocking Out Web Drama... He was not really a sensitive character but he was hyper and very expressive character. Oh how much I loved JW's crazy acting in there. I wish he would play such a character in more detail one day.

 

Cha Yoo Jin is one the side of expressive side too but in cool way.. But he is mostly loved to express his annoyance and sarcasm.. But I loved every expression on Cha Yoo Jin's face too...Aah..his every look is swoon worthy.  

 

If anyone feels like listening to the show I am leaving it here---

 

http://podcastfile2.sbs.co.kr/powerfm/2020/08/POWER-V2000011555-20200828(20-00)-1598838630588.MP3?vod_id=V2000011555&podcast_id=P0000000257

 

Joo Won comes around 11-12 minuets of the show. The host is Lee Joon who is a actor and probably a boy band member. I didn't see any of his dramas but know from news that he have worked with Min Jin Woong in a family drama and seemed to be well aware of Joo Won's work, also is JW just found out coming in the show that the host is his junior from middle school .. I find a show/interview more engaging when I see host of JW's interview express his/her own opinion about his acting or particular character rather than the scripted in general questions. I just feel more detailed answer comes from Joo Won when someone express genuine interest or ask genuine question to him.

[kittyna]

1 hour ago, flutterby06 said:

May be I should make myself more clear in this regard.. Joo Won has used softer tone in other dramas as well but that changed depending on situations of his emotional state and his relationship status with the said character.. But I feel like Jin Gyeom's tone for DY is a bit more softer side.. and it has been constantly that way throughout the show except that one time when she said Tae Yi rude for the first time

 

Ah, I see what you mean - the softer tone of voice is the default tone that Jin Gyeom uses with Do Yeon. Got it  

 

I think we can also add that because Jin Gyeom has difficulty with expressing his emotions, particularly in terms of his facial expressions, a lot of it has to come out through his voice instead. It's still a narrower range than most people would have, but there are very clear hints in his tone of voice as to who he likes or dislikes.

 

E.g. Regarding his interaction with Yoo Min Hyuk, I really like that scene in Episode 15 when Jin Gyeom starts off more hostile, but then softens and says, "Help me. She was your lover." It's the first time he's ever really let down his guard in front of his father, and you can tell how bittersweet a moment it is for Min Hyuk (sweet because he's been waiting for JG to open up for so long; but bitter because it just has to be under such dire circumstances).

 

1 hour ago, flutterby06 said:

Also I think both you and me are not considering Park Si On in this regard because there were countless moment he talked softly with many different people that's because he is just so sweet and generous soul for everyone. So he's the outlier.

 

Park Si On's a sweetie - but I think his general tone of voice is more bright than soft  

 

1 hour ago, flutterby06 said:

He never really talked with Nae Il in softer tone other than when he felt vulnerable that's why I didn't include her in the list until in last 2/3 episodes. But there were moment he used softer tone for Nae Il in his head.

 

If you trace all the way back, Yoo Jin started having some moments when he would use a softer tone with Nae Il really early on; however, it was something he had to consciously remind himself to do. Like, he'd start off really blunt, stop and mentally kick himself, then try again in a softer tone.  And so I think the way his tone of voice changes over the course of the drama is a great way for us to see how his character evolves as well.

 

1 hour ago, flutterby06 said:

Also read while back tracking this thread that a recapper from Dramabeans interpreted Yoo Jin and Naeil as old married couple who skipped the dating part. I find that analogy quite right. 

 

Yeah - they sort of went from hating each other (at least on Yoo Jin's side) to BFFs to bickering and teasing each other like an old married couple with, like, no honeymoon phase in-between  The way I see it, if they ever did get married (and, in my Seolleim in Salzburg series, they're currently engaged, so....) they'd be a great example of the advice to "marry your best friend".

 

I can also point out, though - and perhaps I should flesh this out more in a future post - that Cha Yoo Jin and Seol Nae Il appear to have completely different love languages. So whereas Nae Il associates a softer tone of voice with affection or romance, Yoo Jin's more likely to associate that with feeling safe enough to let his guard down; and they kind of have to learn to read each other's signals and respond accordingly.

 

1 hour ago, flutterby06 said:

So I was taking about the radio show where JW talked about how Alice had more emotional scenes.. There host asked him what role he wants to play next.. Though there are times JW says that he doesn't have any particular roles in mind.. But this time he actually said "I have done apathetic character this time, how about doing a sensitive character next..." Just thinking about that makes me excited. A Joo Won character who strongly reacts and expresses everything and is not cool in traditional sense. I think JW fans will be delighted if he were to play such character. I wish he gets to do such a role even if it's a cameo.

