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[Current Mainland Chinese Drama 2018] The Story of Ming Lan 庶女明兰传 / 知否?知否?应是绿肥红瘦

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12 hours ago, hello210 said:
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From the novel spoilers I read, I thought the time when GTY was away in battle while ML was pregnant, the Stepmom brought Maniang to do the concubine griping thing which lead to ML going into labor, in hopes that both mother and child died, but both survived labor process (ML’s servants stopped Maniang from going too far), so Stepmom had her servant set the Fu on fire. GTY got there after the fire was started in time. From trailers, looks like they’re keeping this part in the drama.

 

Yeah she failed the concubine trick so she pulled another scheme.

 

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One thing I'm wondering is Why GTY had to scheme to get ML in the drama? He had to do it in the book cuz no one was on his side and ML barely knew him, but in the drama, he and ML had many interactions with each other. He was in a position where Sheng family would be happy marrying ML off to him. The only obstacle may be Grandma but if ML told her how he had helped her several time she would have accepted him. Besides, ML actually was fond of him this time. Why couldn't he just ask for ML's hand directly so that she could be proud and high. Instead everybody is thinking ML was just a replacement for Rulan. Why didn't he think that honesty and sincerity would work? He was in a very advantageous position yet he still had to use such underhanded method? And he wasn't being honest with ML either. He only told her when everything was already done. What? He didn't think that ML would accept him? It never crossed his mind that maybe it was against her will? At least he could have hinted to her what he was gonna do beforehand.

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6 hours ago, tomo74 said:

So, it's ok for GTY to mislead his best friend?, it's ok to scheme the family?.

About GTY knowing RL has bf it doesn't mean she can not change her mind, he is not GOD who can read people's mind.

If this thing done by QH, I dont know what people going to say.

This is why I said, some people just biased, for certain character it's ok for doing bad thing and have an excuses.

I'm not against GTY, I just want people judge each character fairly.

 

The whole point of this is that if QH had done what GTY is doing then he would be applauded as well. Because it shows that he is fighting for the girl he loves by planning and using cunning. But as you said it’s not his personality & it’s his personality that I don’t really like

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1 hour ago, anzomi said:

The principal problem with Dr. He is not the cousin, is his soft-hearted nature, and that's what ML tells grandma when she thinks of the future years with him in the marriage. That soft heart will show soon or later being with the cousin or other things.

 

GTY is obviously manipulating to his own benefit but at the end of the day he is only showing the truth about Dr.He, same way ML told GTY about Manniang, and even if GTY didn't have feelings for ML and didn't want to marry her I think is good for ML to know better Dr.He before marriage so she can decide.

Well said @anzomi thanks for saying that After reading your post it made me realize GTY can manipulate anyone he wants but it doesn’t mean he would always win at the game/life he is playing with. It is by a chance he did win this time and there was a chance he still could have lost Ming Lan in the end. He gave her the opportunity to see how Dr He’s kindness could affect their future if she married to him. She chose to let him go.

 

I will be honest all this manipulation was making me waved on the amount of manipulation GTY has done to Ming Lan. Since this post I am back on GTY’s side. lol lol evil-smile-onion-head-emoticon.gif evil-smile-onion-head-emoticon.gif

Everyone action aren’t always black and white because there are a lot of possibilities of how it will end depending on the individual. 

 

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10 minutes ago, linhlinh111 said:

One thing I'm wondering is Why GTY had to scheme to get ML in the drama? He had to do it in the book cuz no one was on his side and ML barely knew him, but in the drama, he and ML had many interactions with each other. He was in a position where Sheng family would be happy marrying ML off to him. The only obstacle may be Grandma but if ML told her how he had helped her several time she would have accepted him. Besides, ML actually was fond of him this time. Why couldn't he just ask for ML's hand directly so that she could be proud and high. Instead everybody is thinking ML was just a replacement for Rulan. Why didn't he think that honesty and sincerity would work? He was in a very advantageous position yet he still had to use such underhanded method? And he wasn't being honest with ML either. He only told her when everything was already done. What? He didn't think that ML would accept him? It never crossed his mind that maybe it was against her will? At least he could have hinted to her what he was gonna do beforehand.

it's a good question and I agree. ML could have defended him and helped him to persuade her granny.

