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Joo Won 주원 [Upcoming Movie "Carter" 2021]


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2 hours ago, kittyna said:

"But aren't you technically on the same side...?" I asked my mom about it while we were watching Stranger, and she said it's likely that they just both want to get the credit for cracking the case.

Yeah there is that, but the real issue is the autonomy of the police from prosecutor, like, we know that police force in any country needs to put under the control of the elected representatives and their discretion should be limited. My lecturer use to always says that "Police are basically organized gang with legitimacy over violence"(he is not some social justice warrior but a proper right winger with intellectual brain). So, yeah south Korean authorities also thought the same thing and made the police force subservient to Prosecution of the country, thinking that they might keep the country from becoming a police state just like a the system in USA , but the downside was that Prosecutors are selected on the basis of exams, just like civil servants, and acts like bureaucrats rather than judicial officers. So, the amount of the power they wield over the police immense, like they literally act like judges, like, in some dramas I have seen that the police needs prosecutors' permission to arrest, search or bring in someone for questioning. Whenever I see the Korean dramas in which prosecutors are depicted, I draw parallels to my country's state level government ministers, who often country the police force of a state. So, in Stranger 2 they have shown it nicely how prosecutors and police often fight over enforcing laws, especially criminal laws and financial laws. Since most of the prosecutors work for sometime for the government and take job in a conglomerate as a legal advisor, I am sure you have seen these depiction in K-drama a lot, where a corrupt prosecutor often helps a Chaebol to get away with tax evasions(rarely) and murders(mostly)

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The reason why JW was bending down and looking at the man. Cr as tagged. Many asked me why I like JW and why I like him for so long?  THIS. Plus his acting. 

A bit quiet on the updates front, so here are some miscellaneous Instagram goodies:

 

Looks to be a work in progress, but this piece of fanart looks nice as it is

 

After (or before?) Ghost selfie

 

And, for those who just can't get enough of Yoo Min Hyuk (don't worry - I feel ya), Kwak Si Yang's already got an offer for his next drama - It's still early stages (so nothing's confirmed yet), and it's kinda disappointing that this is still a second lead role, but it's still nice to see he's going places :) 

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9 hours ago, kittyna said:

and it's kinda disappointing that this is still a second lead role, but it's still nice to see he's going places

It is really hard to break that second lead barrier and get a role as main lead. I think Joo won was lucky in this case, even though he debuted as a second lead, he was able to break that barrier and promote himself as a main lead. Too, bad we won't be seeing Joo won's drama anytime soon, he said in an interview that he is busy with Ghost musical so we will not be taking any drama for the time being.

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1 hour ago, kireeti2 said:

It is really hard to break that second lead barrier and get a role as main lead. I think Joo won was lucky in this case, even though he debuted as a second lead, he was able to break that barrier and promote himself as a main lead.

 

JW definitely was lucky, because there was quite a fortuitous series of events leading up to his first appearance as the main lead in Gaksital.

 

I didn't see this play out in real time (since I only became a fan of JW in 2016), but from what I've managed to piece together from news articles from 2011/2012, JW followed King of Baking, Kim Tak Gu with Ojakgyo Brothers, which was an unusual choice for someone who's just done a successful run as the second male lead. In essence, while it's true that taking on a long weekend drama would present great opportunities for honing one's acting skills (because your character inevitably develops a ton over the whole half-year period), that sort of drama also isn't worth much when it comes to fueling Hallyu stardom. I don't know what went on behind the scenes to make it happen, but point is that it did - and word is that Ojakgyo Brothers was a script that JW chose himself.

 

Well, JW started getting really well-known to domestic audiences this way, so that's a plus for him in the long run. And, close to the end of Ojakgyo Brothers' run, he was actually in negotiations to take the second male lead role in Moon Embracing the Sun (i.e. the part that eventually went to Jung Il Woo). So what happened? Ojakgyo Brothers got a whopping 8-episode-long extension due to its popularity :) Because of that, MES was now out of the question due to a scheduling conflict, which left JW open to other scripts and offers.

 

At the same time this was going on, the producers for Gaksital were running into issues casting their first male lead. This was when Japan formed a huge part of the Hallyu market, so taking on the role of Lee Kang To/Gaksital was risky. But JW read the script, thought the character and story were interesting, and somehow (again, I don't know how) convinced his agency to let him do it. And the rest is history ;) 

 

In short: if it hadn't been for Ojakgyo Brothers and that extension, JW might have stayed on with second lead roles for a while longer.

 

1 hour ago, kireeti2 said:

Too, bad we won't be seeing Joo won's drama anytime soon, he said in an interview that he is busy with Ghost musical so we will not be taking any drama for the time being.

 

I know. It's for the best, though; after finishing Yong Pal, JW did point out that he needed to slow down and rest more, so I like that he's taking his time now. Who knows? Maybe we'll end up with a result like his post-enlistment hiatus where he actually has the time to choose his own next project again. If Alice does well during the awards season, I think that's definitely a possibility. :please:

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13 minutes ago, kittyna said:

Well, JW started getting really well-known to domestic audiences this way, so that's a plus for him in the long run. And, close to the end of Ojakgyo Brothers' run, he was actually in negotiations to take the second male lead role in Moon Embracing the Sun (i.e. the part that eventually went to Jung Il Woo). So what happened? Ojakgyo Brothers got a whopping 8-episode-long extension due to its popularity :) Because of that, MES was now out of the question due to a scheduling conflict, which left JW open to other scripts and offers.

 

At the same time this was going on, the producers for Gaksital were running into issues casting their first male lead. This was when Japan formed a huge part of the Hallyu market, so taking on the role of Lee Kang To/Gaksital was risky. But JW read the script, thought the character and story were interesting, and somehow (again, I don't know how) convinced his agency to let him do it. And the rest is history ;) 

 

In short: if it hadn't been for Ojakgyo Brothers and that extension, JW might have stayed on with second lead roles for a while longer.

I thought of bringing up this same thing in my next reply, like, even though the Moon Embracing was a popular drama, being a second lead is almost like being a supporting character. So, it was blessing in disguise for Joo won, if Ojakgyo didn't had extension of episodes, Joo won would had fallen into the second lead loop and never would have got a chance to play as main lead. Most of his peers like Lee Mi Ho, Lee Jong Suk were already debuted as lead role, so, I think the underdog nature of Joo won comes from the fact that he got his lead role for his third drama, where as he got a lead role straight away in musical, so, that's why Joo won is still interested in Musical despite being a successful K-drama actor.

19 minutes ago, kittyna said:

I know. It's for the best, though; after finishing Yong Pal, JW did point out that he needed to slow down and rest more, so I like that he's taking his time now. Who knows? Maybe we'll end up with a result like his post-enlistment hiatus where he actually has the time to choose his own next project again. If Alice does well during the awards season, I think that's definitely a possibility.

Yeah, I do think he needs a break, since he had also done a movie project this year, so probably he must be exhausted. Musical is little less stressful, since he doesn't need to perform continuously like drama or movie shooting. I really hope his movie does well, since he never got an award in movie category.

21 minutes ago, kittyna said:

If Alice does well during the awards season, I think that's definitely a possibility. 