 

lol - Okay, now you're just making me think of Park Si On...but also not quite? Because Si On's definitely the most emotionally sensitive out of JW's characters so far, so I'd definitely be curious to see where else he could go with that concept.

 

1 hour ago, flutterby06 said:

Any character close to this one I can think about is Seo Ki Woong from Clocking Out Web Drama... He was not really a sensitive character but he was hyper and very expressive character. Oh how much I loved JW's crazy acting in there. I wish he would play such a character in more detail one day.

 

Cha Yoo Jin is one the side of expressive side too but in cool way.. But he is mostly loved to express his annoyance and sarcasm.. But I loved every expression on Cha Yoo Jin's face too...Aah..his every look is swoon worthy.  

 

Seo Ki Woong was just over-the-top crazy - like, the kid seriously looked like he was high or something half the time  But I guess that was the point in Clocking Out, so I'll give him that.

 

As for Cha Yoo Jin, he's definitely more emotionally sensitive than most people give him credit for (drama viewers included). When I did my MBTI portrait of him, I did put him as a Thinking type, but really, I think he'd be pretty close in the middle of the Thinking-Feeling spectrum. It's just that his experiences and upbringing have made him really cautious about showing those feelings, because any sign of them would have led to a crackdown from his father - the little visual tells are still there, though (facial expressions, the way he subtly clenches a fist whenever someone says something that hurts his feelings, etc.)

 

17 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

It feels like it was a CF for Min Jin Gyeom.. so cute.

 

Didn't get to responding to this earlier, but if you have the time, I definitely think little Ju Won's Instagram page is worth checking out - he's adorable  By the way, I still can't quite wrap my head around how much he actually looks like a mini version of JW; it's uncanny.

[kittyna]

So, remember that piece of in-progress Alice fanart I shared a few days ago? Well, it's finished now, and Park Jin Gyeom is looking good  

 

Also, thinking back on my comment about Cha Yoo Jin and Seol Nae Il having different love languages, I'm now curious: what do you think are the JW drama characters' main love language(s)? And what about the girls in their lives?

 

For anyone who's new to this concept, you can check out these videos:

 

 

 

Note: in my personal opinion, it's rare for any person to really have just one love language. Instead, I think it's feasibly possible for a person to prefer to show love one way, and to receive it another:

 

Spoiler

For example, going back to Yoo Jin and Nae Il for a sec - I imagine that "acts of service" is most likely how Yoo Jin shows love or care for Nae Il (making her dinner, tidying her place, helping her practice, etc.), but I think he'd more likely want to receive "words of affirmation" instead (since that's what he lacked from his own parents growing up).

 

So you guys can keep that in mind with your answers too  

[kireeti2]

3 hours ago, kittyna said:

Note: in my personal opinion, it's rare for any person to really have just one love language. Instead, I think it's feasibly possible for a person to prefer to show love one way, and to receive it another:

Not just the language, I think couples also do the "Avoid" thing unknowingly. For instance, when it comes to Yoo Jin, he often shows strong physical neglect towards Nae-il, whenever he is not interested in Hugging her or annoyed by her. And the relationship of PJG and DY has all the "Avoid" (Negative) parts shown in the K-drama video

 

4 hours ago, kittyna said:

what do you think are the JW drama characters' main love language(s)?

Ku Ma-Jun and Shi Yu-Kyung- I think they relationship will rely more on receiving and giving gifts to each other and also the, I think words of affirmation might be far fetch in their relationship, so they might occasionally use harsh words towards each other.

 

Hwang Tae Hee and Baek Ja Eun- I think all the 5 love language mentioned in the video, but the dominating love languages will be "Act of Service" and 'Spending Quality time", and minimum "Avoid" parts mentioned in the video

Lee Kang To and Mok Dan- I can only see two love languages for this couple, I think they will have "Act Of Service" and "Physical Touch", since their situation is different when we compare with other drama couple

 

Kim Seo-Won and Han Gil Ro- I think these couple will have tussle when it comes to the "Receiving and Giving the Gifts", I think Han Gil-Ro will be of mind set of "spare no expense" when it comes to choosing a gift for Seo-Won and ends up getting scolding from her for spending unnecessarily. But, they might be in agreement when it comes to "Physical Touch" and "Quality Time".

