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Posts posted by charlieblue17

  1. 24 minutes ago, lollyminx said:

    Also, it may have been their image, but I don't think it is because IU played a daring role in Persona and YJG also had some steamy kissing scenes in his previous projects.

    I was specifically thinking about the age difference between them, not about their individual willingness to film more steamy romantic scenes... if I remember correctly IU had a recent scandal about sexifying a kid song/story(?); plus most Korean viewers still struggle to see YJG as a proper adult, so I was imagining a potential issue with putting the two of them together in a steamy scene. But I could very well be wrong about it.


    24 minutes ago, lollyminx said:

    Do you mean to tell me that he cried like that in the bus stop and then hugged her tight when she came back, only to remain strong until she left? What's the point of showing he waited for her and cried for her, when there's no crossing boundaries or taking one step further after MW came back from the bridge? 

    indeed. they went back to a happy pretend, both willfully ignoring the elephant in the room by unspoken agreement. Not sure how I feel about that... i get it in some sense, but i also don't... it's really the same issue as the physical contact one - underneath it all it still boils down to building conscious boundaries between them


    24 minutes ago, lollyminx said:

    Or do a restaurant/hospitality reality show.

    they can just competitively eat things and laugh their heads off - i'd totally watch that

    she can finally teach him to do proper selcas too ;-)


    24 minutes ago, lollyminx said:

    AGAIN, thank you for discussing these things further. I expected that most of you will leave this forum but it's good to see closing discussions like this. :star:

    not quite ready to let go yet -- happy to have people to talk to about it. So thanks straight back.


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  2. 17 hours ago, RiceGirl1212 said:

    Also, I don't think a steamy bed scene would need to have been done. 

    I did not need them to actually show anything sexy either. I would have been perfectly fine for instance if MW's 'to the bedroom' scene would have finished with him twirling her around and walking towards the bed. But the explicit and played-out-for-laughs refusal of her natural need for physical contact felt wrong to me.


    As they left it, CS remains too pitiful. He was always a bit of a loner, with no family of his own and when he finally manages to build some family relationships everyone leaves. He only has his memories to sustain him, so they should at least have made as many memories as possible. Isn't it the point that "to have loved and lost is better than not to love at all"? then why enforce such unnatural boundaries between them? Maybe it's a cultural difference thing, but I just don't get it.


    In the end, the gods (and writers) did not seem to like CS at all. His fate was by far the worst of the lot.


    17 hours ago, aria26 said:

    This makes me wonder if the reason we could not feel the burden is because CS' desperation was not shown enough.

    Love the way you've articulated this point. Yes - towards the end CS got a bit too perfect. We started off with a character that refused to walk the given path and instead tried to find creative solutions for the best possible resolution, only to end up an all-accepting self-sacrificing saint. He was always one to internalize hurt, which is why the bus scene had so much of an impact. But after MW returned, he stopped showing any of his negative feelings, not only in front of her (which is understandable) but also in front of the audience. And that was narratively the wrong thing to do, imo... (maybe this was the HS's way of hiding most of the bitter part of their bittersweet ending, but again it felt disingenuous).


    PS: after carefully going through the Hong sisters interview it was made apparent that in their head CS was some sort of a monk who was there just to dutifully send MW off. They put zero thought in his feeling or his fate after MW's departure. And it was down to the director to add a sliver of hope in the ending: if it were up to them there would be no hope of a future together. Just a clean cutting of ties. Job done. Go back to the monastery.


    Also, reading that interview finally convinced me that their bad endings are not some unnatural fluke, but rather an actual character fault. I was expecting too much from the writers all along -- they don't have it in them (cleverness, sophistication, sensitivity, understanding of human emotion, you name it) to do any better. They can come up with clever setups, write funny banter, and infuse the dialogue with layers of meta, but they simply cannot write complete meaningful stories. When their shows do succeed, it is down to the actors and the director who take largely subpar material and make it work. So all the kudos goes to the HdL team who made this a memorable experience despite their blunders.


    The Hong sisters  are officially black listed in my books. Might have taken me 12 tries, but I have finally learned my lesson.