Yeah, about the awards I am not really hopeful. At the best Alice might get awards in actress category for Kim Hee seon, like in 2019 there were lot of awards  under categories like mid-lenght dramas, mini-series.And also, Kim Hee Seon has less competition with other actresses compared to Joo won, he needs to compete with best actors like Han Suk-Kyu, Namgoong Min. And I think to accommodate TKEM, Alice might loose few awards. So, I see Alice wining minimum 1 or maximum 2-3 awards or less.

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6 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

Most of his peers like Lee Mi Ho, Lee Jong Suk were already debuted as lead role

 

Not sure about Lee Min Ho, but Lee Jong Suk also started off with supporting roles (e.g. Secret Garden). His break came in 2013 with School 2013, which has a more ensemble-style casting structure, and he made first male lead after that with I Hear Your Voice (and again, the rest is history).

 

Most prominent actors follow a similar route starting out (supporting to second lead to first lead), as producers aren't likely to risk casting newcomers in leading roles without any idea of whether they'll end up becoming popular. Kim Tak Gu was a bit of an outlier for casting two newcomers as its male leads: usually, if there's one new guy playing the first lead (this was Yoon Si Yoon's second drama, so he was still new), studios will cast a more experienced actor as the second lead. Or vice-versa. So to have a completely unknown actor like JW playing the second lead as well was definitely a gamble - a successful one, in the grand scheme of things, but still a gamble.

 

6 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

I think the underdog nature of Joo won comes from the fact that he got his lead role for his third drama, where as he got a lead role straight away in musical, so, that's why Joo won is still interested in Musical despite being a successful K-drama actor.

 

Personally, I attribute JW's underdog status among Hallyu stars to be due to the roles and projects he's chosen. Generally, JW's characters appeal to older audiences or industry insiders, but his agency's attempts to promote him as a teenage heartthrob through the classic youth or rom-com dramas (which was made many of the others so successful) have fallen flat (e.g. Level 7 Civil ServantCatch MeNae Il's Cantabile, and My Sassy Girl). And since so much of Korea's entertainment industry is driven by Oppa/Unnie culture - especially internationally - if you can't really make it as an "Oppa" type of actor, you're not gonna be as popular.

 

But I feel like it's actors like JW who will actually pass the test of time. One can't play the Oppa forever - nor can even the most prominent actors play first lead forever. Sooner or later, if one wants to survive in this industry, one needs to step back down into supporting roles to make room for the next generation of Oppas; and the more an actor could promote himself as a strong character actor, the better. Diversifying roles is one way of doing it, and I feel like that's the direction JW's taking when we look at his career as a whole. He likes to take on projects that feature characters or concepts that are outside of the box, sometimes with more success than others.

 

7 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

Musical is little less stressful, since he doesn't need to perform continuously like drama or movie shooting.

 

Rather than less stressful, I'd say it's a different sort of stress. I've noticed that JW gets a lot of "two show days" (i.e. playing Sam in two consecutive performances - afternoon and evening). Personally, I see stage acting as more of a marathon, since you need to really stay focused and in character for long periods of time (2-3 hours). Screen acting does involve a more frenetic schedule, though - so there's that.

 

Mind you, this is just a general comparison. COVID-19's something of a monkey wrench in the whole theatre industry, which JW brought up in his Radio Star interview. Not only are audiences smaller, but the cast and crew are risking their health every single time; if one main lead gets sick, the entire rotating group will get sick (which JW demonstrated by talking about the cold that they literally all got in Ghost's first run - I remember that bit from Life Log, actually). These are, of course, factors that also affect dramas and films, but something about how cautious the rest of the world has been re: live performances makes me particularly concerned for Ghost.

 

7 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

Yeah, about the awards I am not really hopeful. At the best Alice might get awards in actress category for Kim Hee seon, like in 2019 there were lot of awards  under categories like mid-lenght dramas, mini-series.And also, Kim Hee Seon has less competition with other actresses compared to Joo won, he needs to compete with best actors like Han Suk-Kyu, Namgoong Min. And I think to accommodate TKEM, Alice might loose few awards. So, I see Alice wining minimum 1 or maximum 2-3 awards or less.

 

As of right now, I think Romantic Doctor Kim 2 is stiffer competition for Alice than TKEM, because that was the big winner for SBS re: ratings. But then again, the entertainment industry culture is shifting, so maybe TKEM's success internationally will trump everything else, as you've pointed out.

 

Personally, I never really hold out on anyone winning any awards; if they get them, I'm happy for them, but if they don't, I don't really care. I do think that JW will end up nominated for an acting award - and probably Daesang as well - but who ends up getting it doesn't really matter to me.

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7 minutes ago, kittyna said:

but Lee Jong Suk also started off with supporting roles (e.g. Secret Garden). His break came in 2013 with School 2013

Yeah, but Lee Jong Suk started as a model, and I think producers will rather take chance with models over any other new comers in the entertainment industry. Like, at least they would think that the  show will garner some rating because of the looks. I am not pointing that models have no acting skills but they do have advantage over others when it comes to getting lead roles, and I think joo won is lucky in this sense, he never got any role based on his looks rather he got opportunities based on his acting skills.

12 minutes ago, kittyna said:

I do think that JW will end up nominated for an acting award - and probably Daesang as well - but who ends up getting it doesn't really matter to me.

I think Joo won did get nominated in some award thing like the ones in which all the dramas compete with each other, I saw it in some fan Instagram account. I think Kim Hee Seon might be nominated for Daesang in SBS drama awards and in  other award functions, for playing such a versatile role.

21 minutes ago, kittyna said:

As of right now, I think Romantic Doctor Kim 2

But "Hot Stove League" managed to beat this drama in 56th Baeksang Art Awards. For some reason I was not able enjoy this Hot Stove League drama like did for Romantic Doctor Kim 2, maybe it as to do with Korean Baseball thing, like, something only Korean audience were able to enjoy it.

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4 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

I am not pointing that models have no acting skills but they do have advantage over others when it comes to getting lead roles, and I think joo won is lucky in this sense, he never got any role based on his looks rather he got opportunities based on his acting skills.

 

Of course, there are a ton of models who end up strong actors as well - Lee Jong Suk's the most obvious example (incidentally, he actually wanted to be an actor from the start, but he wound up getting modelling gigs first), but I could also say the same for Kim Young Kwang :) 

 

As for JW, I do think he's got some points in the looks department, but I often get the sense that his looks are something of an afterthought. As you pointed out, no-one casts him for his looks; and even people who are first drawn by his looks end up becoming fans due to his acting, personality, or both. It probably helps that JW's not afraid of looking ugly or unphotogenic in order to bring out the characters he plays: he's got some really handsome expressions and angles, and then some that are really grotesque (e.g. his infamous "ugly cry"), and I love that he's willing to go there. 

 

4 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

I think Joo won did get nominated in some award thing like the ones in which all the dramas compete with each other, I saw it in some fan Instagram account.