 

Park Si-On and Cha Yoon-Seon- Now, coming to my favorite couple. I think this couple will also have all the mentioned love language, but I think Si-On will display some degree of "Physical Neglect" , but with the help of Yoon-Seo he might overcome it. And the dominate language will be "Word Of Affirmation" and "Quality Time"

 

Yoo JIn and Nae-Il- I think @kittyna has aptly describes their relationship, but I would like to add the "Avoid" thing mentioned in the video, so, I think this couple might experience issues when it comes to "Spending Quality Time" has their career progresses, though they are in same field, I think there might come a time where they have to do their individual tours

 

Han Yeo-Jin and Kim Tae-Hyun- This couple might have trouble getting quality time, but they will make up with other actions like "Physical Touch", "Act Of Service" , and "Words Of Affirmation". The negative aspect might be "The distation part when they are spending time together"

 

Gyun Woo and Princess Hyemyung- First coming to the positive aspects of this relationship: I think this relationship will mostly bank on "Act of Service", "Physical Touch". Negative aspects might be "Distractions while spending time together", "Forgetting important dates of their relationship", I see these negative things in their relationship because of Gyun Woo, due to his work

 

PJG ans KDY- Well coming the couple which is dominated by the negative aspects, but the only thing which is holding this relationship might be their own secret language, which is not mentioned in the video, that is "Empathy" of Kim Do- Yeon and sense of loyalty and protective nature of Park Jin Gyeom, I know these are not ideal feelings of relationship, but this couple is not like other couple who are normal. So, this couple is an exception since the couple exhibits all the negative aspects and next to zero positive aspects, and yet managed to portray they relationship as couple rather than as high school friends

 

 

 

[kittyna]

14 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

Not just the language, I think couples also do the "Avoid" thing unknowingly. For instance, when it comes to Yoo Jin, he often shows strong physical neglect towards Nae-il, whenever he is not interested in Hugging her or annoyed by her. And the relationship of PJG and DY has all the "Avoid" (Negative) parts shown in the K-drama video

 

The way that love languages work is that while most relationships would have elements of all five (and then some other things too, as you pointed out with Park Jin Gyeom and Kim Do Yeon), the assumption here is that each person has a particular preference for one or two languages out of the five. So there's a main way that they use to show their love to others (family, friends, partner, etc.), but there's also - in my opinion - a main thing they need in order for them to feel loved by others.

 

So here's my take so far. I will admit that I was kind of stuck on some of these because of fuzzy memory, extenuating circumstances in the characters' situations, etc., but generally speaking, I hope this works  

 

Gu Ma Jun and Shin Yu Kyung

I think that Ma Jun's  main way of showing his feelings for Yu Kyung is in "giving gifts". Somewhere in his childhood, for better or worse, he came to the conclusion that the people around him only cared for him because of his wealth and status - and as much as he hates that, he does end up internalizing it. So when he courts Yu Kyung, he does so by showing off what he has, offering to help her gain advantages in the company, etc. In terms of receiving love, though, I think Ma Jun's main wish is for "words of affirmation": he wants people to accept him and acknowledge him despite his true background, and it's when he finally receives that encouragement (posthumously from Master Pal Bong, and in person from Kim Tak Gu) that he starts to heal.

 

As for Yu Kyung, I'm not entirely sure how she shows love, to be honest. However, I think that she most wants to receive love via "quality time", seeing as deliberately depriving her of that is how Ma Jun hurts her most (because let's face it: this relationship is dysfunctional as hell, and despite signs of improvement by the drama's end, I don't think they'll survive the test of time).

 

Hwang Tae Hui and Baek Ja Eun

Angst caused by familial opposition aside, I think that this is one of the healthiest and most successful relationships out of JW's drama couples. They really do have elements of all five love languages (as most relationships should), so it's a bit hard to pin down what each person's main preference is. However, if I had to guess...I'd say that Hwang Tae Hui shows love through "acts of service" and wants to receive love through "quality time". He's always offering to help Ja Eun in little tiny ways: moving things that are too heavy for her, making sure she's eating or sleeping or dressed properly for the weather (lol - a bit like an ahjumma, to be honest ), etc. As for the receiving end, he's most content just being with the people he loves, regardless of what they're doing  

 

Ja Eun is pretty similar to Tae Hui in that I think she also prefers to receive love through "quality time". That's the thing she had consistently from her dad - and also lacked consistently with her numerous stepmothers - so it's great that the Hwang family as a whole is able to fill in that gap in her heart. As for showing love, I think she's big on "giving gifts". She makes little presents for her dad and for her friends (including Tae Hui before they progress to being a couple), and even the occasional meal she cooks for her parents or for Tae Hui and his coworkers could fall into this category.