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  3. 3 hours ago, vangsweetie637 said:

    BUT to use “burdensome” makes it seem like they wanted to but just chose not do it or could not.

    I think what they meant to say is that it would be too much of a burden for CS if he got too attached. But he was as emotionally attached as one can get anyways, so if they were really consistent they should have followed through with the physical part.


    I personally felt that this decision undermines the message of the story -- which was to live well and to cherish the little time you are given together, so you can contently move on.  So to me the excuses provided by the Hong sisters seemed disingenuous. More likely, after the casting, someone decided that showing too much skinship might negatively affect one or both of the actors' image (either IU being seen as a cradle robber, or it interfering with YJG's nation's kid image, or some such nonsense). I have no stats on how the Korean audience responded to their initial kiss, but a bad reaction to that could also explain the followup... In the interest of the story it was for sure not.

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  4. 3 hours ago, lollyminx said:

    What's the difference between saying "Saranghae" and "Saranghamnida (?)" 

    he still talks formally to her.


    I was wondering about that too -- i thought that in the end he had won the rice cake competition so he was allowed to talk in banmal to her... I suppose it fits his personality, but I was so happy when he asked her for that as the prize. I get why he would still do it at work, but in private...

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  5. On 8/27/2019 at 9:31 AM, berny2 said:

    Hey guys,


    When (in what episode, and event) do you think that CS started to feel something for MW? I mean his turning point.

    Because the first few episodes he was really hesitant to work with her, and did not want to stay in Hotel del Luna.



    Attraction: the first time he met her on the subway

    Interest: shortly after, amplified by her saving him from the evil ghost and starting to have the dreams

    he also just gets her from the beginning... like the fact that as she is looking at the tiger she is thinking of her own fate

    Love: ... a little more with each day... don't know if there was a big moment of realization... to me it feels like he always knew


    rewatching a whole bunch of scenes from early episodes and the CS-MW interactions are even cuter on the second viewing...

    there's a lot of nuance i missed the first time round...


    For MW:

    Attraction: the first time she met him on the subway

    Interest: from the very beginning; you can see her becoming livelier just from having him around: how much she enjoys teasing him, and arguing with him... there's this spark in her eye around him that was was not there in any of the scenes at the hotel before his arrival. (also she wore a poop-brown dress for him. and bought him a car)

    Love: I think she first realizes it the day after the tree started growing leaves, when she tries to send him away and he refuses. And she is scared shitless by the idea (before getting angry and leaving in a huff).

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  6. 10 minutes ago, laola said:

    I also think its one of the few dramas that have highlighted that intense attraction does not lead to strong relationship you need more than that.

    Everything is very much on point but I love this bit.


    Yes, attraction is one thing, a long term relationship is entirely another.

    And the show spelled that out quite clearly, even if not everyone seems to get it.

    The mature relationship between MW and CS is the best bit of the show for me.

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  7. On 8/25/2019 at 4:45 PM, angelbeast90 said:

    Man Wol wasn't the one whose love wasn't reciprocated, but Cheong Myung. He watched over her as a firefly for a thousand years. The princess' greed was forgiven, she gets to date the enemy she killed. But Cheong Myung.. God Mago, in this day and age, you'd be impeached.


    No one owes love to anybody else.


    CM did stubbornly hang on to her, despite the fact that his existence caused her immense pain, but so what?

    It does not change the fact that he got her family killed... and yes there is a reasonably logical progression that lead to that, and his intentions were not completely evil, but still... had CS been in the same situation, I bet things would have turned out radically different.


    CM made a completely rational decision: he chose his interests over hers and just went on with the princess' suggestion... no attempt to take responsibility for the mess he'd made or to find a solution that did not require sacrificing a whole bunch of innocent people just so. His life and his men's were more important than hers and her people's. Period. A love that can be measured on such scales is no love at all.


    Not to mention his utter lack of understanding of her character. Right down to their very last interaction. Even is MW no longer detests him, there's no way she'd settle for someone like him. Not after she's had a taste of the real deal with CS.


    Also: CS is 100% on her side and always does the right thing. This will always win against CM's flexible ethics* and selfishness.


