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[Drama 2018] Voice 2, 보이스2

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On 9/9/2018 at 12:51 PM, 40somethingahjumma said:

Yeah, I agree with whoever said it before... the more they try and convince us that Kang Woo is a psychopathic maniac the less I believe it. :D There's just an overabundance of evidence which just makes me go... "yeah sure". There can be such a thing too much evidence especially when Norman Bates is calling the shots. Most of the time evidence is meagre but the show is unusually generous... and it just keeps giving. ;) Maybe I've just watched too many police procedurals. :P

 

I'm not really convinced that KW is Kosuke either. Sorry. Sure, he has blackouts but dissociative disorder and luring girls? I'm sceptical. But of course he's suspicious and acts it... and that's partly his own fault because he doesn't trust anyone with his entire life story least of all himself.

 

If Norman Bates is who we think he is... his real relationship with KW that is... wow... words fail me. A literal evil twin perhaps. Well... not quite a "twin" ;)

 

I first heard about Fabre when I read Gerald Durrell's My Family and Other Animals in my teens. I'd never read any of his works until recently because of Voice 2. I started reading The Life of the Spider by Fabre this past week because firstly, I thought the reference might have some far-reaching significance and then well, I'm fascinated by spiders because we have so many kinds in our part of the world. In the first chapter about the female tarantula, Fabre references Leon Dufour another entomologist, I imagine.

 

 

Much of that description reminds me of Norman Bates' lair which is a basement and there's a passageway leading to the "control room". 

But what really fascinated me was this observation by Dufour by way of Fabre:

 

 

It struck me forcibly that Norman Bates has positioned himself as the human observer watching his "insect acquisitions" from the relative comfort and safety of his control room in a grotesque role reversal. He observes his subjects while confining himself to his "glass bottle". He too has set up a contest... a battle of wits and endurance. He perceives himself as the god-like figure of the entomologist that defines not only the terms of engagement between his life specimens but also the outcome. Of course he isn't truly the dispassionate observer but he is curious at what his subjects will do when he throws them crumbs or bait. Will behaviourism rule the day... will they act in predictable ways? When he plants a seed of doubt, will they respond accordingly... will doubt, suspicion and outright hostility win the day? 

 

It isn't entirely a game with him... although games seem to be a large part of how he's controlling and setting up the victims. I have no doubt that the show is saying something not-too-subtle about gaming addiction and how that can become a foothold for unscrupulous individuals to manipulate the gullible and the alienated.

 

At the end of the day it isn't about KW per se. He is like the cat among the pigeons on some level but his guilt or innocence isn't paramount. The Golden Time Team had become a well-oiled machine... and it was until TL Jang was murdered and KW came on board. What's paramount is whether human society can function if trust is at a minimum. That seems like an obvious thing to say but is trust a choice or is it earned? Probably a lot of both. But the point is... a team is a microcosm of society... Norman Bates has his own team too... let's not forget that and they've got it together much more because they are in control of all the facts and the big picture. And it's equally true that trust is near impossible without knowledge and honesty. Also true is that a society cannot function if there's no clarity regarding justice.

 

I also wanted to talk about case of the week. That also had me hopping mad. Honestly, I am an evil person but I thought the women let Kim Min Son off rather lightly by trying to kill him. But I suspect that's the influence of Kwon Yul's minion nurse. I would've strung him up and made him confess on video to what he did and life streamed it, for example. :P There were other things they could have done. I know they did try to use legal means to no avail. Since they manage to find each other, they could have found a more legitimate and vocal means of publicizing their cause.

Still I'm glad to see the show highlight the horrors of dating abuse in conjunction with rich parents covering the problems of their wayward offspring with money and clout. I guess it's not that far removed from domestic violence. And the father was an absolute toad.

 

I am really enjoying Voice 2 so far. It is a different beast from its predecessor. But yeah, I'm generally fond of OCN cop shows mostly because they deal with real world issues in a gritty way. 

 

 

Back to the plot, this post is SO  enjoyable to read! 

 

Thank you very much for explaining the Dr Fabre reference: i must admit that i missed  the obvious reasons, the connection with the ants, aka  humanity seen through Bang Je Soo's eyes!     

Durell is a new author to add to my PAL... 

The excerpts from Dufour and Fabre enlight under a new light the organization created by our resident killer: the descriptions are quite vivid, visual and disturbing. i wish the drama could have find a way to render it on screen with better effects. 