 

Lee Kang To and Oh Mok Dan

As @kireeti2pointed out, this one's hard to figure out - as far as JW's drama couples are concerned, they...really don't get much screen time together  But I also agree with him that, whether we think of giving or receiving, "physical touch" is a big one for both of them. Circumstances require both of them to communicate their feelings for each other in subtle, non-verbal ways: holding hands, quick glances, etc. - and that's not even counting the really awesome moments when Kang To, taking advantage of the fact he's wearing the mask, is able to make his good intentions towards Mok Dan known before she even recognizes him. Finally, if I recall correctly, I think they're one of the few couples in JW's dramas that are strongly implied to have slept together prior to marriage, so there's that bit as well.

 

Han Gil Ro and Kim Seo Won

I'm not sure for Kim Seo Won, but I can definitely see "giving gifts" as a key way Gil Ro would show his feelings if he could. There's the monkey doll, for instance, but I'm sure that given the chance, he'd love to shower his loved ones with a ton of these little tokens  As for receiving love, I think Gil Ro's actually big on "words of affirmation": he really values honesty (weird for an NIS agent, but let's just go with it) and he wants the people around him to be open and truthful in their relationships with him.

 

Park Si On and Cha Yoon Seo

In terms of both showing and receiving love, Park Si On's a bit all over the place.  "Physical touch" does appear to be his least favourite (which is not unusual for someone with autism), but everything else does seem to be fair game. If I had to choose, though, I'd say that his preferred way to both show and receive love is through "words of affirmation" (or, should I say, "thumbs up of affirmation"? ). As for Cha Yoon Seo, I think she's big on "physical touch". She does express her feelings through words a lot - since she senses that that's what works best for Si On - but she also frequently gives in to the urge to hug him or offer a fist bump or something else of the sort, and it's when he finally works up the courage to kiss her that she feels like their relationship is definitely official.

 

Cha Yoo Jin and Seol Nae Il

I already said it once for Yoo Jin, but I'll say it again: he shows love through "acts of service" and prefers to receive love through "words of affirmation". This isn't just in his relationship with Nae Il, but is a constant throughout his interactions with others: he's someone who goes out of his way to help those he cares about, but what he personally needs the most is confirmation from those others that he's on the right track. If he doesn't get that (e.g. from the S Orchestra during their rough patch, or from his father more generally), he'll still keep doing what he thinks he must, but it becomes more of a burden or a chore. 

 

As for Seol Nae Il, in terms of giving, she's probably biggest on "words of affirmation" AND "physical touch". Like, I honestly think it's a true tie here, as she does both things in equal amounts - and at the same time - in her expressions of love for Yoo Jin. In terms of receiving, again, Nae Il's the sort of person for whom anything goes. However, I think that "words of affirmation" are also a big one for her - ironically, though, for someone who wants to receive such words a lot himself, Yoo Jin is...kinda terrible at dealing them out  He's actually trying to learn, though, so just give him some time.

 

Kim Tae Hyun and Han Yeo Jin

Personally, I think that Yeo Jin is the easier one for me to pinpoint here: she tends to show love through "giving gifts" (mostly of the financial variety, but also just in general), and she wants to receive love through "quality time". While she does start off offering Tae Hyun financial assistance with an ulterior motive, even after they're together, she's very solicitous about his physical needs and comfort (e.g. after finding out that he snores, she immediately starts thinking about if it's something wrong with the bed). And I don't think she expects a whole ton from Tae Hyun - or anyone else for that matter - beyond just being by her side because they genuinely want to be there.

 

As for Tae Hyun, he does a bunch of these things, so it's harder to figure out what his main preference is. I think that his circumstances lead him to want to receive love through gifts, but in his heart, he's big on "quality time" as well. And, in terms of showing love, my best guess is a combination between "acts of service" and "words of affirmation". Sometimes, those words are hard to take - like when he doesn't hesitate to tell Yeo Jin when she's wrong - but they're also the deepest expression of his love there is.

 

Gyun Woo and Hye Myung

For me, I think that Gyun Woo's main preference - in both showing and receiving love - is "quality time". Once we get past the "mutual hate" rom-com hijinks in the earlier episodes of the drama, Gyun Woo does appear to be happiest just being in the same place as Hye Myung, no matter where that is or what they're doing: the clinic, his friends' book shop, the palace, his house...doesn't matter. As for Hye Myung, I think that "acts of service" is her preferred way to show love (she's always been a girl of action), and "words of affirmation" is her preferred way to receive love. Above all else, she wants to be told that she's perfectly fine the way she is; she knows that most people won't think so, so those who do say so hold a special place in her heart (Gyun Woo, her father, her grandmother, etc.)  