    PS: *when CM was talking to YW after capturing them and he suggested that as long as some of the innocent villagers get hanged as rebels he may be able to keep YW alive as a slave... that look of shock and disgust on YW's face... well that was me. that guy is scum and you cannot convince me otherwise. 


    Also how very predictable that the thought of saving MW's life wasn't even his own, he just went along with YW's plan.

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  8. I had watched a short clip of the kiss before knowing any of the context. At the time MW’s initial kiss felt like a sad “goodbye” while CS’s followup felt like “this is just the beginning and I’m not letting you go no matter what”.  I loved it so started watching ep12 with the full expectation of adoring the lot, only to get punched in the gut by the context and the price of that “no matter what”.


    Up to now I had believed that the gods were, if not positively inclined towards MW and CS, at least fair; only it turns out that the only rule in this game is that the puppets they are playing with (MW and CS) need to be put through the maximum amount of hurt possible. Everything else is secondary: we no longer vanish evil spirits if it so suits; CS -who has yet to do a single thing wrong- is doomed as well, just for caring about MW. It was all preordained to end in disaster from the get go and everyone’s just a cog in the machine that makes it happen. MW was right all along not to trust them; this is more perverse that even she could imagine. The gods made it such that MW loving CS is enough to destroy them both. Given that  her original trauma was about her loving someone causing the destruction of everything she holds dear, I don't know what to call that except cruel… she really stood no chance. the ending was a done conclusion regardless what she does. the test is there only as an excuse and I bloody feel like swearing.


    I’m hurt and I’m sad and I’m kind of angry. The fabric is tearing at the seams and for the first time the narrative core stopped making sense to me. it’s no longer about forgiveness, or the healing power of love, or moving on. I no longer have any idea what the hell is the point.

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  9. 4 hours ago, vangsweetie637 said:

     secret office romance 





    knowing them... it will probably start off well enough, only for them to get distracted by some bickering and finally end up huffing on their respective pillows, backs at each other. full old-married-couple mode on.


    come to think of it... i'd like to see that :naughty:

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  10. 1 hour ago, lollyminx said:

    Awwww when you put it that way, I agree. I hadn't seen the episode with English subs but it's good to know that MW did this for him and you're right, CS needs love as much as MW. Mago did a good job as matchmaker here. They complement each other despite the bickering and it's heartwarming to know that CS may be alone but MW is there for him and she protects him when he needs it. It's even more romantic when you think that he never really had that kind of protection growing up with his father being a careless thief who didn't think much about his father's wellbeing. MW changed that by helping CS's father. In a way, CS turned out the way he is because of MW. 


    Also, hearing CS tell MW to trust him, with the kind of voice YJG used to tell her that... it was such a warm scene. I really hate it when these kinds of scenes make me want them to date IRL :lol:

    I only watched the live stream and it was kind of laggy so take what I say with a pinch of salt, but this was the vibe I got from MW's words/actions


    2 hours ago, jasminssiii said:

    After that she still went to heaven with a limousine? hahaha she must've still lived a good life lol excluding the fact that she abandoned her son. 


    I think the limo was MW pulling strings for CS's benefit... did not see a white lily 

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  11. On 8/11/2019 at 10:48 AM, jasminssiii said:

    I have the same sentiments regarding CS mom too. It felt so rushed. We could have a great story from that. I was expecting for CS to have a dilemma between sending his mom and making her stay to have a time with her. I decided to just think that CS is sooo mature to think for that and will always do what is right lol and maybe he doesn't want to get attached to her since he knows she would be leaving soon. Actually I'm also a bit nervous now lol but I trust the HDL team because I really know how a Hong Sisters drama works especially towards the end and I hope it wouldn't happen with HDL. I've had enough with Hwayugi not anymore lol. I wish the best for the HDL team and I hope they will be able to exceed our expectations ^•^ 


    His mum was never someone important in his life. And she treated his existence as a shameful secret that she needed to hide rather than a blessing. Why would he want to develop a relationship with that woman? Hearing her saying "I'm sorry" was more than enough*... I think this entire episode was meant more as an excuse to have MW take care of him for a change... even if she clearly has no idea how...