The most fascinating part of this parallel is the position as a watcher, occupied by the Tarentula and Bang Je Soo. It implies that he dissociates himself from everything and i wonder what could have affected him so much to amplify a normal feeling of strangeness to a God complex level.

Not sure that the writer thought  so far his biography, which would be a pity because those psychological points are really a big reasons of the interest for those kind of killers.

 

He's not dispassionate at all indeed, he clearly feels contempt and anger, even though  he doesn't  admit it:  he declared that only the ones who could get over their feelings to reach what he thinks is his level ( in a perfect illusion) could join him, but following his own rules, he shouldn't be elected to lead this cause..

 

Quote

Also true is that a society cannot function if there's no clarity regarding justice.

 

  That's the mother of all distrust: the victims being denied justice. 

In this case, it feels that the killer is taking advantage of it to deconstruct society and force his own view, his own domination but only because he's fed up to hide in a cave while he thinks of himself as a true leader who should rule the world.

His megalomania is his only ideology.

 

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Since they manage to find each other, they could have found a more legitimate and vocal means of publicizing their cause.

      

They didn't try because they didn't want justice anymore, but revenge: resentment was eating them inside but they weren't worried by his potential new victims.  I doubt killing him brought peace to them. At this level of anger, nothing could appease the negative feelings.     

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I've seen few clips of ep 10 (but not official)

 

Spoiler

Chief Na is dead: Bang Se Joo invited Chief Na in his flat and offered him a poisoned bottle of water that he stupidly took while being suspicious of him ( how to ruin a good character!). 

He left his body on a boat after cutting of part of it and leaving it hanging in box with a star.

Kang Woo woke at the scene  with blood everywhere on him and is seen by a witness running from the crime scene

After watching the cctv record proving he was flying away, the GTT is on alert .

  

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spoiler 

Spoiler

i am watching ep 10 now and we can be sure of the brother theory there was two boys kid back then   "cain and abel "had always was the worst hint 

i am sad for chief NA but dear he was blind with his hate that he didn't even search for other choices

again everyone falling for the killer play and  kw is a murder again in everyone eyes , i am sorry kw i want to blame them for being so stupid but dear you should trust kj at least and told her about your sickness you know the killer used it in the past and may do it again and he did now being honest asking them to believe you is hard but kj heart and mind bigger even with all this mess 

 

 

8

 

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I just finished live streaming ep 10. One thing I must say, I am very satisfied at the end of the episode. That's what a capable Director Kang worth of! :kiss_wink: Yasss!!! Can't wait for subtitle to come out in few hours to better understand their lines. 

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I still have hope for our team leader, teaser for upcoming episodes always have some twist so im hoping, KW and KJ have a “silent talk” they just making that drama/hostage so the psycho killer will show up....they need to use their ears and eyes to communicate ....

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they play with him that right that they trust each other and stop acting alone for everyone to believe that kw not a killer they need at least to show that the real killer is really excited not imaging they need to find him so they give him a show he can never refuse to come and watch, something he can't hear or watch from afar 

 

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5 minutes ago, Aya Hong said:

I still have hope for our team leader, teaser for upcoming episodes always have some twist so im hoping, KW and KJ have a “silent talk” they just making that drama/hostage so the psycho killer will show up....they need to use their ears and eyes to communicate ....

 

I assure you will be satisfied watching ep 10 :thumbsup:

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On 9/9/2018 at 2:11 PM, meon said:

Everyone has his own opinion :)  As for me, Jin Uk ssi's acting is brilliant and the  further the better. 

Yes, this is exactly what KW was from the very beginning! Not any contrast with the start of the season.

Sorry for self-citation, but

 

It's a safe thread i think! People can disagree.:lol:

 

But to his defence, it's a difficult role: which requires to switch from competent/skilled cop with a hidden heart to threatening killer, sometimes in one line. 

A difficult challenge which requires a different level of acting than everything that he has done before. 

 

She was the one calling the shots at the start: remember their 1st meeting in the interrogation room. Few episodes later, she was still telling him that she could stop the partnership at any moment and send him back to jail.

But now that he's acting all crazy and instable,  she lets him roam freely! That's bad writing and not how she would have behaved considering she barely knows him.     