 

Do you mean APAN? I think that's a bit different, since it's up to netizens' votes. I'm more interested in the industry-based acting awards, because I know that JW doesn't really stand a chance in popularity contests to begin with (lol - some fan I am, but I mean it). I want to see him being acknowledged as an actor by his peers and seniors, that's all :) 

 

4 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

But "Hot Stove League" managed to beat this drama in 56th Baeksang Art Awards. For some reason I was not able enjoy this Hot Stove League drama like did for Romantic Doctor Kim 2, maybe it as to do with Korean Baseball thing, like, something only Korean audience were able to enjoy it.

 

Hot Stove League? To be honest, I hadn't heard of it until you brought it up (which shows how much I care about sports :P), but the stats are definitely impressive, now that I look it up.  

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19 minutes ago, kittyna said:

because I know that JW doesn't really stand a chance in popularity contests to begin with (lol - some fan I am, but I mean it)

I share the similar opinion. Joo won's popularity is dwarfs when we compare with his peers, like, you mention Kim Young Kwang, he played as supporting role in Good Doctor, but now in terms of popularity he does surpass Joo won.

 

21 minutes ago, kittyna said:

As for JW, I do think he's got some points in the looks department, but I often get the sense that his looks are something of an afterthought. As you pointed out, no-one casts him for his looks; and even people who are first drawn by his looks end up becoming fans due to his acting, personality, or both. It probably helps that JW's not afraid of looking ugly or unphotogenic in order to bring out the characters he plays: he's got some really handsome expressions and angles, and then some that are really grotesque (e.g. his infamous "ugly cry"), and I love that he's willing to go there. 

Here also, I share the same sentiment. I think already mentioned this, in Good Doctor I have first noticed Joo won's acting and then his looks. And, like you mentioned he does look stunning in few angles, I got to see it in Alice. In few angles he was looking better than usual and we can clearly see that there are few facial changes(in natural way). Only thing he now needs to do is select scripts which are unique yet relatable for the audience, preferably Korean audience, international fans only tend to give importance to that Oppa/noon culture. And speaking of unique scripts, I got to watch a kiss scene in "18 Again" drama where female lead is twice the age of the male lead, and it was like a moment where K-drama broke the class ceiling by reversing the roles. Like, it was always like a female high school student who always falls for a older guy, in this drama it was like reverse thing and it was quite refreshing to see it. Btw the drama is remake of "17 Again" movie.

Whenever I see a drama where the script and characters are complex, I wished Joo won was part of  that drama, at least in a supporting role, and I really think now that he has matured as an actor, he can play complex roles really well.

29 minutes ago, kittyna said:

Do you mean APAN?

I guess, that's what comes first before the Channel awards

30 minutes ago, kittyna said:

I want to see him being acknowledged as an actor by his peers and seniors, that's all :) 

For that he needs to pick unique script and needs to play complex characters with unconventional looks, I still think his agency wants him to flower boy type, but that phase is over and joo won needs to take lot of dark roles or a character with lot of scars from the past,  which has lot of arcs. I am secretly hoping that he would take of "John Wick" remake, that would be dope, like it would be lit as hell to see Joo won with a beard killing lot of people, since  he did pretty good job in Alice holding a gun and it was pretty natural.

39 minutes ago, kittyna said:

Hot Stove League? To be honest, I hadn't heard of it until you brought it up (which shows how much I care about sports :P), but the stats are definitely impressive, now that I look it up.  

It's more like "Money Ball" movie as a drama. And it was much complex than the movie, I think the drama was meant for the Base Ball fans, since Base Ball is also popular sport in Korea or for that matter, it is quite popular in whole East Asia.

No wonder it got award for outstanding Korean Drama in Seoul International Awards beating the "Crash Landing On You, Dr Kim 2, and The World Of Married" .

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7 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

I share the similar opinion. Joo won's popularity is dwarfs when we compare with his peers, like, you mention Kim Young Kwang, he played as supporting role in Good Doctor, but now in terms of popularity he does surpass Joo won.

 

Actually, if you'll forgive the tangent, I think Kim Young Kwang wound up being more a surprise than JW for me in terms of turning out to be a strong actor. Probably it's because I knew about JW's stage background really early on, so I had high expectations for his performance to begin with ;) 

 

7 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

And, like you mentioned he does look stunning in few angles, I got to see it in Alice. In few angles he was looking better than usual and we can clearly see that there are few facial changes(in natural way).

 

It's not a hard and fast rule, but generally speaking, I think JW looks best with the type of hairstyle, makeup, etc. that we got in Alice. Like, I don't necessarily think he could pull off the long "sageuk" sort of hair very well (not without some serious getting used to on my part, anyway), but I like his looks best when he's given a hairstyle that goes down to about his ears. I dunno; there's something about what that does for his facial features and proportions that I just personally like.

 

And, on a slight side note, I think he generally looks better in a mask than most Korean male celebrities. :mask: All the focus then ends up on his eyes, and there's no denying that they're among his most distinctive and alluring features.

 

012650407d66cbcf492283f9b12d8a34.jpg

 

7 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

And speaking of unique scripts, I got to watch a kiss scene in "18 Again" drama where female lead is twice the age of the male lead, and it was like a moment where K-drama broke the class ceiling by reversing the roles. Like, it was always like a female high school student who always falls for a older guy, in this drama it was like reverse thing and it was quite refreshing to see it. Btw the drama is remake of "17 Again" movie.

 

Speaking of the reversed age gap, I'm just wondering whether you've watched Secret Love Affair. It's one of my personal favourite dramas, even if the actual romance involved (between a married music instructor and a student twenty years younger) is a bit sketchy - as you might have figured out from my references to it within my Seolleim in Salzburg series. Mind you, in SLA, the younger guy develops feelings first, but the drama definitely did push the envelope in terms of stories focusing on extramarital relationships, the sort of nepotism/classism that occurs within Korea's classical music scene (it's like what we see in Nae Il's Cantabile, but altogether rawer and grittier), etc.

 

7 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

Whenever I see a drama where the script and characters are complex, I wished Joo won was part of  that drama, at least in a supporting role, and I really think now that he has matured as an actor, he can play complex roles really well.

 

Hm...I can't say I've had that experience yet, but I'd love to hear what dramas you've thought that for ;) 

 

7 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

For that he needs to pick unique script and needs to play complex characters with unconventional looks, I still think his agency wants him to flower boy type, but that phase is over and joo won needs to take lot of dark roles or a character with lot of scars from the past,  which has lot of arcs.

 

Exactly my point. To be honest, in my family at least, we tend to describe actors as being either the "character actor" type or the "idol" type; it's not an absolute sort of thing, but generally speaking, by "idol" type, we mean the "flower boy"/teenage heartthrob type (as opposed to the actual K-pop idol-turned-actor, which is a whole other ball game). 

 

I've banked on JW being more the "character actor" sort from the start, especially given his track record for going outside the box in his roles (as one fan meme-ified once), so here's hoping that continues :) 

 

f20f04a3f511f084059ef1ca4c7f77f0.jpg

 

 

8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

I am secretly hoping that he would take of "John Wick" remake, that would be dope, like it would be lit as hell to see Joo won with a beard killing lot of people, since  he did pretty good job in Alice holding a gun and it was pretty natural.

 

:lol: I'm just having a hard time imagining JW with a beard, but otherwise, I get your point. 