I wonder if he was uncertain she would and he wanted to be sure to marry her. Personally I think she would have been happy to marry him.

The only other thing I have in mind is that there was a social expectation/pressure. Since he was the son of a marrquis, successful general he couldn't marry the daughter of a concubine.

But this could be the foundation of their issues later. QH kept declaring his feelings because to him ML was a replacement. GTY knew he got her through scheming.

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6 minutes ago, linhlinh111 said:

One thing I'm wondering is Why GTY had to scheme to get ML in the drama? He had to do it in the book cuz no one was on his side and ML barely knew him, but in the drama, he and ML had many interactions with each other. He was in a position where Sheng family would be happy marrying ML off to him. The only obstacle may be Grandma but if ML told her how he had helped her several time she would have accepted him. Besides, ML actually was fond of him this time. Why couldn't he just ask for ML's hand directly so that she could be proud and high. Instead everybody is thinking ML was just a replacement for Rulan. Why didn't he think that honesty and sincerity would work? He was in a very advantageous position yet he still had to use such underhanded method? And he wasn't being honest with ML either. He only told her when everything was already done. What? He didn't think that ML would accept him? It never crossed his mind that maybe it was against her will? At least he could have hinted to her what he was gonna do beforehand.

Grandma wouldn’t have agreed no matter how high in status he is. When she was talking about 6th Liang son during Molan affair she said he is ‘worse than 2nd Gu’. That’s her opinion of him. She wouldn’t have agreed even if ML tells her that he saved her multiple times. Also, would Big Madam be happy that a General of high standing is passing over her daughter to ask for ML’s hand? Now after his scheming, she is telling everyone that ML is considered a Di daiughter & in Sheng Hong’s eyes ML saved his family name by marrying GTY

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2 minutes ago, fra8 said:

it's a good question and I agree. ML could have defended him and helped him to persuade her granny.

I wonder if he was uncertain she would and he wanted to be sure to marry her. Personally I think she would have been happy to marry him.

The only thing I have in mind is that there was a social expectation/pressure. Since he was the son of a marrquis, successful general he couldn't marry the daughter of a concubine.

But this could be the foundation of their issues later. QH kept declaring his feelings because to him ML was a replacement. GTY knew he got her through scheming.

But ML also knows the truth, that GTY plotted everything to marry her so how can that be the root of their issues? Personally I think it’s insecurities too. ML after seeing Manniang’s punishment probably got a flashback of Concubine Lin going unpunished & she told GTY in the trailer that she wouldn’t mind if he got concubines. That statement probably brought back GTY’s insecurities & seeing her meeting QH just pushed everything past the boiling point

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2 minutes ago, linhlinh111 said:

One thing I'm wondering is Why GTY had to scheme to get ML in the drama? He had to do it in the book cuz no one was on his side and ML barely knew him, but in the drama, he and ML had many interactions with each other. He was in a position where Sheng family would be happy marrying ML off to him. The only obstacle may be Grandma but if ML told her how he had helped her several time she would have accepted him. Besides, ML actually was fond of him this time. Why couldn't he just ask for ML's hand directly so that she could be proud and high. Instead everybody is thinking ML was just a replacement for Rulan. Why didn't he think that honesty and sincerity would work? He was in a very advantageous position yet he still had to use such underhanded method? And he wasn't being honest with ML either. He only told her when everything was already done. What? He didn't think that ML would accept him? It never crossed his mind that maybe it was against her will? At least he could have hinted to her what he was gonna do beforehand.

We also have to remember their little argument at the snack shop when he confronted ML about his first proposal attempt and also the fact that he had made it public that he would only marry a di daughter. Correct me if I’m wrong but everyone still perceived ML as shu born until Daniang pointed out that she is registered under her so she is considered a di daughter of the Shengs. I think that’s why they added little things like that in the drama so that they can keep the GTY had to scheme to get ML aspect of the novel. I don’t know if anyone has posed the question in interviews with the director/writer though so that’s just my guess on it.