 

More OCN clips

 

 

 

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 i like ep 10 they back on the good road i don't understand why that didn't happen from ep 7,  stop hidden things, KW telling KJ to make secret check that their phones weren't hacked by the killer  and she asking agent jin to stop that  or use that against him like they did in ep 10 

i mean from ep 7-8 when he even start thinking that the killer listen to them and he gave her that phones they should start talking about the killer and find how he heard them using the new phones KW give i could understand she wasn't trusting him that moment but what about him  i was angry he give her that phones and the next scene he called her about thinking the killer behind that lady murder by using the phone he thinks the killer listen to it 

 

okay it was slow but at least they back on the game now, just keep it like that please no more dragging, start the real trust and hunting now the game now is interested keep that on the same level at least for us who really love this drama  ( just 2 ep's left why did they waste time before i wanted that kind of teamwork more ) 

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7 minutes ago, nona88 said:

i like ep 10 they back on the good road i don't understand why that didn't happen from ep 7,  stop hidden things, KW telling KJ to make secret check that their phones weren't hacked by the killer  and she asking agent jin to stop that  or use that against him like they did in ep 10 

i mean from ep 7-8 when he even start thinking that the killer listen to them and he gave her that phones they should start talking about the killer and find how he heard them using the new phones KW give i could understand she wasn't trusting him that moment but what about him  i was angry he give her that phones and the next scene he called her about thinking the killer behind that lady murder by using the phone he thinks the killer listen to it 

 

Because trusting him too soon wouldn't have allowed  the revelation on his criminal father and mental illness to be the shock that the writer wanted it to be. The writer wanted us to doubt him until now just like Kwon Joo to play all the twists she had in mind. 

 

She kept his past a secret with the idea that the main characters relationship should be test through  the lens of trust.

Go back to @40somethingahjumma post in last page: it has interesting arguments on how this thematic of trust was used in every case presented to explore the nature of crimes and justice.          

 

Kwon Joo gave him a cold shoulder when he suggested to use the new phones: she just came out of her discussion with Chief Na and learnt few alarming facts and  said that their collaboration couldn't continue if he lies to her. He was angry because how she looked at him and then gave up on his idea.  

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58 minutes ago, titania1000 said:

 

Because trusting him too soon wouldn't have allowed  the revelation on his criminal father and mental illness to be the shock that the writer wanted it to be. The writer wanted us to doubt him until now just like Kwon Joo to play all the twists she had in mind. 

 

She kept his past a secret with the idea that the main characters relationship should be test through  the lens of trust.

Go back to @40somethingahjumma post in last page: it has interesting arguments on how this thematic of trust was used in every case presented to explore the nature of crimes and justice.          

 

Kwon Joo gave him a cold shoulder when he suggested to use the new phones: she just came out of her discussion with Chief Na and learnt few alarming facts and  said that their collaboration couldn't continue if he lies to her. He was angry because how she looked at him and then gave up on his idea.  

 

i don't mind now there were little things that should have played in another way i know the trust things is the game here  but now  i like ep 10, not just because they trust each other but cause they start  using their smart mind and the special ability each one has 

that a secret investing that was for one month i wished to see them play their part of searching, using KJ hearing, agent jin computer skill and agent part many abilities in searching reading and talking other languages i want t see the teamwork even without kw IF THEY STILL don't trust them

so now i am okay they back to the game now, time to make the first step and had their way too :heart: we all were angry about the things here and there but we all love the drama , see it in different ways and being wrong doesn't matter to me as long as the drama i like  keep being great 

i am not blaming kj for not trusting kw  she give him so much for some stranger and has to face so many proofs  against him , kw has his own problem too and so many reasons for not trusting people i am happy he finally chooses to trust KJ and even when she started to not trust him he trust her calm mind  and what she really is and give her evidence to believe on him again, that itself a change on his heart, not just cause he needs her clear his name but he also wants her trust back ( before it didn't matter to him he gave up on people and don't make afford to win them )

 

the scene she saw the video of him with the food she gave him was touching, little things matter  after all, the scene when he told her why he couldn't trust anyone but he thought she was different was perfect too, and how our amazing KJ still tried to find the truth and give him another chance  even when other may just stop even listen to him at that point was just like what she really is , and more other things, that why i liked ep 10 for all that and each one of it

i waiting to watch the ep with sub  i said before i was afraid i would be regretting watching it and not waiting till next week but  i couldn't abandon it or waiting so i even go watching it live and i am happy i did , thanks voice 2 teams for making me really happy now 

 

 edit

 

1 hour ago, titania1000 said:
5 hours ago, meon said:

Everyone has his own opinion :)  As for me, Jin Uk ssi's acting is brilliant and the  further the better. 

Yes, this is exactly what KW was from the very beginning! Not any contrast with the start of the season.