 

Speaking of JW's skills with a gun, though: he's always been pretty good at acting with them (since he's done so a gazillion times over his career), but as a Canadian who lives not too far away from the US border...I try not to dwell on the fact that the majority of Korean men actually do know how to use a gun for very long. :cold_sweat:

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1 hour ago, kittyna said:

Hm...I can't say I've had that experience yet, but I'd love to hear what dramas you've thought that for

Doctor Romantic 2, since he had already done two dramas in medical genre. "The World Of Married", I find conflicts in relationship especially in marriage more complex than love conflicts like "Where female lead is torn between first and second lead". "My Mister", not as male lead, it would be too challenging for him but like the son of the money leader who constantly harass the female lead. And also, in movies like "The Nameless Gangster, The Attorney".

1 hour ago, kittyna said:

but as a Canadian who lives not too far away from the US border

But, you are on near the safer side of the border, like the Norther States have less gun ownership and fewer incidences of Gun shooting when compared to Southern States.

1 hour ago, kittyna said:

.I try not to dwell on the fact that the majority of Korean men actually do know how to use a gun for very long.

Yeah, but shooting incidence are pretty rare in Korea and the fact that we see lot of Police officers from K-drama rarely use gun and rarely display it, tells us that gun regulation is pretty tight in Korea

1 hour ago, kittyna said:

I'm just wondering whether you've watched Secret Love Affair.

It's on my watch list and you have already suggested me when I brought up about "The World Of Married" drama success

1 hour ago, kittyna said:

've banked on JW being more the "character actor" sort from the start, especially given his track record for going outside the box in his roles (as one fan meme-ified once), so here's hoping that continues

Lol! The almost beggar part was apt description of Joo won's character in the "Fatal Intuition" movie, given that he lost his business while gambling with some loan sharks in the movie.

And also, I sort of find the pattern of the success of his dramas. His dramas did well whenever he choose a underdog character and dramas in which he had played a role of cool guy did average in ratings. Maybe that's what he should look in for his next project, a role of Undergo.

 

 

 

 

 

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8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

"My Mister", not as male lead, it would be too challenging for him but like the son of the money leader who constantly harass the female lead.

 

Now that you bring him up...yeah, I can see it. Especially since the loanshark's son had quite a mess of conflicting emotions towards IU's character as well: on the one hand, he blames her for his father's death and wants to finish what his father started; but on the other hand, he's got this obsessive crush on her and at least part of his behaviour is because he's lashing out at her for not returning his feelings.

 

I might not have been able to visualize it before Alice, but now that we've seen Evil Jin Gyeom, I could. :) 

 

8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

But, you are on near the safer side of the border, like the Norther States have less gun ownership and fewer incidences of Gun shooting when compared to Southern States.

 

It's not so much about my own safety as it is that whatever goes wrong in the States eventually affects us as well. In terms of criminal activity, for instance, illegal firearms are smuggled in from the US by street gangs in Toronto, and we have seen a steady increase in gang-related violence here over the years. Or, if you think about COVID-19, the numbers are just terrifying to look at. Not to mention the way that President Trump still refers to COVID as the "China virus" - at this rate, even if he loses the election, I'm not sure if things will get any better for Asian Americans (among whom I do have some relatives), as the general public is so strongly divided and all it takes is one loose cannon with a gun for chaos to ensue.

 

8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

Yeah, but shooting incidence are pretty rare in Korea and the fact that we see lot of Police officers from K-drama rarely use gun and rarely display it, tells us that gun regulation is pretty tight in Korea

 

And am I glad for that! Of course, there's not much that can be done about those who don't abide by the law, but at least both law enforcement and the general public seem to be on board with gun regulations in Korea.

 

8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

Lol! The almost beggar part was apt description of Joo won's character in the "Fatal Intuition" movie, given that he lost his business while gambling with some loan sharks in the movie.

 

Not to mention that at the time, that was probably the most "rough and tumble" we've ever seen JW get with his characters. ;) 

 

8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

And also, I sort of find the pattern of the success of his dramas. His dramas did well whenever he choose a underdog character and dramas in which he had played a role of cool guy did average in ratings. Maybe that's what he should look in for his next project, a role of Undergo.

 

:approves: An underdog, or - if he is cool - in a way that's actually got some sort of reason behind it.

 

New photo shoot

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26 minutes ago, kittyna said:

by street gangs in Toronto

Spoiler

There are gangs in Canada? :flushed: Like, I was aware the about gang violence in USA, but never heard about ones in Canada. And when I looked up in online, I got to know that there are variety of gangs, like there are gangs from each community.

32 minutes ago, kittyna said:

if things will get any better for Asian Americans

Spoiler

 

Yeah, there was surge of racist attacks against Asians around the world after  Trump coined the word "China Virus".

 

 

37 minutes ago, kittyna said:

that was probably the most "rough and tumble" we've ever seen JW get with his characters. ;) 

I would like to see more this from Joo won, since he play such roles really well and it suits for his physical traits as well

 

38 minutes ago, kittyna said:

Now that you bring him up...yeah, I can see it. Especially since the loanshark's son had quite a mess of conflicting emotions towards IU's character as well: on the one hand, he blames her for his father's death and wants to finish what his father started; but on the other hand, he's got this obsessive crush on her and at least part of his behaviour is because he's lashing out at her for not returning his feelings.

Yeah, that character was really messed up, more messed up than the Male lead's wife(not the cheating part, but the part where she was angry with his husband that she cheated )

 

53 minutes ago, kittyna said:

I'm not sure if things will get any better for Asian Americans (among whom I do have some relatives)

I hope it will get better, since people have realized that it can be spread by anyone and origin of virus is not that important.

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56 minutes ago, kireeti2 said:

Yeah, there was surge of racist attacks against Asians around the world after  Trump coined the word "China Virus".

 

56 minutes ago, kireeti2 said:

I hope it will get better, since people have realized that it can be spread by anyone and origin of virus is not that important.

 

Where I'm from, things have never gotten really out of hand. Like, you'll get the occasional bad side-eye or racist rant that ends up being posted on social media (and the person being the racist is then chewed out by netizens), but in my own personal experience, the most frequent sort of comment I got was either 1) a hope/wish that people won't turn out racist; or 2) a compliment along the lines of "If only we'd taken this as seriously as you Asians did from the start". Because in Toronto at least, the infection rate among East Asians was disproportionately low during the first wave, and it's argued that it's because, with access to news from China, Korea, etc., we started masking and staying home sooner. Of course, there are other factors at play, too - such as East Asians generally being wealthier and more likely to be able to work from home than other racialized groups - but the point is that I personally have received more compliments relating to COVID-19 than insults.

 

56 minutes ago, kireeti2 said:

I would like to see more this from Joo won, since he play such roles really well and it suits for his physical traits as well

 

Yeah - for someone with what is arguably the most ordinary home life backstory ever (:P), JW's actually really good at playing characters from the wrong side of the tracks. For me, that's also part of the appeal behind his performance as Kim Tae Hyun in Yong Pal as well; he did a great job juggling Tae Hyun's inner goodness and determination to break out of poverty with his outer appearance as a crass-talking swaggering gangster type.