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10 minutes ago, darkphoenix123 said:

But ML also knows the truth, that GTY plotted everything to marry her so how can that be the root of their issues? Personally I think it’s insecurities too. ML after seeing Manniang’s punishment probably got a flashback of Concubine Lin going unpunished & she told GTY in the trailer that she wouldn’t mind if he got concubines. That statement probably brought back GTY’s insecurities & seeing her meeting QH just pushed everything past the boiling point

 

I lost that part. Thanks!

I meant mostly QH's perception of her being a second choice for GTY and then still believing she loved just him.  I hope that QH wouldnt' have confessed his feelings  if he thought she was happy and in love and really loved. So it was just a wrong perceptiong, if not I would dislike him more. And this would spark  GTY's insecurities because he could feel a second choice especially if she said that.

 

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2 minutes ago, hello210 said:

We also have to remember their little argument at the snack shop when he confronted ML about his first proposal attempt and also the fact that he had made it public that he would only marry a di daughter. Correct me if I’m wrong but everyone still perceived ML as shu born until Daniang pointed out that she is registered under her so she is considered a di daughter of the Shengs. I think that’s why they added little things like that in the drama so that they can keep the GTY had to scheme to get ML aspect of the novel. I don’t know if anyone has posed the question in interviews with the director/writer though so that’s just my guess on it.

Yeah but that was his past life. Wouldn't asking for ML, a shu daughter, prove that his view on status has changed? Instead of asking for the di daughter and get the shu daughter as a replacement? Maybe ML and Grandma now knows that he really wanted ML but others don't, so wouldn't that kinda cheapen ML's value?

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@linhlinh111 Someones reputation isn't so easily restored even today. In ancient china aswell as other ancient kingdoms restoring your reputation was no easy thing. Grandma still wouldn't choose him.

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I did watch episode 39 of the uncut version. Waiting for the TV version. I think madam liang looked sad she didn't get ML as a daughter in law. Molan looked jealous and took a grip on something just to calm herself :D . I don't know what it was, looked like some round type candy. Sorry i can't find the right word for it. 

 

preview scenes

Spoiler

 

 

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52 minutes ago, hello210 said:

I’ve commented before that I think GTY may feel insecure based on what him and ML said to each other in the love triangle trailer. It’s not about ML not being her true self since they changed that in the drama, but they also gave us more feelings between QH and ML than in the novel. I think they will have everything but the words I Love You. They have admiration, respect for each other, and happiness. And since GTY knew about the romantic feelings between QH and ML, after seeing their little meeting, there’s probably some insecurities there that he’s not in ML’s heart. Imagine what it would feel like to be in love with the person you’re married to but that person may still be in love with someone else. He’s very much in love with ML and may want the security of knowing she feels the same way. Based on ML’s remark to GTY in the trailer, GTY hasn’t mentioned love either and maybe that will also make him realize that he himself wasn’t completely honest with his feelings even though he tells her he admired her, I don’t think he’s mentioned love yet. No matter how great some actions are, sometimes people just need the security of those three little words or that they have a place in each other’s heart. 

 

That’s just my take on what their little personal crisis point could be about based on the little bit I saw in that love triangle trailer. We’ll see how they actually play it out when that part comes since these trailers can be misleading. 