    I loved that she got everyone together to brainstorm ... only to conclude that he does not have anyone to turn to either (Sanchez excluded). I wonder if, in the end, this was the thing that changed her mind... that he needs her love as much as she needs his... and she is willing to give that to him, even if only for the little time as she has left


    PS: * that said, the way he asked his mother if he can keep the pictures from the book... the humility of the request... which also implied him caring enough about her to keep her picture with him... he is too pure for this world and I want to give him a big big hug. 

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  12. 2 hours ago, eunki said:

    isn't it just what he does to all ghosts, doesn't he just see her as a poor soul who needs to be cared for and sent to afterlife happily?

    he explicitly said no to that

    CS told Mago that he is not that nice... that if it weren't for his feelings for MW he would have given up already

    But I agree that it is high time for some more explicitly romantic interactions between them


    Side note: I think he is a lot nicer than he gives himself credit for...I found it amazing that his reaction to the sad ending of the guest in room 13 was to try even harder - to collect as many lost souls as he can and make sure that they safely make the crossing. I just love him. And I love that this inherent goodness is what MW loves him for too.


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  13. 52 minutes ago, crispachu said:

    Did God#4 force that guy's death so that she could frame JMW??

    No. MW did not kill that guy. She only showed the gods the extent of his depravity (that his victims were so many that he couldn't even remember their individual names or faces) and then let fate take its course. 


    The gods are all-knowing so she MG#4 can't frame her for sth she did not to. But she can engineer situations in which MW is likely to make the wrong choice and that would give her the excuse she needs to vanish her. I am guessing MR is at the center of that.

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  14. On 7/25/2019 at 4:10 PM, blanciris said:



    Hello.. Hi.. i am newbie here..this is my first post in this forum.. may i ask you to translate what is written by chan sung for man wol on the paper? i am eager to know it.. i happened to see this scene in one of the drama mv ..i can't read hangul.. I wish u guys can help me.. thanks

    I can't see all of it and it's in a bit messy cursive but I think the top row might be her name (jang man weol -ssi), there's a big saranghamnida (I love you) in the middle - with a <3 after. I have no clue what the squiggles on the third row are supposed to mean (some idol's signature?). CS looks unhappy about it... so I'd assume he was not the one writing it.

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  15. Encounter 16 thoughts:

    I liked, though not completely loved, the final episode.

    What I loved:

    JH's 'you can break up with me if you must, but I'll keep on loving you regardless.'

    That SH made a conscious choice to put her own happiness above everything else.

    JH+SH talking in banmal to each other.


    Some bits felt emotionally off though... like JH's mum magically taking a 180 turn, or the execution of SH changing her mind; the neatness of it all... I suppose.

    Still, Encounter remains the first romance-centric drama I’ve finished in years.

    It may not be all that novel in terms of big narrative, but the execution made it feel fresh and shiny and new.

    The writing was both subtle and clever. They knew exactly the story they wanted to tell and they told it to the best of their ability. It wasn’t perfect, but it was consistent in characterization, heartfelt and true to its core. The pacing was very assured and the acting exceptional. SH is by far my favorite role of SHK's, and ep.15 was probably the best acting I've ever seen from PBG.

    And I have a new painting in my living room proving just how inspiring I found the art in this show. 

    (hadn't painted in ages, so it felt really good to pick up a brush again).

    I will remember this show fondly for a long time. 

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  16. Ep15 thoughts


    Seeing JH break down in SH's office hurt a lot. Seeing SH's face going back to completely expressionless hurt even more. But the smile JH gave his parents the morning after finding out the truth, that one broke me. It is absolutely in character, they are falling back on tried and tested coping mechanisms. But it's also heart breaking.


    I think this separation actually helped their relationship in a twisted way. JH kept saying  "let's live together forever", "we can conquer everything as long as we are together", while being kind of cavalier about her fears, her guilt or the implications for his family (to be brutally honest - he let his parents find out about their relationship via the tabloids so I don't see how he could have expected smooth sailing on that front).I think at this point he finally gets where SH is coming from. So now he can start acting on all those promises of protecting her and keeping her happy.