 

Which reminds me: I think I did bring this up once a long time ago, but I now remember thinking that I could visualize JW playing a character like the conman (i.e. Seo In Guk's character) in Squad 38. Like, SIG nailed that performance, and I wouldn't have had the casting go any other way, but if a similar role for someone slightly older ever came around.... ;) 

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1 hour ago, kittyna said:

Because in Toronto at least, the infection rate among East Asians was disproportionately low during the first wave, and it's argued that it's because, with access to news from China, Korea, etc., we started masking and staying home sooner. Of course, there are other factors at play, too - such as East Asians generally being wealthier and more likely to be able to work from home than other racialized groups - but the point is that I personally have received more compliments relating to COVID-19 than insults.

Not only in Canada, most of the East Asian countries were able to control outbreaks and have low transmission rates despite having densely populated cities like Seoul and Tokyo, suggests that East Asian were more willing to wear masks while they are outside, since it is the only way to slow-down the infection rates. Willingness to wear a mask is also factor in slowing down the transmission rate

1 hour ago, kittyna said:

eah - for someone with what is arguably the most ordinary home life backstory ever (:P), JW's actually really good at playing characters from the wrong side of the tracks.

:approves:

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Am I late to talk about Alice? are you already done? Please don't..Please bear with my late talk.. ha ha...

 

I got lost from soompi after posting about the not so organized ending of Alice.. As I was lost in my interpretation of episode 16. So I thought may be I would see how others would like to explain it.. But what I found was bunch of complain how the show is back on Taeyi Jin Gyeom loveline. Honestly as you guys know I have never really thought this drama is about loveline; even if it is it's definitely not Taeyi and Jin Gyeom's loveline. And I definitly don't get how people see the loveline after episode 15 where there's plenty of evidence Yoon Tae Yi playing the role of 2050 Taeyi for both Jin Gyeom and Min Hyuk. Her intertwined memories with 2050 Taeyi is making her see things in a different light that she previously was unable to explain. So I just thought I should think about my own interpretation however non scientific fiction it may be.

 

At first to think what was I expecting from Alice and what I got.. I was expecting to see a different kind of human relationships.. And I got that. Alice was wonderful at it's interpretation of Human Relationships. I've always loved reading science fiction books mostly from local writer and translated ones of Issac Asimov. But I do not really watch many sci-fi shows. So I was not that invested in the details of SF side of the show, I was just watching and enjoying that aspect. I was on board with Teacher and Book of Prophecy mystery. While we know the identity of teacher, I don't think Alice really tried to really explain the origin of Book of Prophecy or what's teachers interest in it. I was disappointed that Alice never really give us a proper conclusion on that. Because I do love the notion of not believing blindly in a prophecy/future because it can always change, I also do want to know how it was there to begin with because it caused so much chaos.

Honestly I think I've been saying it a lot here and there that I'm really satisfied till episode 15 of Alice. It gave me almost everything I wanted to see..in a melodramatic way..but I do have a love for good melo drama..so yeah I enjoyed that melo side. How Taeyi used to hate Min Hyuk's guts but in the end she's the one ended up as being understanding of his sorrow. She said to him "I don't how close we used to be there.. But you're not in my book yet. You'll not be in the future also." in erlier episodes and in ep 15 she asked him to runaway with her and Jin Gyeom.. If that's not melo i don't know what is. Jin Gyeom went from " She is just a very good friend" to "She is a friend who cares about me a lot." to "I can't promise anything." to " If things go wrong for you, it goes wrong for me." These are my definition of classic melo.. well may not be full kdrama version of melo but I used to be sucker for this kind of literature in my childhood. So yeah I was totally satisfied.. May be for many it's to subtle to talk about. But think I write pages on this subtle changes in one characts action towards another.

What was my problem with episode 16? It ended with too many things for viewer's assumptions. That makes it complicated. Like the reset. Like has 2010 Jin Gyeom and his mother gets to live after Reset or it was just Jin Gyeom's assumption. If Park Sun Young can stay in 2010 even after Reset why can't Min Hyuk and others? Is Min Hyuk even there? Why is Do Yeon Jin Gyeom not friend if Jin Gyeom and his mother survived? Is Architect Park son of Park Sun Young? If he is why is he didn't find Taeyi familier right away? Why Taeyi remembers everything so well? And the list goes on... But I will stop here.

 

So there goes How I see the RESET----

 

According to Omma tae Yi Reset will remove the time travelers. So I think as there’s no time travelers. People who were time traveler at one point of life are again given another life in another setting. They would cease to exist as time traveler but they will not cease to live.

Like Park Jin Gyeom born in another family and he doesn’t even know his old house. Taeyi probably born in her adoptive family. Ajusshi Ko may have died if it was his current self but he is alive at present.

 

Though they have a new life, they’re destined to meet. We saw Nambu Police staffs knows Taeyi even without Park Jin Gyeom(first time Tae Yi knew them or they knew her was becuse Detective Jin Gyeom). Do Yeon ended up meeting Architect Park first even though they’re not friends now ( I assumed they’re not because Jin Gyeom doesn’t seem like he ever lived in his old place..).. But they could be friends again.

So I believe if Jin Gyeom can live in this timeline after reset so can Min Hyuk..If only they could show us that Min Hyuk is living somewhere close by… In my imagination he does.. ha ha..

 

My ending goes like this.. Tae Yi meets Jin Gyeom.. they try to share their good old memories and Tae Yi sets JG and DY up because she knows their history.. She ends up meeting Min Hyuk too.. Min Hyuk was very close by.. May be working in JG's company.. Happy Ending! Ha Ha ha.... Me happy.

 

What do you guys think about my RESET?

 

I also have few questions that are bugging me. Shae your insights if you feel like it----

 

1) Did Old Jin Gyeom went to kill Unborn Jin Gyeom because he wanted to be freed from lonely cruel  fate of time loop?

 

2) What did Old Jin Gyeom want as a Teacher? Did he wanted to be freed from his cruel fate aka time travel loop? Or did he want to save himself from getting killed by Jin Gyeom, the controller of time?

 

3) Did he killed Omma first time? Or did Omma commit suicided at that time too? What's his gain from Killing Omma?

 

(Whatever his goal might be killing Omma do not really serves any purpose of him.. His target either way is Jin Gyeom..I think in every time Old Jin Gyeom travelled time it was to try killing each version of Jin Gyeom he could so he could be freed from this lonely sorrowful state but he failed each time. He couldn't kill High schooler Jin Gyeom because of Omma's Protection.. he couldn't Kill Detective Jin Gyeom because he was the controller of time..Alice made things a bit complicated by making Omma die different time with differnt tools. Alice gun, Mystic Kinif, Old gun... But I am not bothered by last two becuse Alice showed us future can always change.. What I am interested is who killed our Jin Gyeom's Omma first time with Alice gun? Was it Old Jin Gyeom?)

 

4) What's Oh Seok Own's goad? Did he knew what he was doing? or was he just puppet of Teacher.