 

(On a random side note, this is the only one of JW's dramas that has the stereotypical over-the-top "giving gifts" moment, in the person of the Qing dynasty prince who proposes marriage. )

 

Park Jin Gyeom, Kim Do Yeon, and Yoon Tae Yi (Doing a three-way here since there's no official love line)

Okay, as @kireeti2 pointed out, Jin Gyeom is pretty crappy at expressing love all around.  It's not entirely his fault, but it means that we can't really look to the usual tells or shows of affection. However, when we think about his relationships with people around him, I think he best shows love through "quality time" (since he's only willing to spend time with the people he actually likes ), and he best receives love through "words of affirmation". So, for instance, it's quite telling that hearing Do Yeon or Tae Yi's voices are what helps him break free of Evil!Jin Gyeom's influence, and it's also their faith in him, as expressed in words, that end up giving him the strength to keep going. (There's probably something about gifts in here as well, since he rather stubbornly insists that he'll only eat his mom's cooking when he's younger, but he does learn to expand by matter of necessity.)

 

For Do Yeon, I think "acts of service" is her big one for showing love, and "quality time" is her big one for receiving love. So, we see her offering to help Jin Gyeom consistently throughout the drama, and the thing she wants the most from him is just being able to spend time with him, regardless of how he reacts to her. She doesn't mind if he just stays silent; as long as he's safe enough to actually be there, and as long as he doesn't push her away, she's fine  

 

As for Tae Yi, I think that "acts of service" and "giving gifts" are tied for her main way to show love. I'm not entirely sure which one it is, because I'm thinking of things like her role in the "Alice" investigation, or how she downloads a GPS app onto Jin Gyeom's phone when she worries he's in danger. So it's probably a bit of both. In terms of receiving love, I think she's also big on "quality time": she feels the most secure when she knows that someone has her back.

 

By the way, I'd also argue that this is the core reason behind the rivalry between Do Yeon and Tae Yi: they both feel like they have to compete for Jin Gyeom's time and attention, but really, they don't. He's perfectly fine with both of them around as his female sort-of BFFs  

 

14 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

Kim Seo-Won and Han Gil Ro- I think these couple will have tussle when it comes to the "Receiving and Giving the Gifts", I think Han Gil-Ro will be of mind set of "spare no expense" when it comes to choosing a gift for Seo-Won and ends up getting scolding from her for spending unnecessarily.

 

My own answers were my main response, but just want to point out that this gave me a really funny mental image 

 

Jin Gyeom's shout-out to Tae Yi - I mean that quite literally, as JW does refer to Kim Hee Sun as "Professor" here

[kireeti2]

17 hours ago, kittyna said:

that's not even counting the really awesome moments when Kang To, taking advantage of the fact he's wearing the mask,

Now you put it like like, their relationship almost feels like superman and Lois Lane, this couple also has similar dynamics, minus the Lee Knag To initial evilness

17 hours ago, kittyna said:

As for Tae Yi, I think that "acts of service" and "giving gifts" are tied for her main way to show love

I thought we it was only about couple and not Mom- son relation. From the beginning I have always seen Tae Yi and PJG relationship as BFF. And Tae-Yi and KDY as classic Mother-in-law and Daughter-in-law, like the way they were competing for PJGS's attention and time, makes it feels like these three characters can have their own soap opera

[kittyna]

11 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

I thought we it was only about couple and not Mom- son relation. From the beginning I have always seen Tae Yi and PJG relationship as BFF.

 

And, to be honest, I see Park Jin Gyeom and Kim Do Yeon more as BFFs than a couple as well, so it was all about equal in my head  

 

11 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

And Tae-Yi and KDY as classic Mother-in-law and Daughter-in-law, like the way they were competing for PJGS's attention and time, makes it feels like these three characters can have their own soap opera

 

Or maybe one of those lighthearted family-style dramas  Add a couple of the other characters to the mix, and there's definite comic gold to be had here.

 

Yet another awesome piece of fanart

 

JW's gone from doing shout-outs to Alice viewers to doing shout-outs to Ghost viewers on Instagram

 

Cute Instagram update

[flutterby06]

6 hours ago, kittyna said:

Cute Instagram update

 

 

cutie...