Sorry for self-citation, but

2

 

It's a safe thread i think! People can disagree.:lol:

 

But to his defence, it's a difficult role: which requires to switch from competent/skilled cop with a hidden heart to threatening killer, sometimes in one line. 

A hard challenge which require a different level of acting than everything that he has done before. 

 

She was the one calling the shots at the start: remember their 1st meeting in the interrogation room. Few episodes later, she was still telling him that she could stop the partnership at any moment and send him back to jail.

But now that he's acting all crazy and instable,  she lets him roam freely! That's bad writing and not how she would have behaved considering she barely knows him.    

5
5
5

 

 

 i agree with @titania1000 it totally safe here, i like soompi forums for that i can meet and talk about so different thoughts and it okay 

it amazing to see how people can see sometimes in the same way and sometimes in a totally different way that makes watching drama so much fun i stopped talking about drama in any other place besides here cause  not having one mind not always acceptable and i am grateful being member here to enjoy the drama and enjoy everyone thoughts 

 @meon and  @ellelyana88  i enjoyed  reading what your views  it interesting thanks for sharing it , i find kw character is so interesting as plot too , the idea of having many killers was interesting too i was not liking it wasn't having  the perfect treatment for the good ideas 

 and i agree even if the idea or the original story was good no even great still we have the scenes written somethings were not considering sometimes,  i would like them to build season 3 a stronger on that part 

Edited by nona88
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Love it that KJ and KW are working together again, thank god. I guess we'll be seeing daddy dearest the psycho in the last episodes. He wrote to the killer that he arrived in Korea and they'll meet soon, then they showed an old man in a car. It can't be anyone else other than KW's dad. I wonder if he'll try to do the same thing to KJ that he did to little Miho. Who knows maybe dad killed Miho because she got too close to his dearest son, so he might not be happy about KW getting close to KJ.

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On 9/9/2018 at 6:46 PM, nona88 said:

 

i don't mind now there were little things that should have played in another way i know the trust things is the game here  but now  i like ep 10, not just because they trust each other but cause they start  using their smart mind and the special ability each one has 

that a secret investing that was for one month i wished to see them play their part of searching, using KJ hearing, agent jin computer skill and agent part many abilities in searching reading and talking other languages i want t see the teamwork even without kw IF THEY STILL don't trust them

 

I hope  my answer didn't sound blunt:unsure:, i should have added  my feelings: i feel the writing made characters look quite stupid for no reason than to keep the suspense as long as possible. 

Like you, I'm not satisfied with it because we know that the GTT and Kwon Joo especially are far from being stupid. I agree that they made a limited use of their abilities and i think they seemed to react without any plans to how figure out things. For example, they never shared with the violent crime unit their infos, except for the meeting between Chief Na and Kwon Joo but it happened only once.

Also like you said, they never tried to understand how the killer knew everything before them, never looked for bugs or a suspect among police officers.  

 

On 9/9/2018 at 6:46 PM, nona88 said:

so now i am okay they back to the game now, time to make the first step and had their way too :heart: we all were angry about the things here and there but we all love the drama , see it in different ways and being wrong doesn't matter to me as long as the drama i like  keep being great 

 

  Actually i'm sadly quite disappointed by the turn of events: i'm watching because of Kwon Joo and LHN, which explains my panic at the idea that she could disappear:(

 

On 9/9/2018 at 6:46 PM, nona88 said:

i am not blaming kj for not trusting kw  she give him so much for some stranger and has to face so many proofs  against him , kw has his own problem too and so many reasons for not trusting people i am happy he finally chooses to trust KJ and even when she started to not trust him he trust her calm mind  and what she really is and give her evidence to believe on him again, that itself a change on his heart, not just cause he needs her clear his name but he also wants her trust back ( before it didn't matter to him he gave up on people and don't make afford to win them )

 

 

I personally worry about the fact that she could trust him too much: i'm still waiting for the writer to explain what happened to Chief Na's brother.

Contrary to Chief Na's death  for which Kang Woo was framed, we  saw the "memories, suggestions, nightmares" of   Kang Woo cutting his ex partner's hand and at that time, he wasn't dreaming.

I'm not sure about Bang Se Joo's claim that he had pictures of that night and it was  a murder committed together but i wonder if this question  will be  answered once they'll catch him.

Same thing for his ex partner's claim that he almost killed a suspect, and what about his seizures?

.      