 

 

 

On 10/26/2020 at 6:43 AM, kittyna said:

I know an actual win is being a bit greedy, but I hope we'll get at least one credible Daesang nomination come year's end (unlike the "let's just nominate everybody" mess that was 2017's SBS Drama Awards).

 

I was in 'at least one nomination' that is for KHS's phenomenal acting as Jin Gyeom's mother until I saw JW playing multiple role.. I would at least like two nomination from Alice.. ha ha..

But definitely don't want to see everrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrybody getting in the nomination.. That's such a joke done by SBS DRAMA AWARDS 2017. :expressionless:

 

But Honestly SBS should specially recognize how KHS and JW perfectly portrayed the emotions in all those death scene of Omma.. Those scene were so intense and it made me cry every time. They were so phenomenal.. Though they performed those again and aging but emotion was never lacking.. I cried in every such scene, I looked forward to each of Omma-son scene. The Omma Tone KHS use for her child of both age was very moving... woah.. Joo Won was asked in a radio show before Alice that if Alice had more emotional scene than Gaksital because the Host Lee Joon remebers how intense Gaksital was. JW said there are more than Gaksital. I know what JW means. Though gaksital had many emotional scenes none of them are this physically/mentally straining where same characters had to go through death again and again and each time the intensity of emotion grew...No matter how good of actors they are, it must have took lots of effort from KHS and JW.

 

On 10/26/2020 at 6:43 AM, kittyna said:

These aren't all the things I liked (for instance, I like to think that Jin Gyeom can count as K-drama representation for platonic relationships everywhere), but you get the idea.

 

So true...  He is epitome of Platonic relationship.

Though I feel Jin Gyeom might end up having feelings for Doyeon given a bit relaxed time where he didn't have to spend his life after his mothers killer.. I can see it..Do Yeon can make it... She has JG wrapped around her finger.. But they doesn't know it with surety..I just see their possiblities are endless.. What do you think @kireeti2? Wanna talk about Jingyeom-Doyeon?

 

On 10/26/2020 at 5:31 PM, nina_mitrokhina 5misnina said:

3. In terms of DNA, Professor Tae Yi remains Jin Gyooma's biological mother. Then how can incest be allowed between these two characters ?!

It seems that the writers went to the violation of common sense and logic for the sake of the notorious "happy ending".

 

Kim Hee-sun interpreted the relationship between Yoon Tae-yi and Park Jin-gyeom as a relationship that is not a love line.

"To Park Jin-Gyeom, Yoon Tae-yi looks just like his mother Park Sun-young, so he has the desperation and sorrow that he doesn't even want to lose Yoon Tae-yi, who looks the same as his mother.

As Yoon Tae Yi I thought I was in favour of Park Jin-gyeom, who protects me so much, but i didn't feel the love line."

 

You will find this in the transaltion of 11th Para:

http://m.koreadaily.com/news/read.asp?art_id=8788601&referer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com%2F

 

ElezoKqVgAA1mhX?format=jpg&name=small

 

So I hope KHS's interprtation will help you to be relived that there's no incest going on in the characters mind. 

 

On 10/26/2020 at 6:57 PM, kittyna said:

If it were up to me, I think I'd be happy with the drama ending after Jin Gyeom and Tae Yi first run into each other again - when, after realizing that Jin Gyeom doesn't recognize her, Tae Yi finally starts to think that it might be better for him this way. I loved that bit about her just being happy that he's happy, because I think that's what love (romantic or otherwise) should ultimately be about.

 

And if the story really had to continue past that point so that Tae Yi could also be happy? As fine as I am with the actual ending, if it were entirely up to me and my writer's imagination, I'd have the second meeting play out differently. K-dramas often have some sort of concept of a "new beginning" in their finales; and rather than a reunion based on subconscious memory, that's the approach I would go for.

 

So, rather than Jin Gyeom starting to remember Tae Yi, I would have written him as someone who doesn't remember, but who ends up meeting Tae Yi again in a different context. Maybe she ends up buying the old house and commissions him to renovate it or something, I dunno. And then they officially introduce (or, in Tae Yi's case, reintroduce) themselves, and a new working relationship or friendship could start.

 

lol - I dunno, guys. It feels sort of sacrilegious to start thinking of an entire alternate ending so soon after the drama's own finale, but..should I? ;) 

 

You're not the only one.. Me guilty here.

Sorry Alice.. As much as I loved you I need my Alice alternate Epilogue to have ultimate satisfaction. ha ha...

On 10/27/2020 at 5:36 PM, kittyna said:

I just realized, after rewatching the ending a few times, that it's actually a really intriguing reversal of Episode 1/2: where Tae Yi is the one who's obsessively searching for Jin Gyeom and who now claims to know him from somewhere, and he's like, "Uh...what?" It's resolved by the subconscious memories floating up in his mind afterwards, but if he does recognize her now, he'd also recognize that it's because of her connection to his mother....Point is: romance is still highly unlikely, in my opinion.

 

I also noticed it how they replaced their position after REST. Before it was Jin Gyeom and now it's Tae Yi who ended up being the one with memory.

 

 

On 10/27/2020 at 7:33 PM, kittyna said:

By the way, there's one detail from the first half of Episode 16 that I didn't comment on before, but that I thought was really brilliant. When "our" Jin Gyeom goes back in time to 2010 again, he checks his arm when he first tracks down his mother and starts to follow her. I actually love that they included that touch. :) 

 

I also noticed it.. He was checking if he was under trance of Old Jin Gyeom or not so his mother may not get danger because of him.. That was such a nice touch. In fact there are many of such little little touch of Jin gyeom's thoughtfulness here and there which shows how he feels for people and things.. I already have some in mind.. may be we can talk more about it later. 

 

 

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11 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

My ending goes like this.. Tae Yi meets Jin Gyeom.. they try to share their good old memories and Tae Yi sets JG and DY up because she knows their history.. She ends up meeting Min Hyuk too.. Min Hyuk was very close by.. May be working in JG's company.. Happy Ending! Ha Ha ha.... Me happy.

Lol! I like this version of ending:approves: Especially the part where TY setting up PJG and KDY :blush:, like in episode 15 we sort of get a feeling that TY(2020) gave blessings to the union of PJG and KDY , so I wouldn't be surprised if she tries to set up them up in this dimension

 

11 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

What do you think @kireeti2? Wanna talk about Jingyeom-Doyeon?

I think the writers did give us hit by making DY do an interview with new PJG in the end, that there is possibility of their union, just like you mentions TY, will be the one to initiate things between them. Lol! In the end everything has been reversed TY  is the one who wants DY to date PJG, earlier she really didn't like DY, perhaps this will be alternative of Spain trip,like, I can imagine how TY(2020) will ask PJG to meet up for lunch or something and also call DY to also come on the pretext of talking about time travel and introduce each other formally, even though they have met before new PJG had no memories of DY, and after meeting TY(2020) he was able to regain his past memories, so, in the next meeting with DY, new PJG will try his best to impress her :blush:

 

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@flutterby06, @kireeti2 - I like how everybody's coming up with their own versions of what things are like for the Alice characters post-reset - you guys will know from my version that I tried to keep as much from the pre-reset storyline as possible (because I personally really like the possibility of the reset being a do-over for Jin Gyeom), but you guys went for something completely different, yet still plausible, so kudos :approves:

 

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

Though they have a new life, they’re destined to meet. We saw Nambu Police staffs knows Taeyi even without Park Jin Gyeom(first time Tae Yi knew them or they knew her was becuse Detective Jin Gyeom). Do Yeon ended up meeting Architect Park first even though they’re not friends now ( I assumed they’re not because Jin Gyeom doesn’t seem like he ever lived in his old place..).. But they could be friends again.