    I was very glad that JH got to hear exactly what mum did, from her own mouth, without any sugar coating. And no matter how good a son he is, it's also clear that he will never forgive her for it. Mum knows deep down that what she did is wrong but keeps insisting that they'll be better off in the long run... I don't even have the energy to hate her properly anymore. I just want her out of my sight (and I suspect JH and her husband feel at least a bit of the same; I wish mum to sleep on the sofa for a long and back-painfully awful time).


    It occurs to me that the entire mess happened because JH and mum could not recognize each other's fundamental nature. They are also awfully similar, in stubbornness and in insisting that time can heal it all (should anyone care for my opinion: time muffles hurt, it does not take it away. Any nontrivial wound will leave a scar. When a precious fragile thing breaks apart, no matter how carefully you put it back together, it's not going to be as good as new).


    Nothing will get fixed before they acknowledge the facts: mum is too small-minded to ever full-heartedly accept SH; JH is too single-minded to move on to someone new. And so the immovable object (mum) meets the unstoppable force (JH). Curious how the writer will find a way out of this conundrum. "해피엔딩 or 새드엔딩"?



    "Love is about two different people growing to resemble each other." 

    but also

    "Habits of a lifetime don’t resolve easily, and you have to consciously decide, day after day, to live differently."

    "To love without knowing how to love wounds the person we love."



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  17. I stoped watching ep13 before the "meet JH's mum" end scene, because I was sad to begin with today, and did not think I could handle it.

    Loved the rest though:

    - the way they approach the conversation about marriage and ever after is the most realistic I've seen in a very long time. The fact that she is worried and ashamed about her history... and that it takes some convincing that all that does not matter as long as they are together...  Even the fact that they talk about it properly...that marriage is not about grand-gesture proposals, but about a lifetime commitment that should not be taken lightly.

    - I love how her interaction with JH changes her in ways small (like inviting people to her house for dinner) and large (like choosing to forgive the minion's betrayal, and sending him to Cuba so that he learns to treasure what he was willing to destroy). They do make each other better

    - every moment of their day to day looks wonderful; eating together, preparing a meal together, or sitting on the couch ... it all feels meaningful and perfect

    - the board meeting reminded me that Sh is so cool; also proved to WS that she does not need protection or saving - from him or anyone

    - I also love how normal their relationship has become, that by now people talk about it  as if it's a given; they can even kiss at the office like it's no big deal.


    Because of the last point, I got so angry about JH's mother's actions. I knew from the beginning that she would oppose and that it would take work to convince her. But the way she went about it was really despicable - the sneaking behind the scenes while avoiding direct confrontation... the manipulativeness of it all. And the fact that she cares more about what the neighbors say than her son explicitly stating that he can't live without SH. I am angry because that hits SH where it hurts the most. MiLfH and WME are bad, but at least they are upfront about it. After a first marriage into a family where she felt treated like an object to display while despised behind the scenes, the last thing in the world she needs is another disapproving mother in law... JH's mother's actions targeted her deepest insecurities and thus hurt the most.

    Why is it that in this show being a mother necessarily makes you a jerk?


    Overall, I'm even more sad now than I was at the start of the day.

    I trust and hope JiSoo will continue to be their amazing couple self, despite all the messiness.

    As long as they talk about it, it should be ok...

    Please be ok.


    PS: I've decided to wait until end of the series and binge the rest. 


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  18. Ep11 thoughts:

    My heart is so full of love that it's starting to overflow. I officially adore Encounter.



    SH+JH are so perfect together, it's not even funny. I was alternating between grinning like an idiot, squeeing, crying, and plain in awe: perfect kiss-while-laughing, the cutest drunken confession, the most adorable morning serenade and what will go in history as the most romantic kdrama proposal I have ever seen. And the parents being adorable, and the nicest mother-daughter evening as cherries on top. This is my favorite episode so far.