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21 minutes ago, nateko said:

Love it that KJ and KW are working together again, thank god. I guess we'll be seeing daddy dearest the psycho in the last episodes. He wrote to the killer that he arrived in Korea and they'll meet soon, then they showed an old man in a car. It can't be anyone else other than KW's dad. I wonder if he'll try to do the same thing to KJ that he did to little Miho. Who knows maybe dad killed Miho because she got too close to his dearest son, so he might not be happy about KW getting close to KJ.

daddy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!    i didn't that part my stream was slow the last scene and i was happy to watch it again and said to myself i will watch it again with sub later OMG if that their father or some old killer it creepy anyway who they fighting against i feel like they planning something bigger and crazier then way may think the killer kept talked about the big plan, cleaning the world.....    :fearful:

17 minutes ago, titania1000 said:

I hope  my answer didn't sound blunt:unsure:, i should have added  my feelings: i feel the writing made characters look quite stupid for no reason than to keep the suspense as long as possible. 

Like you, I'm not satisfied with it because we know that the GTT and Kwon Joo especially is far from being stupid. I agree that they made a limited use of their abilities and i think they seemed to react without any plans to how figure out things. For example, they never shared with the violent crime unit their infos, except for the meeting between Chief Na and Kwon Joo but it happened only once.

not at all, don't worry i read all your posts and i get your thoughts and dear i am  enjoying every answer  and talk with you 

i understand your feeling i was the same i really like the golden team , they the best that why i write they supposed to get better treatment i hope that change from now on 

17 minutes ago, titania1000 said:

 Actually i'm sadly quite disappointed by the turn of events: i'm watching because of Kwon Joo and LHN, which explains my panic at the idea that she could disappear:(

 

 

I personally worry about the fact that she could trusting him too much: i'm still waiting for the writer to explain what did happen to Chief Na's brother. Contrary to Chief Na, we saw the images in which Kang Woo was cutting his hands and at that time, he wasn't dreaming. I'm not sure about Bang Se Joo's claim that he had pictures of that night and it was  committed together. 

6

 

 oh i hopping too, i like they start explaining things a little in ep 10, and i want more of that, i agree on her trusting him was fast even when she said what she said at first but she did really start trusting him fast , JH was another case he was sharing her same pain , they both suffer for 3 years from the same person and she was sure he wasn't the killer like  in 100% , 

but i let that side since it also part of KJ character to trust what she hears and what she feels about people more than what other say and proof point at ( she had her painful part and memory  of how all  fact can be change and be lies ) so her trusting him since she hear his voice talking  to the victims with her super ability and her voice profer  skills maybe be a good reason so i am letting that out of my worry.

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By the way, I think chief NA is still alive. I think they showed him still breathing in that plastic bag. I'm not sure how it's possible but if he is alive then he's testimony will be crucial. 

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8 minutes ago, nateko said:

By the way, I think chief NA is still alive. I think they showed him still breathing in that plastic bag. I'm not sure how it's possible but if he is alive then he's testimony will be crucial. 

 

OMG! That was my thought too when i watched that scene and wonder is it because he is alive they zoomed in his face so close? :open_mouth:

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I finally listened to the two new OSTs and Yeseo's song is beautiful. I'm guessing it's KJ's theme song, it has beautiful lyrics that describe her character so well. I don't remember hearing it in the drama yet, have you, guys? Did I miss it?  That other song though... :skull: must be the bad guys' theme song. 

 

Yeseo – I Hear You English Translation

Feels like I saw the back of you in my dreams
Far away, alone and lost
And I’ll find you Hear you
Even if I can’t see you
I’ll be with you
Yes I’ll find you Here with you
Even if I can’t reach you
I won’t let go of you
I hear you
In every time In anywhere
I’ll be there
In every time, I’m still here
I hear you
In every time In anywhere
I’ll be there
In every time, I’m still here
I hear you

Feels like I’m standing here alone
There’s not a single person to hold me
But I’ll find you I hear you
Even if I can’t see you
I’ll be with you
Yes I’ll find you Here with you
Even if I can’t reach you
I won’t let go of you
I hear you
In every time In anywhere
I’ll be there
In every time, I’m still here
I hear you
In every time In anywhere
I’ll be there
In every time, I’m still here
I hear you

And I’ll find you Hear you
Even if I can’t see you
I’ll be with you
Yes I’ll find you Here with you
Even if I can’t reach you
I won’t let go of you
I hear you
I hear you
I hear you
I hear you

 

Translation by klyrics.net

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