So I believe if Jin Gyeom can live in this timeline after reset so can Min Hyuk..If only they could show us that Min Hyuk is living somewhere close by… In my imagination he does.. ha ha..

 

My ending goes like this.. Tae Yi meets Jin Gyeom.. they try to share their good old memories and Tae Yi sets JG and DY up because she knows their history.. She ends up meeting Min Hyuk too.. Min Hyuk was very close by.. May be working in JG's company.. Happy Ending! Ha Ha ha.... Me happy.

 

So...basically, rather than a familial relationship, we somehow end up with a four-person group of BFFs who may or may not also form two dating couples (Jin Gyeom + Do Yeon; Tae Yi + Min Hyuk). Sounds like fun - and I imagine there's tons of comic gold and cute/fluffy shenanigans to be had with this group :piggydance:

 

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

1) Did Old Jin Gyeom went to kill Unborn Jin Gyeom because he wanted to be freed from lonely cruel  fate of time loop?

 

2) What did Old Jin Gyeom want as a Teacher? Did he wanted to be freed from his cruel fate aka time travel loop? Or did he want to save himself from getting killed by Jin Gyeom, the controller of time?

 

3) Did he killed Omma first time? Or did Omma commit suicided at that time too? What's his gain from Killing Omma?

 

For me, I don't know what the Teacher's goal was at first (btw, I'm calling him that to minimize confusion with Jin Gyeom), but by the time any of our main characters see him (Park Sun Young in 1992, or Jin Gyeom in 2010/2020), he's become a really messed up version of himself. Let's forget the sci-fi for a second and just think about his actions from the perspective of normal human nature - and if we do that, I think there are three basic assumptions I can make:

  1. He believes he's fated to kill his mother according to the prophecy - and he has enough feelings for her that he hates himself for it and wishes that he'd never been born
  2. However, rather than trying to stop the cycle on his own, he's decided to place all the blame on his mother for letting him be born to such a fate in the first place
  3. He's desperate to hold on to his ability to control time because he thinks it's the one part of himself and his life that he can control - and since his mother is now actively trying to close the door of time, he has to kill her in order to hold on to that part of his identity, even if it ends up with him hating himself (and her) more every single time the cycle repeats itself

Is it circular logic? Yes. But people are seldom completely rational, especially when it comes to reflecting on their own wrongful actions and beliefs. So that's the cycle that - it's implied - the Teacher has been repeating in each parallel universe he ends up in.

 

I, too, noticed that he tried to kill Jin Gyeom at the end of Episode 15. Personally, I think it's because he senses (from JG's reaction to meeting him) that he's now dealing with the one version of himself that won't follow the pattern - and he knows from the prophecy that that means that this Jin Gyeom will be the one that could kill him and stop time travel for good. So, in terms of the conflict between the Teacher and Jin Gyeom, it's a simple matter of "kill or be killed" from the Teacher's perspective.

 

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

4) What's Oh Seok Own's goad? Did he knew what he was doing? or was he just puppet of Teacher.

 

I mentioned this in a comment that's probably buried by now, but my guess is that Seok Oh Won - and most of the other time travelers among our antagonists - really only knew or understood that Tae Yi (in any incarnation) and Jin Gyeom were trying to stop time travel, and they couldn't allow that. Seok Oh Won stands out for having read the final page of the book of prophecy, but even his motive seems to just boil down to "Anyone who tries to stop the time travel I had a part in developing must die."

 

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

What I am interested is who killed our Jin Gyeom's Omma first time with Alice gun? Was it Old Jin Gyeom?

 

My best guess is that with the main timeline that we see in Alice, we're dealing with the one parallel universe that deviated from the cycle. It's likely that someone from "Alice" - either acting independently (because there were tons of people from 2050 who wanted Sun Young dead by that point) or on the Teacher's orders - killed Sun Young in Episode 1, as evidenced by the weapon involved and by Oh Si Young's claim in Episode 14 that Gi Cheol Am was the murderer. 

 

Point is, if the Teacher had killed Sun Young in Episode 1, then the prophecy would already have been fulfilled. However, if we look back at the death scene in that episode, there are some pretty strong clues that the prophecy hadn't been fulfilled:

  1. Sun Young's rather cryptic comment when she sees Jin Gyeom: "He's left, and my son's okay." One of the most intriguing things about this line was that, depending on where we were in the drama, it could be interpreted a gazillion different ways. At first, it sounds like whoever killed Sun Young was actually going after Jin Gyeom. Then, after Episode 5, it sounds like she meant that the 2020 Jin Gyeom had made it back to the present in time before the young Jin Gyeom ran into him. But once the whole prophecy was revealed, what I'd argue was the true meaning of that statement becomes clear: my son still has a chance of staying good and stopping this cycle, because the person who just attacked me (and left) was not him
  2. Sun Young's warning about Tae Yi. If the Teacher had been the one to shoot her - thus fulfilling the prophecy by having some version of Jin Gyeom be her killer - then she wouldn't have to be as worried about the prophecy potentially being fulfilled in the future. However, she's aware that there are two versions of herself in this timeline, which means that Jin Gyeom is still vulnerable to the prophecy in the years to come - just with 2020 Tae Yi instead of her.
4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

So I hope KHS's interprtation will help you to be relived that there's no incest going on in the characters mind. 

 

Yeah, I also shared that earlier (or at least an Instagram post about it). Mind you, I don't fault viewers for seeing romance there and being put off by that - again, we've all been strongly conditioned by films/dramas/etc. to expect romance out of plot devices like fated meetings, male/female leads living together, etc. I just never saw it that way myself.

 

4 hours ago, flutterby06 said:

But definitely don't want to see everrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrybody getting in the nomination.. That's such a joke done by SBS DRAMA AWARDS 2017.

 

I kind of feel like 2017 was the year that networks like SBS were scrambling to find a way to work around the massive number of celebrity enlistments. Because the general unspoken rule with the drama awards is that a large prize like the Daesang can't be given to someone who couldn't attend the ceremony, the actual pool for actors who could get rewards that year was really small - but not giving all these big Hallyu stars any recognition at all would have led to a general uproar from fans. So my guess is that they decided to compromise by giving out all of these empty nominations just to be able to say, "See? Your Oppa got nominated - happy now?"