 

6 hours ago, kittyna said:

Yet another awesome piece of fanart

 

 

Wow...That's such a pretty art! Like it very much..

 

On 11/6/2020 at 7:23 AM, kittyna said:

E.g. Regarding his interaction with Yoo Min Hyuk, I really like that scene in Episode 15 when Jin Gyeom starts off more hostile, but then softens and says, "Help me. She was your lover." It's the first time he's ever really let down his guard in front of his father, and you can tell how bittersweet a moment it is for Min Hyuk (sweet because he's been waiting for JG to open up for so long; but bitter because it just has to be under such dire circumstances).

 

That is one of my very favorite moment too.. because it shows how JG just acknowledging their relationship aloud (as aloud as their situation can let them) and demanding from him.. And it also affirms how Jin Gyeom sees Yoon Taeyi. 

 

@kittyna and @kireeti2 haven't got a chance to look in to the Language of Love videos but it's fun seeing your opinion and I get the idea. I think all of you're quite reasonable in your claims for the characters. If I feel anything different strongly may be I will add to it later after I get to see the reference videos.

 

On 11/8/2020 at 1:08 AM, kittyna said:

Park Jin Gyeom, Kim Do Yeon, and Yoon Tae Yi (Doing a three-way here since there's no official love line)

Okay, as @kireeti2 pointed out, Jin Gyeom is pretty crappy at expressing love all around.  It's not entirely his fault, but it means that we can't really look to the usual tells or shows of affection. However, when we think about his relationships with people around him, I think he best shows love through "quality time" (since he's only willing to spend time with the people he actually likes ), and he best receives love through "words of affirmation". So, for instance, it's quite telling that hearing Do Yeon or Tae Yi's voices are what helps him break free of Evil!Jin Gyeom's influence, and it's also their faith in him, as expressed in words, that end up giving him the strength to keep going. (There's probably something about gifts in here as well, since he rather stubbornly insists that he'll only eat his mom's cooking when he's younger, but he does learn to expand by matter of necessity.

 

I would like to add a bit of my own opinion on that highlighted line.. Prof. Taeyi's voice do not really help him breaking free. It was actually Omma Tae Yi's voice that break free Jin Gyeom from Evil. I don't know if it came as a inner voice to Taeyi or she just knowingly (because she knows how omma taeyi talks with JG) thought to use that voice out of desperation..she did use Omma's voice. And that clicked through Jin Gyeom.

 

There's also that time when Old Jin Gyeom came to take Tae Yi to Alice. She used Omma's voice. It's just my assumption Taeyi intentionally talked like that so she could relay Jin Gyeom's mother's feeling..Thinking about either what Omma would like to tell JG before farewell or what JG needed to hear from Omma one last time. 

 

I think like that becuse just before that scene we saw Taeyi spending time with her mother.. suddenly the conversation shifted to motherhood.. Her mother was saying though taeyi isn't related by blood she didn't treat her any different than a mother would love her child..How Taeyi was conflicted and doubtful that she wouldn't be able to be a good mother and her mother reassured her she'll be better than her as a mother. That moment JG Omma's memories of motherhood started to coming to Taeyi. She seemed overwhelmed with that realization.

 

That being said I am not telling Taeyi isn't important to Jingyeom unless she's not mother. JG said it to Si Young that "It  doesn't matter if she's my mother or not I will protect her."

Also he said to Min Hyuk "I don't want to lose her twice. Help me. She was your lover."

 

So JG's attachment to Yoon Tae Yi walks in a very fine line where he's ready to treat her as a different personality when needed but in essence she'll be his mother's another self to him,  he would like to protect her either way.

 

An important moment where Jin Gyeom really treated her similarly and differently simultaneously despite his complicated thought was the birthday celebration scene. He seemed astonished that Yoon Taeyi is sharing the same birthday but he did not make a big deal out of it. He brought the cake thinking about his Omma( though Yoon Tae Yi thought it was for her, but it wasn't because Taeyi was not supposed to coming back). He bought the chain thinking about Taeyi, because she was expecting gift from him and he also wanted to. But then he sings the happy birthday song full it was what he couldn't do for his Omma. As he got to do that it made him happy.

 

 

Wanted to share a personal favorite recent JW moment. I think full video has already been shared. 

 

 

He looked so cute and animated while expressing in emoji.. how can he do it!

 

And He was so happy receiving a box of his favorite snack:

 

Also love how he was saying he is bad at quiz but turned out he's good at emoji quiz! I found this game quite interesting.