 

Thank you for giving your insight, I was really confused with the insecure part. I tend to analyze all the trailers, I cant help it :lol:

from the viewers pov we can see the changes between them when they are around each other, but yes the right way is waiting on after their marriage, maybe something will happen that makes ML clammed up again (the Gu family meddling perhaps)

 

https://youtu.be/JnyM_AgrMqg

 

oh my!!!!! That first seconds of gty and ml *fans herself furiously*

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Values or not, they will still have to scheme to marry Ming lan, because even if ML vouch for his character, grandma would have gotten angry that she doesn't tell her anything and that would have further not allow them to marry. It's like embarking on QH 2.0 proposal. If it wasn't what happened for this wedding, danniang wouldn't have adopted ML and ML would still have been a di daughter. If he had proposed outrightly, Rulan would still be the first to be considered as she is shu daughter and GTY is now an official,and she is also the eldest.. He could have told ML his plan but like what ML said when he eventually told her the plan that wasn't he worried about rulan's reputations at all. So ML wouldn't have supported that plan and she wouldn't want to hold onto any stupid promise that might not work. So working alone to make the mission accomplished is the best choice ever. At least, no one was under the burden of waiting and he wasn't under the pressure 9f disappointing someone. He did it silently and quietly as possible. ML has a great value now than ever, because she married grandly and as a shu daughter, if it was a direct wedding, the wedding might be grand but there will be a lot of rumors as to her reputations again that she is just trying to get everyone in high positions.. But now they all think Rulan was the stupid one and ML is pitiful to have been a replacement. So they are all happy for her that she got to be a madam after all her predicaments... This is a well thought out plan by GTY to not only marry ML but to also raise her reputations in the society. 

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14 minutes ago, Lunkera said:

I did watch episode 39 of the uncut version. Waiting for the TV version. I think madam liang looked sad she didn't get ML as a daughter in law. Molan looked jealous and took a grip on something just to calm herself :D . I don't know what it was, looked like some round type candy. Sorry i can't find the right word for it. 

 

preview scenes

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

We are on a romance overdrive.Not that I mind.

Jealous Molan I love it.

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10 minutes ago, linhlinh111 said:

Yeah but that was his past life. Wouldn't asking for ML, a shu daughter, prove that his view on status has changed? Instead of asking for the di daughter and get the shu daughter as a replacement? Maybe ML and Grandma now knows that he really wanted ML but others don't, so wouldn't that kinda cheapen ML's value?

 

If he ask for her directly, (1) grandma who has a very low opinion of him would not agree. (2) I wouldn't bet on Minglan's feeling for him, he has mentioned marriage a few times but she's never caught on, which means that she's never genuinely considered him as a possible match. Yes, she has respect for him, but there's no guarantee that she'll choose him, who has a complicated background that she's very much aware of, over Dr. He who is much more simple. (3) Big Madam would be very angry that he chooses ML over Rulan, this is not good for Minglan; so with the scheme, he manages to make Big Madam gladly hand Minglan over to him, without any jealousy or anger, she even went around proudly advertises ML as a "di" daughter of her. (4) WIth everyone believe that Minglan ending up with him is only "accidental", no one will consider her a target of jealousy or some sort of weakness that can be used against him.

 

In the end, everyone in Sheng house is satisfy and happy; Minglan''s never be targeted by anyone and her status and value is higher than ever.

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1 minute ago, Lunkera said:

@nichiwoohee clip is restricted by country

 

Sorry guys! Actually all the youtube spoilers everyone posted also restricted by country for mez So it means the one I can see, others cant see :cry: what an odd channel

 

Spoiler

You may already seen it, the first seconds are gty kissing ml’s ears and neck on the next morning after the wedding night

 

I just realize maybe all the spoilers I see are just being uploaded late :tears:

 

 

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1 hour ago, hello210 said:

In my opinion, possibly with the exception of Doc He, CB and wife (that we can see so far), everyone is a schemer in this drama, whether it’s for survival, revenge, or to get something they want. The difference is that each one schemes within their abilities and character. QH pulled little innocent schemes that in his mind is not harmful whereas GTY and ML pulled some whopping ones but they all did it within their characters and perceptions.  Same for the others, SH, CL, Molan, Madame Liang, etc. They all have their flaws and their good points.  And both QH and GTY have the right to feel the way they do because each has their own perspectives of what’s going on. For me, the fact that these characters have been able to generate this much discussion is a testament to the writers and actors for the great job they did. I also enjoy reading everyone’s varied opinions. :)

 

Well said @hello210.  I think because of the era they are in scheming seems to  be the way of life. 

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