    I am losing even the minimum amount of patience that I had for WS. He really is his mother's son, and I loved his uncle for calling him out on it. By now it is perfectly clear that he does not love SH at all; he does not even understand the concept. His behavior is all about seeing JH having something that he could not possess and wanting to take it away. He clearly has no problem going behind his mother's back and doing whatever he damn pleases, so he could have protected SH back when, if he wanted to. I guess it was easier to just buy her some useless expensive trinket instead. And that's all you need to know, really. The hell with him and his stupid hotel. SH is smart and uber-competent. It took her a few years to build a crappy corporate hotel into a top class brand. Starting from scratch again would be hard, but still better than having to tolerate that ridiculous chaebol family.


    PS: don't know if this story has a happy ending or not, but it is for sure true love.

    (but really, if anything is fair in the world, they should never be more than 10cm apart)


    PPS: more highlights

    - drunk SH: 'Nobody ever notices, but I was always cute.' JH: 'I see you.' and you kind of know that that is the whole point of the story. When she is with him, SH can be her true self. And he sees her, all of her, and has ever since the beginning.

    - I loved that he is ten steps ahead in their relationship, as usual - giving her couple rings while committing to her forever in the same breath. It was also great how he told her that he is going to hang in there and do all the things he wants to do, slowly - telling her that no matter how long it takes he'll be waiting for her to reach the same level.

    - love cleaning lady, and how people see them together and just go 'oh, the joy of being young and in love' forgetting all the rest. 


    Before this episode, I was 100% convinced that the story would end with them happily together. But we had to talk about the letter buried under the sequoia tree... and now I am a bit scared. The 'I'll be by your side until your last breath' started to sound like foreshadowing... Good thing SH complained and shut it off right away. 


    PPPS: there is this one learning experiment from the 60s I keep thinking about:  it includes a feeder and a chicken running around trying to get to the food; if the chicken approaches the feeder, it will go away faster than the chicken could catch it; if he moves in the opposite direction, the feeder would follow twice as fast. The only way to get fed is to walk away from the thing you want. The chicken, however, never learns it.

    WS reminds me a lot of that chicken: the only way he could get SH to look at him with something other than contempt would be to step away and let her be happy on a path of her own choosing. But - like the chick - I think he is incapable of ever figuring that out.


    PPPPS: I adore JH's thought processes: like the morning after SH getting drunk he knew that she would be embarrassed, so he came with a plan to embarrass himself just as much to even out the field. Choosing a song about a drunken confession to tease her and take out the sting, making sure that he gets to the 'I loved you from the very beginning' part before stopping. Bonus points for the fact that although his voice is lovely the singing is not perfect. Also for promising a continuation of the second verse at a later time.


    It's good that they are always together, so when one is drinking the other has to drive. They are so cute that the universe could not handle both of them together drunk at the same time.


    P^5S: When JH asks what she is so-so-so happy about, SH first list a long list of things she got to eat :P - a woman after my own heart. And a refreshing view of the love going through the stomach saying.


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  19. On 1/6/2019 at 1:37 PM, mellinadear said:


    However, I loved this particular comment by "Charlie" (I'm assuming it's you :)).

      Reveal hidden contents

    I have a different understanding of their personalities, JH's in particular, and that is the reason why for me this works. To be fair, this may be saying more about me than the actual show.

    First, JH was always a bit of a loner, someone who hides behind the camera or in a book observing life rather than living it. Not unfriendly, but he needs personal space. He is mature for his age (in some respects) and that is possibly to do with how his parents were working a lot and he had to be sensible and responsible from early on. Still, he is particularly emotionally intelligent and open to the world.

    Second, they met in Cuba. Being on a holiday in a magical place where no one knows you gives one the license to be someone else for a bit. To let out the carefree, fun-loving version of you. This might look different for an introvert vs an extrovert but it's pretty universal. It was supposed to be an one-off thing so they could just enjoy the moment, discarding who they are and what it all means in the real world. And it was magical. They genuinely liked each other. And that is the foundation for everything else.

    The ice queen who never smiles caught a glimpse of JH dancing with the little girl and smiled. She liked him before they had spoken a single world, that's why he trusted him when they actually met later that evening.

    JH saw her walking by and she caught his eye - because she looked beautiful, somewhat familiar although he could not place her, but also really lonely. It was enough to notice her again on the wall (he was there first, shown in the foreground as she sits down).