 

Yeah, I don't expect to see a repeat of that particular PR mess anytime soon :P 

 

By the way, on a slightly more random (but infinitely more heartwarming) note, I just stumbled across this ad that little Moon Ju Won (i.e. mini-Jin Gyeom) did recently. And I can't be the only one thinking that his bored look in the first half of the ad is probably what mini-Jin Gyeom looked like most of the time :lol:

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8 hours ago, kireeti2 said:

I think the writers did give us hit by making DY do an interview with new PJG in the end, that there is possibility of their union, just like you mentions TY, will be the one to initiate things between them. Lol! In the end everything has been reversed TY  is the one who wants DY to date PJG, earlier she really didn't like DY, perhaps this will be alternative of Spain trip,like, I can imagine how TY(2020) will ask PJG to meet up for lunch or something and also call DY to also come on the pretext of talking about time travel and introduce each other formally, even though they have met before new PJG had no memories of DY, and after meeting TY(2020) he was able to regain his past memories, so, in the next meeting with DY, new PJG will try his best to impress her :blush:

 

Ooooh.. It will be a sight to see how he will try to impress her.. his life or that life he'd probably gonna make a fool of himself or anger her by saying something short... ha ha... But like this idea as everything is in reverse why not him being a bit more active in perusing her. 

 

I also didn't think Yoon Tae Yi would dislike Do Yeon unless she was always aggravating her. Do Yeon was always ready to attack whenever she saw Tae Yi. And Tae Yi seemed to be finding it competitive. She seemed genuinely curious without hard feelings when she asked Jin Gyeom what's the nature of relationship with Do Yeon, when she asked Do Yeon since when she liked Jin Gyeom. I say, Do Yeon is mostly the reason why they ended up cat fighting and woman sometimes do feel like to a cat-fight when they're provoked regardless of a interest in the same man or any man. ha ha..

 

When I first started Alice I felt kinda sad that Do Yeon's feeling might be ended up being treated as totally one sided.. But then there were scenes where Jin Gyeom took special care of her, his tone for her through out this journey was real soft except that one time he raised his voice and how he would cater to her needs and demands, letting her stay with him at his regular plus old place like it's the most natural thing for him in the world.. This little little touches to their relationship spoke to me.. That they're not yet there, but they can be.

 

Ha ha I think I will have to write another post about this "A bit more than Best Friend" relationship later..

 

But is it just me or you guys noticed Jin Gyeom's soft tone for Do Yeon..? I thought that was a nice detail added by him him in Park Jin Gyeom. I mean Jin Gyeom as a apathetic person can't be really lively while talking to a friend he cares for dearly... so he tried to express it with his soft expression and tone for Do Yeon.. So far JW has only talked anything close to this soft for Ja Eun Ojakgyo Brothers but it was only done after he started having feelings for her.. So I thought Jin Gyeom's tone change from person to person was a really nice subtle touch to his character in Alice. Loved the tone he used for calling "Do Yeona" while hair drying scene "Anee" with a touch of kid Jin Gyeom tone in the car ride with Twice music, when Do Yeon was hitting him for going missing, when he asked her if she felt okay in the morning after Karaoke Night. I loved the soft voice of Park Jin Gyeom. :fullofhearts:

 

7 hours ago, kittyna said:

So...basically, rather than a familial relationship, we somehow end up with a four-person group of BFFs who may or may not also form two dating couples (Jin Gyeom + Do Yeon; Tae Yi + Min Hyuk). Sounds like fun - and I imagine there's tons of comic gold and cute/fluffy shenanigans to be had with this group

 

Yeah they end up being Mutual Friend, thus having a possibility of dating couples.

 

Why I think they're all mostly given a new life to live is mostly because I can't see Architect Park Jin Gyeom as son of Park Sun Young. If RESET allows them to live in this time that doesn't feel very natural and fair when all others are sent back to their original timeline. That's why I see them as being born as separate individual but intertwined by destiny because they shared memories of each other before. because they couldn't see the end of it due to time travel, nature is giving them a chance to be live this time with all those people without the influence of time travel..

 

That's why Taeyi-Jin Gyeom both not remembering previous memory seemed quite appealing to me.. They could still be friends without having those flash backs.. But it's not bad either. Their memories can help them to prevent time travel for the time being.

 

I recently saw a comment on Naver in this scene's section which I found reasonable:

 

 

Like Min Hyuk has regret of not being able to be there for his love and son how his thought at the end was what could have happened if he stayed with them.. This is Jin Gyeom's regret.. If his mother was alive may be could be happy.. May be she could be there for him at moment's of his happiness...

 

7 hours ago, kittyna said:

Point is, if the Teacher had killed Sun Young in Episode 1, then the prophecy would already have been fulfilled. However, if we look back at the death scene in that episode, there are some pretty strong clues that the prophecy hadn't been fulfilled:

  1. Sun Young's rather cryptic comment when she sees Jin Gyeom: "He's left, and my son's okay." One of the most intriguing things about this line was that, depending on where we were in the drama, it could be interpreted a gazillion different ways. At first, it sounds like whoever killed Sun Young was actually going after Jin Gyeom. Then, after Episode 5, it sounds like she meant that the 2020 Jin Gyeom had made it back to the present in time before the young Jin Gyeom ran into him. But once the whole prophecy was revealed, what I'd argue was the true meaning of that statement becomes clear: my son still has a chance of staying good and stopping this cycle, because the person who just attacked me (and left) was not him
  2. Sun Young's warning about Tae Yi. If the Teacher had been the one to shoot her - thus fulfilling the prophecy by having some version of Jin Gyeom be her killer - then she wouldn't have to be as worried about the prophecy potentially being fulfilled in the future. However, she's aware that there are two versions of herself in this timeline, which means that Jin Gyeom is still vulnerable to the prophecy in the years to come - just with 2020 Tae Yi instead of her.

 

@kittyna thanks for your insights on those questions. 

I have similar thought regarding Omma's actual death and that the time of fulfillment of Prophecy wasn't there yet when Mom died. I think I've previously shared in this thread somewhere when people were given impression that young JG is the one who killed his Mother.

 

"my son still has a chance of staying good and stopping this cycle, because the person who just attacked me (and left) was not him" 

That's interesting take..

 

7 hours ago, kittyna said:

I kind of feel like 2017 was the year that networks like SBS were scrambling to find a way to work around the massive number of celebrity enlistments. Because the general unspoken rule with the drama awards is that a large prize like the Daesang can't be given to someone who couldn't attend the ceremony, the actual pool for actors who could get rewards that year was really small - but not giving all these big Hallyu stars any recognition at all would have led to a general uproar from fans. So my guess is that they decided to compromise by giving out all of these empty nominations just to be able to say, "See? Your Oppa got nominated - happy now?"

 

Yeah, I don't expect to see a repeat of that particular PR mess anytime soon :P 

 

I remember some us JW fans became surprised from Tweet that Joo Won got nominated for 2017 Daesung.. I was like "Joo Won was amazing in MSG and it was overall enjoyable drama but it's not enough for Daesung.. So who else got nominated?" And then someone uploaded the whole nominee list for Daesang... And we're like "ooh..that's why!'' ha ha..

 

7 hours ago, kittyna said:

By the way, on a slightly more random (but infinitely more heartwarming) note, I just stumbled across this ad that little Moon Ju Won (i.e. mini-Jin Gyeom) did recently. And I can't be the only one thinking that his bored look in the first half of the ad is probably what mini-Jin Gyeom looked like most of the time

 

It feels like it was a CF for Min Jin Gyeom.. so cute.

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