    When they landed back in reality it took them quite some time to negotiate their new positions (boss-employee) but they had the memory of Cuba as a reminder of the prize and that it was worth it.

    It was her who took the initiative then, with the ramyeon date, teasing him. Had to be her call, because of who she is. And I kind of love her for it even when there were moments it felt awkward and slightly inappropriate. [The way I see it, she was ready for change and him coming along was the excuse she needed to set it into action.]
    Once that message was clear, he turned into the pursuer. He is my-way-JH and once he set his mind to something he will follow through no matter what. This was needed because, although it was clear that she was attracted to him, she had all the baggage of the past and decades of passiveness to battle through.

    By the end of ep.10 they are finally in the place where they want to be, dropping the last barriers between them. Cherry on the cake that it's back in Cuba too.

    But ultimately, two introverts ending up together makes sense, precisely because of the details of who they are as people.

    About JH's fake smiles: half the time his smiles are just for show on purpose. It's one the character's main traits - hiding his real feelings behind a smile, smiling harder when he is unhappy. I think PBG brings a lot of nuance to JH.

    I started watching this show because I adored (and strongly identified with) SH. JH was there just to make her happy and as long as she liked him he was ok. But as we went on, I started to identify with JH too - the hard working parents who live for their kids, the love of books and slight detachment from the world, the stubbornness of doing your own thing despite the social expectations. I now love both characters a lot. It's ultimately because they are smart, genuinely good people that feel real to me; they are a better version of myself I could aspire to.

    Thank you for defending the characters.


    There are always 2 sides to everything. With that we try to find a common ground between the 2 sides.

    We may like The drama, some, not so much while others might be in the middle.

    That's just how life is.

    So, Negative comments or differing opinions about the characters or drama itself shouldn't bother us.

    Yes, I'm that Charlie.  Thanks for reading and sharing.


    I don't mind people with different opinions. In fact, I put a lot of effort trying to explain my point of view and to link back to what they are saying. But it can get extremely frustrating when other parties do not extend the same minimal courtesy. Saying that PBG can't act while extensively discussing his past dramas does not help the original point. Nor does saying I wish this was the story of a poor older woman falling in love with a boy instead (I think that is called Pretty noona...). Or that My Ajusshi is a masterpiece and nothing else compares. I go to forums because I want to have a meaningful conversation about the drama I am currently watching (and loving). If that's not there, then there is no point. 



    I'll stop here, lest I become one of those people who use forums to vent because therapy is too expensive.

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  20. I don't have anything terribly interesting to say, but wrote this up so might as well share.
    The writer set JH and WS up as polar opposites of one another:
    One is the socially-accepted choice, the one with all the money and the power, but also the one who was a complete failure at protecting her and making her happy; someone who, despite the 'SH is not a piece of property' comment to his mother early on, sure treats her like one, completely ignoring her wishes and disregarding her feelings; he does not think her capable of making her own choices and sees her career as a cute hobby. The same patronizing view goes also for her love of art. He thinks everything is fine as long as he buys her another dark and kind of ugly expensive dress. He does not understand her, nor is he willing to listen and learn from what she is telling him. Finally, he is an absolute catastrophe when it comes to communicating his feelings.
    In contrast, JH is, on paper at least, completely unsuitable -much younger, poorer,  and her employee. He has nothing but his brain and determination to fight with, yet he gives his all to protect her. The highlight of his day is seeing her smile. He always treats her with utmost respect - even when he challenges her to expand her boundaries, it would take the slightest hesitation on her side to back off. He greatly admires her as a self-made woman and a success story and hopes he can contribute in his own small way to making her vision reality. He loves art just as much as she does, and encourages her to expand her artistic horizons (his presents: a poetry book, the camera). He just gets her, at a fundamental level; sometimes without needing any words. And although he’s prone to pretending to be fine when he isn’t, he’s always encouraging open communication, asking questions, listening closely to what she is saying. He tells her she is cute, and beautiful and amazing every chance he gets, until she starts believing it too.
    Now matter how obtuse a viewer may be, JH is obviously the right choice for her. 
    Which was probably the whole point.
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